#emc | Logs for 2011-12-25

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[00:10:23] <syyl_ws> hmm
[00:10:23] <syyl_ws> http://pastebin.com/QjFZYYDL
[00:10:30] <syyl_ws> seems this to be right?
[00:11:22] <syyl_ws> spindle seems still to be "open loop"
[00:11:36] <jthornton> hmmm
[00:12:48] <syyl_ws> (output is via pwm, converted to 0-10V)
[00:13:20] <jthornton> this is the spindle on my CHNC http://pastebin.com/PYrLzeXk
[00:14:03] <syyl_ws> uh, thank you!
[00:14:07] * jthornton goes back to merging mill_canned.txt into gcode.txt
[00:14:30] <jthornton> np
[00:14:35] <syyl_ws> i think this will help me
[00:14:44] <jthornton> at least I know that it works for me
[00:15:02] <syyl_ws> :)
[00:15:11] <jthornton> I'm glad I could help
[00:15:19] <jthornton> merry x-mas eve
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[00:16:59] <Tom_itx> merry christmas eve to you too
[00:18:13] <jthornton> you got snow?
[00:18:59] <Tom_itx> nope
[00:19:23] <Tom_itx> Outdoor: 44.6 (F) / 7.0 (C)
[00:19:24] <syyl_ws> xmas is over here ;)
[00:20:04] <jthornton> some rain/snow/sleet for monday yuck
[00:20:09] <Tom_itx> there was frost this morning though
[00:20:22] <jthornton> syyl_ws: I forget where here is?
[00:20:30] <syyl_ws> germany
[00:20:35] <Jymmm> jthornton: Maybe you'll get a boogieboard for xmas
[00:21:09] <syyl_ws> we have xmax on 24. in the evening
[00:21:24] <syyl_ws> on 25. all the trouble is over ;)
[00:21:26] <jthornton> Jymmm: I expect nothing and I'm usually not disappointed
[00:21:48] <jthornton> I liked riding the trains in Germany, always on time
[00:22:04] <Jymmm> jthornton: I meant for boogieboarding in the rain/snow/sleet on Monday
[00:22:26] <syyl_ws> only, if there is no hint of snow in the air...
[00:22:28] <syyl_ws> or rain
[00:22:30] <syyl_ws> or sun
[00:22:38] <syyl_ws> then they are on time ;)
[00:22:42] <jthornton> what was the car museum in Stuttgart? Mercedes?
[00:23:02] <syyl_ws> jep
[00:23:29] <jthornton> one cylinder diesel car, hand cranked what a nice thing to see running
[00:23:43] <jthornton> old guy was as old as the car I think
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[00:24:33] <jthornton> last time I was there if you are a minute late you missed the train
[00:26:09] <jthornton> Jymmm: I do that in the Kubota side by side
[00:31:27] <syyl_ws> mh, getting a error from addf scale.1, but i added "loadrt scale" in the begining
[00:32:42] <jthornton> what error are you getting
[00:33:52] <syyl_ws> ah, got it
[00:34:01] <jthornton> nice!
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[00:34:08] <syyl_ws> loadrt scale count=2 helped ;)
[00:34:15] <jthornton> yep
[00:34:44] <syyl_ws> still learning that hal-stuff...
[00:35:17] <jthornton> once you know how it is easy as cake :)
[00:38:11] * jthornton wanders upstairs to cook some sausages
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[01:20:30] <Jymmm> reindeer sausages?
[01:24:38] <syyl_ws> yeah
[01:24:42] <syyl_ws> seems to work!
[01:27:40] <syyl_ws> and he does spindle sync move!
[01:27:43] <syyl_ws> yeah :D
[01:35:12] <mikegg> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JV04rj5QCzU
[01:35:15] <mikegg> i submit
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[01:51:08] <tom3p> i found several python based graph tool interesting for documenting hal files. this ones from Inria of France 'VisuAlea' running on ubuntu 10.04
[01:51:09] <tom3p> http://videobin.org/+5fm/5v7.html
[01:51:54] <tom3p> theres simpler earlier versions of the graph part
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[01:55:08] <tom3p> elefan & orange are similar but they even come from some tcltk code
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[02:01:23] <tom3p> 'vision' is the earliest ive found http://mientki.ruhosting.nl/data_www/pylab_works/similar_packages_vision.html
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[03:29:44] <tom3p> Merry Christmas everyone!
