#emc | Logs for 2011-06-30

[00:00:16] <andypugh> Yes, didn't I already say that? It's a cheap and nasty chinese lathe
[00:00:27] <Tom_itx> no i didn't read all the log
[00:00:28] <Tom_itx> sry
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[00:01:26] <andypugh> I can see two ways. 1) A very carefully machined expanding device that can grip the radius on the inner lip or 2) Weld a bar across the race and hammer it out.
[00:01:57] <andypugh> 1) requires the lathe to be working. 2) leaves me very, very, committed to removing the outer race.
[00:02:14] <Tom_itx> no welding required for maintenance and repairs
[00:02:50] <Tom_itx> the inner lip may give way before the bearing is unseated
[00:02:55] <andypugh> The latter method is often required to remove motorcycle steering head races.
[00:03:37] <Tom_itx> i have ground slots in them and cracked them out before but it's a pita and should only be done in an extreme situation
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[00:03:58] <KimK> Method (3) EDM style. (as in removing the core of a tap and the four blades fall out). EDM "hack" cut two slits in the outer race and the two 180 degree pieces will fall out.
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[00:04:01] <Tom_itx> cut 2 slots close together and split out a section
[00:04:09] <andypugh> Indeed, so perhaps I should just reassemble?
[00:04:16] <Tom_itx> perhaps :)
[00:04:34] <Tom_itx> wait for catestrophic failure then worry about it
[00:04:56] <andypugh> KimK taking my lathe to an EDM machine might be a challenge.
[00:05:16] <Tom_itx> scratch the brown and see if it comes off. that will tell you if it's oil or heat related
[00:05:25] <KimK> No, do it right where it sits, but you'll have to cook up some doodads to do it with.
[00:05:47] <Tom_itx> slide a chunk of C4 in the race
[00:05:51] <Tom_itx> that will also work
[00:06:04] <andypugh> I doubt I can create an EDM from scratch for less than the cost of a new lathe.
[00:06:34] <Tom_itx> although putting the new one back in might be a trick
[00:07:09] <Tom_itx> try the scratch test. i don't think i'd worry about it too much
[00:07:13] <KimK> Maybe a little square of copper, some pieces of rubber or plastic to cover the ends so you can keep oil on it, some temporary slider, a telescoping antenna?
[00:07:16] <Tom_itx> unless you can see flaking on the race
[00:07:28] <andypugh> The brown is on the surface of the rollers. I am wondering if they have worn such that the bearing is actually runnning on the lips of the races (as the rollers wear the races move through each other.)
[00:07:59] <Tom_itx> i still think you would see some type of metal flaking if that were the case
[00:08:23] <Tom_itx> the worn metal has to go somewhere
[00:08:38] <Tom_itx> what's the lube nearby look like?
[00:08:41] <andypugh> What I was looking for was signs that the outer is loose in the casting (no) or the inner on the spindle (some sign of spinning, actually). I am trying to locate the source of a serious chatter problem.
[00:08:44] <Tom_itx> do a magnet test on it
[00:09:01] <andypugh> I already described how the lube falls straight out again.
[00:09:40] <andypugh> I might re-assemble with grease. Oil is just silly.
[00:10:10] <Tom_itx> unless it's made for use with a drip oiler
[00:10:33] <Tom_itx> you could try it but periodically check to make sure there's still grease in the bearings
[00:10:46] <Tom_itx> showertime
[00:11:52] <andypugh> There is a little spring-ball oiler and a tiny plastic oil bottle in the toolkit. I don't think it was designed with any thought for anything other than being very cheap.
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[00:13:12] <KimK> Oh, hey, I just realized you could use the carriage and cross-slide to hold the electrode holder, if you decide to go that way. That would give you very fine control and maintain proper alignment.
[00:14:18] <KimK> Since you'd be cutting into a square corner.
[00:14:54] <KimK> s/cutting/plunging/
[00:15:12] <andypugh> What do you propose for a power source?
[00:16:15] <andypugh> I can't help feeling that welding a lump of metal to the race is a lot easier.
[00:16:48] <KimK> Well, you've got 240V mains there, just current-limit it to something reasonable with a big light bulb. Maybe 300W or so? You could adjust it as needed. DC rectified, of course.
[00:18:23] <KimK> Yes, if you have a welder handy, and if you can get in and get out fast without heating the headstock, and if they didn't press it in hard, welding a handle onto it is also a viable option.
[00:20:48] <elmo401> you know the tiny ball that holds sockets onto the ratchet? where do you think I can get that setup? the tiny spring, tiny ball and whatever to hold it all together.
[00:20:59] <KimK> Oh, you'd need an oil pump too for the EDM hack, but maybe that could be a turkey baster or something? This would be a totally manual job anyway.
[00:21:23] <elmo401> I guess they either pinch the end or press in a small ring to keep the ball from coming out.
[00:22:09] <andypugh> They peen it over, yes.
[00:22:15] <KimK> elmo401: I have seen those for pressing into fixtures and so forth, all ready-made.
[00:22:31] <KimK> Dann-Carr, maybe?
[00:23:02] <andypugh> You mean like http://www.wixroyd.com/en/catalog/standard-parts/spring-and-index-plungers ?
[00:23:46] <KimK> Ha, exactly like that, Andy, thanks!
[00:24:58] <andypugh> Anyway, night all.
[00:25:21] <KimK> Goodnight Andy. Good luck with that.
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[00:30:18] <moopy> KimK, did you want to commit my util to git???
[00:32:16] <KimK> moopy: Sure, I can do that, but I hope you don't mind waiting a bit. I'm in the middle of a big "docs" mess, and it's inconvenient for me to push anything right now.
[00:32:39] <KimK> I'm making progress though.
[00:33:46] <Jymmm> Does anyone if a fan(s) CFM/Static Pressure ratings are cumulative by chance? eg Two 80CFM@1" SP/each == 160CFM@2" SP ?
[00:34:23] <KimK> You have four of them?
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[00:34:41] <Jymmm> in that example 2 fans
[00:35:25] <Tom_itx> i swore i counted 3
[00:35:35] <Tom_itx> and, no
[00:35:59] <Jymmm> two fans, each mounted right next to each other. Each fan is rated at 80CFM@1" SP
[00:36:10] <Tom_itx> side by side or stacked?
[00:36:14] <KimK> Two 80/1 would give you either (in parallel, for sure) 160/1 or (in series, not so sure) 80/2.
[00:36:24] <Tom_itx> you would gain whatever the output of each fan is
[00:36:58] <KimK> But putting fans in "series" is a whole different deal, so, "not recommended".
[00:36:59] <Jymmm> Tom_itx: did you see what I wrote?
[00:37:17] <Tom_itx> i dunno about static pressure
[00:37:52] <Jymmm> KimK: Yeah, series is airflow voodoo to me
[00:38:17] <Tom_itx> do an experiment
[00:38:33] <Jymmm> I have nothing to measure with
[00:39:05] <Jymmm> I just don't know if the results are 160/1 or 80/2
[00:40:06] <Jymmm> I'm going to assume one or the other is related to series/parallel configuration
[00:40:09] <KimK> The CFMs in parallel certainly add. But if both are not running you'd have to have a shutter or valve or something if one is disabled and you want to keep going on just one.
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[00:40:43] <Tom_itx> he's asking about static pressure
[00:40:44] <Jymmm> KimK: But, when in parallel WHICH is added? The CFM or the SP ?
[00:40:47] <KimK> Otherwise the good one would blow backward out the dead one.
[00:41:02] <Tom_itx> parallel, cfm
[00:41:03] <KimK> The CFM would add in parallel.
[00:41:35] <Jymmm> so two 80cfm fans (one on each end of a tube) is gong to result in 160CFM ?
[00:42:01] <Tom_itx> test it
[00:42:14] <KimK> One on each end and the "load" is taken off in the center?
[00:43:00] <Jymmm> I don't know enough to account for the resistance of the duct (tube/pipe/etc)
[00:44:29] <KimK> I don't think that would be a problem for you. As long as each fan is drawing from free air and facing the "load" approximately equally.
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[00:45:33] <KimK> Wait, weren't you working on a vacuum system? Are these vacuum fans? I guess it doesn't matter, same principle holds.
[00:46:36] <Jymmm> KimK: No, I need to replace 4 fans with much larger (primarily quieter) ones
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[00:47:18] <KimK> OK, blowers then. No problem. I hope you can find something quieter.
