#emc | Logs for 2009-12-29

[00:00:04] <frallzor> these are internal protocols
[00:00:34] <SWPadnos> that makes it harder, especially if they don't publish the protocols and the subset that your VFD supports
[00:00:52] <frallzor> LonWorks , DeviceNet, Modbus RTU och Profibus and card that can work with it
[00:00:56] <frallzor> *cards
[00:01:39] <SWPadnos> I believe all the protocols you mentioned define how to address various registers/memories, but tell nothing of what the various memory locations actually do
[00:02:37] <frallzor> should the info be in the manual?
[00:03:17] <SWPadnos> it may be
[00:04:02] <frallzor> I hate this =)
[00:04:21] <frallzor> guess Ill mate it just go on/off via relay
[00:04:23] <frallzor> *make
[00:05:39] <SWPadnos> that's certainly easier, since they're sure to have included a description of the physical connections in the manual
[00:05:55] <frallzor> that there is
[00:16:24] <ries> frallzor: properly you just need to write a bye somewhere... you can call the company and ask where the datasheet
[00:20:15] <frallzor> dont know about that, I got this vfd used, and dont think they deal with anyone
[00:20:29] <frallzor> no answer yet on my other Q =)
[00:26:36] <ries> frallzor: the other question... Hmm we passed rail grinding... what was your other Q?
[00:26:52] <frallzor> the Q i mailed danfoss
[00:26:58] <frallzor> they dont seem to like me =)
[00:27:00] <frallzor> no answer
[00:34:02] <ries> frallzor: sometimes it takes time...
[00:55:45] <lilalinux> lilalinux is now known as lilalinux_away
[01:15:51] <jimbo> MIN_FERROR what am I shooting for? same for FERROR
[01:22:21] <cradek> FERROR is the allowance at max velocity. MIN_FERROR is the allowance at min velocity (stopped)
[01:22:38] <cradek> so the cutoff is the interpolation of the two
[01:24:41] <jimbo> so based on speed your error is allowed to grow. So if your MiN errorshould be around .001.
[01:24:55] <cradek> sounds reasonable
[01:25:56] <jimbo> And your FERROR should be around .020?
[01:26:45] <cradek> I've always been able to get good following on rapids too, so I set them much closer together
[01:27:05] <cradek> what allowance you need depends on how good you can get your tuning
[02:43:05] <MarkusBec> MarkusBec is now known as MarkusBec_away
[02:48:07] <a-l-p-h-a> sup all!
[07:14:21] <ries_> ries_ is now known as ries
[08:09:13] <lilalinux_away> lilalinux_away is now known as lilalinux
[11:13:46] <Valen> Lyta was a hottie
[11:49:03] <MattyMatt> and the actress was married to the guy in the vorlon suit, as my casual research showed
[11:49:58] <MattyMatt> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patricia_Tallman
[11:50:05] <MattyMatt> mm stuntwoman
[12:06:19] <Valen> she was on ds9 and voyager?
[12:06:21] <Valen> i never knew
[12:07:06] <lilalinux> lilalinux is now known as lilalinux_away
[12:22:16] <lilalinux_away> lilalinux_away is now known as lilalinux
[12:37:50] <archivist> anyone know if a celeron 466 cuts it /me awaiting the live cd download to test properly
[12:38:29] <Jymmm> Not so much cpu as mobo
[12:38:52] <archivist> Im going through some old crap to throw out or keep
[12:39:25] <Jymmm> whatcha got?
[12:41:27] <archivist> micro star 6183
[12:42:52] <Jymmm> Ah 810e chipset
[12:43:41] <Valen> celery466 should have the herbs to run it, dunno about latency or any such
[12:43:49] <Valen> if your using stepper outputs it might be a bit slow
[12:44:05] <Valen> made first real part on the mill today
[12:44:20] <Valen> turns out running a carbide tool at 2x its rated speed isnt much good for it
[12:44:22] <Jymmm> I hated that chipset - max 512MB
[12:44:38] <Valen> on a completley unrelated note, anybody know much about getting carbide tools re-ground?
