#emc | Logs for 2010-11-05

[00:03:40] <theorb> theorb is now known as theorbtwo
[00:10:35] <karl1> hmm.. still missing something
[00:11:11] <Valen> how are you running it?
[00:11:38] <Valen> I don't know the emc specific details but you may need to change to the directory with the executable in it and ./foo the executable
[00:13:43] <karl1> just checked the VERSION file - shows 2.5~pre, from the terminal window, I change to the emc2-dev directory, then type . ./scripts/emc-environment
[00:32:35] <ursa> Anyone have something to say about Vexta PK266-02A 110 oz-in stepping motors?
[00:34:27] <ursa> In fact, is anyone actively listening, or is everyone just lurking?
[03:18:29] <rooks> http://www.exploit-db.com/exploits/15421/ ← hooray for windows!
[04:30:20] <elmo42> is an AC motor easier to speed&direction control then a DC motor?
[13:22:31] <ChanServ> [#emc] "This is the #emc channel - talk related to the Enhanced Machine Controller and general machining. Website: http://www.linuxcnc.org/, wiki at http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/"
[13:31:21] <atmega> I'm cutting $object out of plastic (outside cut), how do you hold something so it doesn't fly around when the final cuts break it free?
[13:32:00] <skunkworks> double sided tape? vaccumm?
[13:32:30] <atmega> tape would work, thanks
[13:33:11] <grommit> tabs?
[13:33:30] <atmega> last time I tried tabs, they left ugly spots
[13:34:02] <grommit> tabs then sanddpaper :-)
[13:34:41] <i_tarzan> psha: whats the vim comment on top of code?
[13:35:01] <grommit> psha left, will be back in a few hours
[14:41:48] <dimas> just got first movement on my router, joyness...
[14:52:59] <grommit> pictures, video? It's worth 1000 words you know...
[14:58:10] <JT-Work> that always is a joyful moment
[15:02:06] <dimas> grommit, not yet
[15:02:40] <dimas> yet too many things to do before milling
[15:03:47] <cradek> atmega: leave .010" at the bottom - don't cut all the way through. then give it a good whack to break the leftover material off and deburr it with a file
[15:04:09] <cradek> I do this with aluminum all the time - have not tried with plastic.
[15:04:48] <cradek> atmega: a few pics of a job done this way: http://timeguy.com/cradek/01280719622
[15:05:33] <Tired_2> everyone wants the aluminum dominoes
[15:05:38] <Tired_2> does anyone sell them?
[15:05:57] <cradek> Tired_2: I sold some - they don't bring enough to be worth making
[15:06:02] <Tired_2> lol
[15:06:05] <Tired_2> not on small scale
[15:06:17] <Tired_2> with something like that, you could just write another program to cut the back side off
[15:06:25] <Tired_2> cause they would be easy to hold in a vice
[15:06:37] <cradek> you underestimate me :-)
[15:06:41] <cradek> this was the prototype run
[15:06:49] <Tired_2> I'm sure it works
[15:07:04] <Tired_2> if you have a nice flat table
[15:07:22] <Tired_2> oh, nm, i didnt read the bottom of the page
[15:07:30] <Tired_2> you chamfered w/ vmill
[15:07:31] <Tired_2> nice
[15:07:51] <cradek> http://www.etsy.com/listing/55043020/aluminum-double-6-domino-set
[15:09:14] <Tired_2> is that your machine in the pics?
[15:09:22] <cradek> yes
[15:09:48] <skunkworks> cradek: those do look really nice
[15:09:55] <cradek> http://timeguy.com/cradek-files/emc/jr.jpg
[15:10:11] <Tired_2> sweet
[15:10:20] <cradek> skunkworks: thanks - but they sure don't sell at that price - was a fun experiment anyway.
[15:10:21] <Tired_2> tool changer :)
[15:10:40] <Tired_2> all that with EMC2?
[15:10:49] <cradek> yes of course!
[15:10:59] <Tired_2> are the jog handles difficult?
[15:11:00] <skunkworks> Tired_2: where have you been? ;)
[15:11:05] <Tired_2> lol, I'm new
[15:11:17] <Tired_2> just got into this to help my friend run his cnc router
[15:11:17] <cradek> jog wheels work perfectly in emc2
[15:11:18] <Connor> Kick Ass aluminum dominos.
[15:11:24] <skunkworks> cradek: have you tried ebay?
[15:11:31] <cradek> skunkworks: yes - I sold one set there
[15:11:34] <Tired_2> he wanted to use mach3, and I'm trying to stick him with emc
[15:11:47] <Tired_2> esp. when I read mach3 was based off emc code
[15:11:48] <cradek> skunkworks: they sold for around material cost (no reserve)
[15:11:56] <skunkworks> yeck
[15:12:03] <Tired_2> 6061?
[15:12:10] <cradek> 5052 because it tarnishes less
[15:12:31] <cradek> 6061 gets ugly looking pretty fast
[15:13:02] <skunkworks> Tired_2: 0.28356481481
[15:13:04] <skunkworks> heh
[15:13:17] <skunkworks> Tired_2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KplU8hkI0AQ
[15:13:42] <cradek> Tired_2: some videos of my machine doing probing, boring, tapping, etc etc.: http://www.youtube.com/user/ChrisRadek
[15:14:16] <skunkworks> Heh - I was just going to paste that
[15:14:19] <skunkworks> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eWitrmtqZ7I
[15:17:32] <Tired_2> sweet
[15:17:32] <Tired_2> thanks
[15:18:18] <Tired_2> We are hoping to add an A axis to ours
[15:18:24] <Tired_2> rotary
[15:18:52] <Tired_2> so, EMC supports measuring w/ touch probe out of the box?
