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[00:08:11] <andypugh> Quiet night. any reason?
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[00:09:05] <kwallace> Something you said?
[00:09:30] <PetefromTn> LOL nobody wants to talk to you andy...
[00:10:07] <andypugh> You mean it was really lively until I logged on?
[00:10:32] <PetefromTn> Oh yeah it was blazin'
[00:10:52] <andypugh> You want me to log off to carry on with the party?
[00:10:55] <PetefromTn> Course I just logged on but I am sure it was..
[00:11:49] <kwallace> Heck no, I want to ask a question.
[00:12:27] <andypugh> Me first. Should I ditch the Chinese lathe and CNC the Rivett 608?
[00:12:53] <kwallace> If one wanted to run a g-code file and have it send a value... not fast enough.
[00:13:21] <PetefromTn> which in your opinion would make the better CNC lathe?
[00:13:45] <andypugh> The Chinese machine will never be a good lathe, even though it is CNC now.
[00:14:52] <andypugh> I also figure that my semi-famous CNC mill/lathe will sell for decent money, even though I don't like it.
[00:15:06] <kwallace> I would tend to keep the Rivett stock, unless I could update it in a reversible way. But I suppose that's no surprise.
[00:15:44] <andypugh> My other hobby is Pre-1925 vehicles.
[00:16:23] <PetefromTn> What is the famous CNC mill/lathe?
[00:17:11] <ds3> andypugh: is that the model T era?
[00:17:27] <andypugh> Rivett made a huge range of attachments and fixtures for the 608. The whole cross-slide pops off with a flick of a lever. My idea is to pop on a CNC slide.
[00:18:14] <kwallace> Andy is famous for his hand cranked hex turning.
[00:18:32] <kwallace> encoder printing
[00:19:06] <kwallace> Putting tool holder sockets on his table
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[00:20:37] <andypugh> PetefromTn: Mainly this one, with 100k hits:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZhICrb0Tbn4
[00:21:08] <andypugh> ds3: yes, though I don't like the T. Too "Ford"
[00:21:09] <kwallace> Oh, and that too.
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[00:22:07] <kwallace> Doesn't someone you know work at Ford?
[00:22:32] <andypugh> All my colleagues work at Ford :-)
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[00:24:13] <kwallace> Thinking of foreign (to me) Fords, I had a few Mercury Capris in my youth.
[00:24:53] <andypugh> Ford is all about: Just how cheaply can we make this, and still have it work properly. 100 years later the company are quite good at getting that right, but the T is just cheap.
[00:25:50] <andypugh> I play with:
https://union.ic.ac.uk/rcc/rcsmotor/
[00:26:08] <andypugh> https://union.ic.ac.uk/rcc/rsmmotor/
[00:26:59] <andypugh> And I own one of these:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ner-A-Car
[00:28:06] <andypugh> And I helped a friend pull this out from under a house:
http://hmvf.co.uk/forumvb/showthread.php?13636-1908-Dennis-Truck
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[00:30:38] <andypugh> I _stongly_ recommend looking at, and reading, the last link. Quite a strange story.
[00:32:22] <PetefromTn> Thats an interesting 3 in 1 man... I used to have a Shoptask 17-20 XMTC Gold series 3 in 1. It was decent for what it was but nothing like seperate machines. Altho as you showed in the video there are interesting things you can do with them.
[00:33:48] <andypugh> It's like a fairly bad lathe, with a milling machine on top, to make a _really_ bad mill.
[00:36:18] <andypugh> The lathe was probably a 3.5" CH (7" swing) design built up to 4.5" CH (9" swing). The tailstock base is very thick, and the bed is very narrow. Someone did hand-scrape the saddle to fit both ways. Sadly not to suit both at the same time....
[00:37:14] <PetefromTn> LOL sounds chinese..
[00:37:34] <andypugh> To be fair, it wasn't expensive, and I learned a lot in the process.
