#emc | Logs for 2012-01-13

[00:00:13] <andypugh> Well, yes, purply-blue
[00:01:24] <Valen> mine is violet purple
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[00:02:03] <andypugh> I am having my usual completion-angst with this motor, I want to go back and redesign it all better, before I have even seen if it works..
[00:02:15] <Valen> thats usually how it goes
[00:02:36] <Valen> making a new motor or mucking with brushless drives?
[00:02:45] <andypugh> Making a new motor
[00:02:57] * Valen has made a few interesting ones
[00:03:06] <Valen> oh have you tried one of those hobby brushless motors on an 8i22 or whatever it is?
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[00:03:39] <andypugh> Not yet. I have run a number of motors on a 7i39, and a couple on an 8i20
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[00:04:11] <andypugh> Valen: This was the motor (running as a stepper here, so not very smooth)
[00:04:20] <andypugh> http://youtu.be/WEI6TBwydqs
[00:04:29] <andypugh> (You might well have seen it before)
[00:04:44] <Valen> because the 7i39 + hobby bldc looks like a decent way of getting some power into a cheap mill
[00:04:52] <Valen> cheaply
[00:05:05] <Valen> heh looks like out motor
[00:05:23] <Valen> DIY ring bearing?
[00:05:32] <andypugh> ?
[00:05:51] <Valen> we made ours with the outer ring having an integral bearing
[00:06:00] <Valen> so a 100mm dia bearing
[00:06:23] <andypugh> My bearing is 55mm OD, but is rather slender, yes.
[00:06:56] <andypugh> https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/kj_M8wpdQj-KTY5eH0Vjr9MTjNZETYmyPJy0liipFm0?feat=directlink
[00:07:22] <Valen> nice
[00:07:33] <Valen> howd you do the laminations?
[00:07:39] <andypugh> Making the laminations was moderately tedious.
[00:07:44] <Valen> heh
[00:07:57] <andypugh> But I punched the centre hole, then milled them individually
[00:08:20] <andypugh> Back up a few shots and there are pictures
[00:09:05] <JT-Shop> andypugh: what do you make of the mystery board?
[00:09:38] <andypugh> There is a fair chance that it never worked.
[00:10:26] <JT-Shop> yes, I didn't consider that option
[00:11:29] <andypugh> The one I bought had a 555 onboard oscillator which was handy for debugging.
[00:12:48] <andypugh> On the face of it, it looks a lot better than mine did.
[00:13:01] <JT-Shop> quality wise?
[00:13:35] <andypugh> Quality and design
[00:13:47] <andypugh> I like the in-hole mounting and heatsinking.
[00:14:34] <andypugh> (which probably also makes it much easier to replace the drivers. I gave up on mine when too many plated-through holes dropped oit.
[00:16:15] <andypugh> I wonder what the other connectors are for? I think with mine I had to do something to make it happy with limit switches.
[00:17:09] <JT-Shop> just looking at the pdf from page one and teh DB9 has a stop and limit pins on it
[00:25:45] <JT-Shop> another how to home my gantry question... want that one?
[00:28:06] <andypugh> Time for bed for me
[00:28:14] <andypugh> Maybe tomorrow.
[00:28:32] <Valen> catchya
[00:28:42] <andypugh> Night all
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[00:29:54] <JT-Shop> good night
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[01:15:47] <skunkworks_> logger[psha]_:
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[01:22:02] <jackc> anyone around that uses a 5i20?
[01:22:37] <seb_kuzminsky> jackc: what's up?
[01:22:59] <JT-Shop> yea, I use a couple of them
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[01:23:31] <jackc> seb_kuzminsky: ive got mine installed and im trying to figure out the pinouts. i used pncconf to make a basic config, and im looking at the .hal it created, but the encoders, pwms, and stepgens i made dont get net'd to any pins
[01:23:45] <seb_kuzminsky> hmm
[01:23:47] <jackc> where is there a doc that tells me which pin goes to which of those devices
[01:23:57] <seb_kuzminsky> the pinout will be logged in the syslog when you start the config
[01:23:58] <JT-Shop> did you look at dmesg for the pins
[01:24:00] <jackc> also, i cant figure out which real pin "gpio24" for isntance is
[01:24:07] <jackc> oh, really?
