#linuxcnc | Logs for 2012-06-18

[00:00:21] <andypugh> I do actually have "onboard" installed. But I can't start it without a keyboard.
[00:00:29] <andypugh> Ah, no, wait..
[00:00:54] <ReadError> ssh in
[00:00:57] <ReadError> and disable login
[00:01:06] <ReadError> theres gotta be a flag or an option in the config
[00:01:16] <ReadError> bounce X
[00:01:27] <andypugh> I am ssh-ed in. But everything happens locally.
[00:02:36] <ReadError> so wait
[00:02:39] <ReadError> why wont vnc work?
[00:03:12] <andypugh> I have an onscreen keyboard. I could click my way to /usr/bin/onboard. (Which I located using ssh)
[00:03:24] <andypugh> VNC needs a password at both ends.
[00:03:36] <tjb1> cant you type the password and then copy and paste it?
[00:03:56] <andypugh> Ubu to Ubu that might not be the case, but the Mac VNC client requires a password at the remote end.
[00:04:13] <andypugh> I have the onscreen keyboard now, so I think I am sorted
[00:05:24] <tjb1> http://www.ebay.com/itm/RII-MINI-II-Touch-N7-Wireless-PC-Keyboard-Touchpad-DPI-EASY-TO-CONTROL-HTPC-/200774606201?pt=PCA_Mice_Trackballs&hash=item2ebf195d79&autorefresh=true#ht_500wt_1413
[00:05:28] <tjb1> There you go andy
[00:05:37] <tjb1> Oh nevermind, only ships to us
[00:06:34] <tjb1> I would buy it but I need to save all my money :/
[00:08:00] <andypugh> I just one-clicked the forst one.
[00:08:13] <andypugh> I have more money than I know how to spend :-)
[00:08:19] <tjb1> Lucky you
[00:08:39] <tjb1> http://www.amazon.com/Logitech-Wireless-Keyboard-Multi-Touch-920-003070/dp/B005DKZTMG/ref=wl_it_dp_o_pC_nS_nC?ie=UTF8&colid=3BK0O7D0X8N5Z&coliid=I10HDUEVWRZHPY
[00:08:45] <tjb1> that might have been a better choice :)
[00:11:42] <andypugh> I like the pad in the middle layout
[00:12:22] <tjb1> reviews werent too positive
[00:13:54] <andypugh> Ah well, we will see how it works out.
[00:14:01] <andypugh> Back in a bit, need to change users.
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[00:16:03] <tjb1> Anyone play xbox?
[00:17:20] <alex4nder> I use a PS3 controller on my mill
[00:22:41] <ReadError> tjb1, pc or bust
[00:22:55] <tjb1> over priced :P
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[00:33:55] <r00t4rd3d> i ordered one of these the other day, a friend has one. It actually has some metal in the design.
[00:33:55] <r00t4rd3d> http://www.ebay.com/itm/260854095120?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649
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[00:35:27] <r00t4rd3d> no stupid clicking keys either :)
[00:35:47] <r00t4rd3d> "Quiet-Type Key Technology"
[00:36:47] <ReadError> order the mount yet r00t4rd3d ?
[00:37:07] <ReadError> did you get it so you can draw ?
[00:37:12] <ReadError> that was my step1
[00:37:19] <ReadError> learning touchoff and where i need to be and stuff
[00:37:33] <ReadError> took a bit to get decent
[00:37:38] <ReadError> now i dont even think about it
[00:38:18] <alex4nder> ReadError: do you have a dial test indicator?
[00:38:27] <ReadError> ya
[00:38:31] <ReadError> i used that to get my backlash
[00:38:35] <alex4nder> when you get a minute, can you measure something for me?
[00:38:50] <ReadError> im in the basement kegging
[00:38:52] <ReadError> whats up
[00:39:36] <alex4nder> so if you take the DTI, chuck it up, and then measure the table at one extreme, and then move the table to the other extreme, what's your table slant?
[00:39:46] <alex4nder> and I mean, don't sweet the indicator
[00:39:49] <alex4nder> I mean leave it where it is
[00:40:05] <alex4nder> er sweep
[00:40:41] <r00t4rd3d> ReadError, i made one
[00:40:50] <r00t4rd3d> http://www.cnczone.com/forums/diy-cnc_router_table_machines/152794-mdf_madness-3.html
[00:40:51] <r00t4rd3d> last post
[00:41:05] <ReadError> hmmm
[00:41:08] <ReadError> let me try
[00:41:12] <r00t4rd3d> its currently drying
[00:41:16] <ReadError> its got a magnetic base lets see if it can stick to the spindle
[00:41:16] <r00t4rd3d> i just painted it
[00:41:32] <alex4nder> ReadError: so I ran into a bug in axis, and crashed my running spindle into the table.
[00:41:40] <r00t4rd3d> lol
[00:41:41] <alex4nder> and it had a nice 1/2" 4 flute mounted in it. ;)
[00:41:53] <alex4nder> so I got a nice 1/2" hole in my table
[00:41:57] <r00t4rd3d> limit switches!
[00:42:04] <alex4nder> how would that have fixed my problem?
[00:42:15] <alex4nder> it had a tool in the spindle
[00:42:18] <alex4nder> and I was doing setup
[00:42:21] <r00t4rd3d> set the limit so you cant crash into the table
[00:42:56] <ReadError> hmmm
[00:43:02] <ReadError> im not sure how to mount this thing alex4nder
[00:43:07] <ReadError> it wont stick to the spindle
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[00:43:12] <alex4nder> the spindle is aluminum
[00:43:12] <ReadError> let me try the z axis
[00:43:14] <r00t4rd3d> what t hing?
[00:43:16] <alex4nder> so if it's magnetic, it won't.
[00:43:19] <ReadError> ya
[00:43:26] <ReadError> i tried the thing behind it though
[00:43:31] <alex4nder> you can mount it to the column, the measurement will be the same
[00:43:34] <ReadError> the silver part the z goes up and down on
[00:43:37] <alex4nder> since I'm not measuring spindle slant.
[00:44:08] <alex4nder> r00t4rd3d: I'm not going to move my limit switches every time I stick a different length endmill into spindle.
[00:44:21] <alex4nder> maybe I'd do it with tool length, but I wasn't even there yet
[00:45:24] <alex4nder> ReadError: so I didn't measure it before I had the accident, but now I'm re-setting up the mill, and I'm seeing slant in my table
[00:45:37] <alex4nder> it might have been there all along.
[00:45:38] <ReadError> got it mounted
[00:45:41] <r00t4rd3d> my bits came with depth rings so i can keep them the same depth hopefully
[00:45:41] <ReadError> let me run it and check
[00:46:06] <alex4nder> r00t4rd3d: a limit ring only helps if all of your endmills are the same length.
[00:46:26] <alex4nder> which would limit your selection, or be really annoying to setup.
[00:46:34] <r00t4rd3d> ya i am going to stay with the same supplier
[00:46:43] <ReadError> alex4nder,
[00:46:48] <ReadError> 0.001
[00:46:52] <alex4nder> ok
[00:47:04] <alex4nder> so you just moved your table in Y, and that's the difference front-to-back?
[00:47:28] <ReadError> yea as far as i could measure
[00:47:31] <alex4nder> (I'm ignoring differences in cosine error)
[00:47:33] <alex4nder> ok
[00:47:34] <ReadError> its a bit offset
[00:47:36] <ReadError> since the mount
[00:47:54] <alex4nder> is it in-line with the Y axis though?
[00:48:04] <alex4nder> like, you're not measuring across the table
[00:48:11] <alex4nder> (diagnoal)
[00:48:14] <alex4nder> er diagonal
[00:48:34] <ReadError> im moving the long axis
[00:48:41] <ReadError> left/right keys
[00:48:45] <alex4nder> oh, no I mean front back
[00:48:55] <ReadError> that could be harder
[00:49:06] <ReadError> i can lift it up over the t slots i guess
[00:49:25] <alex4nder> it's got a round ball end right?
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[00:49:34] <ReadError> yea
[00:49:43] <ReadError> i can move it up
[00:49:44] <ReadError> hold
[00:49:50] <alex4nder> oh, are you using a dial indicator?
[00:49:54] <alex4nder> or a dial test indicator
[00:50:18] <alex4nder> god, the naming of that is so bad
[00:50:45] <ReadError> its a round thing with a springy shaft
[00:50:50] <ReadError> i dont know all the proper terms
[00:50:52] <alex4nder> ah, dial indiactor
[00:51:03] <alex4nder> that's a better measurement probably
[00:51:13] <ReadError> well
[00:51:15] <ReadError> seems to be the same
[00:51:18] <ReadError> all the way across
[00:51:24] <ReadError> maybe like 0.0005 difference
[00:51:26] <alex4nder> yah
[00:51:29] <alex4nder> ok, thanks dude
[00:51:35] <ReadError> how bad is yours off?