[15:19:02] <Tired_2> "box"
[15:19:33] <Tired_2> ... I have a lot to learn about it still
[15:19:47] <Tired_2> I have an hour or two of playing with the live cd
[15:20:24] <Tired_2> lol, cradek, that tool changer is badass
[15:24:51] <grommit> Very cool dominos (and machine). I think you need to anodize them. Just to add to the cost, of course ;-)
[15:25:20] <Tired_2> or cut them out of tool steel
[15:25:28] <Tired_2> so they weigh about a pound each
[15:32:30] <elmo42> why not Ti?
[15:32:38] <Tired_2> hah
[15:42:02] <cradek> Tired_2: yes we have powerful probing gcodes that let you do whatever you want
[15:44:06] <cradek> Tired_2: good idea! I could spend even more hours and money on them before failing to sell them...
[15:45:30] <Tired_2> haha
[15:45:53] <Tired_2> do you run a shop?
[15:46:01] <Tired_2> i assume so w/ those machines
[15:46:06] <cradek> just my little hobby shop
[15:46:17] <Tired_2> those are nice hobby machines
[15:46:35] <Tired_2> what do you use them for other than domiones?
[15:46:42] <Tired_2> cnc almost always supports the other hobby
[15:46:50] <cradek> old machines with dead controls are cheap. emc lets anyone have good machines for a hobby shop.
[15:47:51] <Tired_2> let me show you one I am thinking about buying
[15:47:55] <Tired_2> maybe you can shed some light
[15:47:58] <Tired_2> (if you dont mind)
[15:48:02] <cradek> I'll try
[15:48:36] <Tired_2> gotta host them real fast
[15:49:55] <Tired_2> damn 3g
[15:52:06] <Tired_2> http://uweb.txstate.edu/~ej15/imag0203.jpg
[15:52:13] <Tired_2> http://uweb.txstate.edu/~ej15/imag0204.jpg
[15:52:20] <Tired_2> its an old nc tape mill
[15:52:37] <Tired_2> might go to auction within the year
[15:52:41] <Tired_2> and i could get it cheap
[15:52:52] <Tired_2> 1hp motor
[15:53:04] <Tired_2> 3 phase, which kinda sucks, but I could vfd it for 200 bucks
[15:53:28] <cradek> is it R8?
[15:53:35] <Tired_2> R8?
[15:54:08] <Tired_2> spindle type I'm guessing?
[15:54:14] <cradek> yes
[15:54:33] <Tired_2> I do not know...
[15:54:42] <Tired_2> sorry, pic sucks
[15:54:43] <cradek> pretty sure those are stepper motors - easy to retrofit, but fairly poor performance
[15:54:45] <Tired_2> i couldnt get a good one
[15:54:52] <Tired_2> they are dc servo
[15:54:59] <Tired_2> its got a long linear encoder on X and Y
[15:55:10] <Tired_2> myshumoto or whatever that brand is
[15:55:15] <Tired_2> you can see it right under the vice
[15:55:44] <Tired_2> maybe they are stepper
[15:55:45] <cradek> are you sure they are servos?
[15:56:27] <archivist> * archivist wouldnt care if the price is right :)
[15:56:32] <cradek> does it have ballscrews?
[15:56:38] <Tired_2> yes
[15:56:52] <Tired_2> kinda a lot of slop, but i've been told thats normal
[15:56:52] <cradek> is the quill motorized or is it strictly 2 axis?
[15:57:07] <cradek> how much is a lot?
[15:57:20] <Tired_2> I believe that rectangular section up top parallel with Y axis has another motor in it
[15:57:33] <Tired_2> that drives Z axis
[15:57:54] <Tired_2> the entire cabinet on the left would have to go
[15:57:58] <cradek> knee definitely isn't motorized - not sure the quill is. it kind of looks like it is not.
[15:58:17] <Tired_2> the knee is not, but the Z axis has a lot of wires going to it
[15:58:20] <Tired_2> so, something is going on
[15:58:23] <Tired_2> more than just those knobs
[15:58:32] <cradek> darn, need more pictures
[15:58:39] <Tired_2> i can get more
[15:58:45] <Tired_2> its downstairs in the building i'm in
[15:58:58] <Tired_2> but, i don't need a "get it" or not
[15:59:02] <Tired_2> just thinking on it
[15:59:03] <cradek> I see a lot of things that would make me nervous
[15:59:29] <cradek> there are lots of bridgeports out there with 2hp varispeed "rigid ram" heads and servos/encoders
[15:59:42] <Tired_2> what do you pay for them?
[15:59:42] <cradek> those are a MUCH better machine to start with
[16:00:03] <cradek> that's like asking "how long is a stick"
[16:00:12] <Tired_2> sure...