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[09:32:01] <Loetmichel> mornin'
[09:37:48] <automata> afternoon
[09:40:27] * Loetmichel is sittin at the Parents in laws living room table, looking at the nephews and nieces and waiting it to be tomorrow when we can drive home :-)
[09:41:26] <Loetmichel> ... with my notebook on my lap ;-)
[09:42:46] <automata> I am trying to understand the difference between G10 L1, G10 L10 and G43.1 commands...
[09:43:24] <automata> I understand that g10 Lxx programs the tool table entry
[09:43:25] <automata> and g43.1 sets the offset dynamically...
[09:43:42] <automata> i.e, from within the Gcode...
[09:45:08] <automata> I am writing a CAM program which also stores the tool Offsets...
[09:46:16] <automata> So, I could program the tool offsets at the start of the output Gcode file using the G10 L1 command and then use TXX M6 command to apply the proper tool offset
[09:46:44] <automata> OR : I could use G43.1 and set the offset dynamically inside the generated Gcode...
[09:47:02] <automata> I am trying to understand the pro's and cons of the two approaches...
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[09:57:53] <archivist> other approach edit the tool table in a text editor, reload tool table, so no changes to the gcode
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[10:22:42] <automata> I have been trying not to change the tool table manually but cant seem to find a reason for this stance.
[10:23:03] <automata> I will re-think changing the tool table...
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[11:48:50] <jthornton> well G10 L1 sets the tool table to a value you provide
[11:49:26] <jthornton> G10 L10 sets the tool table so that the current location becomes the values your provide
[11:50:01] <automata> Yup thats what I gathered...
[11:50:54] <automata> I am trying to figure out whether to use G10 L1 Z10 v/s G43.1 Z10
[11:51:04] <jthornton> and T- M6 will not load any offsets at all without a G43 after the tool load
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[11:51:57] <automata> huh? trying that out right now!!!
[11:53:51] <jthornton> automata: http://linuxcnc.org/docview/2.5/html/gcode/m-code.html#_m6_tool_change_a_id_sec_m6_tool_change_a
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[11:55:17] <automata> I was reading from: http://linuxcnc.org/docs/html/gcode_main.html
[11:56:27] <jthornton> the note about G43 it is in there too but not as loud
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[12:11:56] <IG-garage> jthornton: let me shov the picture of my wood stove
[12:13:21] <IG-garage> jthornton: http://img-fotki.yandex.ru/get/3416/137304751.1/0_75f65_b7d5008b_XXXL.jpg and http://img-fotki.yandex.ru/get/3416/137304751.1/0_75f66_859f0d2d_XXXL.jpg
[12:14:45] <jthornton> I noticed you didn't have a flue damper on the other pictures
[12:17:22] <IG-garage> flue damper? What is it? I am probably quite young to have one. :)
[12:18:48] <IG-garage> some pieces of wood are just below the pipe when I load the stove. When the door of the stove is closed, the flow is very tiny.
[12:19:06] <jthornton> it is a flat disk that goes in the flue pipe to regulate the flow of flue gas. Once your fire is going you close it down to stop all the heat from going out the roof
[12:19:57] <IG-garage> yeah, I probably need one.
[12:20:35] <IG-garage> What if I just make the door of the stove fit finely to the stove?
[12:21:01] <jthornton> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Flue-Damper-6-Cast-Iron-Chimney-/230696254314?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35b6917b6a
[12:22:38] <jthornton> dunno, I've never used a wood stove/heater without a flue damper
[12:23:15] <IG-garage> I can make one making a cut of the pipe till the half of its diameter and then insert such a flue damper and weld up the slit
[12:24:33] <jthornton> the link I showed you just drill a hole and put the pin through. make sure you have some small holes in the flue damper like the photo
[12:24:42] <IG-garage> I actually need to create the rest of the pipe. Its current end is horizontal and locates just behind the wall. (It has some cover for kids to not put any trash into it.)
