#linuxcnc | Logs for 2012-05-25

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[00:37:41] <Tom_itx> ping
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[00:37:41] <JT-Shop> atom1: don't need a base period with the 5i25 or 5i20
[00:37:41] <JT-Shop> there is no default anything iirc
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[00:44:22] <Tom_itx> thanks for that andypugh
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[00:46:03] <JT-Shop> Tom_itx: you see my reply?
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[00:46:15] <Tom_itx> no
[00:46:21] <Tom_itx> got lost in the netsplit
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[00:48:45] <Tom_itx> logger[mah]
[00:48:46] <logger[mah]> Tom_itx: Log stored at http://linuxcnc.mah.priv.at/irc/%23linuxcnc/2012-05-25.html
[00:49:27] <Tom_itx> zlog
[00:49:27] <zlog> Tom_itx: Log stored at http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~tom-itx/irc/logs/%23linuxcnc/2012-05-24.html
[00:50:10] <Tom_itx> ok
[00:50:25] <Tom_itx> andy suggested it's not needed on mesa boards
[00:50:48] <Tom_itx> or is it just the 5i20 5i25?
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[00:52:31] <JT-Shop> no base period is needed with a 5i25 or 5i20
[00:52:46] <JT-Shop> I think any pci board for sure
[00:54:49] <Tom_itx> well this is a 7i43 parport one
[00:56:15] <JT-Shop> don't have a clue, but you might just look at the sample configs that Seb made for the 7i43
[00:56:50] <Tom_itx> i've had this working, i'm just comparing notes
[00:58:49] <JT-Shop> ok
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[01:04:41] <JT-Shop> well I got that part of the post processor working so I'm calling it a night
[01:04:47] <JT-Shop> say goodnight Gracie
[01:05:56] <Tom_itx> later
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[02:15:44] <jymmm> Can anyone think of a reason why sunflower seeds might corrode a galvanized trash can they were stored in?
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[02:16:51] <Tom_itx> are they acidic?
[02:16:58] <Tom_itx> are they salted?
[02:17:05] <jymmm> raw, unsalted
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[03:10:23] <skunkworks__> linoleic acid
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[03:18:22] <r00t4rd3d> http://imgur.com/a/2E7Lw
[03:18:25] <r00t4rd3d> soon
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[05:08:55] <archivist> r00t4rd3d, what stops the router bracket being pulled off the vertical slide, it looks like just the Z screw
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[05:31:07] <Connor> archivist: Looks like he's using some sort of V groove setup.
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[05:34:49] <archivist> hard to see
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[05:39:09] <jymmm> he's using these roller skate bar things
[05:40:03] <archivist> except if he was the two plates on Z point the wrong way
[05:40:56] <jymmm> Oh, I though you menat on X
[05:41:23] <Connor> looks like two bearings with a small spacer in the middle
[05:46:06] <jymmm> http://imgur.com/a/bSVs9
[05:46:34] <jymmm> http://imgur.com/a/yBVvz
[05:47:33] <archivist> jymmm, Z is the problem not those
[05:47:56] <jymmm> archivist: Keep your panties on, I'm still scrolling thru the logfiles
[05:54:13] <jymmm> Bah, I thought we talked about it and had a closeup photo, but can't recall the the day nor the conversation to grep for it
[05:58:40] <archivist> select * from logs where user like 'r00%'and message like '%imgur%'; much easier
[05:58:59] <archivist> 31 rows at that I give up
[06:00:48] <jymmm> I looked thru the links he had since April 12, it wasn't there
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[06:01:32] <jymmm> does he have another nick he goes by?
[06:02:07] <archivist> dont think so
[06:05:32] <jymmm> I know I saw the bearing setup as I commented on it.
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[06:10:46] <jymmm> Heh, old #emc logs from 2009-2012, 811 files, 50MB =)
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[06:48:36] <Loetmichel> mornin'
[06:48:46] <DJ9DJ> moin
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[07:53:15] <mk0> how to split spline on lines (not arcs?
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[08:05:50] <archivist> mk0, are you trying to write some cam program/algorithm?
[08:08:23] <mk0> yep. xy-uv
[08:12:02] <archivist> I would go to my "numerical recipes" book and get one of them, I did that for a graphing program I did many years ago, but...I had to use more than one and merge the results due to the lack of range of them
[08:13:45] <archivist> also they are likely in Graphics Gems (source is on the web)
[08:16:32] <archivist> http://www.nr.com/
[08:20:13] <archivist> ew buggers want money
[08:21:19] <archivist> at least the graphics gems code download is free http://tog.acm.org/resources/GraphicsGems/
[09:07:02] <alex_joni> jymmm: still around?
[09:08:45] <alex_joni> jymmm: there is a translation which is pretty accurate: For. a concrete mixer I used a recipe of 3 buckets of sand, one and a half cement, 7-10 l water depending on how wte is sand and foam. Recipe for foam is 3% foam agent diluted in water (theoretically). Basically we used 50 ml per liter of water, ie 5% and for a batch I used 1.5 l of 5% solution. Of course, if you put more cement the stronger the concrete will be, but I don't thi
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[09:26:08] <archivist> methinks this ruling applies to the EMC characters too http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-18198110
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[10:07:39] <r00t4rd3d> archivist, the bearings hold it.