[01:24:10] <jackc> i will look
[01:24:11] <JT-Shop> yea
[01:24:14] <jackc> thanks a ton!
[01:24:18] <JT-Shop> np
[01:24:19] <seb_kuzminsky> the mapping from io number to pin number is in the 5i20 manual from mesa
[01:24:25] <seb_kuzminsky> and also in the dmesg/syslog output
[01:24:41] <JT-Shop> there is info in the EMC manual about that as well
[01:24:41] <jackc> seb_kuzminsky: doesnt it vary by which firmware gets loaded / how many "things" you ask it to make?
[01:24:58] <JT-Shop> yea, that's why you check dmesg
[01:25:04] <seb_kuzminsky> jackc: yes :-)
[01:25:15] <jackc> k. i will go downstairs and take a look now, im sure ill figure it out
[01:25:16] <jackc> thanks again
[01:25:20] <seb_kuzminsky> the syslog messages take all that into account, and tell you what you ended up with
[01:25:25] <jackc> sweet
[01:25:27] <JT-Shop> http://linuxcnc.org/docview/2.5/html/drivers/hostmot2.html
[01:25:54] <JT-Shop> http://linuxcnc.org/docview/2.5/html/drivers/hostmot2.html#_pinouts
[01:25:57] <jackc> JT-Shop: thanks, i looked around but the hostmot wiki stuff i found appears to be a bit outdated
[01:25:58] <seb_kuzminsky> no problem! good luck getting your machine up, ask again if you run in to any other problems
[01:26:14] <seb_kuzminsky> the "real" docs are probably better than the wiki at this point...
[01:26:21] <JT-Shop> :)
[01:26:21] <seb_kuzminsky> what JT sait
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[01:26:28] <seb_kuzminsky> *said
[01:26:43] <JT-Shop> dinner bell is ringing for JT
[01:26:52] <JT-Shop> bbl guys
[01:26:56] <seb_kuzminsky> have a good dinner!
[01:27:00] <seb_kuzminsky> bbl
[01:32:26] <Ekkeri> hmm.. is there a bitfile for Mesa 7I52 daughter card? (non-S)
[01:40:38] <Ekkeri> hmm.. I think I'm missing something because I can't find one for 7I39 either
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[03:14:49] <PCW> Ekkeri: "hmm.. is there a bitfile for Mesa 7I52 daughter card? (non-S)"
[03:14:51] <PCW> For 5I20 its probably SVSS6_6 for 6 encoders and 6 sserial channels
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[08:10:38] <clytle374> I have it running on, oddly it was after I deleted a /usr/realtime and reinstalled.
[08:11:16] <clytle374> It runs but will not build again due to ../lib/libemchal.so.0: undefined reference to `_rt_shm_alloc' and
[08:11:19] <clytle374> ../lib/libemchal.so.0: undefined reference to `rt_shm_free'
[08:11:52] <clytle374> I'm assuming this was a left over from something old. anyone know what config provides it?
[08:30:05] <clytle374> Linking halstreamer Where is this file? Missing header statement due to a rtai change?
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[09:11:47] <clytle374> That is part of rtai_shm. But obviously it works, but won't rebuild. How can this be?
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[09:41:22] <clytle374> Any care to guess the cause of this. http://pastebin.com/Pd7f0NTv
[09:42:39] <clytle374> And why after deleting /usr/reatime and a clean make of magna emc 2.5 started working. And now neither 2.4 or 2.5 will build, both giving the above error
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[10:10:58] <alex_joni> clytle374: what's the output from configure?
[10:14:33] <clytle374> it's here http://pastebin.com/EcL05Sev
[10:16:23] <clytle374> grep only finds it in /src/modsilent but the stuff I know is dwarfed by what I don't know
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[10:17:39] <clytle374> funny that after weeks of it building and not running, now it runs and won't build
[10:21:44] <clytle374> maybe I should clarify I'm only grep-ing the emc/src directory
[10:32:37] <alex_joni> clytle374: a bit odd layout you have
[10:32:51] <alex_joni> run-in-place, but in /usr/src/newtest
[10:33:47] <clytle374> yeah, it was kind of habit so I didn't change it. Was planning to install it after I got it all working
[10:33:56] <alex_joni> can you pastebin the output from the build?
