#linuxcnc | Logs for 2014-10-30

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[02:14:58] <ssi> quiet tonight
[02:16:55] <zeeshan|2> yes
[02:16:55] <zeeshan|2> :D
[02:22:34] <XXCoder> no
[02:23:57] <Connor> Andy, What was that collet setup was that to hold the sprocket ?
[02:24:31] <ssi> Connor: he's gone :(
[02:24:36] <Connor> Doh.
[02:24:42] <ssi> I'd be curious to know what it was he was using that has the fancypants conversational screens
[02:24:50] <ssi> ngcgui didn't look that pretty last time I used it
[02:26:22] <Connor> Looks like some macro's or something.. Maybe something developed for Tormach's LCNC version ?
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[02:30:15] <Connor> What is a removable gab bed ? per the G4003 Lathe
[02:30:51] <jdh> a chunk near teh chuck can be removed for bigger swingover
[02:31:20] <PetefromTn_andro> It's a small removable piece of the bed that unbolts allowing a larger diameter piece to be turned
[02:31:30] <Connor> PetefromTn_andro: Did yours have it ?
[02:31:37] <PetefromTn_andro> Yeah
[02:31:44] <zeeshan|2> allows for bigger parts :D
[02:31:50] <Connor> Yup. Interesting.
[02:32:02] <ssi> Connor: it looks like the tormach stuff
[02:32:06] <zeeshan|2> problem is rigidity becomes a bit of an issue
[02:32:07] <ssi> I'd love to know how to get my hands on that
[02:32:11] <zeeshan|2> cause of the carriage over hang
[02:32:20] <Connor> ssi: Probably HELPED make it.
[02:32:20] <zeeshan|2> ssi
[02:32:24] <zeeshan|2> are you talking about the interface?
[02:32:29] <zeeshan|2> andypugh wrote that
[02:32:37] <zeeshan|2> i was poking fun at him
[02:32:41] <zeeshan|2> cause he took those pictures from inventor
[02:32:42] <zeeshan|2> :-)
[02:33:23] <ssi> lol
[02:33:32] <ssi> so I guess it's not generally available
[02:33:44] <zeeshan|2> he has a link to it on the linuxcnc forums
[02:33:47] <ssi> really?
[02:33:50] <ssi> I'd love to play with it
[02:33:58] <ssi> also I would like to play with inventor fusion
[02:34:08] <ssi> was watching one of his videos about it
[02:34:13] <ssi> and it looks pretty solidworxy
[02:34:33] <zeeshan|2> hes a pretty hardcore inventor user
[02:35:37] <ssi> fusion 360 is supposed to be cad/cam
[02:35:39] <ssi> is the cam worth a crap?
[02:36:52] <zeeshan|2> havent used it
[02:37:05] <zeeshan|2> eek
[02:37:09] <zeeshan|2> looks like autodesk alias
[02:37:12] <zeeshan|2> hard as hell to use
[02:37:17] <zeeshan|2> (alias that is)
[02:39:37] <ssi> well it's worth a shot
[02:39:42] <ssi> I need a good native cad/cam solution
[02:39:55] <ssi> and fusion360 is actually sanely priced, even as a subscription product
[02:40:02] <ssi> I'd happily pay $300/yr to have cad/cam native on the mac
[02:40:30] <zeeshan|2> so many options :)
[02:40:56] <ssi> so many options?
[02:40:57] <ssi> like what
[02:41:11] <zeeshan|2> legal copy
[02:41:14] <zeeshan|2> what you want to do
[02:41:28] <zeeshan|2> you can literally do pretty much everything in any cad/cam package these days
[02:41:35] <zeeshan|2> its when you get into the fancy machining stuff
[02:41:39] <zeeshan|2> some others shine
[02:41:51] <zeeshan|2> like solidworks and inventor are both a joke when working with 1000+ parts
[02:42:00] <zeeshan|2> nx and catia handle them easily
[02:42:03] <ssi> big assemblies you mean
[02:42:05] <zeeshan|2> yes
[02:42:12] <ssi> yeah I'd LOVE to get my hands on NX for osx
[02:42:18] <ssi> tehy're the only big cam to do osx before fusion did
[02:42:36] <zeeshan|2> i honestly started with nx cam
[02:42:38] <zeeshan|2> and i moved to masteram
[02:42:43] <zeeshan|2> nx cam isn't as intuitive
[02:43:05] <ssi> mastercam would be nice but I haven't been able to climb that mountain thus far
[02:43:14] <zeeshan|2> well honestly
[02:43:20] <ssi> and I'm willing to put up with something that's not the best out there if I can run it natively
[02:43:22] <zeeshan|2> it just takes a couple tutorials to get used to it
[02:43:26] <zeeshan|2> or i can show you step by step
[02:43:32] <zeeshan|2> once you do one or two parts
[02:43:35] <ssi> oh I'm not talking about learning it
[02:43:37] <zeeshan|2> i bet you can do majority of the jobs
[02:43:38] <ssi> I'm talking about installing it
[02:43:47] <zeeshan|2> ohh i see
[02:43:54] <zeeshan|2> yea i dont think mastercam exists for osx
[02:43:57] <ssi> no, it doesn't
[02:44:06] <ssi> and their anticrack stuff is pretty good
[02:44:09] <zeeshan|2> why do you hate windows so much
[02:44:16] <ssi> because it blows SOOOO MUCH
[02:44:20] <zeeshan|2> just have a computer
[02:44:23] <zeeshan|2> that's for cad/cam
[02:44:30] <ssi> heh I don't even have a house
[02:44:31] <Tom_itx> there are good packages for windows though
[02:44:36] <ssi> what makes you think I can have multiple computers :)
[02:44:49] <zeeshan|2> or dual boot
[02:44:54] <zeeshan|2> have 2 hds
[02:45:04] <Tom_itx> you should have at least 5
[02:45:04] <ssi> nothx
[02:45:07] <ssi> huge pain in the ass
[02:45:20] <ssi> plus it doesn't solve the problem
[02:45:25] <ssi> with the driver signing crap in windows
[02:45:30] <ssi> this stuff all got a lot harder
[02:45:35] <zeeshan|2> lol
[02:45:35] <ssi> and I'd rather just pay for something I can run
[02:45:39] <ssi> if it works worth a shit
[02:45:44] * zeeshan|2 hides
[02:45:48] <zeeshan|2> i dont know anything about illegal copies!
[02:45:54] <zeeshan|2> at least in the public channel :)
[02:45:55] <Tom_itx> do you need full 3d?
[02:45:59] <ssi> well I know you're not suggesting I buy mastercam
[02:46:03] <ssi> Tom_itx: yeah eventually
[02:46:12] <ssi> and 4th axis ideally
[02:46:30] <zeeshan|2> for me the most important think
[02:46:30] <Tom_itx> the price goes up for that
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[02:46:34] <zeeshan|2> is the link between cam and cad.
[02:46:42] <zeeshan|2> so if i change a hole size in my cad model
[02:46:46] <zeeshan|2> my program should automatically update
[02:46:59] <zeeshan|2> i hate doing shit twice
[02:47:04] <ssi> yes, I agree
[02:47:08] <Tom_itx> do it right the first time
[02:47:13] <ssi> lol
[02:47:16] <zeeshan|2> Tom_itx: unfortunately design doesnt work like that
[02:47:17] <zeeshan|2> :)
[02:47:38] <Tom_itx> so don't post it until it's right
[02:47:51] <Tom_itx> design the model then put the tool paths to it
[02:47:54] <zeeshan|2> you dont get me
[02:48:03] <zeeshan|2> sometimes i have parametric models like AN fittings
[02:48:07] <Tom_itx> yes i do
[02:48:07] <zeeshan|2> -8 -10 -16 etc
[02:48:17] <zeeshan|2> i dont want to have to recam the program
[02:48:22] <zeeshan|2> just because i need a scaled up model
[02:48:32] <zeeshan|2> right now it spits out code for me
[02:48:45] <ssi> ins adjuster told me to go buy a computer
[02:48:50] <ssi> so today I bought a 5k imac
[02:48:51] <ssi> wooo
[02:48:54] <zeeshan|2> haha
[02:48:56] <ssi> my god, it's full of pixels
[02:49:19] <XXCoder> lol
[02:49:23] <XXCoder> gonna love 2001 rwf
[02:49:26] <XXCoder> referemce
[02:50:23] <ssi> :)
[02:52:01] <XXCoder> I dont think 2061 and 3001 movies will ever be made
[02:53:12] <XXCoder> so far only 2 out of 4 books was made into movie
[02:53:42] <zeeshan|2> ssi are you an apple fan
[02:53:43] <zeeshan|2> :-)
[02:55:15] <ssi> I'm a unix fan, and I'm a fan of well-built hardware
[02:55:19] <ssi> so, based on that, yes
[02:55:25] <zeeshan|2> im suprised you down piece your own components
[02:55:27] <zeeshan|2> and built a computer
[02:55:30] <zeeshan|2> and just run linux
[02:55:33] <zeeshan|2> *build
[02:55:37] <ssi> linux is bullshit for desktops
[02:55:39] <ssi> I did it for years
[02:55:44] <jdh> it is afterall, the year of linux on the desktop
[02:55:45] <ssi> but I'm not that broke anymore
[02:55:51] <ssi> and I don't have that kind of time to screw with it
[02:56:02] <zeeshan|2> well usually you can build a better computer
[02:56:13] <ssi> not necessarily
[02:56:25] <ssi> I couldn't build a better computer than what I just bought for less than almost twice as much
[02:56:30] <zeeshan|2> like does your imac come with triple sli? :p
[02:56:37] <jdh> ran across a youtube video of a guys cnc'ed 9x20 with the x screw on the tailstock side.
[02:56:39] <ssi> don't need triple sli
[02:56:39] * zeeshan|2 doesnt know about imacs
[02:56:58] <ssi> do you know how much a 27" 5120x2880 monitor costs?