[10:07:48] <r00t4rd3d> on the aluminum angle
[10:09:18] <r00t4rd3d> http://imgur.com/a/2E7Lw
[10:10:29] <r00t4rd3d> I got the idea from this guy:
[10:10:29] <r00t4rd3d> http://letsmakerobots.com/node/21754
[10:15:48] <archivist> ok your pic didnt really show the ally at 45 deg so you could use the corner
[10:16:25] <r00t4rd3d> http://seriousrobotics.files.wordpress.com/2010/07/dsc00615.jpg
[10:16:34] <alex_joni> archivist: the general idea was that they probably don't have a case, but we don't have the energy, money or knowledge involved to pursue a legal way
[10:16:53] <r00t4rd3d> i am actually quite surprised how rigid it is.
[10:16:56] <alex_joni> so basicly we chickened out, because it's easie rand less problematic for the project
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[15:56:39] <Aero-Tec> r00t4rd3d: looking good
[15:56:52] <Aero-Tec> let us know how well it works
[15:57:13] <Aero-Tec> do not forget to make some video of it working
[15:57:32] <Aero-Tec> would be cool to see just how well it works
[15:58:07] <Aero-Tec> also are you going to try cutting some aluminum?
[15:58:28] <Aero-Tec> would love to see a video of that if it can cut it
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[16:12:42] <skunkworks__> Aero-Tec: so far so good?
[16:23:59] <archivist> I am still waiting for reply to Aero-Tec checking his stepper timing setup
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[16:27:32] <Aero-Tec> so far not so good
[16:27:54] <Aero-Tec> hope to get to the timing thing in a few minuets
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[16:28:07] <Aero-Tec> dealing with the book keeper right now
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[16:54:57] <jymmm> alex_joni: Thanks, I had translated it already, but was hoping you would be able to find out what brown goo he used =)
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[16:57:59] <jymmm> the issue with 'EMC' was probably that we had better websearch rankings than EMC Corp did, and since we are in no direct commercial competition, they went the legal nudge way.
[16:59:34] <jymmm> Hell, we still have like 5th on google when searching for 'emc' =)
[17:00:30] <jymmm> alex_joni: Did we "give up" the domain by chance?
[17:00:43] <jymmm> oh wait, we never had it
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[17:02:16] <archivist> we just never challenged them registering emc we could have invalidated it
[17:02:48] <ScribbleJ> I think linuxcnc is a better name anyhow.
[17:02:49] <jymmm> Nothing saying we couldn't revert back.
[17:06:55] <jymmm> Trademarks are per category... data storage != CNC
[17:08:06] <jymmm> Could even do EMC v2, EMC v3, etc
[17:08:29] <jymmm> peope would still abbr it as EMC and piss em off again =)
[17:08:50] <archivist> machine control software is in the same category
[17:09:48] <jymmm> Too generalized, specifically EMC Corp is a data storage company, not a robotics one.
[17:10:38] <jymmm> Just Like I could register 'Ford' and make pancakes as a trademark
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[17:11:58] <IchGuckLive> it is as it is and need to be acepted linuxcnc is the better name
[17:12:31] <jymmm> IchGuckLive: Don't have to accept a damn thing actually.
[17:13:09] <pcw_home> I like LinuxCNC better as well but my fingers dont
[17:13:09] <IchGuckLive> why is linuxcnc damm we all love it
[17:14:02] <IchGuckLive> as we power up tonns of movements like that in witchita
[17:14:54] <jymmm> IchGuckLive: And what do you say when you see it move tons of metal? Daaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaamn! ;)
[17:17:01] <IchGuckLive> yeh B) O.O
[17:17:26] <jymmm> Hell, EMC is still listed for us.... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EMC
[17:18:21] <ReadError> Following discussions with the EMC Corporation it has been decided to rename this application LinuxCNC.
[17:18:51] <jymmm> ReadError: And your point is?
[17:19:32] <ReadError> just lame on their part...
[17:19:55] <ReadError> they should make einstein change his formula too
[17:22:08] <jymmm> Here is one of their trademarks, it's listed under that 'good and services' categroty http://tess2.uspto.gov/bin/showfield?f=doc&state=4005:6uuivi.2.1
[17:22:49] <jymmm> Here's another for 'sporting goods' http://tess2.uspto.gov/bin/showfield?f=doc&state=4005:6uuivi.2.2
[17:23:16] <ReadError> but theirs is EMC^2
[17:23:29] <ReadError> not sure why they cared that this project was named emc
[17:23:35] <jymmm> Here is 'EMC^2' for a church http://tess2.uspto.gov/bin/showfield?f=doc&state=4005:6uuivi.2.9
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[17:24:05] <Connor> How did end up back on this topic? :)
[17:25:16] <ReadError> jymmm: im showing 2nd
[17:25:19] <ReadError> for EMC on google
[17:26:04] <jymmm> And an Inusrance Company http://tess2.uspto.gov/bin/showfield?f=doc&state=4005:6uuivi.2.22
[17:26:40] <IchGuckLive> jymmm: why are you so abset about this ?
[17:27:05] <IchGuckLive> keep cool and choin the developing future
[17:28:21] <jymmm> I think archivist may be a tad frustrated at the change far more than I am.