[12:45:22] <Valen> sorry 2x its rated feed rate rather, 600mm/minute rather than 240 or so
[12:46:15] <archivist> you need a good grinding wheel, diamond or silicon carbide iirc
[12:47:28] <archivist> speed should not hurt a carbide tool much but vibration and poor cooling will break it
[12:47:48] <archivist> no cooling is often better than poor cooling
[12:48:52] <archivist> if dry for a short period and heats up, then gets coolant it cracks
[12:49:51] <MarkusBec_away> MarkusBec_away is now known as MarkusBec
[12:51:48] <toastydeath> Valen: it costs a couple bucks per tool
[12:52:02] <toastydeath> i think we pay $4-6 per tool
[12:52:55] <toastydeath> you'll have to call up local machine shops and ask them who they use, or look in the yellow pages
[12:55:13] <Valen> archivist I think it was doubling the feed that was the problem
[12:55:18] <Valen> it broke the corners off the tool
[12:55:54] <Jymmm> Valen: why did you feed it at twice the rated feedrate?
[12:56:09] <Valen> thought because we didn't know what the rated feed rate was
[12:56:31] <Jymmm> Valen: Then how did you know it was at twice the rated speed?
[12:56:37] <Valen> and having the ducks nuts of coated carbide tools extrapolated up from a 6mm cutter we knew
[12:56:54] <Valen> thing is we haven't used carbide before, or cut stainless
[12:57:09] <Jymmm> wait, your cutting SS ?!
[12:57:10] <Valen> now I have found the specs, I have done the maths and gone "ahh shit"
[12:57:18] <Valen> yes
[12:57:48] <toastydeath> what cutter diameter
[12:57:51] <Valen> 12mm
[12:57:54] <Valen> half inch
[12:57:58] <Jymmm> ouch
[12:58:06] <toastydeath> i'd feed a half inch cutter at like .001-.002 per tooth in ss
[12:58:16] <toastydeath> 300 sfm, and only with coolant
[12:58:25] <Valen> we had flood coolant
[12:58:35] <Valen> until the coolant pump blew up lol
[12:58:36] <toastydeath> assuming solid carbide
[12:58:40] <Valen> yeah solid
[12:58:48] <toastydeath> how many teeth
[12:58:48] <Valen> with a super coating on it
[12:58:50] <Valen> 4
[12:58:52] <toastydeath> good
[12:58:53] <Valen> 1600 RPM
[12:59:10] <toastydeath> cool
[12:59:22] <toastydeath> carbide is fairly intolerant of being overfed in stainless
[12:59:28] <toastydeath> as you've discovered
[12:59:32] <Valen> yeah, noticed that lol
[12:59:39] <Jymmm> any shrapnal from the coolant pump?
[12:59:56] <Valen> nah just overheated, ironicly enough
[13:00:02] <toastydeath> also what was your depth of cut
[13:00:07] <Valen> 0.5mm
[13:00:09] <toastydeath> and width?
[13:00:31] <toastydeath> (radial stepover)
[13:00:34] <Valen> varied from 0 (rhinocam likes to cut lots of air) to ~80%
[13:00:43] <Valen> it was set to 80%
[13:01:01] <toastydeath> minimal overhang?
[13:01:07] <Valen> ?
[13:01:14] <toastydeath> i.e. the tool isn't sticking out a mile from the spindle
[13:01:14] <Jymmm> I'm a wuss and do everything at 40%
[13:01:22] <Valen> about 40mm or so
[13:02:06] <Valen> its got 35mm of flutes
[13:02:35] <toastydeath> seems like everything else is good
[13:02:49] <Valen> yeah, I think its just an experience thing
[13:03:11] <Valen> we were under the impression that our 1600 RPM spindle speed was way low, but it seems about right for these things
[13:03:19] <toastydeath> also one thing to note, with small cutters like half inch and so forth
[13:03:28] <toastydeath> make sure the coolant jets are directly hitting the cutter
[13:03:33] <Valen> I think we just read about everybody else uses 6mm mills and cause them large
[13:03:44] <Valen> we try as best we can
[13:03:45] <toastydeath> and not just flooding the general area
[13:03:58] <Valen> the cutter usually has about 3 or 4mm of water on it
[13:04:05] <toastydeath> it's not about water on it
[13:04:08] <toastydeath> it's about chip evacuation
[13:04:17] <Valen> yeah, it does a decent job of that
[13:04:20] <toastydeath> and only pressure will do that, not just submerged cutting
[13:04:27] <Valen> we are going to go to a medium pressure jet setup
[13:04:38] <Valen> think 4x garden hose
[13:04:48] <Valen> at the moment its probably on par with a gravity feed
[13:04:57] <toastydeath> from experience I know that I've got about 12-15 seconds to fix a cutter that loses that direct pressure
[13:04:59] <Valen> 4x as in 4 jets
[13:05:04] <toastydeath> you only need one jet
[13:05:08] <toastydeath> it just has to directly hit the cutter
[13:05:27] <Valen> we were doing 4 so that it would be sure to hit it even if its doing the other side of a wall
[13:06:08] <Valen> looking at the cut its done there doesn't seem to be much in the way of re-cutting, given the .5mm cut depth its not been a problem so far
[13:06:29] <Valen> I was actually hoping to do deeper cuts, my understanding is thats limited by mill power and stiffness is that correct?