[02:56:59] <t12> building computers is fun
[02:57:01] <t12> if your time is worth nothing
[02:57:14] <jdh> it's a good for kids
[02:57:25] <ssi> answer: more than I paid for this whole computer, and you can't buy it til december
[02:57:35] <zeeshan|2> shrug
[02:57:38] <zeeshan|2> to me speed is more important
[02:57:53] <zeeshan|2> im running dual quadro k5000 sli
[02:57:58] <ssi> for what
[02:58:01] <ssi> gaming?
[02:58:01] <jdh> heh
[02:58:01] <zeeshan|2> i did not see that kind of setup on an off the shell computer
[02:58:05] <zeeshan|2> no
[02:58:06] <zeeshan|2> cad
[02:58:18] <ssi> ...k
[02:58:20] <zeeshan|2> and ansys
[02:58:28] <zeeshan|2> ??
[02:58:31] <ssi> I think I'll get by without triple sli
[02:58:39] <zeeshan|2> im just saying
[02:58:42] <ssi> and I'm very happy not listening to the fans of three big video cards
[02:59:03] <ssi> I did plenty of that when I was doing bitcoin mining
[02:59:11] <ssi> happy to have that noise out of my life
[02:59:36] <zeeshan|2> depends what you use the computer for at the end of the day
[02:59:59] <ssi> yeah and I'm sure that you'll tell me that your computer usage is more correct or more important or more something or other
[03:00:06] <ssi> and that I'm stupid for using what I use
[03:00:08] <ssi> and that's fine
[03:00:11] <zeeshan|2> wut
[03:00:12] <ssi> just be aware I don't criticize your choices :)
[03:00:25] <zeeshan|2> all i said was
[03:00:29] <zeeshan|2> im suprised you dont piece or youw o components
[03:00:35] <zeeshan|2> considering you're a smart electronics guy
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[03:00:40] <ssi> I did that when I was a teenager
[03:00:41] <zeeshan|2> and youre always building your own hardware
[03:00:47] <ssi> not a teenager anymore
[03:00:57] <zeeshan|2> so touchy :)
[03:00:59] <ssi> it's not interesting to me to build a crappier machine
[03:01:04] <Computer_Barf> can someone help a noob understand servomotors?
[03:01:09] <zeeshan|2> thats where i disagree with you
[03:01:10] <ssi> Computer_Barf: what do you want to know
[03:01:17] <zeeshan|2> crapier depends on what you're trying to do with it
[03:01:23] <ssi> zeeshan|2: we just have very different metrics about what makes a nice computer
[03:01:42] <Computer_Barf> well I am thinking about getting some AC servomotors for a cnc multimachine lathe/milling
[03:01:56] <Computer_Barf> and ive been looking at baldor's flexdrive 2
[03:02:05] <Computer_Barf> as the driver for the ac steppers
[03:02:13] <jdh> on a non-servo-related note, combo machines are not so hot
[03:02:27] <ssi> agreed
[03:02:31] <Computer_Barf> well, thats kind of the point of my project
[03:02:55] <Computer_Barf> http://cncmultimachine.blogspot.com/2014/10/blog-post.html
[03:03:28] <Computer_Barf> the flexdrive , it has encoder inputs for the motor on it
[03:03:57] <ssi> zeeshan|2: in other news, I signed up for the fusion360 trial awhile back and never actually used it
[03:04:01] <ssi> and burned up the trial period
[03:04:07] <Computer_Barf> but since the spindel on the lathe will be driven by a pully, i would assume i would also need an encoder on the controller
[03:04:08] <ssi> I'm pretty unlikely to buy it if I can't actually try it :P
[03:04:20] <zeeshan|2> hehe
[03:04:54] <Computer_Barf> so what im asking is that a normal think, for the driver to watch the encoder on the servomotor, and the controller to watch the encoder on the spindel?
[03:04:55] <ssi> Computer_Barf: not necessarily
[03:05:04] <zeeshan|2> man
[03:05:11] <zeeshan|2> ssi did i tell you i emailed amc?
[03:05:16] <zeeshan|2> was my drives should be arriving next week
[03:05:21] <zeeshan|2> and i cant figure out wtf power cable it uses
[03:05:22] <ssi> Computer_Barf: the encoder on the motor is sufficient, except that you'll have index pulses that don't matchu p 1:1 to your spindle
[03:05:27] <ssi> so you might need a mask or something
[03:05:28] <zeeshan|2> says 2256 w continuous power inthe manual
[03:05:35] <zeeshan|2> which is like 18A @ 120VAC
[03:05:41] <zeeshan|2> yet the connector theyre using is 10A
[03:05:42] <zeeshan|2> lol
[03:05:55] <ssi> heh
[03:06:07] <zeeshan|2> im curious to see what they'll say
[03:06:09] <zeeshan|2> cause it makes no sense to me
[03:07:05] <ssi> Computer_Barf: if your spindle drive is 1:1 ratio, then it doesn't matter at all... if the motor turns faster than the spindle, you can mask it. If the spindle turns faster than the motor, some stuff may work as is, some other stuff may not, not really sure
[03:07:16] <Computer_Barf> ssi: well since they don't match up, is it possible for linuxcnc to watch an encoder on the spindel? I definantly want to index the location of my headstock and although i guess you could work out the ratio , it seemed like it might drift
[03:07:34] <ssi> is it a V-belt driving it?
[03:07:35] <zeeshan|2> http://www.nvidia.ca/content/tesla/pdf/aa-v7-i3-accelerating-mechanical-solutions-with-gpus.pdf
[03:07:42] <zeeshan|2> ssi this is the article i saw a while back
[03:07:53] <zeeshan|2> it really helps so much when you're doing fluid simulation
[03:07:55] <zeeshan|2> which is a resource hog
[03:07:58] <Computer_Barf> ssi: the belt and ratios don't currently exist, this is planning.
[03:08:20] <zeeshan|2> "factorization" is offloaded to the gpu
[03:08:23] <ssi> Computer_Barf: you absolutely CAN use one encoder on the motor for the drive and one on the spindle for the control
[03:08:31] <ssi> Computer_Barf: but you don't have to, and I feel like it's overly complex
[03:08:50] <ssi> Computer_Barf: if you use timing belt to drive the spindle, then there'll be no drift, and the motor encoder counts are reliable
[03:09:11] <ssi> zeeshan|2: honestly if I were interested in doing stuff like that, I'd offload that kind of work to external computing resources
[03:09:21] <ssi> zeeshan|2: I wouldn't compromise my desktop environment for it
[03:09:38] <ssi> I'm quite familiar with using gpus for computing resources, as well as fpgas and custom asics :)
[03:10:17] <zeeshan|2> yea yea
[03:10:20] <zeeshan|2> we all wish we had supercomputers
[03:10:21] <zeeshan|2> :-)
[03:10:28] <ssi> personally, gpu speed for cad hasn't been an issue for me because I'm already constrained by the fact that I'm running solidworks inside a vm and get crap gfx performance
[03:10:42] <ssi> if I can run cad natively I'll get so much better gfx performance than I'm used to that I'll feel like I have triple sli :P
[03:10:45] <zeeshan|2> that must run so slow!
[03:10:50] <ssi> yeah it's not great
[03:10:51] <Computer_Barf> ssi: I guess you are saying that the timing belt and sprocket is so accurate that there won't be significantly measurable drift?
[03:10:59] <ssi> Computer_Barf: correct
[03:11:14] <ssi> they don't slip, they don't have backlash
[03:11:24] <Tom_itx> minimal
[03:11:27] <ssi> right
[03:11:40] <ssi> "significant" backlash
[03:12:03] <Computer_Barf> yes i was guessing that the actual size of the sprocket would have some small variation that might become evident over so many turns
[03:12:08] <Computer_Barf> but i know fuck all
[03:12:21] <Computer_Barf> thats me guessing in the dark with no experience
[03:12:43] <ssi> Computer_Barf: even if it does have some variance, one turn is always one turn
[03:12:44] <Tom_itx> no not if you know the drive ratio
[03:13:11] <ssi> it's not like your spindle will turn 50001 turns for 100000 turns of the motor or something
[03:13:17] <Tom_itx> you could use gears but they're noisy
[03:13:20] <ssi> it's a set number of teeth
[03:13:29] <ssi> gears lash a lot more
[03:13:51] <Computer_Barf> humm ok so my spindel will need a specific timing belt and sprocket on it
[03:14:13] <Tom_itx> i'm switching to timing belts too btw
[03:14:38] <Computer_Barf> I've been planing on getting a spindel off ebay from an atlas lathe
[03:15:50] <Computer_Barf> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Atlas-12-Metal-Lathe-Spindle-Gear-F-365-/360605507123?pt=BI_Heavy_Equipment_Parts&hash=item53f5c35e33
[03:15:59] <Computer_Barf> will this work with a timing belt or is that just for gears
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[03:16:40] <ssi> you need pulleys which have the proper tooth profile for the belt type you want to use
[03:16:49] <Computer_Barf> I guess the whole ratio thing would depend on what speed motor i get.
[03:16:55] <ssi> yep
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[03:18:40] <Computer_Barf> this listing has ended but they come around fairly often http://www.ebay.com/itm/Craftsman-12-034-Atlas-10-034-Lathe-Headstock-Spindle-1-1-2-x-8-TPI-Timken-Bearings-/221577641063?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2047675.l2557&nma=true&si=Im70Bnf5wowN7hpwsq1ndTLFgmY%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc
[03:19:05] <Computer_Barf> the timing belt , is that usually on the back or in the middle?
[03:19:18] <ssi> depends on the machine
[03:19:27] <ssi> usually on the back in my experience
[03:19:51] <ssi> but like south bend lathes are driven with flat belts in between the bearings
[03:20:01] <ssi> so that's an option, just depends on the headstock casting of your machine
[03:23:00] <Connor> What size taper is that ?
[03:26:27] <Computer_Barf> not sure, would need to look up the part number
[03:27:01] <Computer_Barf> the headstock will be cast from concrete so i could do the middle or the back
[03:27:31] <Computer_Barf> probably the middle would be preferable, there is a keyslot
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[03:40:52] <ssi> so far fusion360 doesn't seem too bad
[03:41:01] <ssi> it's different than sworx, and it'll take some getting used to
[03:41:43] <zeeshan|2> its always that first couple of weeks
[03:42:00] <zeeshan|2> eaton hired me even knowing i had limited inventor knowledge
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[03:42:12] <zeeshan|2> i had used it to do very basic extruding
[03:42:20] <zeeshan|2> but i used nx and solidworks religiously
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[03:42:28] <zeeshan|2> i picked up inventor in a week! :P
[03:42:36] <zeeshan|2> i really like software that's intuitive
[03:42:59] <zeeshan|2> week to get started, a couple months to pick up the tricks and a year to get to expert!