[17:29:31] <jymmm> I understand the whole thing, it's not about principal, but of dollars.
[17:29:42] <Connor> I'm not happy that a large corp can bully around a open source project.. I had a company come after mine claiming crap over IVDC.. I've owned the .com of that since 96..
[17:29:47] <Connor> and they were much newer..
[17:29:52] <IchGuckLive> ther is no need to be in that shape as we 95% are happy with that
[17:30:28] <jymmm> IchGuckLive: No your not, you've just accepted it is all.
[17:30:48] <IchGuckLive> as you speek
[17:31:58] <jymmm> Here is how it is... If the Board decided to get the trademark 'EMC2', there is not a damn thing EMC Corp could do about it.
[17:32:39] <jymmm> err Registered Trademark that is
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[17:39:57] <jymmm> Now, THIS would piss em off... register 'EMC2' as the name of a commercial prison... Y S 045 A 6/4/09 Penal services, namely, providing prisons
[17:40:08] <jymmm> http://tess2.uspto.gov/netahtml/manual.html
[17:40:38] <Aero-Tec> archivist: I did put in gecko 320 in the stepwiz
[17:40:43] <jymmm> Those are the categories you have to register a trademark under, and you have to pay for EACH cateogry =)
[17:40:46] <Aero-Tec> so the setting should beright
[17:40:58] <Aero-Tec> going to check them now
[17:41:40] <IchGuckLive> Aero-Tec: the G320 drives your servo at Step/dir ?
[17:43:16] <jymmm> archivist: WOOHOO.... "EMC2" registered as "Y S 045 A 4/22/10 Prostitution services in the state of Nevada" LOL
[17:44:02] <IchGuckLive> jymmm: what do they provide ?
[17:44:18] <jymmm> Enhanced Male Climax 2
[17:44:25] <jymmm> hahahahaha
[17:49:04] <jymmm> Hmmm, one significant category... Y S 037 A 5/7/09 Providing technical support, namely, technical advice concerning the installation, repair and maintenance of electric or electronic apparatus, equipment and devices used for automated or partly automated industrial operations
[17:52:34] <jymmm> N S 042 A 11/26/09 Software development and product development in the field of {indicate subject matter or field(s)}
[17:52:45] <IchGuckLive> hey folks i try to find a good place to store the airfoil wing data g-code generator
[17:52:57] <jymmm> wiki
[17:53:21] <IchGuckLive> whoudt it be best under USING Linuxcnc undenetth the converting tools ?
[17:53:29] <Aero-Tec> IchGuckLive: servo with step & dir
[17:53:37] <IchGuckLive> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?LinuxCNCKnowledgeBase
[17:53:59] <IchGuckLive> o under advanced examples ?
[17:54:01] <jymmm> IchGuckLive: what are you asking?
[17:54:12] <jymmm> oh, catergory.
[17:54:23] <andypugh> Maybe http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Simple_LinuxCNC_G-Code_Generators
[17:55:19] <IchGuckLive> andy there is alot of stuff there
[17:55:21] <jymmm> andypugh: I dont see that under the CONTENTS page
[17:55:37] <Aero-Tec> archivist: here is the info
[17:55:39] <andypugh> Its under "Using Linuxcnc"
[17:55:42] <Aero-Tec> setp stepgen.1.steplen 1
[17:55:44] <Aero-Tec> setp stepgen.1.stepspace 0
[17:55:46] <Aero-Tec> setp stepgen.1.dirhold 35000
[17:55:47] <Aero-Tec> setp stepgen.1.dirsetup 35000
[17:55:51] <Aero-Tec> looks wrong
[17:55:57] <Aero-Tec> but what do I know
[17:55:59] <Aero-Tec> lol
[17:56:17] <Aero-Tec> not sure where to find step time
[17:56:39] <Aero-Tec> oops
[17:56:45] <Aero-Tec> never mind
[17:57:05] <Aero-Tec> step len would be step time I would guess
[17:57:22] <jymmm> IchGuckLive: Yeah, new category under ADVANCE
[17:57:48] <jymmm> andypugh: I only say that because the generators already there are dev by one person iirc
[17:57:50] <IchGuckLive> jymmm: i thing andy is wright
[17:58:25] <IchGuckLive> <_ im Sammel Lothar
[17:58:42] <IchGuckLive> from germany
[17:59:03] <IchGuckLive> i will fit it between 12 and 13
[17:59:48] <jymmm> ic if you know this and already contribed previously, why did you even ask?
[18:00:03] <jymmm> IchGuckLive: if you know this and already contribed previously, why did you even ask?
[18:00:32] <jymmm> I do think that page is getting long though
[18:01:02] <IchGuckLive> as it is most for foam XYUV mashines
[18:01:26] <jymmm> creae a new sub category then
[18:02:17] <IchGuckLive> BUT alot of scale model plane builders are also working with laser or wood cutters for the 3mm pices of that
[18:02:30] <jymmm> then you can expand/add to "Foam Cutting" in the future
[18:02:47] <jymmm> My laser doesn't do 3D =)
[18:03:18] <jymmm> IchGuckLive: General cateory to me would be "Foam Cutting"
[18:03:38] <jymmm> or "Hot Wire Foam Cutting"
[18:04:06] <jymmm> That's what I've used to sell the foam cutters I've made.
