#emc | Logs for 2011-08-11

[00:00:15] <Connor> Okay, I'm completely and utterly baffled.. The Pulley on my band saw.. a plastic pulley, isn't concentric.. The freaking thing is offset a little or something...
[00:01:06] <Connor> I kept trying to figure out why the damn thing vibrated so much.. and why it had a hard spot in it when I tried to turn the wheels by hand when installing a blade.. now I know.. Boggle.
[00:01:58] <PCW> mikegg: there's no released 7I39 config for the 7I43 It needs to be mubulated I see a 48 I/O pinout for a 4 axis config with 2 7I39s however so its easy
[00:02:00] <PCW> Tom_L I doubt its been updated, so if you have th 7I43 and 7I47 mechanical PDFs they are the latet Maybe I've got Toms confused
[00:02:30] <Tom_itx> i was asking about hole locations and suggested you add dimensions to the pdf's
[00:03:21] <Tom_itx> a handy piece of information
[00:03:34] <andypugh> Connor: It _might_ be deliberate
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[00:03:53] <Connor> maybe.. I'm going to check a demo one at the store...
[00:03:55] <Connor> back in a bit.
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[00:04:52] <PCW> Yeah the drawings belong in the back of the manuals
[00:05:34] <andypugh> I have considered writing a "spindle speed wobbler" comp for my lathe, as it seems that random 10% variations in spindle speed can kill chatter. I can imagine that bandsaws naturally have a terrible chatter problem.
[00:05:38] <Tom_itx> i went ahead and measured em like everyone else does i'm sure but it would be handy to know what the intended dimensions are
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[00:13:03] <PCW> the PDFs have the dimensions
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[00:14:43] <PCW> mikeeg: freeby.mesanet.com/svtp4s.zip
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[00:24:01] <tom3p> the g540 stepconf file http://www.linuxcnc.org/wiki/uploads/G540.stepconf has the stepspace steptime dirhold dirsetup all at 1000nS but this file was submitted and
[00:24:02] * Tom_L looks again
[00:24:14] <tom3p> sounds pretty fast, anyone tried that?
[00:27:51] <Connor> andypugh: Floor model at the store is off center too.. maybe it's their idea of a clutch.. I.E. causes the saw to slow down faster when you turn it off..
[00:29:31] <andypugh> Did you see my suggestuin that it might be anti-chatter?
[00:29:42] <Connor> No. let me scroll back.
[00:30:12] <Connor> I don't think it has anything to do with chatter..
[00:30:44] <andypugh> Not knowing where it is or what it does it was always a wild guess.
[00:30:58] <Connor> The pulley is right on the shaft of the motor..
[00:31:24] <andypugh> The existence of skip-tooth blades seems to suggest that there is an issue, though.
[00:31:37] <Connor> then a belt that goes to the lower flywheel.
[00:32:12] <Connor> All I know is, I've never been happy with the thing..
[00:32:31] <andypugh> An eccentric motor pulley will vary the band speed.
[00:33:32] <andypugh> I agree it is probably a fault. But then it is harder to get it wrong than right..
[00:34:36] <Connor> Maybe I'll make a new pulley.
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[00:36:06] <Tom_L> PCW, not trying to be difficult but I don't see hole location dimensions anywhere in the PDFs
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[00:45:30] <elmo40> damn, someone had some spare time... http://www.flickr.com/photos/41823416@N08/
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[00:46:48] <A2Sheds> why does Google search result for "emc2 cnc" come up with "Adobe Acrobat 9 Problems — Sale -127% price off"
[00:47:07] <A2Sheds> "Free Software Photoshop — Sale -151% price off - EMC2"
[00:47:13] <andypugh> We have been hacked, I think.
[00:47:26] <tom3p> been that way for a month at least
[00:47:34] <andypugh> No idea how to fix it, no idea who can fix it.
[00:47:46] <A2Sheds> huh really
[00:49:23] <A2Sheds> the Meta at http://www.linuxcnc.org/ is <meta name="description" content="EMC - the Enhanced Machine Controller, realtime Linux CNC machining" />
[00:51:04] <tom3p> i get "Ms Office Software — Discount -143% price off - EMC2" when i google "emc2 g540"
[00:51:45] <A2Sheds> some pages have the Meta description some have MS or Adobe software at discount prices
[00:52:26] <tom3p> i got an Arduino UNO to count some pulses for Hal, do I need Java? what version which bits ( will JRE6 suffice? )
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[00:54:05] <tom3p> argh i got openjdk6-jre
[00:54:50] <A2Sheds> #coreboot has a couple Google devs, I'll have to ask
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[00:55:07] <tom3p> well will just try, gotta find an A-B usb cable to see if comm works
[00:55:24] <tom3p> A2Sheds, thx itd be nice to clean that up
[00:57:24] <A2Sheds> http://www.google.com/support/forum/p/Webmasters?hl=en
[00:58:49] <A2Sheds> Working with a site that has hacked titles and meta but cannot find out how its happening
[01:01:10] <A2Sheds> http://www.google.com/support/forum/p/Webmasters/thread?tid=29c1b4a9babc54a3&hl=en
[01:01:20] <A2Sheds> Site hacked with pharmacy spammy content on search listings
[01:02:44] <A2Sheds> looks like they infect a site to watch for the google bot and then injecting their advertisement
[01:03:10] <Sairon> sp///
[01:03:12] <Sairon> er
[01:03:13] <Sairon> so...