[16:00:22] <Tired_2> i could get this one for 200-500 USD I bet
[16:00:34] <Tired_2> thats probably less than the bridgeport
[16:00:43] <cradek> the big problem with these that's hard to fix is they're always worn: the top of the knee (Y) is loose in the middle, and the table (X) is worn so it travels in an arc
[16:01:00] <cradek> purchase price is irrelevant - final cost of working retrofit is what you should consider
[16:01:12] <Tired_2> true
[16:01:31] <archivist> what has it been used for
[16:01:48] <Tired_2> not sure
[16:01:50] <cradek> kind of strange that it has a rotating vise on it
[16:01:51] <Tired_2> i know the guy who knows
[16:01:55] <Tired_2> but i have not asked him yet
[16:02:10] <Tired_2> you can also turn a few other parts
[16:02:19] <Tired_2> don't know my names
[16:02:24] <Tired_2> but the head tilts back
[16:02:27] <Tired_2> (and forward)
[16:02:35] <cradek> yes, and rotates side-side
[16:02:38] <Tired_2> and the whole top part swivels left and right
[16:02:45] <Tired_2> yea, i guess thats pretty standard :P
[16:03:09] <cradek> the cnc "rigid ram" models do not do that, and it's a feature that they don't, IMO
[16:04:14] <Tired_2> it would be hard to change it much, you have to dial it all back in
[16:04:24] <cradek> yes
[16:04:41] <cradek> you never use it - but you constantly worry about whether it's still upright
[16:05:13] <Tired_2> yea
[16:05:16] <cradek> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NlzPTftDKmY
[16:05:20] <Tired_2> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0il8uEUCGtk&NR=1 < - hah
[16:05:24] <cradek> I recently helped retrofit one of these
[16:05:41] <cradek> we kept the original velocity mode servos and amps, encoders giving .0001 resolution
[16:05:56] <Tired_2> we have an old cnc bridgeport also
[16:06:05] <Tired_2> but its HUGE, and the work area is small still
[16:06:11] <cradek> the quill is twice as big around as the manual bridgeport heads like the one in your photo - and the tools are QC30 instead of R8
[16:06:14] <Tired_2> like 12" x 8" x 8"
[16:06:41] <cradek> the series 1 cnc are working area about 18x12x(knee?)
[16:06:49] <cradek> the quill moves 5"
[16:07:07] <SWPLinux> those motors have to be steppers. At 4.2V and 4.3A, they would be 18W DC servos
[16:07:16] <cradek> I would not buy an R8 machine for CNC
[16:07:20] <Tired_2> thanks SWPLinux
[16:07:25] <cradek> I would not buy a full size machine tool with stepper motors
[16:07:38] <Tired_2> all good info :)
[16:07:58] <Tired_2> I think I'll just keep my buddies up here at school
[16:08:06] <Tired_2> so when I leave I still can use our HAAS machines
[16:08:36] <cradek> it's sure nice to have a mill at home. I don't know how people get along without them.
[16:08:40] <Tired_2> and this :) : http://uweb.txstate.edu/~ej15/img_0207.jpg
[16:09:05] <Tired_2> http://uweb.txstate.edu/~ej15/img_0215.jpg
[16:10:05] <Tired_2> http://uweb.txstate.edu/~ej15/img_0539.jpg < - my engraver crapped out, but I used your method for that one
[16:10:19] <Tired_2> http://uweb.txstate.edu/~ej15/img_0545.jpg < there we go
[16:10:48] <Tired_2> http://uweb.txstate.edu/~ej15/img_0543.jpg
[16:10:51] <Tired_2> okay, I'll stop now
[16:11:09] <Tired_2> last one: http://uweb.txstate.edu/~ej15/img_0546.jpg
[16:11:49] <grommit> cradek: why would you not buy an R8 machine for cnc?
[16:12:41] <Tired_2> I gotta get to work
[16:12:43] <Tired_2> thanks for the advice
[16:13:05] <cradek> grommit: they have wimpy quills, and tool lengths are not repeatable with collets
[16:13:16] <cradek> Tired_2: welcome
[16:13:43] <cradek> you can get end mill holders for R8, but they make it even wimpier because they have to stick out
[16:13:58] <grommit> I think the tormach uses r8 iirc, is it inaccurate due to this?
[16:14:34] <cradek> no - they have a clever hack to give repeatable lengths - but every tool is held by a 3/4 x 1.25? inch straight shank, with the same stickout problem
[16:15:30] <grommit> I was just talking to a machinist friend who was showing my these toolholders have a recessed collet/nut
[16:15:53] <grommit> He was saying there is nothing you can do better for your machine then reduce the lenth of the tool/holder
[16:20:11] <grommit> check out http://brineytooling.com/pdfs/zerochuckflyer.pdf (though his holders were from Iscar)
[16:20:43] <cradek> yes you can have them awfully short with traditional cnc tapers (not R8)
[16:21:30] <kb8wmc> g'day to all
[16:21:31] <grommit> interesting...
[16:23:16] <cradek> on the other hand I have several ER40 with 6" stickout because otherwise the tools can't reach the table on my mill. they work fine (40 taper)
[16:23:44] <kb8wmc> cradek: is there a maximum number of tools, i.e. drills, that can be layered?
[16:24:18] <cradek> kb8wmc: nah
[16:25:09] <kb8wmc> rgr that...tnx, are there limits to the size of the component part to be machined?
