#linuxcnc | Logs for 2013-05-01

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[01:21:07] <pfred1> hey who wants to check out my nuts?
[01:24:02] <skunkworks> do they screw?
[01:24:16] <pfred1> skunkworks very smoothly I think
[01:25:55] <pfred1> I made my own tap for them out of acme rod but that proved difficult to cut threads with enough space in them
[01:26:17] <pfred1> so I tweaked my tap to give me the clearance I needed
[01:26:24] <pfred1> I used a punch on some of the teeth
[01:26:47] <pfred1> which I thought was a brilliant solution
[01:31:22] <pfred1> no one wants nuts that feel too tight
[01:34:11] <r00t4rd3d> http://www.cnczone.com/forums/diy_cnc_router_table_machines/178546-beta_testers_wanted_dovetail_software.html
[01:35:00] <pfred1> just when i setup a whole new system to run LinuxCNC too!
[01:36:22] <pfred1> anyone want to check out me derusting a saw blade?
[01:36:31] <pfred1> being as my nuts didn't go over so big...
[01:55:55] <L84Supper> are they big nuts?
[01:56:27] <pfred1> not too big
[01:57:04] <pfred1> 1/2 X 10 TPI acme
[01:57:19] <L84Supper> have a pic of your tap?
[01:57:34] <pfred1> I could take one I actually made 2
[01:57:55] <L84Supper> interested in your mods
[01:58:11] <L84Supper> to provide better nut clearance
[01:58:15] <pfred1> I wrote an article about how i made them here http://www.instructables.com/id/Make-an-Acme-Tap/
[01:58:29] <pfred1> yeah I didn't hit upon the peening of the taps when I wrote that article
[01:58:55] <pfred1> well I only peened one of them and use the other as a starter
[01:59:48] <L84Supper> so you made it harder by peening
[01:59:49] <pfred1> I just took a sharp prick punch and carefully smacked some of the teeth in the middle to expand them a little
[02:00:01] <pfred1> nah it makes the metal blow out a little
[02:00:22] <L84Supper> clever little cleaver
[02:00:36] <pfred1> I got the idea thinking of how people adjust framing squares
[02:00:54] <pfred1> don't ask me how I made the leap but that is what I was thinking about
[02:01:17] <pfred1> I guess punches and displacing metal
[02:01:28] <pfred1> anyhow it works
[02:02:08] <pfred1> about halfway up one of the taps I smacked a few of the teeth and I can see them cutting more than the others
[02:02:41] <pfred1> before that i was tapping with a drill over and over and it wasn't making the nut really run easily on the rod
[02:03:28] <pfred1> eventually I'd heat the tap up enough it would expand and kind of get a better fit
[02:03:43] <pfred1> but I was like there has to be a better way than this
[02:05:11] <pfred1> I saw some real butcher jobs on the net people making homemade acme taps
[02:05:32] <pfred1> one guy with a Dremel and the rod in a vise it was painful to watch
[02:06:09] <pfred1> they seemed proud with their results though :\
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[02:20:58] <ssi> so, figures
[02:21:13] <ssi> all day long i sat here and worked on trying to get the linuxcnc arm stuff to work on the new BBB
[02:21:18] <ssi> and the minute I step away, folks start talking about it
[02:22:09] <pfred1> x86 4evah!
[02:22:33] <ssi> lul
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[02:48:05] <generic_nick|2> i love it when my spider gears explode in my differential.
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[03:43:57] <ssi> I guess the roadblock is there's no ipipe patches for 3.8 yet
[03:44:04] <ssi> :(
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[04:01:52] <GammaX-Laptop> and the shop is finally moved! :)
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[05:20:05] <ssi> mhaberler: I've spent my day trying to get linuxcnc on the beagleboard black
[05:20:11] <ssi> I see your name attached to stuff relevant
[05:20:21] <mhaberler> dont, it doesnt work yet
[05:20:27] <mhaberler> only on BBW
[05:20:30] <ssi> for lack of ipipe?
[05:20:37] <ssi> that's where I got stuck for xenomai
[05:20:54] <mhaberler> this will be fixed as soon as the xenomai patch for bb 3.8.x is out and stable
[05:21:03] <ssi> other than realtime, what else is hung up?
[05:21:25] <mhaberler> it seems the boot process wiggles some gpio pins, which are different from bbw
[05:21:39] <mhaberler> what you can do until then:
[05:22:00] <mhaberler> build the 3.8 kernel without xenomai as per eewiki
[05:22:07] <ssi> I can do that successfully
[05:22:14] <ssi> I'm trying to get a decent ubuntu distro on a card to work with
[05:22:15] <mhaberler> recompile the linuxcnc trees with --with-threads=posix
[05:22:23] <ssi> the linuxcnc specific image I downloaded was debian
[05:22:30] <mhaberler> hm, decent _and_ ubuntu
[05:22:33] <ssi> haha
[05:23:03] <ssi> and furthermore, trying to figure out how to get angstrom's fancypants usb0 network driver to work on my not-angstrom distro
[05:23:10] <mhaberler> --with-threads=posix should work as a stopgap until we have the 3.8 xeno kernel
[05:23:33] <ssi> once I have linuxcnc running on the board, I want to get my head in the hal drivers and understand how that works
[05:23:38] <ssi> since I haven't dug into that before
[05:23:38] <mhaberler> sorry, angstrom is a different planet - waste of time IMO, tons of packages missing for linuxcnc
[05:23:46] <ssi> yea I know, I'm not touching angstrom
[05:23:51] <ssi> I just want to be able to do the usb network the way they do
[05:23:52] <mhaberler> excellent idea
[05:24:02] <ssi> since I'm lacking in wired network in here at the moment :/
[05:24:41] <mhaberler> well if I had a bbb around I would do a stopgap image with posix threads, but I dont - sorry
[05:24:49] <ssi> no problem
[05:24:52] <ssi> I don't mind doing stuff the hard way
[05:25:28] <ssi> I'm just having trouble figuring out what to use as a base image
[05:25:39] <ssi> I guess I should go back to that debian img someone (you maybe?) put up
[05:25:41] <mhaberler> I think the 3.8 xeno kernel should appear really soon, so it might not be long; one fellow over at xenomai os working on it
[05:25:43] <mhaberler> amen
[05:26:08] <ssi> yeah I think it was yours
[05:26:09] <mhaberler> I used the wheezy rootfs from eewiki as a start
[05:26:29] <mhaberler> doesnt have all this crap from ubuntu
[05:26:38] <mhaberler> 'no route to plymouth', yeah sure
[05:26:44] <GammaX-Laptop> can i just use regular romex wen hooking up my machines or is the huge rubber coated wire bettera/
[05:26:46] <GammaX-Laptop> ?
[05:26:50] <ssi> http://static.mah.priv.at/public/beaglebone/starterkit/
[05:26:59] <ssi> that sd4GB img
[05:27:03] <mhaberler> yes
[05:27:06] <ssi> I had it running earlier
[05:27:12] <ssi> had to swap out the kernel for a 3.8
[05:27:14] <mhaberler> on bbw I assume
[05:27:18] <ssi> no on BBB
[05:27:20] <ssi> I don't have a white
[05:27:47] <mhaberler> oh really? well if you could document what changed to get it to work with BBB I'd appreciate it
[05:27:58] <ssi> just a kernel
[05:28:13] <ssi> I have a tarball that you can explode in the root of the fs and it will work
[05:28:14] <mhaberler> any changes to boot partition /uEnv.txt?
[05:28:16] <ssi> nope
[05:28:23] <ssi> lemme redo it and make sure
[05:28:28] <GammaX-Laptop> I think we should develop an open source interface/driver system such as the centroid system.
[05:28:58] <mhaberler> what do you mean by that?
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[05:29:26] <GammaX-Laptop> buy the pcb's let people solder them. make minimal profit for future enhancement for linuxcnc
[05:29:26] <ssi> centroids stuff is crap
[05:29:32] <ssi> mesa is much better :)
[05:29:37] <GammaX-Laptop> the idea of that lol
[05:30:48] <GammaX-Laptop> ssi, i will haver photos of the collet tomorow
[05:31:05] <GammaX-Laptop> if still interested that is...
