#emc | Logs for 2011-11-17

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[00:03:10] <PCW> andypugh: Counterswork now!
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[00:03:56] <FinboySlick> Hmmm, how well would lexan fare as a mill enclosure window? Would oil-based coolants damage it?
[00:03:59] <PCW> (we tried both 8 and 16 bit long)
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[00:04:15] <syyl> hmm
[00:04:37] <syyl> i think most enclosure windows are made from polycarbonate (aka lexan)
[00:04:57] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/sherline_files/sherline1.jpg
[00:05:02] <Tom_itx> that's plexi
[00:05:07] <Tom_itx> seems fine
[00:05:14] <Tom_itx> not sure about lexan
[00:05:31] <Tom_itx> should be fine afik
[00:05:49] <syyl> i use lexan also as a sprayshield on our open cnc machine at work
[00:05:57] <syyl> gets a lot of cooleant
[00:06:02] <syyl> no problems
[00:06:03] <FinboySlick> I'll give it a go. Worse that'll happen is it going all yellow and ugly.
[00:06:09] <JT-Shop> FinboySlick: we use lexan for enclosures for machining lines that get flooded with coolant
[00:06:27] <JT-Shop> do you know you can bend it with a sheet metal brake?
[00:06:44] <syyl> (cold!)
[00:06:48] <JT-Shop> yes
[00:06:54] <FinboySlick> JT-Shop: Don't know much about it at all but I'm interested!
[00:07:03] <syyl> and it doent shatter like plexi
[00:07:11] <JT-Shop> we bend it like sheet metal in a brake
[00:07:20] <JT-Shop> can't break it
[00:07:27] <Danimal_garage> a place where i used to work did it all the time
[00:07:40] <syyl> you can ring-roll it too
[00:07:49] <syyl> but it needs to be overbend "a bit"
[00:07:57] <JT-Shop> never tried that :)
[00:08:05] <FinboySlick> The only bit I'm not sure off is 'brake'. Must be my french (or lack of tool knowledge).
[00:08:06] <JT-Shop> so does metal
[00:08:19] <JT-Shop> a bender
[00:08:23] <jdhNC> if you heat it, it doesn't craze as much at the bend
[00:08:34] <JT-Shop> don't need to heat it
[00:08:34] <syyl> http://www.schaller-maschinen-ag.ch/bilder_maschinen/Abkantbank_RAS_2000_2_003.jpg
[00:08:44] <syyl> picture is worth 1000 words ;)
[00:08:59] <JT-Shop> syyl: is too fast
[00:09:04] <FinboySlick> Oh, okay. I have access to a press, I guess it would do.
[00:09:09] <jdhNC> you don't have to heat it, but if you do, it doesn't craze as much
[00:09:28] <syyl> never tried to bend lexan under a press with die and prism
[00:09:31] <syyl> but it might work too
[00:09:32] <JT-Shop> I've never seen lexan craze when bending it
[00:09:45] <JT-Shop> syyl: press brake?
[00:10:13] <FinboySlick> It was suggested that I just clamp it between boards and use a heat gun until gravity does its magic.
[00:10:24] <syyl> if thats the of it..?
[00:10:53] <syyl> ah
[00:11:05] <JT-Shop> http://www.amazon.com/NorthStar-Press-Brake-40-Ton-Shop/dp/B0000AX7M5
[00:11:33] <syyl> ok, thats what i was thinking of :D
[00:11:40] <FinboySlick> I like the orange pictogram.
[00:11:52] <syyl> i used only a bending brake like that in my picture up there
[00:11:57] <FinboySlick> "Don't put your fingers there, idiot"
[00:12:21] <JT-Shop> and pump the handle with your fingers in there :)
[00:12:32] <JT-Shop> I've used both syyl
[00:13:27] <Tom_itx> JT-Shop, do you get a sharp edge with < 90deg bends?
[00:13:43] <syyl> ok, good to know, that it works too
[00:13:49] <JT-Shop> well kinda sharp
[00:14:19] <syyl> the thicker that stuff, the more you get a radius
[00:14:25] <JT-Shop> it's like bending steel really you will get a radius on the inside and outside
[00:14:49] <syyl> (but you can still bend a 10mm thick sheet)
[00:15:12] * JT-Shop gets a calculator out
[00:15:30] * adb #emc-dev exist ?
[00:15:31] <JT-Shop> yea, 9.525mm
[00:15:48] <syyl> ah, a inch-guy ;)
[00:15:51] <JT-Shop> adb: try /join
[00:15:57] <JT-Shop> yea
[00:16:06] <cradek> #emc-devel
[00:16:20] <JT-Shop> mostly we use 6.35mm
[00:16:33] <adb> thx, cradek !
[00:17:58] <JT-Shop> rather we use mostly 5.65 x 45mm
[00:18:47] <syyl> not 5.56?
[00:19:07] <syyl> used to shoot that in the army :D
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[00:19:55] <JT-Shop> typo :/
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[00:20:09] <syyl> ;)
[00:20:15] <JT-Shop> 5.56... fingers broken a tib I think
[00:22:21] <Danimal_garage> JT-Shop is drunk
[00:24:05] <JT-Shop> not really but relaxed for sure
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[00:24:31] <Danimal_garage> i havent really dranken all month :(
[00:24:37] * JT-Shop stays off of flea bay for the duration of the evening for sure
[00:24:47] <Danimal_garage> haha
[00:24:50] <syyl> hihi
[00:25:01] <Danimal_garage> hi hi to you too
[00:25:12] <JT-Shop> last time I purchased a VMC!