[10:34:14] <clytle374> the whole thing?
[10:34:26] <alex_joni> if you run make now (without a make clean)
[10:34:51] <alex_joni> (I assume you already tried a make clean, then a fresh configure and make)
[10:35:01] <alex_joni> what's the emc version?
[10:35:17] <clytle374> yeah, and cleaned again just now. 2.5 branch
[10:35:46] <clytle374> 2,.4 branch does it too.
[10:37:04] <alex_joni> buildlog then please
[10:37:15] <clytle374> the ouput of make looks the same as the past starting with Linking halstreamer
[10:37:40] <clytle374> or the whole thing?
[10:40:03] <alex_joni> you can run make with some debug flag
[10:42:48] <clytle374> I got a bunch of Prerequisite xxxx is older than target yyyyy
[10:43:10] <clytle374> like this
[10:43:13] <clytle374> Prerequisite `/usr/realtime/include/asm/rtai_oldnames.h' is older than target `objects/rtapi/rtai_ulapi.o'
[10:43:21] <clytle374> error looked the same
[10:44:50] <clytle374> I'm posting it now
[10:45:49] <alex_joni> make V=1
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[10:48:25] <clytle374> it's here, http://pastebin.com/n1V2i7Dn want me to cmake clean first?
[10:49:56] <clytle374> I added the end of made -d to that paste
[10:52:46] <alex_joni> sounds like libemchal.so.0 isn't linked properly
[10:52:55] <alex_joni> can you make clean, and paste the whole build?
[10:53:37] <clytle374> yes, any debugging on for it?
[10:55:52] <alex_joni> yeah, but I think V=1 doesn't do anything anymore :(
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[10:58:16] <clytle374> Here is a straight make, let me know if you want any debugginh
[10:58:19] <alex_joni> but put it there just in case
[10:58:20] <alex_joni> ok
[10:58:43] <clytle374> http://pastebin.com/jQuZtAkk
[10:58:55] <clytle374> I'm running it again V=1
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[11:00:59] <clytle374> I don't see anything new with V=1
[11:01:36] <clytle374> should I kill the whole rtai install directory, then make clean and reinstall rtai?
[11:02:26] <alex_joni> no, this shouldn't have anything to do with rtai
[11:02:40] <alex_joni> can you check src/Makefile - line 31 or so
[11:02:52] <alex_joni> should have 'ifeq ("$(origin V)", "command line")'
[11:05:08] <clytle374> ifeq ($(origin PYTHONPATH),undefined)
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[11:06:08] <alex_joni> sounds like you don't have 2.4 or 2.5
[11:06:13] <alex_joni> what does VERSION say?
[11:06:42] <clytle374> python is 2.7
[11:08:10] <alex_joni> I am talking about emc2
[11:08:36] <alex_joni> emc2/src/Makefile should have the PYTHONPATH thing around line 50 or so
[11:08:50] <alex_joni> if in your file it's around 30, then there's something fishy
[11:09:01] <alex_joni> either you have an older emc2 version, or you changed Makefile
[11:10:01] <clytle374> I didn't edit the make file. I screwed up git last night, maybe it isn't right
[11:10:41] <alex_joni> emc2 2.2 branch has PYTHONPATH at line 32
[11:10:50] <alex_joni> http://git.linuxcnc.org/gitweb?p=emc2.git;a=blob;f=src/Makefile;h=06a67f0eda0241a22017d6fe4f998c1a1004444f;hb=refs/heads/v2_2_branch
[11:11:19] <clytle374> PYTHONPATH:=$(EMC2_HOME)/lib/python
[11:11:35] <alex_joni> but check topdir/VERSION please
[11:11:53] <alex_joni> what does it say?
[11:12:04] <clytle374> 2.4.6
[11:12:12] <clytle374> I screwed something up
[11:12:15] <alex_joni> yup
[11:12:47] <clytle374> So maybe 2.5 isn't broke only 2.4
[11:13:28] <clytle374> I've been working 16 hour days if you include trying to get his thing going.
