#linuxcnc | Logs for 2012-02-24

[00:00:45] <andypugh> Artillery wheels were rather stronger than normal, so you might still end up making your own. I guess it might depend on whether you shoot roundhot or canister :-)
[00:02:16] <andypugh> Annoying Wikipedia page, but I don't know enough to fix it: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galloper_gun
[00:04:22] <JT-Shop> yes, the artillery wheels had two steel bands on each side like mine and we will shoot round balls and golf balls and aluminum foil balls
[00:04:59] <andypugh> They used "Artillery wheels" on vehicles until the 1930s.
[00:06:01] <JT-Shop> http://www.customwagons.com/store/index.php?app=ccp0&ns=prodshow&ref=1033&sid=e713t4w9r3au6h77d69iqug7ccm733xh
[00:08:07] <andypugh> <chortle> "Cannon and Limper" http://www.customwagons.com/cgi-bin/pro/emAlbum.cgi?c=show_image;p=Real%20Cannons;i=16;img=hope11A.jpg
[00:08:18] <andypugh> I guess if it ran over your foot...
[00:08:44] <JT-Shop> LOL at limper
[00:09:34] <JT-Shop> limber is the correct term
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[00:10:52] <andypugh> Aye, I know that. As I know that the galloper gun was used in the Napoleonic wars, not just in the US.
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[00:11:19] <andypugh> Hi Evertick
[00:11:55] <Valen> andypugh: to fix a wiki page click edit in the top right ;->
[00:12:07] <Evertick> Hello.
[00:12:09] <Evertick> I could use some advice. I've converted a metal lathe to cnc and use linuxcnc
[00:12:18] <Valen> gold star
[00:12:21] <andypugh> Valen: I do that a fair bit, but in this case I don't know enough about the subject.
[00:12:25] <Valen> ahh
[00:12:44] <Evertick> I'd like to use blender, but havent found any information on how to create gcode for a lathe
[00:12:55] <andypugh> Evertick: A fair few of us have done the same. I hope you started with a better lathe than I did.
[00:13:01] <Evertick> I've only found info on cnc routers and such
[00:13:21] <JT-Shop> Evertick: I use ngcgui for 95% of my lathe ops
[00:13:21] <andypugh> I think Blender is way too complicated for a lathe.
[00:13:32] <Evertick> I already have a router build from buildyourcnc.com
[00:13:38] <Evertick> I'm guessing it is.
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[00:13:58] <JT-Shop> now that I have almost unlimited I/O on the plasma I can hook up the start/stop button :)
[00:14:14] <andypugh> I have some simple library routines and a GUI for generic lathe ops, and hand-code for the complicated stuff.
[00:14:47] <andypugh> JT-Shop: ngcgui is probably better than my approach.
[00:15:03] <andypugh> JT-Shop: You have a handy link?
[00:15:06] <Valen> blender isn't that good as far as CAD
[00:15:26] <Evertick> Cool. Would you use ngcgui to actually draft the item?
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[00:18:25] <Evertick> What app would you use to design the part?
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[00:24:05] <GoSebGo> Evertick: for 2d stuff i've used freecad & pycam
[00:27:01] <Evertick> GoSebGo: I've used pycam before. I also use Qcad. Just have never done a design for a lathe. Only stuff for my router.
[00:27:18] <JT-Shop> andypugh: yea, just a sec
[00:27:33] <Evertick> So I guess the challenge is getting something from *cad into linuxcnc
[00:27:44] <JT-Shop> ngcgui http://linuxcnc.org/index.php/english/component/kunena/?func=showcat&catid=40
[00:28:32] <JT-Shop> Evertick: are you talking profiles or simple shapes?
[00:29:02] <Evertick> I'll start simple, like a chess pawn.
[00:29:28] <Evertick> I'm guessing that would be a profile.
[00:29:30] <JT-Shop> ok that is a profile shape and yea you need to get that into g-code
[00:30:12] <JT-Shop> there is some free dxf to g code stuff out there but I can recall what it is
[00:30:13] <Evertick> JT-Shop: bingo.
[00:31:24] <Evertick> JT-Shop: Does that still fall under the topic of ngcgui?
[00:31:42] <andypugh> I tend to draft it in CAD, dimension to the starts and ends of arcs (and centres to start, to get the I, K parameters) and write the profile by hand. Or just machine like a manual lathe that automatically does the next cut, giving a target X and Z, cut depth, feed and surface speed.
[00:31:43] <JT-Shop> for OD, face, ID, taper, thread, tap kind of things ngcgui is fastest and will even do a profile
[00:32:09] <JT-Shop> what Andy does I tend to do as well for the lathe
[00:32:42] <andypugh> Evertick: This is my system, to get the idea. NGCgui is probably slicker. http://www.bodgesoc.org/lathe/lathe.html
[00:32:54] <JT-Shop> quicker than fiddling with some cam software
[00:33:28] <Evertick> Ok I think I have a rough idea.
[00:33:52] <JT-Shop> Evertick: are you new to a cnc lathe?
[00:34:53] <Evertick> JT-Shop: Yes I am. I had an old manual one that I decided to convert with steppermotors and drivers.
[00:35:26] <JT-Shop> a tip for you then when you view an arc or a tool offset lay on the floor and look up :)
[00:35:42] <JT-Shop> for front tooling
[00:35:52] <Evertick> Ok thanks
[00:36:31] <JT-Shop> get ngcgui installed with some of the subroutines for simple ops and that will get you up and going
[00:36:51] <Evertick> Cool. Thanks. I'll give it a shot
[00:36:52] <JT-Shop> like Andy said profiles are usually easy to lay out in cad and get the offsets
[00:37:27] <JT-Shop> when I do profiles I usually run in radius mode, for most other turning ops in diameter mode
[00:39:48] <JT-Shop> andypugh: your a short timer now
[00:40:10] <andypugh> Indeed.
[00:40:47] <JT-Shop> will you have video and photos of the journey?
[00:43:07] <JT-Shop> I see most of the vessels are in port now
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[01:01:25] <andypugh> There will be photos and video, but none from me.
[01:02:06] <andypugh> Have you seen the Virtual Race? My boat in that flew straight through the finish, and grounded.
[01:02:31] <andypugh> No idea what was going on there, but it has left me approximately last out of 40,000
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[01:08:41] <andypugh> Loetmichel: I assume you are German, but not Fremder?
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[01:31:38] <danimal_laptop> hi John
[01:31:43] <danimal_laptop> hi andypugh
[01:32:04] <danimal_laptop> JT-Shop: im in the market for a plasma
[01:33:04] <andypugh> Hi danimal_laptop , but I am logging imminently
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[03:20:40] <A2Sheds> danimal_laptop: hi, how is the shop going with all the new improvements?
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[04:26:28] <Jymmm> http://images.piccsy.com/cache/images/picc-11kvellbv-204087-504-251.jpg
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[05:00:01] <|n0b0dy|> sharing is caring
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[05:50:44] <Thetawaves> i've got a document specifying setup instructions for mach3, can somebody help me derive some good guess values for step/dir setup and hold times?
[05:50:53] <Thetawaves> http://www.amonstar.com/template/file/3020/desktop-CNC user manual.doc
[05:51:18] <Thetawaves> i wish there were not spaces in that link
[05:51:36] <Thetawaves> http://www.amonstar.com/template/file/3020/desktop-CNC%20user%20manual.doc
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[06:15:03] <seb_kuzminsky> Thetawaves: neat-looking machine
[06:15:07] <seb_kuzminsky> the cable guides are classy
[06:15:35] <Thetawaves> thanks, i am very excited to get it running
[06:16:13] <seb_kuzminsky> you're running mach3 on it now?