[05:31:14] <FATIMA> HOLA
[05:31:27] <mhaberler> ssi: the 3.2 kernel is non-dtb (saw you over at #beagle)
[05:32:01] <ssi> yeah I figured that out :)
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[05:32:15] <ssi> no thanks to that lot
[05:32:15] <ssi> heh
[05:32:38] <mhaberler> but its good to see the ARM board/hw interface mess is coming to an end with DTB
[05:32:46] <ssi> yeah
[05:33:04] <ssi> I have a friend that did the adtrap kickstarter, and their boards are am335x baesed
[05:33:17] <ssi> he's on board for the linuxcnc on bbb party
[05:33:29] <ssi> he's got a bbb on hand and a jtag emulator
[05:33:42] <mhaberler> very well - well it shouldnt take long
[05:33:47] <ssi> nah
[05:33:54] <ssi> we gotta get pcw to design us an awesome cape
[05:33:55] <mhaberler> jtag, jtag.. real men use gdb and printk ;)
[05:34:04] <mhaberler> I think he's on the case
[05:34:10] <ssi> I was thinking maybe a multi-sserial cape would be a good starting point :)
[05:34:22] <GammaX-Laptop> what are you guys talking about? lol
[05:34:36] <mhaberler> well thats a bit pushing it, the serials on the sitara are pretty old school
[05:34:52] <mhaberler> maybe with some PRU magic
[05:35:01] <ssi> yea I wouldn't expect you'd use the uarts
[05:35:13] <ssi> I don't know how sserial works, but I figure he can make it happen with PRU + GPIO
[05:35:30] <ssi> anyway, my plan was to get it to a point where I can write a GPIO wiggler hal driver from scratch
[05:35:30] <mhaberler> pedestrian, but yes
[05:35:37] <ssi> and wiggle it from linuxcnc :)
[05:35:45] <ssi> i need to at least understand that much
[05:35:51] <mhaberler> well, have a look at hal_gpio.c
[05:36:42] <mhaberler> that is for the rpi only I think, but modulo incantations it should be similar (mmap io)
[05:36:46] <ssi> sure
[05:36:57] <ssi> I have an rpi as well that I can mess with
[05:37:08] <mhaberler> I started but lost stamina when Charles started his fancy PRU stepgen
[05:37:18] <mhaberler> could only loose out ;)
[05:37:21] <ssi> the PRU is intriguing
[05:37:49] <mhaberler> yep, and it has a lot of bang, and good timing - no cache, no vm
[05:38:16] <mhaberler> over at #userspace-arduino they do a arduino emulation on the pru. the effect of crack consumption on CS.
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[05:40:07] <ssi> have you seen the UDOO on kickstarter?
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[05:40:25] <mhaberler> nope
[05:40:54] <ssi> kinda interesting
[05:41:00] <mhaberler> oh that one. pretty sick idea
[05:41:04] <ssi> yea
[05:41:11] <ssi> I'm in for a quadcore
[05:41:22] <mhaberler> nice marketing ploy, but idiotic architecture
[05:41:30] <ssi> if I can get linuxcnc running worth a crap on the arm, it'd be cool to be able to run ramps shields as is on it with linuxcnc
[05:41:59] <mhaberler> "buy me, you can use your arduino skills"
[05:42:11] <mhaberler> ramps shields.. ?
[05:42:26] <ssi> reprap stuff
[05:42:36] <ssi> ramps is an arduino mega shield that has five pololu stepper drivers on it
[05:42:40] <mhaberler> ah
[05:42:43] <ssi> plus some high current switches and some other IOs
[05:42:55] <ssi> http://prototechnical.com/cnc/bbb/kernel-3.8.10-vanilla.tgz
[05:42:57] <ssi> there ya go
[05:43:07] <ssi> that's got a uImage, a dtb file, and a modules directory
[05:43:20] <ssi> untar it directly into the root of your image and it'll boot on BBB
[05:43:35] <mhaberler> well I did the kernel, that wasnt the issue - the issue was to get it to dual-boot on bbw and bbb
[05:43:39] <ssi> ohhh
[05:43:51] <ssi> I don't have that stigma :D
[05:44:01] <mhaberler> where I want to get at is a uEnv.txt mod at the max
[05:44:12] <ssi> makes sense
[05:44:15] <mhaberler> in theory the hush shell might be able to autodetect
[05:44:24] <ssi> so is linuxcnc already installed on that image?
[05:44:37] <mhaberler> yes, see the readme
[05:44:53] <mhaberler> both the v2.5 based and master based branches, including pru stuff and emcweb
[05:45:23] <ssi> ahh there it is
[05:45:34] <mhaberler> that was the point of 'starter' in 'starter kit' ;)
[05:45:37] <ds3> mhaberler: how usable is the image you have with a touch screen interface?
[05:46:03] <ssi> logged in as root, a find didn't find it
[05:46:03] <ssi> heh
[05:46:08] <mhaberler> I have no idea, I dont own one; I do expect the current 3.2.21 kernel doesnt support the lcd cape
[05:46:20] <mhaberler> or whatever you use; the 3.8 kernel should
[05:46:20] <ds3> who cares about the LCD cape
[05:46:31] <ds3> got my own board
[05:46:32] <mhaberler> well I cant divine what you are using
[05:46:47] <ds3> I am asking more about the touchscreen UI
[05:47:02] <mhaberler> I would think to get going install the 3.8 kernel, recompile as posix threads and go from there
[05:47:03] <ds3> there was one for the longest time but donno if it is as complete or useable
[05:47:23] <ds3> what's the min. kernel required?
[05:47:44] <mhaberler> well follow the eewiki instructions, hold on
[05:47:49] <ds3> 'k
[05:48:12] <ds3> it might interesting to use this for a lathe refit
[05:48:13] <mhaberler> these are pretty solid instructions: http://eewiki.net/display/linuxonarm/BeagleBone+Black
[05:48:23] <mhaberler> or use ssi's tar file
[05:48:36] <mhaberler> (and bug him about it ;)
[05:48:41] <ssi> hahaha
[05:48:48] <mhaberler> there! support issue closed.
[05:49:01] <ds3> in my notes
[05:49:21] <ds3> is there enough support to also sync a spindle?
[05:49:30] <ds3> (for threading on a lathe)
[05:50:00] <ssi> I got the usb0 net to work on your debian image
[05:50:00] <ssi> hooray
[05:50:57] <mhaberler> well if there are gpio pins left; need to look if the pru driver supports vanilla gpio
[05:51:09] <mhaberler> in terms of logic it should
[05:51:22] <ds3> i donno how hal sees it
[05:51:59] <mhaberler> of course the best would be if somebody redid hal_gpio.c for the bbb/bbw such that it wont trample upon PRU-managed pins if you use the pru stepgen
[05:52:03] <mhaberler> I 'left this as an exercise for the reader'
[05:52:24] <ds3> hehe
[05:52:55] <mhaberler> it's the 'collaboration' keyword in open source, it translates into 'not all me' ;)
[05:53:41] <ds3> yes but one got to balance time on the machine side with the sw side
[05:53:51] <ds3> got a 8 year old project lathe that needs finishing
[05:53:55] <ssi> mhaberler: that's what I'd like to get involved with
[05:54:02] <mhaberler> excellent
[05:54:04] <ssi> mhaberler: one way or another, I want to have my fingers in the hal drivers for the bbb
[05:54:13] <ssi> sounds like you won't kick help out of bed
[05:54:34] <ssi> I flat love the idea of having BBB+mesa for running machines
[05:54:43] <mhaberler> superb; well have a look at the PRU stepgen and which pins it grabs, and talk to Charles
[05:54:44] <mhaberler> sure he'd appreciate
[05:55:02] <mhaberler> and go from there redoing hal_gpio.c
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[05:55:15] <ssi> I wish I could get the stupid network straight
[05:55:27] <ssi> it'd be a lot easier if I had a physical network cable that worked :/
[05:55:51] <ds3> ssi: what does ifconfig -a say?
[05:56:01] <ssi> I have the device now
[05:56:10] <ssi> usb0 Link encap:Ethernet HWaddr f2:39:c7:a8:2a:46 inet addr: Bcast: Mask:
[05:56:29] <ssi> angstrom had all kind of fancypants routing and dhcp set up
[05:56:32] <ds3> so that seems good
[05:56:36] <ssi> so osx just connected to it and was happy
[05:56:40] <ssi> this doesn't have any of that :)
[05:56:41] <mhaberler> why are you using usb?
[05:57:26] <ssi> cause physical networking is in a sad state in my house at the moment
[05:57:31] <mhaberler> I see
[05:57:37] <ds3> no wifi?
[05:57:53] <ssi> plenty of wifi
[05:58:00] <ssi> bbb doesn't have wifi, does it?
