#linuxcnc | Logs for 2013-05-14

[00:01:09] <GammaX-Shop> hmmm
[00:01:13] <GammaX-Shop> stalling even more now...
[00:01:37] <GammaX-Shop> and my numebrs were at like .7 and 8
[00:03:16] <r00t4rd3d> the joys of an odd ball driver
[00:03:27] <GammaX-Shop> wtf
[00:03:51] <GammaX-Shop> maby I should try off off off for peak 7.2 and avg 5 amp.
[00:03:58] <r00t4rd3d> try
[00:04:14] <r00t4rd3d> or just try the next higher setting and see what that does
[00:04:17] <GammaX-Shop> i dont ned o reset my drivers do i?
[00:04:22] <GammaX-Shop> tht is I think
[00:05:04] <r00t4rd3d> i would power it all down before i made jumper changes
[00:06:04] <GammaX-Shop> ok
[00:06:09] <GammaX-Shop> it still just stalled
[00:06:28] <r00t4rd3d> are you moving the jumpers while its all powered up?
[00:07:49] <r00t4rd3d> i hope not
[00:08:56] <GammaX-Shop> I power down the signal going to it so they shut down but yes moving jumpers while there is power going to the driver
[00:09:43] <r00t4rd3d> not 100% but I dont think thats good practice.
[00:10:10] <GammaX-Shop> roger that
[00:10:30] <r00t4rd3d> on my driver if i pull a motor wire while its powered it fries
[00:10:50] <GammaX-Shop> ouch
[00:10:55] <jdh> don't do that.
[00:11:05] <r00t4rd3d> i never tested it
[00:11:24] <GammaX-Shop> testing 1.3 and 16 now
[00:11:47] <r00t4rd3d> are you using the Test Axis button ?
[00:13:14] <GammaX-Shop> wow
[00:13:19] <GammaX-Shop> think I found an issue
[00:13:40] <GammaX-Shop> put new steel couplers on and its SUPER tight
[00:13:42] <r00t4rd3d> ?
[00:13:52] <GammaX-Shop> tite? idk w/e
[00:14:02] <GammaX-Shop> it stalling on that prolly
[00:14:07] <r00t4rd3d> what do you mean tight?
[00:14:14] <r00t4rd3d> hard to spin by hand?
[00:14:21] <GammaX-Shop> I turned all servos off. hard to spin by hand yes!
[00:14:28] <r00t4rd3d> it should be while its powered
[00:14:38] <r00t4rd3d> turn the driver off and spin them
[00:15:15] <r00t4rd3d> if only my parallel cable is hooked up, powered to the driver off, my motors dont spin freely.
[00:15:39] <r00t4rd3d> until its all powered off
[00:15:40] <GammaX-Shop> there completely
[00:15:40] <GammaX-Shop> off
[00:15:47] <GammaX-Shop> hard to spine!!!
[00:15:51] <GammaX-Shop> spin*
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[00:16:18] <r00t4rd3d> i can roll my couplers with 1 finger while its all powered off
[00:20:08] <r00t4rd3d> i think most people get their motors working correctly before coupling them to the screws also
[00:20:10] <r00t4rd3d> i did
[00:21:08] <r00t4rd3d> youtube is filled with driver/stepper tests
[00:21:16] <jdh> wonder why
[00:24:43] <GammaX-Shop> well what kind couplers u have?
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[00:32:53] <r00t4rd3d> dumpstercnc ones
[00:33:47] <r00t4rd3d> your coupler should not effect how easy your screws turn unless they are misaligned
[00:34:22] <GammaX-Shop> its mis aligned
[00:34:35] <GammaX-Shop> myne are straight up hardened steel...
[00:34:37] <GammaX-Shop> not turned on a lathe...
[00:34:52] <r00t4rd3d> i use hardware store threaded rod
[00:34:55] <GammaX-Shop> and the servomounts are chinese ones...
[00:35:22] <GammaX-Shop> threaded rod for what?
[00:35:31] <r00t4rd3d> lead screws
[00:35:40] <GammaX-Shop> ohhhh lol i got a much larger mill
[00:35:55] <r00t4rd3d> they sell it in 1 inch
[00:36:12] <r00t4rd3d> i only use 3/8-16 though currently
[00:37:14] <r00t4rd3d> assembling a new machine though that has all 1/2-10 5 start acme screws
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[00:51:24] <GammaX-Shop> I loosened up the bolts on my stepper and its going no problem now...
[00:52:54] <r00t4rd3d> is it a diy mill?
[00:53:13] <GammaX-Shop> pm45 with stock ball screws
[00:53:21] <GammaX-Shop> and mounts
[00:53:27] <GammaX-Shop> everything but compouter motors and drivers
[00:54:34] <r00t4rd3d> did you do the conversion ?
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[01:02:20] <GammaX-Shop> it already had screws on it
[01:02:26] <GammaX-Shop> everything was dfone except for electronics
[01:03:03] <r00t4rd3d> what are you trying now?
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[01:08:30] <GammaX-Shop> r00t4rd3d: loosened the bolts on stepper and while it has a little bit of wobble to it.... it works great now...
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[01:09:11] <GammaX-Shop> Ill leave it as is now but once it is milling actuall stuff... will put these in hte lathe and make them perfect.
[01:09:19] <r00t4rd3d> put a flex coupler on it
[01:09:26] <GammaX-Shop> already have these...
[01:09:39] <r00t4rd3d> and how well are they working for you?
[01:09:56] <r00t4rd3d> flex couplers are cheap if you order them from china
[01:10:08] <r00t4rd3d> just gotta wait 3 weeks for them
[01:10:37] <GammaX-Shop> flex couplers break
[01:10:43] <GammaX-Shop> ill be doin some heavy machining
[01:10:46] <GammaX-Shop> some what heavy
[01:11:00] <GammaX-Shop> i got the mill at 2.5 vel 25 accell and working great
[01:11:10] <GammaX-Shop> no stallingand no missed stepps
[01:11:19] <r00t4rd3d> at 200 ?
[01:11:27] <GammaX-Shop> yup
[01:11:36] <GammaX-Shop> although the steppers is hot as hell
[01:11:41] <r00t4rd3d> normal
[01:11:53] <GammaX-Shop> like leave ur hand on it and ull burn it hot?
[01:11:59] <r00t4rd3d> yeah
[01:12:04] <GammaX-Shop> interesting
[01:12:14] <GammaX-Shop> whats max temp for these?
[01:12:19] <r00t4rd3d> when idle they heat up
[01:12:32] <GammaX-Shop> I have a temp guage id like to atach and see if its within range
[01:12:37] <r00t4rd3d> run them and they will cool down
[01:12:42] <eric_unterhause1> I now have no reason not to be running some variant of linuxcnc on my beaglebone black
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[01:13:13] <r00t4rd3d> i got a reason
[01:13:27] <eric_unterhause1> wut
[01:14:09] <r00t4rd3d> i dont have a beaglebone black
[01:14:43] <eric_unterhause1> I am feeling a deep sense of pity for you, my friend
[01:15:05] <r00t4rd3d> can you actually do cnc work with it?
[01:15:11] <eric_unterhause1> no, not yet
[01:15:19] <eric_unterhause1> but I have faith that it will happen soon
[01:15:28] <r00t4rd3d> i doubt it
[01:15:51] <eric_unterhause1> i just noticed my nick is screwed up :)
[01:16:47] <eric_unterhause1> well, doubting it is a reasonable position to take
[01:16:57] <r00t4rd3d> most linuxcnc devs have no desire to move away from ancient hardware.
[01:17:05] <eric_unterhause1> but it was worth $45 for me to find out
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[01:18:13] <eric_unterhause1> I don't think there is any antipathy towards cross-platform capability
[01:18:27] <eric_unterhause1> difference between that and nobody volunteering to work on it
[01:18:38] <r00t4rd3d> hardcore machinists do not like change.
[01:24:17] <eric_unterhause1> I guess it helps to plug the micro sd card into the right slot
[01:24:28] <eric_unterhause1> whoculdanode?
[01:24:45] <r00t4rd3d> did you put it in the headphone jack?
[01:24:58] <eric_unterhause1> first I tried putting it in the cup holder
[01:25:40] <L84Supper> isn't the Linuxcnc port to the BBB posted somewhere?
[01:25:42] <eric_unterhause1> hm, looks like it should have worked in the first slot I put itin
[01:25:51] <eric_unterhause1> l84: not working yet
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[01:26:20] <eric_unterhause1> problem is the real time kernel hasn't been ported to the bbb kernel, work in progress
[01:26:23] <r00t4rd3d> that doesnt have a parallel port does it?
[01:26:31] <L84Supper> eric_unterhause1: any idea whats not working and whats working?
[01:27:03] <eric_unterhause1> someone has to come up with an interface to support
[01:27:09] <L84Supper> or where the tree is?
[01:27:11] <eric_unterhause1> too many options right now
[01:27:57] <L84Supper> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Debian_Wheezy_Linux-Rt_Compile_LinuxCNC
[01:28:31] <eric_unterhause1> I think everything is ok on beaglebone white
[01:28:36] <eric_unterhause1> but nobody cares any more
[01:28:47] <eric_unterhause1> which is a little unfortunate
[01:29:25] <GammaX-Shop> my stepper is currently at 156.6 degrees F stable
[01:29:48] <ssi> bbb will be working soon enough
[01:29:55] <eric_unterhause1> GammaX-Shop: that's what I'm talkin' about
[01:30:27] <r00t4rd3d> turn the power down a setting
[01:30:30] <L84Supper> is everyone keeping their beaglbone black work for Linuxcnc private for a while or is there some shared development going on?
[01:30:40] <ssi> L84Supper: it's been going on very loudly in here :P
[01:30:46] <ssi> and on the dev list
[01:30:54] <GammaX-Shop> r00t4rd3d: too much heat? lol
[01:30:59] <L84Supper> have a link to the source?
[01:31:00] <eric_unterhause1> ssi: thanks for your instructions
[01:31:01] <r00t4rd3d> i dont know
[01:31:09] <ssi> eric_unterhause1: did you get it going?
[01:31:28] <eric_unterhause1> no, because I couldn't write to a memory card, doh
[01:31:38] <eric_unterhause1> just got my memory card reader today
[01:31:51] <ssi> haha
[01:32:05] <r00t4rd3d> GammaX-Shop, back the current off a touch
[01:32:07] <eric_unterhause1> I wasn't going to mention it, but you didn't actually give me a link to a kernel
[01:32:12] <L84Supper> ssi: is there public source somewhere?
[01:32:14] <ssi> oh didn't I?
[01:32:23] <eric_unterhause1> I think the mail server stripped it
[01:32:31] <ssi> haha
[01:32:32] <GammaX-Shop> r00t4rd3d: but its going so well! lol
[01:32:32] <ssi> ok
[01:32:48] <ssi> http://www.prototechnical.com/cnc/bbb/kernel-3.8.10-vanilla.tgz
[01:32:49] <r00t4rd3d> well that seems to hot
[01:32:56] <GammaX-Shop> not a lossed step at 2.5 and 25.
[01:33:12] <r00t4rd3d> you probably wont notice if you turn it down
[01:33:20] <r00t4rd3d> if its getting too much
[01:33:26] <r00t4rd3d> or more then it needs
[01:33:30] <ssi> L84Supper: here's my branch:
[01:33:31] <ssi> http://git.mah.priv.at/gitweb?p=emc2-dev.git;a=shortlog;h=refs/heads/bb-hal-gpio
[01:33:40] <ssi> that's where I did my gpio work
[01:33:53] <ssi> Charles Steinkuehler has another branch where he's working on PRU stepgens
[01:34:19] <eric_unterhause1> PRU stepgens would be really nice
[01:34:24] <ssi> yeah
[01:34:33] <L84Supper> ssi: thanks, we will have a look
[01:34:43] <ssi> right now we're pinmuxing via /dev/mem, which isn't ideal
[01:34:46] <eric_unterhause1> there was a discussion today on the bb mail list about clock tweaking on bbb
[01:34:54] <ssi> I've done some research into device tree overlays, that's the direction id like to move
[01:35:12] <eric_unterhause1> the standard settings idles the cpu at 300mHz
[01:35:44] <eric_unterhause1> I didn't recognize the person's name that raised the question, it was about real-time on the bbb
[01:36:09] <ssi> lots of people want RT... I dunno when that'll happen
[01:36:35] <eric_unterhause1> real soon now, I hope
[01:37:32] <GammaX-Shop> god I wish I just had servos! lol
[01:37:52] <jdh> all it takes is a credit card
[01:38:04] <eric_unterhause1> when your servos get warm, then you hate yourself all the more
[01:38:21] <eric_unterhause1> I had a project where we used the windings as a heater-- on purpose
[01:38:23] <GammaX-Shop> this si true
[01:38:24] <GammaX-Shop> but so much easier!
[01:38:53] <GammaX-Shop> dropped current down one knotch and so far the temp is at 154 F
[01:38:53] <ssi> speaking of servos, I got my Y pulleys sorted out :D
[01:38:53] <ssi> https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BKLi5haCMAIynMD.jpg:large
[01:39:51] <r00t4rd3d> GammaX-Shop, does it still run the same?
[01:40:07] <GammaX-Shop> gettin there
[01:40:10] <GammaX-Shop> just taking a little longer.
[01:40:46] <r00t4rd3d> the datasheet for your motors might list the operating temps
[01:42:38] <GammaX-Shop> stepper almost up to 160, currently at 158.1, constant use back and fworth
[01:43:44] <eric_unterhause1> ssi: I unmount the microsd card before dd'ing the image, right?
[01:47:23] <r00t4rd3d> GammaX-Shop, change the idle current back
[01:47:31] <r00t4rd3d> sw4 i think it was?