[06:16:22] <Jymmm> Never thought of this http://i44.tinypic.com/346uwxk.jpg
[06:16:58] <Thetawaves> no i haven't set it up yet
[06:17:24] <seb_kuzminsky> Thetawaves: nice-looking control box too
[06:18:04] <seb_kuzminsky> i didnt see any stepper timing info in the manual you linked
[06:18:06] <seb_kuzminsky> did i just miss it?
[06:18:56] <jdhnc> Jymm: real men wiggle cables
[06:19:07] <Thetawaves> seb_kuzminsky, that's the problem, i don't see any info
[06:19:21] <Jymmm> jdhnc: I am woman, hear me roar!
[06:19:31] <jdhnc> jpegs?
[06:19:41] <Jymmm> perv!
[06:20:01] <seb_kuzminsky> Thetawaves: it's almost visible in the screenshot on page 14
[06:20:19] <seb_kuzminsky> i bet we can read it all off there
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[06:21:20] <Thetawaves> page 13 right?
[06:21:49] <seb_kuzminsky> the page that's labeled "15" at the bottom
[06:23:06] <Thetawaves> hmm! page 15 has two pictures (front and back of controller) and some text
[06:24:24] <seb_kuzminsky> this pic: http://highlab.com/~seb/mach3.png
[06:25:16] <seb_kuzminsky> in my .doc viewer (open office 3.2, i think), that's on the page labeled 15
[06:25:19] <seb_kuzminsky> anyway
[06:25:22] <seb_kuzminsky> in that pic
[06:25:48] <seb_kuzminsky> there's a field labeled 'Step Pulse 1-5 us', and its value appears to be 10 for all three steppers
[06:25:52] <Thetawaves> ahhh yeah 13 for me (weird)
[06:25:57] <seb_kuzminsky> so that's steplen=10000 for linuxcnc
[06:26:53] <Thetawaves> alright, what about setup time?
[06:27:15] <seb_kuzminsky> then Dir Pulse is 3, that's probably what we call 'dirsetup'
[06:27:29] <mrsun> how fun to get sick right at the freakin weekend :P
[06:27:52] <seb_kuzminsky> there's a field unhelpfully called 'Steps per', i wonder if that's inch or metric?
[06:28:02] <seb_kuzminsky> prolly metric on a chinese machine?
[06:28:17] <seb_kuzminsky> 400 steps/mm seems like a lot
[06:29:42] <Thetawaves> yes, i believe all units are mm
[06:29:54] <seb_kuzminsky> i guess it's reasonable, it's 0.0001" per step, in the units i'm used to...
[06:30:25] <seb_kuzminsky> if so, and if the max vel is given in mm/min, then we can compute the stepspace from that
[06:30:47] <seb_kuzminsky> 200 mm/min * 400 steps/mm = 80,000 steps/min
[06:31:21] <Thetawaves> 2000mm/sec actually
[06:31:32] <seb_kuzminsky> 80,000 steps/min * 1/60 min/second = 1333 steps/second
[06:31:39] <seb_kuzminsky> oh you're right
[06:31:51] <seb_kuzminsky> so 13,333 steps/second
[06:32:47] <seb_kuzminsky> that's 0.000075 seconds/step, 75 us/step
[06:33:06] <seb_kuzminsky> we know steplen is 10us, so stepspace must be the other 65
[06:33:26] <Thetawaves> how what?
[06:33:34] <Thetawaves> i'm calculating 800,000 steps a second
[06:33:50] <Thetawaves> 2000mm/sec * 400steps/mm = 800,000mm/sec
[06:33:53] <Thetawaves> errrr
[06:33:58] <Thetawaves> 800,000steps/sec
[06:34:09] <seb_kuzminsky> it's 2000 mm/min according to the label on the gui
[06:34:17] <Thetawaves> ooooohhhh
[06:34:53] <Thetawaves> ok i understand now thanks
[06:35:00] <seb_kuzminsky> great! :-)
[06:35:31] <seb_kuzminsky> so i guess there's some newfangled tool called 'stepconf' where you can poke these numbers in, and it'll write a linuxcnc config for you
[06:35:44] <Thetawaves> yeah i've got that open
[06:35:55] <seb_kuzminsky> or you can spend an evening with an irc window, a manpage window, and a text editor ;-)
[06:36:09] <seb_kuzminsky> is the machine under power?
[06:36:13] <Thetawaves> no
[06:36:17] <seb_kuzminsky> ah, too bad
[06:36:23] <seb_kuzminsky> i think stepconf has a "test axis" button
[06:36:28] <mrsun> mm
[06:36:31] <Thetawaves> i can plug it in :)
[06:36:37] <seb_kuzminsky> gulp!
[06:38:05] <Thetawaves> so dir setup = 3000
[06:38:13] <Thetawaves> what about direction hold?
[06:38:26] <seb_kuzminsky> i dont think i see it anywhere on that screen :-(
[06:38:37] <Thetawaves> should i just leave it at the 20us
[06:38:51] <seb_kuzminsky> that should be safe
[06:42:18] <Thetawaves> max step rate 6896hz
[06:42:56] <seb_kuzminsky> should be twice that
[06:43:00] <seb_kuzminsky> something's not adding up
[06:43:47] <Thetawaves> active low == not inverted
[06:45:50] <Thetawaves> so what is wrong?
[06:46:32] <Thetawaves> steptime = 10,000 step space = 65,000 direction hold = 20,000 dir setup = 3,000
[06:47:42] <seb_kuzminsky> what's your base period?
[06:48:08] <Thetawaves> reported as 6364, but i entered 7064
[06:49:02] <Thetawaves> min base period 72065ns
[06:49:56] <seb_kuzminsky> wait, which of those numbers is the base period you're using? the 75 us one or 7 us?
[06:50:32] <Thetawaves> sorry, 7064 is the jitter number, the base period which is a calculated field says 72064
[06:50:39] <seb_kuzminsky> ah ok
[06:50:54] <seb_kuzminsky> so that explains the problem
[06:51:08] <seb_kuzminsky> you get to change the state of the step and/or dir output pin once per base period
[06:51:25] <seb_kuzminsky> so the step freq is limited to base period / 2
[06:51:49] <seb_kuzminsky> there's some special way to do two writes to the pins per period
[06:53:47] <Thetawaves> i sorta want to hook my driver up to an oscilloscope and measure the cutoff freq
[06:54:50] <Thetawaves> where does the min base period number come from?
[06:54:52] <seb_kuzminsky> can you ask the manufacturer/reseller for timing specs for the stepper amps? or can you find the docs online somewhere?
[06:55:16] <Thetawaves> yeah i asked, still waiting
[06:55:26] <seb_kuzminsky> the base period is determined by measuring the scheduling latency of your computer
[06:55:31] <seb_kuzminsky> it's highly hardware dependent
[06:56:23] <Thetawaves> so it asks the latency test for that number?
[06:56:33] <seb_kuzminsky> right
[06:56:57] <seb_kuzminsky> ah, i was looking for the parport.<portnum>.reset function: http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.4/html/hal_parallel_port.html#r1_1_4
[06:57:23] <seb_kuzminsky> i think that would let you do one full step per base period, instead of one half step
[06:57:34] <seb_kuzminsky> i wonder if stepconf uses that
[06:57:36] <seb_kuzminsky> it doesnt seem to
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[06:57:56] <Thetawaves> so 7khz step speed is pretty lousy?