[03:45:52] <zeeshan|2> man i cant decide
[03:45:54] <zeeshan|2> to RELAX
[03:45:55] <zeeshan|2> or
[03:45:59] <zeeshan|2> go work on the hydraulic pump
[03:46:00] <zeeshan|2> hmmmmmm
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[03:51:59] <Computer_Barf> is it a crazy idea to 3d print a timing belt pully to temporary use while cutting an aluminum one?
[03:54:21] <XXCoder> dont think so
[03:54:28] <XXCoder> its not like it will run for 10,000 hours
[03:54:43] <XXCoder> but then dunno how fast it would wear
[03:54:44] <Computer_Barf> yeah only temporary
[03:55:20] <Computer_Barf> http://cncmultimachine.blogspot.com/2014/10/blog-post.html
[03:56:01] <Computer_Barf> this is my cncmultimachine idea , cast concrete forms, with some self leveling epoxy, epoxy granite in the right places.
[03:56:05] <XXCoder> wish I own something that can make cnc router parts. but then if I had it I would probably not need cnc router. ironoc
[03:56:13] <ssi> zeeshan|2: i'm learning how to do renderings in fusion360
[03:56:16] <ssi> sure which I had triple sli
[03:56:20] <zeeshan|2> lol
[03:56:24] <XXCoder> cool.
[03:56:28] <zeeshan|2> that shit eats cpu and gpu
[03:56:56] <Computer_Barf> XXCoder: yes I delt with the chicken/egg problem alot while building a 3d printer.
[03:57:02] <ssi> it's currently using 4717% cpu
[03:57:03] <ssi> hahahah
[03:57:06] <zeeshan|2> haha
[03:57:12] <XXCoder> barf my major issue right now is lazyness
[03:57:17] <ssi> nah more like 380%
[03:57:24] <ssi> but for a second it was 4717%
[03:57:43] <zeeshan|2> gotta break in the computer :)
[03:57:53] <Computer_Barf> my chicken egg solution was often a drill press and a file, so lazyness would certainly have stopped that.
[03:58:21] <ssi> the rendering stuff is pretty cool actually
[03:58:30] <ssi> soon I'll get to the cam tutoriaol
[03:58:42] <ssi> based on the cad, if the cam is anything like usable I'll probably pay for a subscription to this i
[03:58:47] <ssi> it's really pretty decent
[03:58:53] <Computer_Barf> can someone recommend a good controller for my project?
[03:59:02] <zeeshan|2> nice dude
[03:59:02] <zeeshan|2> :D
[03:59:35] <ssi> oh god
[03:59:43] <ssi> "Next, try the LASER CUT tutorial"
[03:59:44] <Computer_Barf> I've noticed that back in 2006 there was some reason why linux cnc didn't play nice with servomotors, is this still the case?
[04:00:14] <zeeshan|2> Computer_Barf: linuxcnc is not good
[04:00:19] <zeeshan|2> we all dont use it
[04:00:32] <Computer_Barf> umm
[04:00:39] <Computer_Barf> isn't this the linuxcnc room
[04:00:50] <ssi> no, it's the sarcasm room
[04:00:53] <zeeshan|2> i tried to answer your question
[04:01:33] <zeeshan|2> does mach have real time position feedback loop?
[04:01:39] * zeeshan|2 waits for an answer
[04:01:44] <zeeshan|2> looks like the answer is NO!
[04:01:47] <zeeshan|2> linuxcnc ftw
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[04:01:57] <XXCoder> heh I remember this guy
[04:01:59] <Computer_Barf> i dont think it does.
[04:02:08] <XXCoder> kept asking lathe stuff over and over
[04:02:11] <Computer_Barf> does linux cnc?
[04:02:17] <zeeshan|2> Computer_Barf: ofcourser
[04:02:19] <zeeshan|2> and it has more
[04:02:27] <XXCoder> it got so bad I made a macro to answer that with...
[04:02:28] <XXCoder> Pee on it.
[04:02:30] <zeeshan|2> is mach 3 open source?
[04:02:35] <zeeshan|2> the answer is no!
[04:02:41] <zeeshan|2> can i easily write drivers for mach 3?
[04:02:42] <zeeshan|2> HELL no!
[04:02:54] <Computer_Barf> wait do you guys think i am some big mach person?
[04:03:13] <zeeshan|2> no i got offended when you said linuxcnc has issues with servo loops
[04:03:17] <Computer_Barf> im not knowledgeable enough to play OS wars or something like it
[04:03:40] <Computer_Barf> no i just read it on some forum, and i noticed it was real old
[04:03:47] <Computer_Barf> i thought it might not be the case anymore
[04:03:56] <Computer_Barf> the flexdrive 2
[04:04:07] <pcw_home> AFAIK LinuxCNC (EMC) supported servos before step motors
[04:04:07] <zeeshan|2> please understand theres a lot of people in this room (i'm not one)
[04:04:16] <zeeshan|2> who spend hours in a day developing linuxcnc.
[04:04:21] <zeeshan|2> and when you ask a silly question like that
[04:04:23] <zeeshan|2> it's offensive
[04:04:28] <Computer_Barf> that i am looking at , it apparently does the feedback encoder stuff right in the driver and I would just be doing step/dir stuff with the controller and maybe running a second encoder with the controller
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[04:04:42] <Computer_Barf> im just trying to figure out if what I am thinking of is possible
[04:05:26] <Computer_Barf> zeshan|2 well please then just realize I don't know im being offensive
[04:06:32] <Computer_Barf> im not here trolling im just trying to figure out how I can meet my objectives. I personally want to use an open source option if I can
[04:06:33] <zeeshan|2> Computer_Barf: basically if you can dream it
[04:06:35] <zeeshan|2> linuxcnc can do it
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[04:06:45] <zeeshan|2> and if it cant, you can always modify it to do what you want
[04:06:49] <ssi> step/dir servo drives are for mach people
[04:06:56] <zeeshan|2> it did not have a modbus driver for my vfd
[04:06:58] <zeeshan|2> so i wrote one
[04:07:12] <zeeshan|2> i'm sure the real programmers would laugh at my silly code
[04:07:13] <zeeshan|2> but it works :P
[04:07:39] <Computer_Barf> ssi: the flexdrive has some other options but i wasn't able to find info on them for linux cnc
[04:07:58] <pcw_home> When EMC first existed at NIST it supported servos so servos are in its DNA from way back
[04:08:02] <ssi> they'll work fine with linuxcnc because they have a +/-10V analog control moed
[04:08:07] <ssi> mode
[04:08:19] <zeeshan|2> is 0 V off
[04:08:21] <zeeshan|2> iin that mode
[04:08:27] <ssi> 0V is no command
[04:08:32] <zeeshan|2> ah
[04:08:53] <zeeshan|2> i need to sit down and read the amc usermanual
[04:09:00] <zeeshan|2> and start planning
[04:09:02] <ssi> they have another document
[04:09:06] <Computer_Barf> http://www.ebay.com/itm/121453221626?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
[04:09:08] <ssi> which is all about how servo systems work and stuff
[04:09:13] <ssi> it was open on my other computer
[04:09:15] <zeeshan|2> ah
[04:09:16] <Computer_Barf> like , how would you guys control this?
[04:09:19] <ssi> but I can't really get at it right now
[04:09:40] <zeeshan|2> yes
[04:09:50] <zeeshan|2> honestly this is going to be a good experience
[04:10:01] <Computer_Barf> the specs are here: http://www.baldor.com/products/motioncontrol/flexdrive.asp
[04:10:02] <zeeshan|2> theres been so many times i wanted to do precise control for something
[04:10:09] <zeeshan|2> but didnt know how to do it
[04:10:16] <zeeshan|2> using a motor (exception of stepper)
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[04:13:20] <Computer_Barf> like they talk about fieldbus options like devisenet , profibus-dp, CANopen, which appear to be some sort serial interface, don't know if linux cnc can talk to that or not. They appear to have written some entire language for it.
[04:13:48] <zeeshan|2> canbus i think theres drivers
[04:14:03] <zeeshan|2> i think ssi will know the answer better than me
[04:14:11] <zeeshan|2> but i dont think serial is meant for high speed communication
[04:14:23] <Computer_Barf> OI
[04:14:24] <zeeshan|2> i suspect those protocols are so you can setup the drive parameters from a computer
[04:14:25] <Computer_Barf> woops
[04:14:43] <zeeshan|2> like for example
[04:14:53] <zeeshan|2> you send a hexadecimal string which ends with
[04:14:57] <zeeshan|2> "058F" or something
[04:15:02] <zeeshan|2> which might setup 1 parameter
[04:15:17] <Computer_Barf> I will probably just do step/dir for the time being , it just would be cool if I could dig into some of those features later
[04:15:32] <zeeshan|2> why would you do step and dir?
[04:15:41] <zeeshan|2> when a real servo and servo drive?
[04:15:46] <zeeshan|2> *with
[04:16:01] <Computer_Barf> because i dont know better and that is the first thing i recognize and sort of understand lol
[04:16:10] <zeeshan|2> fair enough
[04:16:55] <Computer_Barf> do you see something else on that link that would be perferable?
[04:18:10] <zeeshan|2> looks like a good drive.
[04:18:20] <Computer_Barf> yayyy
[04:18:30] <zeeshan|2> it looks complex though
[04:18:36] <Computer_Barf> booo
[04:18:37] <zeeshan|2> might be a pain in the butt to setup if youre new
[04:18:38] <Computer_Barf> lol
[04:19:02] <Computer_Barf> well i do want something to grow into and im fine with a bit of a challenge.
