#emc | Logs for 2010-01-28

[00:00:13] <SWPadnos> if it never triggers, then you know that the tool change was never requested
[00:00:50] <SWPadnos> I'm assuming for the moment that the tool change position is within the machine envelope (MAX/MIN in the various AXIS sections)
[00:00:50] <danimal_garage> nothing on the meter
[00:01:05] <danimal_garage> yes
[00:01:05] <SWPadnos> meter also doesn't update in realtime, and will not show you a short pulse
[00:01:25] <SWPadnos> halscope captures in realtime, then displays the information. that's crucial
[00:01:34] <danimal_garage> it shows que is not empty after tool change
[00:01:45] <danimal_garage> after i try another toolchange after the first one fails
[00:02:04] <SWPadnos> well, the toolchange never happened, so motion should be waiting for that
[00:02:05] <danimal_garage> the toolchange signal shows no change anytime
[00:02:17] <SWPadnos> and you're trying to do stuff while it can't move, waiting for the tool to change ..
[00:02:20] <danimal_garage> in scope
[00:02:26] <SWPadnos> and it's triggering?
[00:02:29] <danimal_garage> nope
[00:02:31] <SWPadnos> (scope)
[00:02:37] <SWPadnos> then you'll never see anything there :)
[00:02:55] <danimal_garage> works fine if i remove the stuff in the ini for the toolchange position
[00:03:05] <danimal_garage> oh sorry, it's triggering
[00:03:23] <SWPadnos> unfortunately, I can't guide you through using halscope at the moment
[00:03:25] <danimal_garage> just not showing true
[00:03:30] <SWPadnos> got a 5:40AM flight tomorrow
[00:03:34] <danimal_garage> i know how to use it
[00:03:39] <SWPadnos> ok, good ;)
[00:03:45] <danimal_garage> i'm saying the signal is never true
[00:03:50] <danimal_garage> for tool change
[00:03:57] <SWPadnos> which signal?
[00:04:01] <danimal_garage> tool change
[00:04:30] <danimal_garage> i guess i can look at the pin instead of the signal
[00:04:36] <SWPadnos> ok. you may need do f2/f2
[00:04:40] <SWPadnos> machine off/machine on
[00:04:47] <danimal_garage> yea
[00:04:50] <danimal_garage> i tried that
[00:05:01] <SWPadnos> well, sure - look at the pin iocontrol.0.tool-change
[00:05:31] <SWPadnos> it is strange that it works unless you have the config options that cause movement before the change
[00:06:32] <tom3p> does it have to be inposn before the change? is it waiting ? F=0? impossible posn?
[00:06:36] <danimal_garage> weird, it worked that time
[00:07:07] <danimal_garage> tom3p: f=0?
[00:07:20] <tom3p> rapid overide at 0
[00:07:37] <danimal_garage> oh it's at 100%
[00:07:45] <danimal_garage> it moved to the position
[00:07:52] <danimal_garage> but wouldnt change tools
[00:08:09] <tom3p> now works?
[00:08:45] <danimal_garage> nope
[00:08:50] <danimal_garage> it worked once
[00:08:54] <danimal_garage> wont work again
[00:09:18] <danimal_garage> moves to the g30 position just fine
[00:09:22] <SWPadnos> worked once as in actually changed tools, or just moved into position?
[00:09:25] <danimal_garage> but wont try to change tools
[00:09:38] <danimal_garage> always moves to position, only changed tools once
[00:09:55] <SWPadnos> ok, so it actually did change one time then
[00:10:03] <danimal_garage> yes
[00:10:12] <SWPadnos> look at the iocontrol.0.tool-changed pin
[00:10:21] <danimal_garage> i dod
[00:10:23] <SWPadnos> halscope or halmeter
[00:10:28] <danimal_garage> nothing
[00:10:30] <SWPadnos> changed, not change
[00:10:44] <danimal_garage> no change, except the one time it actually changed the tool
[00:10:51] <danimal_garage> oh changed... ok hold on
[00:12:29] <danimal_garage> weird, it changed tools again, but only once
[00:12:40] <danimal_garage> tool changed pin is true
[00:13:14] <SWPadnos> you should also have iocontrol.0.tool-prepare looped back to iocontrol.0.tool-prepared
[00:13:16] <SWPadnos> I think
[00:13:32] <danimal_garage> yea it is in hal
[00:13:36] <SWPadnos> since your changer has to put things back where they came from before going to the new pocket
[00:13:38] <SWPadnos> ok
[00:13:44] <danimal_garage> hmmmm
[00:13:53] <SWPadnos> there could be a timeout issue with the PLC/ladder code
[00:14:03] <SWPadnos> wait a minute or two and try it agaon
[00:14:05] <SWPadnos> again
[00:14:06] <SWPadnos> bbiab
[00:14:08] <danimal_garage> maybe it needs to finish the g30 move before the prepared pin is fired?
[00:14:50] <danimal_garage> ok, thanks for helping
[00:16:03] <danimal_garage> hmmmm i have an idea
[00:16:11] <danimal_garage> brb
[00:22:11] <lilalinux> lilalinux is now known as lilalinux_away
[00:28:23] <danimal_garage> that didnt work
[00:28:26] <danimal_garage> hmm
[00:40:28] <danimal_garage> i think it has something to do with the tool prepare
[00:41:07] <SWPadnos> danimal_garage, in HAL, disconnect the tool change pins from your ladder and loop them back to each other
[00:41:25] <SWPadnos> (tool-prepare to tool-prepared, tool-change to tool-changed)
[00:41:37] <SWPadnos> you can do this "live", you don't have to exit from emc
[00:41:50] <SWPadnos> just make sure it's in the machine off state
[00:42:31] <SWPadnos> you can unlinkp those four pins, then make two nets for the loopbacks
[00:42:37] <SWPadnos> (in halcmd)
[00:43:21] <SWPadnos> oh, you may as well put it in the hal files or ini file, since you'll have to reload emc for ini changes to take effect
[00:44:32] <danimal_garage> ok
[00:44:57] <SWPadnos> doing that will tell us if it's the ladder logic or if it's emc that's the problem
[00:45:49] <danimal_garage> ok, done
[00:46:05] <danimal_garage> want me to watch those pins on scope?
[00:46:36] <SWPadnos> no, see if you can do more than one tool change
[00:46:58] <SWPadnos> with the various toolchange-related ini options set
[00:48:04] <SWPadnos> did you change the hal files to loop the prep/change pins?
[00:49:53] <danimal_garage> yes
[00:52:25] <danimal_garage> how do i attempt a toolchange now?
[00:54:59] <SWPadnos> uh - MDI T2M6?
[00:55:06] <SWPadnos> how were you doing it before?
[00:56:26] <danimal_garage> like that... what am i supposed to accomplish like this?
[00:56:40] <danimal_garage> see if the loop follows through?
[00:56:59] <SWPadnos> no, the loop will make the iocontroller think you have a really fast tool changer
[00:57:06] <danimal_garage> still gives me the same error
[00:57:09] <SWPadnos> and you should be able to MDI motion after the tool change
[00:57:24] <SWPadnos> ok, that's good (ish). it probably points to a bug in emc
[00:57:24] <danimal_garage> que is not empty
[00:57:27] <SWPadnos> ok
[00:57:31] <danimal_garage> yea
[00:57:45] <SWPadnos> can you pastebin the output of halcmd show all
[00:57:51] <danimal_garage> sure thing
[00:57:55] <danimal_garage> hold on a sec
[01:00:11] <danimal_garage> http://pastebin.com/d50de1ff
[01:00:46] <danimal_garage> thanks for helping. i usually assume it's my fault, and i go crazy trying to figure it out
[01:02:13] <SWPadnos> that halcmd shows that the tool change pins are still connected to your ladder
[01:02:18] <SWPadnos> err, that listing
[01:02:39] <danimal_garage> i #'ed out those lines
[01:02:42] <danimal_garage> hmm
[01:02:51] <danimal_garage> should i restart emc?
[01:03:20] <SWPadnos> add these to the end of a HAL file:
[01:03:22] <SWPadnos> unlinkp iocontrol.0.tool-prepare
[01:03:23] <SWPadnos> unlinkp iocontrol.0.tool-prepared
[01:03:25] <SWPadnos> unlinkp iocontrol.0.tool-change
[01:03:27] <SWPadnos> unlinkp iocontrol.0.tool-changed
[01:03:28] <SWPadnos> net prep-loop iocontrol.0.tool-prepare iocontrol.0.tool-prepared
[01:03:30] <SWPadnos> net change-loop iocontrol.0.tool-change iocontrol.0.tool-changed
[01:03:42] <SWPadnos> you can leave all the other connections there, this will undo them and reconnect things as I wanted
[01:03:52] <danimal_garage> ahh ok
[01:04:44] <SWPadnos> bbl (maybe)
[01:05:01] <Jymmm> * Jymmm dogpiles SWPadnos
[01:05:20] <Jymmm> FULL CONTACT CNC'ing
[01:05:35] <Jymmm> GORILLA CNC'ing!