[06:58:15] <seb_kuzminsky> it might be useful to accept the slower step rate for now, and get the machine moving, and then optimize and tune later
[06:58:46] <Thetawaves> 17.5mm/sec
[06:58:50] <seb_kuzminsky> i'm not sure if 7 khz is good or bad... you're using software step generation, out the parallel port, and i dont have any machines that are set up like that
[06:59:20] <Thetawaves> seems really fast
[06:59:22] <seb_kuzminsky> all the machines i use have hardware step generation, and hundreds of khz is normal
[06:59:46] <Thetawaves> heh
[07:00:22] <seb_kuzminsky> 17.5 mm/sec is 41 inches/minute
[07:00:27] <seb_kuzminsky> seems like a fine place to start
[07:00:33] <Thetawaves> 1050mm/min hmmm
[07:00:49] <seb_kuzminsky> one minute per meter
[07:01:13] <seb_kuzminsky> see if it'll even turn the motors, then if it does, see if you can enable the parport reset and double your steprate
[07:01:29] <seb_kuzminsky> are you on linuxcnc 2.4 or 2.5?
[07:01:51] <Thetawaves> the one on ubuntu 10.4 linuxcnc edition
[07:02:15] <seb_kuzminsky> we provide both 2.4 and 2.5 on ubuntu 10.04
[07:02:20] <Thetawaves> v2.4
[07:02:23] <seb_kuzminsky> ah ok
[07:02:39] <Thetawaves> that's what the user manual claims, but i have updated it
[07:02:58] <seb_kuzminsky> ok that's good
[07:03:11] <seb_kuzminsky> it'll say when you start the axis gui later
[07:03:23] <Thetawaves> ok
[07:03:31] <seb_kuzminsky> or you can ask the packaging system by running "dpkg --status emc2" or "dpkg --status linuxcnc", depending on version
[07:03:52] <seb_kuzminsky> but i guess it's not important now
[07:04:11] <Thetawaves> 2.4.7
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[07:04:54] <Thetawaves> active low = invert right?
[07:05:40] <seb_kuzminsky> let's see...
[07:05:46] <seb_kuzminsky> i'm looking here: http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.4/html/config_stepconf.html#sub:Parallel-Port-Setup
[07:06:00] <seb_kuzminsky> it says "Turn on the "invert" check box if the signal is inverted (0V for true/active, 5V for false/inactive)."
[07:06:10] <seb_kuzminsky> i'm not sure what your stepper amps want
[07:06:25] <seb_kuzminsky> it might be in that doc you linked earlier, somewhere
[07:06:48] <seb_kuzminsky> oh yes it is, it's the picture before the one i linked back to you
[07:07:06] <seb_kuzminsky> looks like only estop is active low
[07:07:16] <seb_kuzminsky> aka inverted
[07:09:14] <Thetawaves> same with each step axis
[07:09:15] <mrsun> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FuwFlW3n_3E&feature=g-vrec&context=G208964eRVAAAAAAAAAQ how cute, lets cnc it? :)
[07:09:29] <Thetawaves> turns out that only 7 of the parallel port pins are in use
[07:09:35] <Thetawaves> plenty of expansion for my own circuits :D
[07:09:59] <seb_kuzminsky> no limit or home switches?
[07:10:06] <Thetawaves> nope
[07:10:11] <seb_kuzminsky> 7 is step&dir for 3 axes, then estop, right?
[07:10:12] <Thetawaves> i will have to build them
[07:10:19] <seb_kuzminsky> nice :-)
[07:10:19] <Thetawaves> yeah
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[07:10:58] <seb_kuzminsky> i'd be ready to cut power to the steppers manually, before clicking on the Test Axis button
[07:11:09] <seb_kuzminsky> i wouldn't trust the estop to work just yet
[07:11:19] <Thetawaves> ok
[07:12:05] <Thetawaves> how many pulses per revolution are my stepper motors?
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[07:12:14] <seb_kuzminsky> i don't know
[07:14:04] <seb_kuzminsky> what's your leadscrew pitch?
[07:14:15] <Thetawaves> my best guess is these screws are 2mm/rev
[07:14:32] <seb_kuzminsky> ok
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[07:15:19] <seb_kuzminsky> and it's 400 steps/mm according to that one picture
[07:15:41] <Thetawaves> 800 steps / rev? wtf?
[07:16:11] <seb_kuzminsky> that's what the manual says
[07:16:13] * seb_kuzminsky shrugs
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[07:16:28] <Thetawaves> ?8mm 1204 trapezoidal screw , pitch of 1.25 (double nut + spring consumer backlash)
[07:16:32] <Thetawaves> hmm
[07:16:36] <seb_kuzminsky> ah
[07:16:40] <seb_kuzminsky> 1.25 mm/rev pitch
[07:18:51] <Thetawaves> i can't seem to verify that number somewhere else
[07:19:33] <seb_kuzminsky> if it's in one place in the docs, that's probably enough
[07:20:06] <seb_kuzminsky> once we're done configuring we'll measure the actual movement and sanity-check it
[07:20:29] <seb_kuzminsky> if it's wrong we'll debug it, but until then i'd trust the manual
[07:21:54] <Thetawaves> another site says Max Speed 4000mm/min
[07:21:54] <Thetawaves> Max Engraving Speed 2000mm/min
[07:22:31] <Thetawaves> i didn't find that number in the manual, on another site found searching for 1204 trapezoidal screw
[07:22:33] <seb_kuzminsky> i'd guess "Max Speed" means rapids, without the tool cutting the work, and "Max Engraving Speed" means max speed when the tool is cutting
[07:23:31] <seb_kuzminsky> stepper motors lose torque at higher speeds, and moving the machine requires more torque when cutting than when just traversing
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[07:28:58] <Thetawaves> seb_kuzminsky, thank you for your help
[07:29:15] <Thetawaves> i have to give some drunks a ride home :)
[07:29:40] <Thetawaves> i'll be back
[07:29:46] <seb_kuzminsky> heh
[07:29:49] <seb_kuzminsky> ok, see you later
[07:29:55] <seb_kuzminsky> good luck with your machine :-)
[07:30:04] <Thetawaves> thanks :D
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[07:51:07] <DJ9DJ> moin
[07:58:31] <joe9> any suggestions on how I can make the small notch on the right with a drill press, please? http://i.imgur.com/XghCZ.png is the notch that I am talking about. The little one on the bottom right.
[07:59:15] <joe9> the notch size is approximately 4mm in width and 6mm in height.
[07:59:38] <joe9> I am thinking of looking for a square drill bit, but am not sure if there is a better way of doing something like this?
[08:00:02] <jdhnc> does it really need to be square?
[08:00:28] <joe9> the piece is square, but the notch is not.
[08:00:34] <joe9> jdhnc: does that make sense?
[08:00:51] <jdhnc> do the corners of the notch really need to be square?
[08:00:51] <joe9> the size in the image is the actual size/dimension.
[08:01:05] <mrsun> a file? :P
[08:01:12] <joe9> no, the notch is not square. it is 6mm x 4mm.
[08:01:31] <jdhnc> do the corners of the notch really need to be right angles.