[16:25:34] <cradek> nah
[16:25:45] <kb8wmc> ok
[16:25:50] <cradek> just whatever the autocad limits are
[16:26:36] <kb8wmc> rgr
[16:28:59] <kb8wmc> I redrew a part that I was having problems getting g-code for (same part, new drawing)...I thought there might be embedded in the old dwg something that prohibited the generation of the g-code...the new drawing will not allow generation of gcode either....
[16:29:13] <cradek> what's the error?
[16:29:58] <kb8wmc> well, when I run Realize, it gives me only a list of all the tooling...
[16:30:51] <cradek> I think that's a successful run then
[16:30:55] <kb8wmc> and it lists the v-h feed
[16:31:04] <cradek> yeah that's what it's supposed to look like
[16:31:47] <kb8wmc> dang, I iz gittin mo stoopit by da day
[16:32:49] <kb8wmc> I did'nt even check my files to see if it was there....sorry for the inconvenience
[16:33:05] <grommit> psha: how were your students?
[16:46:15] <psha> grommit: apt-get install camview-tiny
[16:46:25] <psha> it's tiny clone of camview without edit widgets
[16:46:29] <psha> embedable in axis
[16:46:59] <kb8wmc> cradek: FYI, it works like a charm...tnx for all the help
[16:47:08] <cradek> yay
[16:47:23] <psha> grommit: students are lazy as usual )
[16:47:40] <psha> for camview-tiny you first have to create chain in camview and safe it
[16:47:46] <DaViruz> http://rejsa.nu/forum/viewtopic.php?t=67719&sid=ccfcbee1b26525532bcc1e5722b120c3
[16:47:47] <psha> then pass it to tiny
[16:47:52] <DaViruz> i think i need a cnc lathe
[16:47:56] <skunkworks> I was a lazy student.
[16:48:16] <kb8wmc> all that time, I was assuming to see gcode created in the command prompt window and it never did, so I didn't check my files...
[16:50:08] <grommit> psha: I get - E: Couldn't find package camview-tiny
[16:53:37] <qq-> grommit, wget http://psha.org.ru/cgit/psha/pycamunits.git/tree/camview-tiny
[16:58:13] <micges> spam on emc-users :/
[16:58:27] <grommit> bbl
[17:02:43] <psha> grommit: apt-get update
[17:02:47] <psha> then install
[17:03:41] <cradek> micges: I put that user on 'always moderate'
[17:09:05] <psha> skunkworks: everybody was :)
[17:26:16] <qq-> grommit, nvm, use psha help ..
[17:26:30] <psha_> here )
[17:29:48] <atmega> ucs
[17:46:33] <grommit> ok, so I have installed and have /usr/bin/camview-tiny
[17:46:50] <grommit> when I run it says I must specify a chain file
[17:47:20] <psha_> run camview, create chain and save it
[17:47:51] <grommit> my camview no longer has my camera under inputs...
[17:48:32] <psha_> have you installed camunits-plunging?
[17:48:59] <grommit> all I installed was camview earlier today (and camview-tiny just now)...
[17:50:18] <grommit> I recall you had said something about a package for camunits..
[17:52:09] <grommit> I see all these packages at your web site now. Do I need to install all of them listed here? http://psha.org.ru/debian/dists/lucid/contrib/binary-i386/Packages
[17:53:12] <psha> no
[17:53:20] <psha> everything is installed by dependency
[17:53:24] <grommit> just camview-plugins?
[17:53:25] <psha> but maybe i missed some :)
[17:53:35] <grommit> or just camunits-plugins (I mean)
[17:53:59] <psha> it's in libcamunits6..
[17:54:01] <psha> strange
[17:54:54] <grommit> if I do apt-get install camunits, will I get everything?
[17:57:08] <psha_> other plugins are available?
[17:57:35] <Tche> hi for all
[17:57:48] <grommit> not that I know of...
[17:57:54] <Tche> ?
[17:57:57] <Tche> for me?
[17:58:04] <grommit> was talking to psha
[17:58:11] <grommit> hi
[17:58:14] <Tche> hi
[17:58:18] <Tche> fine?
[17:58:23] <grommit> fine.
[17:58:33] <grommit> you?
[17:58:52] <Tche> very fine
[17:58:58] <Tche> friend
[17:59:02] <grommit> glad to hear it
[17:59:05] <Tche> i have one ask for you
[17:59:07] <Tche> ok?
[17:59:15] <Tche> thanks
[17:59:49] <Tche> in the firts sory for my bad ingklish
[17:59:52] <Tche> ok
[18:00:45] <Tche> is possible wit emc align one piece with cicle g38
[18:00:46] <grommit> no need to apologize, i am sure it is better then my {insert your native language here}. :-)
[18:00:55] <Tche> ok
[18:01:01] <Tche> iam for brazil
[18:01:20] <grommit> Portuguese then
[18:01:38] <Tche> fala portugues?
[18:01:55] <grommit> not even a little :-(
[18:02:01] <Tche> a sory
[18:02:07] <Tche> :)
[18:02:22] <Tche> then..............
[18:02:41] <grommit> not sure, but perhaps someone here knows the answer...
[18:03:13] <Tche> is possible align piece automatic with cicle g38 with a probe
[18:03:34] <Tche> ?