[04:19:33] <Computer_Barf> im just wondering what other method you might be referring to to control it
[04:19:39] <zeeshan|2> notice how it says
[04:19:43] <zeeshan|2> "analog and step&dir"
[04:19:48] <zeeshan|2> analog is a better way to control it
[04:20:24] <zeeshan|2> because you'll have a velocity loop between the servo motor and servo drive which basically means that when something tells the servo drive to move at 5 rev/s for example
[04:20:33] <Computer_Barf> the step dir i believe are digital pins, where might I find these analog pins?
[04:20:39] <zeeshan|2> it'll really move at 5.00 rev/s +/- a little error
[04:21:05] <zeeshan|2> analog is important because you'll have encoders or something on your stepper
[04:21:19] <zeeshan|2> that you can send the signal to linuxcnc
[04:21:29] <zeeshan|2> from there you can use that signal to setup position feedback
[04:21:42] <zeeshan|2> linuxcnc outputs "analog"
[04:22:06] <Computer_Barf> ahh i thought that the position feedback stuff was all handled by the driver
[04:22:17] <zeeshan|2> from the looks of it
[04:22:28] <zeeshan|2> that baldor drive i think handles the position feedback too
[04:22:30] <zeeshan|2> so youre right
[04:22:38] <zeeshan|2> i dont know
[04:22:41] <zeeshan|2> im just starting off with servos
[04:22:42] <zeeshan|2> :P
[04:22:57] <Computer_Barf> well either way is probably ok with me
[04:23:35] <Computer_Barf> If I can't figure out the timing belt thing I might need to put a second encoder on the spindle shaft
[04:23:45] <Computer_Barf> but it sounds like linuxcnc can also do that.
[04:24:14] <Computer_Barf> I've gravitated twords those baldor drives because there are so many cheap baldor servomotors out there on the market
[04:25:03] <Computer_Barf> I basically want a big servomotor with suitable torque and rpms for the spindel
[04:29:30] <Computer_Barf> someone mentioned they were going to have to do the timing belt route earlier, still around?
[04:34:51] <Computer_Barf> http://www.baldor.com/products/servomotors/n_series/bsm_nseries_spec.asp?CatalogNumber=BSM63N-150AA
[04:35:26] <Computer_Barf> would this motor be sufficient for a cnc lathe? Im no good with understanding Lb-in or N-m
[04:37:26] <zeeshan|2> you cant pick a motor without understanding torque
[04:37:31] <zeeshan|2> and speed
[04:40:03] <toastyde1th> running the numbers on the datasheet that's a pretty tiny motor
[04:40:08] <toastyde1th> for spindle power
[04:50:19] <Computer_Barf> toastyde1th: well perhaps you could give me a good starting point for my lathe/milling machine. I've been thinking for rpms i would be doing two or three thousand rpm. I've been thinking 2 hp
[04:51:04] <Computer_Barf> there are lots of baldor motors out there so if you give me an idea i could check their line
[04:51:14] <toastyde1th> 1-2hp is good for a small machine, 2-3k rpm is good for a manual machine but not so great for cnc
[04:51:33] <toastyde1th> i don't deal with motors often enough to be comfortable giving suggestions, sry
[04:51:48] <Computer_Barf> well those were only my guesses, a bunch of the baldors do stuff like 4-10k rpm
[04:52:00] <Computer_Barf> im not really asking for a final suggestion though
[04:52:10] <toastyde1th> also the hp doesn't matter quite as much at those spindle speeds because the tools are itty bitty
[04:52:15] <Computer_Barf> just trying to get broad strokes at the moment
[04:52:21] <toastyde1th> but if you have 2 hp on the low end, and a high spindle max, you're good
[04:52:42] <Computer_Barf> yeah often they dont say the hp
[04:52:57] <toastyde1th> gotta do the multiplication from the torque/speed chart
[04:53:13] <ssi> zeeshan|2: here's another reason I like apple stuff
[04:53:14] <Computer_Barf> thats what i need
[04:53:22] <ssi> I'm talking to you from the computer that I pulled out of the house
[04:53:26] <Computer_Barf> a torque speed chart
[04:53:28] <ssi> the facetime camera is melted
[04:53:31] <ssi> but everything else works fine
[04:53:32] <ssi> https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B1K2QFuIEAE-guz.jpg:large
[04:53:41] <toastyde1th> each motor has a different torque/speed chart, so it kinda sucks
[04:54:42] <Computer_Barf> ahh i thought something else then
[04:54:49] <Computer_Barf> that computer is dirty
[04:54:51] <toastyde1th> i don't deal with motors much, so I am of limited help on how to spec them
[04:55:05] <Computer_Barf> probably better than me
[04:55:26] <toastyde1th> but if you're looking for HP at a particular speed, you look at the voltage line you plan on using, and then reference the speed the machine is running at to find the torque
[04:56:00] <toastyde1th> then, if it's pound-inches, you have 1/12 * torque-in-pound-inches * rpm / 5252
[04:56:09] <toastyde1th> that'll give you the HP at that spindle speed
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[04:57:08] <ssi> Computer_Barf: it went through a house fire
[04:57:45] <Computer_Barf> funny how the screen looks so clearn
[04:57:53] <ssi> I pulled nthe glass off the front
[04:57:56] <ssi> needs to be cleaned
[04:58:06] <ssi> the plastic housing of the isight camera in the top is melted
[04:58:10] <ssi> but the camera still works
[05:06:20] <Computer_Barf> ok the range is 4Lb-IIn to 354 Lb-In
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[05:10:54] <Computer_Barf> http://news.thomasnet.com/fullstory/lathe-features-electronic-servo-motor-and-threading-computer-556370
[05:11:07] <Computer_Barf> here is a servomotor lathe with 44 lb-in
[05:11:47] <Computer_Barf> looks around the size I am shooting for , maybe a little smaller.
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[05:20:33] <Connor> ssi: Reminds me of the TI-99-4A
[05:20:40] <Connor> that was in my house fire when I was a kid.
[05:21:02] <ssi> haha
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[05:21:25] <Connor> Yank the HD and have the insurance replace it.
[05:21:34] <ssi> they already authorized me to buy a new machine
[05:21:38] <ssi> I bought a 5k retina imac today
[05:21:47] <ssi> I was actually pulling the hd, but I decided to power it up
[05:21:49] <ssi> and it WORKS FINE
[05:21:50] <ssi> amazing
[05:22:04] <ssi> so that can be my shop cad/cam machine :)
[05:22:22] <ssi> I'll never worried about it getting greasy or scratched or whatever
[05:22:22] <Connor> Replace the mouse and keyboard at least. :)
[05:22:26] <ssi> cause it's already literally been through hell
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[05:23:29] <Computer_Barf> you could cnc up a new faceplace for it
[05:23:37] <Connor> Computer_Barf: Your looking to put 5HP on a lathe using that Atlas spindle ?
[05:23:47] <Computer_Barf> no
[05:23:56] <Computer_Barf> probably less than that
[05:24:36] <Computer_Barf> 2-3 idk
[05:24:52] <Connor> Slant bed?
[05:24:56] <Computer_Barf> what hp do you think it willl explode
[05:25:00] <Computer_Barf> no
[05:25:14] <Computer_Barf> http://cncmultimachine.blogspot.com/2014/10/blog-post.html
[05:25:29] <Connor> Well.. That atlas spindle was small.. I would think you would want something a little more beefy..
[05:25:35] <Computer_Barf> concrete / epoxygrante / epoxy
[05:26:06] <Computer_Barf> nothing is final at this point.. I'm just finding parts I liike
[05:26:41] <Computer_Barf> I was considering making my own spindle using steadyrests and a temporary headstock
[05:26:48] <Connor> I'm going to build a 4th Axis / Lathe Spindle for my G0704. Going to use a headstock from a 7x machine and convert it to 5C collet
[05:26:56] <Computer_Barf> but buying something already made feels better
[05:27:25] <Connor> I probably use the original motor that was on the G0704 which is 600 to 750w motor.
[05:28:09] <Computer_Barf> im on the whole servomotor kick because i want to index the headstock
[05:28:31] <ssi> Connor: I have a guy delivering me a forklift to the airport friday, then making two trips up to the house with his rollback
[05:28:36] <ssi> one to get the machines and one to get my forklift
[05:28:37] <Computer_Barf> the machine you just mentioned looks tempting
[05:28:37] <Connor> Yea. I plan on adding a encoder the the motor to convert it to a servo
[05:28:41] <ssi> all for $1050
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[05:29:10] <Connor> ssi Nice. What are you going to do with you G0704 now that your going to have all your eq at the hanger and no longer a shop in the house? Or have you decided on that yet ?
[05:29:25] <ssi> I'll set it up and use it
[05:29:26] <ssi> or sell it
[05:29:27] <Connor> G0704 Is a REALLY nice machine to start of with.
[05:29:36] <ssi> or maybe trade it to the city building inspector for a horizontal mill he has
[05:29:37] <ssi> hahah
[05:29:37] <Computer_Barf> connor: do you think that plan might be able to machine stainless?
[05:29:42] <Connor> lots of mods for it.. lots of conversions on CNCZone
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[05:30:23] <Connor> I have NO experience with stainless on the G0704.
[05:30:33] <Connor> It is more rigid that a X3.
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[05:30:52] <Computer_Barf> my whole journy into this has been motivated by a struggle i had when building a filament extruder
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[05:31:05] <Computer_Barf> I created a machine that makes filament for 3d printers
[05:31:12] <Computer_Barf> but the stainless metal parts,
[05:31:14] <Connor> Ahh Cool.
[05:31:17] <Computer_Barf> i went though hell making them
[05:31:31] <ssi> heh if you get far enough down this rabbit hole you won't care so much about 3d printers anymore :)
[05:31:37] <Computer_Barf> i had to drill .75" holes in 1/4" stainless plate and
[05:31:46] <Computer_Barf> it was really hard to not have it work harden
[05:31:59] <Computer_Barf> i could drill a half inch hole in it in minutes
[05:32:09] <Connor> ssi: That's exactly what happened to me.. I got into CNC stuff for doing robotics.. ended up making CNC a hobby in and unto itself..
[05:32:13] <Computer_Barf> but a 3/4" could take me hours
[05:32:13] <roycroft> slow speed and fast feed
[05:32:31] <roycroft> and ss will still be a bitch
[05:32:32] <ssi> Computer_Barf: what sort of tool were you using to do it?