[08:01:40] <joe9> jdhnc: oh, yes, please.
[08:02:27] <jdhnc> you could use a broach in a drill press
[08:02:48] <joe9> let me google and read up on "broach". Thanks for the advice.
[08:02:59] <jdhnc> but, if it isn't precision customer oriented whatever, perhaps a drill and a file would be sufficient
[08:03:52] <joe9> I have a dremel. would you recommend using that over a file?
[08:04:11] <mrsun> no imo
[08:04:19] <mrsun> alot harder to control power tools =)
[08:04:20] <jdhnc> a flat file can make the edges square, a dremel will never do that.
[08:04:33] <joe9> mrsun: with just the file, it will be hard to go to such depth. I am a noob.
[08:04:50] <mrsun> joe9, a good file and 4mm deep
[08:04:51] <joe9> mrsun: I meant "will it be "
[08:04:52] <mrsun> no problem
[08:05:01] <mrsun> how thick is the material ?
[08:05:10] <joe9> 1/32" inches
[08:05:12] <jdhnc> drill lots of holes next to each other, then file down the rough edges
[08:05:27] <mrsun> gah
[08:05:28] <jdhnc> oh, I'd start with the file
[08:05:28] <joe9> any files that you recommend?
[08:05:34] <mrsun> inches, whats that in mm now :P
[08:05:43] <joe9> probably, 1 mm
[08:05:52] <mrsun> 0.8 about
[08:05:52] <joe9> or just a little bit more, I think.
[08:06:01] <mrsun> you will file that away with your teeth if you want :P
[08:06:07] <mrsun> wont take more then a couple of minutes
[08:06:13] <joe9> oh, really.
[08:06:22] <mrsun> files can cut material
[08:06:33] <mrsun> and fast, specialy thin material =)
[08:07:21] <joe9> mrsun, any file that you would recommend?
[08:08:19] <mrsun> a flat one? :P
[08:08:32] <mrsun> thats not wider then 6mm on the thin side? :P
[08:08:37] <joe9> btw, is the square drill bit a bad idea, if I have to do this more than a few times?
[08:09:10] <joe9> s/if I have/even if i have/
[08:09:17] <mrsun> or a square file
[08:09:21] <mrsun> thats not wider then 6mm =)
[08:09:24] <joe9> mrsun, thanks.
[08:09:46] <mrsun> joe9, i would say it depends on how many more times
[08:09:53] <joe9> 10 times.
[08:10:02] <jdhnc> what's a square drill bit?
[08:10:10] <mrsun> joe9, do a test, see how long it takes to file that slot in a piece =)
[08:10:27] <mrsun> joe9, and if you are into metal working you realy need to learn to use a file and see how effective a tool it can be =)
[08:10:43] <joe9> mrsun, ok, thanks. will try a file then.
[08:10:49] <mrsun> if it would be alot of times i would rather use some kind of a punch press to do the notching =)
[08:11:16] <jdhnc> what is the material?
[08:11:21] <joe9> FR-4
[08:11:49] <jdhnc> file should be fine
[08:12:04] <jdhnc> or a cut-off wheel in a dremel maybe
[08:12:07] <mrsun> oh its a pcb ?
[08:12:09] <joe9> mrsun, for filing, do I need something special while clamping the piece to protect it?
[08:12:13] <joe9> mrsun: yes.
[08:12:43] <mrsun> joe9, it will cut like butter, so just put some protective sheeting in the vice before clamping it, like a piece of paper or something =)
[08:13:32] <joe9> files seem to be available in these varieties "Rough, Bastard, Second Cut and Smooth" . which one would you recommend?
[08:14:18] <mrsun> ough =)
[08:14:25] <jdhnc> smooth is slow, rough is fast
[08:14:27] <mrsun> i like the ones that is cross cut =)
[08:14:44] <joe9> mrsun, not to question your advice, with a file, will it be precise enough? with the dremel, I was under/over cutting by a little bit. I agree it was hard to get it exact with the dremel.
[08:14:58] <jdhnc> a plain flat wood file \
[08:15:21] <mrsun> joe9, depeneds on you, with a dremel its alot easier to overcut as its a very effective cutting tool
[08:15:30] <mrsun> a file cuts as far as you apply preasure =)
[08:15:41] <mrsun> for very fine cuts, no preasure, for rough cuts, alot of preasure
[08:15:46] <mrsun> alot more control =)
[08:15:53] <joe9> mrsun, that is what I found. hence, am looking for something more precise and faster.
[08:16:17] <joe9> mrsun, jdhnc thanks a lot.
[08:16:20] <mrsun> joe9, filing is also an art, but if you have lines to go after you should have no problems getting it quite precise ==)
[08:16:32] <mrsun> as long as you take it slow to start with until you get more adapt with the tool =)
[08:17:25] <joe9> jdhnc: that is what I had used earlier. a dremel cut-off tool.
[08:18:19] <jdhnc> you need a dado blade for it
[08:18:54] <joe9> are punch presses cheap? they seem to be pretty expensive.
[08:19:08] <mrsun> dunno
[08:19:10] <joe9> and, for a punch press, I probably need a die-set oslt. correct?
[08:19:17] <jdhnc> yes
[08:19:37] <jdhnc> punch tooling is also pricey. you could use an arbor press though.
[08:20:08] <mrsun> for cutting pcbs i was more thinking one of these notching tongs =)
[08:20:26] <jdhnc> never cut pcb with a notcher, but it might work
[08:20:38] <mrsun> or whatever its called =)
[08:22:03] <mrsun> tho cant seem to find one that cuts squares :P
[08:22:47] <jdhnc> nibbler
[08:23:24] <jdhnc> maybe a wood mortising bit
[08:26:02] <joe9> i am reading up on it. what do you think of mortising bits?
[08:26:44] <archivist> mortising bit wont like being used on pcb material
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[08:29:08] <jdhnc> 10 times, might last.
[08:29:14] <joe9> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Iz3pDMP7IsE
[08:30:08] <joe9> but, I do not know if I can get those bits at homedepot/lowes or mcmastercarr.
[08:30:39] <jdhnc> afaik, they are not really square
[08:31:02] <joe9> jdhnc: i think you are right, the edges seem a little curved
[08:31:06] <mrsun> http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&NR=1&v=Wt46yoQkBDA
[08:31:07] <mrsun> :P
[08:33:36] <jdhnc> I'd start with scribe & cut/file
[08:39:42] <joe9> mrsun, good video. thanks.
[08:39:47] <joe9> jdhnc: what is a scribe?
[08:41:16] <jdhnc> a pointy tool that scratches
[08:41:24] <joe9> ok, thanks.
[08:41:41] <jdhnc> scribe the area to be removed, then use a file or dremel or whatever up to the scribe mark
[08:42:26] <jdhnc> diamond scribe, xacto knife, razor blade, electric engraver
[08:44:52] <joe9> got it.
[08:44:54] <joe9> thanks.
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[09:54:27] <|n0b0dy|> http://www.sherline.com/tip20.htm
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[10:11:58] <Thetawaves> a lot of the square hole uses could possibly be done with a round bore and keyway
[10:12:19] <Thetawaves> anybody agree?