[13:06:39] <toastydeath> i only bring it up because it's one of those things that there's no reason not to fix if it's an issue
[13:06:52] <toastydeath> and yes, that is correct
[13:07:12] <toastydeath> and to a certain extent the cutter itself
[13:07:15] <Valen> biggest problem we have is the magnetic stick on flood hose thingie doesn't stick to the iron in the mill
[13:07:54] <toastydeath> ownt
[13:08:15] <Valen> http://garrtools.com/viewitempublic.jsp?edp=27720
[13:08:17] <toastydeath> we put all the steel jobs we get on large machines
[13:08:25] <Valen> thats the cutter we are using
[13:08:27] <toastydeath> for exactly the stiffness reason
[13:08:57] <toastydeath> i guess i can't say "we" anymore since i left
[13:09:01] <Valen> lol
[13:09:10] <Valen> we are planning on making a new mill with a granite/epoxy bed and gantry system
[13:10:00] <archivist> flimsy columns on the chinese toys annoy me
[13:10:08] <toastydeath> a machine that is "good" at cutting stainless is going to be very bulky.
[13:10:13] <Valen> might look at a Carbon fiber gantry actually, (happen to have an assload of the stuff) its really stiff, but I'm not sure if it'd damp out vibrations, it would have to be a super high frequency to bother it though
[13:10:18] <toastydeath> so i probably wouldn't really worry about it much
[13:10:29] <toastydeath> and just keeping cutting how you're cutting.
[13:10:43] <Valen> we have always planned on making the new mill
[13:10:57] <Valen> mainly using this one to make that one
[13:11:24] <toastydeath> what do you cut most of the time
[13:11:27] <toastydeath> not ss, i assume
[13:11:36] <Valen> nothing as yet
[13:11:44] <Valen> this is the first part we have made post CnC
[13:12:04] <Valen> http://www.vapourforge.com/mill/IMAG0031.jpg
[13:12:07] <Valen> thats the mill
[13:12:20] <Valen> we want to actually work mainly on hard stuff
[13:12:20] <toastydeath> cool
[13:12:28] <Valen> stainless and up, inconel etc
[13:12:37] <toastydeath> i know the urge to build a machine for ss and other hard materials is strong
[13:12:49] <Valen> we want to make torches out of it
[13:12:51] <toastydeath> but that's probably not how I'd go
[13:12:53] <Valen> and sell them
[13:13:40] <Valen> We will hopefully be replacing the spindle on this one and going to higher RPM and using ceramic cutters is the plan, (with much smaller bits)
[13:13:46] <toastydeath> consider retrofitting an older cat-50 machine
[13:13:54] <Valen> dont have one
[13:14:37] <Valen> we are in Australia, it seems in the hobby scene we are pioneers here so far lol, there are no bridgeports or anything like that around the place
[13:14:38] <toastydeath> well, the idea would be to spend the money you'd spend on building a sufficient gantry to instead buy an older machine without a control
[13:14:41] <toastydeath> ah.
[13:14:44] <archivist> hmm a cat50 machine is going to weigh some tons :)
[13:14:55] <toastydeath> i just have to warn you how difficult what you just said you're planning to do is.
[13:15:03] <Valen> I understand that
[13:15:14] <Valen> there will be much trial and error
[13:15:26] <Valen> but by the same token its all been done by other smart people before
[13:15:57] <toastydeath> good luck.