[05:32:36] <ssi> you have to run big drills very slow
[05:32:41] <Connor> I would say the G0704 could drill/mill the holes in the stainless.
[05:32:42] <ssi> and you need to step up
[05:32:52] <ssi> can't take 3/4" in one bite, or three bites even
[05:32:56] <Computer_Barf> ssi: well, the problem is that all i have is a cheap drill press
[05:33:07] <Computer_Barf> and the belts only go so slow
[05:33:11] <ssi> yeah for big holes like that you need slow speeds, which means torque
[05:33:19] <Computer_Barf> the drill was iron oxide
[05:33:23] <ssi> like a back-geared mill head
[05:33:31] <roycroft> i had to drill a bunch of 7/8" and 1" holes in 16ga ss recently
[05:33:39] <roycroft> i used carbide tipped hole saws
[05:33:54] <Connor> or, mill it out.. and use a boring head for finial sizing if the size is critical.
[05:33:59] <Computer_Barf> yeah i literally ground the tips off a carbide hole saw
[05:34:13] <roycroft> a really heavy feed is the key
[05:34:19] <roycroft> you need to cut the stuff before it gets hot
[05:34:27] <Computer_Barf> not to mention it didn't hold still enough, got about half way in and it had moved so much the part would have been useless had I made it through
[05:34:48] <Connor> You didn't have it in a vise or clamped ?
[05:35:03] <Computer_Barf> when i did finally make make three holes in plate, i cut out the flanges with a grinder and literally filed them round
[05:35:25] <Computer_Barf> Connor: i did, its just that the chinese build craftsman drill press sucks
[05:35:40] <Computer_Barf> the table isn't designed to hold still properly
[05:35:44] <Computer_Barf> its really horrible thing
[05:35:49] <Connor> I have a little Craftsman drill press.
[05:36:13] <Computer_Barf> I bought it because i had one when i was younger
[05:36:16] <Connor> http://www.ivdc.com/cnc/shop/562.JPG
[05:36:21] <Computer_Barf> what i bought was not nearly as good
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[05:37:13] <Computer_Barf> the point where the plastic pully attaches to the spindel, the grub screw slipped out of place and ground the shaft down
[05:37:28] <Connor> My mill: http://www.ivdc.com/cnc/mill_04_09_14_02.jpg
[05:37:30] <Computer_Barf> I'll basically need a lathe to fix that now.
[05:37:50] <Connor> Computer_Barf: Ouch
[05:37:54] <Computer_Barf> what nema size is on that
[05:38:08] <Connor> The spindle? or the stepper?
[05:38:18] <Computer_Barf> oh i assumed you are using the stock spindel
[05:38:28] <Computer_Barf> i ment the steppers
[05:38:32] <Connor> No. The spindle has been upgraded.
[05:38:43] <Computer_Barf> I would go the route you've gone but
[05:38:44] <Connor> Nema 23, 570 Oz In Steppers
[05:39:01] <Computer_Barf> i know im going to need to not just cut out flanges, but thread them , and thread the pipes going into them
[05:39:19] <Computer_Barf> and make conical nozzels, and thread them too
[05:39:24] <roycroft> you're going to thread ss pipe?
[05:39:31] <Connor> spindle is treadmill motor. 1.75HP Continuous duty
[05:39:53] <Computer_Barf> roycrof: well thats what I need to do
[05:39:59] <roycroft> good luck with that
[05:40:11] <Connor> Wonder if thread milling would work...
[05:40:26] <Computer_Barf> otherwise i would need to weld them like i did for the prototypes
[05:40:37] <roycroft> i bought some tri-clover to 1" mpt adapters a while back
[05:40:40] <Computer_Barf> the stainless steel was a thermal properties choice
[05:40:49] <roycroft> the pipe side was a wee bit oversize
[05:40:57] <roycroft> i had to chase the threads down with a die
[05:41:23] <roycroft> that was a whole lot of work, just to cut them down a wee bit
[05:41:24] <Computer_Barf> yeah ive seen tubalcains videos on dies and was thinking about that
[05:41:47] <Connor> Thread Milling? or die ?
[05:41:49] <roycroft> i'd use a single-point tool in a lathe if i were cutting threads in ss from scratch
[05:41:51] <Computer_Barf> yeah.. Those stainless flanges were a nightmare
[05:41:57] <Computer_Barf> Connor: ive considered both
[05:42:14] <roycroft> i would not even attempt it with a die
[05:42:26] <Computer_Barf> i would need to threadmill inside a .75 hole in a flange, and outside a .75 pipe
[05:42:40] <Connor> how tall the pipe ?
[05:42:48] <roycroft> taper thread?
[05:42:57] <Computer_Barf> about 7 inches
[05:43:07] <Connor> Hmm..
[05:43:18] <Computer_Barf> it needs to be tight enough to hold in hot plastic
[05:43:25] <Computer_Barf> so yeah taper thread i guess
[05:43:41] <Connor> Would have to rotate the head.. I don't think you would have enough room to do that vertically in the mill.
[05:43:43] <Computer_Barf> might be able to teflon the thread but perferably not
[05:43:59] <Computer_Barf> ahh yeah i see what you mean
[05:44:15] <Computer_Barf> there is another possiblity
[05:44:18] <roycroft> and you need to be able to disassemble this?
[05:44:22] <Computer_Barf> it doesn't have to be threaded
[05:44:23] <roycroft> if not, i would weld it
[05:44:28] <Connor> and it's a pain in the ass to have to re-tram it all the time.
[05:44:34] <Computer_Barf> i could instead change the design of the flanges
[05:44:41] <Computer_Barf> and have them have side grub screws
[05:44:56] <Computer_Barf> idk i would worry about plastic leaking though
[05:45:11] <Computer_Barf> well the welding would work for the flanges
[05:45:16] <Connor> Well.. a 4th axis would help. :)
[05:45:20] <Computer_Barf> but not for the nozzel and filter
[05:45:34] <Computer_Barf> i had concerns about the power of a 4th axis
[05:45:39] <roycroft> welding is going to be 100x easier than cutting internal and external taper threads
[05:45:40] <Connor> how big of pipe in diameter ?
[05:45:53] <roycroft> so anywhere you can weld instead of thread is a win
[05:45:54] <Computer_Barf> its .75" wide diameter
[05:46:03] <Computer_Barf> well
[05:46:11] <Computer_Barf> i could
[05:46:31] <Computer_Barf> but im welding pretty ghetto for the time being
[05:46:41] <Computer_Barf> my miller tig welder is 1000 miles away in storage
[05:46:46] <roycroft> hire that part out
[05:47:02] <Computer_Barf> I've been doing prototype welds with batterys and stick
[05:47:31] <roycroft> well don't bother welding ss that way
[05:47:36] <roycroft> it's pointless
[05:47:37] <Computer_Barf> i managed to make my own extruder , but i basically need to plan a route to make many of them, plus i want the gains in what I can do
[05:47:58] <Computer_Barf> roycroft: well it worked well enough for my personal one
[05:48:04] <roycroft> it won't be ss any more
[05:48:23] <Computer_Barf> oh i got a ss stick welding rod
[05:48:26] <roycroft> without an inert shield gas the weld will start corroding over time
[05:48:42] <Computer_Barf> its good enogh, 99 percent of it is stainless
[05:48:57] <Computer_Barf> its for thermal retention , not corrosion resistence
[05:50:03] <Computer_Barf> basically, if the heat rides up the shaft too high, it can melt plastic in portions of the extruder that would cause it to jam, you just want the bottom heating up with as little travel as possible
[05:50:15] <Computer_Barf> otherwise i would have just made the thing out of aluminum
[05:50:21] <Computer_Barf> that would have been wayyyy easier
[05:50:57] <Computer_Barf> the nozzel could be made out of brass , but i would still need to thread the stainless steel at the bottom
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[05:51:50] <Computer_Barf> i could give aluminum flanges a try, but its possible it might leak. Plus i think maybe the aluminum/stainless contact might electrolytically corrode
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[05:52:27] <Computer_Barf> the flanges shouldn't matter as far as thermal stuff goes, they are seperated by a teflon block.
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[05:53:28] <Computer_Barf> Connor , so stainless steel could it be threaded on a 4th axis or is that just too strong
[05:54:17] <Computer_Barf> your machine looks appealing as a starter machine. What model is that brushless dc?
[05:57:01] <Computer_Barf> Connor: so stainless steel could it be threaded on a 4th axis or is that just too strong ?
[05:58:31] <Connor> Probably could (4th axis in lathe mode).. You might need to use a steady rest for 7" pipe though.. unless your 4th axis was large enough for the pipe to thread through.
[05:58:40] <Connor> err go through.
[05:59:25] <Computer_Barf> are those 4th axis usually nema 34 powered?
[05:59:33] <Connor> or some how fix it so you could turn it between centers.
[06:00:10] <Connor> Computer_Barf: I wouldn't use a stepper. I would use a servo.
[06:00:33] <Computer_Barf> and ive landed back in the servo selection dillemma
[06:00:34] <Connor> and not a rotary table type 4th axis.
[06:00:54] <Computer_Barf> yea, i assumed lathe kind
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[06:01:31] <Computer_Barf> ive spent much of the week trying to decide on a servo motor / driver / controller selection
[06:02:11] <Connor> The mill itself is easy. 570 Oz for all the axis.. 1605 ball screws for X and Y, 2005 for the Z.
[06:02:35] <Connor> upgrade the spindle to belt drive with a 1.5 to 1.75 HP Treadmill motor.
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[06:02:54] <Connor> 4th axis design is a different thing.. and, that's were your going to go down the rabbit hole.
[06:03:26] <Computer_Barf> yes i was asking about the model number of the treadmil motor
[06:03:54] <Computer_Barf> yeah the servo motor on the 4th axis
[06:04:06] <Computer_Barf> pretty similar to servo motor selection for a lathe
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[06:04:48] <Computer_Barf> what is the working space on the grizzly?