[10:25:18] <Loetmichel> *google... where is Vilnius? Bossjust ordered me to show some computers a t a military fair... 1500km drive, 2 days demonstration of Computers, 1500km drive back ... THANKS colleague woh has to go to the doctor in thios time :-(
[10:33:39] <psha[work]> Loetmichel: with your roads 1.5k km is not so much )
[10:50:16] <archivist> Thetawaves, do you mean a broach
[10:51:14] <Thetawaves> yeah
[10:52:11] <archivist> I would hate to use my HSS broaches on pcb material
[10:54:32] <Thetawaves> because it will break the pcb?
[10:54:41] <Thetawaves> or because it will gum up your broaches?
[10:55:01] <archivist> no, wear the broach
[10:55:44] <Thetawaves> more than metal?
[10:56:37] <archivist> glass fibre is abrasive
[10:58:05] <archivist> the pcb manufacturers use air driven spindles at 60k rpm and carbide tooling
[11:03:16] <Thetawaves> ahh cool
[11:03:35] <Thetawaves> make some
[11:04:08] <Thetawaves> hell you can probably get a press setup to cut it all in one pass
[11:04:23] <Thetawaves> instead of the many teeth of a broach
[11:05:09] <archivist> the machines mill the outline
[11:06:24] <Thetawaves> then why don't you do the same?
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[11:08:50] <mrsun> gah, digial outputs on a vfd, is that usaly the relay ?
[11:09:04] <mrsun> i want a ready-to-run signal and a faul signal output from the vfd, but aparently it can only do one of them :(
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[11:15:08] <archivist> if it is ready to run it is also not faulty
[11:39:42] <jdhnc> if it is not faulty, is it ready to run?
[11:46:26] <mrsun> hmm, i wonder using a better opamp if i could use the +10.5V analog output to power an opamp for the analog input ref
[11:46:34] <mrsun> analog frequency ref
[11:47:28] <mrsun> using 324N i would get 0-9V max ... :/
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[13:47:13] <DJ9DJ> rehi
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[14:32:42] <Jymmm> erlo
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[14:57:51] <mazafaka> What 'erlo', oh? 'Waterloo' ??
[15:02:05] <mazafaka> Why remind of this battle?
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[15:58:36] <Jymmm> http://images.nationalgeographic.com/wpf/media-live/photos/000/426/cache/truck-moss-woods_42607_990x742.jpg?01AD=3RI9KG1Y5wGX3VroyqohykdYy7accIPTuV39KMJB8y69UqVUKsOItFw&01RI=CFF855C1ABCE61F&01NA=
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[16:04:00] <Loetmichel> jymm: sorry sight.... could have been a gread muscle car somerhere other tan standing more or less rotten in the woiods.
[16:04:00] <Loetmichel> woods
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[16:04:22] <Jymmm> http://images.piccsy.com/cache/images/ice-ice-192756-500-667.jpg
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[16:06:48] <Loetmichel> Jymmm: looks like a normal winter not far from here (north ) ;-)
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[16:12:55] <pingufan> Hello. Yesterday I installed (manually) the hal-entry for the tooltip sensor. Is this all I have to do, or are there some other things I have to do to make it work? I would like to test the small program I got, but I am afraid to damage something.
[16:14:05] <archivist> afraid.... not much we can do for you
[16:15:21] <pingufan> Sure. Is something to be configured in addition, or should it work right now?
[16:15:36] <awallin_> start halmeter and look at probe-input
[16:15:39] <awallin_> does it work?
[16:15:59] <archivist> he got that far already
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[16:21:31] <awallin_> so then you run some safe probe move and enable the switch by hand. does that work?
[16:22:12] <joe9> I am using this attachment (http://www.amazon.com/Dremel-196-High-Speed-Cutter/dp/B00008ZA01) with a drill press to drill 5mm diameter (not through holes) 0.4 mm depth holes.
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[16:22:21] <joe9> my drill press is a craftsma 38142.
[16:22:29] <joe9> Is it a bad idea?
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[16:22:40] <joe9> s/craftsma/craftsman/
[16:23:03] <joe9> any thoughts, please?
[16:23:31] <archivist> does it work, or does it fail, does the tool wear..., all things we cannot see from here
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[16:24:04] <joe9> I think it works. I was not sure if it is a bad idea to use a dremel drill bit with a proper drill press.
[16:24:17] <joe9> I have not tried it yet with a drill press.
[16:24:28] <pingufan> awallin_: I had to boot up everything first. Therefore the delay. Yes, by default it us "FALSE", and when I press it (simulate a touch with the tool), it becomes true.
[16:24:50] <joe9> archivist: I am checking to make sure that it is not "off-the-charts" bad to use dremel bits with a drill press
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[16:25:27] <awallin_> joe9: with a 5mm bit your drill-press probably has enough rpm. running a 0.5mm cutter at low rpm would not be that great
[16:26:13] <joe9> awallin_: ok, thanks. as long as it works, it is not such a bad idea. then.
[16:27:40] <pingufan> So a "G38.2 z0 f20" should do a touch off on the sensor now? Move downwards until the button/sensor is triggered?
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[16:28:41] <pingufan> Only to be sure, this is my very first steps.
[16:29:17] <awallin_> try it without a tool in the spindle, with lots of z-clearance, and flipping the probe-switch by hand.
[16:29:39] <pingufan> Good idea. But it should behave as I described?
[16:30:31] <awallin_> yes, you have to start above z=0, maybe z=5 or something. and the probe needs to be FALSE when you enter g38.2.
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[16:36:50] <pingufan> Excellent! :D Works!
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[16:37:41] <jthornton> Program G38.x axes to perform a straight probe operation. The axis words are optional, except that at least one of them must be used. The axis words together define the destination point that the probe will move towards, starting from the current location. If the probe is not tripped before the destination is reached G38.2 and G38.4 will signal an error.
[16:37:45] <pingufan> The z coordinate is in machine coordinates or address space of workpiece ?
[16:38:11] <jthornton> http://linuxcnc.org/docview/2.5/html/gcode/gcode.html#_g38_x_straight_probe_a_id_sec_g38_probe_a
[16:38:15] <awallin_> whatever is the current coordinate system
[16:39:21] <joe9> i have this vise (http://www.harborfreight.com/5-inch-drill-press-milling-vise-94276.html). I am not planning on using it for milling, but, just as a drill press vise to hold a piece for a few straight lines of holes. I find that the scale is very inaccurate and am thinking of replacing the scale with something more accuarte, such a calipers or something like that.
[16:39:40] <joe9> wondering if anyone has come across something like that.
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[16:39:56] <pingufan> jthornton: What do i understand with 38.4 ? How does this work? Does it move down until it gets contact and then retract?
[16:40:46] <awallin_> pingufan: no. with 38.4 you start with the probe in TRUE state, and move until you see FALSE
[16:41:26] <joe9> the scale on the vise is not held down by a screw but some small screw like attachment. If i remove it with a chisel, I am not sure if I can fit something else in that hole.
[16:41:30] <pingufan> So this is actually not really practicable in my case.
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[16:42:06] <Jymmm> Loetmichel: http://laughingsquid.com/paradise-parking-beautiful-photos-of-abandoned-cars-decaying-in-nature-by-peter-lippmann/
[16:42:33] <pingufan> I just noticed that the microswitch I used closes before it clicks. is this often the case?
[16:44:47] <pingufan> Can I fix the position of G30 in the system (permanently store it), or must this be part of my milling program? Also: Does G30 work with machine coordinates or user coordinates?
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[16:47:03] <awallin_> the parameter values are saved in a file, they don't need to be in every program (unless you want to change them)
[16:47:25] <awallin_> docs seem to say G30 parameters are in absolute coords
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[16:50:37] <pingufan> Where can I read that?
