#emc | Logs for 2010-08-20

[00:04:28] <theorb> theorb is now known as theorbtwo
[00:46:47] <ries_> ries_ is now known as ries
[01:34:56] <jackc> greets gentlmen - its been some time but I have my things setup again
[01:35:08] <jackc> i searched around to get the eagle scripts setup - i found this: http://git.unpy.net/view/eagle.git
[01:35:33] <jackc> but im unsure (1) where to download the actual script and (2) how to make eagle happy with it, since i recall back in the day there were a good few steps required
[01:37:29] <skunkworks> http://git.unpy.net/view?p=eagle.git;a=tree;f=ulp;h=d4fa6ba3e06a3b4e2484570e70e4c02a8543c1bd;hb=124007ad0ecbddf1e80dbb490a45e77aedeabd66
[01:37:46] <skunkworks> I think you just drop the files into the ulp directory.
[01:37:59] <skunkworks> iirc
[01:38:16] <skunkworks> are you running linux or windows for eagle?
[01:38:21] <ries> skunkworks: that's correct.. I have done it once, and it was very simple
[01:39:37] <skunkworks> also - if you try to use it on windows - I think you have to tweek it. (never tried to fix it but I remember it not finding a directory)
[01:40:01] <skunkworks> ries: thanks - I used it quite a bit and it works great
[01:40:51] <jackc> both
[01:40:58] <jackc> will try, thanks
[02:17:04] <eztam> hi
[02:24:14] <spasticteapot> I'm with a hackerspace that wants a 3-axis mill and hasn't got much cash.
[02:25:06] <eztam> get a proxxon mf70
[02:25:08] <eztam> hehe
[02:25:21] <spasticteapot> ????
[02:25:22] <eztam> 1000euros
[02:25:30] <eztam> 3 axis mill
[02:25:35] <eztam> cnc
[02:25:54] <spasticteapot> Link plz?
[02:26:02] <eztam> ok
[02:26:05] <eztam> wait
[02:27:01] <eztam> http://www.usovo.de/shop/product_info.php?info=p261_Proxxon-MF70-CNC-2008.html
[02:27:17] <eztam> thats my mill
[02:27:26] <spasticteapot> Too small.
[02:27:29] <spasticteapot> Waaaay too small.
[02:27:36] <spasticteapot> We're thinking "bridgeport sized. :D
[02:27:42] <eztam> hehe
[02:27:43] <eztam> ok
[02:28:49] <spasticteapot> Actually, I was wondering if anyone here knew a place I could look for a secondhand commercial mill.
[02:29:06] <Valen> ebay?
[02:29:10] <spasticteapot> I'm told that if your'e willing to make some sactifices in precision, it's not too expensive to convert an old 3-axis mill to EMC and replace the screws.
[02:29:15] <eztam> why not
[02:31:46] <Valen> no real sacrifice
[02:31:55] <Valen> you will probably wind up with a better machine for the $
[02:32:06] <Valen> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?JakeAndRussells
[02:32:17] <Valen> though do NOT get that mill as your base lol
[02:39:00] <spasticteapot> Valen: Think bigger. :D
[02:39:02] <ichudov> I have a computer with Licid Lynx and EMC2 all ready to go to replace 8.04. Would you say that it is a straight drop in replacement? All configs work etc?
[02:39:19] <ichudov> This computer has a SSD and boots in 3 seconds
[02:39:35] <spasticteapot> A lot of businesses in Milwaukee used 'em, and now they're a dime a dozen.
[02:39:55] <rooks> ichudov, i think i seen readymade livecd link with 10.4 + emc
[02:40:38] <ichudov> Well, I already have a PC built and ready to go
[02:40:56] <rooks> ichudov, i did, i did seen a readymade livecd link wiht 10.4 + emc :P http://linuxcnc.org/mozmck/
[02:41:49] <ichudov> Anyway, back to my question, all configs etc can stay the same, right?
[02:42:42] <ichudov> I mean EMC configs
[02:44:06] <rooks> thats the usual way of things with linux that you just copy etc from system to system and it works, tho no idea on how it plays with other parts of system, im quite fresh to emc
[02:45:12] <ichudov> Well, this is a EMC specific question. I have Lucid running on a bunch of other desktops and servers. But I have not migrated EMC to Lucid
[02:52:55] <mozmck> ichudov: there are some differences in configuration between emc 2.3 and emc 2.4 I believe, and the lucid packages are 2.4
[02:54:57] <mozmck> so if you are using emc 2.4 on hardy the configs will be the same for emc 2.4 on lucid.
[02:54:58] <ichudov> I have 2.4.3 on the old Ubuntu Hardy as well.
[02:55:37] <mozmck> good. You can just copy the configs over and go.
[02:55:54] <ichudov> Yes, the versions are: 2.4.3 on Hardy and on Lucid, per apt-cache policy
[02:56:10] <ichudov> I have all configs in CVS
[02:57:44] <ichudov> So, for those who run 10.04, has your EMC been misbehaving lately?
[02:59:23] <cradek> no, it's perfect
[02:59:40] <cradek> I run git master packages from buildbot
[03:00:15] <ichudov> Great. My new EMC PC, unlike the old one, is very small and will fit into the cabinet. It has dual core CPU and each core runs 5 times faster.