[01:03:26] <Sairon> today i bought a bunch of $20 digitals timers
[01:03:35] <Sairon> and posted them at each machine in the shop
[01:03:49] <Sairon> kept track of how much time i was spending on the manual mill
[01:03:58] <Sairon> how much time at mastercam
[01:04:05] <Sairon> how much time doing overhead type stuff
[01:04:14] <Sairon> it was kinda interesting
[01:04:21] <Sairon> i'm pretty excited to see where my time goes
[01:04:30] <Connor> A2Sheds: No javascript on the page...
[01:04:34] <Connor> to speak of..
[01:06:30] <andypugh> A2Sheds: The thing I don't get is that the spammy links can't make any money, they don't go anywhere, or identify a source or anything.
[01:06:59] <andypugh> Best guess is that the Google cache got polluted (or is being repeatedly polluted)
[01:07:34] <A2Sheds> it looks like they hack the servers, cpanel etc
[01:07:52] <A2Sheds> I don't know where or how EMC is hosted
[01:08:26] <Connor> It's a Joomla Site..
[01:08:53] <A2Sheds> EMC is not alone with the spammy content
[01:08:54] <andypugh> At some point in the past Google cached this version of the emc2 homepage: http://www.linuxcnc.org/images/fbfiles/images/linuxcnc.png
[01:09:16] <A2Sheds> wow
[01:09:48] <Connor> Okay, That's how to happened.. someone fracked with the site.. SQL Injection most likly.
[01:10:47] <andypugh> But why? it's just annoying with no obvious way to profit from it for the black-hat
[01:11:06] <A2Sheds> just kiddies or common asshats
[01:11:21] <andypugh> All I can think is that it is an attempt by Mach3 5th-columnists to discredit EMC2.
[01:11:24] <elmo40> how could they sql inject? are there new holes to be patched?
[01:11:25] <Connor> script kidies and spam bots.. go figure.. You should so what I have to do to keep spam bots from signing up to some sites run..
[01:11:47] <Connor> I reject 8-10 uses a day using blacklist service.
[01:11:50] <Connor> it's crazy
[01:12:15] <Connor> Depends on the exploit, age of the SQL/Apache/Joomla
[01:12:22] <andypugh> linuxcnc.org is on a truly ancient version of Joomal.
[01:12:49] <Connor> OMG, It's v1.xx
[01:12:56] <Connor> 1.8
[01:12:59] <Connor> WTF.
[01:13:11] <A2Sheds> maybe it's just time to shore everything up
[01:13:20] <andypugh> Worse than that: Joomla! 1.0.14 Stable [ Daybreak ] 11 February 2008 00:00 UTC
[01:13:31] <Connor> Admin says 1.8
[01:13:48] <Connor> http://www.linuxcnc.org/administrator/
[01:13:58] <Connor> Upper right hand corner
[01:14:11] <A2Sheds> I'm actually doing by seasonal reinstall of Win7 due to malware
[01:14:20] <Connor> But, wait.. that's not right..
[01:14:25] <Connor> 1.8 is bran new.
[01:14:27] <Connor> brandnew..
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[01:14:36] <andypugh> I logged in, what I posted is on the next page.
[01:14:36] <Connor> What the heck..
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[01:14:52] <A2Sheds> I only need one MS machine to run CAD, it's really sad
[01:15:21] <Connor> never mind.. it is 1.0. . the 0 has the slash in it.. and it's such a funky font it looked like 1.8
[01:15:23] <PCW> Tom_L: 7i43mech.pdf. 7i47mech.pdf don't have hole locations?
[01:16:14] <Connor> and a band angle that I was looking at it at.
[01:17:00] <Connor> Yea, needs updated to at least 1.5 stable version.. don't bother with 1.6 or 1.7 right now.. 1.8 is going to be long term release.. 1.7 is 6 month release.
[01:17:14] <Connor> They're driving me nuts with their release schedules.
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[01:20:37] <Sairon> A2Sheds: I feel your pain.
[01:21:03] <Sairon> mastercam was being a total *!#$ today
[01:21:15] <Sairon> and i just wished i had something... different
[01:21:25] <Sairon> almost makes it tempting to write a mastercam replacement
[01:21:33] <Sairon> but then, i've a feeling that would take ALOT of work
[01:21:45] <Sairon> there are, however
[01:21:52] <Sairon> alot of times i'm using it and thinking
[01:21:58] <Sairon> "There's got to be a better way"
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[01:53:33] <andypugh> Night all.
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[06:17:35] <automata> hi
[06:18:29] <automata> can someone help me out with configuring hal to set the machine on when the estop is released
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[06:24:20] <Jymmm> you mena withotu having to hit the ON?
[06:30:29] <mrsunshine> on condition shouldnt be when emergency stop buttons are released
[06:30:42] <mrsunshine> imo atleast =)
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[06:49:30] <Loetmichel> mornin'
[06:51:13] <automata> Jymmm: yes without hitting ON
[06:51:42] <Jymmm> automata: Not a good idea safety wise.
