#emc | Logs for 2011-12-05

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[00:04:58] <andypugh> That PS that Jymmm posted earlier is perfect. Have a look inside it with a text editor, it tells you what to edit, and it's all done with variables.
[00:05:20] <Tom_itx> i missed that one
[00:05:54] <Jymmm> andypugh: Told ya =)
[00:06:10] <Jymmm> andypugh: What most ppl dont realize is that PS is actually a programming language
[00:06:32] <andypugh> Oh, I knew that. I also know it is a programming language I don't know.
[00:07:03] <Jymmm> andypugh: It's super easy though. even Tom_itx can do it ;)
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[00:20:43] <andypugh> It doesn't matter to me, but that file actually puts in twice as many slots as asked for, because it multiplies in the wrong place.
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[00:23:41] <JT-Shop> andypugh: why bitmap instead of vector?
[00:24:31] <andypugh> Because printing in inherently bitmap
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[00:25:27] <JT-Shop> unless you have an old pen plotter :) I guess
[00:25:56] <andypugh> I have considered drawing resist lines directly, because I do have an old pen plotter.
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[00:26:40] <andypugh> Normally I shun bitmaps, but the people I might get to print it for me say that they want a 6702x6702 bitmap.
[00:26:49] <andypugh> (that's for a 60mm negative)
[00:27:22] <JT-Shop> what are you making?
[00:27:28] <andypugh> An encoder
[00:27:31] <JT-Shop> cool
[00:28:13] <andypugh> JT-Shop: Have a look at the file Jymmm found (and I mean, have a look inside it) http://fennetic.net/pub/irc/encoder-panelized.ps
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[00:33:15] <JT-Shop> that ain't a whole lot of lines of code to describe an encoder disk
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[00:34:44] <JT-Shop> carp I don't have anything that prints PS
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[00:40:11] <andypugh> More than half that code is filling the page with duplicates, and putting some circular text in the middle.
[00:41:44] <JT-Shop> I like this comment %Don't mess around here unless you know what you're doing"
[00:43:43] <andypugh> Anyway, time to log. Night all.
[00:43:51] <JT-Shop> goodnight Andy
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[00:52:05] <A2Sheds> you can pick up a Canon 9600dpi inkjet for ~$100, inkjet transparency film ~$20 100-sheets
[00:53:44] <A2Sheds> 1pL drops should be good enough for an encoder wheel
[00:56:09] <A2Sheds> tell Andy http://www.amazon.com/Canon-iP2702-Inkjet-Printer-4103B002/dp/B0032AN4O4/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1323046528&sr=8-1
[00:56:31] <A2Sheds> this has 2pL drops, only $42.56 ea
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[01:20:02] <danimal_laptop> JT-Shop: chiller's working good so far
[01:20:12] <danimal_laptop> anodized all day yesterday, no problems
[01:20:37] <Tom_itx> that coil tube in your pics?
[01:21:31] <danimal_laptop> yea
[01:21:48] <danimal_laptop> it's plumbed to a 500w chiller
[01:21:49] <Tom_itx> must be stainless?
[01:21:52] <danimal_laptop> no
[01:21:55] <Tom_itx> hmm
[01:21:56] <danimal_laptop> aluminuminum
[01:22:12] <danimal_laptop> stainless would die faster
[01:22:15] <danimal_laptop> in the acid
[01:22:17] <Tom_itx> oh
[01:23:08] <danimal_laptop> most people use aluminum cathodes for anodizing
[01:23:25] <danimal_laptop> the coil is connected to the cathodes, effectively making it one
[01:23:49] <Tom_itx> how expendable does that make it?
[01:24:28] <ssi> JT-Shop: no, no luck
[01:24:46] <danimal_laptop> it'll last a while if i take it out when not in use, but it only cost me $12 to make, so no biggie
[01:24:55] <Tom_itx> oh
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[02:00:18] <A2Sheds> danimal_laptop: does the tank temp stay constant with the chiller?
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[02:03:33] <danimal_laptop> yes, pretty decent
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[03:00:56] <A2Sheds> pcw_home: what value resistor did you say the 7i33 terminates the encoder input signals with?
[03:02:50] <A2Sheds> nevermind it's in the datasheet 132 ohm termination
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[03:35:16] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: are you on ubuntu?
[03:37:16] <Jymmm> http://i42.tinypic.com/160d98m.jpg
[03:37:20] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: http://i42.tinypic.com/160d98m.jpg
[03:38:36] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: that's just a scrncap
[03:40:08] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: http://i40.tinypic.com/vhunt2.jpg
[03:40:28] <Tom_itx> is that a TV test pattern?
[03:40:36] <Tom_itx> i preferred the old indian one
[03:40:37] <Jymmm> LOL, no an encoder
[03:40:49] <Tom_itx> :)
[03:41:44] <Jymmm> =)
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[03:51:11] <Tom_itx> Jymmm, what dpi does that print?
[03:53:45] <JaegerBar> Tommy
[03:53:56] <JaegerBar> I figured out what JaegarBar means finally
[03:58:51] <cevad> That would be Mama Gkika's?
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[04:32:21] <nieros_> I know this is an EMC specific channel.. but are there any good general primers on Storage? I come from a heavy networking background and I'm looking to dive in.
[04:35:35] <Jymmm> Tom_itx: it's postscript, so any you want
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[05:02:02] <Eartaker> nieros_, storage as in?
[05:03:13] <nieros_> SAN, FC, iSCSI etc- all of it. I'm a complete noob but was introduced to Vblock this past week (UCS/MDS + VNX) and thought it was the coolest shit ever.
[05:04:16] <nieros_> I just have absolutely no idea where to even start :)
[05:05:20] <Eartaker> you might have better luck asking in ##hardware since nothing in this room has to do with networking or server storage arrays
[05:05:47] <nieros_> oh,
[05:05:55] <nieros_> EMC.. is not the EMC I was thinking
[05:05:58] <nieros_> XD
[05:06:06] <Eartaker> nope.. EMC is a CNC control program
[05:06:15] <nieros_> which is equally cool
[05:06:23] <nieros_> But completely different
[05:06:26] <Eartaker> yep lol
[05:06:30] <nieros_> thanks!
[05:06:33] <Eartaker> np
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[05:52:21] <ssi> hrm
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[06:05:24] <Loetmichel> mornin'
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[06:28:52] <JaegerBar> Loetmichel did not sleep long enough
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[06:38:02] <Loetmichel> JaegerBar: bullsh**. 5 hours are enough. but now i have to hurry, I have to be at the company in 20 minutes and still sitting in the Bathtub ;-)
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[06:40:35] <psha[work]> Loetmichel: if the mountain will not come to Mohammed, Mohammed will go to the mountain
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[06:47:53] <Loetmichel> psha[work]: hmm?
[06:48:14] <Loetmichel> [07:37:46] <Loetmichel> JaegerBar: bullsh**. 5 hours are enough. but now i have to hurry, I have to be at the company in 20 minutes and still sitting in the Bathtub ;-)
[06:49:07] <Loetmichel> 10 minutes now, fasten seat belts, its 12 minutes drive if NO rush hour...
[06:49:17] <Loetmichel> <- flying low to the company
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[07:11:06] <Loetmichel> re @ company
[07:11:43] <Loetmichel> little bit late but thats normal for me ;-)
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[09:06:22] <JaegerBar> Loetmichel do you still take baths? or showers?