[03:01:24] <ichudov> I may move it over tonight.
[03:02:40] <cradek> neato
[03:03:18] <ichudov> Today, I also added servo inhibit when EMC is in following error or just disabled with F2. So no movement occurs after following error
[03:03:48] <ichudov> L84supper: did you bid on that NASA mill
[03:43:34] <L84Supper> ichudov: I went with some other machines, spindles and bearings instead. I'm really tired of crappy old controllers.
[04:02:33] <ichudov> I see
[04:02:47] <ichudov> I Never had a chance to use a crappy old controller. ;-)
[04:05:36] <L84Supper> for what that sold for I got some air bearing spindles and a 40k rpm motor plus some linear motor positioners
[04:09:07] <L84Supper> it's sad how many "as is" auctions there are with no part numbers or "untested since we're too unskilled" :)
[04:17:04] <ichudov> and how many of those are "we tested it and it did not work, so we say it is untested"
[04:17:38] <L84Supper> heh.... and we also sell bridges
[04:20:50] <L84Supper> have they all turned into used car sales lots?
[04:24:37] <L84Supper> nothing like a few micron accuracy stage with the description "Assembly is tight, no perceptible slop." (as seen by the naked eye.... closed)
[04:45:35] <alex_chally> ichudov, I have used a looot of crappy old controllers
[04:45:41] <alex_chally> they are not as bad as you might think
[04:45:49] <alex_chally> it is mostly just a verrrry steep learning curve
[04:45:58] <alex_chally> and old networking
[04:46:01] <alex_chally> and slow transfers
[04:46:07] <alex_chally> and burnt in crts...
[04:46:08] <alex_chally> shit, it sucks
[04:47:23] <ichudov> reading this frmo a new CNC pc installed on the mill. Starting EMC2 is next.
[04:48:31] <ichudov> mill is moving with a new PC :):)
[04:49:14] <ichudov> I get following errors on Z
[04:50:18] <L84Supper> I've thrown out better controllers than what some of these machines have
[04:53:24] <alex_chally> anyone have a nice pulse generator lying around they wanna give me?
[04:53:26] <alex_chally> :D
[04:53:38] <alex_chally> i am poor and iwant a pendant that is rawesome
[04:56:19] <L84Supper> how many gigawatt's do you need?
[05:04:16] <alex_chally> L84Supper, over 9000
[05:09:14] <ries_> ries_ is now known as ries
[05:30:34] <L84Supper> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=250676113169&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT odd to see the modern DRO on this relic from the 50's
[05:33:35] <L84Supper> is there any interest here in having the Arch Linux Howto for EMC2 updated or should we add Ubuntu 10.10 support on 3rd party site?
[06:28:19] <IchGuckLive> good morning from germany
[06:29:43] <IchGuckLive> the wether here is so nice we expect 30degC today
[06:34:26] <alex_chally> !conv 30c to f
[06:34:36] <alex_chally> oh, shit, i always forget this channel does not have a really nice bot..
[06:35:03] <alex_chally> IchGuckLive, it has been like that for the last 2 months here.
[06:35:22] <alex_chally> on the other hand starting september there are about 9 months of solid rain...
[06:38:39] <IchGuckLive> Moscow did also have it like this for weks
[06:39:39] <IchGuckLive> 86F
[06:43:12] <dimas> IchGuckLive, now it's rainy around moscow and cold
[06:49:38] <IchGuckLive> this is good for the fire
[06:51:40] <dimas> yeah, even without fire it was smoggy and nervous
[07:14:04] <L84Supper> was thinking about making a CNC stapler out of this http://cgi.ebay.com/Heavy-Duty-Precision-Linear-Slide-Stage-w-Servo-Motor-/150476588446?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0
[10:19:43] <MattyMatt> L84Supper: do you run a print shop?
[10:27:47] <MattyMatt> that'd make a nifty cross-slide too. 2 tools no turret
[11:57:00] <jthornton> * jthornton studies submultiples of the second
[13:19:59] <Jymmm> Morning
[13:20:27] <skunkworks> Good morning
[13:21:37] <Jymmm> So, how are we this morning?
[13:22:12] <skunkworks> I have 2 - 2M x32 sims and 2 - 2M x36 simms (say 8MB on the sticker)
[13:22:41] <skunkworks> (I thought I had more but we must have gotten rid of them a long time ago.)
[13:23:32] <Jymmm> skunkworks: Cool, what would you like for them?
[13:23:38] <skunkworks> you can have them
[13:23:53] <Jymmm> Awwwwww
[13:23:58] <skunkworks> what is your address? I will put them in a box and send them.
[13:24:09] <skunkworks> no warrantee ;)
[13:38:58] <skunkworks> so - I think I should be tuning an axis this weekend. I am excited@
[13:38:59] <skunkworks> !
[13:39:24] <JT-Work> sweet!
[13:39:37] <skunkworks> only moving a few ton around ;)
[13:39:44] <Jymmm> skunkworks: Cool, Your Panduit Axis Turner must have arrived, huh?
[13:39:49] <skunkworks> heh
[13:40:38] <skunkworks> only one of the tachs on the servos where bad - and we don't have one of the axis's servos mounted anyways.
