yeah I sure understand
we also got in well after dinnertime last year
are you gonna have your cell on?
jepler: let's load tomorrow
it would be great to get up, shower, and leave on saturday
I won't ask.
jepler: do you want to fix those obsolete comments in the ppmc configs?
build build build
cradek, maybe we should spend a little time making my fast machine into a .deb builder
I just haven't had the time/mindshare to do it yet
cradek: sorry, I don't think I ever got around to fixing it
are you volunteering to do the 2.2 series of releases if I help you get going?
cradek: loading tomorrow sounds great
jepler: no problem, jon doesn't care I guess
SWPadnos: cool, let's talk about it more then
I think it may be fast enough to do separate packages for dapper and feisty as well
I bought a couple of extra hard disks as well, so we can experiment with fresh installs and the like
the board is supposed to assign a release manager for each new branch - it's just been me so far
maybe I'll open an ssh port for you ;)
I have 2x 9G in my box, only one is used
I'll have 3x320G, with two unused :)
unless I decide to grab the hot spare from the server RAID, in which case it'll be 4
is your gpg key in the keyservers?
we'll have to work out keys
since I had to think about what you said, and I've never done anything related to that, I'm sure no is the correct answer
ok that's fine
we have some time to work on it (not today or tomorrow)
I'm going to try to get this CD made tonight
... and pack
fat chance, I'm sure
I have to figure out why my wife's computer decided to spontaneously lose all her desktop settings and email
(Ubuntu Feisty, so no Windows jokes, please)
lose as in can't find, or lose as in delete?
at least I've finished the robot controller, other than the defective motor drive (I think)
lose as in Thunderbird asks about creating a new profile
* cradek makes a face at thunderbird
not only is the profile file gone, I think the mainl store is gone as well
just because it's the best gui 3-pane standard mailreader doesn't mean it's good
that's a new one on me
she had actually had another problem, and couldn't shut down
so obviously the thing to do in that situation is power doen with the power button ...
that's harmless nowadays
even ctrl-alt-del didn't work. I wonder if it's due to my plugging in a different keyboard - maybe it wasn't considered the promary
do we have anybody bringing a printer yet?
yeah, I figured that whatever was happening before was the real problem
did you look in lost+found?
jmkasunich: not me
did you look on your last backup tape?
jmkasunich, not me either, unless I have room for the laser
I'm sorry, I didn't understand that :)
I have a small laser, networked even
that machine has no backup system at all
I'm not sure how well lasers travel though
yeah - mine is a network PS and HPGL laser
jmkasunich: might take the toner out and put it in a plastic bag
ISTR something in the packaging about never ever ever ship one with a toner cartridge installed
they're great, just take the toner cartridge out
that must be the right advice
or we're all wrong
60/40 that it's the right advice ;)
spiral taps and machinable wax. I coulda swore I had some was, but last time I looked I couldn't find it
hmmm. that's not great odds
I can bring some Al blocks for hte Mazak
jmkasunich: the taps are more important of the two
relatively large ones
jmkasunich: (and matching drills)
do we want tapping head(s) for comparison?
size is a tradeoff
larger won't break, but they'll use up a lot more material
and cost more when I manage to break them anyway
I have 3/8-16 spiral, 5/16-24, and #6,8-32
I'm not positive I have the right kind, but I can also bring several somewhat smaller ones (if I can find them)
actually, they may be the same threads you just mentioned
those are pretty standard
6-32 spiral is easy to break
I also have a couple of weird ones
like 5/16-32, and 1/4-40, very find for their size
hmm, question for Roland: what toolholders does he have?
hmmm. 1/4-40 is a great one for fine adjustment of big things ;)
correction, 1/4-48 ;-)
even better ;)
we had an optics pointing device with two screws that were something like #6 or #8, 64-pitch
I have 1/2-20 too, not spiral tho
somewhere, I know not where, I have a piece of gray PVC plastic 1" x 4" x 24"
I'll be happy to see the difference between the "right" tap for CNC tapping (with a tapmatic or rigid tapping) and "not the right ones" :)
back to the toolholding though - unless roland has a drill-chuck for the mazak, we aren't likely to be drilling or tapping
will the BP have spindle orient this year?
SWPadnos: what do you mean?
I have R8 holders
you mean the bp that was sitting in the doorway last year?
I think JonE wants to make one of the BP retrofits do tapping this year
I seriously doubt it has a spindle encoder
that's part of his "push" to get the index thing fixed
I wonder how he intends to do that :-)
cradek: your lathe spindle doesn't reverse does it?