[01:47:42] <r00t4rd3d> we set it to full, set it back to half now
[01:48:15] <r00t4rd3d> then when the motors are idle they will only get half current
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[01:48:36] <r00t4rd3d> should keep them cooler
[01:48:53] <GammaX-Shop> current temp 161.5 and 3.0 velocity 25 accell
[01:49:19] <eric_unterhause1> will they also be half fast?
[01:50:55] <L84Supper> 30 minutes into the BBB and I already hate TI again
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[01:51:22] <eric_unterhause1> what did they do now?
[01:51:24] <L84Supper> their docs are still about the worst in the industry
[01:51:43] <GammaX-Shop> L84Supper: you know the max temp for a stepper?
[01:52:01] <eric_unterhause1> pretty sure you haven't gotten there yet
[01:52:21] <eric_unterhause1> although I suppose that servos use better magnets
[01:52:25] <r00t4rd3d> its like 180-200f
[01:52:40] <eric_unterhause1> but they can withstand that all day
[01:52:49] <eric_unterhause1> much to my chagrin
[01:52:53] <GammaX-Shop> well myne is 162 +- .5 stable
[01:53:11] <r00t4rd3d> did you change sw4 to half?
[01:53:16] <L84Supper> GammaX: the glass transition temp of coil insulation or whatever melts first :)
[01:53:30] <r00t4rd3d> melt the wires, short out your driver
[01:53:43] <eric_unterhause1> ya, I was always worried about the insulation
[01:54:35] <GammaX-Shop> L84Supper: lol!
[01:55:06] <L84Supper> I'd keep the case under 100 deg C
[01:56:05] <L84Supper> class B insulation is rated at 130 degrees C
[01:56:22] <L84Supper> coil to case is probably ~30 deg C
[01:56:57] <L84Supper> for continuous 90 C is safe
[01:57:12] <eric_unterhause1> I should have bought a memory card reader with blinky lights
[01:58:20] <L84Supper> you can add a heat sink or aluminum plate to lower the temp
[01:58:45] <eric_unterhause1> that works pretty well, did it with a camera
[01:59:04] <eric_unterhause1> the difference in temp was pretty amazing
[01:59:36] <L84Supper> 162 F = 72 C
[02:00:43] <GammaX-Shop> good idea on hatsink
[02:00:45] <GammaX-Shop> heat*
[02:01:07] <pcw_home> Dont most step motors use class H?
[02:01:08] <GammaX-Shop> im stable at 162.5 at a vel of 3.1 accell of 25. those good numbers?
[02:01:58] <eric_unterhause1> I think I just dd'd my image to the wrong place on the sd card
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[02:02:40] <GammaX-Shop> eric_unterhause1: what you trying to dd?
[02:02:54] <eric_unterhause1> beaglebone image
[02:03:00] <L84Supper> pcw_home: don't know what he's got, so figure for worst case
[02:03:57] <GammaX-Shop> eric_unterhause1: i have no idea wtf a beaglebone is soo im out of your realm on htat one
[02:04:15] <eric_unterhause1> its a small computer
[02:04:25] <GammaX-Shop> ohhh now I know
[02:04:29] <eric_unterhause1> I'm installing an image of debian on an sd card to boot
[02:04:53] <GammaX-Shop> what are common vel/accel values people have?
[02:05:02] <GammaX-Shop> for a midsize rf45 type machine?
[02:05:45] <eric_unterhause1> I dunno, but did you know that the derivative of jerk is called snap?
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[02:08:04] <GammaX-Shop> nope lol
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[02:08:59] <pcw_home> what about crackle and pop?
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[02:12:04] <eric_unterhause1> crackle is derivative of snap, pop is derivative of crackle
[02:12:25] <eric_unterhause1> actually, it appears that "jounce" is more common than snap
[02:12:40] <pcw_home> and higher derivatives are just rice crispies?
[02:12:58] <eric_unterhause1> apparently there are motion controls that are jounce limited
[02:13:21] <eric_unterhause1> limiting jerk just seems like a good thing for inter-office harmony
[02:14:01] <eric_unterhause1> jerk limiting is common in aerospace
[02:14:06] <pcw_home> Ive hear of quintic motion profiles but thats about it
[02:15:41] <L84Supper> pcw_home: beaglbone black + FPGA cape vs ZYNQ for embedded motion control of a few axis
[02:16:20] <L84Supper> small machines, not large machine tools
[02:16:30] <pcw_home> jerk limiting is important if you want to minimize the otherwise uncorrectable errors at acceleration steps
[02:16:32] <pcw_home> (and minimize energy stored in mechanics)
[02:18:12] <GammaX-Shop> is 1 step on a servo usualy .001 with ball screws?
[02:18:53] <pcw_home> If you are not using the video or NAND you can probably do everything in a BBB (if not too many axis)
[02:18:55] <pcw_home> an FPGA will have higher performance and be a lot more flexible but the BBB (or just Sitara based SBC is cheaper BOM wise)
[02:19:04] <skunkworks> cradek mentioned with his seiki - he could set the accelleration very high but backed it off because he could feel it in the floor...
[02:19:46] <ssi> I want to keep the video if at all possible
[02:19:47] <skunkworks> GammaX-Shop: could be anything....
[02:19:52] <eric_unterhause1> seiki is knee mill?
[02:20:09] <ssi> it eats a ton of IO, for sure, but it's nice being able to run a monitor directly on it
[02:20:11] <skunkworks> no - mori seiki jr.. smallish machining center
[02:20:24] <skunkworks> *for some definition of small
[02:20:52] <eric_unterhause1> it would be nice to use the bbb for everything
[02:21:07] <eric_unterhause1> but I wouldn't mind having 2 either
[02:21:11] <ssi> I wouldn't mind an fpga cape
[02:21:27] <ssi> or some kind of sserial or SPI breakout
[02:21:29] <skunkworks> http://geektrap.com/bill/01248711886
[02:21:38] <eric_unterhause1> from the beagleboard list it appears that the display is somewhat limited on the BBB
[02:21:47] <L84Supper> there is some small spartan6 cape in the works
[02:21:57] <ssi> limited how?
[02:22:10] <pcw_home> resolution of encoders varies by requirements, a servo plasma cutter will
[02:22:12] <pcw_home> likely have much lower resolution than a lathe or mill .001 to .000005 might be the range
[02:22:39] <skunkworks> GammaX-Shop: my machine is 60960 counts per inch...
[02:23:02] <eric_unterhause1> ssi: limited to low res
[02:23:12] <ssi> how low?
[02:23:17] <ssi> I think it's at least 12x10
[02:23:27] <eric_unterhause1> they are working on figuring that out right now
[02:23:51] <skunkworks> or 0.000016404
[02:24:12] <Valen> hey pcw_home how hard would it be to get gate drive signals out of a 5i22 rather than direction and PWM?
[02:24:12] <ssi> hm that reminds me
[02:24:25] <ssi> I ordered hdmi to micro cable from monoprice and it never showed up
[02:24:29] <Valen> basically just doing the deadtime generation
[02:24:31] <pcw_home> not hard at all
[02:24:43] <pcw_home> use the 3pwmgen module
[02:25:07] <Valen> I was hoping for a regular brushed DC
[02:25:21] <L84Supper> http://circuitco.com/support/index.php?title=BeagleBone_Capes
[02:26:01] <L84Supper> http://beagleboard.org/CapeContest/entries/FPGA+LOGI-BONE/
[02:26:01] <pcw_home> Just use U,W?
[02:26:20] <Valen> thanks, gives me a place to start looking ;->
[02:27:00] <pcw_home> Ill bet the logibone guy is really happy that they used the GPMC for the on card NAND...
[02:27:16] <GammaX-Shop> whats all the hype ith the beagle? GOnna be running lcnc from it?
[02:27:40] <L84Supper> http://valentfx.com/prj/fpga-dev/19-logi-bone-cape
[02:28:53] <L84Supper> http://valentfx.com/images/prj/logi/logi-bone/SCH-LOGI-BONE-FAT-RA1.pdf
[02:29:21] <L84Supper> XC6SLX9 144 pin
[02:30:23] <L84Supper> http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/XC6SLX9-3TQG144C/122-1747-ND/2339929
[02:31:29] <pcw_home> (why not to buy anything from Digikey)
[02:31:49] <L84Supper> 2-3x the price
[02:32:18] <pcw_home> ok for protos
[02:32:27] <pcw_home> or when desparate
[02:32:59] <eric_unterhause1> GammaX-Shop bbb is cheap and it looks like it will run linuxcnc pretty well
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[02:33:26] <eric_unterhause1> nobody is currently making an i/o device that works with it
[02:34:19] <eric_unterhause1> I always like running dd, takes forever, then running sync, takes just as long
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[02:34:55] <pcw_home> I am considering a breakout but the pin muxing reminds me why I hate ASICs
[02:35:32] <eric_unterhause1> all the microcontrollers are muxed to the hilt nowadays
[02:35:41] <pcw_home> sucks
[02:36:18] <Valen> oh you may know this pcw_home a friend was after a FPGA on a usb stick
[02:36:26] <Valen> basically a dongle to make a stream processor with
[02:36:29] <Valen> any suggestions?
[02:36:45] <pcw_home> There must be some cheap ones around
[02:37:15] <Valen> you would think that, but for some reason they all seem to thing you want to interact with the real world
[02:38:12] <pcw_home> Yes its also a missing area in FPGAs (large FPGAs with small pin counts)
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[02:46:14] <L84Supper> Valen: http://www.xess.com/prods/prod048.php
[02:46:50] <Valen> L84Supper: thanks for that I'll pass it on
[02:51:30] <L84Supper> http://www.aliexpress.com/item/100-NEW-FPGA-STARTER-Altera-FPGA-Development-board/705109654.html?tracelog=back_to_detail_a
[02:51:38] <L84Supper> cheaper but not smaller
[02:57:43] <ssi> I have a couple fpga devboards
[03:01:51] <eric_unterhause1> ssi: on Michael's debian install, can I still log in over usb, or do I have to go make a xover ethernet cable?
[03:02:07] <ssi> best off makign a cable
[03:02:17] <ssi> you can load the gadget driver to get usb network going, but it's not as seamless as angstrom
[03:03:06] <L84Supper> http://www.aliexpress.com/item/free-shipping-iCore-FPGA-ARM-development-board-CYCLONE4-STM32-EP4CE6E22C8N-STM32F103VC/605662347.html
[03:03:23] <L84Supper> CYCLONE4 + STM32,EP4CE6E22C8N + STM32F103VC,fpga development board
[03:04:29] <pcw_home> I like the $NaN price
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[03:05:37] <L84Supper> found it for only $52
[03:11:45] <L84Supper> http://item.taobao.com/item.htm?spm=2013.
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[03:33:08] <zultron> Woo hoo! Taobao, the fleabay of the East.
[03:35:15] <eric_unterhause1> how does getting here on friday constitute 2 day shipping?
[03:35:21] <zultron> I spent almost a whole week once learning enough about steppers, stepper drivers, spindles and VFDs, as well as the Chinese characters to read the ads for and purchase a 70 lb suitcase of cheap CNC hardware from taobao.
[03:35:42] <zultron> I think I saved $300 in shipping for all that effort.
[03:37:12] <zultron> eric, you in the US? It's after hours today (Mon), they receive your order tomorrow (Tue), ship the next day (Wed) with 2-day express (Fri).
[03:38:01] <eric_unterhause1> they will ship tomorrow, overnite would be wednesday and 2 day would be thursday
[03:38:21] <zultron> In that case, I'd blame wormholes.
[03:38:29] <zultron> They really do exist.
[03:38:51] <eric_unterhause1> I blame MBA's, but I believe it is the same physical phenomenon
[03:39:53] <ssi> plasma is hard :(
[03:39:54] <zultron> Erm, I'm an MBA, and logistics is a simple OR (Operations Research) problem, in which wormholes are a factor.
[03:41:09] <zultron> As are tsunamis, earthquakes, Godzilla, and other 'systemic' sources of uncertainty.
[03:41:54] <eric_unterhause1> amazon never screwed me like this before
[03:42:14] <eric_unterhause1> usually I don't actually need anything second day, but friday is cutting it close
[03:42:32] <ssi> eric_unterhause1: I've had some days like that
[03:42:56] <ssi> my favorite is when you order something overnight because you absolutely positively need it friday, and then they sit on your order and ship it friday
[03:43:06] <ssi> so much fun to pay $60 for overnight shipping to get something four days from now
[03:43:22] <eric_unterhause1> that's why I don't buy from some company I forgot anymore
[03:43:44] <eric_unterhause1> funny I've forgotten their name
[03:44:00] <eric_unterhause1> paid for expedited shipping, but they sat on it for days and then shipped overnite
[03:44:38] <eric_unterhause1> digikey should also figure out the shipping business
[03:44:57] <eric_unterhause1> I ordered something to go to an address in Minnesota and it took a week
[03:46:01] <ssi> mouser pissed me off real bad a couple weeks ago
[03:46:33] <eric_unterhause1> yeah, they have always been slow too
[03:46:43] <ssi> i tried to order something on a saturday that I needed relatively quickly
[03:46:49] <ssi> and their site was broken
[03:46:56] <eric_unterhause1> that site scares me
[03:47:05] <ssi> (by relatively quickly I mean like wednesday, so usps would have been fine)
[03:47:10] <ssi> monday morning I get an email:
[03:47:13] <ssi> Thank you for your web order you placed with Mouser over the weekend. We have had technical difficulty with our web site that has been corrected. Please advise if you would like for Mouser to proceed with your order or cancel.