[13:40:57] <JT-Work> I have to clear out a temporary spot for the mill before it arrives next week
[13:41:10] <skunkworks> oooh - what did you get?'
[13:41:25] <Jymmm> JT-Work: Temporary? (famous last words)
[13:41:35] <JT-Work> a small Bridgeport VMC with 8 tool changer
[13:41:59] <skunkworks> neat - do you have a picture?
[13:42:02] <JT-Work> 7.5hp 60-6000 r[,
[13:42:05] <JT-Work> rpm
[13:42:25] <skunkworks> home keys!
[13:42:45] <Jymmm> JT-Work: Nice RPM range, you should be able to mill some balsa wood with that =)
[13:43:30] <JT-Work> www.ginpsel.com/Bridgeport/bridgeport-pics.htm should work
[13:44:00] <JT-Work> if I could spell gnipsel right it would work
[13:44:27] <JT-Work> www.gnipsel.com/Bridgeport/bridgeport-pics.htm should work
[13:45:17] <Jymmm> OH a cnc center, nice
[13:45:38] <Jymmm> It even has a sky light!
[13:45:45] <skunkworks> oh - neat!
[13:46:14] <skunkworks> I was envisioning a older bridgeport knee mill with those tool changers from hell.
[13:47:13] <Jymmm> JT-Work: Toss some wheels and a gps on that thing and it could move itself!
[13:47:18] <skunkworks> JT-Work: the link on your home page to cnc machines is broken
[13:48:36] <JT-Work> not really broken but I've never put a link in there yet :)
[13:49:15] <JT-Work> I have a BP series 1 with QS200 spindle but I'm the tool changer for it
[13:49:25] <skunkworks> heh
[13:50:04] <JT-Work> it's been real good but the lack of Z sucks and the saddle is a bit worn so facing off long parts is better done on my manual mill
[13:50:06] <skunkworks> I think 90% of the jobs we did on the K&T we where the tool changers.
[13:50:13] <JT-Work> Z range I mean
[13:51:03] <JT-Work> * JT-Work goes back to paying bills and making out invoices
[14:01:39] <pingufan> Is it allowed to drive input pins of a parallel port high when the PC is switched off?
[14:02:33] <Jymmm> pingufan: Why are you asking?
[14:03:57] <pingufan> I use ISO7220 chips (TI). They do a 100% potential separatioon but are no open collector types. They have relatively much force 15mA
[14:05:11] <pingufan> In my mill, I use a DC-DC converter to supply +5V to it on the PC side, so when I switch on the mill, it sends out a "H" level as no end position switch is ressed.
[14:05:52] <pingufan> If this is not good, I can insert a diode so it does only pulldown.
[14:07:27] <Jymmm> Well, If the pc is turned on and comes to a full boot before turning on the mill, I wouldn't think it would be an issue.
[14:08:10] <pingufan> That is clear. But I don't want to burn my PC because I accidently turn on the mill first...
[14:08:29] <Jymmm> Usually, you want to make sure the PC isn't sending out funky signals TO the mill and do weird things.
[14:08:39] <Jymmm> during the boot process.
[14:09:08] <Jymmm> Is it only to the paraport INPUT, or to the OUTPUTS too?
[14:10:37] <Jymmm> You could toss in some opto-isolators I suppose.
[14:14:53] <pingufan> No. Direction is clear. This chips have only one direction. The outputs from PC are going to the inputs of this isolator chips, so this cannot hurt something (or at least not the PC). I make more care on the PC.
[14:15:43] <pingufan> If the mill does some funky steps when the PC starts does not really matter.
[14:18:29] <Jymmm> Sounds reaosnable to me, but maybe wiati till others show up and ask them too.
[14:19:04] <pingufan> How is your breakout-Board made?
[14:19:43] <bricofoy> if the motor does some unwanted steps, does'nt matter, ok, but if your sindle or coolant starts, this can be dangerous/desastrous
[14:21:08] <pingufan> I have no coolant, and when the spindle starts for a moment, I also do not care. NORMALLY I switch on the PC first. I only dont want to risk that the PC gets damaged when accidentally the mill is switched on first.
[14:22:31] <bricofoy> you could use a charge-pump to switch on the power for your ISO7220 chips, this way you've no risk of burning the parport, and no risk of anything moving/starting in an unwanted way
[14:22:38] <pingufan> You must know, this is a very little mill
[14:23:29] <pingufan> I am close to change to a handfull of opto-couplers...
[14:23:29] <pcw_home> Or gate the inputs to your isolator (force low if no charge pump)
[14:23:33] <bricofoy> you can make a very simple charge-pump circuit with just a capacitor, a resistor and a transistor
[14:23:53] <bricofoy> and use it to enable the buffer chips
[14:24:20] <bricofoy> I think this is the better way to do
[14:24:44] <bricofoy> using optocouplers only solve one part of the problem.
[14:27:35] <pingufan> Well, my mill has now 3 gecko drives inside. (G251, one for each axis). Each drive needs two signals, step and dir, plus one line for turning on the spindle. Results in total in 7 couplers into the mill plus 2 couplers (home switches + tool-sensor) out of the mill. This is currently done with this isolator ICs, but they can do pullup and pulldown.
[14:27:38] <pcw_home> Power the PC side of the isolator from PC power...