[18:03:55] <atmega> good question.
[18:04:06] <Tche> thanks
[18:04:08] <Tche> hehehehe
[18:04:16] <Tche> is possible?
[18:04:43] <atmega> I don't know.
[18:04:47] <Tche> i made one tridemensional machine
[18:04:54] <Tche> more less
[18:05:11] <Tche> because this i nedd for thease
[18:05:19] <Tche> undestand?
[18:05:30] <atmega> It would take many probe movements wouldn't it?
[18:06:07] <Tche> please one moment
[18:06:49] <cradek> you can build a probing routine of any complexity using our G38.x gcodes
[18:07:44] <atmega> it should take either 5 or 6 probes to find the center of a circle
[18:09:18] <grommit> psha: I did apt-get install camunits, but I still have the same problem running camview (no camera input) and I get: ** (camview:4489): WARNING **: Unable to load pixbuf
[18:10:47] <Tche> then
[18:11:14] <Tche> for example
[18:11:51] <Tche> some tridimensional machines no necessary align piece for operations
[18:11:55] <Tche> undesrtad?
[18:15:31] <Tche> ?
[18:16:08] <atmega> you want to align off the center of a circle?
[18:17:26] <Tche> no
[18:17:50] <Tche> i want on peice in machine in any position
[18:18:19] <Tche> and emc make on align
[18:18:22] <Tche> undestand
[18:18:30] <Tche> like tridimensional mahine
[18:18:36] <Tche> machine
[18:20:51] <Tche> ok?
[18:22:20] <cradek> emc doesn't let you rotate a coordinate system except in XY plane
[18:22:29] <cradek> probing is not the problem, if I understand what you're asking
[18:22:40] <cradek> to give a more precise answer I'd have to know more about the exact application
[18:23:37] <Tche> very tanks
[18:23:53] <Tche> execat thease my question
[18:24:37] <Tche> sory for my bad inglesh
[18:25:01] <Tche> Then is possible rotate a coordinate system except in XY plane ?
[18:25:18] <Tche> wiht probe?
[18:25:21] <cradek> no, it is not possible except in XY plane
[18:25:33] <cradek> probing is a separate issue
[18:25:37] <cradek> you rotate with a gcode
[18:25:43] <Tche> in XY possibel , right?
[18:25:57] <cradek> yes you can rotate in XY using G10 L2 ... Rxxx
[18:26:29] <Tche> but is possble make this plane with a probe?
[18:26:46] <cradek> probing measures points and reports the results to you
[18:26:55] <cradek> what you do with them is up to you
[18:27:06] <Tche> please one moment
[18:27:08] <Tche> ok?
[18:29:19] <psha> grommit: i'm back now
[18:29:46] <psha> when i was asking about other plugins i mean tree view on left of camview
[18:29:57] <psha> is it empty or stuff like example input is there?
[18:29:58] <grommit> oh good, Ive gotten no where ;-)
[18:30:13] <grommit> yes, example is there
[18:30:17] <grommit> and other stuff
[18:30:24] <grommit> just not the camera input
[18:30:29] <Tche> like this http://www.mitutoyo.com.br/produtos/mmc/pdf/strato.pdf
[18:30:44] <grommit> by the way while you were gone I installed camunits, but it didn't help...
[18:31:40] <psha> check ldd /usr/lib/camunits/input_v4l2.so
[18:31:45] <psha> is there any missing libs?
[18:32:36] <psha> seem that it's not using any libs...
[18:32:41] <grommit> ldd /usr/lib/camunits/input_v4l2.so linux-gate.so.1 => (0x00ba3000) libc.so.6 => /lib/tls/i686/cmov/libc.so.6 (0x00497000) /lib/ld-linux.so.2 (0x002a1000)
[18:33:34] <psha> ok
[18:33:49] <psha> /dev/video0 device is present?
[18:34:46] <grommit> do I need LCM?
[18:34:52] <grommit> LC_ALL=C apt-cache policy liblcm1 liblcm1: Installed: (none) Candidate: 0.3.0-1.1~lucid Version table: 0.3.0-1.1~lucid 0 500 http://psha.org.ru/debian/ lucid/contrib Packages
[18:36:06] <psha> no, lcm is not needed
[18:36:16] <psha> it's for network streams
[18:36:42] <grommit> the camera is still plugged in, and it was working...
[18:37:32] <psha> hm... try to install libcamunits6 deb package that you'd built
[18:37:40] <psha> leave everything else
[18:37:49] <psha> only dpkg -i that one
[18:37:59] <psha> it seem that i've corrupted build...
[18:38:17] <psha> i'm on debian/testing so not able to test lucid packages directly
[18:38:20] <grommit> I removed the stuff I built yesterday, if that is what you mean
[18:38:32] <psha> pity
[18:38:42] <psha> then try to run camview with debug
[18:39:24] <grommit> there is no -d debug flag...
[18:40:26] <Tche> very tanks for all
[18:40:38] <grommit> hmm, hang on...
[18:40:51] <psha> CAM_DBG=all camview
[18:41:01] <psha> maybe there will be some errors about v4l/video0 etc
[18:41:36] <psha> sorry for abusing you but if we'll get it working all potential ubuntu users will benefit from it :)
[18:42:36] <grommit> I feel like I am abusing you!!