[03:47:20] <ssi> I'm thinking, wow best company ever
[03:47:27] <ssi> so I reply and say yes please get that order going
[03:47:31] <ssi> 10am monday morning
[03:47:57] <ssi> I get no response all day, and then it's too late to order anything, so I email and complain, and ask for a shipping upgrade for the inconvenience
[03:48:09] <ssi> so I get back:
[03:48:09] <ssi> Thank you for the prompt response. I will submit the order for you and waived the shipping.
[03:48:21] <ssi> then TWO DAYS LATER, they ship it 2 day
[03:48:23] <ssi> so I get it friday
[03:48:29] <ssi> and they charged me $50 for the shipping
[03:48:44] <ssi> so I email to yell about that, and the same rep keeps telling me that she's going to credit me back the shipping, but it never happens
[03:48:53] <ssi> took me three weeks to get that money back
[03:49:12] <ssi> I sent this email to them: I suppose that plus the experience i had last week is enough for me to find the initiative to overcome Digikey's horrible web experience and switch suppliers.
[03:49:15] <ssi> hahah
[03:49:49] <eric_unterhause1> I don't know why I order from digikey
[03:50:01] <ssi> I hate digikeys site worse than mouser's
[03:50:04] <eric_unterhause1> newark and allied are just as easy
[03:50:17] <ssi> newark always seems really expensive
[03:50:20] <ssi> as does digikey
[03:50:33] <zultron> Heh, Mouser wrote on their packing slip that they'd sent 4/4 RPis my bud and I ordered (this, after a 4-month backorder). They actually sent 1. Luckily they believed us when we showed them the 1" thick box that couldn't possibly have contained all four.
[03:50:39] <generic_nick> great, i just ordered from mouser lol
[03:50:51] <zultron> Took them four more weeks to get us the other three.
[03:50:57] <ssi> generic_nick: mostly they're ok... they just dicked me over on shipping twice in 2 weeks
[03:51:01] <eric_unterhause1> I like mouser, just don't expect it anytime soon
[03:51:27] <eric_unterhause1> although my bbb came a month before I wanted it to :)
[03:51:29] <generic_nick> i remember mouser was slow when we ordered crap from them when i had a job many, many years ago
[03:51:44] <ssi> I wish there was an electronics supplier with a website and shipping as good as mcmaster
[03:51:50] <ssi> that would pretty much make my life complete
[03:51:55] <generic_nick> lol
[03:51:58] <eric_unterhause1> mcmaster sent me to collections
[03:52:03] <ssi> hah
[03:52:05] <ssi> pay your bills :)
[03:52:08] <zultron> deadbeat
[03:52:24] <eric_unterhause1> yeah, but they say it's 30 days net
[03:52:44] <ssi> I've gotten caught with some goofy stuff with them too... I order almost exclusively through the website
[03:52:53] <ssi> but once I called and asked for some help picking sometihng out
[03:52:59] <ssi> and they shipped it to me, and then sent me a paper invoice
[03:53:02] <eric_unterhause1> actually, my wife lost her credit card and the credit card company changed our number
[03:53:16] <ssi> and I wasn't expecting it... I don't even know how to run a checkbook anymore :P
[03:53:21] <eric_unterhause1> mcmaster shipped me stuff on the old number until they sent me to collections
[03:53:23] <zultron> Among MBAs, Dell's negative CCC (Cash Conversion Cycle) is a legendary business case.
[03:53:30] <ssi> eric_unterhause1: woops
[03:54:26] <zultron> Whoops. Wormhole?
[03:54:26] <eric_unterhause1> I thought it was nice they trusted me to pay, but it would have been nice to know I owed them money
[03:54:43] <ssi> yeah that's a bad situation
[03:54:53] <ssi> overall I love working with them
[03:55:03] <ssi> and their website is the absolute shining example of what ecommerce should be
[03:55:03] <generic_nick> so my keyboard with built in mouse was acting up... turns out my 110v was being drained wayyy too much by other stuff on the circuit. caused issues with the mouse, and also the servos werent working so hot
[03:55:18] <eric_unterhause1> I actually figured it out myself and paid the balance the day before they sent me to collections
[03:55:58] <generic_nick> eric_unterhause1: i had a similar experience when a card i had on file expired
[03:56:09] <zultron> ERP system wormhole, then.
[03:56:22] <ssi> see I just had a card on file expire
[03:56:37] <ssi> and when I went to order stuff, the website said "hey your card is expired, what's the new expiration"
[03:56:40] <ssi> and that was the end of it
[03:56:43] <ssi> that was yesterday
[03:56:56] <generic_nick> this was years ago, maybe they changed it
[03:57:03] <eric_unterhause1> the nice thing about mcmaster is that they get better over time
[03:57:12] <eric_unterhause1> which is rare for an industry leader
[03:57:40] <generic_nick> what would 'murica do if mcmaster went under
[03:57:47] <generic_nick> we'd all be screwed
[03:57:51] <eric_unterhause1> true
[03:57:51] <ssi> bitch about grainger
[03:57:53] <ssi> or something
[03:57:57] <eric_unterhause1> msc is ok
[03:57:59] <generic_nick> oh fuck grainger
[03:58:04] <generic_nick> and msc
[03:58:07] <ssi> yea
[03:58:12] <generic_nick> unless you like getting bent over
[03:58:16] <ssi> msc is annoying as shit.. order from them once and they'll call you forever
[03:58:18] <eric_unterhause1> I work with people who buy everything from grangier
[03:58:24] <ssi> and I'd much rather buy from their bastard cousin Enco
[03:58:24] <ssi> heh
[03:58:40] <generic_nick> enco is ok, just takes too long to get the stuff
[03:58:42] <ssi> you know what's funny... enco and msc are colocated in atlanta
[03:58:45] <ssi> and we bought a brake once
[03:58:53] <ssi> msc will let you pick stuff up, but enco won't
[03:58:58] <eric_unterhause1> I asked them if they heard of mcmaster, but they didn't have an account there
[03:58:59] <ssi> they ship out of the same fucking dock
[03:59:10] <ssi> so we told them we were shipping it private trucking
[03:59:14] <ssi> and showed up with a pickup truck
[03:59:15] <ssi> heh
[03:59:18] <generic_nick> ssi: LOL
[04:00:06] <eric_unterhause1> mcmaster sent me something that cost $500, it was a pain to get them to take it back
[04:00:09] <eric_unterhause1> I didn't want it
[04:00:22] <ssi> I've never tried to return anything
[04:00:26] <ssi> I've heard their return policy is good though
[04:00:28] <eric_unterhause1> they will take anything back
[04:00:52] <eric_unterhause1> I asked them a question about an order once, they offered to take it back even though I hadn't suggested such a thing
[04:01:23] <eric_unterhause1> but it turns out if they make a shipping mistake, it's hard to give it back without a refund
[04:02:12] <ssi> hah
[04:02:15] <ssi> so you didn't pay for it
[04:02:30] <eric_unterhause1> I have no idea who ordered it
[04:02:34] <eric_unterhause1> no clues at all
[04:03:24] <eric_unterhause1> actually, now that I think about it, they threw it in a box with my order so someone else got shorted
[04:04:00] <eric_unterhause1> I ordered a trailer hitch jack from Amazon, they sent me a dog shock collar
[04:04:12] <eric_unterhause1> someone with a dog got a surprise
[04:04:13] <ssi> lol
[04:04:25] <eric_unterhause1> bad dog!
[04:04:50] <ssi> what do people do about Z axis brakes on small mill conversions like the g0704?
[04:05:02] <L84Supper> zultron: I'm in China half the time if you need anything
[04:05:08] <ssi> so they don't spin down when you power off
[04:05:33] <eric_unterhause1> gas spring?
[04:05:40] <generic_nick> ssi: hang it upside down
[04:06:13] <eric_unterhause1> I have a motor with a brake, but I'm afraid to use it
[04:06:27] <ssi> oo gas spring is a good idea
[04:06:36] <eric_unterhause1> although I'm pretty sure the motor would happily spin the brake
[04:06:38] <ssi> what's the best way to select the spring?
[04:07:08] <eric_unterhause1> you would have to ask that, I'm in decision paralysis over that very question
[04:07:20] <ssi> hahah
[04:07:34] <eric_unterhause1> the adjustable ones are far more expensive
[04:09:21] <eric_unterhause1> I am planning on using a digital scale and my trailer hitch jack/dog shock collar to see how much force it takes to lift the thing I'm putting the gas spring on
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[04:10:30] <eric_unterhause1> Hoss has totally rebuilt his 704 into a clone of a 5 axis machining center, or you could ask him
[04:10:57] <ssi> haha I know :P
[04:11:05] <ssi> plus he's way too much of an "internet celebrity" :P
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[04:14:37] <zultron> L84Supper, I do sometimes. Not from China but from Chicago, you driving to the Fest?
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[04:15:26] <L84Supper> haven't decided, lots of projects got delayed into June, running out of free time
[04:15:36] <zultron> Ah, that sucks.
[04:15:41] <ssi> so my neighbor's been hanging out with me in the shop the last couple days
[04:15:47] <L84Supper> 11 hr drive or 2 hr flight
[04:15:51] <ssi> and he coined a new term for metalworking
[04:15:54] <ssi> "reverse 3d printing"
[04:15:56] <ssi> I lol'd irl
[04:16:11] <zultron> How about the PyCAM additive processes project? Still on schedule for this summer?
[04:16:13] <L84Supper> maybe Friday - Sunday
[04:16:41] <zultron> If you ended up driving, I might want something heavy from Shars. :)
[04:16:46] <L84Supper> working on NX CAM first, then we'll see
[04:17:04] <zultron> Bah, NX CAM
[04:17:04] <L84Supper> maybe a few granite surfaces?
[04:17:10] <zultron> You got it.
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[04:17:32] <L84Supper> all the large OEM's use NX and they are the paying customers
[04:17:45] <zultron> Their website can't even compute the shipping for a 18"x24" to Texas.
[04:17:47] <L84Supper> PyCam is for the cheapskates
[04:18:29] <zultron> Yeah, I'm a cheapskate. I've rooted around in there, got task persistence working again, but have to decide whether to add other pieces.
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[04:18:44] <L84Supper> $400 in gas vs $250 flight, can you carry on a granite surface?
[04:19:22] <L84Supper> have to get the devs in China to dig into PyCam
[04:19:25] <zultron> Heh, I bet that the 18x24 would cost about $150 extra for Shars to ship.
[04:19:34] <zultron> Ugh, Chinese developers
[04:19:44] <zultron> That won't produce anything that anyone wants.
[04:19:51] <L84Supper> I try to avoid touching anything beyond 1's and 0's
[04:20:05] <L84Supper> ?
[04:20:15] <zultron> PyCAM is 'in a state of flux' right now, shall we say, between its old architecture and its new plugin-based architecture.
[04:20:32] <zultron> So whatever you touch, you'll want to update to the new plugin architecture.
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[04:20:50] <L84Supper> won't be till July at this rate
[04:21:03] <zultron> Chinese devs won't bother with that. They'll take your specs, do exactly what you ask and no more, and you'll be stuck paying for it.
[04:21:19] <L84Supper> the work on NX should tell us what we need
[04:21:35] <zultron> I may have had a fraught experience with Chinese devs in the past. :)
[04:21:53] <zultron> Tsinghua grads, no less.
[04:22:15] <L84Supper> these aren't outside contractors
[04:22:26] <zultron> Ours were employees.
[04:22:51] <L84Supper> sorry things didn't work out for you
[04:23:03] <zultron> Well, maybe they still will.
[04:23:46] <L84Supper> working on RTAI first
[04:23:49] <eric_unterhause1> I always blame management
[04:24:09] <zultron> But you're not going to get someone who has the love and the sense of aesthetics that other contributors to an open-source project would have, resulting in something of questionable value to the community.
[04:24:55] <zultron> I definitely blame myself, but there's a limit.
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[04:25:49] <L84Supper> also imaging and alignment for Linuxcnc
[04:27:05] <eric_unterhause1> one of the undergrads that works in our lab says that some companies will not hire unless you have demonstrated contributions to open source
[04:27:28] <zultron> Me too. I'm still looking at other things that can help integrate vision, 3D scanning, planning, and other fancy toys at our fingertips.
[04:28:00] <zultron> Wow, that's awesome. Enlightenment.
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[04:28:05] <L84Supper> a camera scans the part on a 5-axis stage, auto aligns itself, scans for defects and other things
[04:28:30] <eric_unterhause1> I forget which company he interviewed with, it wasn't an open source company
[04:29:07] <L84Supper> the devs in China have worked on many open source projects,it's actually how we all met
[04:29:38] <L84Supper> ex AMD, Intel, Oracle, Google people
[04:29:46] <zultron> (I'm wearing a t-shirt that says "RMS 萬歲" (erm, in simplified characters) as we type ;)
[04:30:37] <eric_unterhause1> I kinda miss the serial port on the beagleboard, I guess I'm going to have to get one of those ftdi boards
[04:31:32] <zultron> Initially, the scanner models the machine and fixtures; next models the brick of material placed thereon, and computes bounding boxes and obstacles.
[04:31:45] <L84Supper> I can't say if were 100% committed to PyCam yet
[04:32:00] <zultron> Need to look at ROS. :)
[04:32:23] <L84Supper> it would be nice but if it's too much trouble to work with the other devs it's not worth it
[04:32:25] <zultron> (Not an MBA TLA this time, whew)
[04:32:53] <zultron> Lars has been pretty permissive of large, sweeping changes so far.
[04:33:30] <zultron> That's why I keep asking which version you run, since there was a big performance fix about a year ago.
[04:33:59] <zultron> Lars is often lurking here, 'sumpfralle', but he's not on right now.
[04:34:18] <L84Supper> I have barely touched it myself
[04:34:52] <zultron> It's in a bit of a hairy state right now. Lots of potential, but lots of work needing done with the plugins.