[01:06:18] <Valen> there should be mill fights
[01:07:07] <danimal_garage> still shows the pins linked
[01:07:11] <danimal_garage> hmm
[01:08:19] <SWPadnos> did you restart emc?
[01:08:36] <danimal_garage> just did
[01:08:44] <SWPadnos> you can also add those lines to the ini file, at the end of the [HAL] section
[01:08:50] <SWPadnos> just preface the m all with HALCMD=
[01:08:56] <SWPadnos> them all
[01:09:31] <SWPadnos> if you're using more than one hal file, make sure the lines are in the last one loaded, or at least after the lines that connect the tool pins to ladder
[01:09:37] <SWPadnos> now I'm leaving :)
[01:09:45] <toast_> toast_ is now known as toastydeath
[01:10:48] <danimal_garage> ok its still giving the error, and the loops are correct
[01:10:58] <danimal_garage> ok, adios!
[01:15:15] <Valen> I forsee great pain in my future when it comes time for me to do this ;->
[01:16:35] <danimal_garage> ok i guess for now i'll remove the toolchange stuff in the ini
[01:16:54] <danimal_garage> and just put g30 before the toolchange
[01:17:47] <danimal_garage> this is the same problem mIreland was having. I bet there's a glitch in the latest update for emc
[01:18:21] <danimal_garage> because his was working fine, then just started having errors
[01:18:28] <danimal_garage> same errors as myself
[01:19:14] <tom3p> can you install a separate version of the older style?
[01:19:24] <danimal_garage> eh
[01:19:38] <danimal_garage> not going through all that right now
[01:24:17] <danimal_garage> i'm gunna update ubuntu/emc and see if that helps, i havent done it in a month or 2
[01:24:42] <danimal_garage> thought i did it recently, but that was the lathe
[01:27:21] <danimal_garage> wowsers, i thought my coolant tank was empty, it's actually full.
[01:28:04] <Valen> generally a plesant supprise
[01:28:24] <danimal_garage> not when you gotta empty it
[01:30:42] <Valen> lol
[01:46:03] <danimal_garage> man, i just got some cheap reed switches for homing switches on my mill, and they repeat pretty friggin well
[01:46:21] <danimal_garage> i dont think i've ever seen it out more than .001"
[01:46:39] <Valen> thats pretty awesome
[01:46:45] <Valen> actually that might be a good idea
[01:46:59] <Valen> we were using micro switches for limits but they are filling up with water
[01:47:29] <danimal_garage> i dont think i'd trust them for accuracy, but i'm supprised how close they always are
[01:47:50] <danimal_garage> i always indicate my fixtures anyways
[01:47:55] <eric_unterhausen> I got some proximity switches
[01:48:08] <eric_unterhausen> I don't know if that means they are reed switches or not
[01:48:12] <Valen> eric_unterhausen what sort of $ do they run to?
[01:48:32] <danimal_garage> usually about $25 for decent prox switches
[01:48:39] <eric_unterhausen> can't help with that, got them from a friend
[01:48:52] <danimal_garage> eric_unterhausen: these are just the cheapo mechanical switches from radioshack
[01:49:18] <eric_unterhausen> ok
[01:49:18] <eric_unterhausen> how do you keep them from being flooded?
[01:49:32] <danimal_garage> sorry i guess they dont call them reed switches
[01:49:54] <danimal_garage> http://superdroidrobots.com/images/TE-044-000.jpg
[01:49:54] <eric_unterhausen> the reed switches I have are magnetic
[01:50:00] <danimal_garage> micro switches
[01:50:11] <eric_unterhausen> a lot of people use those
[01:50:19] <danimal_garage> i havent been too worried about coolant, it stays relatively dry where they are
[01:50:25] <eric_unterhausen> actually, that's what's in the expensive limit switches
[01:50:42] <eric_unterhausen> they just put a nice case around it
[01:50:46] <danimal_garage> ha
[01:50:47] <danimal_garage> yea
[01:51:07] <danimal_garage> my hardinge uses those
[01:51:11] <danimal_garage> for limits
[01:51:21] <danimal_garage> not for homing
[01:52:15] <eric_unterhausen> I have a pile of the limit switches, thought about using them for homing but I got over it
[01:57:52] <danimal_garage> running my first real program with the toolchanger
[01:58:01] <danimal_garage> wish me luck
[02:00:01] <eric_unterhausen> good luck, but if you expect failure have a video camera running
[02:01:21] <danimal_garage> ha
[02:01:37] <Valen> have video anyway
[02:02:07] <skunkworks> danimal_garage: you got the tool changer running?
[02:02:23] <danimal_garage> yes
[02:02:56] <danimal_garage> so far so good
[02:02:57] <danimal_garage> 2 changes
[02:07:54] <danimal_garage> skunkworks: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jE8xAXmYv4Q
[02:12:47] <danimal_garage> so far so good, ran a whole program with 4 tool changes
[02:13:36] <danimal_garage> i wouldnt kick it out of bed for eating cookies
[02:13:43] <danimal_garage> except chips ahoy
[02:13:59] <danimal_garage> they've gotten entirely too small lately, and i'm taking a stand
[02:15:01] <eric_unterhausen> bastages
[02:15:19] <eric_unterhausen> those things are a sorry excuse for a chocolate chip cookie anyway
[02:15:21] <danimal_garage> seriously. they're TINY now. WTF?
[02:15:29] <danimal_garage> yea, but they used to be ok
[02:15:35] <danimal_garage> now they friggin suck
[02:17:43] <Valen> danimal_garage nice
[02:18:08] <Valen> kinda disconcerting how much they wobble in the carrier though
[02:18:39] <danimal_garage> ehh, doesnt hurt anything
[02:19:01] <danimal_garage> nothing wrong with it, it's just the design
[02:19:41] <Valen> yeah, its just "disconcerting"
[02:20:06] <Valen> everything else is so ridgid and precise
[02:20:59] <danimal_garage> yea, but the claw has so much travel, the tool can be leaning quite a bit and it wont have an issue
[02:21:10] <Valen> yeah I know, its all good
[02:24:16] <Jymmm> http://sfbay.craigslist.org/sby/tls/1573524086.html
[02:24:56] <eric_unterhausen> I can't believe that's not gone
[02:25:02] <eric_unterhausen> maybe it's a scam :)
[02:26:01] <danimal_garage> na
[02:26:08] <danimal_garage> stuff is cheap right now
[02:26:32] <eric_unterhausen> oh, I forgot that everyone in California was working in real estate
[02:26:39] <danimal_garage> i got my last bridgeport with xyz power feed, vari speed head, power drawbar, and a dro for 1100
[02:26:42] <Valen> I wish stuff like that existed here
[02:27:13] <eric_unterhausen> we're pretty tapped out around here too
[02:28:33] <Jymmm> That's the first I've seen in years
[02:29:04] <Jymmm> ppl are jsut selling stuff to pay the rent
[02:29:52] <eric_unterhausen> danimal_garage I don't want to hear about it
[02:29:57] <danimal_garage> i got my whole shop with deals like that
[02:30:07] <danimal_garage> eric_unterhausen: :)
[02:30:32] <eric_unterhausen> living in a relatively rural area doesn't help things
[02:30:47] <eric_unterhausen> occasionally, a tech school will dump some of their crappy old tools
[02:33:19] <Valen> which are usually better than any of the new crap
[02:44:19] <danimal_garage> man if i can just quiet the head of this machine a little, i'll be pretty happy with this machine
[02:46:51] <eric_unterhausen> I have an old tech school lathe that is the biggest pile of junk ever
[02:47:01] <eric_unterhausen> I wouldn't have believed that a lathe could be this bad
[02:47:49] <ds3> what kind of lathe is it?
[02:47:50] <eric_unterhausen> for example, I haven't figured out how to keep the cross slide nut from turning in its housing
[02:48:12] <eric_unterhausen> it's a Sheldon r-13, very nice lathe
[02:48:22] <eric_unterhausen> similar to Jon Elson's R-15
[02:48:50] <eric_unterhausen> but less mud was generated in it's traverse of the back yard
[02:48:57] <eric_unterhausen> his page on his lathe made me paranoid
[02:49:12] <eric_unterhausen> boom forklift up to the axles in mud
[02:50:02] <eric_unterhausen> http://pico-systems.com/sheldon.html
[02:54:03] <danimal_garage> lol nice
[02:54:44] <eric_unterhausen> I let my daughter drive the boom forklift up and down the street, she was 10
[02:55:01] <eric_unterhausen> one of my many failures as a parent
[02:55:10] <danimal_garage> hahaha
[02:55:19] <danimal_garage> so you're the cool dad
[02:55:37] <eric_unterhausen> I thought she needed the experience
[02:56:19] <Jymmm> eric_unterhausen: I don't see any issue with that.