[11:13:43] <clytle374> My fault I know, not complaining
[11:13:57] <alex_joni> hmm..
[11:14:07] <alex_joni> it seems in 2.4 it is as you are saying
[11:14:17] <alex_joni> so you probably have the 2.4 branch right now
[11:14:24] <alex_joni> but that one should work
[11:14:31] <clytle374> the branch that is running is 2.5
[11:14:42] <clytle374> I don't build in the git directory
[11:14:51] <alex_joni> now you lost me completely
[11:15:04] <alex_joni> if VERSION is 2.4.6 then you are building 2.4 branch
[11:15:42] <clytle374> I
[11:16:11] <clytle374> 've got 3 different build directories. I couldn't get 2.5 to run, but 2.4 did
[11:16:27] <clytle374> Then I was running git bisect to find the break.
[11:17:50] <clytle374> Then someone someone showed me a few things wrong in my kernel. And the problem went intermittant in both versions
[11:17:57] <clytle374> And my head started to hurt
[11:18:51] <alex_joni> in such cases.. scrap and redo from start ;)
[11:19:02] <alex_joni> preferably with a clear head
[11:19:46] <clytle374> I just copied the 2.5 and making sure it builds. Then I'm going to sleep all day
[11:22:20] <clytle374> Thanks for the help. Sorry it was a dumb mistake. After fighting it for a couple weeks, I got excited
[11:22:42] <alex_joni> heh
[11:22:46] <alex_joni> it shouldn't be so hard
[11:24:17] <clytle374> I know. I built at least 12 different kernel/rtai combos, some 64bit some 32 bit and they all would end in a watchdog bit
[11:24:25] <clytle374> no other erroes
[11:24:45] <clytle374> probably 5-6 configs of each
[11:26:32] <clytle374> Can anyone wright on the wiki? I'm going to do a new one for rtai-kernel with a gentoo section
[11:28:20] <alex_joni> anyone can write
[11:28:35] <alex_joni> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?BasicSteps
[11:31:47] <clytle374> thanks again. The existing docs aren't much help anymore. Going to milk the cow early and go to bed, good night all
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[11:55:11] <awallin> IchGocksLive mentioned some new "Vpython" cutting simulation development? anyone know something about that?
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[14:07:46] <Mjolinor> I have a pwmgen problem. I cant make the step size less than 100 us
[14:08:01] <Mjolinor> any links to read?
[14:09:23] <skunkworks> what period are you putting it in? The on time is going to be as long as the thread that it is put in.
[14:09:35] <skunkworks> minimum
[14:09:49] <Mjolinor> i need 1ms to 2ms
[14:10:18] <Mjolinor> I set offset adn minimum to 0.08 and maximum to 0.16
[14:10:22] <Mjolinor> 80Hz si the frequency
[14:10:48] <Mjolinor> so my minimum pulse is 1ms and max is 2 ms
[14:11:35] <Mjolinor> now I can scale but for example if I set hte scale to 40,000 then i just have to click the button 6 times, the width doesnt change until the 6th click then it goes to 1.1 ms
[14:12:19] <Mjolinor> problem si that 1.1ms is 5000 rpm, 1.2ms is 20,000 rpm 1,3 is about 30,000 rpm
[14:12:27] <Mjolinor> and I want more resolution on the revs
[14:17:31] <skunkworks> so - this is a radio control type device?
[14:17:36] <Mjolinor> yup
[14:17:51] <skunkworks> this may be above my paygrade
[14:17:53] <Mjolinor> :) well spotted
[14:17:58] <skunkworks> ;)
[14:18:00] <cncbasher> Mjolnor : have you seen the rc servo test code on the wiki ?
[14:18:08] <Mjolinor> no
[14:18:34] <Mjolinor> I think a parallel port will not do what I want, time to break out the PIC programmer
[14:19:28] <cncbasher> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?RC_Servo_Test
[14:19:54] <Mjolinor> cheers :)
[14:20:40] <cncbasher> hope it helps
[14:20:57] <Mjolinor> :) porblay not, it iwll jsut bake my noodle as they usually do :)
[14:21:02] <cncbasher> haha yea
[14:21:05] <Mjolinor> gese my typing sucks
[14:21:20] <cncbasher> just got my mini2440
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[14:22:43] <skunkworks> .6 - 2.4 (running 20us base period) would give you 90 steps according to the wiki... if I did that right...