[04:35:14] <L84Supper> looks like I have 0.5.1 on here
[04:35:16] <zultron> If you want the changes within a finite timeframe, you're going to have to do them yourself.
[04:35:29] <zultron> Yeah, that one's about 5x slower than the current version.
[04:36:11] <eric_unterhause1> beaglebone wiki down, time for sleep anyway
[04:36:13] <zultron> There are some other efforts to add non-python, binary TPG libs too, but none of them are ready, AFAICT.
[04:36:15] <L84Supper> we don't expect anyone to do the work for us
[04:36:42] <zultron> And there's ODE collision detection, but I haven't gotten it to work out of the box.
[04:37:03] <L84Supper> we are more concerned about personality getting in the way of us building on it vs re-factoring and forking
[04:37:42] <zultron> That's always a risk. Keep an eye on how my recent contribution is accepted (or not) over the next weeks.
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[04:37:51] <zultron> It's already been announced on the pycam-dev list.
[04:38:18] <zultron> And forking is always an option.
[04:38:47] <zultron> But from my impression, Lars would be happy to give up the reins to someone with more energy to drive the project.
[04:39:56] <zultron> And, the plugin re-factoring was initiated by Lars, and I think he'd love to have help on it.
[04:40:55] <L84Supper> there is no current solution for additive manufacturing CAM beyond the toy applications for rerap and and some proprietary applications for old 3d printer tech
[04:41:25] <zultron> Yep, you pointed that out to me first, and I agree there's huge potential there.
[04:42:01] <zultron> I'd also like to use additive manufacturing CAM to rewind my 1924 Neracar magneto.
[04:42:54] <L84Supper> Solidworks is working with the glue guns printers by makerbot
[04:43:11] <zultron> BTW, isn't Staples or someone selling a 3D printer? What do they do for software?
[04:43:25] <eric_unterhause1> staples is putting printers in stores
[04:43:33] <eric_unterhause1> like a copy machine
[04:43:49] <L84Supper> it a Laminated Objet Manufacturing printer LOM
[04:43:50] <zultron> Copy machines scan an original first. Like that?
[04:44:14] <L84Supper> a fancy paper cutter and laminator
[04:44:14] <eric_unterhause1> not intended to be taken too literally :)
[04:44:16] <zultron> Can't upload a CAD drawing to a copy machine in any form.
[04:44:40] <L84Supper> i haven't bothered to look
[04:44:51] <eric_unterhause1> I can't imagine that's going to go too well
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[04:45:17] <zultron> Well, I think the software they provide is worth a bother, even though it hasn't come up high enough on my prio list yet.
[04:45:18] <L84Supper> they also sell the Cube now
[04:45:21] <zultron> either.
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[04:46:20] <L84Supper> all their printer does is cut and glue each layer
[04:46:29] <zultron> That's kinda neat.
[04:46:42] <zultron> You should be happy it's not a 'GGG'.
[04:46:52] <zultron> Ha ha1
[04:46:53] <zultron> !
[04:47:19] <L84Supper> it's not good for much
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[04:47:53] <L84Supper> it's like having a #3 phillps for a toolset
[04:48:21] <zultron> Well, neither are the papier-mache' balloons your kids made in kindergarten, but they're pretty right? Plus the sentimental value.
[04:48:24] <L84Supper> but you won't see hybrids in the US for many years
[04:48:32] <zultron> Sniff, my first 3D printer!
[04:48:42] <L84Supper> the patent holders won't cooperate
[04:49:14] <zultron> Holdering out for the biggest licensing deal, huh?
[04:49:19] <L84Supper> if they can't have it all then nobody wins
[04:49:38] <zultron> Meh, they'll be worked around
[04:49:46] <zultron> They're not important enough to block this.
[04:50:22] <eric_unterhause1> I keep wondering why there aren't lawsuits all over the place given the number of 3d printer companies
[04:50:38] <eric_unterhause1> or am I just not paying attention?
[04:51:06] <L84Supper> the patents for the basic glue gun has expired
[04:51:29] <zultron> But 3d printing with a glue gun is a 'utility patent'.
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[04:51:32] <L84Supper> 3d systems filed against the Form1
[04:51:57] <L84Supper> the inkjet + powder patent just expired
[04:53:31] <zultron> I should go rip apart my old Tektronix solid ink printer and turn it into a 3D printer. That thing's older than 14 years, and printing repeatedly on the same piece of paper shouldn't pass the 'non-obvious' test.
[04:53:36] <L84Supper> there was just a bunch of lawsuits and acquisitions and mergers
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[04:54:24] <L84Supper> the big two in the US are 3D systems ad Stratasys
[04:54:36] <L84Supper> ad/and
[04:55:08] <L84Supper> buy up competitors and just sit on the tech
[04:55:45] <zultron> What else do they do?
[04:55:52] <L84Supper> sell a few machines at high margins, even higher margins on the materials and only target protos
[04:55:53] <zultron> Not familiar with those.
[04:56:36] <zultron> And a big legal arm to protect their intellectchul proppity?
[04:56:41] <L84Supper> they all print at glacial speeds and the materials costs are so high even if they were fast you can't print anything affordable
[04:57:36] <eric_unterhause1> I'm waiting for the patent on the magnifying glass and desert sand printer to expire
[04:57:46] <eric_unterhause1> that thing is awesome
[04:57:51] <L84Supper> hundreds of $$ per liter for wax and $2/lb monomers
[04:58:17] <L84Supper> polymer powders at 1000% margins
[04:59:32] <L84Supper> inkjet printers for $100k's with $500/l fluids
[05:00:15] <eric_unterhause1> so basically, another killer tech being dragged down by rent seekers
[05:00:26] <L84Supper> so parts that could be printer for 20 cents worth of materials end up costing $100
[05:00:44] <L84Supper> yes, for the past 30 years
[05:01:13] <L84Supper> the patent holder of SLA at 3D systems just cashed out 50% of his stock
[05:01:15] <eric_unterhause1> didn't realize it had been that long
[05:01:25] <L84Supper> getting out ow
[05:01:28] <L84Supper> now
[05:01:48] <eric_unterhause1> I guess I'm getting old
[05:02:35] <eric_unterhause1> crap,it's been 30 years since I got my undergrad degree
[05:03:03] <L84Supper> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chuck_Hull
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[05:04:21] <L84Supper> http://news.investors.com/technology/031413-647994-3d-systems-falls-as-founder-charles-hull-sells-stock.htm
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[05:06:11] <L84Supper> nobody in the west is going after high speed additive manufacturing systems
[05:06:45] <L84Supper> it's all old slow proto printers
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[05:21:54] <ssi> https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/941604_10100139469579352_512852766_n.jpg
[05:21:57] <ssi> hahahah
[05:22:07] <ssi> Z mount is looking good
[05:22:11] <ssi> guy behind the madness, not so much
[05:23:55] <ssi> https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BKM8TVgCMAE_YeB.jpg:large
[05:28:31] <Valen> what motor ssi?
[05:28:38] <ssi> MCG 60v servo
[05:28:50] <Valen> what $ and driver and source?
[05:28:58] <ssi> source is ebay, about $50 apiece
[05:29:02] <Valen> nice
[05:29:04] <ssi> drivers are AMC 30A8T
[05:29:24] <ssi> I've got two each of two different kinds of servo
[05:29:49] <Valen> heh shipping on anything like that to here starts at $60
[05:29:49] <gammax-Laptop1> ssi are u british?
[05:29:53] <ssi> hah no
[05:30:03] <gammax-Laptop1> you look british! ll
[05:30:08] <ssi> weird
[05:30:16] <ssi> I'm not british I just have shitty teeth
[05:30:16] <ssi> hahah
[05:30:22] <gammax-Laptop1> hahaha ditto
[05:30:39] <ssi> Valen: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BKM97aHCAAMBFum.jpg:large
[05:30:50] <ssi> I used the skinny kind on the Y, so it tucks up under the table
[05:30:55] <Valen> nice
[05:30:59] <ssi> https://twitter.com/facetiousian/status/334078800226824192/photo/1/large
[05:31:07] <ssi> https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BKGFA46CQAA-7-2.jpg:large
[05:31:09] <zultron> ssi, what's the Z-axis column that motor bracket's attached to?
[05:31:10] <Valen> I'd better go get some screws and bearings
[05:31:16] <ssi> zultron: g0704 column
[05:32:06] <zultron> Ah hah! Very nice.
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[05:34:11] <zultron> Leadscrew inside the column? Very nice.
[05:34:38] <ssi> where else would it go? :D
[05:34:53] <zultron> Don't make fun. I've got a Sieg X2 retrofit.
[05:34:59] <ssi> ohhh
[05:35:17] <ssi> they're what, rack driven on the outside stock?
[05:35:46] <zultron> Originally a rack between the dovetails, but the retrofit mine came with is a ballscrew mounted on the side.
[05:36:07] <ssi> gotcha
[05:36:13] <ssi> hey you have more cnc mill than I do right now
[05:36:56] <zultron> Except that the controller is sitting in my server rack, used for RTAPI testing at the moment. :P
[05:38:32] <ssi> daw
[05:39:02] <zultron> I'm in the middle of taking a break from being in the middle of fixing the LinuxCNC build system to compile rtapi/ulapi modules for all realtime threads flavors with a single ./configure run.
[05:39:34] <ssi> haha
[05:39:35] <zultron> Hit the kernel threads flavors and had to stop for a while.
[05:40:33] <ssi> so I kinda want to gear my Z down even further than X and Y
[05:40:37] <ssi> but the pulleys get espensive
[05:41:05] <ssi> about the smallest pulley I can run on the 3/8" servo shafts is 14 tooth
[05:41:09] <ssi> and I have to bore it out from 1/4"
[05:41:16] <zultron> Buy a CNC 4th axis and stop buying pulleys. ;)
[05:41:34] <ssi> the biggest XL pulleys are 60 tooth for $39 and 72 for $48
[05:41:40] <ssi> zultron: you realize the bootstrapping issue here, yes?
[05:41:49] <ssi> I'm trying to make my one and only cnc mill run
[05:42:10] <ssi> I could try plasma cutting XL pulleys, but I have a suspicion that won't work out in my favor :/
[05:42:11] <zultron> Bah hah, sorry, I guess I wasn't being so clever as I thought.
[05:42:46] <ssi> 72 tooth would give me a 5.14 reduction
[05:43:05] <ssi> which is still 206ipm
[05:43:10] <ssi> at 5300rpm, .2 lead
[05:44:59] <ssi> actually these fat motors might be quite a bit slower
[05:45:05] <ssi> I can't find definitive datasheets :/
[05:45:25] <zultron> Any other tools at your disposal? Your big plastic pulleys might be 3D-printed, then bore the hole for the bushing.
[05:45:42] <ssi> you name it, I have it
[05:45:46] <ssi> except cnc mill :)
[05:45:52] <ssi> I could 3d print them
[05:45:57] <ssi> but I don't think they'll hold up that well
[05:46:00] <ssi> maybe I'm wrong
[05:46:48] <zultron> I bet ABS would do the trick for at least as long as it took to cut your own Al gears.
[05:47:02] <ssi> it's gonna be awhile before I have a working 4th axis
[05:47:32] <zultron> $200 on ebay, you might have it by Friday.
[05:47:42] <ssi> what, 4th?
[05:47:44] <ssi> link?
[05:47:51] <zultron> CNC rotary table
[05:47:58] <ssi> I have a rotary table, but it's manual
[05:48:09] <zultron> That'll work.
[05:48:18] <ssi> one more thing to convert :)
[05:48:46] <zultron> Tell Excel to make the list of stops. How many wheels do you need?
[05:48:54] <ssi> 2 big ones
[05:49:02] <ssi> although I can buy another acetal one for X
[05:49:15] <zultron> Sounds pretty doable!
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[05:49:37] <zultron> You might have to spring for a special mill.
[05:49:47] <ssi> I'll probably just buy another acetal pulley for Z for now, and bore it out to 3/8"
[05:49:50] <ssi> and then see where I'm at
[05:50:00] <zultron> There you go.
[05:50:05] <ssi> I don't know how fast these motors will run yet
[05:50:57] <ssi> https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BKLiYgHCEAAMh6d.jpg:large
[05:51:00] <ssi> :P
[05:51:36] <ssi> I like how it has a spot for "SERIL" number
[05:51:39] <ssi> <3 china
[05:51:54] <zultron> Bah ha!
[05:52:31] <ssi> I'm going to california thursday, so I'm not exactly in a huge hurry to get this stuff all sorted out
[05:52:35] <zultron> Love how it's fixed on the table. I need to do that with the crappy vise that came with my Sieg.
[05:52:48] <ssi> what, clamping blocks?
[05:52:50] <ssi> those are a must have :)
[05:53:42] <ssi> I didn't feel like trying to make a lathe run so I bored the pulley in that fixture
[05:53:56] <ssi> and I turned a bushing down to 5/16" by chucking it in an R8 collet and holding a lathe tool in the mill vise
[05:54:00] <ssi> lazy++
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[05:54:11] <ssi> three lathes and none of them were more convenient than that
[05:54:33] <zultron> Wow!!! I love it!
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[05:56:35] <zultron> See, as long as you're doing that sort of thing, you could use the same fixture, chuck some funky hob into the R8, and go to work cutting that exact pulley.
[05:57:13] <Gammax-new> ssi, http://www.wallacecompany.com/machine_shop/LinuxCNC/Modbus/ does that make sense?
[06:01:44] <zultron> I can hook up my VFD-controlled spindle to LinuxCNC through its modbus interface now?
[06:01:55] <ssi> zultron: that'd be great if I had some funky hob
[06:02:17] <zultron> Another chicken or egg, sounds like.
[06:02:22] <ssi> yep
[06:02:44] <zultron> Does 'you name it' include tool grinders and heat treat ovens?