[02:56:21] <eric_unterhausen> I only recently found out my son was pissed about it, but considering he was 6, I don't think driving was in the cards
[02:57:12] <danimal_garage> yea, you never know when a 10 year old is going to need to drive a boom forklift
[02:57:24] <eric_unterhausen> could happen...
[02:57:30] <Jymmm> Yeah, to drove OFF of daddy
[02:57:35] <Jymmm> drive
[02:57:46] <Jymmm> ro to lift the car off of dad
[02:58:23] <eric_unterhausen> I don't understand why the boom forklifts don't work too well on dirt
[02:59:08] <ds3> tires too thin?
[02:59:09] <Jymmm> dry packed dirt, sure.
[02:59:37] <eric_unterhausen> apparently the tires don't have enough flotation
[03:00:07] <eric_unterhausen> I had one of the off-road forklifts for my mill and it did a lot less damage to the yard
[03:00:47] <eric_unterhausen> but it's nice to be able to just put the tools right in the basement, so the boom wins on that score
[03:08:07] <danimal_garage> i just put them in the garage
[03:08:14] <danimal_garage> no basements out here unfortunately
[03:08:22] <danimal_garage> i miss having a basement
[03:08:34] <danimal_garage> and a yard
[03:09:02] <danimal_garage> damn socal
[03:22:05] <danimal_garage> well the toolchanger has made quite a few changes without error, so i think i'm good on it
[03:22:41] <danimal_garage> aside from the issues with trying to use g30 for tool changes
[03:22:46] <Jymmm> Now, turn everything off, then try again
[03:23:05] <danimal_garage> cant, gotta run production :)
[03:36:25] <mIreland> danimal: thank you that was it! now I'm back to the problems i was working on before.
[03:37:59] <danimal_garage> glad i can help. hopefully they fix the bug
[03:38:28] <danimal_garage> what problems do you have?
[03:39:16] <mIreland> demon posessed toolchanger, it's head spins around and around. haha
[03:39:22] <danimal_garage> fyi, i just put g30 in the programs before the toolchange for the shart term till the issue is fixed.
[03:39:43] <mIreland> occasional misses, change with use
[03:39:54] <danimal_garage> hmm
[03:40:12] <danimal_garage> usually that happens when you call a tool # that doesnt exist
[03:40:22] <mIreland> more serious is the occasional incomplete setdown. this scraps parts.
[03:40:36] <mIreland> it's just adjustment.
[03:40:52] <danimal_garage> yea, you need to adjust the magnet
[03:41:10] <danimal_garage> but it shouldnt run the program if it isnt fully seated
[03:41:21] <mIreland> pulling the pillow and putting it back the same way has fixed it for days.
[03:41:46] <mIreland> I've gotten it to run that way once at least.
[03:42:03] <danimal_garage> you need to have a normally open input coil for the turret down sensor before the tool changed pin
[03:42:32] <danimal_garage> that way it'll at least not try to run parts unless it's fully seated
[03:42:51] <mIreland> magnet? turretdown is a hall effect sw?
[03:43:45] <danimal_garage> the magnet is for the turret tool number switch
[03:44:01] <danimal_garage> the turret down sensor is a prox switch i believe
[03:44:30] <danimal_garage> the magnet adjustment will help it trigger turret stop at the correct time
[03:44:51] <danimal_garage> having the turret down sensor in your ladder will help prevent scrap/crashes
[03:44:51] <mIreland> o yah. the encoder magnet.
[03:45:08] <danimal_garage> yes
[03:45:31] <danimal_garage> it's VERY picky on it's position (the magnet)
[03:46:41] <mIreland> it's there in the ladder... i think i need to verify this monster carefully. I agree it shouldn't be able to run without the turret down.
[03:47:30] <danimal_garage> yea. something is wrong, the turret down sensor will not trigger unless it's truely down
[03:47:48] <danimal_garage> so it must not be in there correctly
[03:48:15] <mIreland> i'll begin by seeing that the switch clears while turret spins
[03:48:20] <danimal_garage> which is odd, because i know cradek would have had it right for at least his machine, and you got the ladder from him.
[03:48:40] <mIreland> correct. it has been smarter than me so far.
[03:49:24] <danimal_garage> yea, he's a smart eff'er
[03:49:34] <danimal_garage> wish i got his ladder lol
[03:49:48] <danimal_garage> but glad i did it myself, i learned alot
[03:50:18] <mIreland> yeah, i was on the edge of embarking on a serious relearn when your message arrived.
[03:50:26] <danimal_garage> i wouldnt have been able to do my mill's toolchanger if i didnt do the lathe one myself
[03:50:31] <mIreland> but i was rite. software...
[03:50:38] <danimal_garage> yea
[03:51:05] <mIreland> I've just started setting up a tiny mill. I expect to learn a lot on it
[03:51:34] <danimal_garage> yea you will
[03:51:45] <danimal_garage> i learned a TON over the past couple months
[03:51:51] <danimal_garage> thanks to these guys
[03:52:05] <danimal_garage> just hoping i can pay it forward eventually
[03:52:50] <mIreland> Me too. I'm sad I didn't discover you while I was sitting around in sandiego
[03:53:05] <danimal_garage> yea, shoulda been on irc!
[03:53:32] <mIreland> folks were selling machines for a song. met an old guy at ramona airport who had *neat* tools for sale cheap
[03:54:50] <danimal_garage> yea no kidding, i got my machines dirt cheap
[03:56:25] <mIreland> he wasn't afraid of linux either... it's too bad i had no car down there. I met some interesting people to be sure.
[03:57:21] <mIreland> wow, so I'm back in business. this was a showstopper. i knew it would be a simple answer.
[03:58:37] <danimal_garage> haha cool
[03:58:47] <danimal_garage> glad it was a simple one
[03:58:59] <mIreland> hey, ever heard of rolamite slides?
[03:59:21] <mIreland> I'm experimenting with them for my little engraver mill
[03:59:36] <danimal_garage> nope
[04:00:01] <mIreland> skateboard bearings and shot tape measure. I feel like a genius.
[04:01:55] <mIreland> hard to make the little buggers track straight tho.
[04:05:10] <danimal_garage> i have no clue what you're talking about lol
[04:08:57] <mIreland> when you see you wont believe it
[04:09:40] <mIreland> rolamites were invented at (ithink)Sandia NL and are in the public domain.
[04:11:09] <mIreland> simply double a piece of spring steel back on itself around rollers in a frame. super genius.
[04:11:26] <danimal_garage> interesting
[04:11:49] <mIreland> zeroish friction even w strong spring because it is balanced against itself.
[04:13:12] <mIreland> i was able to mock one up to play with in two minutes using the aforementioned supplies, 123blocks bars and clamps.
[04:17:32] <danimal_garage> cool
[04:19:38] <mIreland> yay all panels screwed back together. i hate having this troubleshooting session end without and explanation.
[04:20:03] <tom3p> mireland you got a long rolamite slide working?
[04:20:11] <mIreland> that was a dumb thing to fetch a meter after, but i was stumped.
[04:20:53] <mIreland> long slide had trouble with the blade skipping off the walls
[04:21:21] <mIreland> but we were using found rollers and made no attempt to engineer a solution.
[04:22:11] <mIreland> steel C channel, and a tape measure. need rollers like thread spools to keep the tape guiding to center.
[04:23:57] <Jymmm> pics or it didn't happen
[04:24:09] <mIreland> This points to a way to make a very stiff machine very cheaply. you do have to keep the suckers clean tho
[04:25:05] <mIreland> got a couple of pix but havnt posted them. hard to tell the coolness by picture
[04:25:44] <mIreland> it is satisfying to zoom the rollers effortlessly down an 8 foot slide in person tho
[04:26:07] <mIreland> but as i said, it binds. pics will be forthcoming as we refine our methods.
[04:35:34] <tom3p> mireland http://tinyurl.com/yj6lrnw handy to see what the inventor thought
[04:40:16] <mIreland> yes. another convert. try making one; all you need is parallel flats. they don't seem to benefit from being real tight.
[04:40:57] <mIreland> You know you've set it up well if the bias from the curl in the tape moves it to one end.
[04:41:08] <tom3p> i used window blind strips
[04:41:43] <mIreland> I bet nylon strap would work. tape measure looks cool tho
[04:46:41] <mIreland> thinking of just turning down shot skate wheels to fit in the c channel with enough clearance. If the binding issue can be cured this is a stellar hack.