[00:38:18] <andypugh> And I don't think it is Chinese. I think it is a cheap Indian knock-off of a cheap Chinese knock-off of a cheap Emco,
[00:41:09] <somenewguy> I assume the mailing list is the right place for this, but I have a few small updates to make to the "usefull subroutines" that roll out with linuxcnc
[00:41:13] <somenewguy> am I correct in that assumption?
[00:41:16] <PetefromTn> Hilarious. Honestly my main lathe is a chines 12x36 and it has been a great little machine. I have turned all sorts of stuff on it over the years and it always works. In fact the only thing I ever had to do to it was repair the apron mounted on off switch.
[00:44:58] <andypugh> I am a bit unfair to the lathe. It does do good work. I really can't even fault the finish on small diamete work. It just struggles badly on work that end up outside the too-narrow ways.
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[00:46:19] <andypugh> This is it producing a lovely finish on some BS1407:
http://youtu.be/Z1oV_CXwQlE
[00:47:50] <kwallace> So, you just need a mill. ... Oh, you have a mill.
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[00:50:32] <kwallace> andypugh: My guess is you get to see all of the latest Ford stuff. I'm curious about alternators.
[00:50:34] <andypugh> I don't really have the space for two lathes, so either the chinese mill/lathe goes, or the Rivett goes.
[00:50:56] <andypugh> And I _like_ the Rivett
[00:51:05] <kwallace> I saw a big forest next door to you.
[00:51:45] <MacGalempsy> kwallace: whats so interesting about alternators
[00:51:53] <andypugh> There is a small Copse next to me. I don't think Essex has any actual forests.
[00:52:00] <MacGalempsy> typically they are the cheapest, most universal parts on a car
[00:52:29] <andypugh> Not any more.
[00:53:17] <andypugh> They need to talk the right protocol (LIN. CAN, whatever) and on the right network ID, and have the right capacity.
[00:54:45] <MacGalempsy> damn that sucks. everything is getting over complicated
[00:55:09] <kwallace> The ones I'm familiar with have a simple coil with fingers wrapped around, with brushes. I like having a controllable field, but these are very inefficient. My cycle has permanent magnets so no controllable field.
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[00:55:41] <kwallace> I was wonder if the latest stuff is any better.
[00:56:08] <kwallace> wondering
[00:56:58] <MacGalempsy> what kind of bike?
[00:57:27] <kwallace> Okay, I'll let you CNC the Rivett, Steam Punk style.
[00:57:33] <andypugh> I think that they are all permanent magnet machines now. Rotating magnerts, static coil.
[00:57:34] <kwallace> KDX250
[00:58:06] <kwallace> http://www.wallacecompany.com/KDX250/
[00:58:09] <MacGalempsy> nice. got a yz250. you anywhere close enough to Oklahoma City to ride?
[00:58:54] <MacGalempsy> lot. not sure if that thing could keep up
[00:59:04] <andypugh> kwallace: Have you seen my (first) alternator failure?
http://www.bodgesoc.org/OhDear.jpg
[00:59:12] <kwallace> Yosemite CA, but I don't ride much any more.
[00:59:26] <MacGalempsy> oh crap
[00:59:39] <MacGalempsy> ha. im going up to Tuolomne next week
[00:59:50] <MacGalempsy> we rented a house for the holiday
[00:59:54] <andypugh> it did the same trick again 40k miles later :-(
[01:01:08] <MacGalempsy> kwallace: im from Modesto
[01:01:33] <kwallace> https://mapsengine.google.com/map/edit?mid=zYBp-56SNjFs.kq5jQfmiJAYU
[01:02:33] <andypugh> Engine full of powdered magnet. Two choices. Fastidiously clean everything hoping to snag every bit of magnet, rebuild spending £400 on gaskets and seals. Or drop the sump, wipe it clean, change the oil and hoe for the best, noting that an engine with a fraction of the milage will cost you £500.
[01:03:29] <kwallace> I wonder why the rotor failed?
[01:03:45] <MacGalempsy> says I need permission to access tha tlink
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[01:04:56] <kwallace> hows about now?