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[12:26:42] <A2Sheds> my ballscrews are shaky @ 0.5"/sec., looks like I have to tune the servos a bit more
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[13:22:52] <Mjolinor> I am jsut writing some pic SW to activate the current reduce pin on the TB6560 when there is no step signal
[13:23:11] <Mjolinor> Is 2 milli seconds enough time for a stepper to do it's stuff before I reduce hte current?
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[14:05:07] <Loetmichel> Mjolinor: as a normal stepper can only start with about 1ms, i would sax: its critically short... better 5 or 10 ms
[14:05:19] <Loetmichel> say
[14:05:31] <Loetmichel> s/1ms/1kHz
[14:12:53] <SWPadnos> Mjolinor, I'd say more like 1-2 seconds. consider this: with a 2ms timeout, you can't step slower than 500 steps/second without the PIC putting the drive into low current mode
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[14:18:28] <cradek> restarting is the harder thing to solve
[14:18:36] <cradek> by the time you get your first step pulse it's too late
[14:24:44] <cradek> to do it right, I recommend adding current-reduction ability to software stepgen
[14:25:22] <cradek> it would first resume full current, then hold the step pulse for a configurable amount of time, then step
[14:26:15] <cradek> there are all sorts of other hold times already implemented, due to the inherent lousyness of step/dir control.
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[14:38:54] <mrsun> scraping scraping scraping, lalala =)
[14:39:08] <mrsun> only problem is that my back hurts, else i realy like doing it =)
[14:42:17] <mrsun> and table is conical about 0.1mm in the dovetails, thats gonna take some work :P
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[15:36:33] <ssi> mrsun: what part of the world are you in?
[15:43:02] <jthornton> ssi did you get your compressor going?
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[15:46:28] <IG-garage> jthornton: can you give a link to website with a photo of the wood stove in your workshop?
[15:47:28] <jthornton> http://gnipsel.com/shop/machines/machines.xhtml
[15:57:36] <IG-garage> thanks. I'm about to weld together mine one, myself, out of stainless steel.
[15:58:24] <ssi> jthornton: no
[15:58:29] <ssi> jthornton: I ordered a new start cap from mcmaster
[15:59:00] <ssi> if that doesn't fix it, I may try finding a motor shop
[15:59:19] <jthornton> IG-garage: cool, yea the stove is a bit low to load without laying on the floor
[15:59:31] <jthornton> ssi: hopefully that fixes it
[15:59:35] <IG-garage> this former something will be a stove soon. http://img-fotki.yandex.ru/get/4524/137304751.1/0_741a2_d3da10ac_XL.jpg
[16:00:24] <ssi> jthornton: hopefully... I did take the opportunity to replace the wire feeding it. It was woefully undersized
[16:00:30] <FinboySlick> IG-garage: Don't burn the bike!
[16:00:40] <ssi> and whenever the thing would trip the breaker, that wire would be uncomfortably warm :)
[16:01:03] <ssi> also, after replacing the 30A breaker with a 50A one, it no longer trips the breaker, it trips the motor's internal thermal cutout
[16:01:07] <jthornton> yea then you had a voltage drop causing the current to rise
[16:01:52] <jthornton> so it is still drawing too much current I assume
[16:02:06] <jthornton> I don't have any idea what a bad run cap will do
[16:02:06] <IG-garage> Why do you need a riser for the stove? It need to warm up the cold air which is at the floor
[16:02:25] <jthornton> so I can load it without laying on the floor
[16:02:53] <jthornton> the whole shop gets comfy warm when I run the stove
[16:03:17] <IG-garage> but this could make you young and fresh! "as a cucumber" as we say in Russia :)
[16:03:39] <jthornton> I put a cheap box fan behind the stove to blow the hot air to the other side of the shop
[16:03:41] <ssi> I've seen some less-than-fresh cucumbers...
[16:03:52] <jthornton> lol
[16:04:30] <jthornton> IG-garage: I got to drive a Ural with a side car the other day... very interesting steering
[16:05:27] <IG-garage> FinboySlick: this is the bottome of the stove, it now has the door but I do not have a photo yet: http://img-fotki.yandex.ru/get/5822/137304751.1/0_741a5_3d291fe2_XL.jpg
[16:06:06] <FinboySlick> IG-garage: Oooh, I thought you were going to convert that concrete workspace into a stove.
[16:06:21] <IG-garage> Ural is just like a pickup truck. You even can start its engine using kick-start when you sit onto the bike
[16:06:49] <IG-garage> I will con
[16:07:15] <IG-garage> I will convert it into a cozy steampunk-styled workshop
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[16:18:18] <Mjolinor> my reason for doing it in a PIC is that I don't have enough IO to do it with a dedicated prallel port pin
[16:18:52] <Mjolinor> I am also sitting the PIC in series with the step line so that I don't pass the step until the current is high
[16:19:44] <cradek> then you may put the first step too close to the second step
[16:19:56] <cradek> you can't delay steps without stepgen knowing about it, or you will violate timing constraints
[16:20:06] <Mjolinor> from what i can gather form the rather crappy toshiba data sheet the pulse is 66 us (microstepped) so I figured 2 ms was plenty
[16:20:47] <Mjolinor> but maximum jitter imposed by the PIC is about 3 us, I cant see that making anydifference, it's too short
[16:21:18] <cradek> I don't understand how jitter is related to delaying the first step pulse
[16:21:57] <Mjolinor> themaximu delay between getting the step signal from the parallel port and aserting the output pin is 3 us, taht si what I am claling jitter
[16:22:26] <Mjolinor> sadly ther eis no info in the tosh data sheet about how long the current takes to increase or decrease as hte TQx pins change
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[16:22:33] <cradek> how long does the drive take to power up?
[16:22:38] <cradek> ah that's what I was just wondering
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[16:26:15] <Mjolinor> i think I will rewrite it and make it a few seconds
[16:26:53] <Mjolinor> i just did it the easy way decrementing an 8 bit register but that is max 2ms so I will have to go to the internal timer and set a few seconds to power reduce I think
[16:26:55] <Mjolinor> it iwll be better
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[16:44:32] <ssi> I found a motor shop near me that'll look at it if the cap doesn't fix it
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[17:10:59] <Loetmichel> re @ home
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[18:04:31] <IchGucksLive> Hi all
[18:04:54] <treid> howdy
[18:11:12] -!- danimal_laptop [danimal_laptop!~kvirc@] has joined #emc
[18:11:34] <danimal_laptop> dammit it's my turn for interweb troubles
[18:11:56] <alex4nder-> danimal_laptop: it goes round and round
[18:12:18] <danimal_laptop> tech douche is coming soon
[18:12:23] <alex4nder-> danimal_laptop: hey, what's your normal CAM/g-code writing process?
[18:12:42] <alex4nder-> it's become clear that I have a lot to learn
[18:12:48] <danimal_laptop> the spensive one
[18:12:59] <IchGucksLive> today i discoverd some differencein 2.3.5 to 2.4.4
[18:13:06] <alex4nder-> danimal_laptop: sigh
[18:13:11] <IchGucksLive> the crc routine is diferend
[18:13:22] <alex4nder-> the expensive one is 5 times more than I've spent on my mill
[18:13:27] <danimal_laptop> lol
[18:13:30] <danimal_laptop> join the club
[18:15:14] <alex4nder-> I sat through a program that I generated via Mesh-CAM, and I spent most of the time yelling at the tool path "WHY ARE YOU DOING THAT"
[18:15:48] <IchGucksLive> alex4nder-: did you try Heekscad
[18:16:21] <alex4nder-> IchGucksLive: I downloaded it, but haven't generated any g-code from it yet
[18:16:41] <IchGucksLive> try it you wiill be impressed
[18:16:53] <alex4nder-> cool
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[18:19:45] <archivist> alex4nder-, human gcode can be a lot shorter and more sensible
[18:20:11] <alex4nder-> archivist: yah, I busted out some Python and wrote up a g-code macro expander.