[00:48:06] <Jymmm> Well, these are hi-performance 2U fans and I'm replacing with larger ones which will reduce the noise
[00:48:44] <KimK> Ah, in a relay rack installation. OK, interesting.
[00:49:44] <Jymmm> Close, I'm taking a 2U 8 bay enclosure, cutting it in half (it's jsut way too long) and building a new taller enclosure
[00:50:25] <KimK> Sounds good, post some photos maybe?
[00:50:38] <Jymmm> now that I will have the height available, I can use quieter/larger diameter fans 80mm to 220mm
[00:51:35] <Jymmm> What I need to figure out is if I need the same CFM or the same SP as the existing ones.
[01:36:44] <elmo401> depends on the amount of heat you want to dissipate.
[01:41:51] <West0n> So a mill at my school is haveing endmills slip. Any idea on what's causing this?
[01:42:32] <Tom_itx> worn out or dirty collets
[01:42:51] <Tom_itx> or the wrong size
[01:43:04] <West0n> The collets/endmill are right size and newish
[01:43:20] <West0n> I was thinking its not applying enoughh force to the collet?
[01:43:46] <Tom_itx> if everything is 'new' and the right size, yes
[01:44:17] <elmo401> tighten a little more ;)
[01:44:56] <West0n> What would cause not enough force to be applied?
[01:45:06] <West0n> Something wrong in the mill head?
[01:45:17] <West0n> I heard there is springs or something...
[01:45:39] <Tom_itx> hard to say without seeing it
[01:46:01] <Valen> if its a regular collet chuck theres not much that can go to wrong with it
[01:46:25] <Valen> you might have some of the wrong kind of oil in it perhaps is really the only subtle thing i can think of
[01:47:29] <West0n> Its a bridgeport
[01:47:36] <West0n> Isint there a tension bar?
[01:47:42] <West0n> With springs or something?
[01:50:13] <elmo401> no
[01:50:23] <elmo401> top screw style, right?
[01:50:49] <Tom_itx> maybe the tube is cracked
[01:51:06] <elmo401> possibly.
[01:51:16] <elmo401> checkk the taper. see if there are score marks on it
[01:51:19] <elmo401> or a crack
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[02:03:09] <West0n> The taper?
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[02:54:18] <KimK> West0n: Re: taper: I think he meant the outer (spindle) tube, the female taper in the spindle that the collet fits into.
[02:58:47] <KimK> West0n: If there's a crack in the outer tube/taper, as you draw the collet in, it will just spread/split the outer tube at the crack, and the collet's holding power will be greatly reduced. I think that's what was meant.
[02:58:53] <West0n> Just look up inside?
[03:00:54] <Tom_itx> may need magnifluxed
[03:01:02] <KimK> If there's a crack, it should be more pronounced with a collet drawn in. Can you see the outside at that point? If you can only look up the spindle, you might have to try something like penetrating dye to check for a crack.
[03:01:21] <Tom_itx> or dye :)
[03:06:26] <KimK> West0n: You apply and remove the red dye (follow their instructions), but it will soak into cracks, if any, and remain. Then you spray a white 2nd coat (they sell them together) and wait to see if any red dye wicks up from a crack and "spoils" the white 2nd coat. If so, you've got a crack.
[03:07:12] <Tom_itx> or uv penetrant
[03:07:38] <Tom_itx> i think it's mostly used on non ferrous metals though
[03:08:12] <KimK> I've never seen the UV, what color does it glow?
[03:08:25] <Tom_itx> i think purple
[03:08:38] <West0n> Where should the crack be?
[03:08:48] <West0n> The base of the spindle lowers
[03:08:51] <West0n> With a lever
[03:08:55] <KimK> OK. So no 2nd coat then? That could be a time saver.
[03:09:00] <West0n> I don't think that works still though
[03:09:10] <West0n> So I can't see the outside
[03:09:31] <KimK> West0n: You said Bridgeport, are we talking R8 here?
[03:09:32] <West0n> On the other hand, I am done taking metalshop
[03:09:37] <Tom_itx> http://www.ferrochemndtsystems.net/inks.html
[03:09:42] <West0n> Yah kimk
[03:10:09] <West0n> Should stuff in a r8 collet ever slip?
[03:10:20] <KimK> OK, then you'd have to put the dye on the inside.
[03:11:08] <KimK> You'd have to taking a pretty big bite, I think. Were you?
[03:11:09] <Tom_itx> they also have the red stuff
[03:11:44] <West0n> Not that fast
[03:12:04] <Tom_itx> i would think the cutter would break before the collet slipped
[03:12:04] <KimK> But how deep?
[03:12:15] <West0n> It was a side cutter
[03:12:19] <West0n> On steel
[03:12:31] <West0n> A side cut rather
[03:12:44] <West0n> On a 1" diamater long roughcutter
[03:13:06] <West0n> On a steel plate
[03:13:08] <Tom_itx> even so, i don't think it should slip
[03:13:16] <West0n> It was a rather long time ago
[03:13:24] <West0n> Speed was way to high
[03:13:54] <West0n> But barely touching the plate would cause slipping
[03:14:28] <West0n> Looks like the metal shop has 2 broken mills :/
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[03:14:36] <KimK> Once something slips, it can turn up debris on the shaft, and on the inside of the collet. You have to smooth all that junk back down before trying again.
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[03:14:59] <West0n> I am the only one who tryies to fix/align the mills
[03:15:11] <West0n> They are all utter shit right now
[03:15:18] <KimK> Yes, that
[03:15:21] <KimK> Oops
[03:15:34] <KimK> Yes, that's often the case. Good for you.
[03:15:35] <West0n> The bridgeports have 3 degrees's of freedom too :/
[03:15:40] <West0n> And one has a swivel vice
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[03:18:43] <West0n> I am doing many projects on the cnc now though
[03:18:52] <West0n> I am doing many projects on the cnc now though
[03:19:07] <KimK> Good to hear it
[03:19:11] <West0n> So I might just stop messing with the mills
[03:19:22] <West0n> Oppsies. Didn't mean that 2x
[03:20:00] <KimK> No problem. No problem.
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[04:45:53] <Gabew> Could someone explain to me the benefits of using an external fpga card to control my 8 axis stepper motors on my mill?
[04:46:32] <Valen> benifits vs what?
[04:46:45] <Gabew> vs pc controlled via parallel port
[04:46:59] <Valen> i presume your talking about mesa products?
[04:47:03] <KimK> It frees your PC from having to generate steps, and makes it possible to get a lot of encoder feedback in the event you need it.
[04:47:03] <Gabew> yes
[04:47:13] <Valen> you get high step rates
[04:47:18] <Valen> and no jitter
[04:47:23] <Gabew> so basically a vaster velocity
[04:47:39] <Gabew> faster*
[04:47:47] <Valen> lets the PC do less work too I'd imagine, not needing to put out step pulses
[04:47:52] <Valen> so it may be more responsice
[04:47:57] <Valen> responsive
[04:49:31] <Gabew> okay thanks, i researched forever to find out what they really did for stepper motors, and all i could find was about servo motors.
[04:49:55] <Valen> they also mean you can ditch the steppers ;->
[04:50:00] <Valen> servos all the way lol
[04:50:34] <Gabew> ya but i got 6 ims nema 23 stepper motors with onboard drivers for 160 brand new on ebay about 8 months ago. it was a steel.
[04:51:12] <Gabew> i will use servos on the larger mill i am going to build, using the smaller mill :).
[04:55:51] <Gabew> another question, but has nothing to do with emc2. Why the hell won't google chrome load linux web pages.
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[06:46:56] <factor> Been drawing out my parts on white pine , for first hard version of my cnc
[06:47:16] <Eartaker> what kind of cnc?
[06:47:24] <factor> Will cut them out tomorrow
[06:47:36] <Eartaker> gantry, or mill?
[06:47:36] <factor> 3 axis cnc for cutting ceramic tile.
[06:47:41] <Eartaker> oh
[06:48:08] <factor> gantrylike
[06:48:27] <factor> let me upload the latest blender of it
[06:50:40] <factor> rendering it
[06:50:56] <Eartaker> why tile?
[06:51:07] <factor> For my dad's work
[06:51:35] <Eartaker> oh.... whats that? lol
[06:51:40] <factor> floor covering
[06:51:42] <Eartaker> ahh
[06:51:44] <Eartaker> nice
[06:52:07] <Eartaker> http://eartaker.net/machining/milling/zx45.php
[06:52:09] <Eartaker> thats mine
[06:52:16] <factor> To draw a complex floor pattern and it would make custom tile cuts.