[01:06:08] <MacGalempsy> oh yeah, I know the area a little
[01:06:27] <MacGalempsy> my dad just moved from Columbia to Bend Oregon
[01:06:35] <MacGalempsy> CA was just too damn expensive
[01:06:47] <andypugh> I think that eventually the glue gives up. It is geared to the crank. And cranks shake. If that photo had been taken with the rotor removed the view would have been of crank, conrods,and a glimpse of piston skirt,
[01:07:18] <kwallace> Columbia is 45 minutes drive North.
[01:08:01] <MacGalempsy> take old preists grade to save time?
[01:08:18] <andypugh> In fact, right at the very top, mid-right, I think that is a piston skirt. Those chunks of ceramic magnet really are right in the works.
[01:08:30] <kwallace> Of course.
[01:08:47] <MacGalempsy> maybe the monday or tuesday before thanksgiving we can meet for beers?
[01:08:53] <andypugh> But, the bike has done 50k miles since that photo :-)
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[01:09:17] <MacGalempsy> andypugh: are you UK based?
[01:09:27] <andypugh> Aye, that I be
[01:10:06] <MacGalempsy> im not geograph buff, but how man km is it from the north end of britain to the south?
[01:10:19] <andypugh> 1000 miles
[01:10:44] <kwallace> I'm a freelancer, so I have no set schedule.
[01:11:08] <andypugh> That't bottom left to top right, by road.
[01:11:24] <PetefromTn> Well I managed to sell the carcass of my old Acer laptop to a guy for $40.00 and bought a Toshiba Sattelite yesterday. MUCH nicer LOL
[01:11:43] <MacGalempsy> sounds like it would be a a fun ride on the bike
[01:12:13] <kwallace> I don't have anything that runs right now.
[01:12:38] <MacGalempsy> you can ride my pitbike
[01:12:51] <MacGalempsy> lol. its a little 125, but it beats walkin
[01:13:21] <andypugh> The Lands-End to John'O'Groats run is a popular record to set. I think it has been done in 6 days by unicycle,.
[01:13:30] <andypugh> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Land's_End_to_John_o'_Groats
[01:14:16] <MacGalempsy> id be down for another moto tour in the spring
[01:14:31] <MacGalempsy> we did vietnam 2 years ago and it was great. 12 days on the trails
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[01:17:41] <andypugh> Rubbish website:
http://quickinfo.enduromania.net
[01:17:45] <Tom_itx> MacGalempsy, gettin any closer to a working machine?
[01:17:58] <MacGalempsy> http://www.exploreindochina.com/motorbike-adventures
[01:18:25] <kwallace> I have a 73 Honda 750/4 and a 89 Hurricane 600. All the rubber engine bits are leaking on the 750. I was going to convert the Hurricane to electronic injection and got as far as taking it apart.
[01:18:37] <MacGalempsy> Tom_itx: just got up and going, then going to take the wife out for dinner. it will be later tonight before getting back at it
[01:18:51] <andypugh> But we met up with the Enduromania guys in 1999 during the eclipse, and it looks like a great event. I didn't do Enduro then, (but I do now).
[01:19:02] <MacGalempsy> kwallace: ahhh the classic disassemble and get back to it
[01:20:00] <MacGalempsy> i got a mate from college (a former prof) who ride MX, he and I went to Vietnam. we were talking about Argentina, but ended up getting married this summer
[01:20:18] <MacGalempsy> not he and it getting married :P
[01:20:30] <MacGalempsy> so the honeymoon screwed up my fun lol
[01:20:31] <andypugh> If you are wondering, Enduromamania is a long-distance enduro, in Romnaia
[01:20:57] <MacGalempsy> awesome. you ride that event every year? you chunnle your bike?
[01:21:17] <andypugh> Err, no, I have never ridden that event.,
[01:22:21] <andypugh> Some friends and I met up with the Enduromaniacs when we toured (by road) to the Eclipse in 1999.
[01:23:18] <andypugh> We watched the totality with them. It was the first time I had ever ridden a trail. The FJ1100 might not have been the ideal tool.