[18:20:48] <alex4nder-> but thanks a lot regardless for EMC2: my taig is now up and running and milling aluminum.
[18:21:06] <archivist> no need for python as emc gcode has variables
[18:21:42] <alex4nder-> that's cool, but I'm comfortable in python.. I just wrote parametric functions for tasks I wanted to do, and chained them together.
[18:22:16] <archivist> I started out doing that but moved to clever gcode less to do in the long run
[18:22:30] <alex4nder-> cool
[18:24:20] <archivist> only one set of code to debug then
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[18:40:50] <IchGucksLive> emc2 Backgroundgrid Display modification http://youtu.be/dOgYmTkrkAE
[18:43:21] <IchGucksLive> someone can check if it is running propper ?
[18:43:48] <IchGucksLive> done by mic thanks
[18:47:32] <Loetmichel> re @ home
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[19:04:35] <A2Sheds> I came across a mountain of servos, steppers, controllers, amps, ball screw positioners
[19:05:06] <IchGucksLive> A2Sheds: ad what speed
[19:06:31] <A2Sheds> speeds? for which?
[19:07:33] <A2Sheds> I just missed a truckload of robots
[19:08:30] <IchGucksLive> as here by printer steppers you can only get a boy of 100 pairs
[19:09:11] <IchGucksLive> box not boy
[19:09:20] <A2Sheds> i got it
[19:09:21] <IchGucksLive> B)
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[19:11:36] <Loetmichel> A2Sheds: send over the mountain ;-)
[19:12:39] <IchGucksLive> Loetmichel: querry ? readched you
[19:13:38] <A2Sheds> Loetmichel: how much is the VAT in Germany for mechanical parts?
[19:13:51] <IchGucksLive> 19%
[19:14:14] <Loetmichel> IchGucksLive: yes, unfortunally.
[19:14:21] <IchGucksLive> B)
[19:14:25] <Loetmichel> VAT ist 19%
[19:14:35] <Loetmichel> for everything but Food
[19:14:36] <A2Sheds> several of then are Siemens, couldn't they be shipped back as part of a recycling program and skip the VAT?
[19:15:00] <IchGucksLive> i work for Siemens
[19:15:14] <Loetmichel> IchGucksLive: why do you think i am interested in Styrocutting?
[19:15:31] <IchGucksLive> this is not styrocat
[19:16:15] <IchGucksLive> rc-network is highly interestet in the modification files to styrocut
[19:16:57] <Loetmichel> IchGucksLive: ok, dann auf deutsch: NERV NICHT! ich meld mich schon wenn mich was interessiert!
[19:17:02] <Loetmichel> sorry.
[19:17:09] <IchGucksLive> B)
[19:17:39] <IchGucksLive> ok im off for today !
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[19:23:19] <JaegerBar> speaking german eh?
[19:23:28] <JaegerBar> interested in what?
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[19:26:46] <JaegerBar> Nerv?
[19:27:38] <syyl_ws> mr. loetmichel is not very amused about ichgucklive
[19:27:39] <syyl_ws> ;)
[19:29:19] <JaegerBar> what doth Nerv mean?
[19:29:30] <Loetmichel> dont bother me
[19:29:35] <JaegerBar> sorry
[19:29:46] <Loetmichel> means "nerve mich nciht"
[19:29:49] <Loetmichel> nicht
[19:30:11] <JaegerBar> you're not nervous?
[19:30:17] <Loetmichel> no
[19:30:26] <Loetmichel> just annoyed
[19:30:26] <alex_joni> not yet
[19:30:28] <Loetmichel> ;-)
[19:30:48] <JaegerBar> oh it means like "i'm not annoyed"
[19:31:22] <JaegerBar> let me make u some kartoffel gratin to relax you
[19:31:26] <Loetmichel> ichgugslive had postet the third or fourth time a youtube link in my query without comment.
[19:32:02] <Loetmichel> and i said to him: "dont annoy me, if i want to see your videos i will call you!"
[19:33:09] <Loetmichel> btw: gratin is french ;-)
[19:33:21] <Loetmichel> (but used in german also)
[19:33:56] <JaegerBar> lol potatoes are from south america
[19:34:27] <JaegerBar> so it's all really an american dish
[19:34:48] <JaegerBar> do you have a youtube channel Loetmichel?>
[19:35:17] <JaegerBar> i remember you showing me some videos but i forgot the channel name or if they were private
[19:35:35] <Loetmichel> JaegerBar: the were on my private server ;-)
[19:35:38] <Loetmichel> they
[19:35:47] <Loetmichel> s/were/are
[19:38:28] <JaegerBar> k
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[19:47:32] <JaegerBar> Loetmichel, how much does a small home cost in Frankfurt area?
[19:48:51] <Loetmichel> JaegerBar: 100m^2 IN frankfurt: about a million eur and up
[19:49:25] <Loetmichel> >30km from frankfurt: about 300k Eur tops ;-)
[19:49:48] <JaegerBar> holy crap
[19:49:53] <JaegerBar> how much is your house worth?
[19:50:02] <JaegerBar> 250k Eur?
[19:51:01] <Loetmichel> i live in a rented appartment
[19:51:29] <Loetmichel> i think a little more, the house has 4 appartments
[19:51:29] <JaegerBar> where do you do your machining?
[19:51:45] <alex4nder-> the kitchen
[19:51:49] <jdhNC> car trunk.
[19:51:58] <Loetmichel> s/appartment/condo
[19:52:22] <JaegerBar> hmm......
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[19:52:49] <Loetmichel> the condo has 1 bedroom, 1 living room, 2 rooms for children , kitchen and bathroom.
[19:53:19] <Loetmichel> as we have no childs: one room is the bureau of my wife, the other is my workshop ;-)
[19:53:28] <Spida> *g*
[19:53:36] <Loetmichel> jdhNC: car trunk also ;-)
[19:53:43] <JaegerBar> sexy
[19:55:06] <Loetmichel> jdhNC: you have seen this video i presume? -> http://www.cyrom.org/MC/fraese_in_auto.mp4
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[19:56:01] <Loetmichel> JaegerBar: and the rent here is about 1100,- eur for roughly 100m^2 condo... PLUS heating/electricity/water
[19:56:11] <Loetmichel> plus 50 eur monthly for the garage ;-)
[19:56:47] <JaegerBar> it really makes no sense to buy in that case
[19:57:15] <Loetmichel> oh, it would.
[19:57:20] <Loetmichel> but nothing new
[19:57:24] <JaegerBar> oh ok
[19:58:25] <A2Sheds> what does it cost to rent 500m^2 of factory/industrial space there?
[19:58:26] <JaegerBar> i'm still renting myself
[19:58:33] <Loetmichel> IF we had enough money we would buy an old farmhouse with Barn and a stable and some ground around and renovate it
[19:58:47] <JaegerBar> keep saving Michel ;)
[19:58:48] <Loetmichel> A2Sheds; depends on the region
[19:59:03] <Loetmichel> inside the 20km around frankfurt: very expensive.
[19:59:36] <A2Sheds> what is expensive? 5000 eur/mo?