[00:25:45] <Danimal_garage> i bet you dont regret it!
[00:27:47] <syyl> maybe its time for a cnc lathe?
[00:28:41] <Danimal_garage> he has one
[00:28:42] <syyl> then you should head for ebay, as long as you are that decisive ;)
[00:28:49] <syyl> a second one!
[00:29:15] <JT-Shop> got a buddy looking for a grinder ATM :)
[00:29:25] <JT-Shop> about out of room :/
[00:29:31] <syyl> ah
[00:29:33] <syyl> same here
[00:29:42] <Danimal_garage> out of room??
[00:29:46] <Danimal_garage> how can that be?
[00:29:55] <JT-Shop> well not quite yet
[00:30:03] <syyl> im telling a friend that he needs a surface grinder for more than half a year...
[00:30:17] <Danimal_garage> i have almost the same amount of machines in half the square footage lol
[00:30:17] <jdhNC> and a water jet
[00:30:41] <syyl> hmm
[00:30:52] <Danimal_garage> i guess the plasma takes up some room
[00:31:40] <syyl> we have about 10 machines in a room about...6x15m
[00:31:54] <JT-Shop> it really does take up a lot of space
[00:32:00] <syyl> its getting pretty tight in there...
[00:32:15] * JT-Shop gets out a calculator
[00:32:16] <Danimal_garage> JT-Shop: leave it in the garage
[00:32:59] <JT-Shop> 20' x 50' ?
[00:33:16] <syyl> could be right
[00:33:36] <Danimal_garage> i guess i can pull the air conditioner out of here for the rest of the year....
[00:33:49] <JT-Shop> I"m in 30' x 35' in the shop and 24' x 40' for the garage
[00:33:49] <Danimal_garage> although i was sweating today ,almost turned it on
[00:33:57] <Danimal_garage> lol
[00:34:01] <Danimal_garage> i'm 20x20'
[00:34:06] <JT-Shop> both connected by a common wall
[00:34:11] <syyl> (but thats at work..)
[00:34:22] * JT-Shop hears the dinner bell ringing
[00:34:23] <Danimal_garage> my common wall is my diningroom
[00:34:31] <JT-Shop> bbl
[00:34:34] <Danimal_garage> adios
[00:34:48] <syyl> in my own homeshop i only have..15x18
[00:35:03] <JT-Shop> I started out with 4' x 4'
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[00:35:15] <syyl> thats tight!
[00:35:17] <Danimal_garage> wowsers
[00:35:23] <Danimal_garage> that's smaller than my closet
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[00:52:57] <Jymmm> 15x18 is smaller than your closet?! You are such a Diva Danimal_garage!
[00:54:27] <Danimal_garage> i gotta put my shoes somewhere
[00:54:48] <Jymmm> salvation army donation bin?
[00:55:18] <Danimal_garage> bums don't wear prada
[00:55:39] <Jymmm> They will as so as you donate!
[00:56:49] <Danimal_garage> this drywalling is going to be a PITA
[00:58:19] <syyl> there are jobs, nobody wants do to ;)
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[03:08:36] <Nick001> vid-2hd.avi - /MSG [XDCC]05 XDCC SEND 13
[03:08:36] <Nick001> <[XDCC]02> [automagically added] - parenthood.2010.s03e09.hdtv.xvid-2hd.avi - /MSG [XDCC]02 XDCC SEND 13
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[03:09:30] <Nick001> JT-Shop - I dont see where the GE amps are hooked up to your cards
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[03:32:40] <ds3> anyone have a solution to the quadranted circle problem with G02/G03 when using backlash comp?
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[03:33:36] <Eartaker> make sure your backlash comp is accurate
[03:34:13] <ds3> it works fine for rectangles
[03:34:28] <ds3> it appears to not apply it incrementally
[03:34:34] <Eartaker> if you want a perfect circle you will need a boring head
[03:34:39] <Eartaker> how much backlash do you have?
[03:34:47] <ds3> around 0.025 or so
[03:34:51] <Eartaker> JESUS
[03:34:55] <Eartaker> what axis/
[03:34:56] <Eartaker> ?
[03:35:02] <ds3> this is a laser so boring head isn't an option
[03:35:06] <ds3> X and Y
[03:35:07] <Eartaker> ahh
[03:35:36] <Eartaker> you need to fix that backlash rather than compensate for .025
[03:35:37] <ds3> w/o backlash comp, I got parallelograms but round holes
[03:35:46] <ds3> Hmmmm
[03:35:52] <ds3> Ok
[03:35:57] <Eartaker> atleast get it to under.01
[03:36:50] <ds3> I guess I can look at putting weights to preload it
[03:36:51] <Eartaker> ware you using leadscrews?
[03:37:02] <ds3> no, this is a belt setup
[03:37:13] <Eartaker> do you have slop in your belts?