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[06:55:41] <automata> The machine I am building is a very small gantry router with under-powered steppers so it will not be such a huge safety risk (I am assuming).
[06:57:34] <Jymmm> Well, *I* have a different viewpoint of "ESTOP". Most consider it an "Oh shit" button, and not an EMERGENCY STOP button. If you want a PAUSE button, incorporate it, but not take away the safety/ what if factor imnsho.
[06:58:32] <Jymmm> If 4yo was to get to the machine, would you want the E-STOP to do what it's suppose to is my mindset.
[06:59:18] <Jymmm> If that ESTOP was press momentarily (maybe even defective), would you want the machien to turn back on automatically?
[07:00:17] <automata> Actually For this machine I want to get rid of the ESTOP completely and just have a hardware power ON
[07:01:12] <automata> Again this machine is just for trying various emc setups and see what I like for my eventual large format router.
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[07:28:30] <spectral> Is anyone here able to answer a stepgen question?
[07:29:37] <archivist> ask the real question
[07:31:08] <spectral> The first one is, what units is stepgen.x.steplen in? The documentation claims nanoseconds, but stepconfig has set it to 1, and other guides i've seen online suggest it is an integer.
[07:31:55] <Loetmichel> bah, Little by little one goes far.... http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=12238 ... i want more RPM and a better spindle bearing. that was the third tungsten carbide bit broken by ratteling :-(
[07:32:39] <anonimasu> swap to hss
[07:32:40] <anonimasu> :/
[07:34:42] <automata> Jymmm: I figured it out and in the process have fallen in love with HAL!!! Wow what a system!!!! Kudos to the designers!!!
[07:34:46] <Loetmichel> the machinwas never constructed to mill Steel
[07:35:04] <Loetmichel> and with a worn spindle its even worse ;-)
[07:35:18] <Loetmichel> @ anonimasu
[07:38:08] <anonimasu> yes but hss tools cont die from that kind of beating as quick as carbide
[07:38:16] <anonimasu> as carbide is brittle and fractures
[07:38:58] <spectral> In either case, nothing I'm doing to steplen seems to change the output - I've measured the output pin with an oscilliscope and it's always ~2.5us.
[07:39:31] <anonimasu> set up the timings in the ini
[07:39:32] <anonimasu> :)
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[07:51:03] <spectral> Is there something in the .ini file which overrides the .hal file? I don't see anything in the .ini file which looks like it would mess with steplen.
[07:55:11] <awallin> spectral: ini file variables can be used by hal-files
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[08:28:20] <spectral> Ok, looking though the stepgen code gave me an answer to my stepgen units question. It use to be the number of thread periods, but was changed in Mar 2007 to be nanoseconds. So there's some obsolete documentation out there. I believe the stepconfig program is generating incorrect values now though.
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[08:59:21] <spectral> Strike my previous comment about step config generating bad stepgen values. It turns out there is a step doubling mode which uses paralell port hardware to reset the step pulse to inactive after a set duration, specified via parport.x.reset-time.
[09:00:36] <spectral> So the system was ignoring stepgen.x.steplen in favour of the value in parport.x.reset-time. Hopefully this will fix my missing step issue!
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[09:46:07] <nicko> awallin>> was reading your notes on the trajectory planner
[09:46:16] <awallin_> ok...
[09:46:47] <nicko> interestign stuff I guess
[09:46:49] <nicko> !
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[09:47:03] <nicko> are you actively learning more and more ?
[09:47:30] <awallin_> well I've only written about the exact-stop planner, which is the simplest case. cradek probably knows the blending code, I haven't tried to document it.
[09:48:58] <awallin_> the current code is very very general (i.e. three translation and three rotation degrees of freedom). I think any lookahead/high-speed planner needs to make some assumptions about the machine to make the problem tractable
[09:49:00] <nicko> sooner or later I'll be doing control theory at uni
[09:49:57] <nicko> I'm a bit of a layman at the moment
[09:55:48] <nicko> You're referring to the condradiction between requesting that something move to an exact point in space at 'near enough' the same time (for instance 2 axis coordinated movement) - but also maintain a constant feedrate with respect to cutter and material ?
[09:57:08] <nicko> Vertical steps in velo/accel/jerk profiles and so on ?
[09:58:55] <nicko> I have some machiines in mind where I'd be able to smooth out the profiles beforehand - woudl be interesting to know how much I have to within the constraints of the system so the smoothing doesn't go further than it needs to
[10:05:08] <awallin_> that's the idea with trajectory-planning, the input/set-point for your PID is "nice" so that the PID-controller had an easier job of keeping the motor where it's supposed to be
[10:05:13] <archivist> look at paste messages on that with respect to tiny vectors
[10:05:16] <archivist> past
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[10:06:42] <awallin_> IIRC the current emc2 implementation has trapezoidal velocity, so the demands on acceleration are "instantaneous" and if you would plot jerk (time derivative of acceleration) it would have "delta-peaks"
[10:07:51] <nicko> right ...