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[19:59:59] <Loetmichel> outside with more than 10 minutes to the next highway exit: about 10 to 30 eur/m^2
[20:00:19] <Loetmichel> A2Sheds: that would be CHEAP
[20:00:26] <A2Sheds> wow
[20:00:56] <Loetmichel> would be like renting a factory right on wall street ;-)
[20:01:07] <JaegerBar> hahaha
[20:01:10] <Loetmichel> frankfurt is our "wallstreet"
[20:01:15] <JaegerBar> it is?
[20:01:19] <JaegerBar> i thought that's Munchen?
[20:01:19] <Loetmichel> yes
[20:01:44] <A2Sheds> outside Chicago $1200, in the city $5k
[20:01:52] <Loetmichel> no, munich is more like ...i dont know... niagara falls?
[20:02:03] <JaegerBar> lol
[20:02:11] <Loetmichel> no, i think hollywood hills is better
[20:02:33] <A2Sheds> I was just in Niagara Falls, didn't remind me much of Munchen
[20:02:34] <JaegerBar> which is the equivalent of Silicon Valley in Germany? ie, the tech city
[20:02:40] <Loetmichel> the beauty and the rich
[20:02:45] <Loetmichel> hmmm
[20:02:54] <Loetmichel> that would be outside munich
[20:02:57] <Loetmichel> and around
[20:03:00] <JaegerBar> so Bavaria
[20:03:06] <Loetmichel> more or less
[20:03:17] <Loetmichel> but the rhineland is also much technology
[20:03:59] <Loetmichel> only the north is not so really on the top of the technology
[20:04:02] <JaegerBar> i guess the entirety of Germany is tech-related
[20:04:11] <Loetmichel> more or less yes
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[20:04:47] <A2Sheds> I seem to meet lots of software developers in the area between Frankfort and France
[20:04:59] <JaegerBar> Alsaz Loraine?
[20:05:50] <Loetmichel> dont forget: here are living 80 million peope on the same size as califonia + nevada ;-)
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[20:06:37] <A2Sheds> is there a high tech area near Freiburg?
[20:07:15] <Rogge> Are there and GladeVCP folks online now?
[20:07:37] <JaegerBar> hahaha that's a lot of people
[20:08:40] <cradek> Rogge: don't ask to ask; always just ask your real question. if someone has the answer they will give it to you.
[20:09:34] <Rogge> Sorry! I've followed the Glade tutorials and been successful integrating Glade to Axis... but can it be used to design a UI from scratch?
[20:10:44] <cradek> I don't know if ALL the necessary pieces are there, but I think many are
[20:12:21] <Rogge> I've seen UIs in Moccha, QT, TCL - can someone offer an opinion on a good platform for UI development?
[20:12:33] <JaegerBar> lol he's really running his mill in the back of his car
[20:14:16] <syyl_tb> uhm
[20:14:22] <syyl_tb> whats up with http://www.linuxcnc.org/ ?
[20:15:04] <skunkworks_> syyl_tb: upgrading
[20:15:11] <syyl_tb> ah, ok
[20:15:17] <syyl_tb> thank you :)
[20:19:10] <A2Sheds> why didn't EMC get a name like Joomla or Drupal or Hjkkhzvh?
[20:19:19] <Loetmichel> JaegerBar: right ;-)
[20:19:39] <Loetmichel> i was on a convention with some 50 quadcopterfans
[20:19:51] <syyl_tb> emc sounds much cooler ;)
[20:19:58] <JaegerBar> damn that convention sounds really fun
[20:20:15] <Loetmichel> and have sat more time behind my car and bulinding spare parts than flying in this three days ;-)
[20:20:31] <A2Sheds> http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/d4/Mobile_Machine_Shop_US_Army_1943.jpg
[20:20:50] <Loetmichel> niche and comfy ;-)
[20:20:52] <Loetmichel> nice
[20:21:45] <FinboySlick> A2Sheds: And then you turn some aluminium and end up with burnt nipples ;)
[20:21:53] <syyl_tb> looks like there is a real lathe in it..
[20:22:22] <Loetmichel> FinboySlick: in german i would call you a "weichei"
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[20:22:30] <Loetmichel> s;-)
[20:22:53] <FinboySlick> Loetmichel: Google will decide on my impending reaction.
[20:23:48] <Loetmichel> that bit of aluminium shreds... i have used an angle grinder on steel with only short trousers on in "my days"...
[20:24:00] <FinboySlick> Loetmichel: OK, one wikipedia article later, allow me to reply: Oh sure, you germans have tough nipples, I've seen Rammstein on stage.
[20:24:09] <Loetmichel> HARHAR
[20:24:48] <alex4nder-> FinboySlick: Rammstein on stage is .. something
[20:25:07] <Loetmichel> i thint "sissy" would be the correct translation... sasy dict.cc
[20:25:08] <FinboySlick> alex4nder-: Yeah, that's a mild way to put it.
[20:25:09] <Loetmichel> ;-)
[20:25:50] <Loetmichel> ramstein is not my kind of music, but i hafe done one or two stages for them...
[20:26:03] <alex4nder-> FinboySlick: at the show I went to, they were breaking fluorescent lights over each other
[20:26:18] <Loetmichel> lets say it this way: be happy to not know what happens BACKSTAGE ;-)
[20:26:31] <alex4nder-> and spraying the crowd down with some cartoon proxy phallus
[20:26:46] <alex4nder-> needless to say later in the tour, they got arrested
[20:27:05] <FinboySlick> alex4nder-: after mock-sodomizing someone, last I've seen.
[20:27:36] <Loetmichel> FinboySlick: are you sure that WAS "mock" ? ;-)
[20:27:36] <alex4nder-> FinboySlick: yup, they did that at this show as well.
[20:27:50] <alex4nder-> Loetmichel: well if it was real, the keyboardist did a good job keeping the show going
[20:27:56] <Loetmichel> arhar
[20:28:04] <alex4nder-> either way, they're characters
[20:28:13] <Loetmichel> yes, backstage also ;-)
[20:28:15] <alex4nder-> haha
[20:28:19] <Loetmichel> its not just show ;-)
[20:28:19] <A2Sheds> it's illegal there to mock someone?
[20:28:41] <Loetmichel> A2Sheds: no, but to sodomize ;-)
[20:28:43] <alex4nder-> in the US it's all fun and games until someone breaks out a fake penis
[20:28:46] <Loetmichel> on stage ;-)
[20:29:01] <alex4nder-> but I saw them in LA, and that's just par for the course here.
[20:29:35] <A2Sheds> or a breasticle for 0.2 seconds on live TV
[20:29:47] <alex4nder-> think of the children
[20:30:08] <syyl_tb> but direct hit from a 12ga shotgun in the face is ok? ;)
[20:30:26] <alex4nder-> only if you're in the executive branch
[20:30:37] <Loetmichel> syyl: americans... 'nuff said :)
[20:31:25] <A2Sheds> so how do they undo all the damage to children in Germany since they allow nudity on TV, in magazines etc?
[20:31:35] <alex4nder-> A2Sheds: they let them form bands like Rammstein
[20:31:39] <alex4nder-> problem solved
[20:31:50] <A2Sheds> hehe
[20:32:20] <Loetmichel> A2Sheds: what damage?
[20:32:25] <alex4nder-> you ever played the game Florida or Germany?
[20:32:58] <alex4nder-> someone will tell you a completely messed up/twisted/ridiculous story, and you have to guess if it happened in Florida or Germany.