[14:28:25] <pcw_home> That would have better noise isolation as well
[14:28:53] <pingufan> This is possible, when I use an additional USB cable and was my first idea. But doesn't USB also have permanently +5V when the PC is off?
[14:30:04] <pcw_home> Good question Not on my PCs but maybe some with keyboard start
[14:30:27] <Jymmm> pcw_home: I bet it is
[14:30:49] <Jymmm> Many use the kybd/ouse to pull form standby and sych
[14:30:52] <Jymmm> such
[14:30:55] <pingufan> I think I will simply insert a diode. So only pulldown is working, but not pullup.
[14:31:54] <pcw_home> Probably off unless the data pins are tweaked so USB power shouls be OK
[14:32:51] <pingufan> Do parallel port inputs have an internal pullup resistor inside the PC?
[14:36:15] <pcw_home> I would not count on it
[14:36:17] <pcw_home> On the other hand parallel printers have been connected to PC parallel ports for eons and are often powered on before the PC
[14:36:19] <pcw_home> I doubt it really a problem, maybe parallel ports have some other ESD protection than a DIODE clamp to VCC
[14:37:57] <pingufan> Old computers (standard parallel port) had a lot of pullup resistors inside, supplied by the PC, and the printer(s) had opencollector outputs to the printer. So this was clear. I will use a diode, then nothing can happen.
[14:38:15] <pcw_home> IF you are worried , maybe a 300 Ohm or so series resistor would be simpler (and drives both ways)
[14:39:00] <pingufan> It is a nightmare that current computers are not well-documented any more. :(
[14:39:33] <pcw_home> no tech-ref with add-on card schematics,,,
[14:39:59] <pingufan> Yes.
[14:40:25] <pcw_home> (or steal power for a disk connector, maybe with a PTC)
[14:40:28] <mozmck_work> some (many?) newer computer parallel ports only have 3.3v and some only 1.8 as well.
[14:40:32] <pingufan> And as I use the onboard parallel port, it is not funny to blow the all-in-one chip on the mainboard...
[14:41:11] <pingufan> Ok, so I surely will use diodes, then nothing can happen at all.
[14:42:58] <pcw_home> except you lose some noise immunity and depend on the ports pullups (or need to add some)
[14:43:37] <pingufan> well, if the port has no pullups, it doesn't follow the old standard at all. :/
[14:45:06] <pcw_home> easy enough to verify
[14:46:24] <pingufan> But even if not, I wouldn't know where to get the voltage for pullup then correctly. -- Anyway, I will think about that over this weekend and not hurry and damage hereby something.
[14:46:54] <pingufan> Bye.
[14:47:14] <pcw_home> just use a voltmeter on the pin with the PC on then tie to ground with a 1K or so resistor
[14:47:16] <pcw_home> measure with resistor to ground and you can calculate the pullup
[14:50:19] <IchGuckLive> hi all
[14:52:56] <bricofoy> hi
[14:53:18] <mozmck_work> guten tag!
[14:53:29] <IchGuckLive> B)
[14:53:52] <mozmck_work> oder abends...
[14:54:04] <IchGuckLive> im searching for a variable to be named value is grid_symetric or Grid_line_count ?
[14:54:21] <IchGuckLive> its 17:00 here 5pm
[14:54:50] <mozmck_work> ah, thought that might be. 10am here
[14:55:35] <IchGuckLive> anyone a idee to name it in english better
[14:56:01] <IchGuckLive> grid_style
[14:56:21] <mozmck_work> grid_spacing?
[14:57:07] <IchGuckLive> this i think better to the value
[14:57:13] <mozmck_work> what will the variable do?
[14:57:50] <IchGuckLive> change from symetric xY to linees by number in x,y
[14:59:04] <mozmck_work> hmm, so it is a boolean? grid_symmetric may be better.
[15:09:20] <GoSebGo> I got myself all confused with cutter comp in mdi mode last night...
[15:11:53] <GoSebGo> I said g41 g1 x.. y.. and got no motion,
[15:12:48] <GoSebGo> Then g40 gave me an error and no motion, but after that g0 and g1 both worked as expected
[15:13:14] <GoSebGo> Is there some limitation on cutter comp in mdi?
[15:14:00] <IchGuckLive> G41 D?
[15:14:24] <IchGuckLive> the toolofset register!
[15:14:43] <IchGuckLive> is there a number in the tooltable?
[15:14:50] <GoSebGo> No D needed, had a tool loaded with a defined diameter
[15:15:27] <IchGuckLive> you ned to put T1 D1 into the programm
[15:16:04] <GoSebGo> I put m6 t..
[15:16:37] <IchGuckLive> keep the right word style T S D M
[15:18:00] <IchGuckLive> look into comp.ngc
[15:19:21] <IchGuckLive> and put in the first preamble the G40
[15:21:02] <seb_kuzminsky> cutter comp works great for me when I'm in auto mode, running a program
[15:21:15] <seb_kuzminsky> i just dont know how to use it from mdi, it seems to behave differently
[15:25:45] <micges_work> I think that cutter comp isn't fully prepared to be used in mdi
[15:26:26] <micges_work> with cradek we should debug your case and fix it if it's wrong
[15:27:57] <micges_work> (I might be wrong of course
[15:32:26] <IchGuckLive> where mankind is working there are faults
[16:31:26] <IchGuckLive> Jymmm: ?