[06:52:38] <Eartaker> need a new video... the one at the bottom sucks... the VFD rest to full speed and the spindle is running at 6900RPM
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[06:53:08] <factor> nice , heavy duty as well
[06:53:24] <Eartaker> All metalworking for me
[06:53:37] <Grandixximo> Hello everyone, does someone know where i can find the xml or the UI of the axis interface so that i can edit it?
[06:54:07] <Grandixximo> I know i can add to the axis interface whatever i want, but how do i modify the axis interface?
[06:54:27] <factor> http://www.flickr.com/photos/8805552@N06/5887132186 here it is.
[06:54:58] <Eartaker> Factor, thats crazy looking....
[06:55:06] <Eartaker> Grand... no idea on my part
[06:55:12] <factor> :)
[06:55:38] <archivist_emc> factor, you need to learn shear forces
[06:55:51] <factor> drawing the parts earlier , now just printing the backplane from blender to inkscape then to wood .
[06:56:08] <Eartaker> never used blender...
[06:56:53] <Eartaker> I use Mastercam but working on converting to Alibre
[06:57:28] <Grandixximo> I can find the src/bin/axis file where is write in python the behavior of the interface, but where are stored the files for the interface itself?
[06:57:42] <factor> got all the parts in their proper plane, separated for python scripts. so I can animate it
[06:58:11] <factor> in blender , not the CNC movements yet.
[06:58:41] <factor> really helped out designing it in blender for cleareances and bolt holes , for ease of use to build
[06:59:15] <Eartaker> Factor, what is your budget for the build?
[06:59:47] <archivist_emc> factor, sit back and think how the cutting forces will bend your frame before you waste any wood
[06:59:59] <factor> heh I have worked on them for years (not successful ) spent about $1000 , this one I had parts laying around and making it with wood first, before I go big
[07:00:42] <factor> made the electronics first , wrote the printer port test program to draw squares circles and triangles , then made a paper model , then blender
[07:01:14] <factor> not much force , I tested.
[07:01:25] <factor> the drill will do most of it as it slides along the tile
[07:01:51] <factor> I have to keep the bit wet though, so the tile will be in water , while it is being cut
[07:02:21] <factor> out of water I get liquid bit , in water it looks like new
[07:03:03] <factor> not cutting mtal or solid surface. ceramics can be eaten away .
[07:03:08] <factor> metal^
[07:03:28] <factor> but it takes a special tile bit .. you get for the dremel
[07:03:44] <factor> not a concrete or wood or metal bit
[07:03:53] <factor> its a tile bit
[07:05:10] <factor> most of this cutters just will be a forward moving cut along the x y axis .
[07:05:44] <factor> not much Z cut or no cut. will be doing buffering and griding to smooth up edges so will have a little higher Z for it
[07:07:50] <factor> although I would like to make a deeper tank that would lower as each layer was made to get a 3d ceramic item, but no real purpose for that yet, mostly for the tile cut
[07:09:48] <factor> but dont know the speed that is will cut at , alot of newer tile today are much larger. was thinking 4x4 tiles but they dont sell them much anymore nor can they be found. mostly 12x12 .
[07:10:00] <factor> but this one will be made for 8x8 max .
[07:10:23] <factor> will try for the 12x12 once I learn this ones strengths.
[07:11:34] <factor> but yes the distance is really small , so I dont have to worry about frame issues with long cuts, it not made for that.
[07:11:57] <factor> 8in by 8in tile cuts are its design limits.
[07:15:00] <factor> and trying to get away with the 20 dollar steppers instead of the 40 buck ones.
[07:15:22] <factor> its designed to mount larger ones on it if needed, but hope the smaller will do this job. and are geared to do so
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[07:29:18] <Valen> I have milled glass in our mill
[07:29:30] <Eartaker> rpm/
[07:29:32] <factor> nifty
[07:29:32] <Eartaker> ?
[07:29:46] <factor> Valen , anything special for glass?
[07:29:59] <Valen> diamond burr tools
[07:30:08] <factor> yes, same for ceramic
[07:30:13] <Valen> they snap depressingly often though
[07:30:19] <Valen> we figure its fatigue
[07:30:19] <factor> yup
[07:30:39] <Valen> Eartaker: i like the oiler setup ;->
[07:30:42] <factor> why I designed mine to be dunked in water at all times
[07:30:51] <Valen> we are looking at making a peristillic pump for oiling
[07:30:56] Eartaker is now known as Eartaker-AFK
[07:31:07] <Valen> one tube per oil hole so you can get whatever volumes you want
[07:31:10] <Valen> stepper driven
[07:31:16] <factor> nice
[07:31:40] <Valen> our cutting bit was under watter
[07:31:47] <factor> heh
[07:31:52] <Valen> for the glass
[07:32:14] <Valen> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ABNOf_fmEQ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A5j_Y4CwMLM
[07:35:08] <factor> dont have any video of my stuff yet , will be another week until I get some action going outside building the frame
[07:37:04] <factor> ok off to sleep, wake up and start cutting (manually) parts for the CNC
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[13:21:56] <sagC> I'm using bldc-sine, after starting the motor homing reference run, I get a freeze 1-2 seconds later at all 3 PWM signals A, B, C ... Someone knows how that can happen?
[13:22:22] <sagC> the motor turns like a quarter revolution and is then blocked as the PWM signals freeze
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[13:27:46] <jdhNC> somethign out of phase?
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[14:00:54] <pcw_home> <sagC> Sounds like either your encoder raw counts are not piped into the BLDC comp
[14:00:56] <pcw_home> or one of the BLDC comps parameters are not right (scale/poles being the fussiest ones)
[14:06:42] <sagC> you mean hm2_5i20.0.encoder.00.rawcounts ==> enc0 ? I've never seen a different value beside 0 there...
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[14:08:30] <sagC> what does "rawcount" mean there? a full revolution? or revolution multiplied with encoder impulses per revolution?
[14:15:21] <pcw_home> Raw counts are raw encoder counts (unchanged by index ) If raw counts doesn't change, you encoder is not working...
[14:19:31] <tom3p> alibre is now selling a reprap type machine http://www.alibre.com/images/email/june_promo_2.png
[14:21:17] <sagC> ok, I'm using a Mesa 7i39 + 5i20, so the Encoder is connected with the 7i39 and via ribbon cable to the 5i20 in my PC. Is it correct to use the hostmot2-encoder then? hm_5i20.0.encoder.00. .... ?
[14:21:54] <sagC> Using 'dmesg' it shows me these pins: IO Pin 000 (P2-01): Encoder #0, pin A (Input) .., same for pin B and pin Index
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[14:24:00] <awallin_> sagC: from the 7i39 manual it looks like encoder A/B/idx are on 1,3,5 on the ribbon cable
[14:26:09] <sagC> Yeah, there is a kinda big thread in the forums with a similar config here http://www.linuxcnc.org/component/option,com_kunena/Itemid,20/func,view/id,2151/catid,27/limit,6/limitstart,60/lang,en/ , there is a bldc.comp mentioned ... I haven't done anything with that file or dont know what to do with that one
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[14:48:43] <mazafaka> is there a live cd with simulation mode?
[14:49:13] <mazafaka> I need one, to check what code I create, and show to people on their computers
[14:49:50] <awallin_> why couldn't you do that with a live-cd that has an rt-kernel?
[14:49:56] <awallin_> if youre booting from the cd anyway
[14:50:56] <mazafaka> linux RTAI does not work on my laptop even a minute
[14:52:05] <mazafaka> Wait, it works not as RTAI from CD?
[14:53:35] <awallin_> not sure...
[14:54:59] <skunkworks> only way I know of is boot from the ubuntu live cd and then install emc as simulator.
[14:55:45] <mazafaka> I think LiveCD boots with RTAI for all the test as latency to be done.
[14:56:07] <mazafaka> yeah, that's the way. To compile it as a simulator
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[14:56:59] <mazafaka> Is there any free G-code visualiser for Windows?
[14:58:27] <mazafaka> Maybe this: http://code.google.com/p/gcode2vtk/ ???
[14:58:45] <jdhNC> there are some time-limited ones, try ncplot
[14:58:58] <jdhNC> or imagetogcode or something like that has one
[14:59:02] <jdhNC> kcam
[14:59:51] <mazafaka> OK
[15:02:02] <mazafaka> I have drawn a booster for mountain bike, pland to create g-code with HeeksCNC, and... it's already evening, there's no time for downloading Ubuntu...