[20:33:26] <Loetmichel> last time i was asked th do "the talk" to the boy of a friend of mine ( 8 years!) he asked" ok, uncle, what do you want to know?"
[20:33:27] <Loetmichel> ;-)
[20:34:00] <FinboySlick> syyl_tb: Direct hit from shotgun is okay, just ask Dick Cheney ;)
[20:34:14] <Loetmichel> ant i i look at the rates of teen birth germany doesent do so bad...
[20:34:20] <Loetmichel> and if i
[20:34:21] <A2Sheds> Loetmichel: not sure, but it must be really bad since they have to ban it from TV, unless it's on cable
[20:34:51] <Loetmichel> A2Sheds: in germany?
[20:34:55] <Loetmichel> or in us?
[20:35:00] <A2Sheds> in the US
[20:35:51] <Loetmichel> i think so.. in germany you can have softcore live on (free)tv if you stay awake long enough ;-)
[20:36:17] <Mjolinor> donkeys and wet suits if oyu pay for it :)
[20:36:22] <Loetmichel> we have more concerns about brutality than sex over here
[20:36:56] <FinboySlick> Loetmichel: With the exception of brutal sex?
[20:37:01] <A2Sheds> violence seems to be fine here
[20:37:14] <Loetmichel> FinboySlick: hmmm
[20:37:57] <JaegerBar> lol softcore.....jesus
[20:38:08] <Loetmichel> Mjolinor: donkeys? I dont know (i am married and have no use for this channels) but i think tat would violate the law for animal protection
[20:38:23] <Mjolinor> :) probaly
[20:38:39] <FinboySlick> Even if the donkey enjoys it?
[20:38:48] <Mjolinor> I suppose fish would be OK though
[20:39:15] * FinboySlick protests piscine abuse.
[20:39:31] <Mjolinor> mind oyu, I don't knwo what oyu could do with a fish adn I am pretty sure I have no desire to know
[20:40:08] -!- syyl_tb has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
[20:41:19] <FinboySlick> And to think all this talk is A2Sheds's fault with his mobile machine shop.
[20:41:25] <Loetmichel> hihi
[20:41:39] <Mjolinor> hmm, mobile machine shop, wetsuits adn fish
[20:41:55] <FinboySlick> Mjolinor: You forgot the donkey. Never forget the donkey.
[20:41:58] <syyl_ws> can we choose another topic?
[20:41:59] <Mjolinor> true
[20:42:06] <syyl_ws> maybe
[20:42:08] <syyl_ws> uhm
[20:42:10] <syyl_ws> hmm
[20:42:13] <syyl_ws> damn
[20:42:15] <Mjolinor> I am jsut working on what help could be given on the EMC channel for such problems
[20:43:04] <Mjolinor> I am quite sure that my spindle would not have hte power or speed required for such situations
[20:43:06] <syyl_ws> maybe hi ditched his mobile shop in a river, and tries to pull it out with a donkey...
[20:43:27] <syyl_ws> and the wetsuit...
[20:43:32] <syyl_ws> he doesnt want to get wet
[20:43:56] <Loetmichel> harhar
[20:44:13] <syyl_ws> sounds pausible to me
[20:44:27] <Mjolinor> sounds kinky to me
[20:44:50] <syyl_ws> ...
[20:44:56] <syyl_ws> you got a problem ;)
[20:45:56] <Mjolinor> it sounds like a logic problem, how to get a mobile shop out of a river using only a donkey, a wet suit adn a fish
[20:46:26] <syyl_ws> ever played maniac mansion?
[20:46:32] <syyl_ws> or monkey island?
[20:46:57] -!- Rogge has quit [Quit: Few women admit their age. Few men act theirs.]
[20:47:05] -!- viesturs [viesturs!~viesturs@] has joined #emc
[20:47:22] <syyl_ws> but
[20:47:26] <syyl_ws> other topic
[20:47:36] <viesturs> Hello! Can anyone tell me, what is going on with EMC2 homepage?
[20:47:37] <syyl_ws> i finished my spindle encoder disc :)
[20:48:01] -!- e-ndy [e-ndy!~jkastner@static-84-242-102-36.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #emc
[20:48:51] <skunkworks_> viesturs: site upgrade
[20:49:09] <viesturs> Ok, so then I have 2 questions:
[20:49:11] <syyl_ws> you should set an autoreply for that ;)
[20:49:32] <viesturs> 1) is there any chance to get packages that are emc dependencies?
[20:50:26] <skunkworks_> viesturs: the wiki is up.. http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?Installing_EMC2
[20:50:41] <skunkworks_> sudo apt-get build-dep emc2
[20:50:50] <skunkworks_> sudo apt-get install build-essential autoconf
[20:51:44] <viesturs> I suspect I need EMC repository for that, right?
[20:52:07] -!- andypugh [andypugh!~andy2@cpc2-basl1-0-0-cust492.basl.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #emc
[20:52:13] * skunkworks_ doesn't know the inner workings of linux that well
[20:52:41] <cradek> this is the .01% of our 99.99% uptime
[20:52:51] <skunkworks_> heh
[20:52:51] <andypugh> Poor old Visteurs, he is at a client site hours from home the day that Linuxcnc.org is taken down
[20:52:51] <andypugh> 
[20:52:58] <JaegerBar> syyl_ws , please send some pictures of your spindle encoder project
[20:53:03] <viesturs> I wrote on developers list - I noticed that wiki showed up, I also noticed that some changes on www.linuxcnc.org have appeared, but I do not see any other progress
[20:53:18] <cradek> they are working on it
[20:53:20] <andypugh> Ah, Hi visteurs
[20:53:31] <cradek> there is no number of emails that will make them able to work faster
[20:53:44] <andypugh> The eu mirror for the LiveCD is up, is that any good?
[20:53:57] <andypugh> Or the Git repository
[20:54:02] <viesturs> andy: yes, I am pretty amgry to that guy, who did not warn that site might be down. I would have planned installing that machine beforehand.
[20:54:21] <viesturs> cradek: I hope that it can help choosing, which part to fix the next...
[20:54:27] <skunkworks_> cradek: from cold (65deg or so) to 2000rpm working temp is .0028"
[20:54:38] <cradek> skunkworks_: wow, that's a lot
[20:54:38] <andypugh> It was mentioned on the forum, but I didn't see it anywhere else.
[20:55:09] <skunkworks_> cradek: and why I want to compinsate for it ;)
[20:55:25] <viesturs> andy: yes, that is where I see the problem, AFAIK all such announcements are communicated also in the mailing list.
[20:55:50] <syyl_ws> JaegerBar
[20:55:56] <JaegerBar> >?
[20:56:03] <syyl_ws> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/24396704/doppelencoder_3.jpg
[20:56:23] <JaegerBar> wow that's pretty cool
[20:56:36] <syyl_ws> thats not the final version
[20:56:46] <Mjolinor> thats a lot of slots
[20:56:51] <syyl_ws> 120 ;)
[20:57:03] <viesturs> cradek: do You have any idea, if repository might become available in any nearest hours? If not, then I could just not waste my time and go home, it is 11PM for me, would not want to wait all night just for nothing
[20:57:04] <syyl_ws> machined them right a few minutes ago
[20:57:10] <Mjolinor> hmm, do you need that many, my lathe has 48
[20:57:17] <Mjolinor> I have no idea if htat is enough or not
[20:57:27] <syyl_ws> more didnt kill me...
