#emc | Logs for 2011-03-09

[00:00:27] <andypugh> Bah! Given a 9mm cable and a 654-MB1CKN0600 plug, which cord grip should I have bought? http://gb.mouser.com/catalog/643/1404.pdf
[00:01:50] <JT-Shop> a big one?
[00:03:08] * JT-Shop makes a big handful of motherboard standoffs... well maybe a little handful
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[00:03:16] <andypugh> I think I got the email off 2 minutes inside the 30 day limit. I will see what they say.
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[00:03:22] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: seriously?
[00:03:29] <JT-Shop> yea
[00:03:41] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: I have a few jars of them
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[00:04:09] <Tom_itx> you need a bar machine for those
[00:04:21] <Tom_itx> they'll spit em out by the thousands
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[00:04:31] <JT-Shop> why, when you only need 3
[00:04:39] <Tom_itx> overkill as usual
[00:05:00] <JT-Shop> Jymmm: I've used all mine up mounting different stuff
[00:05:11] <andypugh> I want this lathe, but I don't want it _now_ http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=280640435673
[00:05:16] <JT-Shop> yea, so I'll make 18" of them
[00:05:26] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: Hit any repair shop, they have buckets of em
[00:05:48] <JT-Shop> there ain't no repair shops in down town Poplar Bluff :P
[00:05:49] <Jymmm> but I guess you're bored
[00:06:25] <Jymmm> http://www.evilmadscientist.com/article.php/hershey
[00:06:50] <JT-Shop> andypugh: looks like a sturdy one
[00:07:28] <JT-Shop> hmmm slant bed
[00:07:30] <andypugh> Very nice lathe, also with a covered leadscrew and the slant bed _probably_ means space for an X-servo.
[00:08:08] <JT-Shop> just have a few glasses of wine and keep flea bay up on your computer and it will be yours
[00:10:15] <andypugh> It is also 270 miles away, and I don't have space in the garage for it.
[00:10:34] <JT-Shop> 270 miles is not far around here
[00:10:47] <andypugh> I think it is quite a big variant of the breed, 6'4" long and 32" deep.
[00:11:42] <JT-Shop> I don't have any space in my garage either
[00:13:52] <andypugh> I suppose I could move house...
[00:14:47] <andypugh> I think the second one here is a shorter version http://www.lathes.co.uk/willson/page11.html
[00:15:03] <JT-Shop> but I'm getting some room soon http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f163/johnplctech/Shop%20Addition/P3060022.jpg
[00:15:31] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: you cant even drive the tractor into the shop?!
[00:15:51] <JT-Shop> the tractor sure, the backhoe (digger) now
[00:16:00] <andypugh> Yes, but if I built anything that size I would have to seize next-doors garden as well as my own.
[00:16:23] <Jymmm> andypugh: and your point is?
[00:16:24] <JT-Shop> that does become a problem
[00:16:34] <atmega> you could take a little each year
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[00:16:59] <Jymmm> see, atmega has the right idea
[00:17:03] <andypugh> I want their garage, actually. Then I could build a workshop on the side.
[00:18:14] <andypugh> http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=SS13+1RT&aq=&sll=53.800651,-4.064941&sspn=18.598503,42.451172&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Basildon+SS13+1RT,+United+Kingdom&ll=51.581912,0.505084&spn=0.000298,0.000648&t=h&z=21
[00:19:16] <JT-Shop> I have a Samson manual lathe at the other shop http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f163/johnplctech/Machine%20Shop/HPIM2631.jpg
[00:19:21] <andypugh> I have the middle garden and the middle garage. (behind the black car). If I had the westerly garage I could have a linked workshop (you can't really see the northern pitch of the garage roofs)
[00:19:53] <andypugh> Looks very modern.
[00:20:42] <JT-Shop> yea, 70-80's I guess
[00:21:16] <JT-Shop> I don't use it much since I got the CHNC
[00:21:48] <Tom_itx> send it over here
[00:21:56] <Jymmm> I've always wanted a shop big enough to drive thru in a motorhome/bus with dual doors
[00:21:58] <JT-Shop> pretty good photo
[00:22:30] <JT-Shop> I'm moving it over to my new shop, it does come in handy with a tail stock
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[00:34:28] <JT-Shop> I'll e-mail you a hammer Jymmm
[00:38:14] <danimal_garage> nice lathe
[00:38:25] <danimal_garage> i need a newer one myself
[00:38:46] <danimal_garage> one like that would be good, is it 14x46ish?
[00:39:12] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: for what?
[00:39:18] <danimal_garage> something like 16x36 would be awesome, but hard to find
[00:39:25] <JT-Shop> to get started on your new shop
[00:39:52] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: a screwgun, welder, or trowel, but never a hammer
[00:40:18] <JT-Shop> yea Dan it is about 14 x 42
[00:40:29] <danimal_garage> thats what mine is
[00:40:37] <danimal_garage> good size
[00:40:48] <danimal_garage> i just want a heavier duty one
[00:41:12] <JT-Shop> I need to rework the cross slide and the compound slide as they are a bit loose
[00:43:11] <danimal_garage> finish the roof?
[00:45:13] <JT-Shop> up to the ridge caps but it rained all day today
[00:45:42] <JT-Shop> I have enough overlap that it is water tight from that angle
[00:47:26] <danimal_garage> cool
[00:47:42] <danimal_garage> when do you start moving equipment in?
[00:47:57] <atmega> http://www.flickr.com/photos/linux-works/2618014599/
[00:48:51] <JT-Shop> ah, I have a bit of wiring and sheet rock and insulating left to do :)
[00:49:16] <danimal_garage> ah
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[00:49:37] <danimal_garage> i need to find a way to sound insulate my garage door
[00:49:42] <JT-Shop> fake pots!
[00:50:04] <JT-Shop> the garage door I'm getting has 12.6 or so R rating
[00:50:07] <Tom_itx> danimal_garage, get some of that stuff the guys building boom boxes use on their trunk lids
[00:50:17] <Tom_itx> sound deadening stuff
[00:50:24] <JT-Shop> egg crate stuff
[00:53:30] <danimal_garage> dynamat is really expensive
[00:53:45] <JT-Shop> but I have the band saw all ready in the new shop
[00:54:30] <danimal_garage> cost me $46 to wrap my power drawbar and the cover for it in dynamat
[00:54:39] <danimal_garage> didnt help a ton either
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[00:56:54] <JT-Shop> lumpy internet
[00:56:56] <JT-Shop> the air motor?
[00:57:08] <danimal_garage> it's electric
[00:57:13] <JT-Shop> oh
[00:57:19] <danimal_garage> it's an electric impact gun
[00:57:39] <danimal_garage> was a black and decker, now it's a harbor freight :)
[00:59:01] <danimal_garage> anyone know how to tell if a domain is propagated other than just going to the domain and seeing if it works?
[00:59:07] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: LOL
[00:59:23] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: I'm making something you might appreciate
[00:59:32] <danimal_garage> baby back ribs?
[00:59:43] <Jymmm> Jesus on a Tortilla!
[00:59:53] <Jymmm> April 1st around the corner
[01:01:22] <Jymmm> The first one doens't look like much when sitting on the table, but put it up to the light.... GLORY BE PRAISE JEEBUS!!!
[01:01:53] * JT-Shop thinks Jymmm has had a touch
[01:02:31] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: Hey, it's a novelty item, ppl go for that stuff andwhere are you going to buy one from?
[01:03:12] <Jymmm> I should try Jesus Toast too
[01:03:44] <Jymmm> Jesus on a pita?
[01:03:48] * JT-Shop thinks it is time to go inside and check on chow
[01:04:00] <JT-Shop> armadillo on a stick I think
[01:04:13] <Jymmm> possum stew again JT-Shop?
[01:04:29] <JT-Shop> opossum yesterday
[01:04:36] <Jymmm> ah
[01:04:50] <Tom_itx> roadkill?
[01:05:26] <Tom_itx> it's funny how many armadillo you see on the roadside in Tx
[01:06:18] <JT-Shop> upside down mostly?
[01:06:30] <Tom_itx> mostly
[01:07:27] <JT-Shop> kinda strange how the mostly end up that way
[01:09:08] <JT-Shop> say goodnight Gracie
[01:09:53] <Tom_itx> does the roof leak?
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[02:29:32] <skunkworks> is this thing on?
[02:36:27] <Tom_itx> no you're halucinating
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[02:51:12] <ve7it> Jymmm, I finally found a reason to buy an itouch... http://ardrone.parrot.com/parrot-ar-drone/usa/
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[04:23:01] <Jymmm> ve7it: Heh
[04:53:38] <ve7it> Jymmm, that is a very neat toy... al controlled via wifi connection to/from ipad or iphone or itouch
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[05:08:01] <Jymmm> ve7it: Yeah, better than we ever had that's for sure. battery life is 10m
[05:09:10] <Jymmm> ve7it: $300 for the drone, $300 for iTouch, another $100+ for spare parts when you crash it =)
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[05:32:00] <ve7it> Jymmm, great as a spy plane.... chase the neighbours cat dont let the homeland guys hear about it
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[05:33:14] <Jymmm> ve7it: Guess you haven't seen this then http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110228/ap_on_re_us/us_hummingbird_drone
[05:34:36] <Jymmm> ve7it: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Rfx_FRKdS8
[05:37:40] <ve7it> I'll bet the darpa ones charge out at more than $300!
