#emc | Logs for 2009-10-31

[00:16:50] <MarkusBec> MarkusBec is now known as MarkusBec_away
[00:27:51] <andypugh> Given that my mill DC motor and drive both seem to be toast, and that I have never really liked them anyway, and that there is no reverse option and I have a perfectly good VFD already hooked up to EMC2 for the lathe spindle... Is there any reason to replace like-with-like when I can fit a 3-phase motor instead for half the price and more power?
[00:36:06] <frallzor> danfoss vlt 6011, is this a good little inverter? :)
[00:43:53] <andypugh> It doesn't look little.
[00:44:05] <andypugh> 7.5kw?
[00:44:14] <frallzor> at most yes
[00:44:21] <frallzor> 1kHz
[00:44:59] <frallzor> seems pretty ok to be futuresafe?
[00:45:06] <andypugh> What's the full part number?
[00:45:45] <andypugh> Actually, it doesn't matter if you have three phase
[00:46:03] <frallzor> I do =)
[00:46:10] <andypugh> Lucky you
[00:46:16] <frallzor> turns out its not even used
[00:47:30] <frallzor> so I can do some re-wiring and get a nice man to connect it =)
[00:48:03] <andypugh> Sounds like a plan
[00:48:34] <frallzor> is a rating of 20A good?
[00:48:36] <andypugh> Hmm, what is the difference between 3PDT and 3PCO?
[00:48:57] <frallzor> 3DPT-what
[00:49:00] <andypugh> I can never remeber
[00:49:07] <andypugh> relays
[00:49:58] <frallzor> no idea =)
[00:55:05] <jthornton> 3 pole double throw and 3 pole center off or CP030
[00:57:00] <andypugh> Do they make centre-off rlays?
[00:57:59] <jthornton> I have not seen one but well...
[00:59:39] <andypugh> OK, so they are at least as rare as I thought
[01:00:07] <andypugh> I am just figuring out how to "share" my VFD between the mill and the lathe
[01:00:46] <andypugh> And I think 3PCO is three pole change over
[01:01:42] <jthornton> your looking for "forward/reverse" contactors so to speak. Only one can be on at a time...
[01:02:05] <jthornton> they are latched so if one is on the other can not be on
[01:02:58] <jthornton> Your vfd goes to x1,2,3 of both contactors and each device goes to t1... of a contactor
[01:03:35] <andypugh> Effectively, yes
[01:04:41] <andypugh> Contactors are expensive compared to relays. I wonder what the difference is in practical terms?
[01:05:47] <jthornton> usually a relay is for controls and a contactor is for power
[01:06:16] <andypugh> http://uk.rs-online.com/web/search/searchBrowseAction.html?method=getProduct&R=2565155
[01:06:19] <jthornton> you could use a three phase fwd/rev switch
[01:06:21] <andypugh> Cheap, 10A
[01:10:27] <andypugh> Not cheap, and huge: http://uk.rs-online.com/web/search/searchBrowseAction.html?method=getProduct&R=6097454
[01:14:42] <jthornton> just put a receptacle on your vfd and a plug on each machine...
[01:15:17] <jthornton> * jthornton wanders off
[01:15:35] <jthornton> say goodnight Gracie
[08:15:19] <pjm> good morning
[08:17:02] <awallin> what's the status with running emc on 9.10 ? I'd be interested in simulator mode only (on home computer, not machine-shop)
[08:34:44] <anonimasn> morning
[08:35:20] <anonimasn> anyone knows of a cam program to handle a lathe?
[08:35:55] <anonimasn> (I finally found one)
[08:36:27] <anonimasn> err a lathe..
[08:41:02] <ds3> i'd be interested in knowing ifthere are any free ones
[08:41:16] <ds3> MasterCAM and the usual suspect does lathe but...
[08:41:59] <anonimasn> well, mastercam isnt really a option
[08:42:11] <anonimasn> and the post issues with it are huge
[09:01:29] <Valen> I'm trying to play with mastercam
[09:01:35] <Valen> its pretty damn big though lol
[09:08:45] <anonimasn> we make a bit of spare parts for machines that we build
[09:08:53] <Valen> what kind of machines?
[09:09:13] <anonimasn> mounders(I think's the name)
[09:09:28] <anonimasn> and well, lots of one off stuff for all kinds of machines
[09:09:59] <Valen> you were mentioning pistons and rods?
[09:10:09] <anonimasn> yeah for huydralic stuf
[09:10:27] <Valen> oh I was thinking engines and being all like "phwoar, hardcore" ;->
[09:10:40] <anonimasn> hehe I dont have thoose skills
[09:11:03] <Valen> I only play with rockets, nothing complicated like an IC engine
[09:11:19] <anonimasn> I'd buy edgecam in a second if I could pay for it..