[05:58:10] <mhaberler> no dont think so
[05:58:11] <ds3> got one for it on the USB port
[05:58:15] <mhaberler> consumer fads
[05:59:35] <ssi> hey looky there, a link light
[06:01:31] <ssi> hey look at that, a dhcp lease
[06:01:34] <ssi> we're making progress now
[06:02:22] <GammaX-Laptop> ssi, what are you trying to do exactly?
[06:04:40] <ssi> GammaX-Laptop: conquer new frontiers in machine control, basically
[06:04:58] <GammaX-Laptop> ahhh nice
[06:05:06] <GammaX-Laptop> let me know if I can be of assistance :)
[06:05:21] <GammaX-Laptop> Ill boldy go... where no one as gone before.....
[06:05:24] <ds3> ssi: what kind of machine?/
[06:06:56] <ssi> ds3: oh all kinds of machines
[06:07:13] <mhaberler> I hope the sun shines there..
[06:07:50] <ds3> what machine first?
[06:08:10] <ssi> I don't have a particular machine earmarked for the BBB
[06:08:13] <ssi> it's just for the future possibility
[06:08:28] <ssi> I've got a hardinge HNC running linuxcnc with mesa gear
[06:08:38] <ds3> ah
[06:08:38] <ssi> a g0602 converted with mesa gear
[06:08:45] <ssi> a g0704 that needs to be finished
[06:09:03] <ssi> a scratchbuilt plasma table that was running mach but is currently down, and I want to move it over to mesa/linuxcnc
[06:09:23] <ssi> a handful of 3d printers with reprap hardware
[06:09:35] <ssi> a 3 axis engraving machine scratchbuilt that would be a nice target for this BBB project actually
[06:09:54] <ssi> and I just finished up retrofittinga centroid knee mill to linuxcnc with mesa gear
[06:10:03] <ssi> but that last one is for a customer, so I don't get to keep it :(
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[06:13:49] <ssi> ok lets try rebuilding the pru tree with --with-threads=posix
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[06:31:12] <ssi> mhaberler: does charles spend any time in this channel?
[06:31:19] <mhaberler> nope
[06:31:22] <mhaberler> mail only
[06:31:26] <ssi> ok
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[06:31:43] <ssi> I've never been real good about lists :P
[06:32:21] <ssi> I had to pull a fresh tree to build with posix threads
[06:32:29] <ssi> rtapi was contaminating the other trees, wouldn't build :)
[06:38:05] <ssi> haha I like how it builds blinkleds.bin for the pru during the linuxcnc build
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[06:57:30] <mhaberler> make clean in src should do
[06:59:35] <ReadError> vacuum pump shopping is hard ;(
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[07:00:36] <DJ9DJ> moin
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[07:07:33] <JesusAlos> hi
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[07:20:52] <GammaX-Laptop> ssi, when you opened that beheameth of a controler you had... was it coivered in gunk?
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[07:22:37] <GammaX-Laptop> My westamp servo cards seem to have a layer of... stuff on them.... im debating on cleaning them or not.. I shouls say "tr" to clean them...
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[07:40:44] <mazafaka> Have cleaned up my moto, Ural. Do you know of any car shampoo which dilutes oils and which is OK for soil after all? Or do I need to clean it with rags and kerosene...
[07:56:02] <DJ9DJ> just dont clean it ;)
[07:58:20] <mazafaka> no, seriously
[07:59:30] <mazafaka> I think to use detergents and do not know if it's right decision or not. I currently mix wet rags with grease with dust from the floor of the garage and such and put it into trash.
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[10:48:46] <jthornton> simple green
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[10:52:59] <mazafaka> jthornton: `Simply Red' - `It's Only Love' https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m3OlxHUUU5s
[10:53:40] <mazafaka> Is that what you was singing whole morning? :)
[10:54:04] <jthornton> no, it is a green cleaner
[10:56:08] <mazafaka> what is it?
[10:56:56] <mazafaka> Some sort of spray can after which you apply rags and wipe out the remains of the oils and grease?
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[11:01:29] <mazafaka> Their FAQ form has a question form to submit.
[11:02:25] <jthornton> comes in a pump bottle and cleans everything even old greasy keyboards
[11:03:19] <jthornton> http://www.simplegreen.com/
[11:04:26] <jthornton> mazafaka, I forget where your located?
[11:10:48] <mazafaka> jthornton: Russia. And I ask them wether it is their cleaner itself eco-friendly, or when I wipe out this all, whole the stuff together with oils and grease will be less harmful to the mother earth
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[11:26:27] <mazafaka> heh, that's what I looked for...
[11:27:58] <mazafaka> now i need to go... Get something to eat and read next to know why :) Dogs and cats ate raw liver and create stupid smells...
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[12:11:03] <jdh> didn't the oil come from mother earth
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[12:44:35] <PetefromTn> ...
[12:46:23] <PetefromTn> Finally got all the damn rust pinholes tig welded up and ground down and all the surface rust removed from the troughs. Now I am trying to get this Epoxy mixed up so I can apply it to my roughed up interior surfaces of the troughs.
[12:48:52] <ProxDem> PetefromTn: that sounds interesting...if ever you post pictures please feel free to give us a url =)
[12:49:52] <jthornton> ditto
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[12:53:47] <archivist> no pics...it didnt happen!
[12:53:57] <ProxDem> lol
[12:54:37] <L84Supper> if a tree falls in the forest and there was nobody around to take a pic.......
[12:57:40] <L84Supper> PetefromTn: what's the epoxy paints ratio of the components, 1:1 or ~100:1
[13:04:32] <L84Supper> http://images.craigslist.org/3Id3Jd3Nb5I65O55K9d4tc9e833f255b11e64.jpg does the chuck on the right have a name for that type mount?
[13:04:35] <PetefromTn> ProxDem: I have some pictures of the troughs before I started working on them on my photobucket page. I have not taken any pictures of them since I started grinding on them but I will and get them posted. Here is a link ...http://s150.photobucket.com/user/matospeter/library/Cincinatti%20Arrow%20500%20Retrofit?sort=3&page=1.
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[13:06:23] <PetefromTn> The Epoxy system I am using is the West marine epoxy. It is 5-1 ratio for resin to hardner and the paint is basically a gallon container that is 3/4 full and it comes with a quart of hardner that mixes it to a full gallon. This project will most likely only use about a quart for the troughs and I HOPE to be able to use the rest to paint my Nacra Racing catamaran as it is in dire need of a paint job....
[13:12:36] <ProxDem> nice
[13:14:37] <ProxDem> love the dog =P
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[13:26:40] <L84Supper> vintage machine shop for sale http://racine.craigslist.org/tls/3721338548.html
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[13:28:55] <L84Supper> http://images.craigslist.org/3Me3I53Nd5K45F35H4d43cac3248c88171721.jpg any ideas? a press?
[13:29:55] <PetefromTn> L84Supper: looks like an old arbor press...
[13:30:18] <L84Supper> PetefromTn: stand-behind model?
[13:30:59] <PetefromTn> Lol not sure really. Maybe they put the handle on backwards?
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[14:03:40] <Tom_itx> PetefromTn, if you're spraying that stuff, i'd mix a pot at a time instead of the whole gallon
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[14:03:53] <Tom_itx> ever have epoxy paint jell up in a paint gun?
[14:04:01] <Tom_itx> it's not fun to clean
[14:05:26] <JT-Shop> I'm guessing that using a 1/4" diameter end mill when my CAM is programmed for a 1/2" end mill will lead to confusion on my part as I try and fit the gearbox into the resulting hole
[14:05:55] <Tom_itx> unless you use ALOT of comp
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[14:08:55] <PetefromTn> Tom_itx: Yeah man as I said I am only going to be mixing up a quart or so to spray the stuff in these troughs, the rest I will be using on my sailboat.
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[14:32:19] <JT-Shop> It's amazing the thoughts that cross your mind while you try and make sense of things when you didn't get what you expected
[14:34:25] <jdh> that's how we got religion
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[15:03:50] <ssi> hrm
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[15:12:19] <PetefromTn> Okay dudes, Epoxy coating of the first larger trough that has the coolant pump seperation area is finished. It went really well and honestly I was kinda nervous about mixing up so much epoxy at one time but I bought the slow hardener 206 stuff and I was able to coat the entire thing and brush it all up the sides and all around the inside of the container without issue and had enough left to pour some more onto the floor area
[15:12:19] <PetefromTn> of the trough to hopefully seal up the entire unit. Now I am gonna set this one aside to cure and grab the other one and hit it some more with my wire brush and angle die grinder with surface prep disks to get it ready to be epoxy coated. I am roughing up the surfaces pretty harsh so the epoxy will have something to stick to...