[05:38:06] <Jymmm> ve7it: and less runtime =)
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[05:55:14] <anonimasu> is anyone using the rutex plasma thc?
[05:57:10] <anonimasu> actually, what thc is the best to use with emc for plasma?
[05:57:17] <anonimasu> price and performance.
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[07:09:20] <stillme> hello guys, am kind of new here. am trying to install emc2, can i use my desktop the way it is without having to use a plug in vga card??
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[07:12:49] <bill2or3> you *can* use it with the onboard video, it's just not recommended.
[07:14:30] <stillme> my system rejects plug in vga cards
[07:14:53] <stillme> what if i turn off the memory sharing by the vga card or reduce it to bearest minimum?
[07:15:11] <psha> stillme: depends on on-board video
[07:15:31] <psha> intel chips and some ati ones are fine
[07:15:54] <psha> memory sharing is not important
[07:17:00] <stillme> so should i just try the on board card?? i have used two pci cards and ubuntu wont just install on them,
[07:17:11] <stillme> complains of kernel panic
[07:18:47] <Connor> What mobo you have ?
[07:19:32] <stillme> what is mobo?
[07:19:41] <Connor> mother board in your computer.
[07:20:57] <stillme> its a hp compaq desktop
[07:21:24] <Connor> Just try it and see if it works..
[07:22:26] <stillme> ok thanks
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[07:37:19] <Jymmm> stillme: You ight go into the BIOS and disable (or change the 'default' video) the on-board video and install a video card then.
[07:37:27] <Jymmm> stillme: You might go into the BIOS and disable (or change the 'default' video) the on-board video and install a video card then.
[07:37:54] <zhanx_laptop> whats the recommended noob way to go from dxf to gcode?
[07:38:16] <stillme> i kind of tried to do that but i cant find where to disable it
[07:38:31] <Jymmm> stillme: what model?
[07:38:35] <stillme> i only saw where i could reduce the ram it shared.
[07:38:56] <stillme> hp compaq d220 mt
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[07:47:08] <Jymmm> stillme: Can't help you there, they don't have the maint guide online, you'll have to contact HP to get it
[07:47:35] <stillme> ok thanks any ways
[07:47:40] <Jymmm> 'Maintenance and Service Guide'
[07:48:02] <stillme> i want to install the emc using the on board vga
[07:49:14] <zhanx_laptop> stillme does the installer crash due to the video card?
[07:49:56] <stillme> i suspect the video card
[07:50:09] <stillme> cause with the on board it boots to installing stage
[07:51:30] <zhanx_laptop> ok get the alt installer for ubuntu 10.04 then add the emc2
[07:51:44] <stillme> with the on board card i can get to stage of trying ubuntu, when i pug the pci card, ubuntu wont just boot
[07:51:59] <zhanx_laptop> http://www.ubuntu.com/desktop/get-ubuntu/download <- select 10.04
[07:52:00] <stillme> thats what am using
[07:52:03] <zhanx_laptop> hmmm
[07:52:12] <zhanx_laptop> what boot options?
[07:52:16] <stillme> ubuntu 10.04 to install emc later
[07:52:47] <stillme> how do you mean boot options??
[07:53:05] <zhanx_laptop> wait the on board works, but the pci dont?
[07:53:05] <zhanx_laptop> rip out the pci
[07:53:15] <stillme> ????
[07:53:25] <stillme> means i should use the on board??
[07:53:31] <zhanx_laptop> yea
[07:53:56] <stillme> in emc doc, it says its better to use plug in vga
[07:54:02] <zhanx_laptop> or BOOT_DEBUG=2
[07:54:19] <zhanx_laptop> get ubuntu installed first
[07:54:45] <stillme> i dont understand what BOOT_DEBUG=2 is
[07:54:52] <zhanx_laptop> your boot option
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[07:55:42] <stillme> should i try that with the PCI card?
[07:56:02] <zhanx_laptop> yes and you will see and error message that you can google
[07:57:58] <stillme> ok
[07:59:16] <stillme> i wil try that
[07:59:23] <zhanx_laptop> Jymmm, whats your software solution to get gcode out of dxf files if you use them
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[08:08:34] <zhanx_laptop> ok never mind found a plugin for blender that will suit my needs
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[08:55:38] <Guest917> Anyone awake?
[08:55:39] <the_wench> no just us bots, but just ask anyway because Im a clever bot, there is also a chance one of the carbon lifeforms may see and answer too
[08:55:54] <Guest917> Ooh Cute. :D
[09:01:32] <Guest917> I just stopped to say hello
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[09:05:19] <alex_joni> lol @ the_wench
[09:05:24] <psha> :)
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[11:01:14] <Gamma-X> Hello all. Can someone please recomend a good book on intro to cad/cam and engineering principals?
[11:14:25] <archivist> I would tend to say the subjects need more than one book
[11:16:47] <Gamma-X> archivist, Thats fine. Id like primers on both
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[11:22:49] <archivist> I dont have any current books like that, mine are too old to recommend
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[11:30:54] <HDB10> Hi archivist how are you doing ?
[11:31:14] <archivist> ok
[11:32:18] <archivist> Gamma-X, what are you looking to make
[11:32:36] <HDB10> How are you on hal programming ?
[11:33:13] <archivist> not done any yet
[11:33:24] <HDB10> OK
[11:33:29] <Gamma-X> archivist, Motorcycle parts...
[11:33:43] <Gamma-X> For the asian style sport bikes
[11:33:59] <HDB10> Can anyone assist me with a couple of line please
[11:34:09] <psha[work]> HDB10: don't ask to ask
[11:34:14] <psha[work]> btw hi
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[11:36:58] <HDB10_> Take a look in pastebin simple loop
[11:37:47] <archivist> which pastebin
[11:38:04] <HDB10_> pastebin.com
[11:38:07] <psha[work]> :)
[11:38:19] <HDB10_> Under "simple loop"
[11:38:44] <Gamma-X> Id also like to find out the name of a good cnc manufacture if possible. Im lookin for a decent machine.
[11:38:46] <archivist> HDB10, you would paste a link so we dont need to hunt
[11:39:12] <HDB10_> It's at the top of the list
[11:39:51] <archivist> no it is not
[11:40:57] <HDB10_> pastebin has not sent a response for some reason maybe a search
[11:41:07] <HDB10_> simple loop
[11:41:27] <archivist> what is so hard about pasting the unique url to your paste
[11:42:42] <HDB10_> I haven't used the system very much and Iam just getting into using it.
[11:43:16] <archivist> there are hundreds of pastes after yours
[11:44:01] <archivist> look at your url bar in your browser, it should point at your paste
[11:44:56] <HDB10_> I got you just a moment :-)
[11:45:23] <HDB10_> http://pastebin.com/nzUQsdUW
[11:45:33] <HDB10_> That might help
[11:45:39] <HDB10_> :-)
[11:47:26] <HDB10_> archivist Did you get to now ?
[11:59:16] <HDB10> Can anyone assist in sorting this out: http://pastebin.com/nzUQsdUW
[11:59:55] <HDB10> Please
[12:03:08] <HDB10_> psha Are you busy tomorrow ?
[12:03:25] <HDB10_> I see you are at work now.
[12:05:15] <jthornton> you can't execute g code from a c file called with m1xx AFAIK
[12:06:13] <mhaberler> HDB10; why dont you use straight M66 for this
[12:06:33] <HDB10_> Hi jthornton
[12:07:17] <HDB10_> How do you increment the A axis in hal ?
[12:10:39] <cpresser_> HDB10_: i guess halui has some pins for that
[12:10:58] <jthornton> yea halui
[12:12:00] <HDB10_> mhaberler : I don't know if it will work as I am looking for a edge trigger and I am not homing the axis
[12:12:42] <cpresser_> in fact, there is an edge-detect-component
[12:12:50] <mhaberler> see m66 Lword - does edges
[12:13:03] <mhaberler> http://www.linuxcnc.org/docs/2.4/html/gcode_main.html#sec:M66-Input-Control
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[12:14:25] <HDB10_> mhaberler: I'll take a look at it and see if I can figure it out Thanks :-)
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[12:20:59] <HDB10_> mhaberler: How do you increment the A axis at the same time ?
[12:21:18] <mhaberler> are you in manual, mdi or auto mode?
[12:21:32] <HDB10_> Auto
[12:22:05] <HDB10_> Actually running the program
[12:22:17] <mhaberler> what exactly are you trying to do? have A move and wait until switch triggers?
[12:22:56] <mhaberler> then stop move? if so, try a probe (g38.x)
[12:24:46] <HDB10_> I'll try to explain it. I have a disk on the A axis and it has a slot in it. The issue is that the position from the home position varies by several degrees.
[12:25:02] <mhaberler> ok
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[12:26:31] <HDB10_> So I wish to detect the start of the slot and the second side of the slot and the slot width can vary a few degrees also ...
[12:26:56] <HDB10_> This is the best way to explain it to you.
[12:27:17] <mhaberler> and you have a switch to detect the start and 'the second side'
[12:27:21] <jthornton> probe input
[12:27:24] <mhaberler> yep
[12:28:01] <mhaberler> fine, so why dont you probe with g38 then?
[12:28:05] <HDB10_> I have a photo cell and it is connected to a specific pin and is test and working.
[12:28:28] <mhaberler> good, or it with the probe input then
[12:29:21] <mhaberler> g38 can probe any axis, including a
[12:29:53] <HDB10_> I have tried this and it what to reverse the A axis and I need to have it advance.