[15:07:44] <mazafaka> EMC's Image-to-gcode feature in conjunction with GIMP and Inkscape is probably comparable with ArtCAM, I don't know. Will investigate with it on the weekend. And install some Ubuntu to flash drive
[15:11:09] <pcw_home> <sagC> you need to use a 5I20 firmware configuration specifically for the 7I39...
[15:11:15] <mazafaka> HeeksCNC still after several years doesn't open files located at directories with Russian letters in their names.
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[15:15:29] <sagC> pcw_home, my firmware is firmware=hm2/5i20/SVTP6_7I39.BIT , i hope this is the correct one
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[15:18:01] <alex_joni> http://xkcd.com/918/
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[15:24:22] <pcw_home> sagC yep that sounds right
[15:28:10] <sagC> So I think I have to connect the pins for rawcounts with that HAL-command .. 'net enc0 hm2_5i20.0.encoder.00.rawcounts => bldc.0.rawcounts'
[15:29:09] <sagC> But if even hm2_5i20.0.encoder.00.rawcounts is always zero - I can be sure that my error is in the physical wiring of my hardware?
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[15:29:41] <sagC> and not the software configuration? - with the firmware=hm2/5i20/SVTP6_7I39.BIT loaded correctly
[15:30:37] <awallin_> sagC you probably need to pastebin your HAL files so someone can have an opinion... simply loading the firmware is not enough, there is probably an update-function you need to call so that rawcounts will show something else than 0
[15:31:04] <awallin_> sagC: you could start by putting an oscilloscope or multimeter on the encoder wire and see that you have a square-wave signal there
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[15:46:56] <sagC> awallin, here is the HAL: http://pastebin.de/17355 , can anyone look regarding the rawcounts of my encoder is always 0 ? don't care about other config parts
[15:47:23] <sagC> especially regarding the mentioned update-function - i don't know which one or how?
[15:48:17] <cradek> if it doesn't count, the encoder is wired wrong or is unpowered or doesn't work for some other reason
[15:48:24] <cradek> check your hardware again
[15:48:49] <awallin_> what's the difference between hostmot2 and hm2_pci? one is on the fpga and the other on the rt-side ?
[15:50:15] <cradek> hm2_pci is the pci-specific stuff
[15:50:21] <cradek> hm2_7i43 is the parport-specific stuff
[15:50:30] <cradek> hostmot2 is the stuff that all the hostmot2 cards use
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[15:52:21] <awallin_> ok, I guess "addf hm2_5i20.0.read servo-thread" should be enough to update the encoder counts. so it does sound like a hardware problem
[15:54:05] <sagC> ok, i think i will check that with a scope.
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[15:59:51] <Loetmichel> re @ home
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[16:01:28] <cncbasher_> clarification please is it possible to move an encoder and a pwm output from P4 to P3 on a 7I43 ?
[16:04:09] <cncbasher_> i realise this is using pncconf rather than hand coding , or would this need the firmware driver changing also
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[16:09:22] <pcw_home> encoders. PWM gens, step gens etc are all fixed in location,
[16:09:24] <pcw_home> if you need to move them (and not just enable/disable instances)
[16:09:26] <pcw_home> you need different firmware
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[16:12:47] <cncbasher_> thanks , thats what thought i'd need to do
[16:13:46] <cncbasher_> thought i'd save a job of making another terminal board
[16:15:23] <pcw_home> If you have a desired pinout, post it somewhere and I can cobble together a config,
[16:15:25] <pcw_home> usually its no more that a few minute job
[16:15:54] <Loetmichel> IF the Pinout is possible ;-)
[16:16:17] <cncbasher_> thanks peter , i'll post on the forum , in about 20 mins
[16:16:21] <pcw_home> all pinouts that fit are possible...
[16:16:57] <Loetmichel> oh, no Parallel port, sorry
[16:17:16] <Loetmichel> i thought of the Input/output restrictions there.
[16:20:30] <pcw_home> Yeah certain PP pins are unidirectional and the data pins can only be all in or all out
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[16:35:03] <mazafaka> Can End mill go deeper in the material and then cut to the side? What is slot cutter then?
[16:36:23] <Tom_itx> you can plunge cut if it's center cutting
[16:36:51] <mazafaka> yeah, i'm choosing options in HeeksCNC
[16:38:11] <mazafaka> What is cutting sheet metal? Slot cutters or end mills? I worked manually, we used end mills and low feedrates to create shaft keys.
[16:38:14] <cncbasher_> <pcw_home> posted to forum
[16:39:21] <mazafaka> I thought there are only drill bits and end mills, and disk mills for manual milling machines.
[16:42:44] <cncbasher_> slot mills can plunge and cut slots , endmills cannot plunge cut in most cases
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[16:44:36] <Tom_itx> the ones i buy are centercutting, be it 2 or 4 flute
[16:47:54] <tom3p> center cutting end mill et al http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milling_cutter
[16:48:18] <tom3p> when we cut slots ( runners ) for molds, we made single lip cutters
[16:48:41] <cncbasher_> theirs a few subtle differences to the cutting between slot mills and end mills
[16:48:49] <mazafaka> centercutting... You mean, they cut material from the center of the bit while "usual" end mill does not?
[16:49:07] <Tom_itx> not all endmills have the end sharpened to the center
[16:49:08] <mazafaka> slot mills are of a special form?
[16:49:11] <Tom_itx> if they are not, they won't
[16:49:20] <mazafaka> yeah
[16:49:55] <tom3p> Center cutting: Some milling cutters can drill straight down (plunge) through the material, while others cannot. This is because the teeth of some cutters do not go all the way to the centre of the end face. However, these cutters can cut downwards at an angle of 45 degrees or so.
[16:49:56] <mazafaka> you need to move it to and fro when you plunge them
[16:50:14] <tom3p> ^^ quote from the page posted
[16:50:20] <mazafaka> yeah
[16:51:09] <Tom_itx> even so, i try not to plunge straight down if it can be avoided, rather ramp down
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[16:51:55] <mazafaka> ramp down?
[16:52:33] <mazafaka> Do you incline the spindle?
[16:52:46] <Tom_itx> Z0,X0 to Z-x.xx X1
[16:53:37] <tom3p> staircase
[16:53:49] <Tom_itx> helix
[16:53:51] <Tom_itx> :)
[16:53:58] <Tom_itx> i don't like those either too much
[16:54:00] <mazafaka> oh
[16:54:45] <andypugh> Anyone know if you need any magic incantations to set up an ISA card in Ubuntu?
[16:55:24] <tom3p> isa parport? isa whatsit?
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[16:56:55] <kb8wmc> I need some advice on a Z-axis touch off plate...I have installed and configured the appropriate files from emc wiki...the py buttons are there and when enabling MDI mode to do a touch off to the soft aluminum touch off plate, the z axis moves in the opposite direction (upwards instead of down)
[16:57:23] <Tom_itx> invert the signal
[16:57:33] <tom3p> (heh star wars jar jar binks sez "isa parport" )
[16:57:49] <andypugh> ISA pcl720
[16:58:05] <kb8wmc> thanks tom...
[16:58:17] <Tom_itx> andypugh, all but that one will be fine
[16:58:22] <Tom_itx> :)
[16:58:51] <tom3p> andypugh, nice i want one! i/o and 8253s
[16:59:49] <tom3p> the advantech site oughta help, they make all the goodies for taiwan cncs using the taiwan IMRL cnc
[16:59:53] <andypugh> They exist on eBay. There is almost an EMC2 driver.
[17:04:18] <tom3p> 00800-2426-808 tech info europe
[17:04:45] <tom3p> i see no manual , really just sales brochures
[17:05:32] <Tom_itx> i found a manual
[17:05:54] <Tom_itx> like me to post it?
[17:06:41] <tom3p> maybe of use http://support.advantech.com.tw/Support/DownloadSearchByProduct.aspx?keyword=PCL-720%2b&ctl00_ContentPlaceHolder1_EbizTabStripNoForm1_Tab=Specification
[17:07:06] <tom3p> Tom_itx, please, i only found the 1 page sales brochure
[17:08:12] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/pdf/pcl720.pdf
[17:08:56] <tom3p> the FAQ tab ^^^ has some hdwr info and code examples, but it uses dlls & apparently doesnt like W7
[17:09:05] <tom3p> thx
[17:09:49] <Tom_itx> that looks like a nice card if i didn't have mesa already
[17:10:09] <andypugh> The BASIC code samples just use INPUT$ and OUTPUT$ but you need dlls to access raw ports in windows, so that doesn't mean anything.