[18:42:40] <grommit> it is working now
[18:42:52] <grommit> I am not really sure why
[18:43:33] <psha> v4l uvc cameras are not that stable :)
[18:43:45] <psha> they may sometimes hang and don't respond to commands
[18:43:55] <grommit> I unplugged, and plugged it back in, perhaps....
[18:44:09] <psha> that's soloution fo 90% of UVC bugs :)
[18:44:18] <grommit> ok so, I am going to run camview and save the chain...
[18:44:54] <psha> yes
[18:45:00] <psha> then give it to camview-tiny
[18:45:13] <psha> it's small so it won't eat extra space in axis tab
[18:47:30] <grommit> camview-tiny ./camview-chain You must specify chain file
[18:47:40] <psha> -c
[18:47:43] <grommit> ah
[18:47:49] <psha> i feel i need to drop that flag
[18:48:05] <psha> and run gtk "open file" dialog if file is not given
[18:48:24] <grommit> ok. tiny launched. now I need to tie it to the tab in Axis....
[18:48:47] <psha> yes
[18:48:51] <psha> -w {XID}
[18:49:13] <psha> i'll roll camunits-plugins-emc now
[18:53:41] <grommit> something isn't quite right...Axis launches and when I go to that tab, I see a small black box in the upper left, let's say it is 1/2" X 1". then it goes away and becomes a tiny white spec in the upper left a few pixels square
[18:53:54] <grommit> the lights are on the camera so it looks like it is on...
[18:57:26] <psha> at least it's embedding :)
[18:58:29] <psha> may you make a screenshot?
[19:07:08] <psha> grommit: could you make a screenshot?
[19:07:40] <grommit> is there a utility for that built into ubuntu? not familiar...
[19:07:51] <psha> gnome-screenshot? )
[19:07:55] <psha> dunno
[19:07:59] <psha> i'm using scrot for that
[19:08:01] <skunkworks> hit print screen
[19:08:26] <skunkworks> if it is gnome - it should bring up the print screen dialog box.
[19:09:56] <MattyMatt_> that doesn't work for me but then neither does the ₤ key. broken nvidia driver I think
[19:10:18] <skunkworks> other wise it is in applications -> accessories.. I think
[19:12:40] <psha> skunkworks: you'd kill him! :)
[19:24:47] <grommit> something odd is going on with the camera, the machine, or both...
[19:31:41] <skunkworks> psha: oops
[19:33:21] <psha> grommit: i've started livecd and noticed same bug
[19:33:28] <psha> i'll building package with workaround
[19:33:35] <grommit> the tiny window bug?
[19:34:39] <grommit> or the camera bringing the usb bus to a halt bug!?
[19:36:50] <psha> tiny window
[19:37:35] <grommit> I am getting odd behavior now (I wasn't at all yesterday).
[19:38:03] <grommit> To test I plugged another camera in (a cheapo webcam) and ran camview
[19:38:10] <psha> grommit: package is rebuilding
[19:38:35] <grommit> when I launch camview with this other camera I get (and got yesterday as well): Warning: /dev/video0 does not support VIDIOC_CROPCAP
[19:38:39] <grommit> fine
[19:38:50] <grommit> I went back to the other camera which was working
[19:39:02] <grommit> and now when I launch camview I get the same message
[19:39:29] <grommit> Also when I run camview-tiny I see this now too!
[19:39:31] <grommit> camview-tiny -c ./camview-chain Warning: /dev/video0 does not support VIDIOC_CROPCAP ** (camview-tiny:4704): WARNING **: unit_control.c: enum [standard] value [0] is disabled Active: 1; Widget: 0x9184880; Chain: 0x947d020
[19:40:14] <grommit> I get it even with no camera plugged in...
[19:42:42] <psha> warning just tells you that this camera does not support crop
[19:43:00] <grommit> ok, it is running again now (for the moment anyway)... ugh
[19:43:52] <psha> i've added --size parameter to camview-tiny
[19:43:58] <psha> so you may request size you want
[19:44:18] <psha> for unknown reasons axis don't report actual size for window...
[19:45:18] <grommit> this is added to camview-tiny?
[19:45:22] <psha> yes
[19:45:31] <grommit> is it baked yet?
[19:45:32] <psha> apt-get update; apt-get install camview-tiny
[19:45:36] <psha> yes
[19:46:25] <psha> you may say -s 100x100 to force size of video frame to 100x100
[19:46:33] <grommit> ok
[19:46:37] <psha> on debian it's resized automaticaly
[19:46:59] <grommit> should I try it without that, or will it just fail?
[19:47:38] <psha> without size it will show you small white rectangle in the corner :)
[19:47:47] <psha> i don't know why...
[19:47:49] <psha> but have to check it
[19:48:37] <psha> what's password for ubuntu user on livedc?
[19:48:38] <psha> cd
[19:49:56] <grommit> axis is crashing...
[19:50:18] <psha> disable opengl
[19:50:30] <grommit> in the chain file?
[19:50:35] <psha> what's your video card?
[19:50:35] <psha> no
[19:50:59] <grommit> I have an intel MB with integrated video
[19:51:05] <grommit> ATOM310 I think
[19:51:40] <psha> 90% cases of crashing axis are from rtai + opengl issues
[19:52:19] <psha> one possible workaround is to install libgl1-mesa-swx11 package
[19:53:06] <grommit> but axis wasn't having a problem until just now...?