I'm not sure what would be involved because I don't know what kind of feedback it has
SWPadnos: what did you mean by "the difference between the right tap for CNC"
for tapping - 'by hand' would be a good test (for the lathe)
I also don't have a motorized tailstock
very true, I could just turn it
cradek: I wasn't thinking of the tailstock
oh - I think Tapmatic recommends spiral taps vs "hand taps"
clamp the work to the table
SWPadnos: oh, that
[01:30:50] <cradek> http://www.sherline.com/reverse.htm
when I look at MSC, they have about 15 kinds of tap, and I have no idea what the real differneces are
for thru holes, spiral _point_ are best, for blind holes spiral flute
duh, I was looking only at spiral flute, I have a wider selection of spiral point
A current surge that can instantly burn out the speed control can occur if the switch is thrown in one direction while the motor is still turning in the other direction.
heh, here's one cradek can break: 7/16 BSW
"Bull Shit Weight" ?
ok, so not reversing the lathe
british standard whitworth I think
[01:35:20] <jmkasunich> http://www.hgrindustrialsurplus.com/search-products/product-detail.aspx?id=40-715-470&searchtable=1&sortExpression=&SortASC=&pageSize=50¤tPageIndex=0
wonder what that is?
it's a tapper
well no chit
it looks to be in rough shape
doesn't look like the usual procunier or tap-matic
it's similar to a Commander (I have a couple, if you want one)
heh, cradek won'
won't break these: http://www.hgrindustrialsurplus.com/search-products/product-detail.aspx?id=42-120-058&searchtable=1&sortExpression=&SortASC=&pageSize=50¤tPageIndex=0
it looks more like a rigid tap
I have a procunier #2
ok. I think that's similar to a Tapmatic 50 (or SPD5)
when I hit HGR tomorrow I'll see if there are taps for cheap
bins like this are kinda fun to root thru
[01:40:58] <jmkasunich> http://www.hgrindustrialsurplus.com/search-products/product-detail.aspx?id=30-304-957&searchtable=1&sortExpression=&SortASC=&pageSize=50¤tPageIndex=1
damn - now there's a spindle motor: http://www.hgrindustrialsurplus.com/search-products/product-detail.aspx?id=12-246-635
this looks kinda neat: http://www.hgrindustrialsurplus.com/search-products/product-detail.aspx?id=30-344-002&searchtable=1&sortExpression=&SortASC=&pageSize=50¤tPageIndex=1
4500RPM - that's pretty fast for such a big motor
yeah, that is cool
emc2-ubuntu6.06-desktop-i386.iso 0% 2576KB 42.1KB/s 4:29:59 ETA
ok. I should spend a little time with my visiting sister before I leave for a week. see you guys tomorrow (IRC) and Sunday (real life)
safe trip swp
that's faster than my upload speed :(
anybody need drills: http://www.hgrindustrialsurplus.com/search-products/product-detail.aspx?id=42-103-105&searchtable=1&sortExpression=&SortASC=&pageSize=50¤tPageIndex=1
I could put it on a tape and drive to work...
which is the main drawback to my building ISOs and .debs
guess why I don't do it very often
how difficult would it be to build debs on virtual machines?
it's the upload that kills you
but with VMs, it may be the build as well :)
my new box is pretty quick
I'm gonna get the farm moved over to it while I'm at the fest
seems like the farm machines ought to be able to build debs too
try doing a full build in a VM and not in a VM on that machine
iaven't set up vmware yet on it
its probably 2:1, but thats still not bad
building a kernel would take a while, but not building EMC
it's not really much time to wait for the builds - it would be the same effort on an infinitely fast machine
ok. I'm really leaving now. good luck at HGR tomorrow :)
I should try to remember to call Roland tomorrow and ask him if he has a drill chuck for the mazak
tap holder too
cradek: you need a machine AT work, do build the debs on
or the iso's anyway
I definitely could do that.
this'll be there tomorrow, which is soon enough though
jepler: taking camera equipment?
cradek: if I remember I'll bring my canon with 18-55 and 100mm macro lenses
if I don't, then I won't.
um ok, should I then?
I'll have my point-n-shoot
I kinda wish I was keeping my server online
I shouldn't bother then
ok if the mesa card isn't in the machine, it won't show up in lspci, even though it's packed
you need lsboxes
that would be great!
even better would be "findboxes" and "fillboxes"
cradek: did you solve your noise issues with ferrite? need any more ferrites?
the lathe is working perfectly now, except for the PS being a little saggy
I'll toss a comple in a box anyway, we might use them for something else
what about the threads component? :)
threads and motmod are the exceptions
and threads will go away sometime, when we have "newthread" as a command
heh. I didn't want to mention ...
I wonder what benefit there is to having task and io separate now
jepler: actually I wonder why io shouldn't be in RT
I get the impression that in the past (emc1) the way to customize was to replace io with a different program that knew the details of your I/O hardware
e.g. merged with the motion controller
jepler: that's correct
but it also was split in 3-4 different controllers just to prove the flexibility/design of NML
jepler: does a new translation count as a new feature?
I'd say a new translation is fine to include during a release series, if that's the question you're asking.
figures. I just released last night.