[17:10:23] <andypugh> Nice card if you have an ISA bus.
[17:10:43] <tom3p> Tom_itx, thx, thats the goods
[17:10:51] <Tom_itx> np
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[17:11:57] <tom3p> (looks to see if theres a pci vrsn )
[17:13:35] <Tom_itx> i don't see one
[17:14:08] <andypugh> http://www.advantech.com/products/PCI-1735U/mod_1266300C-31B3-4C5F-97BB-EDED1AE21075.aspx
[17:14:40] <andypugh> Even has the same proto-circuit area
[17:14:42] <Tom_itx> but i wasn't looking in the right place either
[17:15:21] <Tom_itx> you'd still have to write emc drivers
[17:15:49] <andypugh> I probably already have, I doubt that PCI access looks that different to ISA access under EMC2
[17:16:04] <tom3p> woot! nice , maybe it acts like an 8255, then most is done
[17:17:25] <Tom_itx> i wonder how it's priced compared to mesa etc
[17:17:40] <Tom_itx> might not be worth the effort
[17:17:56] <jdhNC> US$207
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[17:19:42] <andypugh> Not worth it compared to a Mesa card, you still end up with software stepgens etc.
[17:19:57] <Xolotl4> can EMC be used on an industrial environment to produce consumable goods?
[17:20:15] <andypugh> Is that a licensing question?
[17:20:23] <andypugh> If so, the answer is "Yes"
[17:20:41] <andypugh> EMC2 can also be sold installed on a commercial system.
[17:21:01] <andypugh> If it wasn't a licensing question, then the answer is "Yes" :-)
[17:21:23] <jdhNC> EMC2 is safe for human consumption.
[17:21:24] <Tom_itx> so to sum it up, the answer is "YES"
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[17:22:19] <syyl_> i can eat emc?
[17:22:28] <jdhNC> every bit
[17:22:44] <syyl_> time for eatable usb sticks
[17:23:01] <syyl_> haha
[17:23:04] <syyl_> "every bit"
[17:23:22] <andypugh> New Scientist had a mention of edible RFID tags for food products.
[17:23:22] <tom3p> the pci dio/timer/counter/breadboard has linux driver & source code available , build env listed for rh, debian maybe useful to build hal driver
[17:24:30] <andypugh> tom3p: Probably done: http://www.linuxcnc.org/component/option,com_kunena/Itemid,20/func,view/catid,38/id,10910/limit,6/limitstart,30/lang,english/#11013
[17:25:14] <andypugh> Only problem is that the guy can't get it to work, but there were some serious problems in the code, so I am optimistic that it might work now.
[17:26:28] <Xolotl4> andypungh: is a licensing question, so if i develop a machine using EMC do i have to share my ini and hal files whit my competitors if they ask for? i mean the machine will be used just for my and i don't sell machines.
[17:27:34] <JT-Shop> ANDYPHGH! :)
[17:27:44] <JT-Shop> damm can't type today
[17:27:47] <tom3p> andypugh, THX (http://www.linuxcnc.org/images/fbfiles/files/pcl720-729c93108560bb40a3698e5d113e2951.comp)
[17:27:54] <JT-Shop> ANDYPUGH! :)
[17:28:04] <tom3p> hey andy >you're< the author ;)
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[17:36:18] <andypugh> Xolotl4: As I understand it, you would have to at least give out a link to the source code if you sold a machine with EMC2. But if you are making things with EMC2 then you don't have to give out anything at all. The HAL files and config are your own work anyway, and totally outside the GPL.
[17:40:08] <andypugh> I bought new bearings for the lathe, I managed to persuade myself the others were dead. Well, it wasn't too hard when I noticed that the outer race was scored, and the rollers were only touching on the front 1/4
[17:41:03] <JT-Shop> taper roller bearings?
[17:41:09] <syyl_> the chinese think thats normal ;)
[17:41:24] <Xolotl4> ok will double check the GNU GPL document, thanks.
[17:41:42] <andypugh> Yes, but I suspect that they are very cheap tapir roller bearings.
[17:43:07] <andypugh> Xolotl4: Ask danimal_garage, he works commercially with EMC2. But I am sure that as a _user_ of EMC2 you don't have to do anything.
[17:44:03] <JT-Shop> I make parts commercially with EMC2 and I share all my code unless it is top secret
[17:44:31] <andypugh> Yes, but you don't have to.
[17:44:37] <JT-Shop> right
[17:47:37] <Tom_itx> that's just the kinda guy he is though :)
[17:55:22] <cradek> Xolotl4: there are NO restrictions whatsoever on the USE of GPL software
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[18:01:19] <GermainAdrian> hi all. I want to get a tube to extend my monitor stand. what type of steel has better/smoother surface finish, cold rolled tubing or pickled&oiled?
[18:02:50] <andypugh> Cold rolled. Pickling is to remove mill-scale.
[18:03:38] <andypugh> Can you find this stuff locally? http://www.metals4u.co.uk/products.asp?cat_id=1517
[18:03:49] <GermainAdrian> probably
[18:04:00] <GermainAdrian> i live in a major city
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[18:04:27] <GermainAdrian> are round tubes usually seamless
[18:04:30] <GermainAdrian> or is there a seam?
[18:04:39] <jdhNC> seamless tubes are seamless
[18:04:50] <GermainAdrian> yes, but is it a default thing
[18:04:56] <GermainAdrian> or not
[18:05:03] <GermainAdrian> im a complete noob in these matters
[18:05:05] <cncbasher_> GermainAdrian >are you in the UK ?
[18:05:09] <GermainAdrian> no, canada
[18:05:52] <cncbasher_> cds usualy has a welded seam
[18:06:02] <GermainAdrian> is the seam usually flush with its surface? or what are they like
[18:06:07] <cncbasher_> flush
[18:06:15] <GermainAdrian> then it doesnt matter
[18:07:02] <jdhNC> what size do you need? can you use normal gas/water pipe?
[18:07:08] <GermainAdrian> 1 3/8 inch
[18:07:18] <GermainAdrian> maybe 1.5-2.5mm wall thickness
[18:07:24] <GermainAdrian> its a standard tube
[18:07:43] <GermainAdrian> i found tons of dealers online, i was just wondering about all these grades etc
[18:07:45] <cncbasher_> you should be able to find it localy
[18:07:48] <GermainAdrian> stainless would be the best
[18:07:53] <andypugh> You mist be UK or Canadian to talk about 1"3/8 tube with a 2.5mm wall thickness ;-)
[18:07:58] <jdhNC> heh
[18:07:59] <GermainAdrian> but they seem to be more expensive, and i can only find MASSIVE dealers
[18:08:09] <GermainAdrian> who probably wont sell me a 15 inch long tube lol
[18:08:11] <cncbasher_> if your stuck , let me know and i'll send some
[18:08:23] <cncbasher_> but might take a while as i'm in the UK
[18:08:25] <GermainAdrian> im sure i can find locally, the question is pricing/small orders
[18:08:44] <GermainAdrian> and for stainless i cant find smaller businesses for some reason
[18:09:00] <jdhNC> got a junkyard/salvage/recycling place nearby?
[18:09:12] <cncbasher_> we send stuff all over the world in small qtys , it's the post costs that kill it
[18:09:16] <GermainAdrian> yes, but then i'd have to cut it, i gots no tools at all
[18:09:46] <andypugh> GermainAdrian: Try EBay? I found this, http://cgi.ebay.ca/316L-20-ft-stainless-steel-tubes-/150564913445
[18:09:56] <GermainAdrian> online sources dont make sense
[18:10:00] <andypugh> But more work on search terms might find something more useful.
[18:10:07] <GermainAdrian> shipping is too much
[18:10:07] <cncbasher_> not a problem if your stuck
[18:10:19] <GermainAdrian> ive got a some dealers nearby
[18:10:29] <GermainAdrian> but its only carbon steel palces that are smaller and willing to cut to size
[18:10:41] <GermainAdrian> stainless for some reason is a completely different game, only very large companies
[18:12:23] <cncbasher_> any companys near that use stainless , try for an offcut
[18:12:35] <GermainAdrian> i dont know where i'd go to
[18:12:36] <GermainAdrian> plumbers?