[06:02:56] <ssi> I have a surface grinder, but no heat treat oven
[06:03:08] <ssi> I do have a kiln, but it's at my other shop and not hooked up, and I have no idea what I'm doing with it
[06:03:30] <zultron> Does the kiln have a PID controller on it?
[06:03:32] <ssi> no
[06:03:34] <ssi> one day :)
[06:03:56] <ssi> Gammax-new: I don't know anything about modbus
[06:04:01] <zultron> Hmm, getting a little too far down that avenue.
[06:04:21] <ssi> zultron: yeah that's too deep to avoid spending $50 on a pulley
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[06:04:55] <zultron> So time's worth money.
[06:05:12] <ssi> duh
[06:05:18] <ssi> plus money's worth money
[06:05:21] <Gammax-new> zultron, know anything about modbus?
[06:05:27] <ssi> and it would cost me money to have the stuff I needed to make a hob so that I could try to make a pulley
[06:05:36] <zultron> I'd spend the $50 too unless I were going into the pulley business.
[06:05:44] <zultron> And maybe I'd spend it anyway.
[06:05:51] <ssi> what I don't want to do is buy an expensive pulley that may or may not be what I need
[06:05:55] <ssi> hence, acetal for now
[06:06:07] <ssi> it'll be the same 3.4 reduction as x/y, which may be too little
[06:06:09] <ssi> but it'll WORK
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[06:07:24] <zultron> Don't know much about modbus, except that running my VFD with that sounds cooler than a +10V/-10V signal, if realtime 'guarantees' (ha ha) are met.
[06:08:56] <zultron> I don't know about servos. Is it not as straight-forward as putting a tach on the spindle and seeing how fast it spins?
[06:09:11] <zultron> Or even reading the spec?
[06:09:34] <ssi> reading the spec would be the easy way
[06:09:36] <ssi> if I had one
[06:09:46] <ssi> could put a tach on the spindle and see how fast it spins
[06:09:48] <ssi> if I had a tach:D
[06:10:15] <zultron> Well a tach is a basic one, and that's $15 or so on ebay. No excuse there. :)
[06:10:20] <ssi> if I was really motivated, I could hook the encoder up to something and measure velocity while running it with different voltages
[06:10:33] <zultron> Oh yeah, you have an encoder.
[06:10:35] * zultron drools
[06:10:36] <ssi> the fact that it's on ebay is an excuse
[06:10:40] <ssi> ie not in my hands
[06:10:42] <ssi> heheh
[06:11:13] <zultron> Hey just order it now instead of gabbing here for the next five minutes.
[06:11:21] <ssi> order what
[06:11:28] <zultron> tach
[06:11:30] <ssi> which tach
[06:11:32] <ssi> mount it how
[06:11:33] <ssi> etc
[06:11:45] <ssi> you're solving problems that don't exist
[06:12:02] <ssi> by creating more problems to solve :)
[06:12:14] <gammax-Laptop1> I still need to find a way to appropriately mount my photo microsensor
[06:13:59] <zultron> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Digital-Laser-Photo-Tachometer-Non-Contact-RPM-Tach-Tachometer-Meter-USA-/281081763506?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4171c756b2
[06:14:41] <zultron> Ok ok, I think that's the signal that it's time for bed.
[06:14:49] <zultron> g'night all!
[06:14:57] <gammax-Laptop1> later man
[06:20:16] <ssi> this machine crap gets expensive in a hurry
[06:34:11] <gammax-Laptop1> ssi, ohhhh yes it does!
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[06:59:25] <DJ9DJ> moin
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[09:22:33] <Loetmichel> mornin'
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[10:56:52] * jthornton wonders how having 3-d models of a couple of structural steel shapes can save a "TON" of time making a model of a plasma table
[10:57:17] <jthornton> it must be terrible software if it takes that long to make a tube shape
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[11:59:25] <skunkworks> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RZGP7zNWq-I
[11:59:27] <Tecan> (RZGP7zNWq-I) "LinuxCNC Touch Probe on Steroids" by "ghislain van de walle" is "Tech" - Length: 0:01:39
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[12:28:58] <jthornton> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uXh7voTKkJ8
[12:28:59] <Tecan> (uXh7voTKkJ8) "Homemade cnc, VIP customer wheel golf cart 3/4" thick CNC aluminium milling episode #2" by "laurent parti" is "Tech" - Length: 0:05:31
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[12:47:00] <vvompy> Hi, I want to install RTAI and experiment with it a bit. Does anyone here know which Distribution would run the easiest install and is there an up-to-date tutorial out there? I found some tutorials, but they are all from 2010 and earlier.
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[12:47:54] <vvompy> and sorry that I am asking in this channel, I didn't find an rtai one so I hoped you guys would know something about it, since I read linuxcnc is somehow working with rtai
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[12:53:58] <jdh> vvompy: easiest would be the linuxcnc livecd install. Has rtai there and working.
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[13:04:23] <vvompy> that sounds quite nice, thanks for that tip
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[13:36:55] <PetefromTn_> .
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[13:46:02] <Gigs-> If you all haven't seen this: http://chain-guide.com/applications/index.html
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[14:26:27] <ssi> HI
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[14:26:56] <jdh> what does ssi mean?
[14:27:34] <ssi> stealth systems, inc
[14:27:39] <ssi> an aborted corporaton
[14:27:40] <ssi> hahah
[14:27:48] <jdh> even more stealthy!
[14:27:54] <ssi> yes
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[14:41:48] <ssi> where's all the chatterboxes this morning! :(
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[14:42:40] <L84Supper> you've been quite
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[14:43:02] <L84Supper> quiet even
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[14:43:17] <PetefromTn> hello fellas..
[14:44:56] <ssi> I know I tend to talk to myself... but it's so much better with a friend
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[14:50:14] <ssi> I made some more progress on the '704 lasterday
[14:50:23] <ssi> z servo mount: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BKM8TVgCMAE_YeB.jpg
[14:50:29] <ssi> today I'll get more pulleys and belts
[14:50:52] <ssi> still need to work out a way to mount the X servo... it's gonna involve two plates with spacers, as much as I don't want it to
[14:51:58] <jdh> plasma cut?
[14:52:03] <ssi> yea
[14:52:14] <jdh> that looks pretty handy
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[14:52:22] <ssi> when all you have is a hammer... :D
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[14:52:42] <jdh> mine is hung off the back
[14:52:56] <ssi> I slung it to the side to minimize the space I need behind the machine
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[14:54:08] <skunkworks> aren't white boards awesome?
[14:54:29] <ssi> heh yes
[14:54:35] <ssi> I want another one to put in the other room by the mill
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[14:55:01] <skunkworks> ssi, cut with linuxcnc? or mach?
[14:55:07] <ssi> linuxcnc!
[14:55:12] <skunkworks> yay!
[14:55:15] <jdh> http://tinyurl.com/cezftjk
[14:55:16] <ssi> mach free!
[14:55:35] <skunkworks> yAY!
[14:55:36] <ssi> jdh: I can't etll what the black parts are
[14:55:42] <jdh> stepper covers
[14:55:44] <ssi> ah
[14:55:55] <jdh> connor made those
[14:56:05] <ssi> yea I remember when he was working on that
[14:56:10] <ssi> I made a model and 3d printed some stepper covers
[14:56:17] <ssi> and encoder mounts
[14:56:30] <jdh> http://tinyurl.com/ck2rthk
[14:56:55] <ssi> I made some hoss-style mount plates like yours, but I can't use them
[14:57:06] <ssi> cause a) they're for nema23, b) I can't direct drive with these servos
[14:57:27] <ssi> and I'm kinda glad I did what I did, cause now I don't have motors hanging off the front OR the back :D
[14:57:34] <ssi> https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BKLi5haCMAIynMD.jpg:large
[14:58:12] <jdh> that looks good
[14:58:21] <skunkworks> ssi, are you using original for now?
[14:58:35] <ssi> skunkworks: original what?
[14:58:37] <jdh> did you take the column off to drill it?
[14:58:40] <ssi> jdh: yea
[14:59:03] <jdh> my bolts did not want to come out
[14:59:03] <ssi> original RECIPE?!
[14:59:08] <skunkworks> heh - lead screws
[14:59:10] <ssi> oh
[14:59:13] <ssi> no it's all ballscrews
[14:59:39] <skunkworks> nice!@
[14:59:55] <jdh> http://tinyurl.com/ck2rthk
[15:00:00] <jdh> my Y sticks way the hell out
[15:00:39] <ssi> that's the stepper cover pic
[15:00:46] <ssi> and yeah, I'm glad to get away from that
[15:00:59] <jdh> http://tinyurl.com/cmcz93j
[15:03:01] <skunkworks> I think I would do ss1's way even if I was using steppers.. Allows for servo upgrade in the future.
[15:03:07] <skunkworks> ssi
[15:03:33] <skunkworks> (with a little extra cost for pullys and belts..)
[15:03:52] <jdh> I'm still planning on moving the Y to the back like that at some point. Have to get a new ballscrew. I could get another 1" or so of travel also
[15:04:27] <jdh> ssi: did you have any problem getting the column bolts out?
[15:04:42] <jdh> I tried an 18" bar and they did not want to pop free.
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[15:09:53] <ssi> jdh: i took it apart 2 years ago, but I don't recall any special effort
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[15:10:22] <PetefromTn__> hello my link keeps joining and quitting for some odd reason.
[15:10:31] <ssi> I might ought to have milled the base some to allow for extra travel while it was apart
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[15:11:14] <ssi> what time does mesa open?
[15:11:18] <ssi> I need to order more goods and services
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[15:16:15] <DJ9DJ> re
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[15:25:03] <PetefromTn> hello
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[15:28:05] <ssi> sweet
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[15:30:30] <generic_nick|2> sweet?
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[15:38:21] <ssi> SWEET
[15:38:27] <ssi> I ordered another 7i77/5i25 kit
[15:38:33] <ssi> and I am gonna try to pick it up in person
[15:41:22] <ReadError_> mesa is in atlanta?
[15:41:55] <ssi> no, they're in berkeley
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[15:42:02] <ssi> I'm flying to sfo thursday
[15:42:05] <ReadError_> ahh
[15:44:15] <ssi> so I had a crazy idea last night
[15:44:39] <ssi> set up a hal thread at like 1 second period
[15:44:53] <ssi> write a component that has a function that runs on that thread, and collects various information about what's running
[15:45:17] <ssi> and pushes notification messages to an off-machine process that can, say, send push notifications to your phone
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[15:45:34] <ssi> then you can get "cycle's done" alerts, or "manual toolchange needed", or "fault"
[15:46:03] <ssi> or "hey dummy you left your servo drives enabled and nothing's been done for ten minutes"
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[15:50:01] <ssi> PetefromTn: stay put! :D
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[15:53:10] <DJ9DJ> re
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[15:55:42] <PetefromTn> tryin'
[15:56:29] <ssi> hehe
[15:56:35] <ssi> so how's your cutting been going?
[15:56:39] <ssi> got any pics of parts you made?
[15:57:41] <PetefromTn> not so far...
[15:58:49] <Nick001-Shop> <ssi> have you done steppers with encoders?
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[16:12:36] <ssi> Nick001-Shop: no, not yet
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[16:16:49] <Nick001-Shop> darn - got a control=1 and don't have a clue where it goes
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[16:19:55] <ssi> I don't know what you mean by that
[16:21:12] <Nick001-Shop> that's to put the stepper into velocity mode
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[16:22:13] <ssi> oh
[16:22:25] <ssi> isn't it control-type?
[16:22:32] <ssi> I had to do that on my plasma chargepump
[16:26:24] <Nick001-Shop> don't know found so far - start with servo setup and enable stepgen and control=1 to put it into velocity mode to be able to use the encoders to correct any missed steps
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[16:28:05] <jdh> does that actually work?
[16:28:39] <jdh> if you missed a step, isn't it likely due to load/stall?
[16:28:58] <pcw_home> Yep works (it will not correct for missed steps, only detect them)
[16:29:21] <pcw_home> And can give high accuracy
[16:29:27] <skunkworks> well - if the missing steps don't cause a stall - it will correct them...
[16:29:34] <pcw_home> Yes
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[16:38:24] <Nick001-Shop> that's what I'm trying to do - just can't find sample files for enough info
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[16:42:39] <Nick001-Shop> be back later
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[16:57:54] <generic_nick|2> http://www.plccenter.co.uk/en-GB/Buy/RAPIDSYN%20DIVISION/23E6003FB
[16:58:11] <generic_nick|2> i have one of these which was used as an mpg in a mill
[16:58:43] <generic_nick|2> wonder how hard it would be to figure out the wiring.
[16:59:10] <generic_nick|2> i found the +and-5v lines
[16:59:23] <generic_nick|2> there are 4 wires left, i assume a and b
[16:59:39] <generic_nick|2> think it would hurt anything if i guessed?
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[17:03:54] <IchGuckLive> hi all B)
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[17:15:26] <IchGuckLive> not mutch posting today !
[17:15:32] <IchGuckLive> O.O
[17:19:44] <IchGuckLive> JT-Shop: ?
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[17:23:40] <Aero-Tec> when threading, using the thread tapper, how does EMC calc this?
[17:23:53] <Aero-Tec> does it go past Z end?
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[17:25:44] <Aero-Tec> also when threading and you start say .01 from the stock end before the thread starts to get things up to speed, how does the start thread tapper work?