[01:23:42] <andypugh> http://www.bodgesoc.org/eclipse/index.html
[01:27:51] <MacGalempsy> that looks pretty awesome
[01:28:07] <MacGalempsy> had a street bike, but decided offroad would be safer hahaha.
[01:28:43] <MacGalempsy> unfortunately, my dirtbike isnt street legal
[01:28:58] <MacGalempsy> bbiat
[01:29:04] <MacGalempsy> oops
[01:29:17] <MacGalempsy> got to get ready for the date, catch you guys later
[01:31:09] <kwallace> So andypugh, the latest auto alternators are like bike magnetos?
[01:31:40] <andypugh> Yes, they even make pretty good brushless motors.
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[01:34:29] <kwallace> I was thinking the permanently On field would be inefficient. Maybe they have special controllers.
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[01:37:50] <andypugh> They just open-circuit the coils.
[01:40:32] <kwallace> If I keep my magneto setup I'll need to find a way to recharge the magnets, but if I make a charger, I'll only need it once.
[01:40:40] <Tom_itx> andypugh, what is the wedge for in your rotary design?
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[01:41:58] <andypugh> it's an old-school gib strip.
[01:42:11] <Tom_itx> ok
[01:42:11] <kwallace> I seem to recall it was to adjust backlash?
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[01:44:44] <andypugh> Not exactly backlash in the conventional sense. But the combination of adjustable eccentricuty and the gib strips makes the system torsionally rigid. If the parts are _perfectly_ round.
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[01:46:51] <Jymmm> like a ball bearing track in a sense?
[01:50:12] <andypugh> I am struggling to think of what sense, but maybe
[01:51:57] <Tom_itx> ok it makes more sense. iges import didn't bring in all the parts of the assembly
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[02:04:12] <andypugh> Ah, the joys of travel:
http://www.bodgesoc.org/eclipse/8.html
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[02:18:50] <kwallace> my favorite Ford:
http://www.classiccar.4mg.com/CapriMK1Racing.htm
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[02:19:49] <kwallace> Well, other than this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_GT40
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[02:20:55] <andypugh> Yes, the Capri has a certain something.
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[02:25:11] <kwallace> I had a 2 liter turbo inline four for a few weeks until it got totaled at a stop light. I auto-crossed it a few times but the turbo lag would tend to throw one off the end of turns.
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[02:28:48] <andypugh> I have a 2-litre inline 4 turbo this weekend. It's diesel, but 180 hp and 300 ft.lbs is not slow.
[02:30:17] <andypugh> The turbo is variable-vane, you don't even know it is there.
[02:31:06] <kwallace> Things have progressed since my turbo days.
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[02:31:52] <andypugh> And 45mpg at 85mph. Except in the US, where that is not possible inside your NOx limits.
[02:33:38] <Tom_itx> we've got a couple places there are none
[02:37:32] <Tom_itx> http://www.cnbc.com/id/49520151
[02:37:35] <Tom_itx> http://www.city-data.com/forum/general-u-s/480121-any-roads-out-there-no-speed.html
[02:38:31] <Tom_itx> apparently they've restricted Montana now
[02:38:59] <andypugh> NOx limit, not speed limit
[02:39:04] <kwallace> I grew up in the San Francisco bay area. During the 60's the smog was awful, it didn't take long for the smog laws to clean it up. Sure, they weren't any fun but we are better off. Look at China now.
[02:40:11] <Tom_itx> andypugh, limit or no, i'm witness that through parts of texas you'll get run over if you do
[02:40:49] <Tom_itx> i think they somewhat look the other way
[02:43:42] <andypugh> kwallace: Yes, I agree. NOx limits are good. But halving that limit every 3 years is less good. I think that the current limit is low enough, and setting it any lower is unavoidably at the detriment of fuel economy. NOx should be frozen at the previous level, and a target set to masssively reduce CO2
[02:44:49] <kwallace> You answered my next q. My take on Nitrous Oxide is that the emissions go up as the carbon emissions go down so you're kind of stuck trying to find the middle.