[00:51:40] <alex4nder> like .0005
[00:51:42] <alex4nder> er .005
[00:51:45] <alex4nder> it's off
[00:52:04] <alex4nder> side to side it doesn't move my measurement device
[00:55:12] <Tom_itx> last word indicator
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[02:02:05] <r00t4rd3d> i wonder how many black kids can skip fathers day?
[02:03:09] <Jymmm> O_o
[02:03:29] <Jymmm> r00t4rd3d: WTF?!
[02:04:14] <r00t4rd3d> opps i thought i was in #reddit
[02:10:12] <ReadError> </derp>
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[02:18:01] <r00t4rd3d> cant we all get a bong
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[02:29:27] <AitalMAC> It's possible to move axis instead of joints with a robot?
[02:29:47] <AitalMAC> all the robots i see in EMC2
[02:30:00] <AitalMAC> move joint by joint in manual
[02:30:04] <AitalMAC> and axis in automatic
[02:30:41] <AitalMAC> it's possible to move axis in manual too
[02:30:46] <AitalMAC> ?
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[02:31:34] <AitalMAC> or it's just something EMC can't do?
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[03:20:31] <tjb1> hello all!
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[03:45:23] <archivist> AitalMAC, http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Kinematics
[03:50:21] <archivist> and http://www.linuxcnc.org/docview/2.4/html/motion_kinematics.html
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[06:48:46] <DJ9DJ> moin
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[07:26:11] <DJ9DJ> re
[07:30:17] <Jymmm> oh
[07:31:00] <DJ9DJ> hi Jymmm
[07:31:08] <Jymmm> howdy
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[07:44:44] <Loetmichel> moin
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[10:12:31] <mrsun> cool never thought of that ... differential threads
[10:13:00] <mrsun> a higher pitch thread on the outside of a bolt with a threaded hole in the bolt with lower pitch, when screwed in, it will also screw in whats in the middle hold and you can get very low pitches of thread :P
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[12:46:16] <Jymmm> 9"x12"x2" Grade A (?) Surface plate $44 shipped http://www.woodcraft.com/Product/2004864/7535/Granite-Surface-Plate-9-x-12-x-2-A-Grade.aspx
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[12:50:26] <Tom_itx> hmm
[12:50:42] <Tom_itx> ours was B i think but was something like 3' x 6'
[12:51:08] <Jymmm> Is 'B' better than 'A' ?
[12:51:20] <Tom_itx> probably not
[12:51:23] <Jymmm> k
[12:51:29] <Tom_itx> but less expensive
[12:51:32] <Tom_itx> and still flat
[12:51:41] <Jymmm> and HUGE!
[12:51:49] <Tom_itx> we made big parts
[12:51:55] <Jymmm> $80 for a stone?! YEOW http://www.woodcraft.com/Product/2004486/17791/Norton-Combination-Waterstone-10008000-Grit.aspx
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[12:52:22] <Jymmm> 71
[12:52:44] <Tom_itx> what are we looking for today?
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[12:54:13] <Tom_itx> milled my new heatsink last night, will drill it later today
[12:54:20] <Jymmm> I was going to use utility knife blades for cutting (easy, cheap, available), but if I use planer knives instead I can cut multiple pieces at the same time. Was just seeing how sharp they really are.
[12:54:35] <Tom_itx> damn sharp
[12:55:06] <Jymmm> Which lead to sharpening videos, which lead to sharpening products.
[12:55:11] <Tom_itx> get one with an angled blade so the point contacts first and it will cut better
[12:55:32] <Tom_itx> paper cutters use a slicing motion
[12:55:45] <Jymmm> $14 from lowes for a 3.5" long pair
[12:55:49] <Tom_itx> the big ones anyway
[12:55:52] <Jymmm> Bosch I think
[12:56:15] <Tom_itx> what are you cutting?
[12:56:26] <Jymmm> plastic
[12:56:46] <Tom_itx> solid or tube?
[12:56:48] <Jymmm> can be cut with a utiliy knife razor blade
[12:57:09] <Tom_itx> make a jig to cut to length
[12:57:14] <Jymmm> Just got LOTS of them to cut =)
[12:57:17] <Tom_itx> use a single edge razor blade
[12:57:41] <Tom_itx> with a guillotine sp? type mount for the blade
[12:57:59] <Tom_itx> nice wood project for you
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[12:58:03] <Jymmm> That's what I've been using, but I can only cut one at a time. thus the planer knives instead
[12:58:34] <Jymmm> and a plastic anvil
[12:58:44] <Tom_itx> or a fiskars paper cutter with the round cutter blades
[12:58:56] <Tom_itx> they're inexpensive
[12:59:04] <Jymmm> too slow and it has a problem starting the bite
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[12:59:36] * Tom_itx heads off
[13:00:30] <jdhNC> paper guillotine and an air cylinder!
[13:00:43] <Jymmm> Tom_itx: I need about 5000/day
[13:00:57] <Jymmm> maybe higher
[13:01:20] <Tom_itx> rotary slicer with a stepper feed
[13:01:22] <Jymmm> jdhNC: Tried it, ends look fugly
[13:01:37] <Jymmm> Tom_itx: rotary doens't bite
[13:01:41] <Jymmm> easily
[13:02:02] <Tom_itx> feed it thru a tube
[13:02:24] <Jymmm> or, maybe I use planer knives instead!
[13:02:25] <Tom_itx> the rotary cutter is on the end of a tube
[13:02:35] <Tom_itx> like a fan blade
[13:02:43] <Jymmm> or razor blades at worse case ;)
[13:02:49] * Tom_itx leaves for real this time
[13:02:59] <Jymmm> Tom_itx: oh hell no! dman thing would probably shatter on me =)
[13:03:14] <jdhNC> http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/359779501/Electronic_Material_Plastic_Tube_Nylon_Rope.html
[13:03:17] <jdhNC> or buy one of those.
[13:06:07] <Jymmm> This is cheaper by $10,000 http://www.ebay.com/itm/Auto-Heat-shrink-tube-cable-pipe-Cutting-Machine-USG-/290513110259?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item43a3ee44f3 video here http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1-Hr3BLKKsw
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[13:07:43] <Jymmm> thats wher eI got the idea on using planer knives - sorta like a guiltin
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[13:09:09] <syyl_ws> what form has your plastic?
[13:09:11] <syyl_ws> sheet?
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[13:09:33] <Jymmm> tubing
[13:09:57] <syyl_ws> like a hotshrink tube?
[13:10:10] <Jymmm> thicker
[13:10:27] <syyl_ws> is it stiff in a round form?
[13:10:50] <Jymmm> sorta, but not really I can pinch it flat
[13:10:57] <syyl_ws> hm
[13:11:12] <syyl_ws> ever thought of a finetoothed carbide circular saw?
[13:11:13] <Jymmm> if i try hard enough
[13:11:30] <syyl_ws> that will give a very fine cut with no burr
[13:12:16] <Jymmm> no need; can cut with razor blade. planer knives are just longer and more durable
[13:12:17] <syyl_ws> and is easy to build and automate
[13:17:46] <Jymmm> I have the holder version of these, if you ever come across a pair get them! They use standard utility razor blades http://www.wolfcraft.de/jcatalog_generated/en/products/product_groups/1485_product.html
[13:17:55] <Jymmm> s/holder/older/
[13:19:14] <Jymmm> This is the pair I have (spare blades in handle along with hex wrench http://farm5.staticflickr.com/4034/4504020095_7946d5a81c_m.jpg
[13:19:50] <Jymmm> http://images.craigslist.org/5L55G75E93E83Gf3H3c5c4042f5d1151a1891.jpg
[13:20:20] <syyl_ws> hm, i have no use for such a thing
[13:20:30] <syyl_ws> but they hang around in every toolshop here
[13:20:39] <Jymmm> you would be surprised
[13:21:01] <syyl_ws> i cut everything plastic-like with the circular saw or bandsaw
[13:21:43] <syyl_ws> or my trusty knife ;)
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[13:25:39] <syyl_ws> we have one of those at work, to cut cable conduit
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[13:25:55] <syyl_ws> works ok
[13:26:00] <syyl_ws> but i prefer http://gtwr.de/qtl2_7.jpg
[13:26:00] <syyl_ws> ;)
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[15:20:39] <jdhNC> <urk>
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[16:07:18] <Cnc-Dau> hi
[16:07:37] <Cnc-Dau> can somebody explain to me how have I to connect 5 cables 12 V of step engine to Japanese tb6560 board (XA + XA-XB + XB-)?