[12:30:11] <HDB10_> I have spent days on it.
[12:30:30] <mhaberler> I dont get 'want to reverse'
[12:30:43] <mhaberler> g38 stops on probe contact
[12:31:58] <mhaberler> you can probe in either direction - put in relative mode (g91), then G38.x A<distance> where distance is positive or negative
[12:32:02] <HDB10_> Doesn't it store and return to the start again ?
[12:32:07] <mhaberler> NO
[12:32:13] <HDB10_> OK
[12:32:18] <mhaberler> the manual is VERY clear
[12:32:35] <mhaberler> The move stops (within machine acceleration limits) when the programmed point is reached, or when the requested change in the probe input takes place.
[12:32:44] <jthornton> :)
[12:33:00] <mhaberler> http://www.linuxcnc.org/docs/2.4/html/gcode_main.html#sub:G38.2:-Straight-Probe
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[12:35:56] <HDB10_> I had better go back a take a better look at these function and go from there Guy's.
[12:36:15] <mhaberler> approved ;-)
[12:37:27] <HDB10_> mhaberler: Silly question, which continent are you from ?
[12:37:51] <mhaberler> Planet Europe, Austria, Vienna
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[12:40:00] <HDB10_> I am from down under north of Sydney 400 Km
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[12:40:41] <mhaberler> ok, we always get mixed up with you guys. On Vienna Airport we can buy T-shirts saying "There are no kangaroos in Austria."
[12:41:37] <HDB10_> Yeah: Only about 50 Million of them :-)
[12:42:12] <HDB10_> Hahaha
[12:43:09] <HDB10_> Austria : Getting a bit late here 23.42
[12:43:36] <mhaberler> 13:43 here
[12:43:55] <mhaberler> now take that emc manual to bed and enjoy it ;-)
[12:44:08] <HDB10_> Anyway thanks for you help :-)
[12:44:20] <mhaberler> sure, you're welcome
[12:45:08] <HDB10_> Not tonight I am buggered now so we will attack it in the morning..........
[12:45:27] <HDB10_> Thanks again......
[12:45:42] <mhaberler> the future with g38.x will be so bright you will need f...g sunglasses tomorrow
[12:46:47] <HDB10_> SeeYa Man thanks, Bye
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[13:50:05] <skunkworks> good morning
[13:50:38] <mhaberler> hi
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[13:54:54] <skunkworks> mhaberler: how goes the programming?
[13:55:52] <skunkworks> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mach1mach2cnc/message/126126
[13:55:58] <mhaberler> parts are coming together - the state save/restore and introspection stuff was the last major thing I needed for the toolchange-in-gcode although its useful well beyond that
[13:56:41] <mhaberler> a minor bit is missing, namely interaction of M7x save/restore and abort handling, that's needed for toolchange
[13:56:51] <mhaberler> the major thing is proper docs..
[13:57:40] <mhaberler> right now any mode the TC gcode subs change is reflected in the main programs mode and that's not acceptable
[13:59:26] <skunkworks> neat
[14:00:02] <mhaberler> I guess I get a reputation for re-bugging emc along the way ;_)
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[14:00:58] <mhaberler> one thing I'd like to do for UI's, in particular gladevcp, is interpreter parameter read/write access without going through MDI mode - HAL gets way awkward if abused for that
[14:00:59] <skunkworks> eh - every bit helps
[14:27:32] <skunkworks> there is a site in the uk selling mesa stuff - right?
[14:28:31] <skunkworks> google is failing me
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[14:42:51] <skunkworks> must be this company? http://www.cnc-ready.at/
[14:43:02] <skunkworks> slow
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[14:43:56] <archivist> skunkworks, dont know of one in the UK
[14:46:29] <skunkworks> or europe?
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[14:55:03] <archivist> should be one :)
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[14:59:05] <mhaberler> skunkworks: cnc-ready.at is an Austrian company and I actually bought something from them
[14:59:32] <mhaberler> they are ok to deal with
[15:04:51] <skunkworks> mhaberler: thanks
[15:05:12] <mhaberler> sure
[15:09:18] <JT-Shop> power up, home, and right back to making 6-32 standoffs, I love EMC2!
[15:10:46] <skunkworks> I agree!
[15:11:14] <atmega> why does one make 6-32 stand offs instead of getting them from china?
[15:12:45] <cradek> JT-Shop: I made some 4-40 ones - I form tapped them, which worked really great
[15:13:06] <skunkworks> I have not form tapped yet.
[15:13:32] <cradek> my limited experience says for blind holes it can't be beat
[15:14:06] <JT-Shop> I want them today
[15:14:07] <cradek> you have to get the hole size very right - for small holes I hear sometimes people ream them
[15:14:35] <cradek> (I just drilled for mine)
[15:14:36] <skunkworks> lots of lube
[15:15:00] <cradek> yeah, the lathe has cutting oil flood
[15:15:02] <JT-Shop> I'm missing 3 standoffs to install a new motherboard so it is much faster to just make them and much more fun
[15:15:28] <atmega> that's a good reason :)
[15:15:40] * JT-Shop wonders if he will rigid tap the hole or chicken out and hand tap them
[15:15:42] <atmega> I have hundreds of them here
[15:15:59] <skunkworks> doesn't everyone have a box of extra computer screws/hardware?
[15:16:08] <JT-Shop> I used all mine up mounting all the hardware on my plasma cutter
[15:16:13] <skunkworks> I think it weighs 10lbs
[15:16:23] <JT-Shop> LOL, I can't find that box anywhere
[15:16:28] <atmega> I have anti-static bags full of them everywhere
[15:18:53] <atmega> is anyone going to the cnc workshop in ann-arbor in june?
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[15:26:47] <JT-Shop> too far for me
[15:28:01] <JT-Shop> atmega: I think I have the Max6675 figured out http://gnipsel.com/arduino/max6675/max6675.xhtml
[15:28:15] <atmega> me too... I also can't imagine voluntarily going to ann arbor
[15:28:16] <JT-Shop> just need to finish up some wiring to test it out
[15:30:40] <atmega> looks good to me
[15:31:43] <atmega> I don't recall doing SPI that way though (SPI.transfer)
[15:32:23] <JT-Shop> seems like there is several ways to do it
[15:32:45] <JT-Shop> SPI.transfer uses the hardware SPI AFAIK
[15:33:22] <atmega> I was reading a multichannel ADC, seems like I had to tell it to start the conversion, wait for a bit, then tell it what channel I wanted to read
[15:33:41] <atmega> but, I might be confusing that with something else
[15:34:26] <JT-Shop> the Max6675 is a send data only chip
[15:34:54] <pcw_home> You often start a conversion and then select the _next_ channel to read
[15:35:04] <atmega> yeah, I just don't remember the .transfer
[15:36:15] <JT-Shop> http://www.arduino.cc/playground/Code/Spi
[15:37:57] <JT-Shop> http://arduino.cc/en/Reference/SPI
[15:41:59] <JT-Shop> took me a while to understand that the SPI.transfer you had to send something to get something even if the slave device only sends data out :)
[15:43:48] <atmega> I think I must have been doing SPI by hand
[15:44:02] <skunkworks> btw - turning off accelleration in the flash settings - fixed the problem.
[15:45:38] <JT-Shop> for some reason unknown to me I wanted to use the hardware SPI on the ATmega328 :)
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[15:47:34] <atmega> I got some niftier i2c ADC's with built in programmable amps and used those with the WIRE library instead.
[16:00:52] <JT-Shop> cool, I needed either thermistors or thermocouples that are encased in SS for my project
[16:01:20] <JT-Shop> i have some i2c stuff somewhere
[16:03:12] <Jymmm> Is SPI, hw many masters can there be?
[16:03:16] <Jymmm> how
[16:03:37] <Jymmm> In SPI, how many masters can there be?
[16:03:39] <cpresser_> one.
[16:03:58] <JT-Shop> 1
[16:04:00] <Jymmm> so its a star topology?
[16:04:59] <cpresser_> no, chain
[16:05:17] <cpresser_> daisy-chain. one chip after another
[16:05:17] <Jymmm> then there can be more than one master, just not at the same time
[16:05:53] <cpresser_> depends on the output-drivers on the clock-line
[16:06:51] <Jymmm> from JT-Shop link...
[16:07:00] <Jymmm> It can also be used for communication between two microcontrollers.
[16:07:00] <Jymmm> With an SPI connection there is always one master device (usually a microcontroller) which controls the peripheral devices.
[16:07:00] <Jymmm>
[16:09:15] <cpresser_> I2C can have multiple masters, since all lines are active low and the output-drivers are open-collector. so you dont have drivers fighting against each other.
[16:09:44] <Jymmm> I2C is cool, everything has an address
[16:10:20] <mozmck_work1> in SPI, don't you have to have one chip-select line per slave? That would limit the practical number of devices I would think.
[16:10:49] <Jymmm> http://www.evilmadscientist.com/article.php/hershey
[16:11:12] <JT-Shop> yes, but you can multiplex the chip select lines
[16:12:44] <cpresser_> not all chips have a chip/slave-select line. for example the TI5925 (LED-Driver) has none
[16:13:18] <cpresser_> it is always possible to have a clever design with a multiplex to adress more chips :)
[16:14:19] <pcw_home> I prefer SPI since its easier to isolate and can be much faster that I2C
[16:16:02] * Jymmm kicks cpresser_ in the shin for giving a LED driver he can't use
[16:19:29] <L84Supper> Jymmm: how large an area can you laser engrave?