[02:48:00] <andypugh> Yes, quite, and the time to stop pushing NOx down was a few years ago. It's a solved problem except for specific places (LA, Beijing, Athens). Those places need special rules, and the rest of the world needs to work on burning less oil.
[02:50:19] <Tom_itx> i ran across one of our wind farms the other day somewhat unexpectedly
[02:50:22] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/temp/misc/windmills/Pic_1009_027.jpg
[02:50:59] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/temp/misc/windmills/Pic_1009_029.jpg
[02:54:10] <kwallace> I get a fair amount wind, being on top of a hill. It goes West in the morning and back in the afternoon. Not quite enough to edge out solar though.
[03:00:11] <kwallace> It's getting late there andypugh.
[03:00:32] <andypugh> Past late, into "sillly"
[03:01:19] <kwallace> Oops I forgot it's a weekend night so it's okay.
[03:01:29] <andypugh> Quite.
[03:01:46] <Tom_itx> make it worth staying up for
[03:02:51] <kwallace> Yeah, figure out how to read g-code user parameters in Python for me.
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[03:18:14] <andypugh> kwallace: Which parameters?
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[03:22:18] <andypugh> Suddenly it feels like sleep time. Won't be here tomorrow, see you Sunday.
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[04:15:01] <MacGalempsy> AH that was a nice dinner
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[04:42:48] <PetefromTn> Evening folks..
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[05:09:34] <MacGalempsy> evening
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[05:14:29] <PetefromTn> Hey mac..
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[05:29:05] <somenewguy> does anyone know if it is legal to set a variable #1-#30 within a subroutine?
[05:29:45] <somenewguy> to avoid modifying code more than needed, I want to re-assign what use t obe the last var passed to a sub, so I am simply making the first line of code:
[05:29:53] <somenewguy> #6 = #5410
[05:30:10] <somenewguy> is that allowed, or are 1-30 reserved as consts within the subroutine?
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[05:42:43] <jesseg> Is an extra $2/tap good for having TiN coating on HSS?
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[05:56:04] <Jymmm> Just get some quality taps from a machine supply place.
[05:56:29] <Jymmm> MORe importantly tapping fluid
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[06:36:28] <jesseg> oh hi Jymmm
[06:36:38] <jesseg> I just looked back here and saw your comment
[06:36:59] <jesseg> but I first just ordered a HSS tap from McMaster Carr
[06:37:07] <jesseg> for $6.67
[06:37:23] <jesseg> so we'll see how it be
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[07:03:51] <Jymmm> I like this stuff
http://www.amazon.com/TAPMATIC-NATURAL-Cutting-Tappping-Fluid/dp/B0067BS4BI/ref=sr_1_49?s=industrial&ie=UTF8&qid=1384585413&sr=1-49
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[07:17:18] <jesseg> Natural Tapping oil, huh?
[07:17:26] <jesseg> Is it what Nature uses when it's tapping ?
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[07:46:30] <uw> soybean oil
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[07:47:56] <_DJ_> moin
[07:47:59] <uw> harvested and pressed by people from tibet, while listening to peruvian flute music
[07:48:05] <uw> MOIN DJJJJJ
[07:48:11] <_DJ_> hi uwwwwwwww ;)
[07:48:50] <uw> Das Neue?
[07:49:07] <_DJ_> hm?
[07:49:21] <uw> LOL was neu
[07:50:26] <_DJ_> brrrrr, it's cold outside. about 1 degree celsius and foggy
[07:50:29] <_DJ_> how are you, uw?
[07:51:02] <uw> gut same stuff. it has been a while how is your business?
[07:51:16] <uw> it's 1deg out side over there?
[07:51:56] <_DJ_> yep, tnx, business is going well
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[09:46:28] <MacGarage> evening
[09:47:03] <archivist> 9:46am :)
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[10:15:54] <MacGarage> having a hellova time getting this motor to pid
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[11:22:04] <MacGarage> finally success!