[16:31:27] <maximilian_h> somebody here who can take a small patch ?
[16:34:24] <Jymmm> IchGuckLive: ?
[16:35:30] <IchGuckLive> for the grid python do we need a seperate stepover for including parallel to outline moves so we can generate both with diferent stepovers
[16:36:32] <IchGuckLive> parallel moves makes a target out of the grid
[16:37:37] <IchGuckLive> i shoudt include soomthing like dartboard or spider shape to
[16:41:08] <IchGuckLive> All Folks out there do you think this is to mutch ->http://foengarage.de/banner.jpg
[16:41:37] <IchGuckLive> this is 3x1meter 120Inch width
[16:42:31] <L84Supper> MattyMatt: no, but we do printer R&D in addition to materials science + ME and EE stuff
[16:56:41] <IchGuckLive> ok till tomorrow by<
[18:39:10] <Jymmm> When they make small diameter wooden dowels, how to they cut them with such nicely finished ends in bulk?
[18:44:20] <pingufan> Hi. cradek, are you here?
[18:46:00] <pingufan> Has somebody here the internal schematic of a parallel port? I need to know if (and which) input lines of a parallel port have internal pullup resistors in the computer.
[18:46:41] <JT-Work> that would depend on the design of the parallel port I assume
[18:46:57] <Jymmm> and mfg I would suspect.
[18:47:11] <Jymmm> especially since some laptops use 3.3v
[18:47:16] <pingufan> I am afraid that I damage the parallel port when I assign +5v to it while the PC is off.
[18:48:08] <pingufan> So I want to return signal through optocouplers ( = open collector, only pulldown).
[18:49:47] <pingufan> I could kick me by myself, I threw away all this old hardware manuals where all this was precisely documented.
[18:51:04] <pingufan> Can someone show me a usual schematic of a breakout board, please?
[18:52:14] <JT-Work> what are you looking for?
[18:52:26] <JT-Work> what pins are in and what pins are out?
[18:53:25] <JT-Work> or something else???
[18:54:25] <JT-Work> take a look at cnc4pc web site
[18:56:05] <alex_chally> pingufan, you might find something like this is cheaper and easier then making it yourself: http://www.cnc4pc.com/Store/osc/product_info.php?cPath=33&products_id=245
[18:56:51] <pingufan> Kidding?
[18:56:53] <alex_chally> I have one of their C11g boards, and it is quite nice. variable 10v analogue out for my vfd, optoisolators for everything, a safety charge pump
[18:57:29] <alex_chally> and having leds on all the outs makes troubleshooting connections a breeze
[18:57:39] <pingufan> All I need is a documentation of a interface.
[18:58:06] <JT-Work> google
[18:58:31] <Guest834> anyone have info for StepConf when using a HY-TB4DV-M board?
[18:58:31] <alex_chally> pingufan, http://warmcat.com/parallel/
[18:58:38] <alex_chally> not sure if that has what you want
[19:00:05] <Guest834> Can anyone here help me out with config settings using a 6560 ebay board?
[19:00:36] <alex_chally> Guest834, link to datasheet plz
[19:01:03] <pingufan> almost, yes. This is the pinout. I remember that the parallel port has some resistors on its inputs, but I am not sure if this is the case for all inputs.
[19:02:04] <alex_chally> pingufan, I think all the paraport pins have a common ground, so can't you just multimeter between each pin and ground?
[19:02:42] <pingufan> That's an idea. Why didn't I get that by myself. ;)
[19:03:16] <Guest834> http://www.marcmart.com/TB6560_3Axis_Driver.doc
[19:03:20] <alex_chally> pingufan, my first inclination was to look for documentation too, I don't blame you
[19:03:30] <alex_chally> .doc? laem...
[19:03:34] <L84Supper> is there any interest here in having the Arch Linux Howto for EMC2 updated or should we add Ubuntu 10.10 support on 3rd party site?
[19:04:04] <Guest834> yeah..sorry
[19:04:17] <alex_chally> Guest834, no prob, just giving you shit
[19:04:22] <pingufan> I wonder where I could find schematics of breakout boards. That would make things clearer, too.
[19:04:55] <alex_chally> Guest834, what have you done so far?
[19:05:44] <Guest834> I have all the pin setting ok. I just need the timing part. The motors spin, but anything faster than a few RPM and they halt and get REALLY hot. they also have no torque to them.
[19:06:27] <alex_chally> Guest834, really hot, as in can't touch them? or really hot as in letting out smoke?
[19:06:38] <Guest834> that later
[19:06:40] <alex_chally> do they make a sound when they are not being commanded to move?
[19:06:42] <Guest834> *the
[19:06:48] <Guest834> no sound.
[19:06:55] <Guest834> they seem fine when not commanded
[19:07:27] <Guest834> the board has step indicator lights when sent steps... they are off when they are supposed to, and on when given a command
[19:08:02] <alex_chally> Guest834, silly question, you are providing 12-36v and less then ~3A, correct?
[19:08:23] <Guest834> this is using one of the drop down (gecko) driver board settings, then setting the correct pins. yes to correct voltage.
[19:08:59] <alex_chally> Guest834, there was someone else who we recently helped out with that same board, but I can't for the life of me remember who it was...