[09:11:39] <anonimasn> but well, a part every few days or so(tiny stuff dosent justify that)
[09:12:06] <anonimasn> some stuff :) http://www.io23.net/ul/files/DSC00291.JPG
[09:12:41] <Valen> nice looking widgets though
[09:12:47] <anonimasn> tb housings
[09:12:51] <Valen> whats the markings on the sides?
[09:13:13] <anonimasn> tape to keep the bearings from being contaminated
[09:13:22] <Valen> ahh
[09:13:32] <Valen> nice finish on them anyway
[09:13:40] <Valen> CnC mill too or just the lathe?
[09:13:50] <anonimasn> a mill
[09:13:56] <anonimasn> err cnc
[09:13:59] <anonimasn> and a manual lathe
[09:14:33] <anonimasn> http://www.io23.net/ul/files/roller.png
[09:14:38] <anonimasn> something more for the same
[09:15:24] <anonimasn> it's funny 45 minutes per part on the lathe.. and then 7 minutes in the mill
[09:15:39] <Valen> and the lathe is doing the simple part
[09:16:48] <anonimasn> yep
[09:16:58] <anonimasn> I just picked up a old cnc lathe
[09:17:04] <anonimasn> err nc
[09:17:19] <anonimasn> denford easyturn 3
[09:17:30] <anonimasn> with a broken control or motor
[09:20:33] <anonimasn> I hope I can get it working so I can make some air horns for theese things :)
[09:20:41] <Valen> rofl
[09:21:12] <anonimasn> though this is just hobby stuff :)
[09:22:27] <anonimasn> brb, I'm gonna go to work and start making thoose rollers
[09:22:37] <Valen> have fun
[09:23:20] <MattyMatt> this is the controller setup I'd like, but it's overpriced for what its capabilities I feel -> http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/USB-Stepper-Motor-Motion-Controller-4-Axis---Made-in-UK_W0QQitemZ320441627159
[09:23:44] <Valen> probably wont work with EMC
[09:24:32] <Valen> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4pAxqw5yeZM is ours
[09:24:50] <MattyMatt> the modules plug into individual breakout boards, but one of those + module is 27.99gbp which makes an emc setup cost 80+
[09:24:50] <Valen> we are using 500W scooter motors direct driving ballscrews with linear scales
[09:25:21] <MattyMatt> 2A is enough for me for now :)
[09:25:28] <Valen> ;->
[09:25:47] <Valen> dunno what the exchange rate is atm but take a look at servo systems
[09:26:03] <Valen> mesa have some 4x100W driver boards for not too expensive
[09:26:28] <Valen> some cheap scooter motors (100W ones are like $5 if you don't pick them up from cleanups ;->)
[09:26:36] <Valen> and encoders ;->
[09:26:41] <MattyMatt> plan A is still dremel some wood slowly, sell it and buy bigger motors
[09:27:50] <MattyMatt> phase 7 will involve lasering gray codes directly on the ways for feedback :)
[09:28:05] <Valen> lol nice idea that one
[09:28:20] <Valen> I was planning on just running a laser interferomiter for distance measurement
[09:30:50] <Valen> ;-> in my dream world
[09:31:09] <MrSunshine> * MrSunshine thinks of making emc work on a 386 .. and run the cnc with it
[09:31:13] <MrSunshine> would be AWSOME!
[09:31:29] <MattyMatt> I have a fpu on my 386
[09:31:43] <MattyMatt> so I won't be able to verify it :)
[09:32:19] <MattyMatt> unless I plucked the 387 for hardcore testing. 20Mhz is plenty if emc is ported to DOS
[09:33:10] <Valen> why port to dos?
[09:33:13] <MrSunshine> there is no non graphical frontend for emc ?