[16:19:51] <Jymmm> L84Supper: <--- This Big --->
[16:19:59] <Jymmm> L84Supper: 12x24"
[16:20:45] <Jymmm> cpresser_: Now, find me a cheap version of this.... http://www.maxim-ic.com/datasheet/index.mvp/id/1339
[16:20:57] <L84Supper> Jymmm: if i needed 24 x 24 could you step the material over by 12" or is there a limit to the size of the bed?
[16:21:14] <Jymmm> L84Supper: Like what?
[16:21:34] <L84Supper> Jymmm: sheet of cold roll or aluminum
[16:22:08] <Jymmm> L84Supper: I have a CO2 laser, not a YaG laser. Doesn't do metal.
[16:22:43] <skunkworks> we have used co2 to cut steel..
[16:22:52] <skunkworks> and stainless
[16:22:52] <L84Supper> Jymmm: ahh, is it enough power to engrave a paint coating?
[16:22:55] <Jymmm> skunkworks: Yeah, 2KW
[16:23:00] <skunkworks> 1kw
[16:23:02] <skunkworks> ;)
[16:23:13] <Jymmm> skunkworks: .05 SS
[16:23:18] <cpresser_> finished my DRO: http://ca.rstenpresser.de/~cpresser/tmp/pictures/unsorted/dro/DRO.jpg
[16:23:19] <Jymmm> .005
[16:23:31] <Jymmm> L84Supper: Sure
[16:23:37] <skunkworks> don't remember - probably .020
[16:23:49] <Jymmm> skunkworks: mark or cut?
[16:23:59] <L84Supper> Jymmm: mark, not cut
[16:24:21] <Jymmm> L84Supper: Yes, I can remove paint from a surface.
[16:24:34] <L84Supper> Jymmm: my piece is around 24" x 24" though
[16:24:51] <Jymmm> L84Supper: of steel?
[16:25:21] <L84Supper> Jymmm: yes, cold roll sheet ~16ga
[16:26:06] <Jymmm> L84Supper: Details man, details. drawing helps too.
[16:26:25] <skunkworks> Jymmm: cut
[16:29:36] <Jymmm> I can cut/mark: paper, cardboard, wood, cork, plastics, fabric, foodstuffs, and mark: glass, stone, tile, ceramic
[16:30:25] <Jymmm> as well as remove/bleach coatings/pigments
[16:30:40] <atmega> have you tried CerMark(tm) or whatever the others are?
[16:31:06] <Jymmm> I have some, but haven't tried it
[16:31:35] <Jymmm> oh and can mark annodize
[16:32:11] <atmega> what does it take to cut 4mm acrylic/plexiglas?
[16:32:23] <JT-Shop> I wish they made beer flavored coolant so you won't mind so much getting sprayed with it
[16:32:26] <Jymmm> wth is 4mm ?
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[16:32:48] <atmega> it's 1mm thicker than 3mm
[16:33:02] <atmega> or 1mm thinner than 5mm
[16:33:32] <atmega> or 0.15748 inches
[16:33:42] <Jymmm> I cut 1/4" acrylic all the time
[16:34:03] <L84Supper> thats more like 6mm
[16:34:32] <Jymmm> 6.35mm
[16:34:49] <Jymmm> 25.4/4
[16:35:07] <atmega> how fast can you cut 1/4"?
[16:35:12] <Jymmm> slow
[16:35:28] <L84Supper> atmega: can you make your 4mm acrylic 2.35mm thicker, then he can cut it
[16:36:15] <Jymmm> This is 1/4" http://i53.tinypic.com/2ducze8.jpg
[16:36:30] <Jymmm> this is too http://i51.tinypic.com/2jttp2.jpg
[16:38:29] <Jymmm> sucky PNS camera
[16:38:38] <L84Supper> Jymmm: I was wondering if your machine can handle a sign project where the material is 24" x 24" 16Ga painted steel and we'd like to laser etch an image through the paint layer down to the steel
[16:39:00] <Jymmm> L84Supper: I'd need to see the drawing
[16:39:33] <L84Supper> it's line art or a 1 bit bitmap
[16:39:43] <Jymmm> L84Supper: I'd still need to see the drawing
[16:40:39] <Jymmm> L84Supper: it's all about registration and complexity.
[16:44:14] <L84Supper> Jymmm: I'll get back to you soon with one
[16:44:22] <Jymmm> L84Supper: ok
[16:46:18] <L84Supper> the Cermark looks interesting.... does it contain a frit that gets sintered by the laser?
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[17:04:43] <GammaX> ANyone know any good books to get started in cad and cam?
[17:15:41] <L84Supper> GammaX: I used to get copies of the applications and then work through the tutorials included
[17:16:27] <GammaX> L84Supper, well ive never done cad or cam and I want to start creating motorcycle parts.... tryin to figure out where to begin...
[17:17:50] <L84Supper> GammaX : http://code.google.com/p/heekscad/
[17:17:55] <cradek> do you have a community college where you can take "Lathe 1" and "Milling Machine 1"?
[17:18:19] <cradek> cad and cam don't make parts, machinists do -- that's what I did when I wanted to be able to actually make things
[17:18:31] <atmega> sadly for me, cad + cam will not make you a machinist.
[17:18:45] -!- kirk_wallace [kirk_wallace!~kwallace@vpn-134.sonnet.com] has joined #emc
[17:18:56] <atmega> but, you can still do some cool stuff :)
[17:18:59] <GammaX> Well Im in afghanistan so I am trying to learn as much as I can now...
[17:21:02] <Jymmm> GammaX: how long is your tour?
[17:21:38] <GammaX> year long. Will be out of here next jan some time....
[17:22:15] <Jymmm> GammaX: You looking to make decrotive items or functional (primarily)?
[17:22:35] <GammaX> functional,
[17:23:08] <Jymmm> GammaX: So you want to do stuff like on OCC ?
[17:23:38] <GammaX> you could say that....
[17:23:47] <Jymmm> GammaX: custom design/make flarings, etc
[17:24:17] <Jymmm> GammaX: or iike desing/make engine parts
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[17:25:16] <Jymmm> heads/pistons/carbs/gears, etc
[17:26:03] <IchGuckLive> someone has ever bayed this 4pc 20USD ball bearing blocks from HK
[17:27:16] <IchGuckLive> how precise are they
[17:27:45] <cpresser_> where can i find documentation for .comp-file syntax?
[17:28:39] <cradek> http://www.linuxcnc.org/docs/devel/html/hal/comp.html
[17:30:00] <cpresser_> ty. exactly what i was looking for
[17:30:31] <Jymmm> GammaX: Well, not exactly "industry standard", but you could try this http://sites.google.com/site/sketchuptogcode/
[17:31:39] <danimal_garage> well i left glxgears and latency test running all night
[17:31:52] <Jymmm> GammaX: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Computer-aided_design
[17:31:52] <danimal_garage> i even turned the screen saver back on
[17:32:04] <GammaX> Jymmm, more along the lines of rear sets levers... etc. stuff for super bikes
[17:32:27] <danimal_garage> the servo thread was 12k and the base thread was 19k
[17:32:58] <IchGuckLive> GammaX: yoiu can go thru blender with the Collada files and then produce G-code
[17:33:28] <Jymmm> GammaX: And your CBT's don't have anything on the subject?
[17:33:45] <GammaX> Any book on cnc machining in general?
[17:33:48] <GammaX> cbt's?
[17:33:56] <IchGuckLive> GammaX: blender eyports 3D data to all nown Data files
[17:33:58] <Jymmm> GammaX: Online military education/training
[17:34:18] <Jymmm> CBT == Computer Based Training
[17:34:18] <GammaX> ohhh no. Deffinately not.
[17:34:27] <Jymmm> GammaX: What branch?
[17:34:51] <IchGuckLive> GammaX: all mashines manufactors have there own standart
[17:35:08] <IchGuckLive> so you got to choos the Controler first
[17:35:22] <IchGuckLive> sutch as EMC2 uses iso Standart
[17:35:41] <IchGuckLive> HAAS uses a high level 3Digits G code
[17:36:10] <IchGuckLive> GammaX: Nationality USA ?
[17:37:20] <IchGuckLive> for CAM please join #cam
[17:37:27] <Jymmm> GammaX: http://www.cadtutor.net/index.html
[17:37:56] <GammaX> IchGuckLive, yes Im American
[17:37:59] <IchGuckLive> on the cam channel there are nummerus people working with many nown systems
[17:38:30] <GammaX> Jymmm, Im a Civilian attached to the Marines.
[17:39:08] <IchGuckLive> im living near RAmstein AFV Germany
[17:39:28] <Jymmm> GammaX: Ah, you should ask one of the enlisted to get you some of the training mateials. there's a serious wealth of info you can download as PDF files.
[17:39:45] <GammaX> Ahh very nice area.
[17:39:53] <Jymmm> GammaX: http://www.caddprimer.com/
[17:40:01] <GammaX> Jymmm, you got any links to them?
[17:40:26] <Jymmm> GammaX: No, they are secured servers, but any enlisted personnel has access to them.
[17:40:46] <IchGuckLive> you can look on some of my tutorials to EMC2 or Heekscad -> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DAVkVawm6pM
[17:41:10] <IchGuckLive> im working Full open source
[17:41:48] <GammaX> I need a generalized book on designing of parts... tolerances.. and cad/cam and there differences. I know I want to use mastercam.