[16:09:50] <jdhNC> you have a 5 wire stepper motor?
[16:09:55] <Cnc-Dau> yes
[16:10:11] <Cnc-Dau> 3 5wire stepper motors
[16:10:16] <Cnc-Dau> :-(
[16:10:37] <Tom_itx> http://www.divms.uiowa.edu/~jones/step/types.html
[16:10:56] <Tom_itx> figure out with an ohm meter what the primary windings are
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[16:16:49] <Cnc-Dau> This one http://www.electronicsurplus.com/Item/2906/APPLIED%20MOTION%20PRODUCTS%20INC%20-%20Motor_%20stepper_%2012V%204%20phase%200_16A%20_%20-%204017-838/
[16:17:53] <Tom_itx> that looks like a flippin original IBM full height floppy stepper
[16:18:21] <jdhNC> wonder if that date code is week/year
[16:18:39] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/motors/stepper1.jpg
[16:18:42] <Tom_itx> now doesn't it?
[16:20:11] <Tom_itx> i had mine working at one point so i know you can figure it out
[16:20:18] <Tom_itx> they're not very strong steppers though
[16:20:31] <Tom_itx> but it's my opinion that they are the same
[16:20:32] <Cnc-Dau> looks similar, mine look 1:1 like in my link.
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[16:22:51] <Tom_itx> the date code kinda gives it away too
[16:24:53] <Cnc-Dau> Date 36-84; 27-84; 27-84
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[16:25:23] <jdhNC> 28 year old steppers?
[16:25:33] <Tom_itx> probably
[16:25:46] <Cnc-Dau> i think so...
[16:25:56] <jdhNC> I hope you didnt' pay for them!
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[16:26:16] <Tom_itx> i got mine surplus from OEM equipment :)
[16:27:32] <Cnc-Dau> i've payd for the complete hardware without controller board
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[16:27:57] <Tom_itx> what are you gonna do with them
[16:27:58] <Tom_itx> ?
[16:28:22] <jdhNC> move something very light and very imprecise
[16:28:48] <Tom_itx> mine are still in a box somewhere
[16:28:54] <Cnc-Dau> i had mine working at one point so i know you can figure it out
[16:28:59] <Tom_itx> i did wire one up to figure out the wiring and make it step
[16:29:34] <Cnc-Dau> ups
[16:29:35] <Tom_itx> i wouldn't waste a gecko drive on it though :)
[16:29:49] <Cnc-Dau> engrave
[16:29:51] <jdhNC> as he said, figure out the pairs
[16:30:21] <Tom_itx> one of the wires could be a frame ground
[16:30:33] <Tom_itx> i don't remember now but i did get mine goin
[16:31:26] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/motors/stepper2.jpg
[16:31:31] <Tom_itx> there's another similar one
[16:31:34] <Cnc-Dau> black = common
[16:32:13] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/motors/stepper3.jpg
[16:32:16] <Tom_itx> and yet another
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[16:32:37] <Tom_itx> i think they were all pulled from full height IBM floppy drive of different eras
[16:32:51] <Cnc-Dau> red = coil 1
[16:32:57] <Cnc-Dau> Brown = coil 2
[16:33:06] <Cnc-Dau> green = coil 3
[16:33:15] <Cnc-Dau> white = coil 4
[16:35:19] <jdhNC> did you check resistance between them?
[16:35:23] <Cnc-Dau> I have no notion like I should measure out with the multimetre!
[16:36:05] <jdhNC> check resistance between red and the other three
[16:36:20] <Tom_itx> you will find 2 pairs
[16:37:49] <jdhNC> http://www.wimb.net/index.php?s=motion&page=52
[16:38:46] <Cnc-Dau> I have from everybody pin to everybody pin the same ones worth. only to the black he is restood lower
[16:39:05] <Cnc-Dau> boar, online translator......
[16:40:53] <Tom_itx> pcw_home hmmmm: http://www.mesasystemsco.com/
[16:42:43] <Tom_itx> just happened across that
[16:45:57] <pcw_home> Yeah Mesa Boogie, Mesa Electronics, Mesa Systems
[16:46:27] <jdhNC> just to put all those on the table
[16:46:29] <jdhNC> so to speak.
[16:48:47] <Tom_itx> will the real mesa please stand up?
[16:49:16] <Cnc-Dau> I have to go to the work. I contact later once again.
[16:49:20] <Cnc-Dau> bye
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[16:58:59] <IchGuckLive> HI all
[17:01:28] <sendoushi> IchGuckLive: hey hey!
[17:01:45] <sendoushi> already checked prices and requested discount on that german guy
[17:01:54] <sendoushi> we forgot something... pulleys and belts!
[17:02:00] <IchGuckLive> hi dis you ask your brother for parts
[17:02:05] <sendoushi> not yet not yet
[17:02:14] <sendoushi> for now checking around the web
[17:02:26] <IchGuckLive> you said you woudt try to go directdrive
[17:02:36] <sendoushi> :| haaam i did?
[17:02:51] <sendoushi> hm
[17:03:07] <sendoushi> but didn't you tell me that would be better with pulleys and belts?
[17:03:19] <IchGuckLive> as there is a TR x4 and halfstepping you are on 0.01mm per step direct no pullet needed
[17:03:36] <sendoushi> hm ok
[17:03:36] <IchGuckLive> it is up to you its more cost
[17:04:05] <sendoushi> and is there a significant improvement using pulleys and belts?
[17:04:15] <IchGuckLive> it wil add around 50euros
[17:04:20] <sendoushi> ohh
[17:04:26] <sendoushi> and what will improve?
[17:04:44] <IchGuckLive> smother and alitel better to fix the steppers
[17:05:24] <sendoushi> it's something i can always add or the lath on the TR is different?
[17:05:28] <IchGuckLive> as you see in the video its better to work with the components
[17:05:49] <sendoushi> well i have some margin for now...
[17:05:50] <IchGuckLive> no you can do this afterwards 2
[17:05:57] <sendoushi> maybe it's better
[17:06:04] <sendoushi> if i can do it afterwards
[17:06:26] <sendoushi> for now the price of everything including electronics without the MDF and Alu parts is = 379.53 €
[17:07:02] <IchGuckLive> with the 24V 320Wats powersuply
[17:07:13] <sendoushi> let me check...
[17:07:23] <sendoushi> damn forgot to list the link
[17:07:27] <IchGuckLive> 250Wats minimum
[17:08:06] <sendoushi> it's a kit...
[17:08:09] <sendoushi> that costs 150e
[17:08:13] <sendoushi> i'll show you in a bit
[17:08:19] <IchGuckLive> you said you are going for a Combination TV65+Steppers+power
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[17:08:29] <sendoushi> yep
[17:08:35] <sendoushi> that's the idea
[17:08:52] <sendoushi> shouldnt i?
[17:09:14] <IchGuckLive> up to you it may be cheeper the other way and better
[17:09:22] <sendoushi> the other way?
[17:09:51] <IchGuckLive> 3 epson eatch 15euros +35euro the supply
[17:10:04] <sendoushi> once again... where will i get the epson?
[17:10:09] <IchGuckLive> and the tb is 38 i guess alone
[17:10:21] <sendoushi> tb38 is inside the epson?
[17:11:07] <IchGuckLive> 23LM-C355-44W look on your ebay
[17:11:31] <sendoushi> i cant find anymore the 150e kit
[17:12:07] <sendoushi> is this better than nema23?
[17:13:16] <IchGuckLive> nema23 is the size
[17:13:26] <sendoushi> hm
[17:14:00] <IchGuckLive> yours may have 1,5Nm if! this got 3Nm at 24V 150RPM
[17:14:59] <sendoushi> and it costs less from what i know
[17:15:31] <sendoushi> then i need board and power supply right?
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[17:16:29] <IchGuckLive> sendoushi: Board http://www.ebay.de/itm/3-Axis-TB6560-CNC-Stepper-Motor-Schrittenmotoren-Driver-Controller-Board-/251075582215?pt=Motoren_Getriebe&hash=item3a75455907
[17:17:04] <sendoushi> so... the same
[17:17:32] <sendoushi> http://www.ebay.es/itm/Handle-Remote-Controller-for-3-Axis-Stepper-Motor-Driver-TB6560-/110893648716?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item19d1c6cb4c
[17:17:40] <sendoushi> ehehe seems pretty nice to me that price
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[17:18:28] <sendoushi> and now... the power supply
[17:18:52] <IchGuckLive> sendoushi: this is only the handle not the driver
[17:19:01] <IchGuckLive> for 16USD
[17:19:04] <sendoushi> is it?