[16:51:44] <awallin_> http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.4/html/gcode_main.html#sec:G30,-G30.1
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[16:53:31] <Jymmm> Got Mouse? http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lzbpnzUwUQ1qbklpto1_500.jpg
[16:54:24] <pingufan> It is sad that I cannot store a special move to be done for moving to the sensor. I.e. first up, then back (max y) then right (where the sensor is).
[16:55:11] <pingufan> This picture remembers me to my Janich&Class Industrial PC. MY first computer. Running CPM/3
[16:55:43] <awallin_> I'm sure there are "free" parameter numbers where you can store your probe-position. You could then make a custom M-code for your probe-sequence
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[17:00:08] <Loetmichel> re @ home
[17:01:11] <pingufan> Hmm. Ok. This I will try later, when I am familiar with this probing at all. Any idea which file contains the G30 position?
[17:01:51] <awallin_> VAR file http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.4/html/config_ini_config.html
[17:03:33] <pingufan> Whow. Thank you. :)
[17:04:31] <pingufan> Ah! I do not have to fiddle around at all! G30.1 should do that for me?
[17:05:54] <awallin_> yes, use g30.1 to store the reference position parameters in the VAR file. In general editing the VAR file by hand is a bad idea..
[17:06:20] <pingufan> I thought that, too.
[17:07:15] <pingufan> Only for understanding. The tool table contains tool lengths. They are ignored when using the G38.2 method ?
[17:10:35] <awallin_> the probe-move will not set tool length. it will only store the probed position in the VAR file.
[17:11:03] <awallin_> you have to figure out the tool-length-compensation from that yourself, and then change the tool-length for the current tool with another g-code
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[17:24:11] <sH`> anyone have a good source of carbide bits other than homedepot or flea-bay. ;q
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[17:28:31] <pingufan> awallin_: Ok. So as the tools are almost of same length and have no stopper ring, I can set all tool lengths to 0 and only work with sensed corrections. right?
[17:30:38] <awallin_> pingufan: yes that would probably work..
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[17:32:33] <awallin_> sH`: http://www.maritool.com/ ? depends one what you are looking for I guess
[17:33:11] <pingufan> Nice! Is there a well working converting program (linux, if possible) for converting i.e. a dxf -> G-Codes? I currently test cut2d, but that is windows and not free.
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[17:35:34] <Loetmichel> sH`: which country?
[17:35:40] <Loetmichel> and which size?
[17:35:45] <sH`> US.
[17:36:06] <sH`> just looking for 10x piece sets.
[17:36:35] <sH`> 3/32" 2.4mm
[17:36:38] <Loetmichel> for germany and the small 1/8" bits i would recommend http://www.mmetoolshop.de
[17:36:46] <Loetmichel> sorry, no idea
[17:37:30] <sH`> or even 1.5mm
[17:37:31] <sH`> k.
[17:37:40] <sH`> no biggie, i'll dig around the interwebs.
[17:38:36] <Loetmichel> but i think the PCB manufacturers should know where to get the small milling/drilling bits in TC, 'cause they are usimg them like corn in a popcorn machine ;-)
[17:45:06] <pingufan> I recently bought very nice tools here: http://www.bk-faserverbundtechnik.at/shop/index.php
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[17:45:49] <pingufan> 10° V-Shaped engraving tool with 0.1mmų on tip for ~3 Euro
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[17:46:08] <pingufan> I did a test milling of a PCB. Whow.
[17:46:49] <pingufan> And for me it is very close, i pick up my tools there personally. (1/8" shaft)
[17:48:23] <Loetmichel> pingufan: uhhh... heiz... the bad name... ;-)
[17:48:42] <pingufan> Bad experience?
[17:48:56] <Loetmichel> user of "peters CNC ecke"
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[17:50:20] <Loetmichel> bad manners on criticvs and machines which can only mill swiss cheese, on parmesan it would bend ;-)
[17:51:36] <pingufan> Well, it's fine for me. Cheap tools. I had a look on his machines, they really don't appear strong for their size. My little Gravograph VX is definitely stronger (but also much smaller).
[17:51:53] <pingufan> ... nd has a weight of 50kg.
[17:52:27] <syyl_ws> gravograph is a well known manufacturer :)
[17:53:10] <Loetmichel> the boss of "heiz" has made a criminal complaint against ALL cometitors he was aware of for not having the german "safety features" like emergency sto switch and some manuals
[17:53:59] <pingufan> I got my mill there for 500 Euro. It had a totally burned out electronics. But the steppers were ok. Then I bought three gecko drives (thanks to cradek, this recommendation was golden), and now I have a perfect machine.
[17:54:01] <Loetmichel> and has reactet on critics on his construction in the forum with MORE complaints rather than answer the questions
[17:55:26] <pingufan> My mill also has no emergency stop. But it has a main switch. and this switch is on the machine, easy to reach. (But it's my machine and I don't sell it.)
[17:55:35] <pingufan> That's a bit different.
[17:55:39] <Loetmichel> to be precise: he has filed the complaints at the police
[17:56:19] <pingufan> Haha - Crazy. Well, I only buy my tools there, he is cheap.
[17:56:57] <pingufan> And I save costs for shipment, it is a drive of 15 minutes with my car.
[17:57:18] <Loetmichel> ... so he hasnt the best standing at cncecke.de ;-)
[17:57:50] <pingufan> Ok, back to my Gcodes. So after entering a G30.1 the current point is PERMANENTLY stored in vars?
[17:58:08] <Loetmichel> dont misiinterpret me,. i dont talk about your .at dealer, i talk about the manuifacturer of the "heiz" machines!
[17:58:18] <Loetmichel> high-Z
[17:58:40] <pingufan> Don't worry.
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[17:59:47] <pingufan> Well, supper is ready. M;ust leave now. Have a nice weekend!
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[18:06:31] <IchGuckLive> hi all around the world
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[18:57:12] <IchGuckLive> skunkworks: are you online ?
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[19:26:42] <mrsun> any circuits for PWM to -10 to +10V ? :)
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[19:33:40] <pcw_home> There are a number of way to do it UP/DOWN, PWM/DIR, 50% = 0
[19:35:19] <mrsun> so UP and 0-10V, and DOWN and 0-10V?
[19:35:39] <mrsun> in that case foward/reverse run/stop two wire sequenc is about the same thing? :)
[19:36:00] <mrsun> ahh
[19:36:09] <pcw_home> up = 0 to +10V, down = 0 to -10V
[19:36:13] <mrsun> up down of the internal frequency ref ?