[15:17:06] <ssi> west systems is awesome :)
[15:20:05] <ProxDem> love wire brush...specialy nylon wire brushes for rust removal on delicate surfaces
[15:20:47] <ProxDem> or to gives to unsafe people who would otherwise be throwing metal wires everywhere =P lol
[15:21:35] <ssi> that'd be me
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[15:21:44] <ssi> I have no idea how to run a wire wheel that doesn't involve throwing wires everywhere
[15:21:47] <ssi> mostly in my eyes
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[15:25:01] <ProxDem> lol
[15:25:13] <ssi> i also don't believe in safety glasses :D
[15:25:43] <ProxDem> that makes for an interesting combination
[15:25:58] <ssi> I wear contacts... that'll protect me, right?
[15:25:59] <ssi> :D
[15:26:05] <ssi> ITS FINE
[15:26:52] <ProxDem> lollllll
[15:27:22] <archivist> hmm ethnic snot after a day(or less) on the wire brush
[15:27:32] <ssi> lol ethnic snot
[15:27:39] <ssi> you know what else causes that realbad
[15:27:48] <ssi> ever try to refill laser toner?
[15:27:49] <ssi> :P
[15:28:46] <ProxDem> eewww
[15:29:09] <ProxDem> microscopic plastic particles everywhere!
[15:30:07] <ssi> also microballoons
[15:30:10] <ssi> speaking of west epoxy
[15:30:30] <ssi> in fact, PetefromTn have you thought about microballoons for filling some of your pinholes?
[15:30:40] <ssi> that's usually a good strategy, rather than just straight epoxy
[15:30:49] <ssi> mix it up like toothpaste consistency and use it as a filler
[15:31:15] <ProxDem> would glass be a good filler for his use?
[15:31:27] <ssi> dunno :)
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[16:11:12] <IchGuckLive> hi all B)
[16:14:20] <PetefromTn> ssi: Where were you when I needed you LOL....
[16:14:53] <PetefromTn> The Epoxy is already installed and curing as we speak...
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[16:23:54] <generic_nick|2> you're epoxying a coolant tank?
[16:24:36] <ProxDem> PetefromTn: let us know how it turns out =)
[16:24:39] <generic_nick|2> wish i could do that on my mill, but i dont think i could get a brush in there, it's all in the base of the mill.
[16:25:33] <IchGuckLive> generic_nick|2: there is a tire fixing plastics to go hot water sealing
[16:25:47] <IchGuckLive> it makes near 0.5mm of coading
[16:26:16] <IchGuckLive> i did that 2 times and it is still working after years
[16:26:33] <generic_nick|2> nice, got a link or name of it?
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[16:28:09] <IchGuckLive> teroson
[16:28:51] <generic_nick|2> thanks!
[16:28:56] <IchGuckLive> in the usa liquid moly shoudt be first choise
[16:29:29] <PetefromTn> generic_nick|2: Yeah man I am epoxying the troughs. Mine are removable and have a dual tank arrangement one on each side of the VMC going front to back with the left side housing the coolant pump and its seperation area with screens.
[16:30:22] <IchGuckLive> generic_nick|2: dont forget it is not for injektion into pump or tubes only for the tank
[16:30:38] <generic_nick|2> thanks IchGuckLive
[16:30:38] <IchGuckLive> you may need a seperate water circet for repairing
[16:32:33] <PetefromTn> Be real careful what you choose to use for the coolant troughs as many industrial coolants are real nasty to certain paints and coatings. The Epoxy I am using is your standard west system epocy and I am going to paint over it with several coats of Devoe bar rust 235 epoxy based industrial paint. This stuff is supposed to be impervious to water immersion as well as many chemicals and acids. It is tough stuff but expensive.
[16:32:33] <PetefromTn> The gallon mix with the hardner and some special thinner for it was just under a hundred bucks. The sucky part is that it is enough to do this job I need it for four times over so I will have enough left to paint my sailboats hulls hopefully.
[16:33:34] <IchGuckLive> PetefromTn: as he has only the inside tank
[16:34:50] <IchGuckLive> ok im off DAY of here in germany and BBQ ready B)
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[16:35:22] <PetefromTn> I am only painting the inside of my tanks....
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[16:45:03] <L84Supper> you can save yourself some money by just coating it with polyester resin
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[16:45:59] <ssi> PetefromTn: lol sorry
[16:46:29] <ssi> I do some composite work for aircraft
[16:46:35] <ssi> as a hobby :)
[16:46:46] <L84Supper> http://www.homedepot.com/p/Home-Solutions-1-Gallon-All-Purpose-Fiberglass-Resin-20124/202077791 it contains talc as a filler
[16:47:07] <ReadError> ssi: oh really?
[16:47:19] <ReadError> have yuo made any CF sheets?
[16:47:20] <PetefromTn> L84Supper: Actually I had real concerns about polyester resin in the coolant application. Surely it would be waterproof but will it handle the acids and chemicals long term...
[16:47:27] <L84Supper> yes
[16:47:27] <ssi> yea a bit
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[16:47:44] <ReadError> ssi: well i was wanting to make some, vac infusion style
[16:47:52] <ReadError> but i want a high gloss finish on both sides
[16:47:53] <PetefromTn> ssi: Nice man I actually found this west epoxy to be quite simple and easy to use.
[16:47:55] <ReadError> is this possible?
[16:48:03] <ssi> PetefromTn: I'm assuming you got the pumps?
[16:48:06] <ssi> the pumps make it so easy
[16:48:15] <ReadError> vacuum pump?
[16:48:16] <ssi> ReadError: gloss on both sides is tough
[16:48:23] <ReadError> i was in the market for one ;/
[16:48:28] <ssi> but you could lay it up on glass, and put glass on top, and vacuum it down
[16:48:33] <ssi> and hope you get enough epoxy evac out the sides
[16:48:35] <ReadError> ssi: i was thinking about pre-pregging the inners
[16:48:45] <ReadError> and using the vac to draw out excess with glass on top
[16:49:00] <ReadError> so not a true vac infusion...
[16:49:03] <PetefromTn> no actually with the application basically requiring me to make an epoxy bathtub out of it I knew I would be mixing the entire contents of the quart if not more...
[16:49:17] <ReadError> you suppose that work work?
[16:50:35] <ssi> PetefromTn: ah I see... for small qtys, the pumps are really super handy
[16:50:45] <ssi> ReadError: how are you gonna pre-preg it?
[16:50:52] <ReadError> ssi: by hand
[16:51:01] <ReadError> lay it down, squeege it down as much as i can
[16:51:02] <PetefromTn> ssi: yup I agree I have used the pumps before and they are very handy.
[16:51:10] <ReadError> i need a slow curing resin though
[16:51:21] <ReadError> im fine with leaving it for 24 hours...
[16:51:33] <ReadError> as long as my work time is cool
[16:51:58] <ssi> mix slow resin, and then keep it cold
[16:52:05] <ssi> heat speeds up the cure
[16:52:10] <ReadError> yea
[16:52:21] <ReadError> do you think the prepreg+vac+glass would work pretty good?
[16:52:30] <ReadError> I wanted to run some layers of -45/45 in the middle
[16:52:35] <ReadError> to help with torsion
[16:52:39] <ssi> probably should work well
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[16:53:02] <ssi> my biggest concern with doing gloss on both sides is getting adequate epoxy coverage but still getting it to vacuum out adequately
[16:53:11] <ssi> glossy carbon is actually WAY oversaturated
[16:53:17] <ssi> good carbon should look dry
[16:53:22] <ReadError> well not super glossy
[16:53:24] <PetefromTn> Once built a set of benches for customers to use outside of a bank in a breezeway that would be occasionally wet and we built them from IPE wood which is seriously dense and heavy and we had to use the epoxy to bond the slats together to ensure they would seal up and then we ran stainless bolts thru the leg joints for added strength. Honestly tho once we assembled the benches with the epoxy and it cured I think you could park
[16:53:24] <PetefromTn> a building on top of them and they would not even budge...Very heavy duty benches.
[16:53:31] <ReadError> i just dont want a "textured" top
[16:53:45] <ReadError> where the fibers determine the flatness
[16:53:49] <ssi> what are you doing with it?