[10:08:23] <nicko> I was reading about the continuing series of derivatives
[10:08:35] <nicko> they keep on going - snap, crackle and pop and so on
[10:09:01] <awallin_> yes. the exact-stop planner for those smoother planners is not that hard. the hard problem is blending moves into eachother
[10:10:03] <awallin_> I had matlab code (from holland?) for a jerk or double-jerk smooth planner at some point when I was writing that wiki page (2006)
[10:10:26] <nicko> in my laymans way (a little knowledge much dangerous than none) I always wonder why if you can describe the accel of accel or accel or accel and so on
[10:11:40] <nicko> ...why there isn't some 'final' way to describe motion as the infinte series of all these accels of accels and so on
[10:12:32] <awallin_> turtles all the way to the bottom :)
[10:12:40] <nicko> turtles ?
[10:13:00] <awallin_> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turtles_all_the_way_down
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[10:18:19] <nicko> good fodder for some obfuscated code competition entry ...
[10:18:26] <nicko> some kind of recursion
[10:18:43] <nicko> warm up your PC for no reason than to keep warm in winter
[10:19:00] <nicko> oh hey yeh!!
[10:19:10] <nicko> so I have a spindle here that needs water cooling
[10:19:30] <nicko> I was thinking a motorcycle radiator and a coolant pump ...
[10:19:47] <nicko> plain ol' AC fan if required
[10:19:58] <nicko> anyone played that game before >?
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[10:26:37] <automata> Just a thought: The HAL configuration files are primarily connecting components pins to signals and generating a netlist for the connections. This is essentially the same as a PCB schematic editor like Kicad schematic editor.
[10:26:50] <anonimasu> it's been done before like that I think
[10:27:19] <automata> That is cool... googling for it right away....
[10:27:28] <anonimasu> but experimental..
[10:28:00] <awallin_> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?Eagle2HAL
[10:28:02] <automata> That might be a neat tool for HAL neewbs like me...
[10:30:49] <automata> Eagle2hal is cool!!
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[10:55:14] <nicko> be interesting to see it happen the other way round too ...
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[11:02:01] <cpresser> automata: there is also classicladder if you have to realize more complex logical functions
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[14:55:21] <Loetmichel> ahhhh! now that i am nearly done with the steel case my boss looks at it: "why didn you make that from aluminium? that is also allowed..."
[14:56:17] <canid> ouch
[14:56:19] <Loetmichel> couldnt he have said that 32 hours earlier? Would have spared me about 5 Tungsten carbide mill bits and a LOT of time.... :-(
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[14:58:05] <Jymmm> Loetmichel: no work order?
[15:00:14] <Loetmichel> Jymmm: no, boss saif: "build a case for the Noteboop-PSU, like the other ones..."
[15:00:18] <Loetmichel> said
[15:00:19] <JT-Shop> no ISO 9000 or what ever the number is
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[15:01:30] <Loetmichel> and i thougt: the other ones are from Zinced Steel, so i will build the new one from zinced steel also... even had the boss give me some money to buy a sheet of steel...
[15:03:00] <canid> cast iron question: a buddy of mine was upgrading his mini-mill with one of those air-spring deals for the head-stock
[15:03:20] <canid> and tried to drill out one of the mounting bolt holes with a hand drill
[15:03:35] <canid> then proceeded to try to tap it under power with the same hand drill
[15:04:00] <canid> of course he broke the tap and mangled the hole
[15:04:49] <canid> if i can extract it, what options migt i have to fill and re drill and tap it?
[15:05:11] <canid> i figured JB Weld would probably work, but probably be pretty ghetto
[15:05:14] <JT-Shop> heli-coil
[15:06:05] <syyl> drill bigger, glue in a plug with loctite 648, drill, tap
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[15:08:04] <canid> thank you.
[15:09:19] <archivist> canid take the casting to someone with a spark eroder tap will disappear rapidly
[15:10:05] <archivist> I broke a tap the other day deep in something I had just made, cost me a tenner
[15:10:25] <JT-Shop> I doubt drilling by hand will produce a close fitting enough hole for loctite to properly work
[15:11:00] <Jymmm> lots o lock tite
[15:11:18] <syyl> ah damn, by hand
[15:11:23] <JT-Shop> "LOCTITE®648™ is designed for the bonding of cylindrical fitting parts. The product cures when confined in the absence of air between close fitting metal surfaces"
[15:11:29] <syyl> thats a bit optimistic :D
[15:11:35] <JT-Shop> yea
[15:11:52] <archivist> I did not lose me thread! its still usable after the tap removal
[15:11:57] <JT-Shop> heli-coil or oversize threaded plug
[15:11:58] <archivist> me/my
[15:12:14] <syyl> or a ensat thread insert
[15:12:48] <Jymmm> silly putty!
[15:13:13] <canid> i've got a small drill press myself.