[18:17:53] <tom3p> when i work in Canada i just goto Canadian Tire or Home Depot
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[18:18:36] <tom3p> (OldCastle, Toronto, Stratford...)
[18:18:40] <andypugh> Yeah, you might find something browsing Ikea.
[18:18:57] <andypugh> My TV stand is a very wrongly assembled kitchen shelf.
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[18:19:11] <GermainAdrian> nah i have an ergotron LX desk mount
[18:19:14] <GermainAdrian> but it comes with a very short pole
[18:19:18] <mazafaka> What type of G-code EMC uses? Is it the most standart type, e.g. 'standart ISO output' as HeeksCNC is calling it?
[18:19:26] <GermainAdrian> so i want to remove it, and stick a 20 inch long tube instead
[18:19:37] <andypugh> It was a very cheap way to buy a bundle of stainless tubes, and possibly the only way to do so on a saturday evening.
[18:19:58] <danimal_garage> mornin
[18:20:17] <mazafaka> Can I say that 'I can check the g-code with EMC program because EMC acts as a standart machine'?
[18:20:20] <tom3p> mazafaka RS274-NGC http://code.google.com/p/rs274ngc
[18:20:26] <mazafaka> OK
[18:20:28] <andypugh> mazafaka: It uses a superset of G-code. All standard commands will work, but it also has commands (O-words for example) not found in other dialects.
[18:21:20] <danimal_garage> why does it use an ngc extension instead of nc?
[18:21:46] <andypugh> Next Generation Control
[18:21:49] <tom3p> its a lot like fanuc, but its different (NGC is next generation
[18:22:03] <mazafaka> I will need to explain to my employer what I do (QuickCAD -> HeeksCNC -> g-code (or manually for lathes ->EMC, all in Linux, HeeksCNC is buggy in Windows), and start to use their not free software.
[18:22:18] <mazafaka> o-words?
[18:22:40] <danimal_garage> its a pain because i have to change all my extensions on all my files generated by mastercam
[18:22:50] <andypugh> Loops and conditionals. O was not used in original G-code as it could be confused with zero. So it was "available"
[18:22:51] <danimal_garage> o face?
[18:23:19] <andypugh> danimal_garage: You can add .nc as a known extension in the INI file.
[18:23:25] <mazafaka> RS274 is something about COM-ports...
[18:23:34] <danimal_garage> andypugh: good to know
[18:23:35] <tom3p> no thats rs232
[18:23:39] <danimal_garage> thanks
[18:23:51] <tom3p> each # is a 'standard'
[18:23:53] <mazafaka> Oh, I remember, I created loops myself.
[18:24:00] <mazafaka> Thanks.
[18:24:31] <mazafaka> I worried about this all whole this week. Now I know what to say.
[18:25:02] <andypugh> danimal_garage: [FILTER] PROGRAM_EXTENSION = .NC PROGRAM_EXTENSION = .nc
[18:25:15] <danimal_garage> thanks andypugh
[18:25:46] <danimal_garage> I probably should figure out how to make mastercam output ngc files instead of nc
[18:26:28] <danimal_garage> it's not like i have a single non-emc powered machine here
[18:26:51] <tom3p> victorinox has to start using emc, the [FILTER} just shows emc is th eswiis army knife of cncs
[18:27:03] <tom3p> is the swiss
[18:29:14] <danimal_garage> have you guys figured out a fix for being able to jog in mdi mode?
[18:29:30] <danimal_garage> i almost kinda like it now lol
[18:31:44] <mazafaka> And EMC handles 6-axis machine, not more axes?
[18:32:12] <psha> mazafaka: 9
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[18:32:30] <psha> or more with ja3 :)
[18:32:41] <archivist_emc> mazafaka, up to 9
[18:32:52] <andypugh> psha: More joints, no more DOF..
[18:33:05] <psha> andypugh: with G-code
[18:33:25] <andypugh> Yeah, OK, that's true
[18:33:55] <danimal_garage> 9 axis now??
[18:33:59] <danimal_garage> i thought it was 8
[18:34:20] <andypugh> XYZABCUVW (0 to 8)
[18:34:26] <danimal_garage> ahh
[18:34:40] <danimal_garage> emc rules :)
[18:34:54] <andypugh> psha: Know anything about ISA card config?
[18:35:22] <mazafaka> but RS274 handles 3 up to 6 axes
[18:35:29] <psha> andypugh: no :(
[18:35:39] <cradek> andypugh: ask actual question
[18:35:45] <psha> btw my cameras look like working without latency issues
[18:37:04] <JT-Shop> danimal_garage: just separate your extensions with a comma PROGRAM_EXTENSION = .NC,.nc
[18:37:31] <danimal_garage> ah, thanks John
[18:37:32] <andypugh> OK. What steps are required to make inb() and outb() read/write to an ISA card which already has a valid BIOS setup for MSDOS.
[18:37:55] <cradek> you mean from kernel space? no steps required
[18:38:09] <cradek> from userland you might need an ioperm() or similar call to enable access to the required ports
[18:38:16] <JT-Shop> anyone want to help clean out the coolant tank on the CHNC?
[18:38:27] <cradek> but I'm not sure what you mean by valid BIOS setup for MSDOS
[18:38:32] <danimal_garage> John, no way, i gotta do mine too
[18:38:42] <cradek> is it PnP or is it jumpered to a fixed port?
[18:38:44] <andypugh> cradek: So I wonder why my driver isn't working? I bet the user is doing something really stupid.
[18:38:46] <mazafaka> milliseconds of latency finally reduce the feedrate for reaching the accuracy, and when latency is too high, computer needs improvement?
[18:38:53] <andypugh> Jumpered to a fixed port
[18:38:57] <cradek> andypugh: pastebin code?
[18:39:05] <danimal_garage> i switched to water solulable coolant, but there was still some residual oil in there so now the coolant is nasty
[18:39:30] <danimal_garage> next time it gets low i'm flushing it
[18:39:38] <cradek> danimal_garage: you'll get used to it. water soluble coolant is always nasty.
[18:39:50] <andypugh> cradek: http://pastebin.com/3HjfdDZA
[18:39:59] <danimal_garage> cradek: i woked with it for years, this is the bacteria type of nasty
[18:40:04] <cradek> ew
[18:40:06] <danimal_garage> smelly
[18:40:24] <danimal_garage> the oil sits on the top so it doesnt get oxygen and the bacteria grows
[18:41:00] <danimal_garage> i use water solulable in the mill, that doesnt smell at all, stays pretty clean
[18:41:23] <andypugh> I guess trying to write a driver for a card I have never seen on a bus I have never owned was a bit ambitious.
[18:41:30] <mazafaka> hey, those other 3 axis are... XYZABCUVW ???
[18:41:44] <cradek> andypugh: outb(value, port), not outb(port, value)
[18:41:55] <danimal_garage> at least i don't get all that smoke with the water solulable, i'll take the smell any day over smoke
[18:41:56] <mazafaka> These UVW axes are described with RS275 standart of g-code?
[18:42:00] <JT-Shop> mine gets dirty from way oil
[18:42:17] <andypugh> cradek: You see, that is the sort of thing you spot when you can actually test :-)
[18:42:18] <mazafaka> I can think wrong even further
[18:42:26] <JT-Shop> I'm using ValCool Val Tech b
[18:42:40] <danimal_garage> JT-Shop: a fish tank air pump helps
[18:42:50] <danimal_garage> i have one i need to try and hook up in there
[18:42:57] <andypugh> I want to find some Castrol ClearEdge at an affordable price for a sensible quantity
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[18:43:25] <JT-Shop> danimal_garage: what does the air pump do?
[18:43:59] <danimal_garage> gets oxygen in there so it doesn't smell
[18:44:10] <JT-Shop> hmmm mine never smells
[18:44:17] <danimal_garage> it's supposed to keep the bateria from growing
[18:44:38] <JT-Shop> it just gets cloudy after 6 months or so but no odor at all
[18:44:38] <danimal_garage> thats good
[18:45:37] <danimal_garage> i want to change my v belts on the lathe to a cogged belt
[18:46:17] <danimal_garage> still get some slippage
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[18:49:02] <danimal_garage> cradek: the servos on our lathes are suprisingly strong, i had a crash and it rapided into a piece of 1/8" thick 6al4v titanium, and bent it till it cracked. It takes A LOT of force to bent ti like that.
[18:49:20] <danimal_garage> bend*
[18:49:41] <JT-Shop> the spindle belt?