[03:37:15] <ds3> I have seen worse with acme (i.e. manual lathes and mills)
[03:37:34] <ds3> how do you determine slop in belts? (I am new to belts, screws I understand)
[03:37:41] <ds3> it is a toothed belt, FWIW
[03:37:45] <Eartaker> manual is different... you can capensate for it rather than trying to have a computer do it
[03:38:04] <ds3> *nod*
[03:38:07] <Eartaker> the belts should be tight, not loose at all
[03:38:40] <Eartaker> I have belts on my mill from my servo to ballscrew and have .001" on x and .002" on y
[03:39:08] <ds3> Hmmm
[03:39:10] <Eartaker> you should be able to pluck the belt like a rubber band want watch it vibrate
[03:39:14] <Eartaker> watch
[03:39:21] <ds3> oh. it definitely isn't that taunt
[03:40:05] <Tom_itx> i need to do that to mine
[03:40:06] <Tom_itx> i did z and it's alot better
[03:40:07] <Eartaker> tighten it up and see how that goes... also make sure none of you pulleys are not slipping on the motor shaft
[03:40:22] <ds3> got to find out how to do that
[03:40:43] <Eartaker> ds3 upload some pics
[03:40:44] <ds3> this quadranting effect is consistant so I doubt it is a slip
[03:41:00] <Eartaker> yeah probably belt slop
[03:41:06] <ds3> it is covered and I haven't figured out how to disassemble it yet
[03:41:06] <Tom_itx> put a dial on it and watch it
[03:41:20] <Eartaker> with the system you have you should be able to get 0 backlash if done right
[03:41:51] <ds3> I been trying to figure out how to get a dial on it... thing is all alum and I don't have a big enough clamp
[03:42:59] <Eartaker> sit the dial on your base and have the head hit the indicator
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[03:43:25] <ds3> reverse of normal mill usage?
[03:43:39] <ds3> it is a gantry setup (btw)
[03:43:50] <Eartaker> yeah thats fine... same concept
[03:43:59] <Tom_itx> do you have a last word indicator?
[03:44:13] <Tom_itx> leave the spindle off and put it in the spindle
[03:44:13] <ds3> no. just import clones
[03:44:19] <ds3> there is no spindle
[03:44:21] <Tom_itx> mmm
[03:44:22] <ds3> this is a laser
[03:44:28] <ds3> it moves a mirror around'
[03:44:29] <Tom_itx> oh
[03:44:40] <Eartaker> pic?
[03:44:46] <ds3> i know how to do a dti on a mill
[03:45:06] <ds3> let me see if I can find one online..it is a stock asian designed laser
[03:45:45] <Eartaker> have the indicator hit the part that holds the mirror...
[03:46:03] <ds3> it is similiar to this one - http://www.synthfool.com/laser/
[03:46:15] <Eartaker> oh
[03:46:45] <Eartaker> take the cover off... there shold be a way to adjust the belt... if not make something so you can
[03:47:30] <ds3> so u are saying I shouldn't need to rig up a pulley/weight system to bias it to one side?
[03:48:13] <Eartaker> no... maybe just an idler pulley
[03:48:28] <Eartaker> to adjust belt tension
[03:48:38] <ds3> gotcha
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[03:49:32] <Eartaker> but im betting that in your machine you can slide your stepper motors to adjust the tension
[03:49:35] <ds3> right now with the 0.025 comp, I am getting decent results for rectangular stuff
[03:50:08] <ds3> how much tension is too much?
[03:51:13] <Eartaker> just kinda feel for it.... you dont want any sag in the belt and you want it to just be tight enough to it bounces what you snap it with your finger
[03:51:19] <Eartaker> when you*
[03:51:29] <ds3> ok
[03:51:53] <A2Sheds> whats the size of your belt? width, thickness
[03:52:07] <ds3> donno, not easy to measure
[03:52:13] <ds3> it is hidden in a grove
[03:52:16] <A2Sheds> just roughly
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[03:52:46] <ds3> eyeball says maybe about 5/16" or so...can't see the thickness part. I can feel teeths on there
[03:53:05] <A2Sheds> oh, its small
[03:53:33] <ds3> yes. capacity is a tiny bit more then a sheet of letter sized paper
[03:53:43] <ds3> enough to do what I need
[03:54:41] <ds3> and this is after the mods to expand it from the one pictured on that website
[03:54:45] <A2Sheds> sure, but that belt still needs to be tight
[03:56:20] <A2Sheds> oh, yeah, I remember your tube arcing
[03:57:38] <ds3> ?
[03:57:52] <A2Sheds> or was that someone else with a laser from China
[03:57:53] <ds3> arcing? wasn't me
[03:59:06] <A2Sheds> a few weeks ago somebody got one and the tube was bad out of the box, the same or very similar mode;
[03:59:11] <A2Sheds> model
[03:59:32] <ds3> they are all very similiar
[03:59:50] <A2Sheds> same green wirewound resistor
[04:00:14] <ds3> was his proprietary or a step/dir parallel port setup?
[04:00:59] <A2Sheds> I don't recall that part, his pictures were similar
[04:01:26] <ds3> if he got it direct, it is probally the proprietary stuff... I had a us intermediatary
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[04:02:13] <ds3> but these import lasers are 10% of the cost of US equivalents. Problem is they need a lot of tuning
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[04:22:14] <Jymmm> There are 3rd party controllers for the import lasers available.