[15:13:29] <archivist> canid the tap removal with a spark eroder only removes the tap center the hole and existing thread is not damaged
[15:13:30] <canid> i don't know what possesed my friend to take a hand drill to his mill
[15:13:49] <canid> or especially to try to tap under power with a hand drill
[15:14:10] <canid> i'm reading about EDM now
[15:14:28] <archivist> Ive tapped under power with hand drill but care is needed
[15:15:04] <canid> well certainly it can be done, but i wouldn't do it
[15:15:16] <canid> and not on a critical part of a relatively expensive tool
[15:15:20] <Jymmm> I only tape under power on things like alum plate with lots of holes to be tapped
[15:15:25] <JT-Shop> I tap with a cordless all the time in materials that are conducive to that type of operation like sheet metal and such
[15:15:35] <Jymmm> s/tape/tap/
[15:15:46] <Jymmm> and use tapping fluid too
[15:16:06] <Jymmm> in a syringe
[15:16:42] <archivist> yup tapping in sheet is trivial with drill
[15:17:16] <Jymmm> Or just dip the tap into tapping fluid each time. never had one brak yet when using tapping fluid.
[15:17:18] <archivist> actually better because less tendency to lean
[15:18:16] <Jymmm> Heh, my drill has a level on it, which helps prevent leaning
[15:18:30] <Jymmm> especially on the 15+ tap
[15:18:33] <canid> well yes, but all this aside; would any of you try to do this with the iron casting of your mill's headstock?
[15:18:56] <canid> maybe i'm off, but it sounded like a terrible idea to me
[15:19:15] <Jymmm> s/terrible/dumbass/
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[15:19:59] <archivist> I bet he was not using a machine tap too
[15:20:10] <Jymmm> I'd chuck the tap in a drill press just to make sure it's straight, then turn it by hand
[15:22:20] <Jymmm> canid: So, helicoil sounds about right
[15:22:44] <canid> at any rate, he's been slowly doing a cnc conversion on his mill for the last two years (e.g. occasionally working on it when he has time)
[15:22:48] <JT-Shop> canid: I would not try that on a casting, I would even take care to make sure the holes are perpendicular to the face while drilling and drill pilot holes if needed
[15:22:56] <archivist> with proper removal no helicoil needed
[15:23:15] <canid> and i think he's going to let me correct it and finish setting it up while he's overseas
[15:23:21] <Jymmm> For the record... helicoils in magnesium don't hold all that well.
[15:24:12] <Jymmm> at least not at 8G's
[15:24:52] <canid> now that i have a couple starting places i'll do myself some research
[15:25:15] <canid> up til now my ideas had consisted of 'maybe jb weld filler'
[15:25:31] <canid> you can tell i'm no machinist
[15:25:36] <canid> and neither is my friend
[15:26:40] <canid> if there's room, i think drilling and taping for a larger diameter bolt is probably ideal
[15:26:58] <Jymmm> so, you still have to remove the broken tap?
[15:27:04] <canid> i know the original hole wasn't squared properly
[15:27:07] <canid> yes
[15:27:30] <canid> it's not a blind hole at least
[15:28:16] <Jymmm> Oh, then worse cse, you can just shove a long bolt thru the hole and attacha nut
[15:28:17] <canid> so if i can turn it with any decent torque, i might be able to back or out or turn it through
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[15:34:47] <JT-Shop> if any of the tap is still sticking out of either side you might back it out
[15:35:01] <JT-Shop> if you work careful...
[15:36:23] <Jymmm> lube up!
[15:37:03] <Jymmm> Heh, shove it in an oven =)
[15:39:14] <canid> hey; i have put stranger things in my kitchen oven
[15:40:12] <canid> i routinely temper knife blades in there while while baking my pizas to save on electricity
[15:40:24] <archivist> no force required with a spark eroder
[15:40:31] <canid> well, the blades stay in longer than the pizas
[15:40:52] <canid> archivist: i'll certainly look into that
[15:40:55] <archivist> seriously less damage
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[15:41:49] <archivist> I no longer consider struggling with other methods of tap removal
[15:42:38] <JT-Shop> handy when you have one near by
[15:43:27] <archivist> bout 3 miles for me :)
[15:43:50] <archivist> and takes a small amount of folding
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[15:48:50] <archivist> at the last job we did some production where the part could be thrown when a tap died, was getting about 70-90 parts per tap
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[15:50:39] <canid> i'm researching spark eroding
[15:50:47] <canid> the prosses is pretty interesting
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[15:52:21] <archivist> or http://www.electroarc.com/?gclid=CMnXxLbMx6oCFQwPfAodC1GFzw
[15:53:39] <archivist> all over the place http://www.brokentap.com/
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[16:01:28] <anonimasu> taps are cheap, workpieces are not
[16:01:35] <anonimasu> better swap out eary or mill threads .)
[16:02:06] <JT-Shop> I look at my taps with a 10x before use and discard if the edges show any chipping
[16:02:22] <anonimasu> I power thread on the lathe.
[16:02:28] <anonimasu> if they are damaged they roll form the threads ;)
[16:02:39] <anonimasu> (M20) and up
[16:02:48] <anonimasu> :p
[16:03:00] <JT-Shop> I seldom hand tap anymore
[16:03:04] <canid> i look forward to being able to machine treads
[16:03:08] <JT-Shop> M20 is a nice size tap
[16:03:16] <canid> but i still look forward to being able to own a lathe and mill
[16:03:28] <JT-Shop> machining threads is a whole nuther thing
[16:03:41] <anonimasu> hehe
[16:03:46] <JT-Shop> like thread mills if you don't have spindle sync
[16:04:01] <anonimasu> that's what I mean, if you break the cutter big deal..