[19:09:37] <Guest834> i think mattymatt knows about it... found this irc chat log from a few months back with him asking about making a config for it
[19:09:40] <Guest834> \but no other info
[19:09:55] <alex_chally> Guest834, they are connected with no load, correct?
[19:10:04] <Guest834> correct
[19:10:04] <alex_chally> not connected to screws, just being bench tested?
[19:10:12] <Guest834> correct
[19:10:22] <Guest834> tape on them to see movment
[19:10:40] <alex_chally> and they go in the correct direction/will change directions when commanded?
[19:10:47] <Guest834> yes.
[19:11:26] <Guest834> they operate correctly at minimal speeds. if i set the jog speed to anything above ~10ipm they LOCK
[19:12:53] <alex_chally> Guest834, when you set it alow IPM, is it actually turning the correct number of revolutions per movement you give it? That is, are all of your gear ratios set correctly in EMC?
[19:13:39] <alex_chally> for example, if you had 5tpi screws and you tell the motor to run 1", it should make 5 revs
[19:14:45] <Guest834> good question. this is part of the "i dont know" that i need to figure out how to set
[19:14:55] <Guest834> http://fozztexx.com/CNC/HY-TB3DV-M_3Axis_Driver.pdf another doc, same board but 3 axis
[19:15:06] <Guest834> shows mach 3 setting
[19:15:50] <Guest834> need to translate that 35000kh setting into where i put that into stepconf
[19:17:18] <alex_chally> Guest834, hmm, it is not quite that simple... the analogus setting for EMC is base_period, but I am not sure that is causing your problem
[19:17:25] <alex_chally> although itis something that has to be set correctly
[19:17:59] <alex_chally> Guest834, here is actually a really good irc log for understanding base_period.. http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/emcinfo.pl?PulseRates
[19:19:19] <alex_chally> Guest834, not going to solve your current problem, but at least it will make emc make a little more sense
[19:20:08] <Guest834> ok..bookmarked
[19:21:02] <Guest834> is that the "step waveform timings" ?
[19:21:17] <alex_chally> how many RPMish are they running when they lock? too fast to count?
[19:21:49] <Guest834> about 2-5 revolutions then stop
[19:21:57] <Guest834> maybe not even that
[19:22:04] <Guest834> not in front of them atm
[19:22:39] <Guest834> actualy, now that i think about it.. they dont even make a full revolution
[19:22:40] <alex_chally> Guest834, are you just jogging the axis in EMC?
[19:22:42] <Guest834> when running fast
[19:22:46] <Guest834> yes
[19:23:08] <alex_chally> and you have messed around with changing the movement speed?
[19:23:12] <alex_chally> the little sliders
[19:23:52] <Guest834> yes, thats how i get them to spin.. i have to set it VERY low
[19:24:36] <Guest834> even still, when they spin slowly, there is no torq. to them.. i can stop the motor with my hand
[19:27:08] <alex_chally> Guest834, this sounds like a wiring problem, but I am not sure where. You said it will go not even an entire rev and then stop. is that true for all speeds, or just the fast ones?>
[19:27:30] <Guest834> just fast
[19:28:02] <alex_chally> and what kind of PSU are you using?
[19:28:11] <Jymmm> http://use-enco.com down for anyone else?
[19:28:12] <Guest834> is there a "standard" color coding for a stepper with RGYB wires?
[19:28:24] <Jymmm> Guest834: no
[19:28:28] <alex_chally> Guest834, the only way to be sure is to take a meter to it
[19:28:29] <Guest834> PSU on the computer?
[19:28:45] <Guest834> or into driver boarD?
[19:28:48] <alex_chally> Guest834, PSU hooked up to the driver board
[19:29:14] <Guest834> i think its a 18v 10A or something
[19:29:47] <alex_chally> 10A? you might be hitting the overcurrent protection on the board
[19:30:10] <alex_chally> oh, it is 3A/channel
[19:30:13] <alex_chally> so probably not
[19:30:53] <alex_chally> Guest834, you have the current setting turned all the way up on your driver board, rigt?
[19:31:58] <Jymmm> Guest834: http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/emcinfo.pl?StepMotorWireIdentification
[19:32:37] <Jymmm> Guest834: read it in full first, then do it again =)
[19:33:28] <Guest834> Yes
[19:33:49] <NTU> hey guys! I'm updating the archlinux wiki and making an ubuntu 10.10 package for emc.. :)
[19:33:59] <NTU> archlinux emc wiki
[19:35:34] <Guest834> is there a 4 wire wiki?
[19:35:44] <NTU> rtai 3.8 came out so I figured I'd teach others how to get emc + RTAI on the latest kernels when using the stock archlinux kernel. Arch is usually ahead of the pack compared to Ubuntu, since its rolling. :) As much as I hate ubuntu, I'd doing work for that as well.. :) I hope it will be useful to others!
[19:35:50] <Jymmm> Guest834: read it in full first, then do it again =)
[19:36:06] <pingufan> Guest834: Do you have a multimeter available?
[19:36:52] <alex_chally> Guest834, with 4 wires you should have two coils
[19:38:03] <pingufan> Simply measure the resistance. between any wires (all combinations. You'll find two pairs having resistance, This is a winding.