[17:42:17] <IchGuckLive> so use the mastercam basic training book
[17:42:23] <IchGuckLive> its on amazon
[17:42:32] <Jymmm> GammaX: http://www.caddprimer.com/architecture_cad_chapter_tutorial.html
[17:43:04] <Jymmm> GammaX: Parts and tolerances are more a machinist thing, thna a CAD/CAM thing
[17:43:11] <IchGuckLive> solidege has the best mastercam CAD/CAM system items i now
[17:43:49] <IchGuckLive> for CAD there are School books available
[17:43:55] <GammaX> Jymmm, lookin to read up on both. I want to be able to design parts while im over here and then make them when I get back.
[17:44:41] <IchGuckLive> what parts
[17:44:49] <IchGuckLive> Wood pictures
[17:44:51] <Jymmm> GammaX: If you already have mastercam, start learning it.
[17:45:05] <Jymmm> GammaX: by playing with it that is.
[17:45:25] <IchGuckLive> agree with jimm
[17:45:29] <GammaX> ie: levers, sprockets, rear sets, etc
[17:45:39] <GammaX> gotcha...
[17:45:48] <Jymmm> GammaX: http://www.caddprimer.com/cad-fr.zip
[17:45:52] <IchGuckLive> i got to trunslate this first B)
[17:45:57] <Jymmm> GammaX: http://www.caddprimer.com/computer_aided_design_free.html
[17:46:27] <Jymmm> GammaX: If you are looking for refernece, try the MAchinist Handbook ($$)
[17:47:04] <Jymmm> http://www.amazon.com/Machinerys-Handbook-Toolbox-Franklin-Jones/dp/0831127007
[17:47:12] <IchGuckLive> best to do this are data books or simple the cad3d Cataloges free available
[17:47:28] <GammaX> I appreciate all the help here guys
[17:47:58] <IchGuckLive> http://www.tracepartsonline.net
[17:48:35] <IchGuckLive> mastercam will eat all this nice Β§D files and by one klick generate you a nice G-code
[17:49:36] <IchGuckLive> if you want to stay Free Heekscad does also go with the parts but its more then 5 klicks to G-code
[17:52:03] <IchGuckLive> Learning Mastercam X2 Mill 2D Step by Step [With CDROM]
[17:52:23] <IchGuckLive> ISBN-13: 978-0831133535
[17:52:46] <IchGuckLive> @all is the isbn also used in the USA ?
[17:53:02] <IchGuckLive> as i am in Europe
[17:54:36] <IchGuckLive> ? on my Question
[17:56:21] <IchGuckLive> GammaX: this woudt be the best book for you to start all over
[17:57:46] <IchGuckLive> shuttle save home live -> http://www.ustream.tv/channel-popup/nasa-hd-tv
[18:02:56] <danimal_garage> how come i am able to jog in mdi?
[18:03:01] <danimal_garage> is that new?
[18:03:15] <cradek> you aren't able to
[18:03:22] <danimal_garage> well i am
[18:03:26] <cradek> no you aren't
[18:03:36] <cradek> you aren't in mdi if you are jogging
[18:03:47] <danimal_garage> the mdi screen is up and i am indeed jogging
[18:03:53] <danimal_garage> i'll put money on that
[18:04:02] <cradek> having the mdi screen up doesn't necessarily mean you're in mdi mode
[18:04:03] <danimal_garage> and i'll take video
[18:04:11] <cradek> issue an mdi command and then try jogging
[18:04:35] <danimal_garage> i did
[18:04:40] <danimal_garage> and it still jogs
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[18:04:50] <cradek> what kind of jogging are you doing?
[18:05:01] <danimal_garage> keyboard jogging
[18:05:11] <danimal_garage> with the arrows and page up/down
[18:05:30] <cradek> in AXIS?
[18:05:32] <danimal_garage> ha my pendant jogs too
[18:05:35] <danimal_garage> yes
[18:05:43] <danimal_garage> first time this has happened
[18:05:49] <danimal_garage> normally it doesnt
[18:05:52] <cradek> what emc version? it sounds like a bug
[18:05:56] <danimal_garage> 2.5
[18:06:10] <cradek> hm, a bunch of related stuff has been "fixed" lately
[18:06:11] -!- ve7it [ve7it!~LawrenceG@S0106009027972e37.pk.shawcable.net] has joined #emc
[18:06:30] <danimal_garage> want me to film it?
[18:06:34] <cradek> so if you type m3 in the mdi box and then poke the left arrow, it jogs instead of moving the cursor back?
[18:07:09] <danimal_garage> i did g0x0y0 and hit enter then i jogged
[18:07:13] -!- NoobSaibot [NoobSaibot!~Adium@24-213-19-74.static.mrqt.mi.charter.com] has joined #emc
[18:07:25] <danimal_garage> it still moves the cursor in mdi but it also jogs
[18:07:42] <danimal_garage> so page up actually scrolls through the mdi history
[18:07:49] <danimal_garage> but jogs as well
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[18:07:54] <cradek> what git version exactly?
[18:08:13] <danimal_garage> i didnt use git
[18:08:22] <danimal_garage> i upgraded
[18:08:23] <cradek> how do you have 2.5?
[18:08:33] <cradek> buildbot package or something?
[18:08:49] <danimal_garage> i went to a site and got the source url
[18:08:55] <danimal_garage> yea i think so
[18:09:02] <danimal_garage> sounds right
[18:09:59] <cradek> if it's a package, it will have a version number
[18:10:14] <danimal_garage> well i need to run the machine, so if you want me to check anything or take a video, let me know now before i cant get it to do it again
[18:10:26] <danimal_garage> where do i look for that?
[18:15:33] <danimal_garage> well i gotta run parts again
[18:15:48] <danimal_garage> cradek
[18:16:51] <danimal_garage> i was actually able to re-home in mdi as well
[18:17:49] <danimal_garage> and touch off
[18:19:05] <NoobSaibot> Where is a good place to begin to troubleshoot a Navisphere "ClassNotFoundException" (http://pastebin.com/QWBEAGcs)?
[18:20:32] <skunkworks> NoobSaibot: is this an advanced machine control question (EMC)
[18:20:32] <danimal_garage> cradek i hit f3 then went back to mdi and it wont jog again
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[18:25:26] <NoobSaibot> skunkworks: Perhaps the "EMC" in EMC Navisphere CX700 Storage Area Networking has nothing to do with this channel. I'm just stuck, and I thought maybe I got lucky here.
[18:26:03] <skunkworks> heh - nope. this is a machine control software running on the linux platform :)
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[18:26:24] <atmega> ditch it and buy NetApp
[18:26:24] <NoobSaibot> skunkworks: sorry about that. I'm not a dev, just a net eng temporarily working as a sysadmin on a SAN controller
[18:26:52] <skunkworks> not a problem - we get one of you a month ;)
[18:27:31] <atmega> machine controllers are more fun than SAN's
[18:30:12] <Jymmm> NoobSaibot: You poor bastard! Emc is bad enough, then toss on Java as well. http://www.netapp.com/
[18:31:54] <NoobSaibot> yes, it looks like Java is the culprit, i'm just trying to find it.
[18:32:22] <atmega> it can't be a java problem, java solves problems, it doesn't create them.
[18:32:40] <NoobSaibot> skunkworks: neat-o, my timing is likened to a menstrual cycle. And probably similarly annoying.
[18:32:40] <NoobSaibot> atmega: I wouldn't doubt it for a second. But the closest thing to dev ability in my arsenal is Unix shell, PowerShell and Perl. I won't be making controllers anytime soon.
[18:32:42] <Jymmm> atmega: and the Easter Bunny is real
[18:33:17] <NoobSaibot> Good day to you all, back to the troubleshooting board.
[18:33:29] <Jymmm> NoobSaibot: I'd call them personally
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[18:34:03] <Jymmm> NoobSaibot: It's obviously a bug somewhere or missing object
[18:35:01] <Jymmm> NoobSaibot: http://forum.kaspersky.com/lofiversion/index.php/t148427.html
[18:36:34] <NoobSaibot> I don't use Windows, but thank you for the tip. I'm going to futs with it for another few minutes, then I'll probably give in and contact them.
[18:36:50] <Jymmm> good luck =)
[18:37:34] <NoobSaibot> Thank-you! :-/
[18:37:38] -!- tom3p [tom3p!~tomp@74-93-88-241-Illinois.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has parted #emc
[18:37:51] <Jymmm> NoobSaibot: Tequilia always helps too
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[18:52:22] <Jymmm> NoobSaibot: Oh, I remember one thing that Dell forces the use of IE for some of their devices (bastards). You might try remoting into a win box and connecting from there.
[18:53:02] <Jymmm> NoobSaibot: we had a VM setup for just that purpose
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[19:13:45] <NoobSaibot> Jymmm: Some forums have shown people getting it to work in Chrome and Firefox in Linux. But I'm setting up a Win7VM anyway, and I'm going to VPN in to give M$ a shot. To your knowledge, is that Java error probably on my side or on the Navisphere server side?
[19:14:35] <Jymmm> NoobSaibot: No idea on what side it's on. But I'd setup an XP VM instead, less issues and smaller/faster too.
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[19:15:03] <fragalot> my mate's GIANT lathe died
[19:15:12] <Jymmm> NoobSaibot: I've gotten an XP VM down under 100MB before.
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[19:15:42] <fragalot> the axle to move the tool table sideways has snapped & one of the gear teeth broke clean off... it's a bloody 12cm thick axle that snapped clean in half!