[16:04:13] <theorbtwo> JT-Shop: Surely, if you don't have a spindle sync, the correct solution is to make one?
[16:04:24] <anonimasu> still cheaper then scrapping parts
[16:04:36] <canid> i have my eyes on the grizzly g4003g
[16:05:16] <JT-Shop> theorbtwo: just depends on the threads... for example if you need 2"-32 threads in a part you won't find a tap for that
[16:05:21] <canid> still pretty open when it comes to a mill. it'll be a while unless i find very good work
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[16:51:24] <canid> theorbtwo: isn't that the standard machinists solution? i'm fairly new to this, but that was the impression i've gotten.
[16:53:24] <A2Sheds> what's the plan with EMC and Ubunutu, stick with Ubuntu and Gnome 3 (the unholy mess) or???
[16:53:36] <A2Sheds> Ubuntu even
[16:55:22] <awallin> I tried the 11.10 beta and it doesn't have the 'ubuntu classic' session... some tweaking apparently required to make it look 'normal'
[16:55:39] <awallin> 12.04 is going to be the next LTS I guess
[16:57:51] <A2Sheds> I hope somebody forks Gnome
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[17:12:20] <Loetmichel> re @ home
[17:15:52] <IchGuckLive> Loetmichel: tonight mega shootinstar weekend
[17:16:15] <Loetmichel> ?
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[17:21:15] <IchGuckLive> Loetmichel: sternschnuppen über Deutschland
[17:21:41] <Loetmichel> IchGuckLive: ja und?
[17:22:22] <IchGuckLive> wichmaster spezial
[17:22:27] <motioncontrol> Goo evening
[17:22:41] <IchGuckLive> B) motioncontrol
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[17:23:20] <mhaberler> ok
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[17:25:25] <motioncontrol> have a question about iov2 tool changed: when write the m6 t1 have first motion.analog-out-00 at 1 when confirm digital-00 true read m6 sub and have analog-01 and analog-02 at value 1 first the digital-01 is true. this not is correct because if not have tool changed the analog-01 and analog-02 not is correct changed
[17:25:52] <motioncontrol> i can use the old tool prepare and tool number ?
[17:26:18] <mhaberler> iov2 does not have any motion.* pins?
[17:27:14] <mhaberler> I'm sorry, I dont understand your question
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[17:27:46] <motioncontrol> ok i repeat
[17:28:09] <motioncontrol> i have set in in file iov2 , for io ol version
[17:28:10] <mhaberler> you're talking about an ngc program, right?
[17:28:15] <motioncontrol> yes
[17:28:19] <mhaberler> ok
[17:28:19] <motioncontrol> m6demo
[17:28:22] <mhaberler> aha
[17:29:52] <motioncontrol> the question is for use iov2, i read tool prepare in motion.digital-out-00 and i write tool prepared in mot.dig-in-00 ?
[17:31:51] <mhaberler> io or iov2 has no relation to the motion.* pins - if you use remapping, you define your own pins
[17:32:51] <mhaberler> iocontrol still has to stay around because of lube, mist, estop, emc-enable* etc
[17:34:02] <mhaberler> you started with axis-iocontrolv2-demo.ini, right? let me look that up, its been a while
[17:34:50] <motioncontrol> excuse, when set in rs274ngc in ini file [RS274NGC]
[17:34:50] <motioncontrol> # remap T<pocket> to a named oword subroutine.
[17:34:51] <motioncontrol> # The tool number will be passed as parameter #1
[17:34:51] <motioncontrol> # The pocket number will be passed as parameter #2
[17:34:51] <motioncontrol> T_COMMAND=o<tdemo>call
[17:34:51] <motioncontrol> # remap M6 to a named oword subroutine.
[17:34:53] <motioncontrol> # the tool number currently loaded (in spindle) is passed as parameter #1
[17:34:55] <motioncontrol> M6_COMMAND=o<m6demo>call
[17:34:57] <motioncontrol> # to use the M69 iocontrol based toolchange:
[17:34:59] <motioncontrol> #M6_COMMAND=o<m6remap>call
[17:35:03] <motioncontrol> # handler gsub called on IoAborts - to cleanup HAL pins etc
[17:35:05] <motioncontrol> ON_ABORT_COMMAND=o<on_abort>call
[17:35:07] <motioncontrol> LOG_LEVEL =2
[17:35:09] <motioncontrol> # File containing interpreter variables
[17:35:11] <motioncontrol> PARAMETER_FILE = sim-lathe.var
[17:35:20] <mhaberler> ok
[17:36:05] <motioncontrol> when start a m6 t1 command , first read tdemo sub after m6demo and when press abort on_abort sub is ok ?
[17:37:13] <motioncontrol> now in this sub is used motion pin for read tool change cycle
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[17:37:40] <motioncontrol> i have connet this pin in classic ladder pin for tool sequenze is correct ?