[19:38:22] <Guest834> "Eight wire motors:" is the 3rd line... no mention of 4 wire
[19:38:55] <Guest834> do the coils change if you have the wires from the same coil backwards?
[19:39:07] <pingufan> Guest834: How many wires has your stepper?
[19:39:10] <Guest834> 4
[19:39:14] <skunkworks> for a 4 wire stepper - all you really have to do is short 2 wires together - if the stepper is harder to turn - that is one pair. if not - keep shorting any pair out until you find a pair that makes it harder to turn.
[19:39:33] <pingufan> Then it is easy. Two coils, each has two ends.
[19:39:58] <pingufan> Do you have a multimeter?
[19:40:11] <Guest834> ok.. i know that part, thank you. however, if wire 1 and wire 2 make coil 1... does it matter if i put wire 1 in A+ or A- ?
[19:40:22] <skunkworks> no
[19:40:26] <Guest834> ok good.
[19:40:28] <alex_chally> skunkworks, that is clever, I had never thought of using the coils to create backemf so you can test...
[19:40:31] <skunkworks> it just changes the motor rotation
[19:40:57] <pingufan> Simply connect the two coils. If the stepper runs then in wrong direction, swap wires of ONE coil.
[19:42:29] <Guest834> ok.. so i managed to reverse the coils it wouldnt spin at all? if one coil was backwards, it would spin the wrong direction.
[19:42:36] <pingufan> Must reboot, upgraded my kernel... brb.
[19:53:03] <Guest834> one more question... when configuring axis.. I have 2 motors on my X. how do I mirror the X ?
[19:53:45] <pingufan> ?
[19:54:44] <pingufan> What do you mean? Two motors on X? Mirror?
[19:55:26] <Guest834> X has 2 supported rails, with 1 leadscrew on each rail
[19:55:52] <Guest834> how do i sync both motors
[19:56:11] <pingufan> And they are not mechanically coupled? Oh god...
[19:56:24] <Guest834> :|
[19:56:56] <pingufan> If one motor looses a few steps (by accident), everything will go hard and harder!
[19:57:25] <pingufan> What's the distance between the rails?
[19:57:35] <Guest834> I can deal with that later. its not like im the first person to do it this way
[19:58:58] <Guest834> ok, back to the real question. Is there a way to set that while using the stepconf?
[19:58:58] <pingufan> I would connect the windings A1 and B1 in series, same with A2+B2. A=Motor A, B=Motor B
[19:59:29] <Guest834> I have a 4 axis board. why would i do it that way?
[20:00:44] <pingufan> You can use then one drive for every motor and connect the control lines to both of them?
[20:01:42] <pingufan> If one stepper runs wrong direction, reverse one coil's wires.
[20:03:42] <Fox_M|afk> Fox_M|afk is now known as Fox_Muldr
[20:04:44] <Guest834> its a single board
[20:04:45] <micges> Guest834: try this: http://emergent.unpy.net/01162326817
[20:06:26] <pingufan> :) I would switch two drives to the same control lines (from PC). Tat's easier.
[20:07:27] <skunkworks> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5zcojjR9uqw
[20:14:15] <Guest834> correct direction hold times and step timing are typically found where?
[20:15:05] <skunkworks> usually from the stepper drive manufacturer
[20:16:41] <awallin> kind of "uber keyboard" feel to that control panel in the video :)
[20:17:53] <awallin> no labels, you just "know" what the buttons do
[20:19:12] <Guest834> Are accel and velocity settings based on the driver board or stepper motor?
[20:20:08] <skunkworks> whole machine
[20:20:14] <awallin> Guest834: max accel/vel settings with a stepper system are based on the users fear of losing steps :)
[20:21:08] <skunkworks> http://www.cnc-ready.at/
[20:36:19] <Jymmm> Ok, $3 more to go for free shipping from MSC, what else do I get?
[20:38:02] <alex_chally> Jymmm, more swivle deburring tool replacement knives
[20:38:08] <alex_chally> mine are always dull because I forget to buy new ones
[20:39:02] <Jymmm> I rarely use the ones I have, very little metal work
[20:39:07] <alex_chally> oh
[20:39:09] <alex_chally> hmm
[20:40:13] <alex_chally> Jymmmm, a little more the $3, but this is one of my favorite things I have ever bought from msc
[20:40:14] <alex_chally> http://www1.mscdirect.com/CGI/NNSRIT?PMPXNO=4759210&PMT4NO=92155406
[20:40:37] <skunkworks> thats neat
[20:40:39] <Jymmm> heh
[20:40:40] <alex_chally> of course, I also made a belt clip for my TI-89
[20:40:58] <Jymmm> alex_chally: Where does your slide-rule go?
[20:41:11] <alex_chally> Jymmm, I actually have a slide rule and a holster for that
[20:41:17] <Jymmm> lol
[20:41:23] <alex_chally> but it is only 6" so I can't get enough sigfigs to use it in the shop
[20:41:29] <Jymmm> I have a 4" and have no idea about it
[20:41:32] <alex_chally> skunkworks, I did some math one day trying to figure out how much time I was wasting doing a few things in the shop
[20:42:04] <alex_chally> I figured out it took me about 30 seconds to take out and put away my calipers every time I wanted to use them, and that if I took 50 measurements in a day that was a lot of fucking time over a few months
[20:42:38] <alex_chally> and the shop at school is probably 10k sqft, so if you leave your calipers on one side and have to get them, it takes like 2 minutes to walk it. More like 15 after getting interupted traversing the floor
[20:44:08] <alex_chally> Jymmm, http://www.flickr.com/photos/33383121@N04/4590603817/sizes/l/in/photostream/
[20:44:17] <alex_chally> Jymmm, a girl who I see on and off gave it to me.