[19:16:34] <fragalot> no signs of rust at all.. Could it be the cold that has affected the steel somehow?
[19:16:38] <NoobSaibot> Jymmm: Good call. I'll have to go dig up an old XP ISO or VM image.
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[19:21:30] <Jymmm> NoobSaibot: I know you're in a hurry, but if you take the time to create a nice custom XP distro you can use it anywhere and copy it as many times as you like
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[19:22:28] <bill20r3> Hmm: http://www.publicsurplus.com/sms/all,ut/auction/view?auc=534742
[19:22:52] <bill20r3> anyone heard of or used a "D&M4" benchtop machine?
[19:22:54] <Jymmm> NoobSaibot: you can use nLite to slipstream all the updates and do some other tweaking (like automatically embedding the LicKey,etc) http://www.nliteos.com/
[19:23:52] <bill20r3> it looks pretty un-used.
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[19:27:56] <skunkworks> bill20r3: I have seen them on cnczone.. (can't seem to find it)
[19:28:38] <Tom_itx> what does nlite do?
[19:29:03] <Jymmm> Tom_itx: It allows you to create a custom build of XP.
[19:29:44] <Jymmm> Tom_itx: http://www.nliteos.com/nlite.html
[19:30:23] <Tom_itx> thanx
[19:30:28] <cradek> the main body of it looks just like sherline
[19:30:32] <skunkworks> yes
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[19:31:21] <cradek> I think it has a little drawbar - maybe there were tool holders (since there is a place to put them)
[19:31:33] <cradek> I don't think sherline makes anything like that
[19:31:36] <andypugh> I wonder if these would be a good way to interface with Mesa cards?
[19:31:37] <andypugh> http://uk.rs-online.com/web/search/searchBrowseAction.html?method=getProduct&R=6812874
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[19:35:05] <andypugh> Havr you seen the ISO 15 toolholder systems? it's very cute.
[19:46:03] <archivist> andypugh, that tangential tooling was also used on capstan lathes etc
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[19:58:44] <andypugh> It seems that it would be very economical in HSS>
[19:59:41] <cradek> that's not a new idea - it's been around a long time - I've never tried it but it sure looks functional, and the tools would be very easy to grind.
[20:00:34] <cradek> watchmakers call that shape a graver, the tool is held by hand
[20:02:32] <andypugh> Do they use the same face of the solid, though?
[20:02:37] <cradek> http://www.sherline.com/images/graver.gif
[20:02:41] <cpresser_> any ideas on how to debug a hal-userspace-component?
[20:03:26] <cradek> andypugh: yes the diamond shaped face is usually 'up'
[20:04:15] <cradek> cpresser_: in userspace, you can print to stdout and/or use gdb - there is nothing about userspace hal components that make them unusually hard to debug
[20:04:54] <andypugh> cpresser_: http://git.linuxcnc.org/gitweb?p=emc2.git;a=blob;f=docs/rtfaults.txt;h=6095276de5cef3733d416c341a637134dd862a26;hb=HEAD
[20:04:56] <cpresser_> how can i load it into gdb? wia halcmd?
[20:04:57] <andypugh> Might also be useful
[20:05:44] <cradek> that's for realtime components
[20:05:46] <cpresser_> i got the following: http://nopaste.info/b409a91f41.html
[20:05:58] -!- seb_kuzminsky [seb_kuzminsky!~seb@97-122-121-148.hlrn.qwest.net] has joined #emc
[20:06:04] <cpresser_> it occurs wen assigning the hal-variable to my userspace-variable
[20:06:35] <cradek> pastebin entire code please
[20:06:39] <cpresser_> xpos is a macro, containing #define xpos (0+*inst->xpos)
[20:07:02] <cradek> then inst is probably wrong
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[20:07:46] <cpresser_> http://pastebin.com/wmDBGrZr
[20:08:09] <cpresser_> inst wasnt created be me. "comp" does all this stuff
[20:11:41] <cpresser_> maybe i should reimplement this stuff using python :) then i wont have to worry about pointers
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[20:13:02] <cradek> I don't see anything obvious wrong
[20:13:11] <cradek> (that line is remarked out in this version)
[20:13:44] <cpresser_> yes.. since i wanted to see if the other code runs finde
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[20:13:49] <cpresser_> ~fine
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[20:15:12] <cpresser_> may there be a problem with the way i load the component? i was running emc with the default-emc-start-script (as user cv), then load my component via halcmd as root
[20:15:31] <cradek> you should not do anything as root
[20:15:36] <danimal_garage> cradek, did you want me to look at anything in emc for you regarding the jogging in mdi issue?
[20:15:38] <cradek> but I doubt that's the problem
[20:16:36] <cradek> danimal_garage: yes, it would be great if you could say how to reproduce the problem (well, better yet, tell the devel list, since I probably am not the one to fix it)
[20:17:06] <cpresser_> since i was suspecting hardware-issues (its DIY), and replugged the device several times; so i was running it as root to avoid credential-problems
[20:17:30] <danimal_garage> cradek, i dont know if i can, it wont do it again after i went back to f3 then f5
[20:17:42] <cradek> fooey
[20:17:45] <danimal_garage> i had to run parts :\
[20:18:00] <skunkworks> I think seb fixed some things recently...
[20:19:04] <danimal_garage> cradek, i could home and touch off in mdi as well
[20:19:31] <cradek> true did you ever say what version you have?
[20:19:43] <cpresser_> cradek: shame on me. loading it as user 'cv' (the one running emc) solves the problem
[20:19:51] <danimal_garage> also another possible bug is that you can run a program in mdi if you right click and hit run from here
[20:19:57] <cradek> relevant things have been "adjusted" recently
[20:20:35] <cradek> cpresser_: weird
[20:20:36] <danimal_garage> cradek, i have 2.5 but if you need any more info than that you'll have to tell me where to look for it
[20:21:18] <cradek> ummmmm, have you remembered yet how you got that version? :-)
[20:22:09] <danimal_garage> it was the buildbot page
[20:22:22] <cradek> then try dpkg -l emc2
[20:22:42] <danimal_garage> in terminal?
[20:22:55] <cradek> yes
[20:23:03] <danimal_garage> wont scre anything up or shut down emc, right? stupid question but i gotta ask
[20:23:08] <danimal_garage> screw
[20:23:08] <cradek> no
[20:23:11] <danimal_garage> ok
[20:23:53] <danimal_garage> ok i did that
[20:24:03] <cpresser_> cradek: segfault is gone, but it is not working.. but so far, i am not out of clues...
[20:24:18] <danimal_garage> says unknown package -1
[20:24:21] <anonimasu> does anyone have a clue if the mesa 7i40 will work togther with the 7i43?
[20:24:31] <seb_kuzminsky> danimal_garage: i had some surprise jogs in mdi as well recently
[20:24:43] <cradek> danimal_garage: l, not 1
[20:24:49] <danimal_garage> Ha! see it aint just me
[20:24:54] <seb_kuzminsky> jeff fixed one bug, but i think there is at least one still lurking in 2.4 and 2.5 (and master)
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[20:25:37] <seb_kuzminsky> up until a few weeks or so ago, i could jog in MDI mode (f5) by hitting Ctrl-Shift-Arrows
[20:25:39] <seb_kuzminsky> jeff fixed that
[20:25:49] <danimal_garage> do i have to do sudo?
[20:26:08] <seb_kuzminsky> a few days ago i could jog in MDI mode by hitting F5, then F4, then arrow keys (iirc)
[20:26:16] <seb_kuzminsky> danimal_garage: no sudo needed for that
[20:26:20] <danimal_garage> it says i cant do it without superuser privilege
[20:26:26] <seb_kuzminsky> run "dpkg -l emc2 | grep Version"
[20:26:32] <seb_kuzminsky> that's "dash little-ell"
[20:26:44] <danimal_garage> ah
[20:26:51] <danimal_garage> this monitor is screwy
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[20:27:25] <seb_kuzminsky> sure, blame it on the monitor
[20:28:11] <danimal_garage> 1:2.6.0~pre0-5
[20:28:21] <danimal_garage> is that what your looking for?
[20:28:26] <seb_kuzminsky> perfect
[20:28:32] <seb_kuzminsky> you're using buildbot debs from the master branch
[20:28:45] <seb_kuzminsky> those should have jeff's Ctrl-Shift-Arrow fix
[20:29:01] <seb_kuzminsky> how exactly did you make it jog?
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[20:29:12] <anonimasu> and the next question is what kind of mesa io module do you use for buttons?
[20:29:19] <seb_kuzminsky> was it F5, then F4, then arrow keys? I think that's what i did the other day
[20:29:43] <seb_kuzminsky> anonimasu: i use a 7i37COM for the buttons on my control panel
[20:29:52] <cradek> yeah 7i37 is nice for that
[20:30:03] <anonimasu> easy to wire?
[20:30:04] <cradek> or whatever you use for the rest of your IO
[20:30:05] <danimal_garage> i dont usually use yeystrokes to go to mdi so i probably just hit the mdi tab
[20:30:16] <anonimasu> any idea about the 7i40 servo driver?
[20:30:17] <danimal_garage> keystrokes
[20:30:22] <cradek> mine has a bunch of opto22 for IO
[20:31:15] <anonimasu> is it really nescessary to have that if you spec sensors for 5v output?
[20:31:46] <cradek> are you talking about sensors or buttons?