[17:38:02] <mhaberler> yes, because they replace the iocontrol.0.tool* pins
[17:38:10] <motioncontrol> ok
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[17:38:32] <mhaberler> I think you might still have to loop the tool-change and tool-changed as well as prepare/prepared pins
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[17:39:10] <mhaberler> but technically they are not involved in TC HAL i/o anymore, everything interesting happens in the ngc files
[17:39:35] <motioncontrol> for reset old io i have write in hal file iocontrol.prepare <=> iocontrol.prepared and iocontrol.change <=> iocontrol.changed is correct ?
[17:40:22] <motioncontrol> i don't want use io want use iov2 because is more flexible tool change
[17:40:30] <mhaberler> look, the flow is as follows: without M6_COMMAND/T_COMMAND, an M6 or Tx start iocontrol immediately, and iocontrol pins count
[17:40:53] <mhaberler> if you use remapping, the iocontrol component *does not have any role in toolchange*
[17:41:24] <motioncontrol> yes i want use only iov2 logical
[17:41:33] <mhaberler> the only thing it really does is internally change tool number, offsets etc
[17:41:43] <mhaberler> everything else happens in the remap ngc sub
[17:42:20] <mhaberler> iow: if you use remapping, there is not much difference between io and iov2
[17:42:26] <motioncontrol> the question when set iov2 in ini file the iocontrol.cc not is read and used only iocontrolv2.cc is used ?
[17:42:37] <mhaberler> yes
[17:42:46] <motioncontrol> good
[17:43:08] <motioncontrol> i thing it more power the original io
[17:43:51] <motioncontrol> because i have particolar tool change , my axis move in tool sequanze and if you use io not can resoove it
[17:43:54] <mhaberler> I admit it is confusing - in my development code iocontrol is completely removed and replaced by Python code which does the HAL pin wiggling
[17:44:53] <motioncontrol> ok because you use a you gui ?
[17:45:07] <mhaberler> ?
[17:45:09] <motioncontrol> but i use hal pin
[17:45:59] <motioncontrol> actual version the emc use hal pin not python code
[17:46:22] <mhaberler> this is not either-or, there is a hal Python component.
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[17:47:07] <motioncontrol> but i thing is correct use hal pin and iov2 ?
[17:47:15] <mhaberler> sure
[17:48:07] <gene76> good afternoon folks
[17:48:19] <mhaberler> hi
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[17:48:28] <motioncontrol> in iocontrolv2.cc the pin iocontrol.prepare and io.prepared and io.change and chanded is read and write ?
[17:50:21] <gene76> I need a math whiz this afternoon, to tell me how to calculate the equ of a g2 move, but do the cutting longitudinally for about a foot back and forth.
[17:51:30] <motioncontrol> mhaberler, have only one problem, when read m6 t1 line the interpreter and excute it, the value the pin halui.program-line not is correct because ?
[17:52:14] <mhaberler> because it is executing a different ngc file. that's one of those bugs, sorry
[17:52:35] <mhaberler> dont rely on line numbers around that code
[17:52:52] <gene76> What I need is the chord height of .4", of a circle .880 in diameter. This I can hack in g2 moves I think, but would leave a ridge pattern in the cut
[17:53:13] <motioncontrol> mhaberler, you can resolve it ?
[17:54:28] <gene76> The chord cut is of course the bottom .4 of the circle. Ideas, or shall I do it in g2 moves?
[17:54:40] <mhaberler> This code will be completely replaced later this year, so I'd rather dont
[17:58:08] <motioncontrol> ok thanks
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[18:03:07] <motioncontrol> mhaberler, excuse have another problem when set m61 q2 for load the tool in spindle in mdi the tool is load in iocontrol.tool-numner, but when after start g43 for apply tool ofset not is load the tool offset, the command m61 q1 not fuction, you can ceck it ?
[18:03:53] <mhaberler> that never worked, you need to explicitly set the tooloffset after m61 (I think)
[18:05:33] <motioncontrol> for correct work i load the tool offset g43 . after tool change m6 t1 i write g43 for load the offset tool
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[18:31:42] <JT-Shop> gene76: can you describe what your trying to do?
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[18:57:51] <alex4nder> hey
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[19:22:59] <Danimal_garage> hi
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[19:37:14] <alex4nder> Danimal_garage: how's it?
[19:38:42] <Danimal_garage> not too bad except this shitty server connection
[19:38:46] <Danimal_garage> how about you?
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[19:41:23] <alex4nder> Danimal_garage: good, my new dial calipers and test indicator showed up, so I think I'm going to ditch work and mess with my mill for a couple hours.
[19:43:29] <Danimal_garage> haha nice
[19:44:02] <Danimal_garage> wish i could do the same, but my mill is my work
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[19:50:07] <alex4nder> Danimal_garage: when you tram your mill, what do you use?
[19:50:19] <alex4nder> a DTI in some type of extension, chucked up into the spindle?
[19:51:20] * anonimasu just bought a 3kw inverter
[19:54:14] <gene76> JT_shop: yes, digging a barrel bedding channel in a stock. I know the diameter of the barrel, .880", and the diameter of the core box bit, 0.755, and I want to cut the bottom half of a circle
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[19:55:15] <gene76> after subtracting the bit diameter from the barrel diameter to get the swing. But what I have so far refuses to cut more than the bottom 90 degrees of the cut.