[04:52:27] <mIreland> for my engraver I've used a big block of tooling plate and made runners and spacers that screw to the side. I've made 2 sets of rollers per side to anchor the gantry at four points.
[05:03:56] <danimal_garage> mIreland: i just discovered something: the "encoder" for the turret position needs to be centered around the shaft that rotates the magnet. There's some flat in it if you loosen the 4 screws that hold it down. You can pull the magnet off to see the alignment
[05:04:24] <danimal_garage> there's some adjustment in it*
[05:04:26] <danimal_garage> not flat
[05:05:16] <mIreland> i remember coming across that. i was terified it would never go back the same
[05:06:26] <mIreland> and of course it probably didn't
[05:07:30] <danimal_garage> lol
[05:10:18] <danimal_garage> i just centered mine
[05:10:31] <danimal_garage> and it hasnt had a mistake yet
[05:10:39] <danimal_garage> i did like 20 changes so far
[05:15:12] <danimal_garage> yea i've been stuggling with the occasional toolchange error where it doesnt seat properly
[05:15:22] <danimal_garage> maybe every 6 tool changes
[05:15:41] <danimal_garage> but centering that encoder around the magnet shaft seems to have done the trick
[05:16:26] <danimal_garage> i drew a line where the magnet went before i took it off.
[05:16:41] <danimal_garage> put it back on and lined up the mark i drew, and i didnt even have to adjust it
[05:16:54] <mIreland> ahh, you took it clean off to sight it in concentric.
[05:17:04] <danimal_garage> yes
[05:17:22] <danimal_garage> it was worth it, it's never worked this well
[05:18:54] <danimal_garage> i'm getting close to using it... my coolant just came in today
[05:19:22] <danimal_garage> all i gotta do is make a mounting plate for my 3 jaw chuck
[05:20:58] <danimal_garage> i really shouldnt be working on my machine with a few beers in me. i just dropped 2 screws in my cutting oil
[05:21:37] <Jymmm> ding em out
[05:21:39] <Jymmm> dig
[05:22:04] <danimal_garage> well i gotta drain the coolant tank, so i'll get them eventually
[05:22:11] <Jymmm> wuss
[05:22:32] <danimal_garage> you wanna reach your hand it probably 10 year old cutting oil?
[05:22:34] <Jymmm> put on the wish list: coolant pump
[05:22:44] <danimal_garage> little giant
[05:22:49] <Jymmm> I'd use a magnet
[05:22:50] <mIreland> hrmmm. i can't sight it too well against the edge of the soft plastic it's dipped in. I can, however, see how their original alignment tool must have looked.
[05:22:52] <danimal_garage> they work well
[05:23:27] <danimal_garage> mIreland: mine wasnt too hard to sight in
[05:23:36] <danimal_garage> the hole seemed fairly round
[05:23:37] <mIreland> oooh, u have mystery tank too? I've been having such fun speculating...
[05:23:54] <danimal_garage> i just pulled the screen off the top
[05:24:00] <danimal_garage> about to pump it out
[05:24:20] <mIreland> let me know if there is sunken treasure.
[05:24:33] <danimal_garage> i'm trying to get the vertical slide off now, then i'll pump it out
[05:24:36] <danimal_garage> ha!
[05:24:48] <mIreland> say, what do you mean to replace it with?
[05:24:48] <danimal_garage> probably 30 years of chips
[05:25:02] <danimal_garage> performance biolube nucut lite
[05:25:09] <danimal_garage> reccomended by cradek
[05:25:17] <mIreland> well that certainly has a ring to it.
[05:25:19] <danimal_garage> i just got it today
[05:25:23] <danimal_garage> it's soy based
[05:25:34] <mIreland> neato. pricey?
[05:25:43] <danimal_garage> expect to pay $140 for 5 gallons shipped if you plan to use it
[05:26:21] <mIreland> thankyou i mite... depends on demand for stainless goodies i guess
[05:26:37] <danimal_garage> cradek says it doesnt smoke up or smell
[05:26:45] <danimal_garage> and cuts great
[05:26:57] <danimal_garage> that's worth $140 to me
[05:27:02] <Jymmm> and you can make tofu from the leftovers
[05:27:09] <danimal_garage> since my ship is in my garage, attached to my house
[05:27:14] <mIreland> how will i keep outsiders at bay w/o smoke?
[05:27:25] <Jymmm> flying swarf
[05:27:29] <danimal_garage> i'd expect that from someone from the bay area, Jymmm
[05:27:41] <Jymmm> danimal_garage: I dont tuch the shit
[05:27:43] <Jymmm> touch
[05:27:50] <danimal_garage> inhale it, huh?
[05:27:56] <danimal_garage> :)
[05:28:09] <danimal_garage> yea that crap is gross
[05:28:12] <Jymmm> but it cant taste much worse that soy based coolant
[05:28:26] <danimal_garage> it tastes like nothing
[05:28:35] <danimal_garage> have you tried it? (tofu)
[05:28:50] <mIreland> air flavored calamari
[05:28:52] <Jymmm> only deep fried and with peanut sauce
[05:29:23] <danimal_garage> deep fried in bacon fat lol
[05:29:30] <danimal_garage> vegie delight!
[05:29:52] <danimal_garage> i'm strictly a pizza and beer guy
[05:30:30] <danimal_garage> although i'm pretty happy, i found an awesome burger joint near me
[05:30:47] <danimal_garage> WAY better than any fast food, for much cheaper
[05:31:22] <danimal_garage> $5.00 for a double cheeseburger meal, and you get more fries than a large at mcdonalds
[05:31:30] <danimal_garage> legit burger too
[05:31:54] <danimal_garage> i havent eaten dinner yet if you cant tell
[05:50:01] <mIreland> tempermental sucker. i'm getting mixed results.
[05:51:05] <mIreland> also, i get noticeable blowby at position 7.i probably need to dig into it.
[05:53:02] <danimal_garage> blowby?
[05:53:56] <mIreland> air leak
[05:58:27] <mIreland> wish i had manual collet closer on this thing. that baby leaks air too, plus it's a drag to switch collets.
[06:01:49] <danimal_garage> yea same here
[06:03:04] <mIreland> u got part chute?
[06:03:32] <mIreland> i thought it was silly till i tried it. now i'm totally sold.
[06:05:36] <danimal_garage> i took it off
[06:05:47] <danimal_garage> i dont make parts small enough to use it
[06:09:48] <mIreland> say, anybody ever use the 3d software 'blender'?
[06:21:42] <danimal_garage> well the coolant tank is draining. wonder how much it holds
[06:21:54] <danimal_garage> it's full to the brim
[06:28:27] <mIreland> okay, so i got the whilyding back into adjustment but now I'm finding that the pillow block does not always work as it should. that gets to be a lot of screws to mess with.
[06:32:06] <danimal_garage> pillow block?
[06:33:04] <mIreland> that's what they call the stopper thingie for the turret. it is behind a 1" plug under the right hand side panel.
[06:33:28] <mIreland> yours seems to be working famously
[06:33:55] <danimal_garage> gotcha
[06:33:59] <mIreland> mine stops the turret at different places depending on how long ive been aired up, i think
[06:34:03] <danimal_garage> yea mine's working fine now
[06:34:11] <danimal_garage> odd
[06:35:03] <mIreland> i believe it's time to tear into the turret. i cannot allow it to run without me like this.
[06:35:05] <danimal_garage> isnt the stopper the bigger selanoid under the very front cover?
[06:35:27] <danimal_garage> there's a rod that pushes on the stopper pawl
[06:35:49] <mIreland> yes, but it operates a lever which has a plunger on it. that plunger works in the 1" cap
[06:36:00] <danimal_garage> hmm
[06:36:20] <danimal_garage> well sounds like you know more about it than i. i havent gotten that far into it, thankfully
[06:36:40] <mIreland> it makes it hit gently instead of hard, hence the name pillow block.
[06:36:49] <danimal_garage> gotcha
[06:36:56] <mIreland> my chucker came with books. a mixed blessing
[06:37:16] <danimal_garage> i got some literature, but i havent really gone through it too much
[06:37:45] <danimal_garage> i'm more of a "tear into it and learn as you go" kinda guy
[06:37:50] <danimal_garage> not a big reader
[06:38:04] <mIreland> my advice is don't fool with it until it breaks, but then where is the fun in that?
[06:38:12] <danimal_garage> ha
[06:38:24] <mIreland> toolchanger has been the main hangup at all stages
[06:38:28] <danimal_garage> your air pressure good?
[06:38:33] <mIreland> yes
[06:38:57] <danimal_garage> well like i said, if you use the turret down sensor as your safety, you can leave it unattended
[06:39:16] <danimal_garage> it'll just not continue to run till you seat it properly
[06:39:23] <mIreland> i think oil seeps in and affects the pillow. i can get scary halfengaged toolchanges at times; not good.