[13:16:03] <Valen> thanks ;->
[13:16:29] <Valen> I am thinking the bed for about the same volume as our current machine would weigh in the 300kg range
[13:17:02] <Valen> given that epoxy/granite is much better at vibration dampening than cast iron I'm hoping it will do a decent job
[13:17:17] <Valen> Its not going to be a 3 inch deep at 500ipm cut
[13:17:33] <Valen> I just want it to turn out parts ready for hand finishing
[13:17:45] <Valen> solid and stable, good spindle
[13:17:56] <Valen> linear scales for accuracy
[13:18:26] <Valen> small cutter at a higher feed I'm thinking
[13:19:05] <Valen> most importantly an automatic tool changer ;->
[13:19:57] <Valen> i b0rked him
[13:20:05] <Valen> with my awesomeness i presume
[13:33:19] <Valen> (00:16:02) Valen: thanks ;->
[13:33:20] <Valen> (00:16:28) Valen: I am thinking the bed for about the same volume as our current machine would weigh in the 300kg range
[13:33:20] <Valen> (00:17:01) Valen: given that epoxy/granite is much better at vibration dampening than cast iron I'm hoping it will do a decent job
[13:33:20] <Valen> (00:17:16) Valen: Its not going to be a 3 inch deep at 500ipm cut
[13:33:20] <Valen> (00:17:30) rob__ [n=rob@5ad18d09.bb.sky.com] entered the room.
[13:33:20] <Valen> (00:17:32) Valen: I just want it to turn out parts ready for hand finishing
[13:33:22] <Valen> (00:17:44) Valen: solid and stable, good spindle
[13:33:24] <Valen> (00:17:55) Valen: linear scales for accuracy
[13:33:26] <Valen> (00:18:25) Valen: small cutter at a higher feed I'm thinking
[13:33:28] <Valen> (00:19:04) Valen: most importantly an automatic tool changer ;->
[13:36:52] <archivist> Valen, did you see the pic of a 5axis DG machine a few months ago, I think its form is could be made from sheet material
[13:38:04] <Valen> no?
[13:38:31] <archivist> Im trying to find it
[13:45:04] <archivist> found it http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Bearbeitungszentrum_Schnittmodell_Hermle_01.jpg
[13:45:29] <archivist> gantry ish with toolchanger
[13:46:26] <archivist> could add webs to stiffen
[13:46:32] <Valen> oooh shiny
[13:47:08] <archivist> if I can afford I shall make something like it
[13:47:51] <archivist> started to draw it up as a built up from sheet design
[13:51:29] <Valen> how does it move X and y?
[13:51:41] <Valen> oh nvm I see
[13:52:02] <Valen> I would rather put one axis of rotation on the spindle and one on the table
[13:52:17] <archivist> you could
[13:52:29] <Valen> but I can see doing it that way giving you a large machining volume
[13:52:35] <archivist> wouldnt be a direct copy then
[13:52:50] <Valen> wouldnt be a direct copy if done in E/G either ;->
[13:52:58] <Valen> makes putting the doors on the front easy too lol
[13:53:30] <Valen> need to program a 360 rotation of the lower axis every once in a while to drop swarf off ;->
[13:53:44] <Valen> must have some pretty decent drives on those rotary axies
[13:54:09] <archivist> it does make a clean cube shape of machine though
[13:54:32] <Valen> yeah, space efficent
[13:54:40] <Valen> whack some doors on the front and its finished
[13:55:22] <archivist> the hermle website is crap though
[13:55:24] <Valen> it would be much easier to make without the stacked rotary axies
[13:55:42] <archivist> I want the stacked rotaries
[13:55:51] <Valen> yeah but you are insane ;->
[13:55:59] <archivist> only a bit
[13:56:03] <Valen> any paticular reason for wanting that?
[13:56:12] <archivist> gear making
[13:56:35] <Valen> why is stacked rotary better for that than one on the spindle?
[13:57:20] <Valen> yaknow at the expense of some inertia, if you extended the arms of that rotary up past the centerline you could put some counterweights there
[13:58:05] <archivist> for a thin pinion a support may be needed
[13:59:26] <Valen> I'm just not seeing the difference in the end result, from the parts POV both schemes have the cutter making the same actions no?
[14:01:33] <archivist> Im used to the stacked now
[14:06:25] <Valen> you have it on yours?