[18:49:50] <danimal_garage> JT-Shop: yes
[18:50:19] <danimal_garage> would be nice to get a big servo on there
[18:50:38] <danimal_garage> i finally got an encoder mounted on it
[18:51:53] <mazafaka> How spatial arc is defined? Something like G2 X0 Y1 I1 J0.5 F25 but with K letter or how?
[18:52:43] <JT-Shop> Z
[18:52:45] <cradek> danimal_garage: yikes. can you set your ferror trip closer?
[18:52:55] <mazafaka> z?
[18:53:00] <cradek> what do you mean by spatial arc?
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[18:53:19] <andypugh> mazafaka: arcs can only be in the XY, YZ or XZ planes, you can't do 3D arcs as far as I know.
[18:53:34] <mazafaka> cradek: the one which is not solely in XY, XZ or YZ plane
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[18:53:44] <mazafaka> Duh!
[18:53:45] <andypugh> I don't know why, as G2 X Y Z I J K does give enough information.
[18:54:20] <danimal_garage> cradek: it's set to .0002" i believe
[18:54:46] <mazafaka> So I probably can. If you would given me enough information, I did one out of some old aluminum wire, and send it to you :)
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[18:54:57] <cradek> emc2 can do arcs in xy, yz, zx, and rotated yz/zx planes
[18:55:27] <danimal_garage> cradek: ferror is .001, min ferror is .0002
[18:55:35] <danimal_garage> i could go lower i guess
[18:55:38] <mazafaka> What 'rotated yz/zx planes' are?
[18:55:43] <andypugh> danimal_garage: by "cogged" belt do you mean a toother timing-style belt, or a V-belt with teeth on the inside? In the latter case the teeth are only there ti give more flexibility (but allow a deeper belt, so might have the required effect). And you probably knew that.
[18:55:57] <cradek> emc2 can rotate the work coordinate system around the Z axis
[18:56:03] <cradek> that makes those two planes rotate as well
[18:56:03] <danimal_garage> andypugh: a timing belt
[18:56:06] <mazafaka> Oh, ok
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[18:57:14] <mazafaka> cradek: so it's possible to create local coordinates and rotate them - surely if the machine kinematics makes it possible
[18:58:28] <tom3p> it stinks i smell
[18:59:01] <tom3p> dr samuel johnson ^^^ author of the 1st dictionary
[18:59:05] <mazafaka> Oh, no, this intellectual fisting isn't petting at all! Ennaugfh
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[19:03:51] <andypugh> Aha! He made it
[19:04:23] <andypugh> Best discuss it here, other folk might have input
[19:05:03] <andypugh> So, have you tried the latest variant I sent out? cradek noticed a good reason that write wouldn't work, and I had noticed a reason for read not to work
[19:06:48] <mazafaka> Not absolutely any arc is possible, anyway. It's more simple to approximate series of splines with short lines and create the surface, or necessary 3D arc as a sequence of lines.
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[19:07:12] <Jymmm> Ah, security at it's finest "On June 19 there was a four-hour security glitch at Dropbox. During that four-hour period anyone could log into any account with any password. If someone knew the email you used to login they could supply any password at all and it would work..."
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[19:11:58] <JT-Shop> Dan, I finally got a good coolant pump for the VMC, a 1/4hp 480v 3 phase gray mills pump
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[19:13:01] <GermainAdrian> Alloy Steel 4130 NORMALIZED Tube
[19:13:09] <GermainAdrian> what is "normalized" supposed to mean here?
[19:13:21] <danimal_garage> nice!
[19:13:28] <cradek> internal stresses have been minimized
[19:13:34] <GermainAdrian> ok
[19:13:57] <danimal_garage> JT-Shop: how do you run 480v? Transformer after the roto-phase?
[19:15:56] <JT-Shop> the VMC had a built in transformer to 480v
[19:16:08] <JT-Shop> the original pump was 480v 3ph
[19:16:20] <andypugh> You can probably re-wire for 240 3p
[19:16:31] <JT-Shop> no need
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[19:17:04] <JT-Shop> I was running a 240v 1ph off of one phase and ground :)
[19:17:25] <danimal_garage> nice
[19:17:54] <danimal_garage> i got a cheap tank and pump from ENCO
[19:17:59] <danimal_garage> it's like a 10 gallon
[19:18:14] <JT-Shop> it works temporary... the machine dealer connected the first pump 240v 1p to two 240v hots... didn't last long
[19:18:35] <danimal_garage> lol
[19:19:00] <danimal_garage> my mill has an internal tank but it's a pain to clean so i got that external one
[19:19:32] <JT-Shop> I didn't care, he built me a coolant tank for no charge after I asked him about it
[19:19:36] <danimal_garage> the internal one was iron so it rusted
[19:19:44] <danimal_garage> sweet
[19:20:27] <andypugh> The internal tank on my mill needs cleaning out. Not been used for years. I think it is mainly twaylube.
[19:22:15] <danimal_garage> ha thats how mine was
[19:22:32] <danimal_garage> old coolant and way lube and metal chips
[19:22:40] <andypugh> I am very tempted by http://www.arceurotrade.co.uk/Catalogue/Machine-Spares/One-Shot-Lubrication-System
[19:22:42] <danimal_garage> probably 10-15 years worth
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[19:30:07] <JT-Shop> I think I'll wait till I move the plasma cutter to the new shop to clean out the CHNC coolant tank that way I don't have to crawl under the plasma water table to get to the CHNC coolant tank
[19:30:23] <robin__> ah plasma
[19:30:28] <robin__> hateful stuff
[19:31:24] <robin__> remind me to sell mine
[19:33:35] <JT-Shop> when?
[19:34:05] <robin__> try now
[19:34:25] <danimal_garage> sell yours
[19:34:36] <robin__> damn, good idea, i'd forgotten
[19:37:36] <andypugh> My dad is thinking of buying a plasma cutter, he was put out by the £200 oxy-acetylene bill for kit he hadn't used for a whole year.
[19:37:48] <andypugh> So the bottles have gone back to BOC
[19:39:16] <andypugh> Thanks cradek, looks like that was it.
[19:39:31] <skunkworks> andypugh: what is the project?
[19:39:52] <andypugh> No idea. Just a guy on the forum.
[19:40:09] <JT-Shop> it's too late now is gone
[19:41:49] <skunkworks> ah
[19:42:02] <danimal_garage> hmm i guess it's late enough to eat lunch
[19:43:45] <danimal_garage> this computer keeps freezing and/or shutting down, especially when i play music
[19:43:55] <danimal_garage> wonder if the heat sink needs grease
[19:44:09] <cradek> yeah - check fans and run memtest
[19:44:09] <danimal_garage> on the cpu
[19:44:18] <danimal_garage> fans work
[19:44:24] <danimal_garage> i'll try memtest
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[19:45:36] <tom3p> andypugh, is the final version http://pastebin.com/3HjfdDZA plus "outb(value, port), not outb(port, value)" ?
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[19:47:14] <andypugh> I doubt it is the _final_ version. But latest is: http://www.linuxcnc.org/images/fbfiles/files/pcl720.comp
[19:49:23] <GermainAdrian> where is the linuxcnc chat
[19:50:43] <tom3p> andypugh, thx
[19:51:10] <andypugh> GermainAdrian: Here, I think?
[19:51:40] <GermainAdrian> oh
[19:51:56] <andypugh> Or do you mean the forum?
[19:52:18] <andypugh> linuxcnc.org == emc2
[19:52:38] <GermainAdrian> oh ok
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[19:55:27] <andypugh> Does anyone know off-hand what is inside a Bijur oiling metering unit?
[19:55:59] <cradek> they're just a restriction, so I'm guessing something like a tiny hole
[19:56:10] <andypugh> I am guessing a tiny hole and a one-way ball?
[19:56:18] <tom3p> yeh some have check
[19:56:32] <cradek> ah forgot about one-way
[19:57:01] <andypugh> I might knit my own using 4mm copper pipe to distribute, and soldered-on fittings.
[19:57:54] <andypugh> Woot! ISA-card chap has machine movement.
[19:58:36] <andypugh> Does that mean I should submit the driver?
[19:58:44] <tom3p> hint: auto oilers usually pump once at startup. so if debugging a machine, pull the power off the auto-oiler, or be ready for a pool after several starts
[19:59:20] <tom3p> andypugh, i was interested because i use a programable timer
[19:59:45] <andypugh> If you want to add the timer function to the current driver, be my guest.