[12:25:42] <IG-garage> But this one on the photo is 'unopened' and has noholes
[12:27:07] <jthornton> small holes in the center where the wire goes through
[12:27:28] <jthornton> ie you don't want to block it off 100%
[12:27:41] <jthornton> then your making charcoal
[12:28:00] <IG-garage> but how it is being fixed 90 degrees when you need full throttle?
[12:28:51] <jthornton> the spring provides enough friction to hold it where you set it and the handle indicates the position
[12:29:16] <IG-garage> ok
[12:29:21] <IG-garage> I can make one in the horizontal part of the piping, the one withing the garage.
[12:30:47] <IG-garage> What if the surface of the stove is too tiny to give off the heat to the air? I even thought of some tiny water heating system with anti-freeze liquid for car engines into it
[12:31:57] <jthornton> you can add some fins to the flue pipe to get more heat
[12:32:07] <archivist> input damper would seem to have a similar validity
[12:32:22] <IG-garage> only some or many of them?
[12:32:31] <jthornton> the damper will keep a larger portion of the heat in the stove vs the amount of wood you burn
[12:32:37] <IG-garage> and will damper prolongate the burning?
[12:32:43] <jthornton> yes
[12:33:03] <IG-garage> oh, i'll have added one into the system.
[12:33:50] <archivist> on the steam boiler we have a flue (output) and an above fire damper (input)
[12:35:34] <jthornton> is that the same as the draft control on my wood heater or the door damper on my wood stove?
[12:35:45] <jthornton> ie regulate the incoming air flow?
[12:36:07] <IG-garage> i understand it as it does exactly this
[12:36:11] <archivist> yes air above fire is the door
[12:36:32] <IG-garage> wait, i have some cool photo
[12:38:00] <IG-garage> http://www.krusto.ru/2011/01/06/miniatyurnaya-drovyanaya-pech-ot-bullerjan-furnaces/
[12:41:00] <IG-garage> heh, the stairs: http://www.krusto.ru/2011/01/25/lestnicy-visyashhie-v-vozduxe/
[12:41:59] <IG-garage> 'El revelry de intellecte'
[12:42:05] <jthornton> pretty complicated for a wood heater but an aesthetically pleasing design
[12:42:41] <IG-garage> it 'reminds V8 engine' as it is said in the webpage
[12:46:37] <archivist> I wonder if the heat exchanger should be improved and forced air in so it has a cool exhaust (I know the condensation in the exchanger would be a problem)
[12:48:53] <IG-garage> cool exhaust will probably not go up in the piping and you risk to to have it withing the building.
[12:50:02] <archivist> it will if pumped
[12:50:35] <IG-garage> this would be some complicated heating.
[12:50:38] <jthornton> if it is colder than the ambient air it might not go out, but that is not likely to happen
[12:51:57] <jthornton> these go in the flue pipe and have a small fan on the back http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/category_heaters-stoves-fireplaces+heater-stove-fireplace-accessories+heat-reclaimers
[12:52:00] <IG-garage> I'll go use sled to carry some more wood chips into the garage
[12:52:28] <jthornton> I've seen many home made versions of them
[12:53:37] <IG-garage> it turns on and off at a specified temperature
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[14:45:22] * jthornton has fun with canned cycles
[14:46:19] <mazafaka> this is pervy
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[14:52:17] <archivist> must be beer can cycles
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[15:03:33] <realmatt> does some one here know where I can get a schematic for the quill control board on a bridgeport series 2
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[15:24:52] <A2Sheds> realmatt: just out of curiosity, are you trying to fix it or retrofit?
[15:25:24] <realmatt> fix right now
[15:27:41] <realmatt> a pretty good story goes with this milling machine as well
[15:30:02] <A2Sheds> maybe here http://www.ebay.com/itm/BRIDGEPORT-Series-2-R2C3-CNC-Mill-Parts-Manual-II-/310216619466
[15:35:13] <realmatt> this is the one I have http://www.ebay.com/itm/BRIDGEPORT-Mill-Series-II-Standard-4J-Head-Op-Manual-2-/310212458748?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item483a1a78fc
[15:35:53] <realmatt> but still, this will be a great help with fixing it.