[14:06:35] <archivist> yes
[14:06:39] <Valen> nice
[14:06:49] <cradek> people always want to move a gantry X with two leadscrews, but I've never heard of anyone making an A trunnion out of two vertical rotaries
[14:06:53] <Valen> I thought you only had a single rotatry
[14:07:31] <Valen> cradek you lost me after "never heard of anyone"
[14:09:00] <cradek> two vertical rotaries - put a motor on each - bolt them to the table so they face one another - strap a table with a C rotary on it between them
[14:09:14] <Valen> ahh
[14:09:27] <archivist> one could control backlash that way
[14:09:35] <cradek> yeah, at least sort of
[14:10:30] <Valen> you could with suitable controllers I spose
[14:13:25] <archivist> this is my homebrew Valen http://www.collection.archivist.info/archive/djcpd/PD/2009/2009_08_15/102CANON/IMG_0246.JPG
[14:14:09] <archivist> dunno if it will still look like that when I put it back together
[14:15:26] <Valen> nice
[14:16:09] <Valen> direct drive steppers?
[14:16:43] <archivist> x an Y yes A and B are 90:1
[14:18:26] <Valen> how do you find the backlash when you are doing stuff on A and b?
[14:18:49] <archivist> all gcode runs one way
[14:19:05] <Valen> ahh
[14:19:09] <archivist> I even overrun and come back
[14:19:12] <Valen> you write all yours by hand
[14:19:17] <archivist> yes
[14:19:39] <Valen> rhinocam makes a 12000 line program to mill a 15mm hole with a 12mm cutter 20mm deep
[14:20:08] <toastydeath> that is exciting
[14:20:10] <archivist> a helical gear is about 100 lines
[14:20:36] <toastydeath> a 15mm hole is like, ten lines
[14:21:08] <Valen> it did it all with G1s
[14:21:18] <Valen> not even a G2 or 3
[14:21:29] <Valen> G15 would just be cheating (and EMC doesn't support it)
[14:23:21] <Valen> what is the option again for telling emc to smooth cuts?
[14:41:05] <archivist> http://linuxcnc.org/docs/html/gcode_main.html#sub:G61,-G61.1,-G64:
[15:10:07] <cradek> http://blog.cardomain.com/2008/12/17/heres-why-you-should-never-run-over-a-mattress/
[15:11:03] <archivist> hehe that should be on failblog too
[15:42:43] <frallzor> eyy ries
[15:43:24] <ries> hey frallzor
[15:43:40] <frallzor> do you if the springs needed for the MM is the same size for all?
[16:35:41] <Valen> archivist thanks for the link
[16:58:29] <skunkworks> jymm: other than the smp kernal probably has other positives- latency was 15000vs aprox 19000
[17:59:43] <lilalinux> lilalinux is now known as lilalinux_away
[18:04:13] <lilalinux_away> lilalinux_away is now known as lilalinux
[19:08:28] <Jymmm> What do I need to know / check when looking to buy a used scope? Specifically TDS-220... http://www2.tek.com/cmswpt/tidetails.lotr?ct=TI&cs=afs&ci=14296&lc=EN
[19:09:37] <archivist_emc> does it work
[19:10:22] <Jymmm> * Jymmm smacks archivist_emc with a clue-by-four
[19:11:00] <eric_unterhausen> how much you payin
[19:11:21] <archivist_emc> I am happy to buy dead ones at the right price, but you need a wrker
[19:11:34] <eric_unterhausen> we have a couple of the tds-200
[19:11:35] <bill20r3> check it against the calibration signal, I guess.
[19:11:46] <eric_unterhausen> they work ok
[19:11:54] <Jymmm> eric_unterhausen: define "ok"
[19:12:00] <bill20r3> if you have another known-calibrated scope you could check it against that.
[19:12:17] <Jymmm> bill20r3: Wold be my first scope.
[19:12:18] <archivist_emc> use the self cal to test
[19:12:20] <eric_unterhausen> Jymmm: I prefer the more expensive ones :)
[19:12:38] <Jymmm> eric_unterhausen: elaborate
[19:13:52] <eric_unterhausen> I thought those were a little awkward to get synced, the newer ones are better
[19:14:10] <eric_unterhausen> also, they were recalled because of a problem at high voltages
[19:14:13] <jimbo> Are you able to use HAL to create a +- 5volt squarewave at .5hz?