[16:53:54] <L84Supper> why the vac? to remove bubbles?
[16:54:04] <ReadError> ssi: multirotors
[16:54:06] <ssi> L84Supper: to remove air AND excess epoxi
[16:54:12] <ReadError> L84Supper: pull out extra epoxy
[16:54:16] <ssi> ReadError: gotcha... I built a couple out of aluminum once upon a time :)
[16:54:16] <ReadError> i want a light and strong product
[16:54:32] <ReadError> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/25091878/Photo%20Apr%2024%2C%2011%2056%2021%20PM.jpg
[16:54:38] <ReadError> im buying CF now
[16:55:05] <ReadError> but feel i would have more flexability making it
[16:55:09] <ssi> if it were me, I'd probably use premade epoxy tubes
[16:55:11] <ssi> er
[16:55:12] <ssi> CF tubes
[16:55:19] <ssi> and then make motor mounts and epoxy them to the tubes
[16:55:32] <ReadError> since most of the off the shelf stuff is 90 and uni
[16:55:43] <ReadError> ssi: nah, when you fly like i do, thats not a viable option
[16:55:52] <ReadError> these are made for hard acro, and hard crashes
[16:55:52] <ssi> haha what does that mean
[16:56:35] <ReadError> http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=CCv6Rxy-SLc#t=7s
[16:56:36] <Tecan> (CCv6Rxy-SLc) "Stupid Towelie Crash" by "readerror67" is "Tech" - Length: 0:00:12
[16:56:38] <ReadError> like that ;)
[16:56:38] <L84Supper> what range of flexural modulus do you need?
[16:56:54] <ssi> http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/27742_582008144562_214144_n.jpg
[16:57:01] <ssi> http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/27742_582181287582_1322230_n.jpg
[16:57:03] <ssi> it was way too big
[16:57:05] <ssi> but that's the idea
[16:57:23] <ReadError> http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=jORrEOPPY9A#t=31s
[16:57:24] <Tecan> (jORrEOPPY9A) "Towelie Crash #2" by "readerror67" is "Tech" - Length: 0:00:44
[16:57:33] <ReadError> CF tube would not stand a chance there
[16:57:33] <GammaX> ssi do you ever get off here?
[16:57:42] <ssi> GammaX: yeah, sometimes for months at a time :)
[16:58:00] <ProxDem> ssi: nice variable PSU 30~35volts 5amps I guess?
[16:58:01] <ReadError> so the plan was to make 4-5mm CF sheet
[16:58:10] <ssi> ProxDem: I think it's 3A
[16:58:15] <ProxDem> ahh =(
[16:58:21] <ProxDem> I have the 5amp version of that enclosure
[16:58:36] <ssi> here's the first one we built
[16:58:38] <ssi> it's WAY too big
[16:58:38] <ssi> http://sphotos-c.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/p206x206/32092_581531404952_6152279_n.jpg
[16:58:41] <ssi> 600W motors
[16:58:44] <ssi> hahahaha
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[16:58:54] <ssi> http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/32092_581531419922_4445811_n.jpg
[17:00:01] <PetefromTn> nice bandsaw...
[17:00:02] <ssi> it's good that thing never flew... it would have been a death trap
[17:00:15] <ssi> PetefromTn: all the crap in that picture, and the $200 HF bandsaw is what you notice? ;)
[17:00:28] <ssi> not the airplane wings or the racecar? :D
[17:00:38] <PetefromTn> What I was just about to say is the frame with wheels in the left side...
[17:00:52] <ssi> http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/25970_574548638472_7782915_n.jpg
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[17:01:17] <PetefromTn> mmmm now that looks yummy...
[17:01:25] <ssi> http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/25970_574632225962_7800113_n.jpg
[17:01:25] <ssi> haha
[17:01:27] <PetefromTn> IS that a sportbike motor?
[17:01:30] <ssi> yep
[17:01:31] <ssi> 750
[17:01:32] <andypugh> I still need to buy a more helicopter-proof lamp fitting for my living room, though I am vaguely used to the "illuminated shards of broken glass" look now.
[17:01:57] <ssi> it's fun looking through my facebook pictures
[17:02:03] <ssi> at all my aborted projects :P
[17:02:07] <ssi> I have a LOT of them
[17:02:08] <PetefromTn> I'd say that little beastie hauls balls...
[17:02:34] <ssi> yea if we ever got it setup right, it'd be amazing
[17:02:34] <archivist> do people really finish projects!
[17:02:35] <PetefromTn> I know me too. I have built all sorts of stuff for myself let alone customers....
[17:02:37] <andypugh> No Diff?
[17:02:41] <ssi> andypugh: nope, solid rear
[17:02:52] <PetefromTn> for smoking tires and such....
[17:02:55] <ssi> I finish projects for customers
[17:02:58] <andypugh> I can imagine that being a problem
[17:02:58] <ssi> and occasionally my own
[17:03:27] <ssi> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oWyro2yWBdA
[17:03:28] <Tecan> (oWyro2yWBdA) "F750 car, day 2" by "imcmahon" is "Autos" - Length: 0:01:54
[17:03:30] <andypugh> I mainly started on this CNC project to make a differential of my own design. I have alomost forgotten that.
[17:04:00] <PetefromTn> I am just starting building two of these one for me and one for my wife....http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yw9gWlpdQoI
[17:04:06] <Tecan> (yw9gWlpdQoI) "Completed DIY Recumbent Warrior Trike" by "Spinner Guy" is "Autos" - Length: 0:00:53
[17:04:07] <jthornton> andypugh, did you ever get the washing machine motor to work?
[17:05:01] <andypugh> I have not even tried so far. I blew up the spare 8i20 too, so that has delayed things.
[17:05:11] <jthornton> ouch
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[17:07:04] <ssi> http://sphotos-f.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/p206x206/150255_606882890372_3844644_n.jpg
[17:07:11] <ssi> http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/155578_606882875402_2731558_n.jpg
[17:07:15] <ssi> only one rotor
[17:07:17] <ssi> but still pretty fun :)
[17:07:37] <andypugh> My plan is to get a friend to buy me one as payment for some work I did for him: http://benlovejoy.wordpress.com/2013/03/27/idesk/
[17:08:02] <skunkworks> jthornton, how was the spider fest?
[17:08:15] <ReadError> why is the monitor so low?
[17:08:21] <ReadError> i was under the impression that eye level is best
[17:08:58] <skunkworks> andypugh, wow - that sounds like my wife... 'do we need all these cables?'
[17:09:42] <andypugh> I don't know why he wanted the monitor so low, but he did. That was the hardest part of the project.
[17:10:07] <andypugh> As it is a 30" monitor, perhaps that puts the centre at eye level?
[17:10:57] <ssi> photographic evidence that at least once, my shop was clean:
[17:10:57] <ssi> http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/416980_811175596152_1798297854_n.jpg
[17:11:02] <ssi> http://sphotos-c.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/421789_811175646052_1184776647_n.jpg
[17:11:05] <ssi> well, clean-ish
[17:12:52] <andypugh> I saw a neat attachment for a surface grinder today: http://www.arceurotrade.co.uk/Catalogue/Collets/ER-Collet-Fixtures/Stevensons-ER32-Sharpening-Fixture-050-070-10300
[17:13:05] <ssi> andypugh: I have that actually
[17:13:13] <ssi> well mine's not ER
[17:13:15] <ssi> it's 5C
[17:13:17] <ssi> but same fixture otherwise
[17:13:36] <andypugh> Is the Stevenson John Stevenson I wonder?
[17:14:01] <PetefromTn> Aww man...CHNC....DROOL....excuse me.
[17:14:11] <ssi> PetefromTn: it's just a regular HNC
[17:14:35] <PetefromTn> Even still,, I don't have one...
[17:14:43] <PetefromTn> Where ya at?
[17:14:51] <ssi> NW atlanta
[17:14:53] <ssi> Kennesaw
[17:15:05] <PetefromTn> NO SHIT!! I am just north of you in Maryville, Tn...
[17:15:11] <archivist> andypugh, yes /me knows hime, cannot see indexing mechanism though on that
[17:15:12] <ssi> sweet :)
[17:15:38] <PetefromTn> So have you actually built and flown a people plane?
[17:15:40] <ssi> archivist: the one I have has lines on it... it doesn't positively index, you just line it up and lock down the setscrew
[17:15:59] <ssi> PetefromTn: I haven't yet flown the one I've built
[17:16:01] <archivist> ew not accurate then
[17:16:03] <ssi> but I've flown ones otherpeople built :)
[17:16:56] <PetefromTn> SWEET... What are ya building? I have ALWAYS dreamed of building an experimental..