[20:00:18] <andypugh> I didn't even read that section of the manual.
[20:01:17] <tom3p> i have to look at 8254 timing anyway, i can try. thx for all the work
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[20:29:32] <tom3p> got D510MO, case,ps, mem& hd and an 8g thumb to install with plus LTC1286 for analog input at 500hz and the hal-edm code looks fairly healthy http://imagebin.org/160813
[20:29:36] <tom3p> a good day :)
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[20:44:39] <danimal_garage> anyone know how to do a memtest? I tried google but nothing seems like the test i did before
[20:44:45] <danimal_garage> i cant remember how i did it though
[20:44:59] <danimal_garage> it's ubuntu 10.04 btw
[20:45:01] <skunkworks> it is in the grub menu
[20:45:23] <skunkworks> on bootup
[20:45:24] <cradek> hold down left shift early in the boot process to get a menu
[20:45:59] <danimal_garage> ah ok
[20:46:13] <danimal_garage> i thought it was something i ran from terminal last time
[20:46:24] <cradek> no, you have to boot into it
[20:46:27] <danimal_garage> ok
[20:46:57] <danimal_garage> i smeared some fresh compound on the heat sink, hopefully that does it, but i wanna check the memory too
[20:48:39] <danimal_garage> brb, i'll give it a shot, thanks
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[20:52:23] <kb8wmc> I was able to correct the direction of travel (thanks to folks in here) on my brother's Z axis touch off plate, but now we are receiving an error as follows: "Probe tripped during non-probe MDI command." Anyone have an idea what this means and how to correct?
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[20:52:49] <andypugh> Probably noise in the probe wire
[20:53:31] <kb8wmc> ok...rgr that...
[20:53:56] <andypugh> The message means that the probe has triggered when it wasn't expected to
[20:55:32] <kb8wmc> ok...what should I be looking for to correct it?
[20:55:44] <kb8wmc> I can change the probe wires
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[21:05:27] <andypugh> Lazy solution would be to put a debounce fiilter in the HAL file. Another 100uS dealy isn't going to lead to much innacuracy, how far does the probe move in that sort of timescale?
[21:06:10] <kb8wmc> I have it set for 3 inches per minute travel rate
[21:06:15] <kb8wmc> so not too far
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[21:06:56] <andypugh> .0000005" in fact...
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[21:07:43] <kb8wmc> yes...andy I apologize but I have to step out for a while
[21:07:55] <kb8wmc> thanks for your help and input so far
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[21:23:54] <danimal_garage> well it passed memtest
[21:29:07] <jdhNC> connor?
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[21:35:39] <Connor> jdhNC: What's up?
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[21:47:06] <danimal_garage> man it's nice out today
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[22:05:19] <danimal_garage> hmm so the pc is still shutting down
[22:05:27] <danimal_garage> passed memtest
[22:05:56] <danimal_garage> cpu grease is good, fans work
[22:08:50] <danimal_garage> maybe power supply
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[22:22:27] <mazafaka> what is rigid tapping?
[22:25:27] <Eartaker> tapping but rigid....
[22:25:58] <Eartaker> the spindle and feed are in sync to equal whatever thread pitch you are trying to tap
[22:26:46] <Eartaker> the spindle requires an encoder to do this. Most machines do not have this option so most use a tapping head
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[22:45:05] * JT-Shop is sure glad andypugh knows about that stuff
[22:46:30] <mazafaka> oh, ok
[22:47:40] * JT-Shop likes rigid tapping with EMC2
[22:50:59] <mazafaka> weird, there are no not amd-64bit version of HeeksCNC for linux, only script for automatic installation through svn...
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[23:06:24] <JT-Shop> most machines newer than the mid 80's have rigid tapping, either as an option or standard or not maybe
[23:08:22] <JT-Shop> oil metering units use a check valve and a piston of sorts with a spring to only pump the metered amount each time the system is pressurized http://www.bijurdelimon.com/fileadmin/products/docs/bdius/Datasheets/35990_FIT_Quick-Conn-MU_DS.pdf
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[23:17:32] <mazafaka> Voila! HeeksCAD is installed!
[23:17:51] <mazafaka> Here's the script: http://code.google.com/p/heekscad/wiki/BuildWithCmakeOnUbuntu
[23:21:37] <Xolotl4> JT-Shop: do you have a web site?
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[23:30:04] <JT-Shop> yes
[23:30:54] <Eartaker> lol
[23:32:46] <JT-Shop> hmm google for jt's place and I'm seventh
[23:33:10] <JT-Shop> google for gnipsel and I'm first and second :)
[23:33:31] <JT-Shop> and third and 4th....
[23:34:45] <toastydeath> google+ anyone
[23:35:20] <JT-Shop> I feel funny I need to put my tin foil cap back on... must be solar flares
[23:35:45] <Eartaker> Nice VMC
[23:36:21] <JT-Shop> thanks, I was drinking at the time and surfing flea bay and got lucky
[23:36:32] <Eartaker> nice
[23:36:44] <Eartaker> what did you pay for it?
[23:36:49] <JT-Shop> 6k
[23:37:20] <JT-Shop> so I take it you found gnipsel.com
[23:37:45] <Eartaker> nowt a bad price =]
[23:37:46] <Eartaker> yeah i did
[23:38:01] <JT-Shop> I thought it was a fair price
[23:38:19] <Eartaker> ATC?
[23:38:26] <JT-Shop> 8 station
[23:38:50] <Eartaker> maybe someday I will buy one....
[23:38:52] <Eartaker> no room right now
[23:39:10] <JT-Shop> I'm gaining room did you see the new shop?
[23:39:30] <Eartaker> ughh looking for the link
[23:40:06] <JT-Shop> http://gnipsel.com/shop/machine-shop.xhtml
[23:40:17] <Eartaker> oh nice
[23:40:45] <Eartaker> im confined to a 1 car garage at the moment
[23:40:49] <Eartaker> but... http://www.eartaker.net/machining/milling/zx45.php
[23:41:54] <JT-Shop> lol my surname means I lived near thorn bushes near a town
[23:43:13] <JT-Shop> a manual mill you converted?
[23:43:19] <Eartaker> yeah
[23:43:45] <JT-Shop> neat!
[23:43:51] <Eartaker> thanks
[23:44:16] <JT-Shop> I have a Samson lathe I want to convert when I get it moved into the new shop
[23:45:24] <JT-Shop> oh wow a multi stage pneumatic cylinder for the tool release?
[23:46:27] <JT-Shop> really nice work Eartaker
[23:47:48] <JT-Shop> oh a classic Heartbreaker, Led Zepplin
[23:48:12] <JT-Shop> Maritool is my favorite place for tool holders
[23:48:49] <Eartaker> I would like to change out my lathe as well but it does what I need for now. yeah i wanted to be able to preset my tool height like an ATC and be able to use the CNC tool table to not have to zero the Z-axis evertime I change a tool but the ATC function is done manualy. I hit the valve, tool drops out and i just insert the new one
[23:49:02] <Eartaker> Maritool is awesome
[23:49:14] <Eartaker> those holders are the ER-20's
[23:49:34] <JT-Shop> the photo makes them look like ER32's
[23:49:53] <JT-Shop> I use 11-32 on the VMC
[23:50:27] <JT-Shop> are your tool holders repeatable?
[23:50:36] <Eartaker> yes
[23:50:52] <JT-Shop> even if you manual change them you can preset them prior to an Op
[23:50:57] <Eartaker> 1 sec ill show you how that works out....
[23:51:13] <JT-Shop> that's what I do on my BP Anilam conversion mill
[23:51:57] <Eartaker> http://www.tormach.com/Flash/TTS_small.html
[23:52:37] <Eartaker> for the maritool holders tormach sells a little conversion ring to epoxy onto the holder to allot it to do this
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[23:52:54] <Eartaker> you can see it in the pic of the one im holding
[23:53:11] <JT-Shop> yea, I see it
[23:54:26] <JT-Shop> where did you source the ballscrews?
[23:56:49] <Tom_L> logger[psha]
[23:57:07] <Eartaker> eBay supplier
[23:57:12] <Connor> jdhNC: Heya, Was you needing something ?
[23:57:25] <Eartaker> linearmotionbearings is the seller
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[23:58:16] <Eartaker> 20mm dia screws
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[23:59:35] <Tom_L> your first pic is missing
[23:59:58] <Eartaker> mine?