[19:14:41] <eric_unterhausen> so if you are going to use it on high voltages, you might want to check with tek
[19:14:48] <Jymmm> eric_unterhausen: Right, but they'll fix that still (I hope)
[19:14:56] <eric_unterhausen> I'm guessing they will
[19:15:07] <Jymmm> eric_unterhausen: Yeah, I already have the SN list of them
[19:15:28] <eric_unterhausen> I would love to have one of those scopes at the right price
[19:15:31] <Jymmm> eric_unterhausen: So what else dont you like about them
[19:15:56] <archivist_emc> I dont like not having one
[19:16:00] <Jymmm> eric_unterhausen: what would be "the right price" today?
[19:16:13] <eric_unterhausen> mostly the sync problems, they can be a little annoying
[19:17:42] <eric_unterhausen> although the auto function makes up for that to some degree
[19:18:06] <Jymmm> eric_unterhausen: what would be "the right price" today?
[19:18:26] <eric_unterhausen> It looks like getting one for less than $500 is unlikely
[19:18:37] <eric_unterhausen> I don't buy used equipment very often though
[19:19:17] <Jymmm> Ok, besides the self-calibration, what else should I look at/for?
[19:20:00] <bill20r3> uhm, read the manual, see if it has a 'self test', find out how to run it.
[19:20:36] <Jymmm> bill20r3: Is that it? I've read on some of these that the LCD is "faded"
[19:21:01] <Jymmm> I'm just not sure what all I should be looking at/for
[19:21:07] <bill20r3> I don't really have any advice specific to that model, but I know my HP has a self-test, so maybe the Tek does too.
[19:21:51] <Jymmm> bill20r3: I believe they do, I'm just needing to know what else beyond the obvious
[19:22:04] <isy> hi all
[19:22:07] <bill20r3> maybe take along a laptop with some soundcard signal generator software, so you have something to test it on.
[19:22:10] <Jymmm> not necessarily that specific make/model
[19:22:34] <eric_unterhausen> the way I use scopes, calibration isn't too essential
[19:23:30] <Jymmm> eric_unterhausen: That's like saying "the way you drive, there's no need for brakes" you need to ELABORATE a bit, no ALOT! =)
[19:23:34] <bill20r3> heh, same.
[19:23:55] <bill20r3> I use a scope for stuff I used to use a blinking LED for. :-)
[19:24:00] <eric_unterhausen> I mostly look to see that the signal is what I want to see
[19:24:04] <bill20r3> <-- amateur
[19:24:16] <eric_unterhausen> * eric_unterhausen is a mechanical engineer
[19:24:32] <Jymmm> eric_unterhausen: ok, comparison. I get that.
[19:24:54] <eric_unterhausen> it usually doesn't matter to me if a signal is off by 10%
[19:27:20] <Jymmm> * Jymmm attaches a electic shock machine to eric_unterhausen, now is that 50 or 500 volts???
[19:27:48] <eric_unterhausen> sometimes even that doesn't matter :)
[19:27:59] <Jymmm> I have no signal generator, just my HT
[19:28:02] <Jymmm> eric_unterhausen: lol
[19:30:40] <Jymmm> Hey, what happens if you stick an antenna on one of the channels?
[19:31:29] <archivist_emc> simple test is a finger to center contact
[19:33:00] <Jymmm> archivist_emc: Heh, no signal....flatline =)
[19:33:33] <archivist_emc> adjust settings or use auto
[19:38:08] <archivist_emc> the manual will tell you how to test it
[19:38:43] <Jymmm> archivist_emc: LOL, no I mean no brain function... flatline =)
[19:39:00] <eric_unterhausen> at work the fluorescents will give you a nice big signal when you touch the center
[19:39:37] <archivist_emc> dont use the term flatline for scopes unless you mean lack of deflection
[19:39:57] <eric_unterhausen> flatline is better than the unmoving dot
[19:40:08] <eric_unterhausen> of course, digitals don't usually do that
[19:40:29] <Jymmm> I meant EKG machine flatline, as in no pulse, as in dead, pushing daisies, etc
[19:40:49] <archivist_emc> my old 7403N seems to have died
[19:41:58] <eric_unterhausen> Jymmm: do you have the scope in front of you?