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[04:28:41] <A2Sheds> what do the import lasers use for motors?
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[04:52:06] <emcrules_d510> PCW: you around?
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[04:53:53] <pcw_home> vaguely...
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[04:56:02] <emcrules_d510> i should be able to inierface an encoder to a 7i42 correct
[04:56:16] <emcrules_d510> 1000ppr
[04:56:18] <pcw_home> Yes
[04:56:31] <emcrules_d510> the boards good for 10khz
[04:56:43] <pcw_home> 10 MHz
[04:57:02] <emcrules_d510> if i spin the encoder quick it misses counts
[04:57:12] <emcrules_d510> if i spin it slow its ok
[04:58:16] <pcw_home> Look at your signals probably something is marginal
[04:59:49] <emcrules_d510> as far as voltage levels?
[05:00:16] <pcw_home> If the encoder is single ended watch out for ones that dont have push-pull drive
[05:01:51] <emcrules_d510> the encoder is line driver output
[05:02:45] <pcw_home> I assume you are using a hardware encoder (hm2.board.encoder.xxx.xxx)
[05:03:34] <emcrules_d510> no just gpio i thought hardware encoders were on the daughter boards
[05:04:29] <pcw_home> Oh OK that will be limited by the EMC sample rate so expect to lose counts if you spin it
[05:05:08] <pcw_home> no reason not to read hardware encoders via a 7I42
[05:05:39] <pcw_home> (but single ended only of course)
[05:06:04] <emcrules_d510> is it just a matter of looking at the pin file and figuring out where the encoders are mapped to
[05:06:35] <pcw_home> Yep (well and enabling them in the config line)
[05:07:25] <emcrules_d510> they are already
[05:08:31] <pcw_home> but you need to use the hm2xxxx stuff
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[05:10:42] <emcrules_d510> yeah they were already in the config might of been messing me up as well
[05:11:38] <emcrules_d510> yep thats much better now
[05:11:59] <emcrules_d510> pcw_home: thanks
[05:12:17] <pcw_home> No problem
[05:12:19] <pcw_home> 'Nite
[05:19:08] <emcrules_d510> nite
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[06:08:54] <grandixximo> psha do you remember that issue with the camera error making hard disk full?
[06:10:00] <grandixximo> I have reinstalled camview and i have included the DRO patch, and it is ok now, the camera does not get disconnected anymore, but if i actually unplug the camera the error is still there
[06:10:01] <grandixximo> [20210.562393] uvcvideo: Failed to set UVC probe control : -19 (exp. 26).
[06:11:04] <grandixximo> you can just unplug your camera to see how many error come in dmesg
[06:19:38] <grandixximo> hello psha???
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[06:37:42] <grandixximo> Hello mhaberler
[06:37:55] <grandixximo> please visit the forum
[06:38:16] <grandixximo> i have reply about the run from here problem
[06:39:07] <grandixximo> http://www.linuxcnc.org/component/option,com_kunena/Itemid,20/func,view/id,14365/catid,38/limit,6/limitstart,12/lang,english/
[06:39:31] <mhaberler> thanks, I just saw that
[06:39:50] <mhaberler> I am working on the issue
[06:40:57] <grandixximo> it's great to hear that :)
[06:43:36] <mhaberler> there is a lot of history involved in the issue, which I need to understand to avoid creating more mess but rather clean it up
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[06:47:07] <grandixximo> about the abort issue is it the way i write the code?
[06:51:20] <psha[work]> hi
[06:51:45] <Loetmichel> mornin'
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[06:57:04] <mhaberler> I dont think so - this needs to work
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[06:58:42] <Loetmichel> hrm... my china battery charger is discharging my mobile (AGM) charger battery... second day now... 17Ah discharged, still 11,41V... this will take forever...
[06:59:31] <Loetmichel> i think i should build a bigger Charger/discharger... maybe with this heatsink, should be sufficient: http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=487
[07:01:39] <Loetmichel> (the battery has 42Ah)
[07:02:55] <Loetmichel> SHOULD have. i want to know how much is left in there after i let it sit on the shelf for half a year, battery hat 3,1V voltage left ;-)
[07:03:08] <Loetmichel> had
[07:05:29] <grandixximo> Well it does not work, it's ok with M2
[07:06:20] <grandixximo> But abort is not executing the lines above it
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[08:26:25] <grandixximo> mhaberler if you have news please reply on the forum, thanks
[08:27:14] <mhaberler> yes - after I am done, which I am not yet. thanks.
[08:27:28] <grandixximo> thank you
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[08:58:15] <sparr> Loetmichel: i had to discharge and charge a 36V 225Ah battery bank recently
[08:58:21] <sparr> that was painfully slow with the tools i had on hand
[08:58:26] <sparr> i'd build a better discharge rig next time
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[10:46:54] <sparr> does anyone make 1:1 diameter-pitch threaded rods? what are they called (style, brand, etc)?