[11:23:49] <archivist> rest should be easy now
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[12:08:21] <jthornton> yea
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[12:10:08] <MacGalempsy> good morning guys
[12:10:33] <MacGalempsy> so after all said and done, it was just like someone said yesterday. just reverse the motor wires
[12:11:16] <MacGalempsy> so P is set with a following error of less that 1m
[12:11:41] <MacGalempsy> FF1 and FF2 are set at .0003P and .00005P
[12:12:18] <MacGalempsy> how do I go about I and D, do I need to?
[12:17:01] <jthornton> I and D are usually not used for a velocity drive
[12:17:36] <MacGalempsy> cool.
[12:17:50] <MacGalempsy> P ended up being 279
[12:17:57] <MacGalempsy> does that sound right?
[12:18:29] <MacGalempsy> that was less that 1m following error at 10in/min
[12:21:36] <jthornton> mine was P-550 I-0 D-0 FF0-0 FF1-1.8 FF2-0.017 for my X axis
[12:22:22] <MacGalempsy> did you tune ff1&2 or just go with the .03 and .005%?
[12:24:10] <jthornton> the % is a general guide so you know how little it takes, yes I tuned it the got the percentange
[12:24:22] <MacGalempsy> ok just read the rest of your article
[12:25:05] <MacGalempsy> and actually understanding it now. going to the garage to tray and fine tune ff1&ff2, then its on to figuring out how to trigger the z axis brake before a move
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[12:27:37] <jthornton> you just release the brake when you power up the drive
[12:27:48] <jthornton> you don't want the brake on when the drive is on
[12:29:08] <MacGarage> oh that makes it easy
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[13:38:05] <PasstScho> moin!
[13:42:10] <PasstScho> anyone experienced in generating own mesa firmware/configuration and might give me a hint where to start? I don't want to reinvent the world but i'd like a firmware that makes better use of my needs (like 5 stepgens (just step/dir!), 7 encoders(a,b,index), 2 pwm)...
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[13:55:03] <jthornton> pcw_home, is your man for that
[13:56:42] <PasstScho> :)
[14:00:55] <Tom_itx> i've done a couple but you'd better get peter to guide you thru it
[14:01:43] <Jymmm> 3 limit switches, and a partridge in a pear tree!
[14:03:24] <Jymmm> Tom_itx: you mucked with mesa firmware?
[14:03:37] <Tom_itx> just bit files a byte
[14:03:48] <Jymmm> ah
[14:04:17] <Jymmm> Tom_itx: Thught you were being uber fpga code monkey on me!
[14:04:33] <Tom_itx> i've played with them a bit but nothing serious
[14:04:43] <Jymmm> gotcha
[14:05:20] <Jymmm> Hey, does anyone know tips on dip coating parts and getting an even surface/thickness?
[14:05:20] <PasstScho> i hope a little playing is all that i will need ;)
[14:06:26] <Tom_itx> Jymmm keep the parts moving so gravity doesn't affect the coating
[14:07:08] <MacGarage> guys PID tuning is gonig well on the first axis. I am down to ferror of .0009
[14:07:16] <Jymmm> Tom_itx: it's dipping in the wax you suggested, how do I keep em anti-gravity =)
[14:07:31] <MacGarage> average is .0007
[14:07:32] <Tom_itx> or cool them real quick
[14:07:45] <Tom_itx> cool the material before dipping?
[14:07:49] <Tom_itx> heck i dunno
[14:08:48] <Jymmm> We all know if oyu have something vertical and spray paint (or whatever), there's always that lil blob on the bottom corner
[14:09:14] <Tom_itx> flow the wax over the material on a conveyor like chocolate factories do
[14:09:18] <archivist> electrostatic painting
[14:09:35] <Tom_itx> i wasn't sure about electrostatic if wax would work there
[14:09:38] <Jymmm> Tom_itx: Need to do both sides
[14:09:50] <Jymmm> archivist: molten wax?
[14:09:54] <Tom_itx> used to work next to a electrostatic paint booth...
[14:10:18] <archivist> I see wax as a waste of time and effort
[14:10:27] <Tom_itx> do one side, cool, protect the bottom and rinse and repeat
[14:10:30] <Jymmm> archivist: compared to?