[17:17:04] <ssi> an RV-7
[17:17:34] <ssi> http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/531894_10100127757156142_1721581625_n.jpg
[17:17:48] <PetefromTn> NOICE!! That is a beautiful plane man...
[17:17:48] <ssi> http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc1/706319_952582450682_1774579309_o.jpg
[17:17:53] <ssi> that's my buddy Dan in it
[17:18:22] <PetefromTn> LOL I was gonna ask that...
[17:18:29] <PetefromTn> Dan looks NOT HAPPY...
[17:18:32] <ssi> hahah
[17:18:35] <ssi> that's his surly face
[17:19:02] <PetefromTn> Whatever happened to the wannabeF1?
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[17:19:10] <ssi> it's in my friends shed at the moment
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[17:19:18] <ssi> so many projects, so little time
[17:19:31] <PetefromTn> Did not appear to be able to hookup too well, What was the final drive?
[17:19:39] <ssi> the motor mounts weren't terribly solid
[17:19:46] <ssi> and the chain tension was bad
[17:20:39] <PetefromTn> That is another project I have wanted to build but just dunno where the hell I could use it, I have a cop down the street who is a nice guy but when I rode my daughters yard cart down his end he gave me some dirty looks....
[17:23:31] <andypugh> It seems to me that with a 4th that can be angled, on a 3-axis machine, it should be easy to sharpen drill bits.
[17:23:50] <andypugh> (I seem to have totally lost the knack of doing it by hand, possibly an eyesight thing)
[17:25:36] <archivist> if you dont mind the machine being covered in bits of grinding wheel
[17:25:59] <skunkworks> rob_h, you around?
[17:26:48] <archivist> I did wonder about 5 axis grinding on my machine but kept it at "just thought"
[17:26:50] <ssi> andypugh: hoss has some intriguing videos of sharpening the flutes of endmills on his 4th axis witha grinding head
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[17:34:07] <PetefromTn> SWEET.....http://knoxville.craigslist.org/tls/3766900376.html
[17:38:41] <cradek> wow
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[17:46:24] <andypugh> Seems high-priced, though that is rather a lot of tooling.
[17:51:00] <andypugh> ssi: Hoss's sow's ear of a mill is still no silk purse, even after all that work.
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[17:53:36] <archivist> andypugh, I agree :)
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[18:03:16] <PetefromTn> Yeah I think it is high too but these are very precise accurate machines despite being from a bygone era for the most part. They have their purpose tho. If I had the coin it would already be in my shop. I figure it is really worth about $2k or so....
[18:04:51] <andypugh> PetefromTn: Oh, absolutely. With infinite space and money I would have bought this: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/39-X-29-Y-SIP-MP-5F-HYDROPTIC-JIG-BORER-Tooling-Package-SIP-Rotary-Tbl-3-Ax-/400458631092?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item5d3d31c7b4
[18:05:20] <andypugh> Societe Genvoise made _lovely_ tools.
[18:06:45] <PetefromTn> yeah man....NICE stuff.
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[18:26:10] <ssi> andypugh: lol
[18:26:19] <ssi> andypugh: bless his heart, he tries
[18:27:47] <ssi> andypugh: I have a G0704 myself... haven't finished converting it yet, sadly
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[18:27:52] <ssi> I really want to get some kind of big mill
[18:27:53] <archivist> got your sunglasses handy? https://plus.google.com/photos/102358420595488787966/albums/5857519426057564721#photos/102358420595488787966/albums/5857519426057564721
[18:28:06] <ssi> something from the 80s or 90s with a crappy control, but already with ballscrews and motors
[18:28:18] <ssi> I don't really want to retrofit my 9x42 manual machine
[18:28:26] <rob_h> skunkworks, Hi
[18:28:51] <andypugh> archivist: Slightly scary
[18:29:06] <archivist> wernt me guv
[18:30:16] <cradek> needs a go-faster stripe
[18:31:18] <andypugh> Anodising.
[18:34:22] <ssi> http://atlanta.craigslist.org/atl/tls/3734649081.html
[18:34:29] <ssi> something like that maybe... but half that money :P
[18:35:18] <PetefromTn> ssi: You can pick up one of these Cincinatti VMC's for pretty cheap and I am already running bascially with brand new everything. It is a full blown VMC with toolchanger and rigid tap. Weighs about 7k...
[18:35:32] <ssi> how cheap is pretty cheap
[18:35:49] <PetefromTn> You'd laugh if i told you what I paid for mine....
[18:35:51] <JT-Shop> too much for dead iron
[18:36:02] <ssi> I paid $1000 for my HNC
[18:36:03] <ssi> so try me :)
[18:36:09] <JT-Shop> I paid that much for my VMC and it worked
[18:36:26] <PetefromTn> yup those Bridgports are nice but that is crazy high for that machine IMHO.
[18:36:33] <ssi> yeah it's way too mcuh
[18:36:51] <ssi> also 7k is just a bit too heavy to be convenient for me
[18:36:56] <ssi> I have a 5k forklift
[18:37:01] <ssi> but I guess I could strip it a bit on the trailer
[18:37:15] <PetefromTn> Meh weight is only bad when you move it in then it is just a nice addition.
[18:37:20] <ssi> yeah I know
[18:37:35] <PetefromTn> I moved it here with a rollback car hauler myself...
[18:37:40] <ssi> so how much did you pay? :D
[18:37:46] <andypugh> ssi: Cheaper: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Cincinnati-15VC-1500-Vertical-Machining-Center-VMC-/130894668258?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1e79ee21e2
[18:38:07] <PetefromTn> Wow that is a beast...
[18:38:16] <ssi> yea that's more machine than I want
[18:38:23] <PetefromTn> I paid $1300.00 for it plus moving....
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[18:38:32] <ssi> PetefromTn: that's in my budget :)
[18:38:34] <ssi> what kind of machine is it?
[18:38:48] <ssi> andypugh: Travels 60x26x25, 15HP, 480ipm rapids, cat 50 spindle taper, and 23,500Lbs, with full enclosure and chip conveyer
[18:38:49] <PetefromTn> Its a Cincinatti Arrow 500 vmc...
[18:38:52] <ssi> hahaha
[18:39:21] <andypugh> I have some 50-taper tooling you can have for postage :-)
[18:39:23] <ssi> PetefromTn: I'd jump on a deal like that if I could find it
[18:39:29] <PetefromTn> You'd need three phase for sure on that monster... My machine is running entirely on single phase...
[18:39:42] <ssi> I've been thinking about moving my shop to the airport
[18:39:45] <ssi> I have two and a half hangars
[18:39:51] <ssi> and 1.5 of them are on the end of the building where there's 3ph
[18:39:53] <PetefromTn> They are out there just keep searching...
[18:40:07] <ssi> PetefromTn: I decided I wanted an HNC, and I had one within about 2 months
[18:40:11] <PetefromTn> Another nice machine is a Fadal VMC15...
[18:40:20] <ssi> cradek and JT planted that seed in my mind
[18:41:04] <PetefromTn> Honestly I have a largish two car garage and it fits easily in here with room all around it to walk around and I can even pull my Pontiac Fiero GT project car inside if I want to right in front of it...
[18:41:35] <ssi> PetefromTn: yea but I have three lathes, two mills, a surface grinder, a horizontal bandsaw, and a 50x50" plasma table in mmy garage ;)
[18:41:49] <ssi> I need to get rid of my clausing
[18:41:53] <ssi> that'd be a good spot for a mill
[18:41:54] <PetefromTn> The travels are 20x20x20, again with rigid tap and toolchanger cat40 tooling...
[18:42:01] <ssi> yea that'd be perfect
[18:43:05] <PetefromTn> I have a decent sized manual lathe, a commercial tig unit, bandsaws, grinders, tables, compressor, etc etc.. in here and I can still pull my van inside to work on it if I need to.. We build my Daughter's Suzuki samurai Rock crawler in here too.,
[18:43:12] <ssi> nice
[18:43:24] <ssi> we should get together and tour each others shops :)
[18:44:08] <PetefromTn> I'd love to see your aircraft build, you'd probably have to wipe it all down by the time I left there from all the drool over it LOL...
[18:44:10] <archivist> hmm shop crawl.... have to tidy up!