[10:48:49] <toastydeath> not that i am aware of, you may have to look at multi-lead screws
[10:49:48] <toastydeath> the only screws i've ever seen like that are multi-lead worm gears
[10:50:22] <toastydeath> 1:1 screws tend to bind up under any appriciable load
[10:55:30] <mrsun> gah freakin chinese drill presses
[10:55:37] <mrsun> no bearing adjustments to be seen
[10:55:49] <mrsun> and when fully extended it can go back and forth like 1mm ....
[10:59:06] <awallin> 'floating' spindle...
[11:01:11] <mrsun> the actual holder for the spindle is not adjustable either
[11:01:18] <mrsun> and its there the main problem is
[11:01:41] <mrsun> was thinking of dismantling it all, bore upp the hole and put a bronse bushing there the set screw can push some on insted of the stupid just straight hole :P
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[11:17:18] <sparr> http://www.igus.de/wpck/default.aspx?PageNr=7001&CL=DE-en
[11:17:19] <sparr> aha!
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[11:39:05] <MattyMatt> heh 50mm pitch in 10mm shaft :) I'd call that one an archimedes drill
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[12:32:57] <sparr> MattyMatt: im more looking at the 12mm pitch 10mm shaft
[12:33:09] <sparr> or 12mm pitch 18mm shaft
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[13:52:35] <JT-Shop> Nick001: ?
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[15:32:16] <Nick001> JT-Shop - I don'nt see where the GE amps are hooked up to your cards
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[15:34:04] <demacus_> hi people. im trying to generate gcode for my first 3d part right now. i tryed a few applications like pyCAM, Skeinforge, cam.py, gCAD3d but none of them produces me acceptable gcode. theyre all milling the part "line by line", could you give me an advise how i can produce faster code which uses arcs for holes?
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[15:36:16] <jdhNC> do any of them have options for enabling g2/g3 instead of devolving them to line segments?
[15:37:19] <demacus_> i'm currently try to figure it out but i couldnt find something like this. which applications do you use for generating gcode?
[15:37:23] <jdhNC> unless you mean arcs through Z then I have even les idea.
[15:37:50] <jdhNC> I only do 2.5d stuff at most. Either cut-2d or by hand.
[15:38:50] <jdhNC> I've seen options in some CAM software to use arcs or lines
[15:39:06] <demacus_> hmm, yes this seems to be a faster solution to do it by hand, but on more complex parts it would be nice to have a software doing this.
[15:40:40] <JT-Shop> Nick001: on my CHNC?
[15:41:53] <JT-Shop> demacus_: have you looked at heekscad?
[15:42:24] <Nick001> JT-Shop - Yes
[15:42:32] <demacus_> no, not yet. thank you. ill have a look
[15:42:50] <JT-Shop> on the 7i33 drawing
[15:44:03] <Nick001> JT-Shop - I'll take another look
[15:44:11] <JT-Shop> I just show the cable and wire colors for the CHNC side
[15:44:37] <JT-Shop> the drawing sucks being two pages :/
[15:45:10] <JT-Shop> the terminal blocks for the vel cmd are labeled if you zoom in a bit
[15:45:15] <JT-Shop> bbl
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[15:56:31] <Nick001> I see the vel cmd and vel gnd - there are 8 connections total - 7 if you take of the 2 tach connections -
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[16:15:52] <demacus_> JT-Shop: its compiling atm - description looks promising.
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[16:34:49] <MattyMatt> demacus_ I use a script but now I usually edit in the g2&g3 by hand
[16:35:03] <MattyMatt> blender script
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[17:21:04] <jthornton> Nick001: I don't have tach's connected to the 7i33 only encoders and vel cmd to drives
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[17:50:52] <jthornton> Nick001: I added TB-1 and TB-2 as separate prints now much easier to see http://gnipsel.com/shop/hardinge/hardinge.xhtml
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[17:59:27] <danimal_laptop> mornin
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[18:05:59] <JT-Shop> hi Dan
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[18:11:17] <danimal_laptop> Hi John
[18:19:44] <skunkworks> Danimal_garage: get your big machine yet>
[18:23:38] <JT-Shop> Dan, you gonna toss the grinder on your trailer too?
[18:23:53] <danimal_laptop> ha i dont have a trailer4
[18:24:05] <JT-Shop> you gonna put it your van?
[18:24:42] <danimal_laptop> he'll ship it i assume
[18:27:44] <danimal_laptop> he owns a machinery moving business
[18:27:55] <danimal_laptop> he's bringing the mill up here for me
[18:28:46] <JT-Shop> ah ok
[18:29:42] <Danimal_garage> skunkworks: not yet, saturday
[18:29:56] <Danimal_garage> it's the same size as my other mill, not very big
[18:30:55] <Danimal_garage> about 3 tons
[18:31:03] <Danimal_garage> i think you can make one on your mill
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[18:37:53] <Danimal_garage> JT-Shop: when i go down to pay him and help him rig up the machine i'll try and take a look at the grinder for ya
[18:38:00] <Danimal_garage> probably saturday
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[18:39:34] <JT-Shop> ok thanks Dan
[18:39:37] <JT-Shop> bbl
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[18:53:01] <IchGucksLive> hi all are there cabels between the mesa 5i cards and the mashine finished available ?