[17:19:21] <sendoushi> oops
[17:19:22] <sendoushi> lool
[17:19:26] <sendoushi> my bad!
[17:19:41] <IchGuckLive> you do not need this
[17:20:01] <sendoushi> what about power supply? (while i search for the driver)
[17:20:28] <sendoushi> http://www.ebay.es/itm/High-quality-CNC-TB6560-3-Axis-Stepper-Motor-Driver-Controller-Board-with-fan-/261045316002?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3cc78369a2#ht_4015wt_1103
[17:21:00] <sendoushi> maybe i'll go with the link you gave me since it comes with some extra bundle
[17:23:52] <IchGuckLive> sendoushi: search for meanwell 24V 250W
[17:26:31] <sendoushi> i'll do
[17:26:47] <sendoushi> i cant find much on the ebay but...
[17:27:22] <sendoushi> what alternatives do i have?
[17:27:35] <sendoushi> the price without the mdf, alu and the power supply is now on the 320e
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[17:32:59] <IchGuckLive> Folks someone can tell me if the debounce is in the documentation
[17:33:14] <IchGuckLive> i want to debounce my parport pin 13 not
[17:33:34] <IchGuckLive> this is all homeswitch
[17:33:40] <pcw_home> man debounce
[17:35:57] <pcw_home> (this goes for all the comps BTW)
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[17:39:42] <IchGuckLive> i cand find anything in the integreator manual
[17:39:47] <mrsun> http://www.cedar--rapids.com/Industrial-Equipment-/Wellington-Heights-/Construction-Equiptment-/South-bend-lathe-adjustable-countershaft-adpic.PHP.jpg <-- casting one out of alu should be strong enough shouldnt it? :)
[17:39:55] <pcw_home> man debounce
[17:40:09] <IchGuckLive> there is just the definition
[17:40:09] <jdhNC> http://www.linuxcnc.org/docs/html/man/man9/debounce.9.html
[17:40:39] <mrsun> why not hardware debounce it? :)
[17:40:55] <IchGuckLive> also only the definition but no example how this work
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[17:42:01] <jdhNC> I pastebin'ed mine, but can't find the link offhand
[17:42:08] <syyl_> shouldnt be a problem, mrsun
[17:42:24] <psha> logger[psha]: .
[17:42:26] <pcw_home> How real time components work in general is in the HAL manual
[17:42:28] <pcw_home> how specific components work is in the components man page
[17:42:30] <IchGuckLive> the output can this be net home-all <=
[17:42:38] <mrsun> tho i think the one on the southbends are bent at the top, but i guess ill just make mine straight =)
[17:42:42] <syyl_> maybe go for ball bearings
[17:43:01] <mrsun> i will use ballbearings yes
[17:43:09] <mrsun> dont want more glide bearings then i need =)
[17:43:26] <mrsun> tho ballbearkings for 20mm shafts gets quite big ODs :/
[17:43:43] <syyl_> maybe needle bearings
[17:44:01] <syyl_> wait
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[17:44:11] <syyl_> i have the ina/fag catalog right here :D
[17:44:30] <mrsun> roller bearings has 52mm OD at 20mm shaft
[17:44:39] <syyl_> the smallest ballbearing has 20/32mm
[17:44:50] <mrsun> 42 on roller
[17:44:53] <mrsun> hmm
[17:45:33] <syyl_> needle bearings without a inner ring are 20/26
[17:45:40] <syyl_> but they need a hardened shaft
[17:45:45] <syyl_> to run on
[17:45:48] <mrsun> thin section bearings then ?
[17:45:59] <mrsun> found 20/27 on thin section bearings :P
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[17:46:16] <syyl_> but can they hold any load?
[17:46:28] <syyl_> thats a problem with those flimsy bearings :D
[17:47:21] <syyl_> i would cast the eyes for the bearings bigger
[17:47:35] <syyl_> to put a bit more substancial one in there
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[17:48:23] <A0Sheds> anyone ever try one of these low cost digital durometer testers? http://www.amazon.com/Durometer-Digital-Hardness-Tester-Battery/dp/B006NZQLVS/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&qid=1340041615&sr=8-6&keywords=durometer+tester
[17:48:58] <mrsun> with big housings i will surley need cores
[17:49:05] <mrsun> never done big castings nor used cores .. :P
[17:49:53] <mrsun> 20/47 i guess i can live with, but how thick would the housing walls need to be ?
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[17:52:06] <sendoushi> sorry IchGuckLive i had to leave for a while
[17:52:18] <sendoushi> have you said something while i was ogne?
[17:54:52] <IchGuckLive> do you think a 47nF capaciter will fix the problem to all-homeswitch insted of hal fixing
[17:54:58] <pcw_home> how long, how long has that evening train been ogne?
[17:55:24] <IchGuckLive> sendoushi: no
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[17:56:37] <pcw_home> probably a cap will fix it (depending on how stiff the pullup is and cap value)
[17:57:16] <sendoushi> i can't find that power supply damn :s
[17:57:17] <IchGuckLive> i will go with 10nF
[17:57:33] <IchGuckLive> 100nF =0.1yF
[17:57:57] <pcw_home> if you need to debounce a bunch of pins, software is probably easier (and immune to noise all the way up to the parallel port chip)
[17:58:45] <IchGuckLive> only one parport 13 not
[17:59:24] <pcw_home> not to hard in HAL either, only a couple lines
[17:59:50] <IchGuckLive> i know but no example shows homing
[18:00:05] <IchGuckLive> espechel home-all
[18:00:30] <sendoushi> IchGuckLive: can you please tell me more alternatives?
[18:00:55] <pcw_home> thats outside of the scope of debounce (it will work for any 'bit' signal)
[18:01:19] <pcw_home> debouce doesn't care what its debouncing
[18:01:26] <pcw_home> debounce
[18:01:27] <IchGuckLive> so "net home-all <= debounce.0.0.out "
[18:01:39] <IchGuckLive> does this work
[18:02:00] <IchGuckLive> if i loatrt debounce cfg=1
[18:02:04] <pcw_home> somthing like that
[18:02:06] <IchGuckLive> delay 200
[18:02:10] <pcw_home> and addf
[18:02:24] <IchGuckLive> yes also a tread
[18:02:32] <IchGuckLive> i try
[18:02:39] <pcw_home> like most HAL comps
[18:06:48] <sendoushi> http://cgi.ebay.es/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=110573320385&fromMakeTrack=true&ssPageName=VIP:watchlink:top:es#ht_2786wt_1165 but expensive
[18:09:51] <IchGuckLive> pcw_home: it is all only does the net home-all as it is discribed halbit take the debounce out or do i need a fake net name
[18:10:32] <pcw_home> I think you need a new net
[18:10:34] <IchGuckLive> sendoushi: this will fit more then you neede
[18:10:43] <sendoushi> but it's very expensive :s
[18:10:51] <sendoushi> and it's the only one i find
[18:11:09] <IchGuckLive> sendoushi: china has more
[18:11:21] <cpresser> sendoushi: i use those switching PSUs a lot. they are not that cheap, but the quality is okay
[18:11:24] <sendoushi> trying to find...
[18:11:27] <IchGuckLive> sendoushi: try to find your compleade 150USD box
[18:11:44] <sendoushi> the cnc kit i found on the other day?
[18:12:02] <IchGuckLive> cpresser: here also 30+ mashines no failu on the powersupply
[18:12:45] <IchGuckLive> pcw_home: thats the case and as it is defind halpin the home_is_shard depends on this
[18:12:53] <IchGuckLive> we will see
[18:12:59] <IchGuckLive> i try
[18:13:47] <IchGuckLive> what delay shoudt i use 200 or smaler pcw_home
[18:15:13] <pcw_home> what is your basethread period?
[18:15:34] <IchGuckLive> 25000
[18:16:08] <pcw_home> so 200 would be 5 ms delay, probably enough
[18:16:19] <IchGuckLive> ok
[18:16:38] <IchGuckLive> sendoushi: http://www.ebay.de/itm/3-Axis-CNC-TB6560-Stepper-Motor-NEMA23-Kit-24V-15A-Power-Supply-Mach3-New-/261025116743?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_77&hash=item3cc64f3247
[18:16:39] <pcw_home> depends on switches of course
[18:16:51] <sendoushi> IchGuckLive: close to that...