[18:04:50] <IchGuckLive> did you see my 5axis
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[18:12:37] <archivist> Aero-Tec, your steplen looks way too short
[18:14:08] <archivist> this page tells you how to set for your latency etc http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?TweakingSoftwareStepGeneration
[18:14:34] <archivist> see bottom paragraph
[18:15:51] <archivist> and the page I linked the other day which has some example values, but your latency may effect the values
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[18:32:11] <Aero-Tec> what time base does EMC use?
[18:32:47] <Aero-Tec> us, ms or something else?
[18:33:22] <IchGuckLive> howto Change the $MaxPost on the wiki ?
[18:33:30] <Aero-Tec> with the 3500 number it has it looks to be us
[18:33:40] <andypugh> No, it's nS
[18:35:17] <Aero-Tec> oops, that was what I meant
[18:35:19] <Aero-Tec> ok
[18:47:41] <IchGuckLive> done airfoilgenerator online NOW
[18:48:03] <IchGuckLive> someone can check the download of the zip Please ? ! :D
[18:50:14] <Connor> were did you put it ?
[18:51:26] <Connor> found it.
[18:51:36] <IchGuckLive> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Simple_LinuxCNC_G-Code_Generators#Airfoil_G_code_Generator_3_4Axis_XY_XYUV_Foam_EDM_Style
[18:51:37] <Connor> pulled it down just fine..
[18:52:06] <IchGuckLive> THANKs and off for me today its getting late !
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[19:00:02] <andypugh> https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/izs9EehSiBmY_omIxaSJBtMTjNZETYmyPJy0liipFm0?feat=directlink
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[19:02:04] <alex4nder-> hey
[19:02:26] <Connor> andypugh: What is that? encoders ?
[19:02:51] <andypugh> Yes, custom made by a local laser-cutting place. They have a 25um beam.
[19:03:21] <Connor> damn. Why does the one have the external tabs?
[19:05:31] <jymmm> *sigh* It's so frustrating that you have to order product based upon ROI of the shipping costs.
[19:05:58] <Connor> jymmm: ?? What you ordering ?
[19:06:09] <cradek> andypugh: very neato
[19:06:40] <jymmm> Stuff by the pound that cost $8/lb, and the shipping is $7 for 1 to 4 lbs
[19:07:40] <jymmm> err $7/lb
[19:08:16] <djdelorie> andypugh: sweet. How many lines?
[19:08:31] * djdelorie needs to mill a 60-line encoder to measure lathe RPM
[19:11:22] <alex4nder-> djdelorie: what diameter?
[19:11:59] <djdelorie> doesn't matter, I just want something one-shot to see how fast my lathe runs, and 60 lines means I can use Hz on my multimeter as RPM directly
[19:12:09] <djdelorie> probably cut an old CD then paint it black
[19:12:12] <alex4nder-> nice
[19:14:15] <archivist> djdelorie, measure rpm whatever next...fast as possible and no chatter and the chips fly nicely is another measurement :)
[19:14:45] <andypugh> 512 lines, 2048 counts, 46mm ID
[19:15:01] <andypugh> The tabs are to fit between rotor magnets.
[19:15:40] <andypugh> djdelorie: What sort of lathe?
[19:15:46] <djdelorie> archivist: it's a 1922 south bend lathe. four-step pulley and 3:1 back gear
[19:15:55] <djdelorie> http://www.delorie.com/photos/southbend-lathe/
[19:16:09] <andypugh> Well, there you are. Gear-tooth sensor on the main gear. Job done.
[19:16:21] <archivist> I think we have a closet southbend club in here :)
[19:20:00] <djdelorie> how many teeth on the main gear? Any clues? The drive gear on the gearbox end is 16 teeth, eventually I could add a small MCU/LCD box to show RPM "on the fly"
[19:21:36] <andypugh> I wouls use the big one at the chuck end
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[19:22:27] <djdelorie> assuming I can find a decent mounting spot. It's got a cover over the whole thing
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[19:23:02] <archivist> a zero crossing detector, monostable and filter and use a dvm, calibrate to any gear qty
[19:23:23] <andypugh> djdelorie: http://pico-systems.com/bridge_spindle.html
[19:23:50] <djdelorie> sweet!
[19:24:23] <andypugh> http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/ATS667LSGTN-T/620-1328-2-ND/2042753
[19:25:08] <andypugh> For extra credit, file the corner off of one tooth, then re-code the "encoder" module to use the missing tooth as an index. (Actually, I might do that)
[19:25:29] <andypugh> gear + missing tooth worked on cars for decades.
[19:25:33] <djdelorie> I am *not* filing any teeth off an antique lathe ;-)
[19:25:46] <andypugh> You only need to make one slightly shorter.
[19:25:59] <andypugh> And only partial width.
[19:26:04] <theorbtwo> Cut a new gear, then modify that one?
[19:26:09] <andypugh> It doesn't interfere with the gear action.
[19:26:24] <theorbtwo> Paint the gear black, except for one tooth, and use reflection?
[19:26:27] <Tom_itx> sounds like a matter of principle
[19:26:31] <andypugh> Bur, if you prefer, use a second sensor on a keyway for index.