[18:53:35] <IchGucksLive> i think i will upgrade from 5 to 6 axes and now parport is not more workable
[18:53:54] <IchGucksLive> are this cards available in germany ?
[18:56:30] <IchGucksLive> JT-Shop: are you a reseller ß
[18:59:00] <IchGucksLive> cheeper is to go for 2 parports
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[19:40:14] <Nick001> jthornton-how are the rest of the teminals on the amp wired - 12v etc
[19:41:04] <Nick001> I have to keep leaving the comp - thats why the delay
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[21:07:02] <JT-Shop> Nick001-Shop:
[21:07:26] <JT-Shop> the rest of the amp was factory wired
[21:08:44] <JT-Shop> Nick001 btw, my drives are Siemens drives
[21:11:26] <Nick001-Shop> oh - I thought you had GE amps
[21:12:47] <Nick001-Shop> I got the part of vel cmd but there's 7 connections to deal with and I don't like black clouds in the shop
[21:15:34] <JT-Shop> 7 connections on your drives?
[21:18:48] <danimal_laptop> Nick001: do you have the GE hiak drives?
[21:19:08] <danimal_laptop> or Nick001-Shop
[21:20:39] <danimal_laptop> i have ge hiak drives in my hardige hnc, if i can be of any asistance
[21:22:15] <andypugh> I have run out of drivers to work on! I might have to actually work on my machine!
[21:22:21] <danimal_laptop> ha
[21:22:33] <danimal_laptop> you can fly to CA and build my mill
[21:23:03] <andypugh> (though I can think of a good big job on sserial, if I get bored)
[21:23:08] <danimal_laptop> thanks for getting all the cool mesa stuff to work with emc2 btw :)
[21:23:19] <andypugh> danimal_laptop: I am sailing to CA in february, will it keep?
[21:23:44] <danimal_laptop> it should be up and running by then hopefully!
[21:24:08] <danimal_laptop> but if you end up in southern CA, you should swing by and check out the shop
[21:24:55] <danimal_laptop> i'm hoping the mill will be up in less than a month
[21:25:14] <danimal_laptop> if it's encoders and not resolvers, that should be easy
[21:26:15] <Nick001-Shop> danimal_laptop They are HiAk's with resolvers and tach's. I need a way of getting rid of the tachs
[21:26:58] <danimal_laptop> Nick001-Shop: same amps i have
[21:27:19] <danimal_laptop> why do you need to get rid of the tachs?
[21:27:55] <Nick001-Shop> they keep wicking oil into them and need cleaning
[21:28:04] <danimal_laptop> ah
[21:28:52] <Nick001-Shop> The X axis has that oil mist inside of it and after a while fouls the tach.
[21:28:58] <danimal_laptop> cant you take the encoder count and translate it into some analog value associated with the velocity?
[21:30:38] <danimal_laptop> i would assume you can do it in hal
[21:30:57] <Nick001-Shop> Don't know how - thats why I'm here. I have Pico running somewhat but I'd like an alternative to get back to using the GE drives
[21:31:45] <Nick001-Shop> Someone mentioned using a dac signal to replace the tach using the mesa cards
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[21:32:20] <Danimal_garage> yea
[21:32:27] <Danimal_garage> thats what i was thinking
[21:33:24] <Nick001-Shop> also would like to go back to the resolvers - these encoders don't look like they'll last a long time with the oil
[21:33:57] <Nick001-Shop> mesa has a 6 resolver card
[21:35:13] <Nick001-Shop> are you still using the tach's?
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[21:35:28] <Danimal_garage> yes
[21:35:39] <Danimal_garage> do you have an HNC?
[21:35:45] <Nick001-Shop> and no ol probs?
[21:35:55] <Danimal_garage> none
[21:36:05] <Nick001-Shop> HCNC
[21:36:22] <Danimal_garage> silicone the covers
[21:36:29] <Danimal_garage> i used rtv on everything
[21:37:33] <Nick001-Shop> did that - the oil mist is inside the slide assembly from that air leak that Hardinge needs
[21:37:47] <Danimal_garage> my machine is from 1978, i doubt it's ever had any problems wit hthe tachs
[21:38:17] <Danimal_garage> have you considered water based coolant?
[21:38:22] <Danimal_garage> i dont use oil anymore
[21:38:33] <Danimal_garage> it was a mess and it smoked up the shop
[21:40:34] <Nick001-Shop> That will gum thing up with the water based soluble - tried that many years ago and had to swith back. Condinsation inside other covers caused problems
[21:41:56] <Nick001-Shop> its a mess but if you flood the part and don't get crazy with the speeds and feeds - it's not too bad
[21:42:06] <Danimal_garage> wow you must use the hell out of the thing or something
[21:43:09] <Danimal_garage> it smoked up my whole house, i'll never go back to oil
[21:43:18] <Danimal_garage> i'd rather replace stuff once a year
[21:43:33] <Danimal_garage> i cut titanium and stainless
[21:43:51] <Nick001-Shop> I do parts up to 4" in alum down to 3/8 for the timing pulleys and sometimes in alloy steel - mostly finishing cuts
[21:43:55] <Danimal_garage> up to 6" diameter
[21:44:20] <Danimal_garage> yea i didnt have much problems with amluminum
[21:45:33] <Nick001-Shop> I don't blame you - that would stink up the house. My shop is a separate bulding on the side of the property so if it's smoking - I open the doors and windows.