[19:42:13] <Jymmm> eric_unterhausen: no, looking at buying it
[19:43:21] <eric_unterhausen> I thought when you said "flatline" you were talking about the tds
[19:43:37] <archivist_emc> then "Jymmm> I meant EKG machine flatline, as in no pulse, as in dead, pushing daisies, etc" makes no sense at all
[19:51:31] <MarkusBec> MarkusBec is now known as MarkusBec_away
[19:52:22] <MarkusBec_away> MarkusBec_away is now known as MarkusBec
[19:52:37] <Jymmm> archivist_emc: Sticking a probe on a dead corpse will not show anything on a scope
[19:53:09] <Jymmm> so they tell me that is
[19:53:11] <archivist_emc> you should not be getting a dead one
[19:53:55] <archivist_emc> unless exceedingly cheap for spares
[19:54:04] <Jymmm> archivist_emc: I was joking <rolls eyes>, saying that *I* don't have any measurable brain activity - it was a joke son, a joke
[19:55:10] <Jymmm> archivist_emc: the only thing dead I was talking abut was human body, and I dont need to buy any of those for "spare parts" tyvm =)
[20:46:26] <isssy> hi all
[21:16:01] <acemi> what is the status of touchy, the user interface? is it beta? rc?
[21:39:57] <skunkworks_> cool - my 5i20 seems to work ;) hooked one whole encoder into it.
[21:41:14] <pjm> yay! mesa cards do rock!
[21:41:39] <skunkworks_> they sure do!
[21:41:51] <skunkworks_> pjm: how is your project coming?
[21:41:54] <pjm> i'm dead impressed with my 7i43
[21:42:04] <pjm> its pretty good thanks! its taking a rest over xmas etc
[21:42:33] <pjm> and i'm doing a spot of re-wiring of the PSU's etc, and adding in another stepper driver board to support 4th axis
[21:42:55] <pjm> i managed to get another couple of IMS483 microstepper drivers off ebay, and they actually work!
[21:43:07] <pjm> + they were cheap
[21:43:23] <skunkworks_> nice
[21:43:55] <pjm> so anyway i should be finished with the wiring tommorow evening, then i can start making lens adapters for my image intensifier project
[21:44:39] <pjm> also i need to think about a) a touch probe and b) a tool length auto cal device
[21:46:36] <skunkworks_> cool beans!
[21:47:21] <pjm> after that, i cannot really think of some next steps, probably replace X and Y leadscrews with some uber-precision ones
[21:47:32] <skunkworks_> my 'current' project.. http://www.electronicsam.com/images/KandT/pcbmill/tableanddisp.JPG
[21:47:39] <pjm> or just add in another ball-nut per axis
[21:47:54] <skunkworks_> you have rolled ball screws right now?
[21:47:55] <toastydeath> or a preloaded ballscrew?
[21:48:03] <bill20r3> "image intensifier" ?
[21:48:23] <pjm> um dunno exactly what type of ballscrews they are to be honest
[21:48:27] <toastydeath> bill20r3 image intensifiers add gunfire and hostages to any boring holiday photo
[21:48:36] <pjm> they were recovered from the scrap yard
[21:48:56] <bill20r3> what holiday couldn't be improved by some gunfire, after all.
[21:49:22] <toastydeath> that's what i've said for years
[21:50:43] <pjm> http://pjm.dyndns.org/cam/cnc_build_photos_etc/yaxisleadscrew.jpg = pic of leadscrew
[21:51:20] <toastydeath> pjm how much backlash does it have
[21:51:24] <skunkworks_> some backlash?
[21:51:30] <pjm> a few thou
[21:51:41] <toastydeath> is the lash constant throughout the travel
[21:51:51] <toastydeath> i.e. does it have .003" of backlash in the center, but also .003" at the edges
[21:52:00] <pjm> the leadscrews were off some glass etching system which used a big ass laser to write on reed switches
[21:52:03] <skunkworks_> BIGGER BALLS! ;)
[21:52:07] <pjm> LOL
[21:52:11] <toastydeath> HE'S GOT BIG BALLS, SHE'S GOT BIG BALLS
[21:52:13] <toastydeath> but we've got the biggest
[21:52:15] <toastydeath> balls of them all!