[19:36:27] <mrsun> Using the Up/Down function allows the frequency reference to be set by two push buttons. One digital input must be
[19:36:27] <mrsun> programmed as the Up input (H1-oo= 10) to increase the frequency reference, the other one must be programmed as the
[19:36:27] <mrsun> Down input (H1-oo= 11) to decrease the frequency reference
[19:36:43] <pcw_home> that is PWM feed to two pins depending on polarity
[19:37:25] <mrsun> but that would require using a closed loop i guess to use that kind of command that i pasted there
[19:37:34] <pcw_home> 50% = 0 is the simplest but really needs a good enable circuit otherwise it will come up full -10
[19:38:31] <mrsun> Example: Terminal A1 is set to supply the frequency reference, and the bias (H3-04) is set to -100%. The frequency reference
[19:38:31] <mrsun> can be set from 0 to 100% with an analog input of 5 to 10 V. With an input of 0 to 5 V, the frequency reference can be set
[19:38:31] <mrsun> from -100% to 0%. The drive reverses the motor rotation with negative input
[19:38:34] <Loetmichel> mrsun: i would go the easy way and make a RC-filter behind the PWM, then a operational amplifier to amplify the signal from 0-5V to 20V and shift it 10V "down"
[19:38:51] <Loetmichel> implies a negative and positive 12V to 15V supply
[19:38:55] <mrsun> now theres something, i guess that would be so ic an use 0-10V signal and still ahve forward/rev on the it by 0-5V (rev) 5-10V (forward)
[19:39:04] <pcw_home> Right thats the 50% = 0 option
[19:39:16] <mrsun> pcw_home, ahh =)
[19:39:49] <mrsun> or ill just use the start forward/start rev and a pwm 0-10V to set the speed
[19:40:55] <pcw_home> Ya, If you have a for/rev digital input I would use that and a unipolar 0-10V its simpler
[19:40:56] <mrsun> got the basic forward/rev, e-fault and VFD fault return board built up
[19:41:34] <mrsun> just would have to add a terminal to connect a low pass filter for the 0-10V, tho the 0-10V requires me to have a +12V supply somewhere in there also :P
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[19:42:20] <pcw_home> PWM from parallel port?
[19:42:48] <mrsun> pcw_home, i guess, from emc
[19:42:58] <mrsun> got no mesa card :P
[19:43:46] <pcw_home> When we do this we first standardize the PWM with a CMOS gate running from a reference supply (3.3 or 5V)
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[19:44:24] <mrsun> pcw_home, huh ? :)
[19:45:05] <Loetmichel> pcw_home: taht would be a good idea, also ;-)
[19:45:10] <pcw_home> (the parallel port signal is not stable voltage wise)
[19:45:29] <mrsun> pcw_home, got a breakout board that gives me 0 - +5V
[19:46:14] <pcw_home> OK then just a op amp X2
[19:46:33] <mrsun> low pass + opamp X2 then ? :)
[19:47:10] <pcw_home> breakout give you 0 to 5V analog or just 5V signal level?
[19:47:17] <pcw_home> gives
[19:47:41] <mrsun> gah things gets a bit strange to me with all this, the bob wants a constant +5V voltage applied to the things im driving then it pulls stuff low by shorting to gnd ... feels all backwards =)
[19:47:50] <mrsun> pcw_home, digital levels
[19:48:11] <mrsun> so the pwm will be at the output but 0-5V guaranteed =)
[19:49:05] <pcw_home> OK so low pass filter, maybe multiple pole then op amp (matched resistors, input to +)
[19:49:49] <mrsun> ofc, as i need a second supply i could make the voltage 0-12V using the opto isolator on the board for the VFD
[19:50:09] <mrsun> gah i suck at electrical design =)
[19:51:43] <pcw_home> Yep that how some of our output potentiometer things like the spindle output on our 7I47S work
[19:51:45] <pcw_home> OPTO --> CMOS BUFFER --> RAIL-RAIL OP AMP
[19:52:25] <pcw_home> (CMOS buffer because OPTO doesn't swing rail to rail)
[19:54:53] <mrsun> ahh might be true, depending on the voltage drop over the opto on the breakout board i guess i might not have a full +5V
[19:55:08] <mrsun> see, here my electrical engineering stupidity comes in again :P
[19:55:32] <pcw_home> also depends on how good you need it to be
[19:57:16] <mrsun> i guess as i have opto couplers already from the breakout board i could just do with a buffer for the vfd signals? :)
[19:58:21] <pcw_home> Does the VFD have a 10V (potentiometer top lead) output?
[19:58:29] <mrsun> pcw_home, yes
[19:58:34] <mrsun> 10.5V
[19:58:39] <mrsun> for the frequency ref stuff
[19:59:38] <pcw_home> so maybe the easiest thing would be to use the OPTO output, low pass filter it and run it from this 10.5V
[20:00:40] <pcw_home> bbl
[20:01:06] <mrsun> pcw_home, ahh you mean couple the 10.5V to the opto coupler, then low pass filter the output fromt he opto coupler for the analog input ?
[20:02:22] <jthornton> all that is left now is to clean out the boil pot and wait for the beer to make itself
[20:02:24] <pcw_home> yes 10.5 to pullup res to OPTO
[20:02:52] <pcw_home> slave driving those poor little yeasties
[20:03:07] <mrsun> pcw_home, pull up res ? to where? :)
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[20:04:33] <mrsun> i wonder if the frequency ref common is the same common as everything else on the vfd
[20:04:54] <pcw_home> Well depending on polarity OPTO+ connects to 10.5V and OPTO- pulls up a resistor to ground
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[20:06:10] <pcw_home> _or_ 10.5V connects to resistor, other resistor side connects to OPTO+, and OPTO- connect to ground
[20:06:49] <pcw_home> so you now have ~10.5V PWM from the OPTO output
[20:06:59] <mrsun> as ive got it now +10.5V connects to opto, output of opto connects to resistor and then a cap to GND and back to the vfd
[20:08:54] <pcw_home> Sounds right but the resistor needs to connect to ground and you probaby need a series resistor as well since you will have very unsymmetrical drive resistance
[20:09:23] <jthornton> you know the little buggers love it till they get drunk
[20:09:41] <pcw_home> (this is why we follow the OPTO with a 4000 series CMOS gate in our stuff)
[20:10:27] <pcw_home> then a series resistor after the gate for the first RC pole
[20:10:50] <pcw_home> really BBL
[20:11:02] <mrsun> http://i44.tinypic.com/2hf2b8p.png thats how ive done it =)
[20:11:06] <mrsun> pcw_home, just go =)
[20:11:10] <mrsun> im just happy i get help :P
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[20:41:06] <PCW> mrsun: a 1K or so resistor from pin 9 of the PC847 to ground would probably make that work a lot better
[20:42:01] <mrsun> PCW, before or after the resistor to the cap ? :)
[20:44:56] <PCW> before
[20:45:07] <mrsun> oki =)
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[20:46:11] <PCW> makes the output more of a variable voltage source instead of variable current source
[20:47:23] <mrsun> ahh ok =)
[20:49:48] <PCW> looks like about 20 mA of LED drive on the OPTOs and 50% minimum CTR so 1K should just work with the lousiest OPTO
[20:53:03] <mrsun> PCW, the LED drive current is calculated to 20mA yes, 1.2V 20mA
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[20:53:28] <mrsun> tho they can take 50mA
[20:54:07] <mrsun> PCW, CTR?
[20:54:26] <PCW> Current Transfer Ratio
[20:55:29] <PCW> so 50% CTR and 20 mA in means ~10 mA out on the worst possible optocoupler (when new)
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[20:58:24] <mrsun> ahh ok =)
[20:58:40] <PCW> If this was not a one-off I would use a 1.5K K pulldown so the worst possible OPTO could tolerate a 33% loss of CTR over time and still work
[20:58:42] <PCW> but its extremely likely that the CTR in the OPTO you have is better than 200%
[20:59:19] <PCW> (since its somewhere between 50% and 600%)
[21:02:37] <PCW> This is much more fun than figuring out why my FPGA processor code for DMA packet reception from Ethernet
[21:02:39] <PCW> does not work but alas I must return to banging my head against the wall...