[19:29:13] <djdelorie> I could superglue a tab to the gearbox-end gear, too, and use an optical decoder. *Adding* bits is OK, but I can't easily replace any of these gears - they all have custom bearing angles on them
[19:29:15] <cradek> andypugh: cars engines only turn one way with a fairly high minimum speed...
[19:29:34] <djdelorie> and yes, it's a matter of principle ;-)
[19:29:55] <cradek> andypugh: for threading I think your plan would work, but you probably wouldn't want to tap with it
[19:29:57] <archivist> djdelorie, is the "bolt" for setting over the tailstock original? looks a bit long
[19:30:18] <andypugh> They are starting to add quadrature detectors now, so that cars with start/stop features can start more quickly (they can fire without seeing an index)
[19:30:34] <djdelorie> http://www.delorie.com/photos/southbend-lathe/img_2548.html - I think all the "set" is on the long side, so that's how much movement you have
[19:30:50] <andypugh> But yes, I am just thinking about threading and CSS for parport users who are short of pins.
[19:31:10] <Tom_itx> wow i bet that thing is older than JT-Shop
[19:31:17] <cradek> is it true that some have no starter motors to spin up? they know absolute position so they just start firing?
[19:31:31] <archivist> djdelorie, mine dont stick out at all, but I do have the taper turning attachment
[19:31:31] <andypugh> Not that I know of.
[19:31:34] <cradek> hmm
[19:31:37] <djdelorie> 1922 - it's 90th birthday was earlier this month. http://www.delorie.com/photos/southbend-lathe/original-ledger-entry.html
[19:31:41] <cradek> heard that somewhere, might be bogus
[19:31:50] <andypugh> Well, I know of one vehicle that does that, the 1916 Dennis I drive.
[19:31:58] <JT-Shop> what thing
[19:32:01] <djdelorie> archivist - I don't have a taper attachment
[19:32:10] <Tom_itx> djdelorie's lathe
[19:32:41] <andypugh> So it is definitely possible. It would work with direct-injection spark-ignition engines.
[19:33:12] <Tom_itx> set up for overhead drive shaft drive
[19:33:15] <cradek> would it work to just inject and fire without any compression?
[19:33:42] <Tom_itx> or so it appears
[19:33:50] <archivist> cradek, I have seen a Rolls Royce start without use of the starter or staring handle or being pushed etc, the driver flicks the advance retard on the steering wheel
[19:34:13] <andypugh> cradek: It works on the Dennis, but that is 4:1 compression. I don't know if that matters.
[19:34:23] <djdelorie> cradek: on tugboat engines, the engine computer fires 200 PSI air into the various cylinders, in the right sequence, to get the engine moving enough to start it
[19:34:30] <andypugh> archivist: They need to turn on the trembler coil too.
[19:34:36] <cradek> djdelorie: wild
[19:34:50] <djdelorie> ear protection is required if you're in the engine room when it happens
[19:35:18] <archivist> air staring is entertaining :)
[19:35:18] <andypugh> The Dennis can sometimes start that way after an hour or two, but generally needs a few turns of the handle to fill the cylinders.
[19:35:30] <JT-Shop> djdelorie: what kind of engine is it?
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[19:35:52] <djdelorie> the kind that just barely fits on a railroad flatbed car
[19:36:04] <andypugh> But as there is no way to hand-crank a 9-litre engine fst enough to get the magneto working, trembler-start is the only way.
[19:36:07] <JT-Shop> EMD?
[19:36:28] <djdelorie> I have no idea about the details. I just remember the stories and what it looked like
[19:37:11] <archivist> andypugh, unless you have a flick magneto (stationary engines often have them)
[19:37:13] <JT-Shop> EMD is what they use in locomotives, boats and rigs for diesel electric
[19:37:47] <djdelorie> tugboats are direct drive, not electric. These are deep-sea tugs, not harbor tugs
[19:37:47] <JT-Shop> up to 20 cylinders at 645 cubic inch per cylinder... I use to work on them is why I know
[19:37:55] <JT-Shop> ah ok
[19:38:04] <Tom_itx> cylinder diameter?
[19:38:12] <JT-Shop> on the EMC?
[19:38:16] <Tom_itx> yeah
[19:38:19] <djdelorie> his boats pushed barges of gasoline and fuel oil up and down the coast
[19:38:20] <archivist> enough :)
[19:38:21] <Tom_itx> probably over a foot
[19:38:25] <JT-Shop> 16-18 inches
[19:38:31] <djdelorie> yeah, these were in the 1-3 foot range
[19:40:43] <JT-Shop> I've only been on river tugs and iirc they had a gearbox instead the generator bolted to the EMD's
[19:41:23] <Tom_itx> JT-Shop, i tried your step and space values on my drivers yesterday and it worked fine on one but the other two requied 1100 on the step instead of 1000 to make it 'sound' smooth. i found it odd that 2 required different values
[19:41:24] <djdelorie> ocean tugs have a 12 foot clutch plate driving a 12 inch diameter shaft with a 12 foot propellor on them.
[19:41:32] <andypugh> Not our engine, but someone we know. http://youtu.be/ivN1FNsrCsI
[19:41:38] <djdelorie> (approximately)
[19:41:47] <JT-Shop> did you tune the morphing point?