[20:57:31] <JaegerBar> can you send me pictures of the machined version
[20:57:33] <cradek> usually you'd want the slots to be 50% wide
[20:57:39] <JaegerBar> the *actual real life* version
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[20:58:01] <cradek> viesturs: I would be very surprised if there wasn't something up within a few hours
[20:58:08] <viesturs> skunkworks: sudo apt-get build-dep emc2 is not working (at least for me)
[20:58:36] <viesturs> cradek: ok, thanks
[20:58:52] <Mjolinor> with 48 slots and 2000 rpm that gives 96k ppm which I thought was a lot for a parallel port
[20:59:12] <syyl_ws> got a mesa card :D
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[20:59:40] <Mjolinor> hmm, I'm tight
[20:59:54] <andypugh> syyl_ws: Have you seen: http://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/products/716-0604/
[21:00:52] <andypugh> JaegerBar: You can look at mine if you want: https://picasaweb.google.com/108164504656404380542/Gibbs#5437112859354194098
[21:01:46] <Mjolinor> how many slots is that?
[21:01:57] <Mjolinor> and why do you need that many
[21:01:58] <cradek> viesturs: http://old.linuxcnc.org/emc2/dists/lucid/
[21:01:59] <andypugh> I have forgotten. 150?
[21:02:17] <Mjolinor> or maybe a better question is how many do you need for thread cutting?
[21:02:27] <cradek> viesturs: I suggest you waste no time getting the files you need
[21:02:57] <viesturs> cradek: from where?
[21:03:01] <cradek> THAT URL
[21:03:02] <andypugh> Mjolinor: For this: http://www.youtube.com/user/blyndpew?feature=mhee#p/u/8/3oTJNEVpvYY
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[21:03:26] <viesturs> ok, sorry, did not notice, that You posted the link
[21:03:33] <cradek> no problem
[21:03:38] <cradek> I didn't mean to yell
[21:04:16] <Mjolinor> ok so not an AC motor
[21:04:36] <andypugh> Yes, that is just a normal AC motor and normal VFD
[21:04:45] <Mjolinor> oh crap I have a lot to learn
[21:04:56] <skunkworks_> cradek: so maybe this weekend or sooner I will have spindle temp on the pyvcp :)
[21:05:29] -!- sumpfralle [sumpfralle!~lars@on1.informatik.uni-rostock.de] has joined #emc
[21:06:27] <Mjolinor> so are oyu fefeding hte inverter with 0-10 or over soem other interface?
[21:06:47] <Mjolinor> so are you feeding the inverter with 0-10 or over some other interface?
[21:07:47] -!- JaegerBar has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
[21:09:46] <Mjolinor> I was just going to use for my spindle and hope that I can configure EMC to accept the headstock disc input to provide feedback for the PWM signal
[21:10:17] <Mjolinor> from what I have read that shoudl be possible but I haven'#t got that far into EMC yet, I am still making ahrdware
[21:10:37] <Mjolinor> and let's hope my hardware is better than my typing
[21:13:59] <Nick001-Shop> Hi all - Having a prob getting 10.04 to work with asus P4P800SE motherboard with bios 1010.007, 1011.001 or 1012. It shows the first screen if I'm fast enough and then a blank screen. 8.04 is currently on it and working well. Any ideas?
[21:14:07] -!- JT-Shop [JT-Shop!~chatzilla@216-41-156-59.semo.net] has joined #emc
[21:14:41] <cradek> Nick001-Shop: how much ram?
[21:16:15] <syyl> hmpf
[21:16:19] <syyl> now he left
[21:16:22] <syyl> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/24396704/2011-12-05_21-58-29_419.jpg
[21:16:38] <cradek> pretty
[21:16:44] <syyl> 120 slots
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[21:16:58] <cradek> looks like a good approximation of 50% slots too
[21:17:02] <syyl> index slot will soon follow
[21:17:06] <syyl> yeah
[21:17:10] micges_ is now known as micges
[21:17:25] <syyl> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/24396704/2011-12-05_21-04-40_323.jpg
[21:17:36] <syyl> machined it with a 0.8mm endmill ;)
[21:17:50] <cradek> I bet that took patience
[21:18:03] <Nick001-Shop> 1 gig
[21:18:19] <syyl> 101minutes machining time
[21:18:22] <cradek> Nick001-Shop: what kind of video?
[21:18:42] <Nick001-Shop> agp video card
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[21:19:09] <cradek> if you hold down left shift can you get the grub menu?
[21:19:21] <cradek> did you check the md5sum of your iso before you burnt it?
[21:20:32] <Nick001-Shop> dont know about the shift key - dl 4 times with same result
[21:21:11] <cradek> it's very silly to download 4 times when you can check the md5sum and be sure whether or not you have a good download
[21:21:51] <cradek> first verify that your download is right, then try holding left shift while booting to get the grub menu, and there are some video options you might try
[21:22:30] <Nick001-Shop> what video options?
[21:22:50] <cradek> look on the screen to see what they are - I don't remember
[21:22:58] <cradek> from memory perhaps "nomodeset" is one of them
[21:23:26] <cradek> you can also verify your CD *after* burning it, via an option on that screen
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[21:24:57] <Nick001-Shop> Dumb one - how do I check the md5sum after?
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[21:28:37] <JaegerBar> thanks Andy....what motor are you using for this servo?
[21:31:18] <JaegerBar> andypugh , why are you making this servo motor
[21:31:50] <syyl> JaegerBar
[21:31:51] <syyl> [2216:20] <syyl> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/24396704/2011-12-05_21-58-29_419.jpg
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[21:34:23] <alex4nder-> syyl: sick
[21:34:45] <syyl> looks almost like i planed it in the cad ;)
[21:35:23] <Crumpite> I've got a question about an error I keep getting in stepconf, can anyone help ?
[21:36:13] <Crumpite> The error is: Traceback (most recent call last):
[21:36:13] <Crumpite> File "/usr/bin/stepconf", line 1926, in on_jogplus_pressed
[21:36:13] <Crumpite> self.update_axis_params()
[21:36:13] <Crumpite> File "/usr/bin/stepconf", line 1915, in update_axis_params
[21:36:13] <Crumpite> halrun.flush()
[21:36:14] <Crumpite> IOError: [Errno 32] Broken pipe
[21:39:49] <Nick001-Shop> where do I get a md5sum checker prog for linux - all I'm finding is for windows and I don't have wine
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[21:42:01] <Mjolinor> i think it is there if oyu open a command window
[21:42:44] <Mjolinor> md5 <tab><tab> at the command line
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[21:51:15] <andypugh> JaegerBar: Just reading back through the logs. That was just an experiment to see if it was even possible to do that with an AC motor. The eventual application will be spindle alignment for a toolchanger on my miling machine.
[21:52:09] <JaegerBar> pure genius
[21:52:44] <skunkworks_> What did I miss?
[21:53:38] <Mjolinor> donkeys wetsuits fish and index disks the quality of which even Apple can't conceive
[21:53:42] <JaegerBar> damn i really need to get me a mill so i can do cool electromechanical projects like this
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[21:57:33] <andypugh> ABS sensor wheels would make an OK encoder target, possibly using the actual ABS sensor.
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[21:58:04] <andypugh> http://www.gasgoo.com/auto-products/sensor-558/1133452.html for example.