[19:53:36] <psha> it's using opengl not very extensively
[19:54:07] <grommit> so what should I try exactly?
[19:54:16] <psha> apt-get install libgl1-mesa-swx11
[19:54:28] <psha> it will install some packages and remove ubuntu-desktop
[19:54:31] <psha> it's safe
[19:54:34] <psha> it's described on wiki
[19:54:51] <psha> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?TroubleShooting#Installing_Software_based_OpenGL
[19:56:55] <grommit> ok. but no change
[19:57:01] <psha> still crashing?
[19:57:07] <grommit> yes
[19:57:10] <psha> run it from console
[19:57:13] <psha> emc file.ini
[19:58:54] <grommit> EMC2 - 2.4.5 Machine configuration directory is '/home/tom/emc2/configs/EMCO' Machine configuration file is 'EMCO.ini' Starting EMC2... No input devices could be opened. This usually indicates a misconfigured system. Please read the section 'PERMISSIONS AND UDEV' in the hal_input manpage custom.hal:5: hal_input exited without becoming ready Shutting down and cleaning up EMC2... Cleanup done EMC terminated with an error. You can
[20:00:38] <psha> something bad is somewhere else :)
[20:03:11] <grommit> camview also uses opengl doesn't it? I can see the video running camview alone...
[20:04:55] <psha> yes
[20:05:00] <psha> have you installed new camview-tiny?
[20:05:02] <psha> with -s flag?
[20:05:34] <grommit> hmm, I just commented out this whole thing and Axis won't run. Something else has happened. Hold on...
[20:09:33] <skunkworks> sticky wicket?
[20:10:37] <grommit> ok, problem was between keyboard and chair.
[20:10:42] <grommit> all fixed
[20:10:44] <grommit> and working
[20:10:53] <psha> size request is working fine?
[20:10:57] <grommit> and there was much rejoicing
[20:11:01] <grommit> rah
[20:11:06] <grommit> yes
[20:11:08] <grommit> size works
[20:11:18] <atmega> I've been half 'listening'... will this let you touch off via cam?
[20:12:00] <psha> grommit: great but i really don't understand why on debian it's resizing fine and on ubuntu - not
[20:12:07] <psha> atmega: automaticaly?
[20:12:30] <atmega> that would be nice, but it doesn't have to be auto
[20:12:43] <atmega> I can't actually think of how it woudl be auto.
[20:12:46] <psha> auto adjustment based on markers is not that easy...
[20:13:19] <psha> as for manual touching - it may be used like util for mach3
[20:13:22] <atmega> it would be cool to center on the cam image and have the cam-spindle offsets be auto-magic
[20:13:22] <psha> i think
[20:13:44] <psha> atmega: it's possible of course
[20:13:59] <psha> but i think cam mounted near spindle will suffer from vibration?
[20:14:08] <atmega> probably
[20:14:17] <psha> so you have to recalibrate it often
[20:14:17] <atmega> any common cams to avoid for linux?
[20:14:38] <psha> dunno, any v4l/v4l2/dc1394 cameras will work i think
[20:14:59] <psha> to be more preciese _any_ UVC compatible will definitely work
[20:15:02] <grommit> http://bgp.nu/~tom/pub/ss-v.png
[20:15:24] <psha> great :)
[20:15:32] <psha> now you need crosshair i think? )
[20:15:34] <atmega> auto-axis rotation via two cam-picked points woudl be cool also
[20:15:58] <grommit> Yes! That is what started this whole thing. I need crosshairs and position (from my encoders)!
[20:16:24] <psha> git clone git://psha.org.ru/psha/cu-plugins
[20:17:09] <psha> install emc2-dev libcamunits6-dev libcamunits-gtk6-dev packages
[20:17:17] <psha> cd cu-plugins
[20:17:21] <psha> make crosshair.so
[20:17:24] <psha> make halui.so
[20:17:26] <psha> halio
[20:17:56] <grommit> nitialized empty Git repository in /home/tom/cu-plugins/.git/ fatal: The remote end hung up unexpectedly
[20:18:02] <psha> sorry
[20:18:15] <psha> again
[20:18:25] <grommit> better
[20:18:29] <psha> i have git-daemon rejecting clone requests by default
[20:18:40] <psha> only on allowed repos
[20:19:44] <grommit> when you say install emc2-dev etc you mean apt-get install yes?
[20:19:50] <psha> yes
[20:22:19] <grommit> make halui.so make: *** No rule to make target `halui.so'. Stop.
[20:22:39] <psha> halio.so
[20:23:38] <grommit> I get a bunch of errors posted at pastebin...hold on a sec...
[20:24:24] <grommit> http://pastebin.ca/1983171
[20:25:40] <psha> /usr/include/emc2/
[20:25:46] <psha> add this to CFLAGS i think
[20:25:50] <psha> or...
[20:25:53] <psha> hm
[20:26:09] <psha> yes
[20:26:13] <psha> -I/usr/include/emc2
[20:26:15] <psha> in Makefile
[20:26:16] <psha> to CPPFLAGS
[20:26:24] <psha> CFLAGS
[20:26:58] <psha> build crosshair first :)
[20:27:09] <grommit> I did build crosshair
[20:27:12] <psha> then run camview with '-p path-to-this-dir'
[20:27:18] <psha> add crosshair to the chain
[20:27:37] <psha> -p means where to search for plugins
[20:27:37] <grommit> before messing with makefile?