[06:05:06] <Connor> http://www.ebay.com/itm/TREADMILL-PERMANENT-MAGNET-DC-MOTOR-GENERATOR-WINDMILL-LATHE-2-80-HP-PROFORM-/291281076278?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item43d1b48036
[06:05:16] <Connor> that's the exact treadmill motor I have.
[06:06:26] <Connor> Stock: 18 7/8" X, 6 7/8 Y, Z around 11" to the table..
[06:06:45] <Connor> When I'm done with my conversion the Y will be 9 1/2"
[06:07:02] <Connor> you can add more Z too it too.. by flipping the Z saddle and doing some additional mods..
[06:07:17] <Computer_Barf> the plan ive been workign on is basically a lathe that can do horizontal milling like a gingery mill , with a bed space of 12x18"
[06:08:31] <Connor> Table size: 7-1/16" x 26-5/8"
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[06:09:38] <Computer_Barf> my goal is that it should be able to cut out the parts to make supports and other parts for an overhead gantry, to self upgrade iinto a overhead spindle cnc machine
[06:11:04] <Computer_Barf> Connor: I presume that the 7-1/16" dimension, you could have metal overhanging tword you on the machine right
[06:11:14] <Connor> Oh yea.
[06:11:31] <Computer_Barf> like you could put something bigger than that on the bed and have it overhang, then turn it
[06:11:57] <Connor> Yes. as Long as it's short enough to not hit the column.
[06:12:27] <Computer_Barf> ther are certain triangular parts i would be milling for the cnc machine gantry that act as braces
[06:12:43] <Computer_Barf> no i ment the overhang being opposite to the column
[06:12:55] <Connor> yea. that would be fine.
[06:13:13] <Computer_Barf> humm.
[06:13:41] <Connor> go on cnczone.com and browse the benchtop sub-forum.
[06:14:05] <Computer_Barf> Planning my machine won't be without challenges , its tempting to get one like yours
[06:14:30] <Connor> http://www.ivdc.com/cnc/cnc8.jpg
[06:14:34] <Connor> My first CNC machine.
[06:14:41] <Connor> Built with table saw and hand drill
[06:14:52] <Connor> and the router a little bit later on.
[06:15:11] <Computer_Barf> well I was going to bujild a joe cnc
[06:15:22] <Computer_Barf> their new one 4x8
[06:15:27] <Computer_Barf> it can do aluminum but
[06:15:32] <Connor> 12" x 18" x 4.5"
[06:16:08] <Computer_Barf> I have basically to worry about these stainless steel parts , and i might ocassionally want to cut out some mild steel
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[06:16:22] <Computer_Barf> it puts me in the position of wanting too machine machines at once
[06:16:41] <Connor> You kinda need a mill and a lathe.
[06:17:27] <Computer_Barf> yes this is why I was considering building a machine that takes on both of those rolls
[06:17:51] <Connor> One thing I learned building my CNC router..
[06:18:02] <Connor> I built it to be both a router, and a 3D printer..
[06:18:18] <Computer_Barf> i had looked at the 4th axis stuff "the ultimate 4th axis" videos on youtube
[06:18:25] <Computer_Barf> well a 3d printer needs more speed
[06:18:50] <Connor> Combination machines may be versatile.. but, rarely do they do a good job at all there tasks.
[06:19:07] <Computer_Barf> well , combination lathes and mills exist
[06:19:21] <Connor> My Router can do 200 IPM. I used 1610 ballscrews. (1 turn per 10mm)
[06:19:36] <Connor> but.. it so heavy that the acceleration wasn't supper good for printing.
[06:19:53] <Connor> Yea. and those 3-in-1 machines aren't all that..
[06:19:57] <Computer_Barf> well yeah thats what i ment
[06:20:16] <Connor> Now adding things like 4th axis... etc..
[06:20:30] <Computer_Barf> the issue i had with the commercual 3 in 1 machines was the working space
[06:20:50] <Connor> helps.. but, you really need one that would allow you to put that pipe all the way through the chuck.. or you would have to use a steady rest or some how rig it between centers..
[06:21:23] <Connor> I hate to cut this short.. but, it almost 2:30am. I need to clean up and get to bed.
[06:21:46] <Computer_Barf> i originally was going to build my own spindel but yes that would have required more steady rest stuff and it just seemed like that much more of a challenge to an already ambitious task
[06:21:58] <Computer_Barf> ahh its cool
[06:22:26] <Computer_Barf> but yes the original spindel I was planning on a decent hole though the middle
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[06:52:24] <cathode> goddamnit. i hate when i'm dyslexic and mess things up
[06:53:13] <cathode> https://www.dropbox.com/s/c6lwn9knjoiy319/2014-10-29%2021.53.33.jpg?dl=0
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[06:53:56] <cathode> the pieces on the top are an inch longer than they're supposed to be and the holes at each end are referenced off the end, not off one end
[06:54:43] <cathode> also some of the holes are way off (somehow) measure twice cut once? doesn't work when you're dumb twice in a row
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[07:11:35] <archivist> "some adjustment required"
[07:11:46] <cathode> :(
[07:12:03] <cathode> good thing i was already planning on painting this stuff. i'll drill new holes and fill the others with JB weld
[07:15:13] <archivist> rivet metal in for best :)
[07:16:29] <cathode> eh?
[07:18:30] <archivist> a clock dial we did, no chance of paint to hide the inserts http://www.collection.archivist.info/searchv13.php?searchstr=norfolk
[07:19:38] <archivist> with the right shape hole you can make a very strong repair
[07:19:44] <cathode> i guess i dont understand how that would help me
[07:21:15] <archivist> better than jbweld can be drilled, tapped etc
[07:21:25] <Computer_Barf> http://miami.craigslist.org/mdc/tls/4697702986.html
[07:21:34] <Computer_Barf> you guys think this could thread stainless steel?
[07:21:54] <cathode> archivist - but .... i ... forget it.,
[07:22:01] <cathode> i'm not going to rivet it
[07:22:04] <cathode> that's dumb, sorry.
[07:22:31] <cathode> Computer_Barf - those things are like $500 new, aren't they?
[07:22:52] <Computer_Barf> you are thinking of the harbor freight ones
[07:23:06] <Computer_Barf> http://miami.craigslist.org/mdc/tls/4721362164.html
[07:23:08] <Computer_Barf> like that
[07:23:39] <cathode> yes, but i don't imagine that $1000 one is much better
[07:24:19] <Computer_Barf> 7x10 vs 9 x 20
[07:24:32] <Computer_Barf> so nearly double the length
[07:24:55] <Computer_Barf> but regardless, im wondering if its even possible to thread stainless with a lathe like these
[07:25:23] <cathode> i'm sure if you could set up a pump and coolant pond below it would help
[07:25:37] <cathode> i havent worked with stainless much but if it gets hot at all... game over.
[07:25:39] <Computer_Barf> it actually appears the table has that
[07:26:06] <Computer_Barf> yes thats the problem with drilling it on the press
[07:30:31] <cathode> yep.
[07:30:46] <cathode> i stick to aluminum usually. its pretty forgiving to work with :)
[07:30:52] <Computer_Barf> that and torque
[07:31:10] <Computer_Barf> i would use aluminum but the application requires it for heat properties
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[08:02:14] <Deejay> moin
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[12:24:56] <taiden> morning all
[12:25:32] <taiden> I had a strange thought today
[12:26:11] <taiden> Id like to build another desktop CNC router, but the footprint needs to be very small... ie 12x12x6 or even smaller
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[12:26:40] <taiden> I would benefit greatly from a rotary axis oriented as a C-axis
[12:27:33] <taiden> if I had an X,Z,C 3 axis setup, I was wondering if I could use Kinematics module to convert traditional XYZ toolpaths to work properly
[12:29:08] <skunkworks> yes.
[12:29:30] <skunkworks> if your asking how - that is above my pay grade... :)
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[12:30:21] <taiden> that's probably fair ahha
[12:30:40] <taiden> I ask because I've never used the Kinematics module
[12:30:49] <taiden> but if you think it's a reasonable strategy, then I think it's worth investing in
[12:31:29] <taiden> especially with a name like "skunkworks," I feel I should consider your advice more than anyone else on here :)
[12:32:04] <jdh> C would be rotation around the Z?
[12:32:15] <taiden> yes
[12:33:15] <taiden> the parts I make are cylindrical in nature but I would also like to be able to make parts that work well with a rectilinear coordinate system
[12:33:22] <skunkworks> I know that had been discussed before.. but I don't know if anyone has made it.
[12:34:16] <taiden> I haven't been in front of LinuxCNC in almost a year. Would this be something I could test in software only before I purchase parts?
[12:34:35] <taiden> I fear that the output on screen would be garbled
[12:34:45] <jdh> I can't picture that as XZC, but I might not have the greatest spatial rotation thinking.
[12:34:58] <skunkworks> yes. you could also make a virtual model using vismach...
[12:35:33] <taiden> OK. thank you skunkworks for the suggestion
[12:35:40] <skunkworks> the rotory table would be - well the table. you would then 2 linear axis - x and z.
[12:35:57] <skunkworks> *have
[12:36:01] <taiden> confirmed yes, that is the strategy i have in mind :)
[12:36:04] <zeeshan|2> two x and y coordinates and c would need a special transfromation matrix i'd think
[12:36:42] <zeeshan|2> cause usually you're working on cartesian or joint space
[12:37:03] <skunkworks> The only issue I can think of is at the center of rotation of c - there could be very large velocities of c
[12:37:14] <skunkworks> if I am thinking right..
[12:37:42] <taiden> skunkworks: that is absolutely a valid point
[12:37:48] <taiden> one i had not considered
[12:37:53] <zeeshan|2> timing law
[12:38:37] <taiden> zeeshan|2: I'm not keeping up with you, sorry
[12:39:39] <zeeshan|2> hehe
[12:40:09] <zeeshan|2> does your cam not support c axis?
[12:40:19] <skunkworks> (and something linuxcnc doesn't do very well at the moment) Linuxcnc calculates the trajectories -> then runs them through the kins.
[12:40:23] <zeeshan|2> is that why youre trying to use x y z?