[14:10:48] <archivist> sensible methods
[14:10:52] <Tom_itx> why do you need to cover the ss anyway/
[14:10:53] <Tom_itx> ?
[14:10:57] <Jymmm> archivist: such as?
[14:11:03] <archivist> etching resist
[14:11:07] <Jymmm> Tom_itx: electro etching
[14:11:43] <Tom_itx> yeah you may be better off with purpose built materials
[14:12:05] <Jymmm> Tom_itx: ?
[14:12:48] <Jymmm> archivist: Do you know of one that srays on and dries almost instantly?
[14:13:00] <Jymmm> sprays*
[14:13:29] <Tom_itx> Homebrew electrolytic etching - posted in Finish and ... I used nail polish for a resist, but in subsequent experiments found that it ...
[14:14:00] <Tom_itx> bees wax?
[14:14:03] <Tom_itx> http://www.iforgeiron.com/topic/21790-homebrew-electrolytic-etching/
[14:16:52] <Jymmm> Tom_itx: Oh, I get it now... I can just dip the whole thing, then invert the piece in the air till it solidifies
[14:17:29] <Tom_itx> the silk screen doesn't sound like a bad idea
[14:18:16] <Tom_itx> i do UV paint with one
[14:18:38] <Jymmm> If I do the wax, then I can just engrave the artwork with the laser to vaporize the wax, then electro etch
[14:18:39] <archivist> just pay someone who does it in production
[14:18:58] <Tom_itx> i'm thinkin he's the 'someone'
[14:19:30] <Tom_itx> i went to a sign co and they were very helpful and even gave me some UV paint samples
[14:20:48] <Tom_itx> the wax may vaporize too big a pattern doing that
[14:20:58] <Tom_itx> or melt and run
[14:20:58] <Jymmm> archivist: I can't afford the $8000 in punch press dies
[14:21:06] <Tom_itx> make your own
[14:21:26] <archivist> I said an etch company
[14:21:35] <Jymmm> archivist: why?
[14:21:37] <CaptHindsight> Jymmm: what fluid are you going to etch in?
[14:21:43] <archivist> google photo etch
[14:22:05] <archivist> cheap setup cost for low qty
[14:23:44] <Tom_itx> or even silkscreen mask?
[14:24:32] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/boards/USBTiny_Mkii/silkscreen/uv_paint.jpg
[14:24:59] <CaptHindsight> silkscreen photoemulsions are low cost but he doesn't want to use them, he's stuck on wax
[14:25:13] <Tom_itx> i suggested wax
[14:25:20] <Tom_itx> maybe he'll listen :)
[14:25:30] <Tom_itx> it would take longer
[14:25:35] <CaptHindsight> he's be asking about this the past couple of days
[14:25:40] <Tom_itx> i know
[14:25:49] <Jymmm> blame Tom_itx for that
[14:25:50] <archivist> will be another 6 years of pontification to go yet
[14:25:53] <Tom_itx> gtg...
[14:26:11] <CaptHindsight> same answers, but expecting different results perhaps?
[14:26:48] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: No, I asked about even coating of wax. Others kept bringing up different coatings
[14:27:06] <Jymmm> /methods
[14:27:09] <CaptHindsight> so what is wrong with wax?
[14:27:10] <archivist> unrealistic setup cost expectations v qty of production
[14:28:07] <Jymmm> I can do 8 at a time, nt too bad
[14:28:10] <Jymmm> not*
[14:28:26] <Jymmm> more if I make fixtures
[14:29:04] <Jymmm> I can reuse the wax, and Just use low heat to remove it, not a chemical bath.
[14:29:22] <Jymmm> hell, just hot water for that matter.
[14:29:32] <CaptHindsight> sounds great, problem solved
[14:29:51] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: And you are being an ass, why?
[14:30:22] <CaptHindsight> is there something else besides wax you'd like to try?
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[14:30:46] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: you jumped in the middle of a conversation. I'd suggest to scroll back
[14:31:55] <Jymmm> All I asked about was even dip coating. archivist was the one that brought up other methods/dismissed the wax idea.