[18:44:30] <ssi> yea definitely come check it out
[18:44:39] <ssi> we've got a lot of cool stuff going on at the airport
[18:44:50] <JT-Shop> hey guys, can you execute something in classicladder from g code like a M100?
[18:44:52] <PetefromTn> Yeah right now these coolant troughs and chip trays are all over the shop while I R and R them for leakproofnesskindasituation....
[18:44:53] <andypugh> This might be an interesting conversion: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Deckel-KF-12-duplicator-milling-machine-a-manual-cnc-/221047363368?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3377731728
[18:45:01] <ssi> my cherokee is there, my RV build, dan has a cherokee 6 he's working on an engine for, he's building an RV4 and a pitts S1
[18:45:07] <ssi> we've got five hangars between us
[18:45:13] <ssi> and he has an apartment above one of the hangars
[18:45:26] <ssi> it's down at tara, south of atlanta
[18:45:31] <PetefromTn> unmarried I assume LOL...
[18:45:32] <ssi> because he works at ZTL down there
[18:45:33] <ssi> yeah
[18:45:34] <ssi> heh
[18:46:18] <PetefromTn> I have often told my wife of the desires I have to try to build my own personal aircraft and she just laughs and says well you had better ante up heavy on the life insurance LOL...
[18:46:23] <andypugh> Though this is probably a better buy at 4x the price: http://www.ebay.com/itm/DECKEL-FP4A-CNC-VERTICAL-MILL-B28764-/360609684161?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item53f6031ac1
[18:46:25] <ssi> it's not that bad
[18:46:52] <ssi> andypugh: that's a good size for me, but beyond my budget
[18:47:03] <PetefromTn> My father was a private pilot and licensed but he never bought a plane...
[18:47:18] <andypugh> The copy-mil looked short on spindle power.
[18:47:20] <PetefromTn> Its too bad he was such an asshole we might have gotten along famously...
[18:47:23] <ssi> did you see my carbon panel?
[18:47:37] <PetefromTn> who?
[18:47:41] <ssi> you
[18:47:47] <PetefromTn> no whaddya mean?
[18:47:50] <ssi> sec
[18:48:11] <ssi> http://sphotos-f.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/p206x206/532469_953658599072_1742394259_n.jpg
[18:48:17] <ssi> http://sphotos-h.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/480379_956207496062_428749677_n.jpg
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[18:49:31] <PetefromTn> I think I could get her to go for one of these...http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qhR1zSw0kRo
[18:49:32] <Tecan> (qhR1zSw0kRo) "| Powered Parachute Flying Low |" by "Allen Bryant" is "Autos" - Length: 0:04:24
[18:49:39] <PetefromTn> That looks pretty sweet man.
[18:49:55] <ssi> heh you're much safer in an airplane :P
[18:50:01] <PetefromTn> I gotta go pickup my kids from school here now be back in a bit still gotta goo up this other trough....
[18:50:04] <ssi> oke
[18:50:57] <skunkworks> rob_h, Hi.. You did spindle orient with just a vfd - right?
[18:51:08] <rob_h> correct
[18:51:14] <rob_h> just in crappy Hz mode
[18:51:20] <rob_h> vector i bet would be easy as pie
[18:52:08] <ssi> http://www.ebay.com/itm/SUPERMAX-3HP-3-AXIS-CNC-VERTICAL-MILL-ANILAM-CRUSADER-II-CONTROL-42-X-9-/360647102346?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item53f83e0f8a
[18:52:16] <rob_h> but if i was todo it again, id probly pick a VFD that could do it all for you. for a single orient point
[18:53:11] <rob_h> mind u, would be intresting to see how the newer VFDs handle a PID input from linuxcnc, as i notice alot of them now can switch from Vector to Hz to get up the speed range
[18:53:38] <ssi> I tried to do PID control of my vfd and didn't have much luck
[18:53:42] <ssi> I think it's a TECO VFD
[18:53:58] <rob_h> but what motor? a standard induction probly would not respond to grate
[18:54:06] <rob_h> i have a proper Spindle motor hooked on the end
[18:54:17] <rob_h> mitsubishi in that case
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[18:54:23] <ssi> whatever the stock HNC motor is
[18:54:29] <ssi> I think it's just a 3ph induction motor
[18:54:43] <rob_h> yea if it was CHNC would of been fanuc spindle motor :)
[18:54:48] <ssi> right
[18:54:50] <ssi> servo
[18:54:53] <rob_h> skunkworks, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D6dGYsXAPIU
[18:54:54] <Tecan> (D6dGYsXAPIU) "EMC2 Spindle orientation with VFD" by "roberth270" is "Tech" - Length: 0:00:50
[18:55:10] <skunkworks> rob_h, :) http://www.cnczone.com/forums/pico_systems_motion_control_products/178756-spindle_orientation_pico_universal_stepper_controller.html#post1264982
[18:55:27] <skunkworks> If you wanted to add your 2 cents.. (Al isn't a linuxcnc fan..)
[18:55:58] <rob_h> yea i guessed that, been along time since iv been on cnczone
[18:56:42] <rob_h> id say if u want serov like contorl you will never get it from a VFD, i belive even a fanuc spindle drive cant give you it, they seem to chang to a servo drive unit to do it and switch back
[18:57:00] <ssi> one day I'll upgrade it to a servo spindle
[18:57:03] <ssi> for now it does ok
[18:57:04] <skunkworks> I think he needs it just for tool change
[18:57:16] <ssi> I can at least rigid tap and thread
[18:57:40] <rob_h> yea i mean old VFD or spindle drive as its called does ti all electronicly and holds very tight position hard to move it with out alot of force
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[18:58:40] <rob_h> looks like they have a pickup on the spindle side for position
[18:59:27] <ssi> what, the HNC? there's a spindle encoder, yes
[18:59:47] <rob_h> no what skunkworks linked too
[19:00:04] <ssi> oh sry
[19:00:32] <rob_h> ill have a read over it but depends how much that guy wants to mess around, like i said most vfds that can do closed loop vector can now do a single position stop if not more
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[19:00:58] <rob_h> as thats all a spindle drive seems todo also, change to vector mode.. but why they cost 10k+ over a 2k vfd i dont know
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[19:02:36] <rob_h> aah it says he is looking at closed loop vecotr drive with position stop, so easy
[19:02:55] <rob_h> the gear change will make it abit more tricky maybe
[19:03:17] <PetefromTn> kay back now... kids got homework LOL...
[19:04:50] <ssi> :)
[19:04:51] <PetefromTn> we talkin' VFD's... I got a Hitachi WJ200 on mine and I am still working on getting the parameters right, just installed it about a week and a half ago...
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[19:05:40] <skunkworks> I think pete wants to do the same thing.. (that rob_h has done)
[19:05:53] <skunkworks> orent the spindle for tool change.
[19:06:10] <rob_h> yea putting a reply now
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[19:06:41] <PetefromTn> The only funny thing about my Cincinatti actually is the spindle motor. It is 7.5HP 5.5kw and it runs up to 12k RPM motor speed. It is also a 50 hz motor and I have been working with Mike Kilroy trying to get it to run correctly like it did under the original control. It is a good motor but kinda loud when it is at full rip..
[19:07:44] <PetefromTn> He actually told me to take it out of vector mode because it works better with this VFD in regular mode apparently...
[19:09:02] <PetefromTn> Right now I am supposed to play with the settings to get it to pull 6 amps at 500 spindle RPM by playing with the input frequency settings until it outputs that which you can read on the display. I have been working on these damn chip trays for about a week and a half now so I have not even tried it yet.
[19:09:43] <PetefromTn> skunkworks: yeah man I want to have spindle orientation and just picked up a nice encoder for the motor I have to make a bracket to install it and get it wired up. Again Chip trays....
[19:15:02] <ssi> PetefromTn: it's a 3ph motor, and you're running it on single phase with a vfd?
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[19:21:06] <rob_h> skunkworks, i put a reply now hope it helps him i dont see him having any bad problems if he does his homework right :)
[19:21:33] <skunkworks> thanks rob_h and andypugh
[19:21:44] <skunkworks> :)
[19:21:48] <PetefromTn> ssi: sorry man I was just slinging some epoxy to the second coolant trough. Cannot mess around typing whle I mess with that...
[19:21:53] <ssi> no problem
[19:21:57] <ssi> I'm in no rush :D
[19:22:16] <PetefromTn> Yeah it is a three phase motor running on a three phase VFD derated to single phase input power by half...