[12:41:55] <taiden> zeeshan|2: I'm not sure if I can set up an XZC type machine def in Mastercam
[12:42:12] <zeeshan|2> im pretty sure you can
[12:42:20] <zeeshan|2> because on lathes you have x y and "A" axis
[12:42:25] <skunkworks> You might be able to output a feedrate override that is scaled based on how far you are away from center in the kins module..
[12:42:29] <zeeshan|2> x z and a axis i mean
[12:42:50] <zeeshan|2> when i was going through the post processor config
[12:43:00] <zeeshan|2> i did see something about C axis
[12:43:21] <skunkworks> zeeshan|2, putting the kins inside of linuxcnc make hand programming easier - plus it runs 'normal' gcode.
[12:43:50] <taiden> can you imagine trying to jog around the part lol
[12:43:53] <taiden> probably get seasick
[12:43:54] <zeeshan|2> lol
[12:43:58] <skunkworks> heh
[12:44:24] <skunkworks> and the idea i cool :)
[12:44:30] <zeeshan|2> i looked at the kinematics module help file
[12:44:42] <zeeshan|2> and it says it converts from cartersian to joint and joint to cart
[12:44:58] <zeeshan|2> but it doesn't appear to handle x y and cartesian
[12:44:59] <zeeshan|2> er
[12:45:01] <zeeshan|2> and joint
[12:46:00] <taiden> is joint used for robotic arms?
[12:46:08] <taiden> I'm not familiar with joint
[12:46:13] <zeeshan|2> mostly yes
[12:46:28] <zeeshan|2> but you can also convert from joint space to cartesian
[12:46:35] <skunkworks> in the most complicated sense it does this.. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ARjpL44IfE
[12:46:53] <zeeshan|2> that looks like joint space to certesian
[12:46:57] <zeeshan|2> since it's only working inthe xy plane
[12:48:01] <taiden> nice!
[12:48:12] <taiden> looking at kinematics tutorial it doesn't look that difficult for my use case
[12:48:34] <taiden> i suspect it would be a lot like a polar > rectilinear conversion
[12:48:42] <skunkworks> yes - I would think your application would be one of the simpler ones...
[12:49:07] <taiden> HMMMMM
[12:49:27] <taiden> I love LinuxCNC
[12:49:34] <archivist_herron> I do use an axis the way you want but cheat and use the rotation just to put the part at some known angle
[12:49:47] <taiden> we use Mach3 at school and it's alright
[12:50:26] <taiden> so whats the deal with the BeagleBone hardware? this is new since I was last using LinuxCNC
[12:50:26] <archivist_herron> so I use trivkins and think about the gcode
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[12:51:30] <lair82_> Good morning gentlemen, I have ran into an issue on one of our turning centers, we keep getting a fault of " Bug: Call stack Underrun" when we try to run a certain program. I am not sure what causes this. Here is a link to the program that is giving us issues, http://pastebin.com/EfUmTtVm .
[12:51:34] <taiden> are people finding it preferable to finding old PCs and latency testing them?
[12:52:11] <archivist_herron> not many
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[13:00:55] <taiden> OK thank you all for the guidance
[13:01:23] <taiden> I have to decide if this is going to be cheaper than a typical XYZ 3 axis machine
[13:03:02] <CaptHindsight> taiden: the peddlers of *dunio IO boards have made quite an effort to get the maker community to avoid the use of a PC when controlling a toy machine
[13:03:54] <zeeshan|2> lair82_: looks like something to do with interpolation
[13:03:57] <zeeshan|2> looking through the source code :P
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[14:12:54] <JT-Shop> is there any info anywhere on all this new kernel stuff?
[14:13:00] <JT-Shop> RTAI and such
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[14:25:30] <Jymmm> ?¿
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[15:34:35] <cox> Hi just came acros this, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kz02FxYAvC4 looks quite nice.?
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[15:37:12] <_methods> lol
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[15:49:51] <CaptHindsight> JT-Shop: what are you looking for?
[15:52:51] <CaptHindsight> JT-Shop: the latest RTAI is here https://github.com/NTULINUX/RTAI there are no debs yet so you have to build from source
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[16:09:17] <CaptHindsight> Plane hits Flight Safety building at Wichita http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/plane-hits-building-wichita-kansas-airport-people-trapped-report-article-1.1992877
[16:10:19] <CaptHindsight> that's the airport near Stuarts place
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[16:40:36] <tjtr33> lair82, maybe post your tooltable ( ie: tool 101 ) and whats with M42? i dont have that Mcode. you running this on linuxcnc?
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[16:44:08] <tjtr33> M85 also, this is not code for a linuxcnc
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[16:44:52] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sA0WDoTtTT8
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[17:03:12] <archivist> tjtr33, he is using this remap thing in linuxcnc
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[17:11:20] <tjtr33> ok, he has to simplify the problem, and supply any special items, the call stack underflow is one call to many, the stack is empty!
[17:11:26] <tjtr33> thx archivist
[17:11:56] <tjtr33> sounded like o word to me
[17:12:19] <archivist> tjtr33, or more like a remap bug
[17:12:46] <jdh> and why the ugly line numbers
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[17:13:07] <tjtr33> yah, i havent looked underneath remap, tho i played a bit with it's use
[17:16:03] <archivist> jdh because it is from some cam system
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[17:25:12] <tjtr33> maybe useful to add into his code "#<_remap_level> - current level of the remap stack. Each remap in a block adds one to the remap level. For debugging."
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[17:31:52] <JT-Shop> CaptHindsight, I'm just curious about it
[17:32:54] <_methods> http://www.instructables.com/id/Modification-of-the-Lexmark-E260-for-Direct-Laser--1/?ALLSTEPS
[17:33:56] <archivist> tjtr33, I should mention this was looked at in the other chan and without the remaped codes there is an arc error, the remap just dumps a bad error message on the user
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[17:36:17] <zeeshan|2> any hydraulic power pack experts here? :(
[17:36:19] <zeeshan|2> =[
[17:36:59] <tjtr33> archivist, yes i hacked out the mcodes and saw the ctr error. the remap prob needs revealing the src
[17:37:03] <tjtr33> thx
[17:37:46] <tjtr33> i was very pleased to see the remap allows passing oodles of parms, just like real GANUC macroB style
[17:38:06] <tjtr33> FANUC
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[17:39:33] <zeeshan|2> i'm trying to diagnose why my electric motor keeps stalling on the hydraulic power pack
[17:39:44] <zeeshan|2> (well its drawing way too much current at running speed)
[17:40:01] <zeeshan|2> i first thought the reservoir was getting pressurized putting strain on the drain back path
[17:40:04] <zeeshan|2> that was not the problem
[17:40:24] <zeeshan|2> then i disconnected the outlet of the pump and ran it
[17:40:33] <zeeshan|2> i can see clear fluid coming out and its a nice steady stream.
[17:40:44] <zeeshan|2> motor draw is 1.1 A , without pump its .9 - 1.00A
[17:40:50] <archivist> jambed pressure relief valve
[17:40:58] <zeeshan|2> really?
[17:41:04] <SpeedEvil> zeeshan|2: 1.1A@what voltage
[17:41:10] <zeeshan|2> 240V
[17:41:14] <SpeedEvil> And what's its nameplate wattage/current
[17:41:20] <archivist> and blocked pipes
[17:41:31] <zeeshan|2> 0.33 kW @ 2.8 A
[17:41:36] <zeeshan|2> 240vac
[17:41:54] <_methods> damn wtf happened to the e-book.technical newsgroup?
[17:42:41] <zeeshan|2> archivist: i think you might be right on the jammed relief valve
[17:44:41] <archivist> been outside, strip the pump and pipework
[17:44:59] <zeeshan|2> why strip pump
[17:45:03] <zeeshan|2> i can see it flowing fluid
[17:45:23] <archivist> was pretty nasty inside my barber colman
[17:45:25] <zeeshan|2> its asap i hook up the outlet line the current draw shoots to 3A
[17:45:46] <archivist> blocked somewhere
[17:45:48] <zeeshan|2> can you please help explain the relief valve stuff
[17:45:53] <zeeshan|2> before i rip the pump apart
[17:45:58] <zeeshan|2> i want to start at the valve block
[17:46:06] <zeeshan|2> i see a relief valve, i see a pressure switch
[17:46:25] <archivist> check those
[17:46:26] <zeeshan|2> and i see an outlet solenoid which directs flow to drawbar
[17:46:34] <zeeshan|2> pressure switch i saw working..
[17:46:40] <zeeshan|2> i dont know how a relief valve works
[17:46:48] <zeeshan|2> is it like a check valve with a spring?
[17:46:50] <archivist> just a ball and spring
[17:47:04] <jthornton> is there a pressure gauge on the system?
[17:47:09] <zeeshan|2> jthornton: no :(
[17:47:16] <zeeshan|2> i'd like to add one while its apart
[17:47:18] <archivist> opens when the pressure is above x
[17:47:21] <zeeshan|2> i'm not sure where i can add one
[17:47:29] <zeeshan|2> maybe t-between the pressure switch?
[17:47:43] <archivist> stops the pump stalling
[17:47:52] <zeeshan|2> ahh
[17:47:56] <zeeshan|2> so if theres crap jammed in there
[17:48:05] <jthornton> is the voltage correct at the motor?
[17:48:07] <zeeshan|2> it'll try to build too much pressure
[17:48:12] <zeeshan|2> jthornton: yes 240VAC
[17:48:23] <zeeshan|2> i have not checked though to be honest
[17:48:37] <zeeshan|2> i hooked it up to my 120VAC vfd and its suposed to output 3 phase 240vac
[17:48:46] <jthornton> ok, low voltage like from a loose connection can cause high amp draw
[17:48:56] <jthornton> oh, you didn't check it at the motor then
[17:49:01] <zeeshan|2> no i did not
[17:49:20] <zeeshan|2> but the reason i didnt check it yet is 1. my multimeter blew up
[17:49:35] <zeeshan|2> 2. it was outputting .9A free running
[17:49:46] <zeeshan|2> so i figured it'd draw a lot more than that if the voltage was low
[17:49:58] <zeeshan|2> :-(
[17:50:42] <zeeshan|2> http://www.princessauto.com/pal/Components/0-to-5000-PSI-Glycerine-Filled-Pressure-Gauge/8000851.p
[17:50:45] <zeeshan|2> im gonna go buy that
[17:50:47] <zeeshan|2> and anotehr multimeter
[17:50:47] <jthornton> I've seen small 3 phase motors running on single phase because of a bad connection in the motor
[17:51:02] <zeeshan|2> jthornton: how can i check for that?