[14:32:35] <CaptHindsight> Jymmm: it's been dragging on for days, wax sounds great, dip it in wax
[14:32:51] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: no fucking shit?
[14:33:09] <CaptHindsight> if that doesn't work out, try something else, you'll learn by trying
[14:33:17] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: If you dont what to hear it, toss me on /ignore
[14:34:21] <CaptHindsight> I thought you were looking for encouragement
[14:34:45] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: For the third time... 2013-11-16.06:31:55 Jymmm: All I asked about was even dip coating.
[14:34:52] <CaptHindsight> wax is pretty safe to try, low cost
[14:35:21] <CaptHindsight> yeah, dip coat into wax or maybe some other fluid
[14:35:58] <CaptHindsight> photoemulsions used in silkscreens are also low cost and relatively safe
[14:36:18] <CaptHindsight> and they are easily removed
[14:46:57] <Loetmichel> Jymmm: WHAT do you want to coiat? and why?
[14:47:00] <Loetmichel> -i
[14:47:28] <Loetmichel> ah, scrollback helps.
[14:47:40] <Loetmichel> pcb electro etching
[14:48:21] <Loetmichel> hmmm
[14:49:23] <Loetmichel> maybe an ikea square glass vase filled with blackened parrafine in it, and the whole thing in a second container with hot water... and then just dip the boards in and pull tehm out
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[14:49:26] <Loetmichel> should work
[14:50:03] <Loetmichel> i suppose the laser works better with black stuff than with clear parrafine way?
[14:50:06] <Loetmichel> wax
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[15:15:02] <MacGarage> it was a good night thanks everyone!
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[15:53:47] <jthornton> got chips?
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[15:55:38] <PetefromTn> Mornin' folks..
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[16:00:09] <JT_Shop> morning
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[16:13:25] <PetefromTn> JT_Shop: Hows it goin man.
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[16:55:50] <JT_Shop> busy busy busy...
[16:59:16] <ju-emb> I know, I asked that before here but I forgot:
[16:59:18] <ju-emb> how do I know from inside a python script where the actual used config files reside
[17:00:49] <ju-emb> I like to loadusr a python script and access files that I put in the same directory as the config files are
[17:01:41] <ju-emb> sorry that was the wrong tab i should ask that on de dev
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[17:32:51] <IchGuckLive> hi all B)
[17:34:23] <IchGuckLive> someone knows about tmart.com cheep rablets ?
http://de.tmart.com/promotion/Blowout-Sale.html?cc=eur&gclid=CL3Qg5TB57oCFUlf3godjUwATA
[17:35:34] <Loetmichel> ... that second attempt in PCB milling looks WAY better... a sharp engraving bit is essential ;-) ->
http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=14507 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jMXxjT4nNxg
[17:37:37] <IchGuckLive> nice job is it a vaccuum table
[17:38:07] <kwallace2> That feed rate seems a bit high, but I haven't made any boards so...
[17:40:24] <kwallace2> The board looks good with the picture at full scale.
[17:41:36] <IchGuckLive> Loetmichel: can you get a look on this cheep tablets for my projekt
[17:42:57] <Loetmichel> ich: no vacuum table... double sided tape ;)
[17:43:10] <IchGuckLive> nice to know
[17:43:14] <Loetmichel> kwallace2: the feed rate was at 70%
[17:43:40] <Loetmichel> because at 100% the whole macheine will wiggle that much taht the cellphone cam wont do any good
[17:44:10] <Loetmichel> it can do F1500 without problewms or inaccuracies when engraving PCBs ;-)I
[17:44:49] <kwallace2> I thought the copper would tear at that feed rate but your spindle speed must be high enough to keep up.
[17:45:59] <Loetmichel> 24krpm
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[18:43:00] <Tom_itx> Loetmichel what is the chip load at that rate?
[18:43:51] <Tom_itx> that's the key factor
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[18:49:38] <Tom_itx> that and surface speed which are related
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[22:12:51] <_DJ_> gn8
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