[21:45:50] <Danimal_garage> ha nice
[21:46:33] <Nick001-Shop> I tend to stay aay from the monster materials because I can -)
[21:46:40] <Nick001-Shop> away
[21:50:11] <Danimal_garage> i bet you can hook up a second pwmgen pin to the pid.#.output pin in hal and scale it so the voltage is correct when you hook that pin up to a DAC, it would probably fool the drives into thinking you have a tach
[21:51:22] <Danimal_garage> i guess you can probably use the velocity of the encoders to drive the pwmgen pin as well
[21:52:21] <Danimal_garage> but i don't know much so i'm not the one to ask, but i bet it would work
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[21:54:10] <Nick001-Shop> hopefully someone will see this and respond. I know enough electronics to be dangerous to myself
[21:54:23] <Danimal_garage> lol
[21:54:32] <Danimal_garage> same here
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[21:55:02] <Danimal_garage> i've had an emc2 powered machine for over 2 years now and i still barely get it
[21:55:19] <Danimal_garage> soon 2 be 4 machines actually
[21:55:30] <JT-Shop> I like ValCool, as long as you maintain the ratio correct no rust or fuss
[21:55:37] <MOGLI> I want to use EMC2 in box packing machine.. we need to syncronize 5 vfds for conveyor etc.. and 2 servo motors.. is it possible with EMC2+ Mesa 5i20???? any suggestion....
[21:56:12] <andypugh> Nick001: The Mesa Resolver card has velocity outputs too.
[21:56:14] <JT-Shop> the gs2 component will control a gs2 vfd
[21:56:46] <Nick001-Shop> How would I use them?
[21:56:47] <JT-Shop> dunno if you can control 5 or not
[21:57:19] <MOGLI> we are using Delta VFDs my plan is to use 0-10v ...
[21:57:29] <andypugh> Nick001-Shop: You would need to take the values to either a DAC, or to PWM and then to a low-pass filter.
[21:58:07] <MOGLI> yes... mesa 5i20 will generate freq or pwm than dac will convert it in to 0-10v..
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[21:58:22] <MOGLI> i think mesa has already a card which can convert it in to 10v...
[21:59:05] <andypugh> Yes, though you would need 6 channels of PWM-voltage, 3 for the command signal, and 3 for the velocity feedback
[22:00:14] <andypugh> 7i48 is $99 and will do 6 channels
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[22:00:29] <MOGLI> andypugh: let me check it...
[22:01:29] <Nick001-Shop> andypugh - now I'm totally lost - need to check out the 7i48 card and decode what you just said
[22:01:31] <andypugh> 7i65 is 8 channels, but a lot more money.
[22:01:40] <MOGLI> m not able to find it...
[22:01:46] <MOGLI> in which section? motion control???
[22:01:57] <andypugh> 7i49 is $184 for 6 resolvers.
[22:02:04] <andypugh> Daughter cards
[22:02:34] <andypugh> MOGLI: It isn't your question I was answering...
[22:02:55] <Nick001-Shop> after what I've been spending - not a prob
[22:02:57] <andypugh> Though the same answer might work
[22:03:45] <MOGLI> it can work i think.. at least theoritically
[22:04:33] <andypugh> Bear in mind that synthetic velocity has been used, but would be considered experimental.
[22:04:43] <Nick001-Shop> gone from ajax to mach 3 and twice to emc and this is the furthest i've gotten. good thing I have other machines while I get re-educated
[22:04:52] <MOGLI> EMC + MESA 5I20 + MESA7i48.. can it control 5 VFDs speed??? how to bypass position section if i want to use it as axis..
[22:05:02] <MOGLI> one more thing we do have encoders on all ACIM motors
[22:06:07] <MOGLI> i mean i ddont want to use it as axis but i dont know any other way to control...
[22:10:19] <andypugh> MOGLI: I am not sure what the question is, but you can close the PID loop on velocity, if velocity is what you want.
[22:11:18] <andypugh> No reason that X300 couldn't mean "spin motor 1 at 300 rpm"
[22:13:08] * bootnecklad__ prods andypugh
[22:13:25] <JT-Shop> MOGLI: do the conveyors have to be synchronized with the motion?
[22:13:48] <andypugh> I just noticed the new 7i77. That also has 6 channels of digital-to-analog, but can't (easily) be used with the Resolver card.
[22:15:13] <andypugh> bootnecklad__: ?
[22:15:24] <bootnecklad__> hello!
[22:15:33] <Nick001-Shop> andypugh-nothing's easy - what will it take?
[22:17:24] <andypugh> Nick001-Shop: Depends what you want. If you want the resolvers back, and for the resolvers to take over the role of Tachs, then 7i43/5i20/5i23 + 7i49 + 7i48
[22:18:14] <andypugh> 7i49 should be working with the 2.5 version of EMC2 as of yesterday.
[22:20:03] <Nick001-Shop> I want the resolvers back without the tachs and is there enough left for +-10vdc to drive the spindle whick has the 3'rd resolver
[22:21:00] <andypugh> How many axes do you have?