[19:41:55] <Tom_itx> no not yet
[19:42:12] <JT-Shop> might not sound smooth till you do
[19:42:16] <Tom_itx> i still gotta hook it all up to the machine
[19:42:30] <Tom_itx> no, the step pulse was too narrow apparently
[19:42:42] <Tom_itx> once i widened it it quit right away
[19:42:45] <Tom_itx> sounded normal
[19:43:18] <JT-Shop> maybe you found a way around turning the pot to make them smooth in midrange
[19:43:18] <Tom_itx> i think i finally set them all to the same value
[19:43:36] <Tom_itx> i dunno, i think this may have been something else
[19:43:45] <Tom_itx> i'll fiddle with the pot later on
[19:43:58] <archivist> andypugh, the FA registration means burton upon trent /me met the owner too
[19:44:10] <andypugh> Barry. He's a loony
[19:44:17] <Tom_itx> i was testing with a spare set of steppers
[19:44:31] <Tom_itx> i'll adjust everything once i get it all on the machine
[19:44:48] <andypugh> We know him fairly well, he and his wife are both mechanical engineering lecturers.
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[19:46:28] <archivist> andypugh, http://www.collection.archivist.info/archive/DJCPD/PD/2009/2009_09_14_Tees_Cottage/P1010046.JPG
[19:47:02] <archivist> and others in that directory
[19:47:49] <archivist> just a "small" collection he has :)
[19:48:13] <andypugh> There is a video of him showing off his collection here: http://youtu.be/SXeK4MNFz-0
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[19:49:07] <archivist> I saw those two vids a while ago :)
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[19:50:36] <PCW> Tom_itx: if you are tweaking the steplen I would make it twice as big as the drives spec unless it limits your maximum speed
[19:50:37] <PCW> (no need to get near the I-wont-step-anymore limi)
[19:50:48] <PCW> limit
[19:51:43] <andypugh> FA1075 was all in bits with the previous owner. Our club (when we were students) descended on it en-masse and put it back together over a weekend.
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[19:52:48] <archivist> he has it in nice shiny condition when I saw it
[19:53:14] <Tom_itx> PCW, i was just trying jt's values since they're both gecko 203v and similar steppers. i realize the machines are different and will require different tuning.
[19:55:10] <PCW> what I'm saying is there is normally no reason to set the steplen anywhere near the manufactures minimum spec unless its limiting you maximum speed
[19:55:10] <Tom_itx> it was more to test the psu and drive wiring last night than anything
[19:55:21] <Tom_itx> i agree
[19:56:38] <PCW> now if drive manufacturers would just use quadrature all this silly timing would go away
[20:03:40] <Connor> How quickly does a spindle need to reverse for rigid taping ?
[20:04:21] <Tom_itx> probably doesn't matter just so it stays in synch
[20:04:36] <Tom_itx> and doesn't bottom out
[20:04:46] <Connor> That was my Next question. :)
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[20:05:21] <Tom_itx> air rarely breaks cutters
[20:05:34] <Connor> I guess rigid taping blind holes would be a hard thing.. vs through hole...
[20:05:35] <Tom_itx> test it cutting some air first
[20:05:56] <JT-Shop> Connor: not hard just have to use the correct tap and settings
[20:06:26] <Connor> I need to finish my encoder for the spindle this weekend.. and figure out my Y and Z limits..
[20:08:24] <djdelorie> Connor: tap wood?
[20:08:58] <alex4nder-> Tom_itx: air dulls my cutters.
[20:09:05] <alex4nder-> I think it's the friction.
[20:09:05] <Connor> I don't even have any taps suitable for rigid taping... All I have are cheap a$$ ones from HomeDepot.
[20:09:16] <djdelorie> those would tap wood OK :-)
[20:09:33] <Tom_itx> alex4nder-, maybe it's just the cloud over your head
[20:09:43] <alex4nder-> Tom_itx: I think it's the nanites the government is using to control us.
[20:09:46] <Connor> I'm just asking questions so I can get the correct stuff when I'm ready to do that.
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[20:10:03] <alex4nder-> speaking of which, I haven't seen that Scot around recently.
[20:10:54] <JT-Shop> Connor: basicly there are two types of taps for ridge tapping spiral point and spiral flute.
[20:11:12] <JT-Shop> spiral point pushes the chips down so are good for through holes
[20:11:28] <JT-Shop> spiral flute pull the chips up and are good for blind holes
[20:11:30] <Connor> I think spiral flutes were the ones I was looking at.
[20:11:40] <archivist> alex4nder-, dont tempt fate!
[20:11:50] <Connor> Can spiral flutes be used for both ?
[20:12:28] <JT-Shop> sure, spiral point taps are less prone to breaking though
[20:12:43] <alex4nder-> archivist: I know, I'm sorry.
[20:12:48] <archivist> :)
[20:14:06] <Tom_itx> yeah we used alot of spiral flute on the automatics
[20:14:10] <Tom_itx> (non cnc)
[20:14:51] <Tom_itx> a few jobs required multi lead taps as well
[20:15:00] <Tom_itx> iirc a couple were left hand
[20:17:15] <Tom_itx> both of those would require special consideration on a cnc
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[21:05:21] <archivist> ban hayro about to spam
[21:06:14] <jdhNC> surely not.