[20:44:28] <alex_chally> shame she lives so far away, otherwise she would be a keeper
[20:45:10] <Jymmm> this is a COMPASS #403
[20:45:24] <Jymmm> made in Japan
[20:46:38] <NTU> does anybody know if a patch from RTAI for x86 will work for an x86_64 kernel?
[20:47:27] <NTU> * NTU tries it
[20:50:43] <alex_chally> Jymmm, I like the mag glass on that
[20:50:52] <alex_chally> can you get 4 sig figs out of it ?
[21:02:46] <NTU> hmm looks like it worked..
[21:19:26] <Jymmm> alex_chally: I have no clue how to use a slide rule
[21:20:08] <alex_chally> Jymmm, wikipedia has a good little bit on it if you want to learn
[21:20:20] <alex_chally> I actually used it as a primary tool in a math class I took earlier this year
[21:20:26] <alex_chally> because I was bored and wanted to learn how to use it
[21:20:35] <Jymmm> cool
[21:36:45] <spasticteapot_> spasticteapot_ is now known as spasticteapot
[22:00:45] <NTU> SWPadnos: ping > does http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?EMC_With_Custom_Kernel#Install_the_New_Kernel create an initial ramdisk or does the kernel magically just work without one with the HDD support compiled as modules?
[22:06:25] <NTU> fakeroot make-kpkg --initrd didn't work for me and was wondering what magic spell you casted. :)
[22:21:43] <Fox_Muldr> Fox_Muldr is now known as Fox_M|afk
[22:46:18] <JT-Hardinge> * JT-Hardinge wonders how to stuff 60,000 pounds of machinery in a 40,000 lb shop
[22:55:39] <rooks> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I2LDFPxOpHY :)
[22:56:10] <rooks> i hope to do sth like that when ill make my cnc machine some day :)
[22:59:21] <JT-Hardinge> sth?
[23:00:37] <rooks> something
[23:02:03] <JT-Hardinge> ya don't need cnc to build that
[23:04:22] <rooks> yes, but i want to make it detail-nice, plus im thinking on experimenting with strange flying shapes one day :)
[23:06:21] <JT-Hardinge> I flew R/
[23:06:41] <JT-Hardinge> C for 25 years and for detail nice you only need your hands :)
[23:07:24] <JT-Hardinge> now if your making a scale motor for your Sopwith Camel you sure could use some CNC equipment
[23:07:36] <rooks> im too lazy, when you have a cnc, everything becomes a cnc cutout :)
[23:07:44] <KimK> Hi JT. I saw there were some docs troubles, nothing I caused, I hope?
[23:08:12] <JT-Hardinge> nope it was all my doing... copy and paste with smart quotes and ....
[23:09:03] <JT-Hardinge> I told you that stuff was more picky than programming LOL
[23:10:00] <KimK> OK. The patch file I sent you was only about 90% of what I wanted to, there was some kind of a merge conflict in one file on my end and I haven't quite learned what to do about resolving it, but I'll send the rest along as soon as I can.
[23:10:07] <JT-Hardinge> rooks: I find cnc can slow you down on one off things
[23:10:26] <JT-Hardinge> when did you send it?
[23:10:45] <KimK> Oh, I don't know, a few days ago?
[23:11:08] <JT-Hardinge> I've not seen it yet... and that may be my fault as well
[23:11:26] <KimK> OK, let me know if you need a resend.
[23:11:48] <JT-Hardinge> setting up a dual core computer for docs with a Zotac motherboard and atm I don't know if I set up the e-mail yet on it
[23:12:03] <JT-Hardinge> it should come through when I check
[23:12:09] <KimK> I think I sent it to jthdev?
[23:12:20] <JT-Hardinge> jetdev
[23:12:37] <KimK> OK, you'd know, I'd have to look.
[23:13:15] <JT-Hardinge> I just got that computer up and running a week or two ago so some things are not done yet like e-mail apparently
[23:13:17] <KimK> Ha, maybe _I_ better look, lol
[23:13:48] <JT-Hardinge> if you sent it to a bogus address it should bounce back
[23:16:16] <JT-Hardinge> I'll wander down to the beer cave and check...
[23:16:36] <KimK> bjtdev it turns out
[23:17:37] <KimK> It says Sunday, August 15, 4:44pm
[23:19:05] <JT-Hardinge> I better go down to the beer cave and make sure my e-mail is set up properly on the dual core Zotac
[23:24:45] <Valen> crap, now my desktop is getting the unknown runlevel problem
[23:30:16] <jthornton> * jthornton understands now the livecd does not have evolution...
[23:34:29] <Valen> evolution is crap anyway ;-P
[23:38:04] <NTU> evolution the horrible email app?
[23:42:36] <NTU> 246 lines of code I need to write / edit for RTAI on arch.. how wonderful