[20:32:09] <anonimasu> well, limit switches
[20:32:17] <anonimasu> will the 7i37com-ta do that nicely?
[20:32:32] <cradek> seb_kuzminsky: what's com?
[20:32:41] <danimal_garage> seb_kuzminsky, you are right, f4 does make it so you can jog
[20:33:16] <anonimasu> common input reference
[20:33:20] <seb_kuzminsky> cradek: that's the new version where all the inputs share a common low side
[20:33:27] <danimal_garage> i was in mdi then i hit f4 then f5 and you can do everything you can do in manual control
[20:33:27] <seb_kuzminsky> makes wiring a little more convenient
[20:33:31] <cradek> ah
[20:33:38] <seb_kuzminsky> danimal_garage: surprise!! movement!!
[20:33:41] <cradek> yes if all your sensors are the same
[20:34:01] <danimal_garage> however i'm positive i didnt hit f4 the first time it happened
[20:34:07] <seb_kuzminsky> ruh-roh
[20:34:11] <anonimasu> mhm, I think I'll go for the 7i37-ta
[20:34:13] <cradek> so far I always seem to end up with half of them needing high common and the other half low common
[20:34:17] <anonimasu> since that has output drives
[20:34:19] <danimal_garage> i've actually never seven seen that screen before
[20:34:21] <anonimasu> for some aux stuff
[20:34:39] <seb_kuzminsky> anonimasu: the 7i37com has the same outputs as the regular 7i37, iirc
[20:35:17] <anonimasu> im kindof lost as to which one is better
[20:35:54] <anonimasu> my ground will be common anyway
[20:36:34] <seb_kuzminsky> if all your inputs are high-side switched and have common ground, i think the 7i37com is more convenient to wire up
[20:36:36] <cradek> seb_kuzminsky: do you still have that crazy override limit I wired up, that you have to be behind the machine to activate?
[20:36:40] <anonimasu> even for the inductive sensors...
[20:37:01] <seb_kuzminsky> the regular 7i37 is more flexible, at the cost of having to run more wires
[20:37:09] <seb_kuzminsky> cradek: yes, it's saved me more than once :-)
[20:37:31] <seb_kuzminsky> it's good calisthenics to reach that button and hit the right jog key in axis :-)
[20:37:39] <cradek> heh
[20:37:44] <cradek> super convenient
[20:38:02] <anonimasu> I can just bridge all commons.. what I will use as well
[20:38:05] <anonimasu> on the normal one
[20:38:24] <anonimasu> is there a output like ref on it?
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[20:47:49] <mikegg> http://cgi.ebay.com/Tsugami-Model-S-25-5-Axis-CNC-Swiss-Type-Screw-Machine-/400039796685?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item5d243adfcd#ht_2698wt_1140
[20:48:10] <mikegg> no balls
[20:51:11] <andypugh> anonimasu: The 7i40 will almost certainly work with a 7i43. It has a perfectly standard Mesa-type pinout.
[20:52:37] <PCW> Yes it does work (Only a few of our daughter cards _don't_ work with EMC)
[20:52:40] <andypugh> I wire Mesa cards direct. Because I am too tight to spend money.
[20:53:02] <andypugh> Which is why I have ordered a bumch of http://uk.rs-online.com/web/search/searchBrowseAction.html?method=getProduct&R=6812874
[20:54:13] <andypugh> You can wire switched-to-0V buttons direct to the headers.
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[20:56:57] <atmega> no pullups needed on?
[20:57:53] <andypugh> There are weak ones (I think) built in. Pete would know better than me. I am just saying what I have got away with.
[20:58:02] <PCW> Pull ups are provided on the card (most cards) or the FPGA (7I43)
[20:58:08] <atmega> cool
[20:58:29] <atmega> I would have bought some, but it is 2011 in the rest of the world :)
[20:59:57] <anonimasu> really nice, that's the way im going to do it...
[21:00:37] <PCW> If you use the bare FPGA pins beware of hot plugging things or make sure you alaway have a ground between systems that you do not disconnect
[21:00:46] <PCW> always
[21:01:00] <anonimasu> tho, I dont plan on that since
[21:01:12] <anonimasu> I like screw terminals and more robust stuff
[21:01:21] <anonimasu> I already killed a 7i43 before without even using it
[21:02:14] <cradek> 7i37 is only $69
[21:02:17] <anonimasu> PCW: what card do you recommend for general purpose io? the regular 7i37 or the com one?
[21:02:30] <cradek> fpga cards are much more expensive to risk
[21:02:53] <Tom_itx> hey anonimasu
[21:03:08] <anonimasu> Tom_itx: hey!
[21:03:14] <cradek> hm $79 for screws
[21:03:19] <PCW> Weve killed a few using cell phone chargers as power supplies (Ive measured about 70V open circuit from charger ground lead to earth)
[21:03:25] <cradek> guess that is getting up there
[21:03:51] <anonimasu> this was using usb from the computer as power and it just died for some reason
[21:03:53] <PCW> If you just want 5V IO you can use a 7I42TA
[21:03:55] <cradek> weird - I assumed those chargers always gave isolation, but maybe not.
[21:04:32] <Tom_itx> anonimasu, how did you kill a 7i43?
[21:04:35] <cradek> ahh 7i42ta looks great (and cheap)
[21:04:47] <anonimasu> Tom_itx: I dont know, I think static electricity and bad luck...
[21:04:56] <PCW> well they are isolated but have considerable capacitance to the primary side
[21:05:19] <Tom_itx> anonimasu, did you get my pm?
[21:05:21] <anonimasu> or the paralell port on my pc might have been given a spike somehow
[21:05:22] <Tom_itx> last night
[21:05:34] <anonimasu> yeah I did tho I didnt have time to try it out yet
[21:05:40] <Tom_itx> np
[21:06:00] <anonimasu> I'm gonna try drawing my encoder adapters and see if I can get it working
[21:06:18] <Tom_itx> got a model or print?
[21:06:29] <anonimasu> a drawing
[21:06:30] <Tom_itx> i could mirror it here and show you a few things
[21:07:22] <anonimasu> just a pdf with dimensions
[21:07:49] <Tom_itx> couldn't be that complicated
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[21:07:52] <Tom_itx> alum?
[21:07:55] <anonimasu> let me reboot and draw it up
[21:07:56] <anonimasu> yeah
[21:08:12] <Tom_L> or upload it somewhere
[21:08:23] <anonimasu> I think it's just a few holes
[21:08:23] <Tom_L> and i can draw it as well
[21:08:47] <anonimasu> sure let me give you the pdf of the motor
[21:08:50] <Tom_L> how do you generally set your Z zero?
[21:08:58] <anonimasu> at the material top
[21:09:16] <Tom_L> i usually set it above the material but that's fine
[21:09:18] <anonimasu> for round stuff in center
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[21:09:27] <Jymmm> Tom_L: why?
[21:09:31] <Tom_L> safety
[21:10:01] <anonimasu> brb
[21:10:30] <anonimasu> rebooting
[21:12:19] <Tom_L> Jymmm, so if you tell the machine to go to Z0 you can be assured it will clear the work and any fixtures
[21:13:05] <Tom_L> i don't always do that for rapid moves, the software i use will define those separately
[21:13:49] <Tom_L> so if i'm doing a bolt hole pattern etc, i can raise it .025-.050 for speed instead of going clear to Z0
[21:16:56] <anonimasu> done
[21:17:39] <anonimasu> http://www.mclennan.co.uk/datasheets/european/dcservo/m60001504kwservomotor.pdf
[21:18:18] <Tom_L> have you set up a job plan yet?
[21:18:36] <anonimasu> no, I didnt yet
[21:19:18] <Tom_L> i can show you how to do an array too
[21:20:03] <anonimasu> I think I'll draw it up in my cad for now, and import as dxf
[21:20:10] <Tom_L> naw
[21:20:14] <Tom_L> it won't take long
[21:20:26] <anonimasu> well, let me get a drawing of the encoder
[21:20:47] <Tom_L> heds?
[21:20:53] <anonimasu> renco
[21:21:04] <anonimasu> http://www.renco.com/fileadmin/files/Productinfo/R35_655524.pdf
[21:21:23] <Tom_L> so what part do you need to make?
[21:21:47] <anonimasu> a adapter that mounts the back holes to the encoder
[21:22:03] <anonimasu> I'll draw it up really quick and give you a picture of exactly how i needs to look
[21:22:32] <Tom_L> that might give me time to finish something up here too
[21:22:44] <anonimasu> allright
[21:26:37] <Tom_L> you just need an adapter for the bolt hole pattern on the motor and encoder?
[21:28:13] <anonimasu> yes
[21:29:37] <Tom_L> which encoder?
[21:29:51] <Tom_L> C C4 or CR
[21:30:59] <anonimasu> the r35 one
[21:31:20] <anonimasu> i'll have a drawing in 5 seconds just gotta measure where the holes are at the motor since they are missing them in the drawing
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[21:36:33] <anonimasu> just checking the encoder now
[21:37:37] <andypugh> _Properly_ cool 3D printing. http://www.ted.com/talks/anthony_atala_printing_a_human_kidney.html
[21:37:43] <anonimasu> Tom_itx: done
[21:37:46] <anonimasu> making a drawing now
[21:38:17] <alex_joni> hey anonimasu, ltns
[21:38:56] <anonimasu> hey how's things?
[21:39:19] <alex_joni> pretty good
[21:39:47] <Tom_L> got a dxf?