[14:23:09] <skunkworks> 20 may be pushing it on some computers.
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[15:00:55] <MattyMatt> cncbasher, going to put miniemc on it?
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[15:12:45] <cncbasher> MattyMatt> yea i'm hoping to shortly
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[15:13:35] <MattyMatt> nice. that looks like a good embedded solution
[15:14:41] <MattyMatt> when I've done my lathe, I'll probably swap the PC between that and the lathe, unless I get a small controller
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[15:15:16] <MattyMatt> one old PC makes sense, dunno about a shopful :)
[15:16:36] <MattyMatt> ..and the mill..
[15:17:31] <MattyMatt> and the drill press. I'm CNCing that for a weird reason
[15:17:56] <MattyMatt> hobbing drive wheels for reprap
[15:40:57] <skunkworks_> MattyMatt: did you see - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ejnnP9rZkDo
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[15:54:15] <Guest16182> Hi every body we are starting a project using the Mesa 5i22 to control a Grinding Machine in Aguascalientes Mexico
[15:54:32] <jdhNC> hotwater mexico?
[15:54:38] <Guest16182> good toughs are well come
[15:54:52] <Guest16182> hot springs
[15:55:29] <jdhNC> surface grinder?
[15:57:48] <Guest16182> round grinding
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[16:29:39] <MattyMatt> skunkworks, is that yours?
[16:29:58] <skunkworks_> no - just youtube surfing
[16:30:18] <skunkworks_> I think they are cool - just don't think I will ever build one.
[16:33:37] <MattyMatt> the quality is still not compelling. you can tell stuff is printed in poor light or by touch
[16:34:05] <cncbasher> MattyMatt> problem now is connecting the 2440 up and getting some sense out of it
[16:34:36] <MattyMatt> it is getting perfectly satisfactory for stuff like handles
[16:34:52] <MattyMatt> 0.1mm layer heights, some people are doing
[16:35:08] <MattyMatt> that's 4/1000"
[16:43:29] <MattyMatt> somebody did an indiegogo for a reprap with emc2 as the official drive method. expect lots of incoming queries from them :)
[16:47:08] <MattyMatt> the_wench, reprap is http://objects.reprap.org/wiki/Builders/EMCRepRap
[16:47:33] <MattyMatt> does the_wench do queries?
[16:50:33] <MattyMatt> ah it's OK, only 54 full kits pledged and most of them will use Mach3 http://www.indiegogo.com/SeeMeCNC-H-1
[16:51:02] <MattyMatt> half dozen will wander in here at most
[16:52:46] <cncbasher> then once they try to install emc , 6 will dissapear
[16:55:21] <MattyMatt> not all six. if they're linux already they're not gonna run away immediately
[16:56:03] <awallin> that looks very wobbly...
[16:56:37] <MattyMatt> I'm half way through building in simulator mode on a deb 6 machine, so I can debug my gcode in the warm
[16:58:36] <MattyMatt> awallin they're not so bad when tightened up. they do need some diagonal struts to stop the gantry wobbling in X
[16:59:29] <awallin> did anyone try a delta-robot for 3d printing? since there are no cutting-forces..
[17:01:48] <MattyMatt> yep precision is the issue
[17:03:04] <MattyMatt> and extruder weight. they still weigh ~600g
[17:03:51] <MattyMatt> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X8i8Jy80wNU
[17:04:23] <MattyMatt> that's the best performing mendel atm. no drastic sign of wobble there
[17:05:13] <MattyMatt> the electronics mounting plate is supposed to provide the frame stiffness in X dir, and it seems to be working there
[17:05:21] <awallin> if that is done with steppers, how do they know they are not losing steps?