[20:27:39] <psha> yes
[20:28:06] <psha> then use that chain with camview-tiny
[20:28:09] <psha> with -p flag again
[20:28:16] <psha> i'll have a cup of tea :)
[20:33:35] <grommit> http://bgp.nu/~tom/pub/ch.png
[20:33:45] <grommit> now to building halio..
[20:35:00] <skunkworks> awesome!
[20:36:57] <grommit> psha: added this line to Makefile: CFLAGS += -I/usr/include/emc2/
[20:37:07] <grommit> still failed, posting output
[20:37:43] <grommit> http://pastebin.ca/1983180
[20:38:52] <grommit> Isn't that water boiling yet? ;-)
[20:51:32] <grommit> I need to take off psha. I will check the archive to see if you made any suggestions on the next problem. If nothing there I will look for you next week. THANKS!
[21:03:27] <psha> grommit: you need libglut3-dev
[21:03:51] <psha> that's for archive
[21:20:23] <motioncontrol> good evening. the command m61 q1 in mdi or in ini file RS274NGC_STARTUP_CODE=M61 Q1 not fuction because ?
[21:20:29] <qq-> ot, how to find the polarity of a special 4 pin female supply on a laptop board ? , no original adapter ?
[21:21:53] <Jymmm> look up the atx specs
[21:22:12] <LawrenceG> service manual?
[21:22:22] <qq-> Jymmm, me ? its a laptop board
[21:22:34] <Jymmm> mfg?
[21:22:58] <psha> qq-: LawrenceG has good suggestion
[21:23:07] <psha> search for service manuals on the web
[21:23:18] <qq-> google , thanks
[21:23:32] <psha> sometimes thay may be found on special forums or torrents
[21:24:48] <qq-> stupid vendors , the use 4 pin for two entries
[21:25:20] <psha> one may be used for 1-wire sensor
[21:26:36] <qq-> no , they are used by 2 (2 for each pole)
[21:29:29] <psha> 4 pins is not bad compared to sata power cable :)
[21:29:59] <psha> it has 15 (_fifteen_) pins
[21:30:37] <qq-> psha, but they use 4 entries too
[21:31:03] <psha> yes, 3.3, 5, 12
[21:31:07] <psha> + gnd
[21:31:52] <psha> but it's strange for me - why it has that many pins?! more than data connector (7)
[21:33:46] <qq-> it's a 'new' technology , repartition of current on many contacts
[21:36:54] <skunkworks> logger_emc: bookmark
[21:36:54] <skunkworks> Just this once .. here's the log: http://www.linuxcnc.org/irc/irc.freenode.net:6667/emc/2010-11-05.txt
[21:39:56] <psha> qq-: great tech :) specially for molex to sata-power adapters :)
[21:40:14] <qq-> heh
[21:40:40] <psha> i understand when you have additional power pins for processor or two power connectors on tesla 'video' cards
[21:40:53] <psha> they are eating a lot
[21:43:58] <qq-> the main advantage is cable flexibility (being made by many tinyies tires) ..
[21:58:09] <psha> building in clean chroots is horribly slow... :(
[21:59:59] <Valen> debootstrap?
[22:00:20] <Valen> actually, just compiling stuff, it shouldn't be any slower than outside
[22:01:07] <srpski> srpski is now known as Dannyboy
[22:01:11] <psha> yes
[22:01:25] <psha> installing, unpacking, removing :)
[22:15:37] <gabeW85> hello?
[22:17:32] <gabeW85> hello?
[22:18:42] <micges> hi
[22:18:56] <gabeW85> i need some help
[22:19:22] <gabeW85> i keep getting an error when i try to load emc2
[22:47:53] <Jymmm> stat emc from a shell then you can see any error messages
[22:47:58] <Jymmm> start emc from a shell then you can see any error messages
[22:50:17] <psha> bb all
[23:14:52] <fenn> hmm cdco looks quite cheap
[23:19:07] <qq-> cdco ?
[23:21:13] <fenn> http://www.cdcotools.com/
[23:22:28] <qq-> thx
[23:24:47] <fenn> is r8 significantly better (more than 20% better) than 3/4" straight shank, for manual milling?
[23:25:12] <fenn> trying to decide whether to get 3/4" shank tooling because i may go with tormach system eventually
[23:31:06] <mikegg_> hey fellas, enco is running a sale on Noga indicator holders right now. I scooped up a small one for 60 bucks
[23:31:19] <mikegg_> plus theres promo codes on the internets for free shipping
[23:31:30] <mikegg_> them things are the tits if you never used one
[23:34:14] <JT-Hardinge> fenn: in my manual mill I use r8 collets on straight shank tooling except for face mills
[23:36:27] <fenn> * fenn grumbles about les watts' site being down
[23:37:12] <JT-Hardinge> I've had a Novaflex for years and love it
[23:37:47] <fenn> what is a novaflex?
[23:38:41] <fenn> tripod mount?
[23:38:45] <JT-Hardinge> an magnetic base indicator that is real sweet