[21:09:26] * Tom_itx sets mode #linuxcnc +b @!@
[21:19:07] <DJ9DJ> gn8
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[22:21:23] <jymmm> Interesting...
[22:21:33] <jymmm> Those stickers on fruits and veggies tell you quite a bit! 4 numbers mean they were conventionally grown. 5 numbers starting with number 8 means they are genetically modified (GMO). And 5 numbers starting with 9 means they were organically grown.
[22:22:11] <andypugh> Can you grow any terrestrial life inorganically?
[22:22:41] <jymmm> andypugh: I could tell you, but then I'd have to kill you.
[22:22:46] <andypugh> And all crops are GM, the question is whether randomly or carefully.
[22:23:16] <jymmm> andypugh: Well, just KNOWING is half the battle =)
[22:23:46] <andypugh> Not caring is the Switzerland.
[22:24:25] <jymmm> heh, no idea there. Don't care for their chocolate, knives, or blondes.
[22:27:12] <andypugh> Just saying that they tend to avoid battles by not being there.
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[23:08:55] <Connor> You think a whindshield washer pump would do okay for a flood coolant pump?
[23:10:26] <jdhNC> dunno, but they aren't really made for continuous duty
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[23:10:48] <Connor> http://www.harborfreight.com/6-1-2-half-gallon-parts-washer-96952.html might be better.
[23:11:06] <Loetmichel> Connor: jdhNC is right, and they are not made for pumping debris.
[23:11:17] <jdhNC> here too, and muggy.
[23:11:20] <jdhNC> <urk>
[23:11:23] <Loetmichel> you will have to filter the coolant before
[23:11:37] <Connor> okay, what about the parts washer ?
[23:11:48] <andypugh> If it is a centrifugal pump it will cope. If it is a vane pump, probably not.
[23:12:07] <Loetmichel> the parts wahser pump will do
[23:12:14] <Loetmichel> its made for it.
[23:12:26] <jdhNC> probably has other useful plumbing also
[23:12:35] <Loetmichel> but you have to use the filter in the washer bowl or make a similar
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[23:13:17] <roycroft> a pond pump might work
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[23:13:21] <Loetmichel> i use a miniature room well pump for the coolant
[23:13:21] <roycroft> depending on the coolant you're using
[23:13:25] <jdhNC> http://www.harborfreight.com/3-full-trash-pump-with-212cc-gas-engine-68370.html
[23:13:45] <Loetmichel> but i have a 3 stages filter before its intake
[23:14:22] <andypugh> By the time you have bought a parts washer and dismantled it, you might as well have bought something like: http://www.axminster.co.uk/axminster-axminster-coolant-system-prod21084/
[23:14:52] <Connor> Find me a place in the us that has that..
[23:15:00] <Loetmichel> 1mm aluminium sheet metal with 2mm holes, some polyacryl wool and a diesel paper filter cartridge
[23:15:14] <andypugh> I assume that they are in every corner shop in the US, for half the price.
[23:15:30] <Connor> http://www.littlemachineshop.com/products/product_view.php?ProductID=3520&category=-1495788196
[23:15:35] <Connor> Closest thing I've seen for it.
[23:16:57] <jdhNC> http://www.ebay.com/itm/290667434744
[23:19:38] <andypugh> It's axiomatic to me that you giys in the US have more choice of stuff at half the price. Ergo it is just a case of finding the search term
[23:19:54] <roycroft> but none of our stuff is scottish
[23:20:44] <Loetmichel> roycroft:maybe because the sheeps wool products are cheaper from aisa?
[23:20:45] <Loetmichel> ;-)
[23:21:02] <Connor> andypugh: Sometimes it's not true.
[23:21:15] <Connor> That parts washer was under $50.00 and I can get it locally.
[23:21:17] <roycroft> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bzG_J7RCGS0
[23:21:33] <Loetmichel> Connor: i looked at the video
[23:22:04] <Connor> I did too.. you can see the pump in it.. it looks small.. but.. heck..
[23:22:15] <Loetmichel> the washer seems to have a normal submersible pump for use in indoor wells like the one i use
[23:22:20] <Loetmichel> but i see no filter
[23:22:23] <r00t4rd3d> ReadError, http://imgur.com/a/2E7Lw
[23:22:32] <r00t4rd3d> almost ready for a marker test
[23:22:34] <Loetmichel> that accopunts NOT for a long lifetime?
[23:23:33] <Connor> yea, but, I would put a filter under the chip pan before it drained back into the tank.
[23:24:07] <Loetmichel> r00t4rd3d: ouch, that looks a bit labile to me
[23:24:21] <r00t4rd3d> thats how i like it
[23:24:30] <r00t4rd3d> and i dont know what labile means
[23:24:39] <Loetmichel> unstable
[23:24:46] <r00t4rd3d> rock solid
[23:24:46] <Loetmichel> not sturdy
[23:25:07] <andypugh> r00t4rd3d: Don't take this the wrong way, but the Y looks flexy
[23:25:34] <r00t4rd3d> Y is the long one right? front to back?
[23:25:35] <Loetmichel> the 10mm round linear ways wiothout ANY support gice me the goosebumps
[23:25:41] <andypugh> Me too.