[17:27:32] <archivist> "thread tapper" what g code are you looking at
[17:27:54] <Aero-Tec> g76
[17:28:09] <IchGuckLive> spindle encoder is ppr
[17:28:36] <Aero-Tec> one per rev
[17:28:41] <Aero-Tec> index only
[17:28:58] <IchGuckLive> so no tread precission
[17:29:01] <archivist> start well out of the work for index only
[17:29:17] <IchGuckLive> why not at list 100ppr
[17:29:33] <IchGuckLive> yu got only one info per rev thats bad
[17:30:10] <IchGuckLive> so you will overshout the Z at max 1 rev
[17:30:23] <IchGuckLive> = 1 tread pitch
[17:30:24] <archivist> Aero-Tec, it is guessing by interpolation,
[17:30:59] <IchGuckLive> and you need to do a Z on and ov of 1 rev or more
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[17:31:40] <pcw_home> if you have a lot of inertia, good speed control, or shallow cuts, it might be OK
[17:32:28] <pcw_home> but its pretty m^2
[17:34:17] <JT-Shop> yes
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[17:37:40] <IchGuckLive> JT-Shop: it must be terrible software if it takes that long to make a tube shape
[17:37:46] <IchGuckLive> did you see my plasma CAd
[17:38:32] <IchGuckLive> in ProE i did only 2 Squares and all other is parametric assambly on the table as long and Width height can be freed
[17:38:54] <IchGuckLive> acording 2 -> jthornton wonders how having 3-d models of a couple of structural steel shapes can save a "TON" of time making a model of a plasma table
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[17:40:02] <IchGuckLive> i teatch my students on how to make a Hole Mashinesidewalk with one part and 4 klicks
[17:40:39] <IchGuckLive> if a Female student is present she need to deside hight and wide of the finish part ! B)
[17:41:34] <JT-Shop> that was in reference to the mailing list
[17:43:41] <IchGuckLive> found it in the irc log
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[17:48:50] <Aero-Tec> 8 inch chuck and 2 HP motor
[17:48:59] <Aero-Tec> not a small lathe
[17:49:10] <Aero-Tec> sorry got phone call
[17:49:34] <Aero-Tec> doing max so far 1 inch thread
[17:50:19] <Aero-Tec> I have the abilaty to add 3 more ppr
[17:50:31] <Aero-Tec> so 4 plus a index
[17:51:21] <Aero-Tec> the index would be the same as one of the pulses
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[17:52:21] <Aero-Tec> also one would be larger then the others, it would be the index one
[17:52:36] <Aero-Tec> I could make a new encoder ring
[17:53:16] <Aero-Tec> possibly do 10 ppr
[17:53:29] <Aero-Tec> with a index
[17:54:05] <archivist> I have 48 plus index on my little lathe
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[17:55:02] <Aero-Tec> I am using the Pport, not sure if fast enough for lots of ppr
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[17:57:58] <Aero-Tec> any help on setting up a new encoder would be great
[17:58:55] <Aero-Tec> I can make it, but not sure how fast the port and comp will work
[18:02:27] <Aero-Tec> the encoder i have on it now has 4 slots, one is abour 1.5 longer then the other 3
[18:02:36] <Aero-Tec> it was setup for mach
[18:03:35] <Aero-Tec> but mach did not finish the longer encoder slot upgrade and so I had to cover up all but one slot
[18:04:42] <Aero-Tec> to do 4 + index I would need to add a hole and a new opto for index
[18:05:15] <pcw_home> 4 PPR should be a lot better than 1
[18:06:16] <pcw_home> only 1/4 as much time to get into trouble
[18:06:25] <Aero-Tec> lol
[18:06:35] <Aero-Tec> I could make a new disk
[18:06:59] <Aero-Tec> but not sure how many ppr I can go
[18:07:28] <Aero-Tec> if Pport and box is fast enough I could go lots more
[18:07:56] <FinboySlick> You guys seen this? It's pretty cute. http://vimeo.com/44251003
[18:08:01] <Aero-Tec> just do not want pulse to get to short for box to see
[18:08:10] <FinboySlick> And you can't go wrong with the man in black.
[18:08:31] <pcw_home> Max PPR depends on your base thread rate and spindle RPM
[18:08:33] <pcw_home> (and slot width if you are not doing square waves/quadrature)
[18:09:33] <Aero-Tec> not there yet but hope to be soon
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[18:12:23] <Aero-Tec> base period 25000
[18:12:35] <Aero-Tec> max rpm 1300
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[18:15:38] <Aero-Tec> encoder dia is 3.75 inch
[18:16:16] <Aero-Tec> any recomendations for a new encoder?
[18:17:06] <ssi> Aero-Tec: this is on a lathe?
[18:17:13] <Aero-Tec> yes
[18:17:17] <ssi> I made mine
[18:17:22] <ssi> http://sphotos-c.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-frc1/205204_655375525742_5631970_n.jpg
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[18:17:48] <ssi> I think it's 32ppr
[18:18:58] <Aero-Tec> looks good
[18:19:11] <Aero-Tec> you using a Pport?
[18:19:30] <pcw_home> 60/1300/25e-6 = 1800 CPR so maybe 500 CPR max = 125 slots
[18:19:30] <Aero-Tec> not sure what seep they will work at
[18:19:45] <ssi> no, 7i43
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[18:21:36] <Aero-Tec> will a pport work at that speed?
[18:23:12] <Aero-Tec> will also have to rewrite my startup files
[18:23:59] <Aero-Tec> add a index input
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[18:32:03] <Aero-Tec> I started on a very thin shoe string, so I had to cheap out as much as possible
[18:32:20] <Aero-Tec> had to build up stock and tooling
[18:32:50] <Aero-Tec> now I have some $$ to upgrade the machines
[18:33:12] <Aero-Tec> just need to order things and have some time to do the work
[18:33:44] <Aero-Tec> problem is machine upgrades mean machine down time
[18:34:25] <Aero-Tec> need to get ahead of things a tad more for that to happen
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[18:36:44] <GammaX-Shop> heyyyyy everybody!
[18:37:00] <ssi> heyyyyy
[18:37:47] <Aero-Tec> anyone know about pports and how fast they are?
[18:38:14] <Aero-Tec> I know the standared is a tad sloppy and changed over time
[18:38:41] <Aero-Tec> would hate to make a encoder and have it not work
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[18:39:37] <Aero-Tec> was wondering if someone had first hand know how of it
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[18:45:02] <skunkworks> Aero-Tec, depends mostly on computer latency...
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[18:50:30] <generic_nick|2> any idea why a keyboard/mouse would start acting up when linuxcnc is powered on?
[18:51:39] <GammaX-Shop> generic_nick|2: wireless or hard wired?
[18:52:06] <generic_nick|2> i tried 2 identical keyboards, keeps doing it. the keyboard has a built in mouse thing. when i turn linuxcnc, the lights on the keyboard (for cap lock, etc) flash, and the curser acts all weird.
[18:52:09] <generic_nick|2> wired
[18:52:34] <generic_nick|2> it only seems to do it with a usb extension cable. but it didnt do this before, it's a new problem
[18:52:52] <generic_nick|2> i tried different extension cables, it isnt the cable
[18:52:53] <GammaX-Shop> how long of an extension?
[18:53:00] <GammaX-Shop> what about without the extension?
[18:53:10] <generic_nick|2> works ok without it
[18:53:24] <generic_nick|2> 6 feet or so
[18:53:35] <GammaX-Shop> you usb hub might not be outputting a good amount of voltage and/or amps
[18:53:41] <generic_nick|2> no hub
[18:53:47] <GammaX-Shop> the hub on your motherboard
[18:53:56] <generic_nick|2> it's the only usb device i use
[18:54:05] <GammaX-Shop> I understand
[18:54:09] <generic_nick|2> ah
[18:54:10] <GammaX-Shop> have u tried diff usb ports?
[18:54:15] <generic_nick|2> it's a new problem
[18:54:16] <generic_nick|2> yes
[18:54:22] <generic_nick|2> doesnt change
[18:54:24] <GammaX-Shop> front and back?
[18:54:34] <GammaX-Shop> or every usb port?
[18:54:43] <generic_nick|2> there's only 4, i tried all
[18:54:44] <GammaX-Shop> U might only have 1 "hub" on hte motherboard...
[18:54:50] <generic_nick|2> it' an atom board
[18:54:56] <generic_nick|2> d510mo
[18:55:28] <GammaX-Shop> you can try to do a bios update.... you can try a diff keyboard
[18:55:33] <ReadError_> so finding 8" hook and loop straps is like impossible
[18:55:42] <ReadError_> atleast on amazon, unless i want 100
[18:55:45] <GammaX-Shop> read 8" wide?
[18:55:50] <ReadError_> long
[18:56:02] <generic_nick|2> GammaX: it's a new problem, something is wrong
[18:56:02] <ReadError_> like the kind with the little plastic loop
[18:56:05] <GammaX-Shop> Im fairly certain they have 25 and 50
[18:56:09] <generic_nick|2> it worked fine for years before that
[18:56:18] <generic_nick|2> i tried 2 keyboards, same thing
[18:56:46] <GammaX-Shop> http://www.amazon.com/Velcro-Industrial-Strength-Sticky-Back-Fasteners/dp/B00006RSP1/ref=sr_1_7?ie=UTF8&qid=1368557779&sr=8-7&keywords=velcro
[18:56:58] <GammaX-Shop> http://www.amazon.com/Velcro-Sticky-Back-Fastener-Dispenser-VEK90081/dp/B00006RSWT/ref=sr_1_8?ie=UTF8&qid=1368557779&sr=8-8&keywords=velcro
[18:57:11] <Connor> generic_nick|2: Your keyboard isn't working ?
[18:57:14] <ReadError_> http://www.frys.com/product/3358942?site=sr:SEARCH:MAIN_RSLT_PG
[18:57:18] <GammaX-Shop> http://www.amazon.com/Velcro-2-Inch-10-Feet-Industrial-Strength/dp/B00114LOMM/ref=sr_1_14?ie=UTF8&qid=1368557779&sr=8-14&keywords=velcro
[18:57:19] <ReadError_> like that
[18:57:21] <Aero-Tec> skunkworks the base period is 25000 if that helps any
[18:57:22] <ReadError_> with the loop
[18:57:35] <generic_nick|2> Connor: it's working, but it's acting up when linuxcnc is powered on
[18:57:44] <GammaX-Shop> ohh
[18:57:49] <GammaX-Shop> make your own
[18:57:52] <Connor> How is it acting up ?
[18:58:06] <GammaX-Shop> or just buy from frys..
[18:58:14] <ReadError_> yea frys screwed me over already
[18:58:17] <Connor> are you sourcing anything with 5v from the Computer or USB ports ?
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[18:58:25] <ReadError_> said "ohai we have them in stock, ships same day"
[18:58:30] <GammaX-Shop> Connor: I dont think its getting enough power. that or the extensions are messing with is signal quality.
[18:58:34] <generic_nick|2> lights flash, it stops responding, curser keeps going to the upper left corner of the screen.
[18:58:36] <ReadError_> order, 2 days later "uhmm yea, about that, we dont have them in stock..."
[18:58:48] <GammaX-Shop> make your own
[18:58:52] <generic_nick|2> Connor: yes, i run something of the 5v.
[18:59:00] <generic_nick|2> but it has worked for years
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[18:59:11] <Connor> PSU's can get weak.
[18:59:14] <Connor> anything change?
[18:59:33] <generic_nick|2> not since the last it worked.
[18:59:39] <ReadError_> GammaX, then i have to sew
[18:59:42] <GammaX-Shop> generic_nick|2: I have a feeling your hub is having issues, might be worth a try to get a pcie or pci usb port card
[18:59:49] <GammaX-Shop> ReadError_: sew.. maching... no diff
[18:59:50] <skunkworks> Aero-Tec, you should be able to count reliably at 20khz... If you quadature is perfect - you can aproch 40khz
[19:00:03] <generic_nick|2> GammaX: not an option on my mobo
[19:00:22] <generic_nick|2> only 1 pci slot and it's used for a mesa card
[19:00:36] <Aero-Tec> skunkworks thanks for the info
[19:00:41] <Connor> Do you have the other USB headers hooked up? Atom boards have a header for additional 2 usb's
[19:00:51] <generic_nick|2> no
[19:00:51] <GammaX-Shop> they do sell powered usb extensions but Idk if thats the exact problem...
[19:01:14] <GammaX-Shop> so to spend the money just to TRY and fix it.... I dont like doing that
[19:01:30] <Aero-Tec> will need to rewrite my startup files for the new encoder system
[19:01:41] <Connor> You might try running the 5v off a external PSU to see if that fixes the issue... instead of sourcing it off the CPU 5v
[19:02:04] <generic_nick|2> Connor: i changed the power supply for the servos to run on 220v to get them off the same circuit as the computer, and it helped
[19:02:14] <generic_nick|2> Connor: already tried that
[19:02:19] <GammaX-Shop> generic_nick|2: do you have an accurate meter that can tell you have many miliamps are going to the keyboard?
[19:02:31] <Connor> Hmm.. Sounds like EMF or noise then..
[19:02:36] <generic_nick|2> i doubt it's accurate
[19:02:48] <GammaX-Shop> also for anyone interested in knowing.... a atx power supply CAN and does quite well.. supply 24v out of the box.
[19:02:56] <generic_nick|2> Connor: hmm maybe, huh?
[19:03:07] <Connor> electrical noise...
[19:03:14] <generic_nick|2> yea
[19:03:15] <Connor> EMF.. same thing...
[19:03:22] <GammaX-Shop> generic_nick|2: well if you can open the keyboard you can take readings while its plugged in directly and then while its plugged in from extension
[19:03:33] <Connor> You have it on a USB extension ?
[19:03:38] <generic_nick|2> yes
[19:03:44] <Connor> if, so, remove that for a test.. and see if the problem goes away
[19:03:45] <GammaX-Shop> Connor: its only 6 footer
[19:03:54] <generic_nick|2> Connor: it does
[19:04:05] <generic_nick|2> i tried 2 extensions
[19:04:10] <generic_nick|2> didnt fix it
[19:04:32] <Connor> Stupid question... any AC lights, radios, chargers transformers etc etc near the USB extension.. or AC lines running PARALLEL to it ?