[18:17:20] <IchGuckLive> sendoushi: this woudt be best for you
[18:17:24] <sendoushi> w8 a sec...
[18:17:33] <IchGuckLive> as here al components are in
[18:17:35] <sendoushi> you told me those motors were better right?
[18:17:47] <sendoushi> the ones you gave me
[18:17:52] <sendoushi> the schrittmotor
[18:18:08] <pcw_home> Also depends if this is really for switch debounce or EMI rejection
[18:18:10] <IchGuckLive> yes but is best to stay for you with that i REthink
[18:18:37] <IchGuckLive> pcw_home: lets try and see
[18:18:48] <sendoushi> with those motors, the tb by itself
[18:18:56] <sendoushi> and the power supply that is expensive the 90e one
[18:19:03] <sendoushi> all goes for 170e
[18:19:11] <sendoushi> while the link you gave me is like 165e
[18:19:18] <sendoushi> so... for 5e...
[18:19:22] <sendoushi> what do you think? the kit?
[18:20:10] <IchGuckLive> this is a 0.9Nm motor so NO this is not Good
[18:20:32] <sendoushi> so the thing now is find a power supply
[18:20:37] <IchGuckLive> oh i need to go BY
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[18:21:16] <alex4nder> yoh
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[18:23:36] <mrsun> hmmm ... im not experienced enough with this :P
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[18:26:24] <sendoushi> http://www.ebay.es/itm/CNC-24V-15A-DC-Regulated-Switching-Power-Supply-360W-New-/150820718726?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item231d9d8886 is this good?
[18:29:37] <cpresser> sendoushi: looks like a chinese rippoff. but that does not mean the quality is bad :)
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[18:31:25] <alex4nder> the chinese probably made it in the first place
[18:31:56] <alex4nder> sendoushi: for that price, I'd just buy one from meanwell
[18:32:12] <sendoushi> the problem is ... where are the meanwell
[18:32:17] <sendoushi> i can only find for 90e!
[18:32:59] <alex4nder> dunno, I'm in the US
[18:33:30] <sendoushi> hm ok
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[19:07:19] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: Well, I guess it beats doing it completely by hand http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ST9cMOa96tU&feature=endscreen&NR=1
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[19:14:30] * Jymmm waits for JT-Play, JT-Beer, and JT-BBQ to arrive. THEN it's a party!!!
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[19:30:50] <Jymmm> Quiet in here today. Weekend hangovers or bad hair day Monday?
[19:35:21] <Loetmichel> <- dislocated a rib in sleep yesterday
[19:35:48] <Jymmm> Um, HOW?!
[19:35:51] <Loetmichel> got through the workday today with 150mg of diclofenac...
[19:36:06] <Loetmichel> not much drive to do anything this evening
[19:36:43] <Loetmichel> it happens from time to time, i think the joint to the spine is a bit damaged
[19:37:45] <Loetmichel> now i will have aboput a week of "knife in the back§ with every breath and then it will be good again.
[19:37:49] <Loetmichel> shit happens
[19:38:17] <Jymmm> duct tape em
[19:39:20] <Loetmichel> its only one rib, left short one
[19:39:35] <Loetmichel> which dislocates from time to time
[19:39:42] <Jymmm> then you won't need much duct tape
[19:40:01] <Jymmm> one or two rolls shoudl last you a life time
[19:40:13] <Loetmichel> my doc says: supress the pain and wait
[19:40:18] <Loetmichel> it will heal itself
[19:40:23] <Loetmichel> so i do
[19:40:25] <Loetmichel> ;-)
[19:40:28] <Jymmm> quack
[19:40:38] <Loetmichel> ?
[19:40:56] <Jymmm> It's more "I can't do anything for you, so suck it up!"
[19:41:12] <Jymmm> "that'll be $135 USD, pay at the door"
[19:41:29] <Loetmichel> he did: he wrote the recipe for the 75mg diclofenac pills ;-)
[19:41:45] <Jymmm> that's all they ever do.
[19:41:52] <Loetmichel> they are on prescrition in germany
[19:42:03] <Jymmm> Actually take away their Rx pad, and they're pretty much useless
[19:43:41] <Loetmichel> pad?
[19:43:47] <Jymmm> New Apple^h^h^h^h^h Big Pharmacutical company slogan... "There's a pill for that"
[19:44:01] <Loetmichel> you think my pahrmacist could read the handwriting of my doc?
[19:44:05] <Loetmichel> computer.
[19:44:15] <Jymmm> Loetmichel: the note pad they write the perscription on
[19:44:19] <Loetmichel> the prescriptions are printed
[19:44:55] <Jymmm> It's rare, I've only seen printed Rx in one place (other than hospitals)
[19:45:26] <Loetmichel> its a good thing, especially wiht my doc... his handwriting is wirse than mine
[19:45:47] <Jymmm> Loetmichel: Sure, it's really not THAT hard to read scribbly Rx most of the time. You just have to know what the limits are.
[19:45:49] <Loetmichel> i could get ANYTHING with a handwritten rx from him ;-)
[19:46:03] <jdhNC> never heard of diclofenac
[19:46:21] <Loetmichel> dont know the brand in the us
[19:46:41] <jdhNC> doesn't seem to be one.
[19:47:35] <Loetmichel> "active components: Diclofenac Na (75 mg per pill)"
[19:47:47] <Jymmm> Its an NSAID, Just think 800mg Imbuproferin
[19:47:59] <Loetmichel> nsaid?
[19:48:35] <Jymmm> NSAID = Non Steroidal Anti Inflamitory Drug
[19:48:59] <Jymmm> Motrin, Advil, etc
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[19:49:25] <Jymmm> most muscle relaxers are NSAIDs
[19:49:42] <Jymmm> It's just a "family" of drugs
[19:49:46] <Loetmichel> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diclofenac#Trade_names
[19:49:51] <Jymmm> soem OTC, some Rx
[19:50:13] <Loetmichel> its a very strong painkiller
[19:50:30] <Loetmichel> and especially for miscle/bone pain, not the headache varety
[19:50:33] <mozmck> Loetmichel: Is there a chiropractor you can go to? The ones that aren't quacks can usually put a rib back in place.
[19:50:33] <Loetmichel> variety
[19:50:45] <jdhNC> afaik, no muscle relaxors are nsaids
[19:50:50] <Loetmichel> mozmck: none that i am aware of
[19:52:10] <Loetmichel> i have lived through it without any painkillers in times
[19:52:23] <Loetmichel> but this time it got a bit worse than usually.
[19:52:29] <mozmck> I think a DO (doctor of osteopathy) can do it too.
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[19:53:12] <Loetmichel> its the classic "evrything is fine until i laugh"
[19:53:14] <Loetmichel> ;-)
[19:53:26] <Loetmichel> (or sneeze, or hiccup)
[19:53:38] <Jymmm> Loetmichel: THEN DONT DO THAT! =)
[19:53:40] <mozmck> oh, well don't laugh sneeze or hiccup!
[19:53:48] <Connor> Sharp pain in between shoulder blades?
[19:54:29] <Jymmm> jdhNC: http://www.drugs.com/diclofenac.html
[19:54:54] <Loetmichel> Connor: deeper
[19:54:59] <Loetmichel> short rib left
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[19:55:08] <Loetmichel> and right beside the spine
[19:55:28] <Jymmm> Loetmichel: poke it with a stick till theres no more pain
[19:55:42] <jdhNC> Diclofenac may cause life-threatening heart or circulation problems such as heart attack or stroke
[19:55:46] <Loetmichel> tried; doesent help ;-)
[19:55:46] <Connor> If I sleep wrong..I sometimes this Knife in between shoulder blades.. toward the right shoulder..
[19:55:56] <Jymmm> jdhNC: they all say that
[19:56:08] <Loetmichel> jdhNC: no problem
[19:56:16] <Loetmichel> i have a strom heart
[19:56:25] <Loetmichel> strong
[19:56:42] <Loetmichel> otherwise i would be dead a long time
[19:56:52] <Loetmichel> ... worked as an electrican for years
[19:57:08] <Loetmichel> about one "wakeup call" from the outlet per day ;-)
[19:57:43] <Loetmichel> and its 230V 50Hz over here, not the 110V plaything like in the us of A
[19:57:47] <Jymmm> jdhNC: Well, not all, but many. Ever hear the drug commercials, "may cause death"
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[20:04:26] <Jymmm> I want to mount a plastic/delrin wheel (cam) on a stepper motor to create an up/down motion. Anything I can put on it to prevent wear or flat spots on the outside of the wheel
[20:05:00] <Jymmm> or even something like an oversized bearing would be nicer
[20:05:10] <Jymmm> but cammed of sorts
[20:05:58] <Connor> Jymmm: What are you making ?