[21:58:33] <Mjolinor> don't think they would be accurate enough
[21:58:49] <Mjolinor> they use halleffect sensors
[21:58:55] <andypugh> You can thread (just about) with one PPR
[21:59:08] <Mjolinor> hmm
[21:59:24] <Mjolinor> so I have no worries with my original disk at 48 slots then
[21:59:46] <andypugh> No, I hobbed gears with a 50 tooth sensor
[21:59:54] <Mjolinor> abs discs hardly work for ABS in reality :)
[22:00:28] <andypugh> A crank angle sensor is something I mean to experiment with (I have a few in my desk at work)
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[22:00:45] <Mjolinor> that would work I think
[22:01:01] <andypugh> That's a 60-2 magnetic track. They even use quadrature on stop-start vehicles.
[22:01:01] <Mjolinor> still hall effect but a lot better device generally
[22:01:40] <Mjolinor> but you may have problems iwth the actual mass of metal that you can have unless you are going to use a wheel the size of a flywheeel on a car
[22:01:45] <cradek> andypugh: missing pulse for index?
[22:01:59] <andypugh> Yes, hence my recent query on the dev list
[22:02:06] <cradek> andypugh: (that would be interesting/challenging to deal with)
[22:02:42] <andypugh> Mjolinor: The crank sensor is about 100mm diameter, pressed on to a hub that sits behind the FEAD belt drive.
[22:03:10] <Mjolinor> ok, soem are, I was htinkin g of hteones on the flywheel
[22:03:11] <andypugh> (Easy to press off the hub, then you have an 80mm through-hole, ideal for a lathe encoder)
[22:03:37] <andypugh> Yes, they used to use the actual starter ring gear.
[22:03:38] <cradek> do they control both spark and injection?
[22:03:46] <andypugh> cradek: Yes.
[22:03:47] <Mjolinor> yes
[22:03:56] <cradek> I suppose you could put the index hole wherever nothing needs to happen
[22:04:02] <Mjolinor> they control everything from that :)
[22:04:04] <andypugh> And they guarantee injection accuracy to 0.1 degree.
[22:04:48] <andypugh> (I don't know anything about sparks, our engines don't use them :-)
[22:04:54] <cradek> heh
[22:05:10] <cradek> in USland they all do :-)
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[22:05:36] <A2Sheds> andypugh: http://www.amazon.com/Canon-iP2702-Inkjet-Printer-4103B002/dp/B0032AN4O4/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1323046528&sr=8-1
[22:06:04] <A2Sheds> 2pL 4800dpi
[22:06:09] -!- Connor [Connor!~Connor@] has joined #emc
[22:06:18] <A2Sheds> $43
[22:08:07] <andypugh> A2Sheds: I am in the UK, and if I buy a printer it will be laser.
[22:08:30] <A2Sheds> that link started as amazon UK
[22:08:35] <A2Sheds> something changed
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[22:08:52] <andypugh> No point having an encoder that runs when it gets wet
[22:08:57] <A2Sheds> anyway, an inkjet like that can easily print your encoder
[22:09:46] -!- JT-Shop [JT-Shop!~chatzilla@216-41-156-59.semo.net] has joined #emc
[22:09:52] <andypugh> For once, $43 != £80. http://www.amazon.co.uk/Canon-4800x1200dpi-resolution-Borderless-Printing/dp/B0036ORDSO/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1323122955&sr=8-1
[22:10:01] <Nick001-Shop> cradek Found the info and the cd checks good to the md file on the cd. I'll try the shift key and then put in a newer video card and see if that helps. BTW do you have a Hardinge HCNC with the flat turret and are you using the plc to control it (Pico card?)
[22:10:06] <A2Sheds> you can either seal the print or use a ethanol based ink for thermal inkjet
[22:10:49] <skunkworks_> andypugh: like a resolver? ;)
[22:11:31] <andypugh> skunkworks_: Resolvers do win for ruggedness, but I don't fancy trying to make one.
[22:12:18] <andypugh> Though, as I am already making a brushless motor...
[22:12:44] <skunkworks_> heh
[22:13:18] <skunkworks_> andypugh: the expantion/voltage was close enough to linear to me...
[22:13:20] <cradek> mine is HNC and yes it uses classicladder for the turret
[22:13:30] <cradek> the turret is extremely easy to run
[22:13:53] <cradek> it has full position feedback built in, and takes only two output bits to run
[22:14:30] <skunkworks_> SO - I should put a limit3 in front of the offset componant... just in case?
[22:15:28] <JaegerBar> andypugh can you teach me how to make a PID controller using an Atmel 8 bit microcontroller
[22:15:55] <skunkworks_> JaegerBar: why?
[22:16:10] <JaegerBar> i want to get better at control theory so i know what i'm doing when i go and get a servo kit
[22:16:39] <skunkworks_> JaegerBar: emc would let you experiment and the pid componats are already there...
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[22:17:07] <andypugh> skunkworks_: Won't hurt
[22:17:41] <skunkworks_> andypugh: I figured..
[22:17:42] <JaegerBar> well in truth i want to become a better control theorist
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[22:17:59] <JaegerBar> i tried to tie it into the channel topic to stay relevant
[22:18:12] <andypugh> I am not especially good at control theory.
[22:19:45] <JaegerBar> so what
[22:19:55] <JaegerBar> i want to learn how write the C code for that to see if i can
[22:20:11] <JaegerBar> it doesn't have to perform perfectly, i just want to be able to ask you questions on how to get it roughly working
[22:20:20] <andypugh> The actual code is really simple.
[22:21:13] <cradek> once you understand pid the code is trivial to write
[22:21:15] <andypugh> When the forum comes back, I can give you a link.
[22:22:03] <JaegerBar> i understand an integral control loop
[22:22:17] <JaegerBar> but i don't understand how you can have P, I, and D controls all in the same loop
[22:22:27] <JaegerBar> and i also don't understand the discrete time theory
[22:22:45] <JaegerBar> converting a continuous time theory to work in the discrete-time domain which is in reality everything nowadays because it's all digital
[22:22:50] <Nick001-Shop> cradek - do have those files posted somewhere. I'm using Wallaces software files and I've actually had the machine going to the next tool without indexing and proceeding to continue. Luckily I was cutting air at the time. I think I should try for someting a little more reliable. It's back to normal for now but who knows for how long./
[22:22:55] <cpresser> JaegerBar: do you have basic knowledge in control theory?
[22:23:17] <andypugh> JaegerBar: You are over-thinking it :-)
[22:23:23] <andypugh> P = Pgain * E
[22:23:39] <cpresser> if yes, which is your native language. i have some pretty good stuff in german if you want to understand the math behind it :)
[22:23:44] <andypugh> I = I + Igain * E
[22:23:55] <andypugh> D = Dgain * (E - oldE)
[22:24:01] <andypugh> C = P + I + D
[22:26:47] <cradek> Nick001-Shop: nope I don't.
[22:29:34] <JaegerBar> well andy, can i ask you some questions after i have my plant setup
[22:29:39] <JaegerBar> i want to make a little servo
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[22:30:19] <JaegerBar> my native language is english but i can understand some germanic languages
[22:32:17] <andypugh> What will be the starting point of your servo?
[22:34:53] <Nick001-Shop> cradex - are those files or something close to what you have on the linuxcnc somewhere? I've looked at the ladder files and I'll be in deep dudu trying to put them together.
[22:35:26] <cradek> Nick001-Shop: I don't think so, sorry
[22:35:42] <cradek> Nick001-Shop: but the turret is very easy to operate. if you know or learn rudimentary ladder you'll be fine.
[22:35:55] <JaegerBar> the starting point of my servo is a little DC motor
[22:36:00] <JaegerBar> and maybe a potentiometer?