[19:05:04] <Connor> could be a bad transformer..
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[19:05:15] <generic_nick|2> it runs across some cables, but it always has
[19:05:29] <Aero-Tec> did you move the keyboard to a new location?
[19:05:31] <generic_nick|2> bad transformer as in the psu?
[19:05:33] <generic_nick|2> no
[19:05:44] <ReadError_> get a wireless keyboard/mouse
[19:05:47] <ReadError_> they are great
[19:05:50] <generic_nick|2> no
[19:05:51] <Connor> doesn't matter.. something could have changed in a transformer.. or something.. PSU could have also blown a filter cap or snubber..
[19:05:59] <generic_nick|2> i like my keyboard
[19:06:03] <GammaX-Shop> i dont like wireless for anything on cnc...
[19:06:09] <ReadError_> whys that
[19:06:17] <ReadError_> my display faces the opposite way
[19:06:20] <ReadError_> and my router is pretty big
[19:06:25] <ReadError_> so its the only good solution
[19:06:31] <generic_nick|2> because cnc is realtime and wireless isnt, i would asume
[19:06:40] <ReadError_> uh?
[19:06:44] <Connor> same reason he want's this fixed.. RF noise and latency
[19:06:53] <GammaX-Shop> 1, extra RF. 2, you could be doing something like jogging and the power goes out of your somehow out of range it and continues on.... Not safe IMHO
[19:06:58] <ReadError_> usb is realtime?
[19:07:56] <generic_nick|2> Connor: i was getting ferrors out of the blue at about the same time. when i changed the servo power supply to run on 220v instead of 110v, it got better
[19:08:29] <Connor> anyway generic_nick|2 I would eliminate your CPU's PSU.. and check any other PSU's and wall warts you have.. something is producing major EMF
[19:08:55] <generic_nick|2> thanks Connor. no other transformers around there \
[19:09:00] <Connor> eliminate as in temporarily replace with another one to make sure it's not a iissue
[19:09:08] <generic_nick|2> there is one for the monitor i suppose, but thats it
[19:09:17] <generic_nick|2> it's like a laptop oone
[19:09:25] <Connor> that could do it.. Flat screen? yea..
[19:09:53] <generic_nick|2> yes
[19:09:58] <generic_nick|2> hmm
[19:10:14] <generic_nick|2> the usb extension is running near there too
[19:10:28] <Connor> try moving it out of the way, or plugging it up across the room with extension cord into another outlet.
[19:11:01] <Connor> those things can take a power surge.. still work.. but blow filter caps and be a HUGE source of EMF
[19:11:30] <generic_nick|2> it probably got wet when i was cleaning my shop
[19:11:36] <generic_nick|2> you could be right
[19:11:46] <Connor> that could do it too. :)
[19:12:37] <generic_nick|2> ill check it out, thanks a lot Connor
[19:12:48] <Connor> hehe.. I had a Surge Protector plugged up.. and it had those surge protectors for the Dish/Cable TV...
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[19:13:54] <Connor> the socket it was plugged into.. ended up getting the hot mains shorting to the metal box box it was in.. (older house).. it started sending 120v 60hz through the satellite dish.. I had a old
[19:14:13] <Connor> 17" CRT that started getting strange noise on it.. like 60hz noise..
[19:14:27] <Connor> and my satellite dish stopped working...
[19:14:36] <generic_nick|2> ha, weird
[19:14:59] <Connor> I went to work. and when I came home.. I noticed this little bit of smoke coming from the grounding block of the dish right at my roof..
[19:15:15] <Connor> I went to check it out and touched the ground wire got a shock..
[19:15:44] <Connor> tested it and got 120v...!!! damn think had spent all night and half the day arcing and started a small fire!!
[19:16:18] <Connor> THAT was scary..
[19:16:42] <generic_nick|2> lol damn!
[19:17:02] <Connor> oh after I removed the power.. my CRT went back to normal..
[19:17:34] <Connor> let me know if that fixes you KB issue..
[19:18:38] <generic_nick|2> will do man. working on making a new control pannel, so when i do that, ill move everything
[19:18:42] <generic_nick|2> thanks again
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[19:33:07] <skroon> hi all
[19:33:30] <skroon> is there a desktop tool that I can have it load my gcode and simulate the paths the cnc will do?
[19:33:56] <cradek> linuxcnc does that - it shows you the path
[19:34:14] <cradek> you can run it in sim mode, with no hardware, on a standard OS install.
[19:34:43] <Connor> standard Linux OS install. :)
[19:35:12] <Connor> probably under a vm linux install too..
[19:35:37] <skroon> Connor: ow that's great
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[19:36:18] <skroon> Connor: I did search for linuxcnc / emc / emc2 on ubuntu 12.04 didn't show up, so I thought perhaps you need special linux installation for it to run
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[19:36:58] <cradek> the buildbot packages sim for ubuntu 12.04
[19:37:07] <Connor> You can download the SIM straight from builddot
[19:37:12] <Connor> err. buildbot
[19:37:42] <skroon> ok that's new to me, i'll look into what buildbot is,thanks
[19:37:54] <cradek> see buildbot.linuxcnc.org
[19:38:08] <skroon> thanks
[19:38:33] <cradek> you probably want 2.5 branch
[19:40:23] <skroon> great, i'm installing already :-)
[19:40:30] <skroon> yeah installing 2.5 indeed
[19:41:41] <skroon> up and running, that was fast! great job linuxcnc :)
[19:42:34] <skroon> now just need to pick a random machine configuration? or really try to get as close to the real deal?
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[20:32:39] <skroon> cradek: you know which configuration I should choose during simulation?
[20:32:50] <skroon> i'm able to load some gcodes, but i'm not able to hit the "play" button
[20:33:01] <skroon> or perhaps, that's never possible in simulation mode?
[20:33:06] <cradek> sim/axis
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[20:33:22] <cradek> elaborate on "not able to hit"
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[20:34:24] <cradek> you should be able to run your code, if your simulated machine is enough like your real machine
[20:34:46] <cradek> bbl
[20:35:00] <Connor> Click the X, then the power button, Clcik Home All.. then you should be able to run the file
[20:35:02] <andypugh> All the sims need to be turned on and homed.
[20:35:42] <skroon> cradek: it's grayed out
[20:35:44] <andypugh> Also, many need to be jogged off the top limit and touched-off before any G-code will fit inside the envelope. I think this is a pity.
[20:36:05] <skroon> ahh ok let me try that right away
[20:36:48] <skroon> ah indeed, I needed thit the X , and home it :)
[20:38:51] <skroon> cool! thanks
[20:38:59] <skroon> it's awesome learning a bit more about gcodes this way :-)
[20:41:21] <Aero-Tec> right now I have my setup files set for one index per rev, and it is working
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[20:42:01] <Aero-Tec> what do I need to change to add one phase and index
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[20:42:46] <Aero-Tec> I will upgread to a full quadature later
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[20:44:01] <skroon> what is like the cheapest, linuxcnc compatible machine?
[20:44:07] <DJ9DJ> gn8
[20:44:20] <ssi> off lease dell optiplex 755 is what I buy
[20:44:23] <ssi> they're $150
[20:44:27] <Connor> to run a cnc? Probably a Atom based machine
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[20:44:42] <frallzor> atom is my vote too
[20:44:43] <PCW> you need a sensor, a free input pin and you need to wire the input pin to the encoder counter 'A' pin
[20:44:53] <skroon> sorry, I mean the CNC it self
[20:45:16] <ssi> there's no reas answer to that :P
[20:45:16] <Aero-Tec> here is the hal file http://pastebin.com/fdTFeREu
[20:45:25] <frallzor> any machine
[20:45:28] <ssi> cheapest one is one you cobble together out of crap you have lying around
[20:45:30] <skroon> about the computer though, it needs to have a parallel port right? are there still machines manufactured with a parallel port ? :)
[20:45:34] <Aero-Tec> do I need to post the INI file as well?
[20:46:13] <Connor> skroon: Intel Atom with standard VGA port.. and buy a PCI Parport card.
[20:46:31] <PCW> Yep there are new motherboards with parallel ports (and PCI/PCIE add-on cards)
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[20:46:52] <PCW> many atom MBs have PPs
[20:46:56] <PCW> bbl
[20:47:00] <frallzor> most even
[20:47:03] <skroon> I heard there are even people running it off a raspberry pi, or what that be more of a hack then something really supported?
[20:47:09] <Connor> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Intel-D525MW-Mini-ITX-Motherboard-w-Atom-525-CPU-/200542103383?pt=Motherboards&hash=item2eb13da757
[20:47:25] <Connor> + parport PCI + Memory + SSD HD and a small PSU
[20:47:38] <Connor> skroon: I wouldn't do that right now..
[20:47:43] <Connor> way to early
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[20:47:47] <ssi> Connor: doesn't that board you linked have a parport?
[20:47:49] <ssi> looks like it does
[20:47:58] <skroon> cool, I think I have an stom somewhere :-)
[20:48:10] <skroon> btw, I currently have an iModela CNC, which is USB though
[20:48:14] <Connor> It does. But, I always prefer to use a addon for a extra $12.00 for the added protection..
[20:48:30] <ssi> Connor: what do you use for breakout?
[20:48:32] <skroon> i'm able to send "gcodes" directly to the driver
[20:48:38] <Connor> Currently a C10
[20:48:41] <frallzor> iModela... controllerwise I say youre f*ked then
[20:48:51] <skroon> frallzor: why? :)
[20:48:53] <frallzor> better off just using the supplied software
[20:49:09] <Connor> I think he's planning on converting it..
[20:49:09] <skroon> frallzor: you mean iModela Controller software it self?
[20:49:30] <frallzor> yeah, why bother with emc for that =)
[20:49:37] <frallzor> seems to work as supposed
[20:49:45] <skroon> frallzor: right, so just feed it the gcode files directly right?
[20:49:57] <skroon> have you ever worked with an iModela as well?
[20:50:10] <frallzor> I assumed it just handles stl-files in the software
[20:50:46] <skroon> yeah thats euhmm Player software that comes with it indeed... I however currently want to use it purely for making pcb circuits
[20:50:57] <frallzor> ahh that would be nice
[20:52:40] <frallzor> cool, seems one can send g-code to it
[20:52:52] <skroon> basically what I tried was this:
[20:53:42] <skroon> cat test.ngc >/dev/usb/lp0
[20:53:54] <skroon> with some really simple gcode inside test.ngc
[20:53:57] <skroon> and that worked
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[21:02:18] <ssi> so my thc is workng, sort of
[21:02:40] <ssi> it tracks the voltage well, but every move, it's like axis is losing account of the steps the thc moves the Z axis
[21:02:45] <ssi> so the home position gets lower and lower
[21:02:57] <ssi> and eventually it's trying to probe from so low that the switch is closed before the move
[21:03:02] <ssi> and the program faults
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[21:04:25] <skroon> frallzor: but even if I would be able to send g-code to it like that, I won't be able to control it with emc right?
[21:05:01] <frallzor> I bet Roland use a special usb-protocol
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[21:11:46] <Aero-Tec> got the lathe apart, making new encoder for it
[21:12:05] <Aero-Tec> can anyone here help with hal file?
[21:12:19] <Aero-Tec> also do I need to edit the INI file as well?
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[21:24:04] <PetefromTn_>
[21:24:36] <andypugh> Aero-Tec: That all depends on what you are trying to do :-)
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[21:33:38] <Aero-Tec> I have it setup for one index per rev, that has worked fine for feed per rev and other things I needed like RPM reading
[21:34:28] <Aero-Tec> but now I need to redo it for A channel of encoder, 20 ppr and a index input
[21:34:37] <andypugh> You may only need to change the encoder counter scaling to suit the new pulse count.
[21:35:10] <andypugh> (and re-wire HAL to split the A and Z phases)
[21:35:13] <Aero-Tec> need to rewire the ecoder and hook up the pport to the new input
[21:35:48] <Aero-Tec> does that nean I need to redo the INI file as well?
[21:36:05] <Aero-Tec> I knew hal needed work
[21:38:58] <GammaX-Shop> its amazing the places you can pick up free cnc stuff
[21:39:06] <GammaX-Shop> motors encoders... gears etc.
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[21:41:07] <Aero-Tec> care to share?
[21:41:51] <Aero-Tec> I would think it would depend on where you live
[21:44:19] <GammaX-Shop> anyone know link to instructions on getting ps3 controller to work with linuxcnc?
[21:45:04] <andypugh> GammaX: Search the Wiki for SimpleRemotePendant
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[21:45:18] <GammaX-Shop> thanks
[21:45:37] <andypugh> Aero-Tec: You may need to change the INI if the encoder scale is stored in the INI
[21:48:17] <PetefromTn_>
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[21:53:29] <ssi> anyone have any thoughts on my thc goofyness?
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[21:56:17] <Aero-Tec> can not see it in the INI, but not sure what I am looking for so could be wrong
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[21:57:28] <Aero-Tec> this is in the hal file
[21:57:30] <Aero-Tec> setp encoder.0.position-scale 1.000000
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[21:59:04] <GammaX-Shop> I followed the directions for usb joypad and it just crashes the program on start... any thoughts?
[21:59:05] <PetefromTn>
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[22:02:11] <skunkworks> GammaX-Shop: need a bit more info.... If it crashed - it should tell you why.
[22:02:17] <GammaX-Shop> yes
[22:02:54] <GammaX-Shop> im tyring to sort through the info on wha tto give you...
[22:03:38] <GammaX-Shop> bunch of modules such as hal_lib does not exist in /proc/modules.