[19:22:36] <ssi> I had a hard time finding VFDs bigger than 3hp that'd run on 1ph
[19:23:30] <PetefromTn> yeah you can get them up to 10HP and I almost bought one like that but after talking to the folks at driveswarehouse I picked up this Hitachi WJ200 in 15hp..
[19:26:13] <skunkworks> rob_h, he is using step/direction servo drives.. Shudder...
[19:26:29] <rob_h> realy
[19:26:37] <rob_h> repalced the fanuc motors with steppers... erm ok
[19:26:39] <PetefromTn> who is?
[19:26:43] <rob_h> must be big ones
[19:27:13] <skunkworks> rob_h, no - step/dir servo drive.
[19:27:18] <rob_h> aah sorry
[19:27:32] <skunkworks> again 'shutter'
[19:27:34] <skunkworks> ;)
[19:27:38] <rob_h> odd combo
[19:27:47] <PetefromTn> skunkworks: who are you talking about?
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[19:27:59] <rob_h> PetefromTn, http://www.cnczone.com/forums/pico_systems_motion_control_products/178756-spindle_orientation_pico_universal_stepper_controller.html#post1264982
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[19:40:34] <PetefromTn> so is RobH kudos?
[19:42:12] <PetefromTn> Okay dudes....Epoxy resin is DONE>.>
[19:44:22] <rob_h> ye
[19:45:43] <JT-Shop> yea
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[20:43:19] <gabewillen> How do you normally send floating point values in a binary serial packet
[20:44:06] <gabewillen> i know how to shift an integer to bits, but im curious how a decimal value is sent. Do i send the position of the decimal?
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[20:45:31] <t12_> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IEEE_floating_point#Basic_formats
[20:45:33] t12_ is now known as t12
[20:46:20] <t12> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single_precision_floating-point_format
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[20:49:09] <gabewillen> thanks for doing the search for me, i googled sending floating point values. But all that came up was Ascii
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[21:01:33] <andypugh> gabewillen: Just send the 4 or 8 byte of the FP value, then reassemble.
[21:04:21] <DJ9DJ> gn8
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[21:41:23] <gabewillen> thats what im going to do
[21:42:28] <gabewillen> multiply the floating point by 10 ^ x untill its an integer, the send that value and bit shift the integer value
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[21:53:43] <gabewillen> never mind that
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[22:42:39] <rootB> Hello, linux cnc.
[22:43:06] <rootB> I just bought a Desktop CNC (Shapeoko) and I'm looking for a tutorial to get the hang of it. There are a lot of concepts i don't know about.
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[22:50:19] <WalterN> why would my boss not like it if I didnt take any breaks?
[22:50:52] <cradek> rootB: can you ask something more specific?
[22:50:53] <WalterN> I cant fathom why the owner would not like it if the machines run longer
[22:52:35] <rootB> Cradek: a CNC tutorial for an absolute newb.
[22:52:45] <rootB> My goal is to mill PCBs, but i need to at least now the basics.
[22:55:29] <rootB> that's pretty much all i need.
[22:57:46] <gabewillen> There are plenty of tutorials for cnc beginners
[22:58:07] <rootB> do you know a really newb friendly one?
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[23:03:29] <andypugh> rootB: I thing jthornton has one somewhere. (that was me using his name in an attempt to wake him up)
[23:03:53] <rootB> oh
[23:04:39] gimpswork is now known as gimpspace
[23:04:42] <andypugh> But the basics are G0 is fast non-cutting moves and G1 is slow, cutting moves. Each take an X Y and Z with a number, and G1 takes an F for feedrate too.
[23:05:27] <rootB> Oh
[23:05:35] <rootB> i odntu nderstand terms like feedrate and such
[23:05:38] <rootB> that's what i want to learn
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[23:06:32] <andypugh> So, G0 X100 Y100 Z-2000 would be a rapid move to your basement, and expensive in cutters. G1 X1 Y1 Z1 F0.0001 would be a very slow move that would give you time to light the barbeque.
[23:07:18] <Tom_itx> :)
[23:07:33] <gabewillen> Maybe you should look into some machining books or tutorials first
[23:07:47] <gabewillen> learn the basics and terms
[23:07:50] <rootB> Yeah
[23:07:56] <rootB> That's the reason I'm looking for a tutorial
[23:08:06] <rootB> one that isn't "HEY KIDS HERE'S A GCODE IT DOES THIS, USE IT!"
[23:08:09] <andypugh> rootB: http://gnipsel.com/linuxcnc/g-code/index.html
[23:08:09] <Tom_itx> http://www.gnipsel.com/linuxcnc/index.html
[23:08:13] <Tom_itx> there
[23:08:22] <rootB> oh
[23:08:26] <rootB> I'm on windows, is there any problem?
[23:08:29] <Tom_itx> andy beat me to it
[23:08:39] <andypugh> Different url, same site
[23:08:40] <jdh> lots of problems
[23:08:41] <Tom_itx> other than it's windows, no
[23:08:49] <rootB> I guess i can use another CAD program?
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[23:09:30] <andypugh> rootB: You probably want a dedicated PC for the CNC controller anyway. Something cheap is fine.
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[23:09:40] <rootB> oh
[23:09:42] <rootB> i got a netbook
[23:09:44] <rootB> will that do it?
[23:09:52] <jdh> lots of problems
[23:09:55] <andypugh> Probably not.
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[23:10:16] <rootB> well i have 2 PCs
[23:10:18] <rootB> i guess i can use one for it
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[23:10:26] <andypugh> The netbook probably doesn't have any suitable output ports.
[23:10:42] <rootB> my CNC is arduino-powered
[23:10:44] <rootB> it has a USB
[23:10:53] <rootB> It's one of those desktops CNCs
[23:11:10] <andypugh> A lot of us just use a bare Atom motherboard ($80) in the same box as the rest of the electronics.
[23:11:22] <andypugh> Ah
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[23:11:38] <andypugh> USB and LinuxCNC do not mix.
[23:11:51] <rootB> oh
[23:12:00] <rootB> Well, at least i want to learn the tutorial
[23:12:04] <rootB> to learn the basic terms
[23:12:23] <andypugh> The gnipsel tutorial is still good for you, but LinuxCNC is not going to work with all your hardware.
[23:12:33] <rootB> oh
[23:12:39] <rootB> well im gonna read it
[23:12:49] <andypugh> LinuxCNC on a generic PC would sit where the Arduino is at the moment.
[23:13:03] <Tom_itx> you are trying to use adapted reprap softwrae
[23:13:08] <Tom_itx> software*
[23:13:36] <PCW> you can run the simulator on most any PC, though you need to install Linux
[23:14:53] <andypugh> To use LinuxCNC, put a cheap PC with a parallel port where the Arduino now sits. You now have a spare Arduino for other projects, your other PC is free to take where you want, and your CNC controller is far better than an Arduino could ever be.
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[23:19:20] <rootB> How much is a CNC controller?
[23:19:43] <Tom_itx> you can use a parallel port
[23:19:44] <jdh> check local craigslist for cheap computer
[23:20:18] <andypugh> LinuxCNC is a CNC controller. And it is free. So the answer to your question is $0
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[23:23:50] <rootB> oh damn
[23:23:58] <rootB> The question is how to plug a parallel controller into my machine
[23:25:15] <jdh> there are cheap pci cards that work.
[23:26:13] <SWPadnos> rootB, you will need to look at the way the Arduino is connected to things like motor drivers and limit switches. Once you know how it's wired, you can create a LinuxCNC configuration which mimics that on the parallel port (or several parallel ports, if you need more I/O)
[23:26:30] <rootB> Woa
[23:26:33] <rootB> now this sounds interesting
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[23:28:21] <SWPadnos> there's a tool called stepconf (which comes with LinuxCNC) which makes it easy
[23:28:47] <SWPadnos> just select which parallel port bits are to be used for what (unless you have strange needs, in which case you're on your own :) )
[23:30:32] <andypugh> OK, so I am selling a pile of semi-worthless junk on eBay, on the offchance that someone wants it. one penny starting price, no reserve. Someone has asked me "What is the least you will take"
[23:36:05] <andypugh> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/111061250684?ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1555.l2649
[23:39:47] <PCW> They want to offer less than a penny?
[23:40:43] <andypugh> Apparently. Or they are very stupid. Posibly both,
[23:41:33] <adb> R1 is an BMW ?
[23:43:48] <andypugh> Yamaha
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[23:45:37] <adb> thx
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