[20:09:29] <Loetmichel> make a round delrin part with a excentric hole fot the stepper shaft
[20:09:38] <archivist> Connor, pipe dreams
[20:09:58] <Loetmichel> and then use a piston rod in this to generate linear motion
[20:10:29] <Loetmichel> so you get less wear (if any) and if it wers it wears evenly, no flat spots
[20:10:33] <Jymmm> Loetmichel: That's what I'm planning, but I'm trying to reduce the wear effect on the outside of the wheel somehow.
[20:10:54] <Jymmm> archivist: There's is more truth in that, than you might think =)
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[20:19:14] <mrsun> gluing up the first part of my countershaft for the lathe =)
[20:19:16] <mrsun> yeey =)
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[20:32:36] <anonimasu> howcome there is no really fast 5 axis work done with emc?
[20:32:56] <Connor> what do you mean ?
[20:33:13] <anonimasu> I never saw someone do really fast contouring on 5 axis on a video with emc.
[20:33:36] <Connor> 5 axis machines are harder to come by?
[20:33:47] * anonimasu nods
[20:34:15] <Jymmm> think I saw one, but it wasnt your standard hardware
[20:34:16] <Connor> 3 axis is hard enough, 4 your strutting your stuff.. 5?
[20:34:39] * anonimasu has like 9 2kw servos on a shelve that has to be used
[20:34:45] <jdhNC> I'd have a hard time manually doing toolpaths for 4 axis
[20:34:46] <Jymmm> anonimasu: It wasn't a retrofit, but it was high end stuff.
[20:35:09] <Connor> jdhNC: What do you have that has a 4th axis ?
[20:35:15] <anonimasu> 32760pulses per rev :]
[20:35:37] <jdhNC> nothing yet. But when/if I do, no clue how I will get toolpaths
[20:35:38] <Connor> I'm looking for a DC motor /servo for my 4th axis.. 48v range...
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[20:36:19] <anonimasu> i'll do 3 axes now for the small machine then prep for 5 axis stuff, rotary and trunnion
[20:36:25] <Connor> Some 4th axis is setup to use the 4th as if it was the Y and just do engraving..
[20:37:06] <anonimasu> as to why I need 5 axes.. idk why :p
[20:37:08] <anonimasu> it'd be neat.
[20:37:08] <Connor> That could be done in ANY 2d or 2.5d CAM pakage
[20:37:10] <jdhNC> so isn't that really just 3 axis
[20:37:24] <anonimasu> like 300x500x300mm of travel
[20:37:40] <Connor> jdhNC: In that application yes. Unless they're doing other operations with it.
[20:38:18] <anonimasu> tho atm im speed limited to 2400rpm out of 3000 because of the drives :/
[20:38:25] <jdhNC> http://www.ebay.com/itm/220946034041
[20:39:25] <Connor> Would still need to mount a normal motor on it to do lathe work.
[20:39:39] <anonimasu> but with 5nm of torque.. continous
[20:39:42] <jdhNC> vs. just using a lathe for lathe work?
[20:40:01] <anonimasu> and 10nm peak stall torque
[20:40:14] <Connor> well. If it was fast enough.. I would have a CNC lathe then too .:)
[20:40:36] <jdhNC> mount the 7x on the bed
[20:40:52] <archivist> you just mill round no need to turn
[20:41:06] <anonimasu> like 0.08 seconds from end to end of the y axis.. at rapid..
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[20:41:23] <anonimasu> actually les
[20:41:23] <anonimasu> s
[20:41:33] <Connor> jdhNC: I've played around with that. Would just be better to have a small 4th axis unit like that to mount onto the table.
[20:41:56] <anonimasu> 0.12 seconds for the x axis.
[20:42:15] <jdhNC> someday.
[20:42:27] <jdhNC> I have 8 years of college to pay for over the next 5 years
[20:42:38] <Connor> jdhNC: Yup. For now, I just want to get the stepper covers on it.. and get it enclosed.
[20:42:50] <Connor> and get the rest of my limit/home switches installed.
[20:43:05] <Jymmm> jdhNC pay it off in 3 years, become a hooker!
[20:43:11] <JT-Shop> sounds like more ramin noodles for you jdhNC
[20:43:29] <Connor> jdhNC: More like less dive trips. :)
[20:43:46] <jdhNC> yeah, this might be my last one for a while.
[20:44:00] <Jymmm> jdhNC: with that kollage djumakashun, you can even be a high class hooker =)
[20:44:10] <jdhNC> though, I am stopping off to sell some teeth on the way down. I'm hoping that will make a dent in the first semester
[20:44:33] <Connor> jdhNC: You fill tanks for fellow divers?
[20:44:46] <Connor> jdhNC: Not that you can make a ton of $$ off of that.
[20:44:51] <jdhNC> not really, too much liability.
[20:45:22] <jdhNC> I get helium and O2 via a friend that puts them in with his company tanks so I fill his.
[20:45:42] <Jymmm> jdhNC: give tours?
[20:46:07] <jdhNC> Jymm: sure. for $50, I'll give you a tour of my garage!
[20:46:10] <Tom_itx> ok those are heavy boxes
[20:46:21] <Tom_itx> was a control for a UV unit
[20:46:31] <Jymmm> jdhNC: No I mean dive others tours of the places your dive to
[20:46:40] <Jymmm> give others
[20:46:59] <Jymmm> jdhNC: Become an underwater tour guide
[20:47:11] <Jymmm> jdhNC: then you can still dive, and get paid for it.
[20:47:51] <Connor> Jymmm: Number one rule: Don't turn your hobby into a Business, you'll regret it.
[20:47:52] <jdhNC> I can't imagine diving with anyone that would pay for a guide.
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[20:48:14] <Tom_itx> try the caymen islands and you will see alot of them
[20:48:21] <jdhNC> my last nnn dives here have been collecting teeth
[20:48:24] <Jymmm> Connor: too true
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[20:49:07] <Jymmm> jjdand you dont think an amature/hobbiest diver/archiologist wouldn't want to see that?
[20:50:33] <jdhNC> they could just call up one of the local dive charters and go see.
[20:50:51] <jdhNC> I only take people I know and trust on my boat.
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[20:54:38] <Jymmm> jdhNC: Fine, then back to the educated hooker =)
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[20:55:43] <Jymmm> jdhNC: Since you dive, you're in shape and have the stamina, so now it's just a matter of finding filthy rich lonely widows =)
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[20:56:42] <andypugh> You missed out "gullible"
[20:57:22] <Jymmm> andypugh: No, if they are filthy rich, they know what they are getting into.
[20:57:40] <andypugh> There's the problem though.
[20:58:02] <Jymmm> what problem?
[20:58:14] <andypugh> The woman I am pursuing might be considered a widow, as her boyfriend killed himself.
[20:58:19] <andypugh> Thinking about it.....
[20:58:50] <Jymmm> andypugh: But you're looking at it from a LTR, not a night of bliss
[20:59:23] <andypugh> I have been pursuing for 6 years.
[20:59:49] <Jymmm> could be a widower, or even a filthy rich divorcee
[21:00:19] <Jymmm> andypugh: Well, if you are still pursuing after six years, it might be time to move on
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[21:02:38] <DJ9DJ> gn8
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[21:08:54] <andypugh> Don't be daft. If I succeeded how would i ever find time for my CNC hobbies?
[21:09:12] <Jymmm> hahahaha
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[21:09:41] <andypugh> Having an actual girlfriend would be far too much trouble. But chasing keeps my hind-brain quiet.
[21:09:46] <JT-Shop> time for that will creep back as the years pass
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[21:14:24] <andypugh> I am already fairly old, you know.
[21:16:15] <Jymmm> andypugh begot Moses
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[21:18:57] <tjb1> What the hell is the point of a distributor if its shipping direct from manufacturer…
[21:19:41] <Jymmm> The manufacture doesn't have the deal with customer that are whining about distributors =)
[21:20:07] <tjb1> Just another person to add money to the final cost...
[21:20:25] <tjb1> Who sells 3"x3" extrusion besides 80/20 and automation4less
[21:22:13] <tjb1> Msc too expensive...
[21:22:23] <Jymmm> ebay
[21:22:52] <tjb1> Ebay is more than the distributor
[21:22:59] <tjb1> So is amazon
[21:24:13] <tjb1> McMaster is even more expensive...