[21:52:20] <pjm> yeah the backlash is pretty constant
[21:52:32] <pjm> i think its 3 on Y and 4 on X
[21:52:36] <toastydeath> then what skunkworks_ said holds, if you can find balls to repack the screw
[21:52:43] <toastydeath> you should be able to get larger ones to preload it
[21:52:51] <pjm> right
[21:52:52] <toastydeath> i think a couple people here have done that, i certainly haven't
[21:53:15] <pjm> when i first got them, i made the error of removing the leadscrew from the ball nut assy
[21:53:22] <pjm> then some 'raining' noise happened
[21:53:37] <pjm> and all of a sudden, ball bearings all over the desk, floor, me
[21:53:39] <toastydeath> ah, the sound of pure, distilled angst and despair
[21:53:44] <pjm> hahh
[21:54:05] <pjm> it was pretty amusing but ebay came to the rescue with new balls
[21:54:11] <pjm> all held in place with grease
[21:54:21] <bill20r3> "eBay, saving your balls since 1997"
[21:54:26] <bill20r3> or whenever.
[21:54:28] <skunkworks_> is there an external ball return?
[21:54:28] <pjm> hahh
[21:54:35] <pjm> no
[21:54:39] <skunkworks_> yeck
[21:54:47] <pjm> although it looked as if there was one at manufacture
[21:54:58] <pjm> but its a 'use once' type of thing
[21:55:06] <skunkworks_> wow
[21:55:18] <skunkworks_> makes it a bit harder to re-packl
[21:55:28] <pjm> anyway i cannot decide if i should just try to get additional balls, or replace the leadscrew / ballnuts etc
[21:55:30] <skunkworks_> re-load.. whatever
[21:55:51] <pjm> yeah it was tedious to repack, but once done, seems very nice indeed
[21:56:52] <pjm> skunkworks_ btw nice pcb machine, where u get that from?
[21:57:29] <pjm> i was looking at one of these "3D" etching things u see in shopping centres, they make a scan of whatever, then burn it in a lump of perspex
[21:57:33] <skunkworks_> well - the plate was found in the junkyard. the rails and such came from a dispencing machine.
[21:57:38] <pjm> pretty nice mechanism for XYZ
[21:57:49] <skunkworks_> I think it will work for what I need
[21:57:57] <pjm> yeah it looks pretty nice!
[21:58:17] <skunkworks_> have to come up with a drive system - I don't think I will be using the cables.
[21:58:47] <skunkworks_> might go dumpstercnc anti-backlash nuts or some such thing
[21:58:59] <skunkworks_> 'cheap'
[22:02:50] <pjm> well it looks like it'll be pretty nice once u have it operational
[22:02:59] <skunkworks_> Thanks :)
[22:03:04] <pjm> i must go and fish out some more cnc parts from my local scrap yard
[22:04:21] <bill20r3> you must have a good scrapyard.
[22:04:44] <pjm> hehh its ok, but it seems the price goes up on a weekly basis
[22:05:01] <pjm> they actually look at the c**p now to estimate what they think u will pay for it
[22:05:13] <pjm> where as 5 years ago u just put it on the scales and paid by weight
[22:06:15] <bill20r3> try to look disinterested.
[22:06:34] <pjm> hehh problem is they know me there
[22:06:48] <pjm> so if i turn up with a box of 'goodies' they know its stuff i need
[22:07:22] <cradek> smear mud on it
[22:07:41] <pjm> LOL, they'd make me pay for the weight of mud too!!
[22:07:45] <cradek> put the least shiny bits on top...
[22:08:01] <pjm> i'd say this lot are worse than used car sales men
[22:08:09] <cradek> heh
[22:09:57] <skunkworks_> the old junk yard here was the same way... You could get stuff for the price of scrap as long as the guy didn't think it was worth anything
[22:10:56] <pjm> the company my dad works at has another engraver that looks like its heading for the skip/dumpster. so he's got his eyes on that
[22:11:09] <pjm> as there are nice leadscrews there plus all the motors etc
[22:30:43] <jt-plasma> I need to make some standoffs... know anyone with a CNC lathe?
[22:32:36] <toastydeath> standoffs?
[22:32:41] <toastydeath> a manual lathe will work for that
[22:32:49] <toastydeath> ugh i had to make like 50 standoffs for some stupid GE part
[22:32:58] <toastydeath> cnc, but it was still horrifically annoying
[22:36:16] <jt-plasma> yea, I will do them on the manual lathe
[22:38:45] <jt-plasma> I only need 8 I think
[22:39:24] <jt-plasma> anyone know of a good place in the USA to get Idec switches?
[22:42:59] <frallzor> I need some cuddle
[22:46:01] <Jymmm> jt-plasma: ebay
[22:49:36] <jt-plasma> Jymmm: and there they are LOL
[22:51:41] <Jymmm> jt-plasma: =)