[21:02:41] <PCW> bbl
[21:02:57] <mrsun> hehe =)
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[21:03:28] <mrsun> but the A1 terminal should be high impedance right ?
[21:03:37] <mrsun> analog input terminal
[21:03:44] <PCW> I swear I make 2 mistakes in eveyy line of code
[21:03:45] <mrsun> so it shouldnt draw like any power ? :)
[21:03:57] <mrsun> PCW, haha days like that can just go away imo =)
[21:04:38] <PCW> Yes it normally should be high impedance (so potentiometers are reasonably linear)
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[21:10:17] <mrsun> so now those parts are done, putting vfd into source mode, connect the ouputs to the optos outputside inputs and let them go to vfd gnd, let VFD 10.5V go to opto coupler output side and low pass filter that and pass it back, now its just to get the relay to talk to me =)
[21:10:40] <mrsun> i guess i could use the NC side of the relay as a "READY TO RUN" signal and the NO side as FAULT ...
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[21:10:54] <mrsun> or ill just go for getting the fault side
[21:11:04] <mrsun> dont want to hog all the inputs i have just for the vfd =)
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[21:15:01] <mrsun> hopefully i wont burn stuff up :P
[21:15:16] <mrsun> quite expensive stuff to play with when you dont know what the hell you are doing :P
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[21:25:45] <Evertick> Howdy@
[21:25:48] <Evertick> !
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[21:27:34] <Evertick> I'm having some trouble figuring out ngcgui. Can anyone help?
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[21:29:35] <mrsun> PCW, grounding of signal cable, should it be done in one end or two ends? :)
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[21:34:03] <PCW> the analog? Both ends but just to the local GND of your PWM-potentiometer simulator
[21:34:15] <PCW> at the breakout end
[21:35:02] <mrsun> PCW, this board will be at the vfd unit and i will ahve a signal cable from the pc to it
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[21:39:08] <mrsun> PCW, the 1k was that supposed to go to the analog input gnd terminal ?
[21:39:14] <mrsun> =)
[21:39:57] <Jymmm> cradek: http://i41.tinypic.com/a9web8.jpg
[21:41:36] <cradek> meh, 1 should have been overbar(.9)
[21:42:15] <DJ9DJ> hmm, looks interesting
[21:42:43] <cradek> cute but not the greatest implementation
[21:43:04] <cradek> in particular the mishmash of different kinds of minus signs - poor typesetting
[21:43:50] <Jymmm> cradek: I thought you might enjoy it is all =)
[21:44:10] <PCW> mrsun yes
[21:44:12] <PCW> when you are done and before you connect to VFD you should have a isolated three terminal device like a potentiometer (V+ wiper GND)
[21:44:13] <PCW> and you should be able to test the voltage output with any handy 5- 12V power supply
[21:44:29] <cradek> and the 5 is just wrong!
[21:44:41] <mrsun> PCW, ahh ok =)
[21:44:48] <Thetawaves> Mach3 configuration guide for this 3 axis machine specifies 800 steps per (what i believe to be mm). These screws are 2 start 4mm pitch lead screws. SO 800 = x * (1/4) ... x = 3200 steps per rev
[21:45:00] <mrsun> PCW, yeah as it is now (ive already changed it) ive got 3 from eachother isolated terminals for the functions
[21:45:03] <cradek> Jymmm: I did, but my inner geek thinks it wasn't done by a math person :-)
[21:45:14] <Thetawaves> does my math add up?
[21:45:33] <mrsun> one for the analog (A+, Wiper, GND) one for digital inputs (S1, S2, S3 and common) and one for the relay output back to the pc
[21:45:40] <Jymmm> cradek: I'd love to see how you've improved upon it.
[21:45:42] <Thetawaves> 3200 steps / rev seems high...
[21:47:44] <mrsun> and i think ive managed to turn every single screw terminal upside down
[21:47:51] <mrsun> or back to front
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[21:54:25] <mrsun> oh well, fixed =)
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[21:56:44] <Jymmm> http://i39.tinypic.com/142fmgh.jpg
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[22:02:43] <raynerd> Hi guys, not stricktly linuxcnc but general cnc. I`m converting one of these TEP machines as someone else is on here. I need to add a z axis. The machine is only tiny and I was just wondering what peoples opinions were on using something like a vertical slide and adapting it for the z axis: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/RDGTOOLS-SMALL-VERTICAL-SLIDE-MINI-LATHES-TAIG-CONQUEST-CLARKE-/29065604275
[22:02:43] <raynerd> 6?pt=UK_Home_Garden_PowerTools_SM&hash=item43ac733f04
[22:04:42] <mrsun> got to love clients that cuts lines into half :P
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[22:06:19] <raynerd> or no use?
[22:07:01] <raynerd> If my machine was bigger I`d make one, but I don`t know how to get it all so compact and just thought a prebuilt slide would work OK.
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[22:14:05] <mrsun> gonna make this card tomorrow and see what happends i think =)
[22:14:10] <mrsun> thanks alot for the help PCW =)
[22:14:38] <PCW> Thank me if it works :-)
[22:19:25] <mrsun> PCW, hehe =)
[22:19:30] <mrsun> well you cant have made it much worse =)
[22:19:54] <mrsun> hopefully i wont burn out the breakoutboard and the parport :P
[22:33:34] <Jymmm> http://forgifs.com/gallery/d/198097-1/Rims-they-see-me-rollin.gif
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[22:42:48] <PCW> and... I have packet data!
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[22:47:26] <raynerd> Anyone about?
[22:48:11] <raynerd> I`m just about to order some parts to make my z axis. My travel on the x and y axis is only 13" in both directions... what would you be looking for in z axis on such a small machine?
[22:48:26] <raynerd> I thought about 4" ?
[22:49:37] <raynerd> But to get this, it means I have to have the y axis suspended a miniumum of 4" above the bed... on such a small machine I`m just wondering if this is all then getting a bit high
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[22:52:27] <DJ9DJ> gn8
[22:52:32] <raynerd> gn8
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[23:23:17] <Jymmm> Say Awwwwww (and even the cat with cabbage on it's head is cool) http://www.cutestpaw.com/articles/best-of-the-week-cute-animal-pictures-1/
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[23:44:52] <Jymmm> While the pipe are starburst candy, da shit inside looks legit! lol http://i42.tinypic.com/17e3xd.jpg
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[23:52:28] <alex4nder> woot
[23:52:40] <alex4nder> my taig did its first "professional" milling job
[23:53:15] <cstop> subdued clapping from near and far
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[23:54:48] <Thetawaves> i told the machine to move 5mm but instead it moves 2.5mm
[23:55:28] <pfred1> your axis scale correct?
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[23:56:31] <Thetawaves> axis scale?
[23:56:47] <pfred1> it is on your machine's conf file
[23:56:54] <pfred1> in not on
[23:57:11] <Jymmm> "I don't want to hide anymore." - Waldo
[23:57:21] <Thetawaves> i was using stepconf...
[23:57:42] <pfred1> yes stepconf makes up axis scales
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[23:57:49] <Thetawaves> where should i look for this file?
[23:58:06] <pfred1> in your EMC directory?
[23:58:17] <pfred1> you can change it in stepconf too
[23:59:11] <Thetawaves> i see a textual description of the scale setting but no actual place to set it
[23:59:11] <pfred1> it is a sum of your ratio your lead steps per revolution and your step mode
[23:59:37] <Thetawaves> ahhhhh