[06:39:43] <danimal_garage> i did too till today
[06:40:03] <mIreland> i worried that turret would not seat fully if that happened a lot
[06:40:15] <mIreland> maybe why #7 is hissing...
[06:40:30] <danimal_garage> well if it didnt seat properly, the turret down switch would be false
[06:40:49] <mIreland> quite so. i have verified that just lately
[06:41:00] <danimal_garage> so your program wouldnt run, if your ladder was set up the way it should be
[06:41:37] <mIreland> you are correct. all should be safe.
[06:42:06] <danimal_garage> you could even set it up so it re-attempts the toolchange if it doesnt seat within x amount of time
[06:42:27] <danimal_garage> so even if it messes up, it can fit itself
[06:42:54] <danimal_garage> so the machine isnt just sitting idle waiting for you to fix it while you're off dropping a deuce
[06:42:56] <mIreland> as it is it just poltergeist spins until it becomes satisfied and latches in.
[06:43:17] <danimal_garage> kinda, yea
[06:43:23] <mIreland> but i see you have thought this out as i have...
[06:44:16] <danimal_garage> yea, i spent some time on it lol
[06:45:31] <mIreland> that reminds me. I've never been sure i set up the homing sequence on this thing correctly. do you have that figured out on your machine?
[06:46:00] <danimal_garage> yep, works great
[06:46:34] <danimal_garage> use an and2 component
[06:46:39] <danimal_garage> in hal
[06:46:50] <danimal_garage> you can do it in ladder too
[06:46:55] <danimal_garage> there are 2 home switches
[06:47:01] <danimal_garage> plus the index
[06:47:58] <danimal_garage> you want to make it so hal only sees the home switch if both home switches (per axis) are active at the same time
[06:48:05] <danimal_garage> and then searches for index
[06:48:38] <mIreland> i have to touch it in on startup and it does vary quite a bit. i would expect it to zero exactly the same each time.
[06:49:08] <mIreland> index is distinct from fine home sw?
[06:50:52] <danimal_garage> index is different, yes
[06:51:03] <danimal_garage> are you using the resolvers still?
[06:53:56] <mIreland> yes. bought resolver encoders from jon elson. put a shaft encoder in place of spindle encoder. axes are all original.
[06:54:16] <danimal_garage> then the resolvers have their own index point
[06:54:46] <danimal_garage> so when your course and fine switches are both true, then have it search for index
[06:55:07] <mIreland> that's what i thought... seems i had trouble with that for some reason.
[06:55:34] <danimal_garage> you might have to adjust the fine home switch so it's active the same time as the couse one
[06:56:15] <danimal_garage> to do that, i set up pyvcp leds connected to those pins so i could easily see it when i was rotating the fine home switch
[06:57:03] <danimal_garage> it'll home out to the accuracy of the machine
[06:57:23] <danimal_garage> meaning within tenths of a thou
[06:57:31] <mIreland> mmm delicious
[06:57:57] <danimal_garage> there are 10 index points per rev, so using both home switches is important
[06:58:14] <danimal_garage> otherwise it could easily be off .02" every once in a while
[06:58:34] <mIreland> what could need adjusting if anything?
[06:58:43] <danimal_garage> the fine home switch
[06:59:19] <danimal_garage> the whole resolver/tach/fine home switch/gear box can rotate easily if you loosen the 4 screws around it
[06:59:45] <danimal_garage> if you pop off the covers where the resolvers are, you'll see what i mean
[07:00:01] <danimal_garage> but if you havent touched them, chances are they are in the right position
[07:00:41] <mIreland> yikes. i haven't touched them and will try like hell to fix it without doing so.
[07:01:13] <mIreland> I was very pleased to not have to touch any of the axis drive assemblies
[07:02:50] <danimal_garage> i took my z axis apart to see if i could easily mount encoders
[07:02:55] <danimal_garage> like a dumbass
[07:03:16] <mIreland> did you switch out resolvers?
[07:03:26] <danimal_garage> nope
[07:03:34] <danimal_garage> got the pico boards too
[07:04:11] <mIreland> jeez, i hope we at least mounted the stuff in different places :)
[07:04:38] <mIreland> 5i20, 7i33, 7i37?
[07:05:35] <danimal_garage> yep
[07:05:41] <danimal_garage> and 7i42
[07:07:06] <mIreland> what is 7i42 for?
[07:09:03] <danimal_garage> just a breakout board
[07:10:24] <mIreland> what you using for a computicator?
[07:10:33] <danimal_garage> dell
[07:10:45] <danimal_garage> craigslist special
[07:10:48] <danimal_garage> p4
[07:10:56] <danimal_garage> gig o'ram
[07:11:00] <danimal_garage> 200g hd
[07:11:34] <danimal_garage> u?
[07:12:57] <mIreland> very nice. I went with an $85 intel atom motherboard and 2G ram for $40. using 8g thumbdrive for hd. all mounted in the relay cabinet.
[07:13:14] <mIreland> My chucker is my best computer
[07:14:32] <mIreland> I need to lace up the wiring nice once and for all and mount the USB connectors in the side of the cabinet.
[07:16:31] <mIreland> It has internet. I'm on it rite now.
[07:28:57] <danimal_garage> yuck. just unclogged the coolant drain
[07:29:03] <danimal_garage> nasty
[07:29:16] <mIreland> no treasure?
[07:29:18] <danimal_garage> had to scoop out a bunch of chips by hand
[07:29:40] <danimal_garage> well, my nose tricked me into thinking i was smelling fresh blueberries
[07:29:49] <danimal_garage> does that count?
[07:31:13] <mIreland> well sure it does
[07:31:21] <danimal_garage> i'm off to eat dinner, adios
[07:31:28] <danimal_garage> good luck with the tool changer
[07:31:34] <mIreland> enjoy
[08:07:59] <numen> hi
[08:08:13] <numen> does anyone use an xbox 360 controller with emc2?
[08:09:30] <Jymmm> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?Simple_Remote_Pendant
[08:09:55] <numen> Jymmm the questions is, which module should i use
[08:10:26] <Jymmm> http://www.google.com/search?q=joystick+site%3Alinuxcnc.org&client=firefox-a
[08:11:10] <numen> Jymmm the problem is, that it is a wireless controller, which can not connect without the correct driver module
[08:11:48] <Jymmm> I would NEVER use a wireless ANYTHING
[08:12:03] <numen> why?
[08:12:25] <archivist_emc> Jymmm, not even your mobile phone!
[08:42:37] <renesis> he has wires to the tower
[08:42:53] <renesis> with a little transmitter antenna pointing into the big reciever antenna
[08:55:19] <lkthomas> hey guys
[09:09:46] <lilalinux_away> lilalinux_away is now known as lilalinux
[09:16:57] <micges_work> hi
[09:18:28] <numen> hi micges_work
[09:18:52] <micges_work> hi numen
[09:43:13] <Jymmm> cradek: alex_joni Another spam bot idiot (mrhtvqkfci has joined (n=tmlhp@host86-128-63-45.range86-128.btcentralplus.com)) set channel to +R for a bit. Just fyi
[10:02:55] <MarkusBec_away> MarkusBec_away is now known as MarkusBec
[10:10:57] <piasdom> g'morning all
[10:37:16] <numen> the contoller does not work, but it shows the values
[10:37:22] <numen> has anyone an .hal file for an joypad, which works with steppers?
[10:37:28] <numen> could anyone check nopaste.info/5abdde269e.html
[10:55:09] <numen> noone?
[11:00:40] <numen> hmmm
[13:04:49] <numen> is it possible, to say a range with the joypad, where it does not move?
[13:08:30] <Valen> not too many people are on at this time
[13:09:17] <archivist_emc> the magic word to search for is deadband
[13:15:05] <numen> archivist_emc the problem is, i use an xbox 360 wireless controller, and if i dont use an joystick, it moves very slow...
[13:16:54] <archivist_emc> I know nothing about xbox
[13:19:08] <numen> archivist_emc its shown as a standart js0 gamecontroller
[13:19:38] <Valen> numen, archivist is right, you want to adjust the deadband
[13:19:41] <numen> how can i set the deandband?
[13:19:51] <numen> Valen yes, thats true
[13:19:57] <numen> shal i paste the config file?
[13:20:19] <numen> http://pastebin.com/f698823f9
[13:20:39] <numen> and i want, that it stops faster if i put the sticks in center position
[13:21:12] <Valen> if you don't touch the sticks does it stop or keep moving?