[17:05:34] <MattyMatt> your print comes out wonky :)
[17:06:17] <awallin> is there any problem with a high extruder feedrate? or can the extruder go as fast as the table
[17:07:02] <skunkworks_> this guy was going to - I don't know if he finished
[17:07:03] <MattyMatt> above 150mm/s (faster than most currently go) you begin to need more watts
[17:07:04] <skunkworks_> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5MOSnFSx8JQ&feature=mfu_in_order&list=UL
[17:07:42] <awallin> oh? then incoming plastic cools the nozzle?
[17:08:42] <MattyMatt> layers & nozzles are getting smaller for finer prints, so the quantity of plastic melted per second isn't really going up
[17:10:08] <MattyMatt> but yeah the plastic sucks the heat out of the nozzle
[17:10:33] <awallin> here's some progress on 2D offsets: http://imagebin.org/193434 (I'm cheating by drawing arcs as straight lines... for now)
[17:10:37] <MattyMatt> they are 25 - 60W typically right now
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[17:12:51] <MattyMatt> skunkworks_ nice
[17:13:13] <MattyMatt> ball joints are tricky without a lathe tho
[17:13:47] <MattyMatt> a drilled & tapped ball bearing in a printed cup would work
[17:15:02] <Loetmichel> re @ home
[17:15:26] <MattyMatt> awallin, I have watched your voronoi diagrams with interest but I haven't a clue what they're for :)
[17:16:53] <MattyMatt> that's the first one I've seen that looks like toolpaths
[17:17:20] <awallin> patience MattyMatt, patience.
[17:17:57] <skunkworks_> :)
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[18:27:30] <skunkworks_> https://github.com/bjj/2x_laser
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[19:30:55] <MattyMatt> do mesa cards need a pci chip or does the fpga handle that?
[19:33:13] <MattyMatt> I've got empty pcmcia slots on all my thinkpads. an fpga would make a nice copro
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[19:44:18] <JT-mobile> am i really on?
[19:45:02] <syyl> no!
[19:45:34] <JT-mobile> hA im on my eye phone
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[19:46:39] <syyl> eyephone, earphone, footphone..
[19:46:48] <syyl> ;)
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[19:47:26] <JT-mobile> last time I tried I could. not make it work
[19:47:44] <syyl> but now, it works :)
[19:47:58] <JT-mobile> :)
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[21:07:30] <skunkworks_> cool
[21:07:32] <skunkworks_> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VpLub9O2V6Y
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[22:30:17] <andypugh> I was disappointed at the response to my analogue input idea, I thought that it could be quite useful, and economical on pins too.
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[22:31:58] <andypugh> On an unrelated note, why does the "part" of gEDA import a schematic directly, but not create the netlist too?
[22:32:31] <andypugh> I mean "pcb" part. That was a very odd typo-type mistake
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[23:35:34] <awallin> latest CAMtastic results http://www.anderswallin.net/2012/01/2d-offsets/
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[23:36:12] <andypugh> ah, awallin, how did your IRAMS experiments turn out in the longer term?
[23:37:09] <awallin> andypugh: I did not finish the IRAMS project. It worked at low voltages/currents, but I almost let the smoke out of them when trying higher voltages..
[23:38:10] <awallin> current-sensing on the power stage was not easy (for me anyway..)
[23:38:34] <andypugh> I can't work out if they are actually any good at all. They look good on paper, but I blew two up
[23:40:07] <awallin> I thought I had an over-current protection circuit also, but heated them up quite rapidly/uncontrollably once or twice
[23:40:21] <andypugh> Did you have a heatsink
[23:40:23] <andypugh> ?
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[23:40:54] <awallin> yes, some old Pentium heatsink+fan, when testing with higher voltages.
[23:40:54] <andypugh> I was wondering about making up a batch of PCBs for them.
[23:41:30] <andypugh> (seeedstudio, batch of 10). They match the 3ppwmgen pretty well
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[23:43:08] <awallin> the mesa-card can do pid-loop and commutation. but I'm not sure about overcurrent-protection, or if a current or voltage loop is desirable
[23:43:41] <andypugh> From the forum: IOError: [Errno 32] Broken pipe
[23:43:51] <andypugh> Rings a bell, can't recall the cause
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[23:49:55] <awallin> gotta sleep now..
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