OK, I think I have the wiki updated for 2.1.6
I'll leave the linuxcnc parts for alex_joni
I sent the customary email
* jmkasunich prepares an HGR shopping list
"packages like Mach 2 that have a step and direction output for the spindle. The step pulse is converted to an analog level (the pot) and the step direction contact is in place of the FWD/REV switch. "
oh, it's just pwm
sounds a tiny bit like how I abused freqgen to get pwm(pdm)+direction for servo motors before the pwmgen component came along
can anybody think of anything else I should look for/at when I'm at HGR?
gonna try to find cheap taps for cradek to break'
do we take bets on how many will break before it is working ;)
that depends on what material he's trying to tap
wax would be nice
4140 heat treated ;-)
I'll be doing the SF stuff in a second too
ok - just got the quick ref cards
how'd they turn out?
they look pretty good, and now we know the correct decisions to make for another batch ;)
(I'd probably go with the 5 mil lamination, for one)
which decisions are?
the text of the G-code side is a little small. some folks with imperfect vision or low-level shop lighting may have a hard time reading them
I was afraid of that
other than that, they're nice
I think a two-column table, rotated 90 degrees would be better for that
next time around I think I'd like to enter it into easycad
but since that's a royal PITA, I'm happy with the result :)
did you find anything else fun at HGR?
found a mill for Cradek
unfortunately shipping will probably cost darn near the same as the mill
he lives in the middle of nowhere
I know the problem quite well
it seems in quite nice shape
[20:03:13] <jmkasunich> http://www.hgrindustrialsurplus.com/search-products/product-detail.aspx?id=30-166-001
the price is now $999
that's about 7' tall, right?
7'2, more or less
not counting the pallet it sits on
I live in the middle of the *country*
actually, thats one of the problems for transport - if its less than a certain height, it can go on a common carrier, which is much less expensive
and we're going nowhere, so therefore ...
I called HGR, he didn't have any ideas about Lincoln, but there's a local company called "Heavy Company" who moves about anything
the QC spindle is fine - it just took slightly more torque than I could get with my greasy bare hands
found a wrench?
local to you, or to hgr?
yeah, found a whole tub of them
local to me
"gantry to 1 million pounds" says their ad
[20:07:00] <jmkasunich> http://www.sjdiscounttools.com/arm34-307.html
thats the kind of wrench you use on the spindle
although you can use a non-adjustable one, or even make one pretty easily
do you know if it's a normal taper?
I think its a 30
the problem is going to be the garage door being less than 7'2 tall
actually 7'2 + palette is probably ideal
that's only a minor detail
yeah, just tip it on its side
I think it's a matter of velocity
to make it fit
its a dirt floor, right?
dig a trench
nope, I'm putting it on concrete
and the door .. is that over concrete too?
no, that's easier - get rid of the concrete and that's probably enough extra space ;)
remove from pallet outside, put on 1/2" diameter steel bars, and roll it
< cradek> the problem is going to be the garage door being less than 7'2
garage door is 7'0
or take the somewhat less easy route and remove the head assembly
cradek: you measured it already?
removal should be only 4 bolts plus whatever hoses/cables go up there
you can use an engine hoist to move it around
(once you get it down)
if you could remove the head here, you could greatly reduce shipping cost
because head and machine on seperate pallets would go in any old truck
for delivery to a freight terminal
instead of a dedicated truck
maybe even on the same pallet - put the head sideways on the table (with the knee lowered)
pallets are cheap
shipping hem isn
shipping them isn't
balancing the head on the table won't be fun tho
wood shims and ratchet straps ;)
where can you lift these things?
there's a 5/8 eyebolt hole on top (of the manual machines at least)
thats a good question
and people use a forklift under the ram (on the manual machines)
HGR will be happy to forklift it onto a truck using the pallet
in the photo, it's not on one
the CNC doesn't have the ram
it is now
I'm about 99% sure its a NMTB-30
jmkasunich: do you recall: would the machine be any less deep without that back cabinet?
yes, I believe the back cabinet adds about 8"
you'd have to remove the side cabinet too though
because its right hand side (when view from the right side of the machine) is flush with the back of the back cabinet
ouch, "heavy company" said probably $1500 (half day of work) for the last few miles :-/
I think they could do it though.
got a friend with a flatbed pickup trruck?
* alex_joni vaguely remembers that SWPadnos was talking about a truck
or, put another way, $100 +/- a case of beer may get you a friend with a flatbed pickup truck
it's a pirate trrrrruck ;)
seems like the forklift is more a problem than the truck
a flatbed doesn't need a forklift
they have winches
oh the tipping kind?
ok, sourceforge release and linuxcnc page updated with 2.1.6
cradek: still there?
did you see the message from Jon E
he will be working on the bport at the workshop
nice opportunity to see what you might be getting yourself into
yes I'm anxious to have a better look at that one
then make a decision
for instance, maybe some part other than the full head comes off the top
jmkasunich_ is now known as jmkasunich
I was thinking about spindle speed control - replace the air motor with a nema 23 stepper, use the spindle encoder for feedback
the only thing you'd have to do manually is gearchanges
"the spindle encoder" being the one you'll have to add of course, the mill doesn't have one
but I'm sure you want to do rigid tapping ;-)
probably not on day one, but yes
thanks again jmk
safe trip guys