[23:25:47] <andypugh> But see how it goes
[23:25:59] <r00t4rd3d> only going to use a dremel
[23:26:10] <r00t4rd3d> thats why light weight
[23:26:30] <r00t4rd3d> my first machine
[23:26:35] <Loetmichel> even a dremal can cope with a bit sideways load.
[23:26:46] <Loetmichel> your gantry cant
[23:26:54] <Loetmichel> my first CNC want better....
[23:26:59] <andypugh> If there is a problem, you could swap those for: http://www.zappautomation.co.uk/tbr16-supported-guided-rail-p-415.html?cPath=29_38
[23:27:07] <r00t4rd3d> i was leary about my z axis but its tight as fuck
[23:27:13] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=2859
[23:27:26] <Loetmichel> ... but i have learned a lot since then ;-)
[23:27:29] <r00t4rd3d> http://letsmakerobots.com/node/21754
[23:27:36] <r00t4rd3d> look at that
[23:27:41] <r00t4rd3d> where i got my ideas
[23:28:03] <r00t4rd3d> if i can do this ill be happy:
[23:28:04] <r00t4rd3d> http://seriousrobotics.files.wordpress.com/2010/07/dsc00624.jpg
[23:28:35] <andypugh> r00t4rd3d: He has a stiffer Y than you, though.
[23:28:48] <r00t4rd3d> thats what you mom said too
[23:29:14] <andypugh> See how it goes. A swap to supported rail is easy if there is a problem.
[23:29:18] <r00t4rd3d> y is the back to front right?
[23:29:25] <r00t4rd3d> or left to right
[23:29:34] <Loetmichel> hmm, whats englisch wor "merkbefreit"? ;-)
[23:29:52] <Loetmichel> left to right
[23:30:08] <r00t4rd3d> thats fine
[23:30:25] <r00t4rd3d> left to right, my back and forth is whats worrying me
[23:30:33] <Loetmichel> the problem is that your small bars supporting the Z are only mounted at the sides
[23:30:42] <Loetmichel> and can flex over the whole lengh
[23:31:01] <Loetmichel> i had a machine once with this construcktion
[23:31:03] <r00t4rd3d> not with the lead screw
[23:31:25] <Loetmichel> it hat 1" bars for 2 feet of y movement, though
[23:31:34] <r00t4rd3d> 12"
[23:31:45] <Loetmichel> r00t4rd3d: ignore the leadscrew
[23:32:12] <Loetmichel> it doesent support ANYTHING it just provides position horiontally
[23:32:20] <r00t4rd3d> if i got to bump up the bars i will
[23:32:28] <r00t4rd3d> not a big deal
[23:33:03] <Loetmichel> ... and the machine STILL flexed about 2mm in the middle if force of 10n applied
[23:33:10] <Loetmichel> even with 1" bars
[23:33:14] <r00t4rd3d> even though i got about 130 in my y axis
[23:33:15] <Loetmichel> THATS the problem
[23:34:03] <Loetmichel> 10N
[23:34:08] <r00t4rd3d> i honestly would not care if i used this as a pattern machine, sharpie marker
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[23:34:37] <r00t4rd3d> i can bandsaw awesomely, I suck at drawing.
[23:34:45] <Loetmichel> hrhr
[23:36:23] <r00t4rd3d> if i cant get a computer to move this thing back,forth,left,right,up,down with no tools I would probably be happy
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[23:37:09] <r00t4rd3d> my expectations are low, my dreams are high.
[23:37:44] <r00t4rd3d> opps , cant=can
[23:38:08] <Loetmichel> ok, the expectations grow with the use...
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[23:38:18] <Loetmichel> lets how you talk in half a year
[23:39:01] <Loetmichel> like a friend said as i build my first CNC: "I warn you, you will get too lazy to saw a rectangle out of some plywood"
[23:39:08] <Loetmichel> ... i am now ;-)
[23:39:40] <r00t4rd3d> well i frame houses for a living so lazy is not an option :D
[23:40:02] <r00t4rd3d> saw in hand every damn day
[23:40:34] <Loetmichel> r00t4rd3d: so buiold a CNC in "house size" and mount it on a trailer...
[23:40:46] <Loetmichel> wit automated plywood reloading
[23:41:38] <Loetmichel> ... make a photo of the house, go to your laptop, get readycut plywood sheets out if your trailer, only the bolting to the house left as manual work ;-)
[23:42:01] <Loetmichel> thats what he meant with "getting lazy"
[23:42:52] <Loetmichel> i tend to use the CNC fot he simpelest of tasks, because it is there and works for(instead of) me ;-)
[23:43:54] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/MC/balsakopter_fraesen.avi
[23:44:04] <Loetmichel> could have sawn this ;-)
[23:44:26] <Loetmichel> but the CNC makes it faster, repeatable and more accurate ;-)
[23:47:54] <Loetmichel> (its a complete quadrokopter chassis made of balsa wood)
[23:47:59] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=4921
[23:49:09] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=5168
[23:52:27] <jdhNC> http://www.plumbersurplus.com/Prod/Little-Giant-VMC-1-1-50-HP-Machine-Tool-Coolant-Unit-4-Power-Cord-560610/57149/Cat/1445
[23:52:42] <jdhNC> more than the parts washer but mostly ready to go and free shipping.