[13:23:18] <numen> it moves slow
[13:29:14] <Valen> is it a new or old controller? I think most xbox's actually return to 0
[13:29:26] <Valen> there is some kind of config thing too as i seem to vuagley recall
[13:29:45] <numen> Valen nearly 0 but not exactly
[13:30:03] <numen> so i think i should set a deadband about -0.05 til +0.05
[13:30:27] <Valen> I reckon see if you can do it outside emc
[13:30:44] <numen> i have to use an userspace driver
[13:30:49] <numen> think, this is not possible
[13:31:46] <Valen> I believe you need to run jscalibrator
[13:32:30] <numen> where to find?
[13:32:37] <numen> Valen its not always same value
[13:32:52] <Valen> calibrating it should let you set the deadbane
[13:33:40] <Valen> looks like for hardy its a package in unicerse
[13:34:25] <numen> Valen you know, too, how i can set the time, in which the maschine after letting the stick in the midle
[13:35:43] <Valen> I dont understant
[13:41:39] <numen> Valen with the calibration it does not work
[13:42:17] <Valen> what does not work?
[13:42:27] <numen> set the deadband
[13:42:34] <Valen> anyway bed time for me
[13:42:35] <numen> i set it, but its not enough
[13:47:26] <Valen> so set it to more then
[13:54:30] <numen> so the problem with the deadbane ive done
[13:55:17] <numen> but now is the problem, iv i have the stick in an max speed position, and put it to the center, it waits a short time till it begans to slow down
[13:55:20] <numen> how can i set this?
[15:05:11] <numen> how is it possible, to use a switch on my joypad for changing the moving speed?
[15:33:43] <theos> theos is now known as itheos
[15:34:21] <itheos> itheos is now known as theos
[16:23:01] <numen> re
[16:23:21] <theos> ?
[16:24:03] <numen> ?
[16:24:13] <theos> ??
[16:24:49] <numen> why?
[16:25:01] <theos> what?
[16:25:12] <numen> wtf
[16:25:25] <theos> wth
[16:28:12] <theos> theos is now known as theo-sama
[16:28:22] <theo-sama> theo-sama is now known as theos
[16:28:52] <theos> theos is now known as theo-sama
[16:29:22] <theo-sama> theo-sama is now known as theos
[17:01:46] <tlab> in Opera linuxcnc.org comes up in english and french for me lol
[17:02:29] <tlab> maybe it's german
[17:02:42] <tlab> Page d'accueil d'EMC
[17:14:05] <lilalinux> lilalinux is now known as lilalinux_away
[17:17:38] <lilalinux_away> lilalinux_away is now known as lilalinux
[18:39:51] <tom3p> end of screw bent... noticed a tight spot when turning screw shaft
[18:39:51] <tom3p> shaft end bearing mounts into flange, saw flange wobble when shaft rotated
[18:39:51] <tom3p> screw turns thru nut fine, so just the end is bent
[18:39:51] <tom3p> any ideas how to straighten? (10mmdia screw, not ball, not very hard)
[18:41:40] <cradek> in or out of the machine?
[18:41:51] <tom3p> in the head assembly
[18:41:54] <bill2or3> I'd try rolling it on a flat surface to see where the bend is, then putting it on a table with something propping it up on either side of the bend, and press.
[18:42:13] <bill2or3> but personally I'd probably just make it worse. :-|
[18:42:23] <cradek> yeah, but if it's too near the end there's no way to hold it
[18:42:51] <cradek> I've fixed pushrods by rolling them on a surface plate and bending them straight - it takes patience but is simple
[18:44:23] <tom3p> ok, time to make a tool to grip the end of shaft (30mm long straight) surface plate? maybe lathe ways...
[18:44:30] <tom3p> thx
[18:44:53] <cradek> if it's still in the bearing, you should rotate it and indicate the exact high spot and mark it
[18:45:43] <cradek> hard to eyeball stuff like that - use measuring tools where you can
[18:46:18] <tom3p> hmm, i can see it when i rotate the screw in the nut. i see the plate holding the bearing wobble. i can mount an indicator, it was just noticed by eyebal
[18:46:51] <tom3p> will use the dti to check if wobble gets better
[18:59:52] <Danimal-office> hi
[19:00:21] <Danimal-office> how come all of a sudden i have to register my nicks?
[19:01:13] <archivist> there was spam in here today
[19:01:27] <Danimal-office> oh
[19:01:46] <Danimal-office> pain in the arse.. i was wondering why noone was replying to anything i typed.
[19:02:34] <cradek> Jymmm: thanks for taking care of the channel at 4am - I was asleep (for once)!
[19:03:03] <cradek> Danimal-office: yuck. it should have told you.
[19:03:11] <archivist> lots of channels are setting +R, the problems have been around since just before xmas
[19:03:28] <Danimal-office> ha its my fault, i never really look at the server window
[19:03:34] <tom3p> do we need to memorize this new key?
[19:05:24] <danimal_garage> good thing i didnt have much impartant to say
[19:05:57] <tom3p> it may all be in your terminal buffer, just copy & paste
[19:06:37] <MOGLI> hellllo.. wht is this yaar... if nobody wants to help than please tell me
[19:07:17] <tom3p> MOGLI you havent asked anyhting
[19:07:51] <bill2or3> maybe he just needs a hug.
[19:28:54] <terrylm> hi
[19:29:32] <terrylm> OK, finally figured out that registration stuff!
[19:30:06] <cradek> that's good for next time - but for now the requirement for this channel is off.
[19:30:33] <terrylm> oh, ...
[19:30:36] <cradek> there's a irc-spam-worm thing going around and once in a while it bites us here, and we have to turn on that restriction. sorry it's a pain.
[19:30:51] <cradek> anyway welcome
[19:31:52] <terrylm> I'm looking to hook a phisical power on button (parport pin)
[19:32:13] <cradek> what do you want the button to do?
[19:32:16] <terrylm> to the machine on button in axis. Anyone know how?
[19:32:30] <cradek> ah
[19:32:50] <cradek> to go from estop-reset to machine-on state, like F2 in AXIS, you can hook a button to halui.machine-on
[19:33:20] <terrylm> OK
[19:33:43] <cradek> you can hook hardware buttons/controls to halui to do most anything you can do in the GUI
[19:34:06] <cradek> halui docs here: http://www.linuxcnc.org/docs/devel/html/gui_halui.html
[19:34:14] <terrylm> Thanks, I'll got check it out. I'll leave this logged in, but I have to go out to the shed...
[19:46:22] <danimal_garage> fresh cutting oil FTW
[19:46:35] <danimal_garage> having to drain the old cutting oil FTL
[19:46:38] <cradek> isn't it great stuff?
[19:46:44] <danimal_garage> havent tried it yet
[19:46:51] <cradek> beware - it makes you want french fries
[19:46:51] <danimal_garage> but looks nice lol
[19:46:56] <danimal_garage> yum
[19:47:28] <danimal_garage> it's funny, the tank was completely full, so i drained it and it was maybe only 3.5-4 gallons
[19:47:36] <danimal_garage> the rest was swarf
[19:47:53] <cradek> that's what keeps the level up
[19:47:59] <danimal_garage> so i cleaned it completely out
[19:47:59] <cradek> that and way oil
[19:48:07] <danimal_garage> oh crap, i shoulda left it in there? lol
[19:48:11] <cradek> haha
[19:48:36] <danimal_garage> hey i think i found a bug in emc
[19:48:37] <cradek> if mine gets too low to pump (but still smells and works ok) I'm going to put rocks in there
[19:48:45] <danimal_garage> haha good idea
[19:48:46] <cradek> oh?
[19:49:43] <danimal_garage> yes. if i use TOOL_CHANGE_QUILL_UP, TOOL_CHANGE_POSITION, or TOOL_CHANGE_AT_G30, it will not change tools
[19:49:52] <danimal_garage> (in ini)
[19:50:04] <danimal_garage> and mireland had the same issue
[19:50:12] <cradek> thanks for making the bug report - I commented on it already
[19:50:19] <danimal_garage> as soon as you take that out of ini, it works fine
[19:50:23] <danimal_garage> ah ok cool
[19:50:28] <cradek> http://sourceforge.net/tracker/?func=detail&atid=106744&aid=2941688&group_id=6744
[19:50:46] <cradek> in summary: are you sure about TOOL_CHANGE_POSITION not working?
[19:51:01] <danimal_garage> yes
[19:51:49] <danimal_garage> even if i take my ladder completely out of the equasion and do a toolchange-toolchanged and tool prep-tool preped loop, it hangs up
[19:51:49] <skunkworks_> does it move to the tool caange position?
[19:52:04] <danimal_garage> yes, that parts works fine
[19:52:15] <danimal_garage> it's the actual tool change that never happens
[19:52:31] <skunkworks_> cradek: isn't the jr using some form of that?