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[22:04:26] <GammaX-Shop> same for rtapi, rtai_math, rtai_sem,rtai_fifos
[22:05:05] <GammaX-Shop> error inserting rtai_hal.ko -1 file exists
[22:08:57] <GammaX-Shop> skunkworks: any thoughts good sir?
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[22:16:20] <JT-Shop> which instructions are you following
[22:17:02] <GammaX-Shop> JT-Shop: http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Simple_Remote_Pendant
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[22:18:41] <Aero-Tec> JT-Shop: can you look at this hal file?
[22:18:44] <Aero-Tec> here is the hal file http://pastebin.com/fdTFeREu
[22:19:12] <Aero-Tec> want to change so A channel has 20 ppr
[22:19:21] <Aero-Tec> and a index
[22:19:40] <Aero-Tec> right now it is 1 index only
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[22:20:18] <ssi> JT-Shop: you see my thc problem in the backscroll?
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[22:39:32] <r00t4rd3d> GammaX-Shop, http://qjoypad.sourceforge.net/
[22:39:41] <r00t4rd3d> no need to screw with hal for a joystick
[22:40:49] <GammaX-Shop> nice!
[22:41:13] <GammaX-Shop> thanks
[22:42:19] <r00t4rd3d> i use that with a usb classic Nintendo controller
[22:43:54] <GammaX-Shop> lol
[22:43:57] <GammaX-Shop> awsome
[22:44:02] <GammaX-Shop> I got one of them for the roms
[22:44:17] <r00t4rd3d> thats what i do while i wait for cuts
[22:44:38] <r00t4rd3d> super mario bros or donkey kong
[22:45:57] <GammaX-Shop> yup!
[22:46:08] <GammaX-Shop> i got an n64 converter aswell for ocarina of time
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[22:47:21] <andypugh> Nooooo! Keyboard emulation is a _horrible_ way to run a pendant.
[22:47:39] <r00t4rd3d> never had an issue with it andy
[22:47:51] <L84Supper> http://chicago.craigslist.org/wcl/tls/3783131731.html says it's a #143352 by Northern Tool, http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_7171_7171?isSearch=143352 but the chuck must be out
[22:48:04] <andypugh> I didn't say it won't work, but it's still horrible.
[22:48:33] <r00t4rd3d> if it works without issue, hard to say think its horrible.
[22:49:02] <r00t4rd3d> how is doing it through hal any safer?
[22:50:17] <andypugh> Because HAL is realtime, and guaranteed to be serviced. If your GUI freezes then the keyboard emulation will too, and may stick,
[22:50:45] <r00t4rd3d> and that cant happen with hal?
[22:50:47] <andypugh> (Also, no analogue jogging via keyboard emulation).
[22:51:35] <andypugh> r00t4rd3d: It shouldn't happen with HAL Though as hal_input is a userspace component, there are ways that it probably could.
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[22:52:14] <andypugh> ref recent reports of a completely frozen machine sucessfully finishing the machining if the part.
[22:53:42] <r00t4rd3d> how is my usb keyboard safe then to jog ?
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[22:54:02] <r00t4rd3d> that isnt a hal component
[22:55:00] <r00t4rd3d> if i was holding down the arrow key and my gui froze, wouldnt i be in the same boat?
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[22:59:01] <generic_nick|2> got my new control pannel wired and the bracket built. just gotta wire it to my mesa cards now!
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[22:59:17] <generic_nick|2> hopefully the weird mpg works.
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[23:00:08] <JT-Shop> must be solar flares today, I keep loosing my connection
[23:00:22] <generic_nick|2> ill have some configuring to do, with the touch screen ill have more pyvcp buttons
[23:00:26] <JT-Shop> dang sure ain't clouds or rain
[23:00:30] <andypugh> r00t4rd3d: Yes, quite. Keyboard emulation is just as bad as keyboard.
[23:00:51] <generic_nick|2> i'm not saying it's aliens JT-Shop, but it's aliens.
[23:01:45] <generic_nick|2> could be Obama hacking your system too.
[23:02:20] <r00t4rd3d> its the top quality service provider, earning your 100 bucks a month
[23:03:01] <andypugh> Right, time I went to snooze.
[23:03:04] <generic_nick|2> interweb is espensive.
[23:03:13] <generic_nick|2> adios andypugh
[23:03:14] -!- andypugh has quit [Quit: andypugh]
[23:04:34] <GammaX-Shop> well if keyboard emu is out... I need to figure this hal one out!
[23:05:09] -!- JT-Shop has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds]
[23:05:17] <r00t4rd3d> its just as risky as using a usb keyboard to jog
[23:05:55] -!- adb has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
[23:05:55] -!- JT-Shop [JT-Shop!~John@] has joined #linuxcnc
[23:06:00] <r00t4rd3d> ive jogged my machine with qjoypad hundreds of times
[23:06:20] <JT-Shop> what is a qjoypad?
[23:06:38] <r00t4rd3d> maps joystick buttons and movement to keystrokes
[23:06:47] <JT-Shop> ah
[23:07:15] -!- jthornton_ [jthornton_!~john@] has joined #linuxcnc
[23:07:38] <GammaX-Shop> JT-Shop: any thoughts on my problem?
[23:07:38] <JT-Shop> ssi no, I've been out
[23:08:11] <JT-Shop> are you trying to use a ps2 joypad not a PC joypad?
[23:09:06] * JT-Shop listens to Iron Man
[23:10:05] <GammaX-Shop> yes. its a ps3 controller with usb reciever
[23:10:05] <GammaX-Shop> logitech type
[23:11:02] <JT-Shop> dunno if they work or not...
[23:11:53] <JT-Shop> my experiance is only with a PC joypad just like the one in the wiki page
[23:12:35] <Jymmm> thats what she said
[23:12:47] <JT-Shop> hi jymmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
[23:12:59] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: how goes?
[23:13:46] <JT-Shop> busy, playing sometimes work gets in the way
[23:14:02] <JT-Shop> how about you?
[23:14:13] <GammaX-Shop> JT-Shop: well its still giving me those errors as stated above
[23:14:33] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: Trying to stay out of trouble, sorta succeeding
[23:17:06] <JT-Shop> Jymmm: http://imagebin.org/257687 just finished these
[23:17:39] <JT-Shop> GammaX: did you verify that the ps2 joypad even works with a PC as shown in the start of the instructions?
[23:18:02] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: Nice, you'll have to hit the sex toy conference in Vegas now =)
[23:18:49] <JT-Shop> going to the Sypders Owners Event in Maggie Vally
[23:19:04] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: maggie valley?
[23:19:12] <JT-Shop> NC
[23:19:16] <Jymmm> ah cool
[23:19:32] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: get ready to sweat you balls off!!!
[23:20:01] <JT-Shop> just purchased a trailer for the spyder in NC so I have to make a dash to pick it up next week
[23:20:14] <jdh> what's a spyder?
[23:20:17] <JT-Shop> at least I can get free lodging at my sisters
[23:20:19] <GammaX-Shop> JT-Shop: yes
[23:20:27] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: a trailer to tow behind the tric?
[23:20:48] <JT-Shop> yea, but it is a Spyder
[23:21:06] <Jymmm> three wheels right?
[23:21:09] <r00t4rd3d> jdh, old mans tricycle :)
[23:21:15] <JT-Shop> http://www.spyder.brp.com/home?__utma=1.1755468562.1365720590.1366119610.1368573642.4&__utmb=|utmccn=(referral)|utmcmd=referral|utmcct=/forums/showthread.php&__utmv=-&__utmk=33707553
[23:21:22] <JT-Shop> wow what a link
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[23:21:45] <jdh> a backwards tricycle?
[23:21:50] <JT-Shop> well no, a trike only has one front wheel and a spyder makes you a rock star LOL
[23:21:58] <Jymmm> tric
[23:22:14] <Jymmm> trike
[23:22:26] <JT-Shop> went to SpyderFest a few weeks ago and over 1200 Spyders showed up
[23:22:38] <Jymmm> BIG can of RAID!!!!
[23:22:47] <Tom_itx> how many home built?
[23:23:03] <JT-Shop> none
[23:23:10] <jdh> maggie valley is barely in .nc, should be pretty cool to cold there now.
[23:23:17] <Tom_itx> are you building one?
[23:23:27] <JT-Shop> the event is in the middle of June
[23:23:41] <JT-Shop> Tom_itx: no, I gave up and sold that stuff
[23:23:46] <Tom_itx> oh
[23:23:50] <JT-Shop> no time or space to do it right
[23:23:51] <Tom_itx> can am the one to get?
[23:24:12] <JT-Shop> well... I thought so, for me
[23:24:41] <JT-Shop> it is a different community than Narleys
[23:24:42] <Tom_itx> mid june.. you're gonna miss the fest
[23:24:57] <JT-Shop> crap
[23:25:16] <JT-Shop> it is june 13, 14 and the Lamonster BBQ is the 15th
[23:25:25] <Tom_itx> 17-23 iirc
[23:25:40] <JT-Shop> that's the next week
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[23:26:04] <JT-Shop> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y3H8B_aW3ZQ
[23:26:04] <Tecan> (Y3H8B_aW3ZQ) "Jerry Clower The Coon Huntin' Monkey" by "Tora Kuma" is "Comedy" - Length: 0:02:55
[23:26:12] <GammaX-Shop> JT-Shop: when performing first test I get execv(hal_hoystick): no such file or directory
[23:26:18] <JT-Shop> might still make it
[23:26:32] <JT-Shop> that don't sound good
[23:27:22] <GammaX-Shop> I might know the issue
[23:27:32] <JT-Shop> GammaX: did you add each item one at a time?
[23:27:37] <JT-Shop> YEA!
[23:27:56] <GammaX-Shop> i might need to change js0 to something else.
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[23:28:15] <JT-Shop> js0?
[23:28:23] <r00t4rd3d> did you find out what was binding up your axis ?
[23:28:46] <r00t4rd3d> too much cheese?
[23:29:09] <JT-Shop> so what did the coon hunting monkey do?
[23:29:32] <r00t4rd3d> got arrested for hate crimes
[23:29:46] <JT-Shop> different monkey
[23:31:04] <jdh> there is a special 3 wheel license?
[23:31:39] <JT-Shop> it varies by state
[23:31:52] <GammaX-Shop> no js0 is correct.
[23:32:14] <JT-Shop> the general rule is if you can stow your oxygen so you can breath you can drive one
[23:32:22] <jdh> heh
[23:33:20] <JT-Shop> they had one guy that is a paraplegic and carried a wheel chair on a custom rack
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[23:33:33] <JT-Shop> it was amazing to see him mount and dismount the Spyder
[23:34:11] <JT-Shop> GammaX: does the loaduser line work?
[23:35:44] <GammaX-Shop> when i put that in I get the error of stdin :2: execv(hal_joystick): no such file or directory
[23:36:12] <GammaX-Shop> but my device is already in as js0 which is confirmed
[23:36:18] <ssi> JT-Shop: the thc is working, but on every pierce I lose some motion somewhere
[23:36:32] <ssi> JT-Shop: my Z home softlimit keeps getting lower and lower, and eventually it can't get high enough to pierce
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[23:36:59] <ssi> JT-Shop: it's not the mechanicals losing motion, it's the thc component monkeying with the numbers somewhere I'm prretty sure
[23:37:03] <ssi> just not sure how to troubleshoot it
[23:37:51] <JT-Shop> ssi: are you making a Z move up to clear the offset after the cut?
[23:38:04] <ssi> probably not?
[23:38:15] <JT-Shop> yikes!
[23:38:23] <JT-Shop> you have to move up to remove any offset
[23:38:38] <ssi> anything in particular?
[23:38:39] <JT-Shop> I need to work on a manual entry :(
[23:38:42] <ssi> or can I just do a g0z0
[23:38:47] <JT-Shop> yep
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[23:39:18] <GammaX-Shop> still gettin errors on start...
[23:39:36] <ssi> JT-Shop: should I put that in my sheetcam post?
[23:39:44] <ssi> I'm running your post
[23:39:58] <JT-Shop> it should move up iirc
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[23:40:14] <JT-Shop> oh the clearance height is the key in sheetcam
[23:40:22] <JT-Shop> that makes it move up
[23:40:36] <ssi> hm ok
[23:40:48] <ssi> there's a G0 Z0.5 after every M5
[23:40:52] <ssi> I'm assuming that's the clearance height
[23:41:18] <JT-Shop> GammaX: do you have anything besides the loadrt line?
[23:41:27] <JT-Shop> sounds plausable
[23:41:49] <GammaX-Shop> i got the machine to come up...
[23:41:53] <GammaX-Shop> idk what i did
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[23:42:39] <JT-Shop> can you see it in show hal configuration?
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[23:45:46] <GammaX-Shop> I am able to see some of the input movements of it...
[23:46:05] <ssi> JT-Shop: so... I'm still not sure how to fix this
[23:46:10] <GammaX-Shop> if I press right on my dpad... btn-pinkie-not pops up.
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[23:47:06] <JT-Shop> ssi monitor the cur_offset pin to see if it clears
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[23:47:20] <JT-Shop> GammaX: sounds like your working then
[23:47:20] <ssi> any move makes it clear?
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[23:47:37] <GammaX-Shop> JT-Shop: just trying to figure out how to get everything else working.
[23:48:07] <JT-Shop> Cocoa says "daddy take me out for a run"
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[23:48:32] <JT-Shop> ssi: any positive Z move should clear it
[23:48:37] <JT-Shop> really quick
[23:48:38] <ssi> ok I'll see what I can do
[23:49:06] <JT-Shop> help me document what you find
[23:49:12] <ssi> ok
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[23:54:20] <GammaX-Shop> JT-Shop: were you able to use the sticks? and not just buttons?
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