[22:36:21] <andypugh> Eeeew! I don't know how they have the nerve: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2-Pcs-Hand-Threading-M16-Screw-Thread-Metric-Plugs-Taps-/300619883826
[22:37:58] <andypugh> Somebody on here a few years ago made herself a servo from a DC motor, a cardboard disc and marker pen, and mouse-sensors. (from a ball mouse). I think she made an H-bridge using a ULN2008 controlled by the parport.
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[22:39:23] <cpresser> andypugh: if you need high-quality metric tools just ask some of central european people here in the channel. in my option those taps look like trash
[22:40:17] <andypugh> Quite, hence my comment. I don't know how they have the nerve to show such clear photos.
[22:40:47] <Loetmichel> andypugh: ouch... got one in this quality also. http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=4273
[22:41:20] <Loetmichel> and the ebay seller has threatended me for giving him a negative.
[22:41:26] <andypugh> I think I could make better with a bolt and an angle grinder
[22:41:42] <Nick001-Shop> cradex - I guess I'll have to try it - after I get more of my machine going - resolver adapter on the spindle and hooking up all those SSR's in the back cabinet. I still have a lot of learning to do. (Old dogs-new tricks) Time to pull the plug and try the shift button and a new video card and see if anything works.
[22:42:16] <Loetmichel> he means about 80 eurs for a set M3->m10 of this would be so dirt cheap that i couldnt possibly requet more quality
[22:42:16] * cpresser shivers when looking at pictures like this
[22:43:09] <andypugh> Loetmichel: No, €80 for a set of that quality isn't fair. I got a similar set from Aldo for £20.
[22:43:12] <cpresser> the medium-quality ones from wuerth are about 10Euros per piece
[22:43:14] <Loetmichel> cpresser: ebay. i normally buy local
[22:43:15] <andypugh> (Aldi)
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[22:43:43] <andypugh> I bought these http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/300631077494
[22:43:53] <Loetmichel> there i get a m4 like this http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=3031
[22:44:06] <Loetmichel> for less then 5 eur.
[22:44:16] <Loetmichel> (right one)
[22:44:28] <cradek> I can't imagine buying ebay taps at all
[22:44:33] <cradek> cheap taps are always false economy
[22:44:53] <cradek> only if your time is utterly worthless should you use cheap taps
[22:45:21] <cradek> hey did someone ask for my opinions? I have some
[22:45:26] <cpresser> i had a lot of good engarving bits from ebay. but every other tooling i bought there so far was trash. unusable trasg
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[22:45:58] <Loetmichel> i only use single taps. no sets
[22:46:17] <andypugh> cradek: I agree, I have M2.5 to M12 of these: http://www.cromwell.co.uk/static/publication/990/pages/166.pdf
[22:46:26] <Loetmichel> and nearly only the machine ones for dead end holes
[22:46:33] <andypugh> But I wanted an M16 for a one-off job.
[22:46:53] <Loetmichel> would be over here in germany about 12 eur
[22:47:05] <Loetmichel> a singel tap, not a set
[22:47:05] <andypugh> £30 for the set of three.
[22:47:11] <Loetmichel> single
[22:47:20] <andypugh> (and what _is_ the second for?
[22:47:22] <Loetmichel> no set needed
[22:47:48] <Loetmichel> the second what?
[22:47:55] <Loetmichel> tap on my photo?
[22:48:01] <andypugh> Taps come in Taper, Second and Plug
[22:48:09] <cpresser> most people over here use single-pass taps nowadays. those 3-pass-sets are not that common anymore
[22:48:24] <Loetmichel> thats an M5 single machine tap for through-holes
[22:48:31] <Loetmichel> hence the straight flutes
[22:48:53] <andypugh> I am a traditionalist. Even if I do often use a cordless drill to drive them :-)
[22:49:17] <Loetmichel> andypugh: you can do taht with the singe-pass taps ,too
[22:49:41] <Loetmichel> onla drawback: VERY short centering taper
[22:49:52] <andypugh> Yes, but I like having a Taper to get me lined up. In a through-hole that is normally the only one I use.
[22:49:59] <Loetmichel> so one have to aling carefully
[22:50:11] <Loetmichel> it will NOT center itself in the hole
[22:50:30] <andypugh> Last night I cut an M12 thread with an M6 tap :-)
[22:50:31] <cpresser> this is the tool i use to drive the taps: http://www.wtn-shop.de/out/pictures/1/gewinderatsche_p1.jpg
[22:50:57] <andypugh> cpresser: I don't like the ratchet ones. I prefer fixed.
[22:51:13] <cpresser> middle-position of the switch: fixed.
[22:51:23] <andypugh> Until you nudge it.
[22:51:25] <Loetmichel> andypugh: the last time i used something other than a cordless drill to drive the taps in something is lost in memory...
[22:51:44] <andypugh> I use one of those when working on the Fire Engine, as that is what they have.
[22:51:47] <Loetmichel> even with M1.6 i use the cordless
[22:51:48] <Loetmichel> ;-)
[22:51:54] <cpresser> the ratched function is only used to drive the tap out of the hole when done
[22:52:47] <Loetmichel> surprisingly i break occasionally a M6 or M8 in the cordless... until now never a M3 or M2 ?!?
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[22:53:45] <andypugh> Bigger proportional chip load?
[22:53:51] * cpresser NEVER breaks taps :)
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[22:59:09] <andypugh> My lathe has one screw head glued on to a hole with a tap in it :)
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[23:29:04] <andypugh> Any ideas? andypugh@ubuntu:~/emc2/configs/arc-cnc (copy)$ sudo comp --install arckins.c
[23:29:04] <andypugh> make -C /usr/src/linux-headers-2.6.32-122-rtai SUBDIRS=`pwd` CC=gcc V=0 -o /Module.symvers modules
[23:29:04] <andypugh> make[1]: Entering directory `/usr/src/linux-headers-2.6.32-122-rtai'
[23:29:31] <andypugh> I lost the important bit... /bin/sh: Syntax error: "(" unexpected
[23:34:28] <alex_joni> hrmph
[23:34:48] <andypugh> Hi alex
[23:34:58] <alex_joni> hey andy
[23:35:14] * alex_joni tries to figure out where user post counts come from in kunena
[23:35:41] <andypugh> Just count them all manually :-)
[23:35:59] <andypugh> And hand-edit the database
[23:37:06] <JT-Shop> mine seems to be 100% reliable...
[23:37:43] <andypugh> I am guessing that might no longer be true
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[23:40:07] <alex_joni> aha, I see, said the blind man
[23:40:19] <alex_joni> JT-Shop: hi
[23:40:21] <alex_joni> got a minute?
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[23:47:23] <alex_joni> any forumers around?
[23:47:49] <alex_joni> andypugh: you're pretty active on the forum iirc :)
[23:47:55] <andypugh> Yes
[23:49:23] <andypugh> What's the question?
[23:51:38] <andypugh> (I figured out that error, make didn't like a bracket in the file path. Seems fair.
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[23:54:33] <alex_joni> andypugh: was wondering if you could take a peak at the forum and see if all is in place
[23:55:21] <andypugh> alex_joni: I can't see it at all. 404
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[23:55:54] <andypugh> That's from the "Forum" link and the "community" link
[23:56:02] <alex_joni> andypugh: try the user menu link
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[23:56:12] <alex_joni> I haven't changed the forum and community link yet
[23:57:03] <andypugh> Ah, OK. First time I have seen that link down there
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[23:58:59] <andypugh> Looks good so far
[23:59:29] <andypugh> We seem to have lost the User Map, but that was broken anyway.