[19:56:25] <gene76> running in g19 mode, no tool descritptions
[19:57:13] <Danimal_garage> i don't tram my mill, it's all solid
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[19:57:36] <alex4nder> ah
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[19:58:54] <gene76> JT-shop: yes, digging a barrel bedding channel in a stock. I know the diameter of the barrel, .880", and the diameter of the core box bit, 0.755, and I want to cut the bottom half of a circle
[19:58:59] <gene76> after subtracting the bit diameter from the barrel diameter to get the swing. But what I have so far refuses to cut more than the bottom 90 degrees of the cut.
[19:59:01] <gene76> running in g19 mode, no tool descritptions
[19:59:30] <Danimal_garage> man this connection sucks lately
[19:59:49] <gene76> Seems so, I'd be fussing at my ISP
[20:02:14] <gene76> back in a short, caffiene low.
[20:05:32] <gene76> back even later, better half says its dinner time :)
[20:05:42] <jthornton> ok
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[20:17:25] <JT-Shop> gene76: is this a round nose bit? are you wanting to run the U shaped path or long ways?
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[20:33:37] <jepler> apparently, 150 google+ invitations await behind this URL: https://plus.google.com/_/notifications/ngemlink?path=%2F%3Fgpinv%3D16Nnc2PSJmA%3AakHwUfAIv7g
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[21:08:15] <JT-Shop> what is the link from?
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[21:20:24] <anonimasu> is open loop vector control any good for a vfd?
[21:23:58] <JT-Shop> http://www.drives.co.uk/news/technews/news_technews418.htm
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[21:26:05] <anonimasu> I bought a omron sysdrive 3g3mv-A2115 vfd
[21:26:05] <anonimasu> :)
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[21:29:09] <anonimasu> and im wondering if it'll perform ok
[21:29:31] <JT-Shop> to replace the one that let the magic smoke out?
[21:30:17] <anonimasu> yep
[21:30:57] <canid> haven't eard anybody actually use that expression in a while
[21:31:08] <canid> good to see it's still in use
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[21:32:00] <anonimasu> I know vector control is better but not what it'll do for me running a lathe off it
[21:32:59] <JT-Shop> can the omron drive do closed loop?
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[21:37:51] <anonimasu> no
[21:39:16] <anonimasu> http://www.limasoft.cz/omron/pdf/3G3MV_en_manual.pdf
[21:39:19] <anonimasu> _maybe_
[21:40:27] <anonimasu> yeah it looks like it can
[21:42:19] <anonimasu> it has a pulsetrain reference input
[21:42:51] <gene76> JT-Shop: Yes its round nosed, with a nose radii of .376"
[21:43:19] <gene76> JT-Shop: Back from dinner, obviously.
[21:46:56] <JT-Shop> you wanting to do the U path or the long path?
[21:46:59] <anonimasu> looks like this vfd had 27 million of settings.
[21:47:24] <JT-Shop> should be easy then if only 27 million settings to choose from
[21:48:04] <JT-Shop> gene76: you want to use cutter comp or just plan the path knowing the tool diameter?
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[21:48:34] <anonimasu> 356 pages of manual..
[21:48:39] <anonimasu> http://www.limasoft.cz/omron/pdf/3G3MV_en_manual.pdf
[21:49:04] * JT-Shop is not even going to click on that link :)
[21:50:13] <anonimasu> my only question is this a good vfd?
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[21:59:29] <JT-Shop> looks nice to me
[21:59:45] <JT-Shop> but what do I know...
[22:00:04] <Tom_itx> :)
[22:00:51] <Tom_itx> it's five oclock somewhere....
[22:01:04] * JT-Shop hands one to Tom_itx
[22:01:25] * Tom_itx sets the empty down and grabs it
[22:06:41] <syyl> getting close
[22:06:42] <syyl> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/24396704/CIMG0795.JPG
[22:06:42] <gene76> JT-Shop: I'm just planning the path knowing the tool diameter, and I found I could get the bottom half of the circle by wrapping the k value in a comment, so that part is running ATM
[22:06:51] <syyl> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/24396704/CIMG0794.JPG
[22:09:22] <gene76> JT-Shop: I am zero'd/homed a bit high, so it will take some minor adjustments to get to the correct depth. I'd guess a bit over another .0625 for the depth.
[22:15:11] <anonimasu> syyl: nice looking!
[22:15:38] <syyl> :)
[22:15:50] <syyl> and there, the harmonic drive:
[22:15:53] <Tom_itx> set the bar high for anonimasu
[22:15:56] <syyl> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/24396704/CIMG0789.JPG
[22:16:31] <anonimasu> when you do make that yourself i'll join the machining :p
[22:16:58] <anonimasu> Tom_itx: it seems like my bar is high already :)
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[22:18:47] <anonimasu> Tom_itx: looks like a harmonic drive is easy to build, if you own a edm..
[22:18:49] <anonimasu> and a wire edm :D
[22:19:08] <Tom_itx> not with the tools i have
[22:19:25] <anonimasu> mine neither
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[22:59:45] <gene76> Andy: What is the number of digits available in emc?
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[23:05:49] <MOGLI> hello JT-SHOP.. i have few question regarding thc
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[23:35:06] <andypugh> gene76: I am not sure I understand the question?
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