[19:53:09] <danimal_garage> mireland is having the same exact issue, but if we take it out, both our machines work fine
[19:54:09] <cradek> I found and fixed AT_G30 and QUILL_UP a while back
[19:54:10] <danimal_garage> cradek: every once in a while it will complete a tool change, but only if it was already in the g30 position and i f2/f2 before i attempt
[19:54:28] <cradek> I have always used and never had trouble with TOOL_CHANGE_POSITION
[19:54:36] <danimal_garage> weird
[19:54:39] <cradek> if it is also giving the same problem I have a separate bug I have to find
[19:54:52] <cradek> so you're sure that if you have **only** TOOL_CHANGE_POSITION you still get this problem sometimes?
[19:55:19] <danimal_garage> i'm running production now, but once i'm done, i can check again for you
[19:55:36] <cradek> I'd appreciate that. Please try in a program and also in mdi
[19:55:42] <cradek> (they may act differently)
[19:55:43] <danimal_garage> but i'm fairly sure i tried all 3 individually
[19:55:51] <danimal_garage> ok
[19:55:59] <danimal_garage> i only tried in mdi
[19:56:18] <danimal_garage> probably betwen today and tomorrow i can try it
[19:56:45] <colbq200> hmm iv just discovered a huge flaw in being self employed
[19:56:47] <danimal_garage> i just dont want to restart emc since i'd have to indicate my fixture again
[19:56:57] <colbq200> my boss is a dick :P
[19:57:10] <cradek> danimal_garage: sure, np, just let me know
[19:57:24] <danimal_garage> for now, i just put a g30 in the program before the tool change
[19:57:35] <skunkworks_> colbq200: you should take him out back and have a few rounds with him... ;)
[19:57:47] <cradek> yeah AT_G30 and QUILL_UP were definitely broken in 2.3.4 unfortunately
[19:58:11] <colbq200> skunkworks_ yeah but i think ill lose
[19:58:19] <danimal_garage> btw, mill tool changer is working awesome, i've been running it quite a bit
[19:58:30] <cradek> neat
[19:58:35] <skunkworks_> * skunkworks_ has visions of 'fight club'
[19:58:43] <colbq200> lol
[19:58:46] <danimal_garage> haha
[19:58:59] <colbq200> skunkworks i was thinking the same
[20:13:55] <MOGLI> hello anybody here...
[20:16:05] <tarzan> hi
[20:27:59] <terrylm> Thanks, the advice on hooking up panel buttons with halui worked great.
[20:28:17] <cradek> great, welcome
[20:29:33] <terrylm> I had already hooked the feedhold to motion.feedhold, but now I see there is also a halui.program.pause, is it the same thing? which is better?
[20:30:48] <cradek> motion.feedhold is realtime (starts stopping in the same millisecond you assert it). halui.program.pause does the same things as pause in the GUI, and is what you need if you want to single step
[20:31:23] <cradek> so they are not the same thing and neither is better - they are just different
[20:32:06] <terrylm> Thanks for clearing that up for me.
[20:32:51] <MOGLI> can anybody help me with threading G76???
[20:33:24] <cradek> I bet that depends on the specifics of the question
[20:34:39] <MOGLI> my machine simply freez down on G76... it shows running but there is no machine movment :(
[20:34:44] <MOGLI> :(
[20:35:00] <cradek> what kind of spindle encoder setup do you have?
[20:35:19] <MOGLI> spindle encoder working fine....
[20:35:25] <cradek> tell me about it
[20:35:38] <MOGLI> its a single channel.. i mean i used only PHASE A
[20:36:23] <MOGLI> u there??
[20:36:48] <archivist> we need some more clue in your question
[20:37:07] <cradek> you need an index pulse. do you not have that?
[20:39:29] <terrylm> Panel button question again. The feedhold button is lighted, would I use halui.program.is-paused to turn the light on?
[20:40:04] <cradek> terrylm: if the button does program.pause I think that would be a good way to light it
[20:40:06] <MOGLI12> sorry got dc... my net sucks..
[20:40:10] <MOGLI12> u there cradek??
[20:40:26] <cradek> if it does realtime motion.feedhold, that won't come on
[20:40:33] <terrylm> It does motion.feed-hold.
[20:40:36] <MOGLI12> i am using ENCODER PHASE A only.. it shows perfect speed 760RPM
[20:40:44] <cradek> you need index pulse
[20:40:58] <MOGLI12> without index its not possible???
[20:41:02] <cradek> no
[20:41:13] <cradek> index pulse is what lets emc know to line up multiple threading passes
[20:41:43] <MOGLI12> i am running short of input lines.. i think i neeed to sacrifice limit switch..
[20:41:53] <MOGLI12> hey cradek its not showing any error....
[20:42:10] <MOGLI12> only index pulse will do?? or PHASE A also needed??
[20:42:17] <cradek> it's not an error, it's simply waiting for the index pulse, which is the correct behavior
[20:42:36] <MOGLI12> oh.. ok got it ...
[20:42:41] <cradek> brb
[20:42:42] <MOGLI12> thanks thank you very much...
[20:42:57] <archivist> you need both phase A and the index for quality threading
[20:43:43] <MOGLI12> ok archivist.. got it... tell me one thing does it affect scaling?
[20:44:09] <MOGLI12> i mean right now my encoder scaling is set to 250?? what it would be if i use index and Phase A?? i am using 250PPR ENCODER
[20:44:40] <archivist> scaling is a separate concept to having an index pulse
[20:45:02] <MOGLI12> ok let me try using index pulse..
[20:45:03] <MOGLI12> brb
[20:45:10] <MOGLI12> thanks cradek thanks archivist..
[20:45:48] <numen> hi
[20:49:29] <terrylm> My next question is how to implement a lathe tool turret. I've read all I can find on tool changing and have found a few pieces to the puzzle, but mostly this seems to be undocumented?
[20:51:41] <archivist> not many are the same, so are machine specific as far as I can see
[20:55:51] <terrylm> This one is 8 position, has a 1000 count encoder (A, B, index) directly on the turret shaft, and is driven by a 500 ppr stepper motor. At this point I don't know the gear ratio from the motor to the turret. There is an electric lock that makes an impressive clank and it locks and unlocks.
[20:58:12] <terrylm> Oh, ya, and the motor shares the drive amp with the Z axis, so there is a relay board to select Z or turret for the drive amp.
[21:01:36] <andypugh> Is the celeron55 here the same as the Heekscad Celeron55?
[21:02:10] <terrylm> Is there a better place/time/person to find out about implementing a turret?
[21:02:14] <skunkworks_> I would guess. join #cam
[21:02:48] <skunkworks_> andypugh: ^
[21:03:25] <andypugh> I haven't got as far as having any specific questions yet.
[21:03:46] <archivist> yes he is
[21:03:53] <terrylm> #cam would be a good place for emc/hal tool chang question?
[21:04:07] <andypugh> Just looking into the possibility of a Mac build, I gave up on Google Sketchup when I couldn't figure out how to place a hole in a defined place.
[21:04:10] <archivist> terrylm, in here for that
[21:04:46] <archivist> andypugh, danielfalck has managed a mac build
[21:05:09] <terrylm> My need to to implement a lathe tool turret.
[21:05:21] <andypugh> And no, this is a perfectly good place to ask about emc toolchangers
[21:05:47] <e3mm> e3mm is now known as e3m
[21:05:58] <archivist> terrylm, also look at the archive of discussions from in here
[21:06:18] <terrylm> OK
[21:07:28] <skunkworks_> I think your turrit would have to be 'homed' when the machine is first brought up so it would know where the index was... would it turn forever? or does it only have afew hundred degrees of rotation?
[21:10:33] <skunkworks_> I would also think it would be 100 times easier if you gave the turrit its own drive.
[21:10:38] <cradek> the carousel on my mill "homes" the first time I do a tool prep. the smarts is all in ladder.
[21:10:50] <skunkworks_> cradek: nice.
[21:10:52] <celeron55> andypugh: yes i am
[21:11:36] <cradek> you could do the same with a real encoder. you just have to assume it unhomed at startup, and then when it seeks a certain position, if it's not homed yet - home it
[21:11:53] <skunkworks_> cradek: the first time you do a tool prep - it just turns in one direction until it get an 'index'?
[21:12:09] <andypugh> You might not have wanted to admit that. (Though currently I have stalled at the first hurdle, waiting for a download authorisation link from OpenCascade
[21:12:25] <terrylm> I just got back, was looking at the irc archive, is there a way to search it with out downloading what looks like several hundred little files?
[21:12:34] <cradek> for the first tool I have it go forward to home and then continue on in that direction to find the tool. subsequently it goes in the optimal direction.
[21:12:51] <cradek> terrylm: just using google works kind of ok for that
[21:13:22] <andypugh> The search link on the linuxcnc homepage (lower left) searches the IRC archive too.