[17:51:37] <jthornton> open the box on the motor where the wires go in and check the connections
[17:52:10] <zeeshan|2> and measure the continuity between the phases?
[17:52:23] <zeeshan|2> to check for internal breaks?
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[17:53:04] <jthornton> check the connections, pull on them check the torque of the nuts if they use that type
[17:53:10] <zeeshan|2> okay
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[17:58:27] <Jymmm> zeeshan|2: how did you blow up your dmm ?
[18:01:46] <jdh> didn't swap the probe before measuring current?
[18:03:30] <pcw_home> measuring 240VAC on a low current range is a good one
[18:04:29] <pcw_home> on a high current range (and a decent meter with a 600V fuse) the fuse will blow before much damage...
[18:05:00] <pcw_home> cheapo meter will be a fireball
[18:07:00] <jdh> I got a few extra fluke 440mA fuses last time.
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[19:07:38] <zeeshan|2> i made the mistake of letting my friend borrow it for a day
[19:07:53] <zeeshan|2> and i got it back blown up. i guess he tried to measure current using the ohm/v probe
[19:08:20] <_methods> yeah man
[19:08:27] <_methods> never let anyone borrow your multimeter
[19:08:38] <_methods> i got my fluke smoked like that
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[19:09:36] <_methods> i have a no pressure washer, steam cleaner, multimeter, and motorcycle loaning policy
[19:09:43] <zeeshan|2> jthornton archivist
[19:09:48] <zeeshan|2> i took the valve body apart..
[19:10:02] <zeeshan|2> pulled out the relief valve
[19:10:10] <zeeshan|2> when i hammer on the ball at the end
[19:10:13] <zeeshan|2> it doesnt seem to return back.
[19:10:37] <zeeshan|2> http://www.boschrexroth-us.com/country_units/america/united_states/en/Products/bri/Products_and_Catalogs/bosch_branded_products/literature_downloads_pdfs/a_downloads/pdf_erl/ACCUMULATOR_901.pdf
[19:10:42] <zeeshan|2> page 41 has the specs for it
[19:11:01] <zeeshan|2> mine is 532 004 107
[19:11:05] <zeeshan|2> 140bar
[19:11:06] <jdh> it's almost lathe season.
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[19:14:53] <skunkworks_> tormach?
[19:16:42] <jdh> a tormach lathe would be quite cool.
[19:18:00] <jdh> not a lot of lathe for that much money though.
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[19:19:32] <zeeshan|2> archivist: good morning
[19:19:34] <zeeshan|2> are you there?! :D
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[21:31:56] <cpresser> any idea how to interface a rotary-encoder which outputs grey-code to linuxcnc?
[21:32:05] <cpresser> datasheet is this one: http://www.mikrocontroller.net/attachment/114542/Jog_Wheel_SRGPHJ3200.pdf
[21:32:12] <cpresser> i want to use it as MPG
[21:32:21] <Connor> Not sure you can.
[21:33:34] <cpresser> it only has 10ppr, so its not a good choice anyway
[21:34:01] <Connor> http://www.cnc4pc.com/Store/osc/product_info.php?cPath=40&products_id=163
[21:34:05] <Connor> That's what you want. :)
[21:34:56] <cpresser> i ordered one weeks ago... still not here :/
[21:35:11] <Connor> From them ?
[21:35:36] <Connor> Or China ? :)
[21:36:39] <cpresser> ebay somewhere
[21:36:58] <cpresser> most likely the packet is waiting at the german customs
[21:37:17] <cpresser> getting stuff from outside the EU is a pita.
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[21:40:21] <cpresser> want to get the frontpanel done today... but that aint gonna happen
[21:42:04] <PCW> you could use the mux_generic component to get a 0..15 count from gray code
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[21:42:31] <PCW> or 0..9
[21:51:16] <PCW> ha mux16 already knows gray code
[21:52:08] <Jymmm> All your grey codes belong to us!
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[22:00:00] <zeeshan|2> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZMfGPH-OaXE
[22:00:17] <zeeshan|2> can someone confirm if how i'm thinking it operates is correct?
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[22:00:21] <zeeshan|2> especially the part about the ball part
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[22:08:49] <jdh> it operates the way that looks obvious
[22:09:10] <zeeshan|2> so ball pushes on valve
[22:09:15] <zeeshan|2> and it opens?
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[22:09:30] <jdh> maybe not so obvious then.
[22:09:38] <zeeshan|2> ??
[22:09:38] <jdh> I actually got bored about 10 seconds in.
[22:10:08] <Connor> what is the valve for ?
[22:10:16] <jdh> blow-off valve
[22:10:19] <zeeshan|2> hydraulic pump
[22:10:23] <jdh> or looks like it anyway
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[22:10:51] <zeeshan|2> i really think that ball bearing is supposed to move
[22:10:56] <zeeshan|2> because i dont see how else this valve can open
[22:11:02] <zeeshan|2> there is no other face for the pressure to act on to open it
[22:11:22] <zeeshan|2> i have no idea how the hell the ball grew though
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[22:13:19] <jdh> is it just a check valve or release valve?
[22:13:27] <zeeshan|2> release valve
[22:13:31] <zeeshan|2> its supposed to open when it sees 2000psi
[22:13:34] <jdh> where does it overflow to?
[22:13:37] <zeeshan|2> reservoir
[22:13:48] <zeeshan|2> so i think its constantly moving
[22:13:51] <zeeshan|2> to maintain pressure
[22:14:22] <zeeshan|2> you know im kinda silly
[22:14:26] <zeeshan|2> i should just go buy t he damn pressure gauge
[22:14:34] <zeeshan|2> so i can actually see whats going on
[22:14:39] <jdh> or just grab one out of the junk box
[22:14:45] <zeeshan|2> i dont have one that high
[22:14:52] <zeeshan|2> car ones are like 300psi
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[22:15:46] <jdh> I have quite a few 5kpsi+ !
[22:15:57] <zeeshan|2> yes cause you're mr scuba! :D
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[22:16:11] <jdh> and release valves, but they just vent.
[22:16:44] <jdh> all have balls that are held with an adjustable spring.
[22:17:09] <jdh> hm. I have some SS ones that are sort of discs
[22:18:24] <zeeshan|2> its FOOD time!!
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[22:21:32] <PetefromTn_> Connor Ya there man?
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[22:22:15] <Connor> PetefromTn_: Yea
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[22:22:26] <PetefromTn_> Been thinking about this lathe.
[22:22:39] <PetefromTn_> got a minute to chat
[22:22:44] <Connor> sure. Phone ?
[22:22:48] <PetefromTn_> sure
[22:22:51] <jdh> how 80s
[22:23:51] <Connor> freaking phone just rebooted.
[22:24:13] <PetefromTn_> hehe
[22:24:20] <PetefromTn_> goto PM
[22:24:24] <Connor> okay. it's back up
[22:24:30] <PetefromTn_> OK
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[22:35:52] <Deejay> gn8
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[23:08:33] <andypugh> Somebody has made a hoverboard https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/142464853/hendo-hoverboards-worlds-first-real-hoverboard?ref=NewsOct3014&utm_campaign=Oct+30&utm_medium=email&utm_source=newsletter
[23:09:01] <andypugh> I thought it was in inverted quadcopter thing at first, but it actually seems to be electromagnetic.
[23:09:27] <andypugh> (So requires a copper half-pipe)
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[23:16:14] <PCW> Lenze's Law
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[23:16:54] <andypugh> They are doing something clever, as it works as an induction motor too, it can steer in the XY plane
[23:17:58] <PCW> yeah (look at a old stile power meter)
[23:18:05] <PCW> style
[23:18:40] <andypugh> Aren’t they a shaded-pole motor? This seems a lot more active.
[23:19:03] <andypugh> Anyway, for $10k I can do without one :-)
[23:19:46] <PCW> "pole shading" can be done with multiple active poles
[23:20:28] <PCW> Wonder if the copper is backed with iron
[23:21:25] <PCW> or maybe its lateral field (many pole pieces)
[23:22:53] <andypugh> For $300 you can have a hover development kit
[23:23:41] <PCW> I have a linear induction motor prototype (designed for opening/closing curtains) where the moving part is just a sheet of copper
[23:25:19] <PCW> well you can make a dev kit with some transformer iron and copper wire
[23:26:15] <CaptHindsight> it's about as much a hoverboard is as a bucket with wheels flung from a catapult is a flying car
[23:28:38] <andypugh> CaptHindsight: I disagree, it rides along on an actual force field! What more could you want?
[23:29:33] <CaptHindsight> andypugh: an actual hoverboard
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[23:30:35] <CaptHindsight> now when the actual one comes along it won't be taken seriously due to this scam
[23:33:01] <andypugh> What do you mean by “actual hoverboard” then?
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[23:34:40] <andypugh> There aren’t any other forces of nature of significant strength (if there were, we would have spotted them) so the “Hoverboard” has to use one of the known forces.
[23:36:16] <andypugh> Antigravity would be neat, but would need to be an actual repulsive gravity field to hover with. (otherwise you would float about at random heights)
[23:36:51] <PCW> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x6hYAM17UnA
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[23:39:08] <andypugh> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A1vyB-O5i6E :-)
[23:39:46] <PCW> That's a little stronger field...
[23:41:40] <PCW> wonder how much emf is being generated in the frog by moving at that rate in that intense magnetic field...
[23:42:48] <PCW> Ive heard of some big magnets that you need to move slowly in to avoid blacking-out
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[23:46:55] <andypugh> Yes, resaaerch MRI scanners, for example.
[23:47:28] <PCW> wonder if its done this way:
[23:47:29] <PCW> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dw73DcwIX-A
[23:49:18] <PCW> you can probably test that for a lot less than $300
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[23:52:54] <PCW> probably a lot more efficient for generating a strong AC magnetic field than a (non superconducting) electromagnet
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