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[21:26:36] <JT-Shop> tjb1: frame world
[21:26:55] <tjb1> Lookin now
[21:26:59] <tjb1> Any luck on laptop?
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[21:28:18] <Jymmm> tjb1: http://search.ebay.com/?sass=8020inc&ht=-1
[21:28:21] <tjb1> You have to call them to get a price?
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[21:29:38] <JessicaRN> I'm getting a fireball rig from a friend of mine (he doesnt use it anymore). can anyone point me in the right direction to go from cad to a solid part using this rig? I have access to Mach3. I also have 123d, creo, and a very old autocad
[21:29:42] <JessicaRN> i'm going to be cutting wax and then casting parts.
[21:30:07] <andypugh> Sounds like fun.
[21:30:28] <andypugh> But I don't thinl _any_ of those bits of software can do CAM.
[21:31:20] <tjb1> *tjb1: Ebay is more than the distributor [5:22pm]*
[21:31:26] <tjb1> Already been there Jymmm
[21:31:29] <andypugh> CAM (computer aided manufacturing) is the software which converts the 3D model to G-code (ie, individual machine moves)
[21:32:01] <toastydeath> plus you don't have to really know anything about stuff because everything comes out all "auhfduhadfkjhfgluglhjguhlghuhng
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[21:32:31] <andypugh> JessicaRN: One possibility is HeeksCNC, which you can download for free.
[21:33:08] <JessicaRN> thx andy, i know mach3 can drive the steppers using the gcode, but i am missing the cad to gcode part
[21:33:32] <JessicaRN> heeksCNC? is it any good? can it handle complex geometry?
[21:33:46] <andypugh> JessicaRN: There is actually a #cam but I think everyone on there is here too.
[21:34:00] <tjb1> No one talks in #cam :)
[21:34:07] <andypugh> http://code.google.com/p/heekscnc/
[21:34:15] <andypugh> I don't know, I have never tried it.
[21:34:23] <JessicaRN> what are all the rapid prototyping ppl using to generate their gcode?
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[21:35:11] <andypugh> The amateurs tend to use Skeinforge. But that solves a subtly different problem
[21:35:31] <andypugh> There is _lots_ of CAM software if you have deep pockets.
[21:35:37] <JessicaRN> it still needs to make gcode, doesnt it?
[21:35:55] <andypugh> But it is a field with few customers, and it makes them money, so the software tends to be expensive.
[21:36:40] <JessicaRN> so, what are ppl using?
[21:37:01] <JessicaRN> most of us diy'ers dont have deep pockets
[21:37:16] <andypugh> JessicaRN: Yes, Skeinforge makes G-code, but it only has to deal with one tool, and simply draws slices of the part. Subtractive machining (routing/milling) tends to make different types of moves.
[21:37:41] <JessicaRN> yeah, and deals with tool widths
[21:37:46] <tjb1> everyone closes at 5 pm :/
[21:38:13] <andypugh> So far, I tend to write the G-code by hand, or use SheetCAM. But I am making engineering components, not art-parts.
[21:38:34] <Jymmm> ark parts <ducks>
[21:38:44] <JessicaRN> what is the best opensource g-code generator out there?
[21:38:51] <andypugh> I am guessign that if you are investment casting you are making sculpture/jewellery?
[21:39:00] <JessicaRN> yeppers
[21:39:27] <tjb1> Our records indicate that you have requested and not received the following information. This request has been forwarded to the 80/20 distributors in your area for processing.
[21:39:41] <JessicaRN> I can also swap the head on this for some type of extruder, but i also want to do milling
[21:39:42] <tjb1> Yeah cause the lazy ass distributor doesnt want to deal with me...
[21:39:47] <andypugh> JessicaRN: A big list here. http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Cam
[21:40:47] <JessicaRN> thx again, andy. from your experience, which tool is the goto piece of software?
[21:41:07] <andypugh> But I think HeeksCNC is closest to workable. I am not at all sure about the CAD part, I didn't particularly like it.
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[21:41:48] <andypugh> This is probably worth a look too: http://www.mecsoft.com/freemill.shtml
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[21:42:54] <andypugh> Not open source, but zero-cost
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[21:43:07] <JessicaRN> i'm assuming that I can do the cad work in about any contemporary app and just export/import it to the cam tool. is this correct?
[21:43:33] <andypugh> For an open-source toolchain I think I would use free-CAD for modelling then import into Heeks
[21:43:44] <tjb1> http://www.ebay.com/itm/80-20-T-Slot-Aluminum-Extrusion-15-S-1530-x-18-5-N-/330706485788?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4cffa4821c#ht_1351wt_1180
[21:43:54] <tjb1> Distributor quoted me $14 for the same exact piece...
[21:44:04] <andypugh> Yes, there are enough file formats that that is fine. You lose the modelling information, but not the shape.
[21:45:27] <JessicaRN> ok. i've got creo and 123d. both of these seem more than capable of doing the parts I need. do you see any problem with these?
[21:45:48] <andypugh> I know nothing about either.
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[21:46:07] <JessicaRN> creo is the new name for ProEngineer
[21:46:26] <andypugh> Ah, OK.
[21:46:29] <Tom_itx> ProE isn't free
[21:46:37] <JessicaRN> no, but creo is
[21:46:45] <andypugh> Blender might suit?
[21:46:49] <JessicaRN> you are limited to 60 parts
[21:47:01] <JessicaRN> 60 parts per model
[21:47:22] <JessicaRN> i've never used blender. it outputs stl?
[21:47:34] <andypugh> I don't know, but I think so.
[21:47:46] <andypugh> Rhino3D is also popular.
[21:48:01] <JessicaRN> rhino is not free, is it?
[21:48:13] <andypugh> There is a big difference between "direct modelling" CAD and Parametric CAD.
[21:48:15] <tjb1> Draftsight :)
[21:48:18] <tjb1> 2d ftw.
[21:48:39] <JessicaRN> what is the difference?
[21:48:43] <andypugh> No, €195 for a student, €995 otherwise. So very not-free
[21:49:11] <JessicaRN> what is the difference between direct modeling and parametric?
[21:49:40] <andypugh> Paramtric CAD is all about "extrude this simple shape this far, drill a hole here, extrude this profile from that face by 10mm". Direct modelling lets you grab points and corners and pull them about.
[21:49:56] <andypugh> Sort-of the difference between milling and scultping with clay.
[21:50:11] <andypugh> And, the full spectrum between exists too.
[21:50:24] <andypugh> Google Sketchup isn't awful.
[21:50:51] <JessicaRN> ok
[21:50:55] <JessicaRN> i gotcha
[21:51:20] <JessicaRN> alright. i'll look into the tools you suggested. Thanks a bunch!
[21:51:54] <JessicaRN> ciao!
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[21:52:36] <andypugh> I probably ought to try out blender. It looks like fun
[21:53:30] <tjb1> That the one where you pull points around?
[21:53:44] <Tom_itx> andypugh would solidworks be considered Parametric CAD?
[21:53:51] <andypugh> Tom_itx: Yes
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[21:53:54] <andypugh> As is Inventor
[21:54:00] <Tom_itx> but not acad
[21:54:06] <Jymmm> ProEnginner
[21:54:09] <andypugh> Inventor Fusion blurs the border, as that is direct modelling
[21:54:54] <tjb1> Wonder if I can request the 8020 demo van and have them bring my order with them :D
[21:55:09] <andypugh> Don't go looking at me like I am some sort of expert! I just felt that I knew a little more than JessicaRN!
[21:55:28] <Tom_itx> i'm going to quote what you say as gospel
[21:56:20] <Jymmm> Tom_itx: He does predate Moses, so ....
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[21:57:53] <Tom_itx> no wonder he likes boating so much.. he was on the ark
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[22:04:18] <andypugh> That reminds me: What are the recommended feeds and speeds for Gopher Wood? I have given up on it ever stopping raining here.
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[22:12:28] <tjb1> Ah wonderful
[22:12:39] <tjb1> My bachelors degree is going to cost me $82k
[22:12:52] <tjb1> Thats without all the interest
[22:13:10] <tjb1> Probably 90k when I am done :P
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[22:14:23] <andypugh> Yikes! I got paid a grant to do mine. I think I prefer that
[22:15:26] <tjb1> I got about half off my first 2 years
[22:15:31] <tjb1> these last 2 have all been on loans
[22:16:44] <jdhNC> I'm still paying off my MS
[22:17:41] <tjb1> If I could go back…I would have tried to get into MIT
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[22:18:11] <jd896_laptop> hi all
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[22:19:05] <Jymmm> There are some that are not even bothering with getting a degree these days
[22:19:33] <jdhNC> I'll be paying for (most of) my kids now.