[21:13:45] <skunkworks_> really? I don't think I knew that. neat
[21:14:24] <cradek> skunkworks_: it could reverse after homing, but it's just a 3ph motor on contactors so reverse without stopping is a little violent
[21:14:54] <skunkworks_> heh
[21:15:01] <skunkworks_> just a few more latter rungs... ;)
[21:15:20] <cradek> actually there's special ladder to keep it from reversing in this initial homing case
[21:15:29] <cradek> oh you mean to stop first, yeah :-)
[21:15:32] <skunkworks_> heh
[21:18:53] <terrylm> OK, the search got about 300 hit for tool turret, some fromthe archive, I'll wade though that with time, but it sounds like some of you here have actually done it befor.
[21:19:28] <cradek> I think a lot of folks have :-)
[21:19:29] <archivist> someone has done more than once
[21:19:41] <archivist> not me
[21:19:48] <terrylm> Great
[21:19:49] <cradek> using a real encoder with index is slightly harder I bet, but you can do it
[21:24:03] <terrylm> OK, the shared drive amp thing aside, it seems like the basic steps are: 1. move to a good location. 2. unlock the turret. 3. If need be, home it, run it around untill it finds the index pulse (1000 count encoder directly on turret shaft), 4. Keep track of tool posisition in classic ladder? or some where? 5. go to the tool. 6. Lock it. Done?
[21:24:38] <cradek> yep
[21:26:13] <terrylm> OK, so starting with the first part, how do I get it to move to a tool change location when m6 is called?
[21:26:38] <cradek> m6 can automatically move for you. you put the tool change position in the ini file.
[21:26:56] <anonimasu> hm, one tip is to always make a _safe_ move before calling m6
[21:26:58] <terrylm> Oh, that is handy.
[21:27:14] <cradek> yeah you definitely have to be sure you're clear
[21:27:29] <terrylm> yes, I always clear the part befor calling m6.
[21:27:29] <anonimasu> even though it makes some prep moves, always remember
[21:36:06] <terrylm> OK, TOOL_CHANGE_POSITION in the [EMCIO] section. I had tried that earlyer, but got an error about the format being bad, so just put 0 0 and still got the error.
[21:37:13] <andypugh> I think I am going to give up on Heekscad, I can't even get the first dependency, wxGTK
[21:39:38] <terrylm> I also see TOOL_CHANGE_AT_G30, which I could also use.
[21:40:07] <cradek> I like that on my lathe. I can set tool change location depending on the work stickout and the longest tool
[21:41:32] <terrylm> OK, now that M6 moves to a good place, how to do the next step, unlock the turret, this is a parport pin to a relay.
[21:46:26] <cradek> terrylm: I think it's easiest to do sequencing type tasks in ladder.
[21:47:30] <cradek> to manipulate index-enable yourself (not hooked to the motion controller) for homing, you'll probably have to use the tristate_bit component
[21:48:12] <terrylm> Are there any examples?
[21:49:01] <cradek> none suitably close to your situation that you can just tweak them without full understanding, I bet
[21:49:43] <cradek> I think once you're homed you'll want to use a limit3 block to drive the turret's servo to the various positions
[21:52:47] <terrylm> OK, I'm reading about classic ladder now, done lots of programing, but never an ladder or PLC work.
[21:53:47] <cradek> you could also write a comp if you're more comfortable with that, but I think ladder is simpler
[21:54:46] <cradek> the advantage of a comp is you could control the r/w index pin more directly
[21:57:47] <terrylm> I've been meaning to learn ladder programing anyway, so will go that route.
[21:58:19] <terrylm> I'll step out to the shed for a bit and play with it...
[21:58:47] <archivist_emc> run a network cable to shed :)
[21:59:01] <andypugh> WDS might be easier
[22:00:21] <andypugh> (Now installing the new version of XCode Tools, so I can get Macports to run, so I can get wxGTK (As neither Fink nor apt-get can find it). And I thought Linux was complicated!
[22:03:34] <andypugh> I am wondering why it has taken me so long to think of trying Heekscad on theUbuntu VM...
[22:03:55] <terrylm> Actually the networking comes from the shed...
[22:04:54] <terrylm> I just started this chat from the house.
[22:08:38] <acemi> There is a note in the kernel changelog which says that "module_param_array() on charp doesn't work reliably"
[22:08:47] <acemi> http://www.kernel.org/pub/linux/kernel/v2.6/ChangeLog-
[22:09:32] <alex_joni> 1) module_param_array() on charp doesn't work reliably, since we use an
[22:09:33] <alex_joni> uninitialized temporary struct kernel_param.
[22:09:37] <alex_joni> acemi: yuck
[22:10:44] <acemi> does this mean that module_param_array has to be deleted from EMC code?
[22:11:03] <acemi> for charp
[22:11:43] <alex_joni> acemi: interesting question
[22:12:03] <alex_joni> acemi: hopefully it'll get fixed for 2.6.32
[22:12:27] <acemi> "The simplest fix (ie. for 2.6.32) is to never free the memory"
[22:12:37] <acemi> this is the fix for 2.6.32
[22:12:38] <skunkworks_> heh
[22:12:43] <alex_joni> another thing I'm thinking is to maybe try allocating the memory in the module
[22:12:58] <alex_joni> acemi: I read that, but I'm not sure what they mean by free the memory...
[22:13:05] <alex_joni> from the module? from insmod? ...
[22:24:50] <alex_joni> http://verydemotivational.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/11/129035528626063351.jpg <- ROFL
[22:25:40] <anonimasu> alex_joni: I finally bought a eos :)
[22:25:51] <alex_joni> anonimasu: 500?
[22:26:00] <anonimasu> 1000d
[22:26:04] <anonimasu> the 500 was too steep for me
[22:26:09] <Vq> alex_joni: i wish i had one of those :)
[22:26:10] <anonimasu> it was like 300 eur more
[22:26:13] <anonimasu> http://www.io23.net/ul/files/IMG_2794.JPG
[22:26:34] <Vq> as well as one of those solar-cell powered flashlights...
[22:27:31] <anonimasu> alex_joni: I regret not buying one a long time ago :)
[22:33:18] <Jymmm> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mI9LxjuNT0U&feature=response_watch
[22:35:32] <jepler> it looks like the uses of module_param_array(charp) in the kernel all have the array uninitialized, which means it's full of NULLs
[22:36:41] <jepler> I think it is doing something like trying to free the old value
[22:39:29] <alex_joni> Vq: and wifi spray
[22:39:55] <jepler> so yeah that patch you named might fix this behavior, as it removes the kfree in param_set_charp
[22:40:35] <jepler> but perhaps we should future-proof our use of these by making them be NULL / uninitialized
[22:41:57] <skunkworks_> Jymmm: really cute. :)
[22:42:13] <skunkworks_> one of our cats would bark when we got the laser out..
[22:42:18] <Jymmm> skunkworks_: Yeah it is =)
[23:06:56] <MarkusBec> MarkusBec is now known as MarkusBec_away
[23:23:01] <andypugh> http://toolmonger.com/2010/01/28/its-just-cool-portable-wooden-cnc-machine/
[23:24:03] <bill2or3> I saw that, dunno why he didn't use a base, with a big hole in it.
[23:24:11] <bill2or3> it just looks wobbly without one.
[23:30:18] <andypugh> I am bored of watching my mac install wxGTK. It seems to have a semi-infinite number of dependencies, xmlparser. libncurses and up. It's been downloading and installing for an hour or more, but at least it is actually working now.
[23:30:46] <andypugh> If I ever tire of life, I might try a Mac-native EMC install :-)
[23:30:58] <bill2or3> pass.
[23:33:31] <tomp> hello
[23:33:53] <tomp> tomp is now known as tom3p
[23:34:09] <danimal_garage> hello
[23:34:43] <tom3p> thx, hello is more important now as a verification that this thing fskn works ;)
[23:35:36] <danimal_garage> hello, is anyone in here? anyone seen tom3p lately?
[23:36:47] <tom3p> not me. wow its 7deg F here, just walked home from grocery store after 5ths top the car was dead dead, not even click... oh well winter in the midwest
[23:37:29] <tom3p> got my 10000 steps doen for today
[23:52:50] <danimal_garage> lol
[23:52:53] <danimal_garage> that sucks
[23:53:03] <danimal_garage> it's like 70f here right now
[23:53:26] <alex_joni> 21F here
[23:53:40] <danimal_garage> i turned my air on when i had some hyraulic lines disconnected and it made a friggin mess :(
[23:53:47] <alex_joni> heh
[23:53:56] <alex_joni> g'night all
[23:53:59] <danimal_garage> nite
[23:54:08] <tom3p> nite alex
[23:59:35] <numen> has anyone an idea, how i can use 2 buttoms on my joypad, for setting high and low speed for moving?
[23:59:43] <numen> i use the joypad_v2.hal