[15:35:59] <realmatt> Thanks !
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[17:28:06] <pcw_home> Merry Christmas, Happy Hanuka, Peaceful Kwanzaa and a (premature) Mawlid an-Nabi
[17:28:08] <pcw_home> And a big thanks to all the EMC developers/documentation wranglers/web site maintainers for their continuing excellent work!
[17:28:36] <Tom_itx> and to you a very Merry Christmas
[17:28:46] <A2Sheds> Happy Merry Festivus!
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[17:48:07] <skunkworks_> Happy Holidays!! Thanking everyone for another great emc year!
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[18:17:24] <Jymmm> Merry Christmas!
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[18:19:49] <elmo40> merry hoho
[18:20:15] <Jymmm> and a hoho to you too!
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[18:33:49] <IchGucksLive> Hi all around the world
[18:34:23] <alex4nder-> hey merry christmas
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[21:45:27] <CNCPC> Hello i want to use EMC to control Box Packing machine it has 2 axis(Step/Dir) and 5 Delta VFDs can i do it using Mesa 5i20 + 7I48 6 channel Analog servo interface. My VFDs can take 0-10v .. i just need to syncronize their speed only. All ACIM motors have encoders.
[21:46:45] <CNCPC> anyone here?? andypugh??
[21:52:12] <A2Sheds> quiet in here, but you can
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[21:53:05] <CNCPC> A2Sheds: you mean its possible???
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[21:53:18] <A2Sheds> CNCPC: sounds like a piece of cake
[21:54:00] <CNCPC> can you tell me where to start?? any speed syncro Configs/HAL etc,
[21:54:24] <A2Sheds> analog 0-10V out to your VFD, servos in velocity mode
[21:56:24] <A2Sheds> there might be some configs to copy/start with
[21:56:53] <CNCPC> ok A2Sheds, if its possible than i will check all the configs available..
[21:57:40] <A2Sheds> I'm just looking at the gcode to command speed vs position
[21:57:50] <CNCPC> one question comes in my mind . if we can drive it this way than whats the difference between Servo AMP and VFDs
[21:57:53] <CNCPC> just out of curiosity
[21:58:01] <A2Sheds> you can use the standard pncconf to get a basic hal and .ini
[21:59:07] <A2Sheds> the type of motors
[21:59:48] <A2Sheds> ac servo amp for ac servo, servo amp for dc servo, vfd for AC induction motor
[22:00:17] <CNCPC> ok that i got it.. but it means if we tweak in PID than can we get jerky/low resolution Position control of AC motors??
[22:00:29] <A2Sheds> yes
[22:00:58] <A2Sheds> somebody else here is doing similar on the knee for their mill
[22:01:04] <CNCPC> u sure of it?? anyone tried this before???
[22:01:12] <A2Sheds> sure
[22:01:15] <CNCPC> if you find please send me the link
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[22:03:33] <A2Sheds> i was just thinking about using g01 vs g96 spindle control
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[22:04:08] <CNCPC> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3oTJNEVpvYY
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[22:04:18] <CNCPC> he used AC induction motor as servo
[22:04:42] <A2Sheds> sure
[22:04:59] <A2Sheds> it's not as precise as a servo, but it works for many apps
[22:06:06] <CNCPC> yes thats what i was thinking i have 2-3 apps in my mind that need this kind of solution..
[22:07:01] <A2Sheds> servos will have better torque over a wide range of speed, an AC induction motor was designed with a much small range in mind
[22:07:32] <A2Sheds> it comes down to the windings and magnets used
[22:08:10] <A2Sheds> also accel decell times, inductance etc etc
[22:09:16] <A2Sheds> everyone must be out at xmas party's
[22:09:25] <A2Sheds> or hungover
[22:10:43] <CNCPC> u are right... thats what i was thinking.. why anyone not answering
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[23:43:50] <alex4nder-> hey
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[23:59:34] <gene76> Hi all