[22:19:35] <andypugh> Jymmm: There always have been?
[22:19:49] <tjb1> I think I would be better off with an MIT degree :P
[22:20:01] <tjb1> Seems like they actually do all the worthwhile stuff too
[22:20:08] <jdhNC> some don't
[22:20:16] <cylly2> Jymmm: $me for example
[22:20:17] <jdhNC> some live in the media lab and never bathe
[22:20:19] <Jymmm> andypugh: This is a group/organization; they focus on career/startup things instead
[22:20:58] <tjb1> Holy balls, 40 k a year...
[22:21:14] <cylly2> as we get in germany no longer "dipl. Ing" but common "bachlor/master" i see no gain in hanging me a degree on my wall
[22:21:23] <Jymmm> instead of the 2-4yr college, it's business directly
[22:21:45] <andypugh> Sounds like bargain to sit in the media lab and never bathe. It's about the same as it costs to sit in a boat and race round the world, and never bathe.
[22:21:55] <Jymmm> these are not your average persons
[22:22:05] <jdhNC> nah, sitting in a boat costs a lot more.
[22:22:18] <Jymmm> jdhNC: cost you what $8000 USD ?
[22:22:21] <Jymmm> err andypugh
[22:22:26] <Jymmm> andypugh: cost you what $8000 USD ?
[22:22:44] <jd896_laptop> quick one can an input be net'd to more than one pin eg to link to ui as well as an input signal?
[22:22:48] <andypugh> Yes, for the Pacific. The full round-the-workd race is 12 months and 40k
[22:22:58] <jdhNC> not counting the boat
[22:23:10] <andypugh> jd896_laptop: Yes.
[22:23:14] <Jymmm> jdhNC: boat was included =)
[22:23:23] <Jymmm> andypugh: was food included?
[22:23:28] <andypugh> jd896_laptop: Or maybe no
[22:23:30] <jdhNC> oh, you pay to be crew on someones boat?
[22:23:43] <Jymmm> jdhNC: that's what andypugh did back in aprilish
[22:23:44] <andypugh> jd896_laptop: I might have misunderstood the question
[22:24:01] <jd896_laptop> hmm im getting a already linked to error
[22:24:01] <jdhNC> heh... I just try to get people to share fuel cost
[22:24:17] <andypugh> Fuel? What's that?
[22:24:29] <Jymmm> jdhNC: around the world sailing race
[22:24:33] <jdhNC> it's what runs the generator
[22:24:49] <andypugh> jd896_laptop: If you want to net two outputs to one input, you need to combine them with OR2 or AND2
[22:25:02] <Jymmm> NAND
[22:25:16] <andypugh> We don't have a NAND.
[22:25:23] <Jymmm> wth not?!
[22:25:24] <jd896_laptop> otherway round one input to two outputs
[22:25:56] <Jymmm> andypugh: ya always need a NAND =)
[22:26:30] <andypugh> jd896_laptop: That's the same way round
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[22:27:32] <jdhNC> on a more important note, anyone have a Galaxy Note?
[22:28:00] <Jymmm> is that the big screen phone?
[22:28:05] <jdhNC> 5.3"
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[22:31:08] <cylly2> only a dell streak
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[22:43:12] <Nick001-Shop> Can a regular permanent magnet dc motor be controlled like a servo motor with linuxcnc?
[22:44:12] <jd896_laptop> does it matter if one is a pyvcp
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[22:47:55] <JT-Shop> can you run a chain saw in reverse with the chain backwards?
[22:48:27] <andypugh> Nick001-Shop: Yes. If you add an encoder
[22:48:40] <JT-Shop> ok
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[22:49:17] <andypugh> JT-Shop: 2-stroke or 4-stroke?
[22:49:28] <JT-Shop> diesel
[22:49:47] <andypugh> You have a diesel chainsaw?
[22:50:14] <andypugh> Anyway, the question remains, 2-stroke or 4-stroke?
[22:50:34] <JT-Shop> yea, it's a bit heavy but made from an old Deutz engine
[22:51:26] <JT-Shop> does seem to have intake and exhaust valves
[22:51:50] <andypugh> I think that persuading the injector pump to work in reverse might be a problem.
[22:52:05] <andypugh> And you would need to change the cam timing.
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[22:52:10] <JT-Shop> yea that may be a bit an issue
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[22:52:22] <andypugh> And if it has an oil pump, you would need to get clever with that potentially
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[22:52:47] <JT-Shop> well I guess I just leave it as a uni-tasker then
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[22:54:14] <Nick001-Shop> andypugh - can i put the encoder on the spindle that it's driving with a 2/1 ratio?
[22:54:16] <Nick001-Shop>
[22:54:28] <andypugh> Nick001-Shop: Yes
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[22:54:53] <andypugh> Te ratio doesn't even matter
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[22:55:51] <JT-Shop> http://imagebin.org/216989
[22:56:49] <Nick001-Shop> I'm trying to direct tap a hole with this along with a servo driving the slide with the tapping spindle on it
[22:57:40] <andypugh> Nick001-Shop: That should be possible. You need an encoder on the spindle too, of course.
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[22:59:24] <Nick001-Shop> the spindle is driven by this dc motor in question - spindle will have the encoder on it rather than the motor.
[23:02:07] <andypugh> Ah, in that case, on the spindleis where it needs to be.
[23:07:55] <Nick001-Shop> Thanks for the info - I'll go forward with this project. Will mesa drive this type of unit? I'll have 3 drilling and 1 taping with an indexing spindle holding the part.
[23:08:39] <andypugh> I would imagine that Mesa have some combination to drive almost anything.
[23:09:09] <andypugh> You could probably do it all with a parallel port, if you wanted a challenge.
[23:10:25] <JT-Shop> we were thinking of mounting two chain saws on my buddies jeep bumper to clear a path for Fords to follow...
[23:10:32] <Nick001-Shop> I'll have to check with them after I have more of these heads finished. Would parallel port count fast enough?
[23:11:05] <Tom_itx> har har
[23:12:08] <Nick001-Shop> I thought parport was for steppers
[23:12:37] <andypugh> Nick001-Shop: You can use it for low-count encoders, or slow moving axes.
[23:12:41] <Tom_itx> no, there is a mesa card (7i43) that is driven off the parallel port
[23:12:57] <andypugh> and you can generate PWM (albeit fairly slow PWM) to control a servo
[23:13:14] <andypugh> Tom_itx: No, I wasn't meaning that.
[23:13:36] <andypugh> It is (juat about) possible to run a servo system from the parport.
[23:14:07] <andypugh> http://emergent.unpythonic.net/projects/01142347802
[23:14:11] <andypugh> As an example
[23:18:34] <Nick001-Shop> I guess I should try it out - Sounds like I've got a lot more learning to do - and I thought I was done with the Hardinge -)
[23:20:43] <andypugh> Ah, no, you might as well accept that you won't be making things any more, you will be makming better and better CNC machines that you could make things with. But will be too busy to.
[23:22:44] <Nick001-Shop> This unit is to cross drill and tap the timing belt pulleys and spur gears that I make for a living
[23:23:56] <Jymmm> heh
[23:24:40] <Jymmm> Nick001-Shop: I know someone that made their own tapping machine for production purposes
[23:24:54] <Jymmm> very creatively I might add.
[23:25:08] <Nick001-Shop> any info or links
[23:25:43] <Jymmm> Nick001-Shop: It's semi automatic, all from drill presses
[23:25:51] <Jymmm> not sure if you want to go that route
[23:26:44] <Nick001-Shop> no - building an all in 1 unit - I already do drill presses - too much handling
[23:27:59] <Nick001-Shop> a 2 drill head unit to drill the holes - drill presses to countersink and the tap with tapping heads
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[23:29:02] <Jymmm> Nick001-Shop: 1.5 seconds http://www.arrowantennas.com/sams/sam17.html
[23:29:31] <Jymmm> Nick001-Shop: http://www.arrowantennas.com/shop/shop.html
[23:30:35] <Jymmm> Nick001-Shop: http://www.arrowantennas.com/sams/sam.html
[23:33:15] <Jymmm> I like that he came up with a simplified solution
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[23:40:04] <Nick001-Shop> I just need something to cut down the # of times I handle the same part.
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[23:48:39] <elmo40> get someone else to do it for you?
[23:48:56] <Nick001-Shop> how so?
[23:50:19] <roycroft> walk up to the person and say "please do this for me!" :)
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[23:54:25] <Nick001-Shop> Time to go - Dinner
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