[21:39:48] <alex_joni> having a blas with alibre lately (http://juve.ro/blog/projects/01298803577)
[21:40:59] <anonimasu> I see, im fighting ugs nx at school alot
[21:41:49] <alex_joni> siemens plm?
[21:42:44] <Tom_L> anonimasu, you drew it in metric units right?
[21:43:02] <Tom_L> i'll have to install my metric stuff here in a bit
[21:43:19] <anonimasu> http://ah.io23.net/ul/files/encoder_adapter.png
[21:43:21] <anonimasu> yeah
[21:43:57] <Tom_L> or i can draw that up real quick
[21:44:38] <anonimasu> or well, I can export it so you can help me with the toolpaths and we can look at drawing stuff another day
[21:44:52] <anonimasu> or just do /25.4 and draw in inch
[21:44:53] <Tom_L> i still need a metric job plan
[21:45:01] <Tom_L> i'm making one right now
[21:45:13] <anonimasu> allright im rebooting back to linux
[21:48:01] <anonimasu> done
[21:48:11] <anonimasu> alex_joni: nice!
[21:48:20] <alex_joni> anonimasu: thanks
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[21:53:38] <anonimasu> Tom_L: you still there?
[21:53:43] <Tom_L> yeah
[21:53:48] <Tom_L> i was doing something
[21:54:02] <anonimasu> I pm:ed the itx one
[21:54:14] <Tom_L> oh
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[22:40:42] <danimal_garage> dammit i got another positioning error out of the blue in the y axis
[22:42:17] <danimal_garage> this is getting expensive :(
[22:45:41] <skunkworks> what do you mean 'positioniing error'?
[22:46:01] <danimal_garage> it looses position
[22:46:06] <andypugh> Wierd.
[22:46:10] <danimal_garage> doesnt actually throw an error code
[22:46:16] <danimal_garage> yea
[22:46:35] <skunkworks> so - your encoder couting is getting lost?
[22:47:08] <danimal_garage> yea
[22:47:23] <andypugh> FWIW my completed machine is running without the SMI patch (it disappears every time you recompile) so gives a RTAI delay every 64 seconds. (Of course, only the first is reported) and it does not actually cause any problems.
[22:47:59] <danimal_garage> it goes resolver===>drive to convert to encoder counter===>7i37
[22:48:33] <danimal_garage> or 7i33
[22:48:58] <danimal_garage> whichever one is the daughter board for 4 servos
[22:49:03] <danimal_garage> me forgets
[22:49:18] <danimal_garage> andypugh, i don't have SMI on my machine
[22:49:50] <andypugh> No, I am just saying that the problem is likely to be unrelated to the realtime delays (it was you with that problem with a screensaver?)
[22:50:03] <danimal_garage> yea
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[22:50:11] <danimal_garage> how big were your delays?
[22:50:36] <andypugh> 300,000!
[22:51:00] <danimal_garage> thays less than half of mine
[22:51:03] <danimal_garage> thats*
[22:51:14] <skunkworks> danimal_garage: are you still getting realtime delays
[22:51:18] <danimal_garage> i get it in the neighborhood of 750k
[22:51:31] <andypugh> Is this a D510?
[22:51:39] <danimal_garage> skunkworks, havent seen one since i turned off the screensaver
[22:51:41] <danimal_garage> yes
[22:51:49] <skunkworks> thats good.
[22:51:54] <danimal_garage> yea
[22:51:55] <andypugh> Wierd, no sign of that with mine (so far)
[22:52:00] <skunkworks> how far from your drives to the 7i33?
[22:52:06] <skunkworks> is it differental or ttl?
[22:52:13] <danimal_garage> i turned the screensaver, but i leave it blank instead of the cosmos thing
[22:52:35] <danimal_garage> skunkworks, a few inches, and it's differential
[22:52:45] <skunkworks> wow
[22:52:50] <danimal_garage> i turned back on the screensaver*
[22:53:04] <skunkworks> can you compare the counts in the drive to the counts in emc?
[22:53:06] <danimal_garage> i'm using cat6 cable, sheilded and stranded
[22:53:28] <danimal_garage> i dunno
[22:53:29] <skunkworks> figure out if you are loosing between mesa and the drives or the drives and the reslovers?
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[22:53:51] <danimal_garage> i dont see how it can be the resolvers as they dont count
[22:54:05] <danimal_garage> but i have limited knowledge so anything is possible
[22:54:25] <skunkworks> how far is your position off?
[22:54:55] <skunkworks> and do you have the 7i33 set for differential?
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[22:55:40] <danimal_garage> it varies. about .100" this last time, but it continually changes. it is set to differential
[23:01:07] <skunkworks> exactly .1?
[23:01:17] <skunkworks> what is 1 rotation of your resolver?
[23:02:35] <danimal_garage> no, there's no consistent error
[23:02:42] <danimal_garage> .200"
[23:03:10] <danimal_garage> it goes off a little bit more every time i feed it
[23:05:53] <anonimasu> PCW: are you still there?
[23:06:03] <anonimasu> PCW: how well does your plasma thc work?
[23:06:13] <andypugh> danimal_garage: Resolver loose on shaft?
[23:07:00] <danimal_garage> i'll check
[23:07:18] <PCW> anonimasu: Its just a isolated noise resistant A-D that outputs frequency
[23:07:26] <andypugh> Is it always the same axis that glitches?
[23:07:33] <Tom_L> anonimasu
[23:07:55] <danimal_garage> andypugh, right now, yes, but not before
[23:08:14] <PCW> ( 2500V isolation ~1pf capacitance from input to output)
[23:08:28] <andypugh> Never discount the possibility of multiple problems...
[23:09:37] <PCW> multiple overlapping problems is often the case for hard to solve bugs
[23:11:07] <danimal_garage> swapping the drive now
[23:11:25] -!- skunkworks has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
[23:11:29] <danimal_garage> i have a spare
[23:11:52] <PCW> I would expect noise in the resolver leads to be more of an issue than the encoder leads (depending on how good the drives resolver to digital converter is)
[23:13:38] <JT-Shop> chance of snow tonight :/
[23:14:20] <Tom_L> and 70 F tomorrow
[23:15:47] <danimal_garage> PCW, i just don't see how a resolver can be off like that. i can see it being off while moving or if it's a full rev off, but not staying in the incorrect position by a random amount
[23:15:58] <danimal_garage> am i wrong on that?
[23:18:01] <PCW> Depends on how they do the resolver to incremental (quadrature) converter...
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[23:18:22] <danimal_garage> damn i have no way to set this drive up
[23:18:35] <danimal_garage> the only computer in here with a serial port died
[23:19:11] <PCW> USB-Serial
[23:19:48] <danimal_garage> think that will work?
[23:20:09] <PCW> They seem OK with our serial stuff
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[23:22:49] <JT-Shop> danimal_garage: you can get a usb-serial from rat shack
[23:23:19] <kirk_wallace> I am trying to make && make install using this Makefile: http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/uploads/Makefile , but I get a message "Makefile:24: .o/homann_modio.d: No such file or directory". I made a mistake the first time I compiled but removed all of the new files and tried again, but make seems to be remembering something from the previous make.
[23:23:40] <JT-Shop> make clean?
[23:23:55] <kirk_wallace> Okay. I'll try.
[23:24:20] <kirk_wallace> Nope, I get the same message
[23:24:26] <danimal_garage> JT-Shop, i have one but i dont have a driver for it
[23:25:18] <danimal_garage> win 7 doesnt have one in it either
[23:25:31] <danimal_garage> i dont know what brand it is
[23:26:19] <danimal_garage> yay win update found one
[23:32:57] <kirk_wallace> In the Makefile there is a my_file.d , what are .d files?
[23:35:33] <andypugh> Directories, often
[23:37:14] <kirk_wallace> I guess I could open one to see. Thanks.
[23:38:10] <kirk_wallace> Yup, directories. Now I'll check if they are correct.
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[23:43:05] <JT-Shop> danimal_garage: I had to trick win 7 to find a driver for my printer :/
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[23:49:01] <danimal_garage> i got it working
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[23:49:27] <JT-Shop> cool
[23:52:03] <danimal_garage> interesting... i turned on the overtemp monitoring and it instantly threw a motor over temp alarm
[23:52:31] <andypugh> Odd.
[23:52:41] <danimal_garage> maybe it's overheating
[23:53:02] <danimal_garage> but that doesnt explain the positioning error i guess
[23:53:07] <andypugh> No chance that one of the signal lines is accidentally wired through the thermistor? That might work OK until the motor heated up...
[23:53:53] <danimal_garage> i doubt it, they're all factory cables
[23:55:42] <danimal_garage> i'm dry running a part now
[23:55:47] <danimal_garage> we'll see how it works
[23:55:59] <danimal_garage> it's possible these motors dont have an OT sensor
[23:56:07] <PCW> An overheated motor would be stinking hot, is it to hot to touch?
[23:56:12] <danimal_garage> actually there's no wiring for one
[23:56:28] <danimal_garage> PCW, it's room temp
[23:56:41] <danimal_garage> as are the drives
[23:56:57] <danimal_garage> drives may be 1 or 2 deg warmer
[23:57:12] <PCW> You really have to push a servo system to get the motors hot
[23:57:17] <danimal_garage> yea
[23:57:26] <danimal_garage> i've never felt them get warm
[23:57:48] <danimal_garage> we'll see how it is now with the different drive
[23:58:30] <PCW> Do you have a scope?
[23:58:40] <danimal_garage> nope