[22:21:55] <andypugh> That combination will support 6 resolvers and 6 channels of analogue voltage output.
[22:22:24] <Nick001-Shop> I'm still useing 2.3.5 - should I update - I tried 10.04Install disk but couldn't get it to work
[22:22:59] <andypugh> (Actually, I am not sure that the Resolver software will work with the 5i20, and I think you need the 400k 7i43, and you would need to check with Pete that 7i43 + 7i49 is workable)
[22:23:07] <Nick001-Shop> andypugh - I have X & Z and Spindle
[22:23:21] <andypugh> A lathe?
[22:23:35] <andypugh> No problem then.
[22:23:42] <Nick001-Shop> Hardinge HCNC
[22:25:18] <Nick001-Shop> I need +_10vdc to contol the spindle amp
[22:25:19] <Danimal_garage> Nick001-Shop: i did ditch the spindle resolver for an encoder
[22:25:23] <Nick001-Shop> The spindle has a resolver but no tach
[22:26:58] <Danimal_garage> what's different between the hnc and the hcnc?
[22:27:39] <Nick001-Shop> The encoders don't look like they will stand up like the resolvers. I've already replced 2 encoders vs never with the resolvers
[22:28:46] <Nick001-Shop> hnc had a tape drive and HCNC has allen bradly full cnc control vs ge nc control
[22:29:34] <Danimal_garage> http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v20/danielwilcox/hardinge2.jpg
[22:29:47] <Danimal_garage> that's my machine before converting it to emc2
[22:29:58] <Nick001-Shop> That was a big changeover at that time between tape control and full cnc
[22:30:11] <Danimal_garage> yea
[22:30:20] <JT-Shop> looks like from the tv show with robbie the robot
[22:30:30] <Danimal_garage> gotta love the 700lb controler
[22:30:55] <Nick001-Shop> GE NC (punched tape) control
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[22:31:21] <andypugh> Resolvers are very tough. I like them.
[22:31:26] <Danimal_garage> at least it had a u-stor
[22:31:52] <Nick001-Shop> the CNC wiped them put
[22:32:20] <andypugh> I am trying to use three resolvers using an Arduino. I would reccomend the Mesa board though.
[22:32:37] <Nick001-Shop> andypugh - never had a prob with them in 30 years on 2 machines
[22:33:17] <andypugh> But if you are feeling adventurous: http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?ResolverToQuadratureConverter
[22:33:30] <Nick001-Shop> I have a 3rd mach that I only used very little
[22:34:21] <Danimal_garage> buy better encoders?
[22:34:27] <JT-Shop> yea from Lost in Space
[22:34:27] <Nick001-Shop> andypugh - Pico has them for 150 each - 450 to convert the Harding vs 189
[22:34:46] <Danimal_garage> yea, i have the picos on my lathe
[22:34:57] <Danimal_garage> that was before mesa had one though
[22:35:33] <Nick001-Shop> mesa is 189
[22:36:44] <Danimal_garage> yea i know
[22:36:46] <Nick001-Shop> Danimal_garage - encoders are sort of open - will let stuff leak into the electronics
[22:36:55] <Danimal_garage> not the ones i have
[22:37:08] <Danimal_garage> they have more sealed ones
[22:37:58] <Nick001-Shop> whatones do do have - I have dynapar
[22:38:01] <Danimal_garage> automationdirect.com has them
[22:38:13] * JT-Shop makes a box to keep dyslexia parts in :/ as I just made another one for that box
[22:38:17] <Danimal_garage> i have a dynapar on my spindle, the open type
[22:38:29] <Danimal_garage> i have sealed ones for my mill though
[22:38:51] <Danimal_garage> trd-nh2500-rzvwd
[22:38:56] <Danimal_garage> google tha t
[22:39:10] <Nick001-Shop> spindle isn't as much a prob as X axis and Z is right behind it
[22:39:37] <Danimal_garage> yea i know
[22:44:25] <Nick001-Shop> Danimal_garage - found it - I'll check it out
[22:44:57] <Nick001-Shop> 141 is about what i paid for mine
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[22:54:13] <emcrules_d510> andypugh: changing the pgain sign did the trick
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[23:04:45] <demacus_> so people, just to report back, i did not manage to run emc2 on 3.0.7-rt. and after this i've managed to produce some nice gcode with skeinforge at least-my mistake on this was that i didnt care about the planar directions in PRO/Engineer. thanks for your hints today.
[23:04:59] demacus_ is now known as demacus_away
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[23:15:04] <andypugh> emcrules_d510: excellent
[23:16:49] <emcrules_d510> andypugh: motor is very springy at standstill after homing
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[23:35:08] <andypugh> You probably need more Pgain
[23:35:36] <andypugh> But it probably won't be stable with more Pgain until it is connected to the machine.
[23:36:52] <andypugh> Having said that, my system is rather springy too. Actually it has a quarter turn of nothing, and I need to get to the bottom of why. (I am tending to blame my DIY resolver convertor)
[23:37:10] <andypugh> emcrules_d510: You have encoders, yes?
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[23:44:15] <andypugh> There is a possibility that it might be necessary to tune the PID loop inside the 8i20 too. I need to talk to Peter about that.
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