[09:33:20] <Valen> just run slackware or something
[09:33:24] <Valen> there are I believe
[09:33:39] <Valen> heck you don't even need to run a graphical front end on the machine
[09:33:46] <MattyMatt> dos has 100% cpu. zero latency unless you choose to install TSR etc
[09:34:21] <MattyMatt> dos = "devoid of system"
[09:35:07] <Valen> latency is limited by the hardware(ish) of the system not the OS so much
[09:35:07] <MattyMatt> if you stick to VGA, you can pretty much 100% predict how long a GUI takes to draw
[09:35:33] <Valen> if you use a multi core/multi cpu machine, it doesn't matter ;->
[09:35:47] <MattyMatt> that's the theory
[09:35:57] <Valen> 2400 latency on mine
[09:36:03] <Valen> seems to work pretty well ;->
[09:36:05] <MrSunshine> well it all will be interrupted if a interrupt comes even if its multicore right? :)
[09:36:44] <MattyMatt> if your X driver gives permission for your gpu to hog the bus, then you're in trouble
[09:37:02] <MattyMatt> answer, no X driver
[09:37:30] <MattyMatt> minimal keyb & mouse interrupt handlers
[09:37:32] <Valen> MrSunshine, no because you reserve a CPU just for EMC
[09:37:47] <Valen> all it does is run your realtime EMC software
[09:38:15] <Valen> MattyMatt, my nvidia card is on AGP, and my mesa card is on PCI, no contention there
[09:39:34] <MattyMatt> they can both grab the bus, contending with the cpu socket for access to dram. chipset choice affects this of course, but it's true on older ones
[09:39:43] <MrSunshine> so in theory that should work even on a non realtimer kenel then ? :)
[09:39:46] <MrSunshine> with multiple cores
[09:39:55] <MrSunshine> if you can reserve a cpu just for the machine
[09:40:26] <MattyMatt> if the PIO were directly attached to that reserved core, it would all be dandy
[09:41:20] <MattyMatt> but it ain't. a 386 in real mode is directly addressing the printer port tho. no TLB etc
[09:42:09] <MattyMatt> or whatever the port mapping is called
[09:43:16] <Valen> I use mesa hardware so I don't really need to interact with the printer port
[09:44:41] <MattyMatt> the inkjet board I'm using for testing has 80188. I'm loath to bypass that but it's just TOO primitive :)
[09:56:29] <MattyMatt> AAARGH. somehow I've drilled the mounting holes for one of my beams 4mm off
[09:57:26] <MattyMatt> I'm measuring this all really slowly. I can't believe I didn't double check it
[09:57:57] <MattyMatt> mounting SLOTS >:) they were gonna be oversized anyway
[09:59:44] <EbiDK> EbiDK is now known as EbiDK|AWAY
[10:22:55] <MarkusBec_away> MarkusBec_away is now known as MarkusBec
[10:25:26] <MarkusBec> MarkusBec is now known as MarkusBec_away
[10:29:03] <archivist_emc> MattyMatt, I have not looked at the code but I expect realtime to be interrupting X, ie the otherway round
[10:30:09] <archivist_emc> the problem will be video drivers also done in interrupts
[10:39:02] <MarkusBec_away> MarkusBec_away is now known as MarkusBec
[10:47:35] <MattyMatt> I'll find out when I delve in the source
[12:04:54] <MrSunshine> dammit, got axles that isnt quite right ... they turn just fine like 80% of the turn then they go realy heavy to turn fine after the 20% again :/
[12:05:44] <MrSunshine> i could bore upp the holes more, put in a ball bearing (got axial bearings on both sides atm) but cant find a bearing that is small enough =)
[12:06:37] <MrSunshine> would need some low profile bearings or something :)
[12:06:44] <MrSunshine> 8mm inner, 12mm outer or something like that
[12:09:16] <MattyMatt> oillite bushes?
[12:09:33] <MrSunshine> what is that? :)
[12:09:50] <MrSunshine> and the axle isnt perfect ... it got some groves in it ... so im afraid bushings would tear up to fast :/
[12:10:27] <MattyMatt> http://simplybearings.co.uk/shop/p120716/AL0812-12+Oilite+Flanged+Bush+8x12x12mm/product_info.html
[12:10:34] <MattyMatt> oilite. one L
[12:12:18] <MrSunshine> gonna try the motors with it, if it cant move it (i can move it by hand the part that is not going heavy .. the other part i need a tool
[12:13:20] <MattyMatt> got a bottle of engineer's blue :)
[12:13:23] <MattyMatt> ?
[12:14:01] <MattyMatt> see where it's rubbing
[12:15:44] <MattyMatt> is the groove a keyway?
[12:16:35] <MattyMatt> * MattyMatt just had a meccano flashback
[12:16:39] <MrSunshine> MattyMatt, i have welded on an extension, then turned it in a lathe and i dont remember if it ended up that way in the process or if its something that has become in the place in the mill
[12:17:03] <MrSunshine> but i cannot see any groves in the actual bushing its in now .. (its a pure peice of cast iron)
[12:18:33] <MrSunshine> 8x12x3,5 found a ball bearing i think could fit =)
[12:18:51] <MrSunshine> i think its 8 and ive bored it up to 12 to be able to fit the axial bearings in there
[12:19:16] <MrSunshine> hell, its even 19 the whole .. damn =)
[12:19:58] <MrSunshine> and ofc, there is no 8x19 bearings :P
[12:20:25] <MrSunshine> yes, there =)
[12:21:54] <MattyMatt> yes that's a common size. I think that place I linked has them. roller skate are 22mm OD and they are cheapest
[12:22:16] <MrSunshine> MattyMatt, well if i take it up to 22 the axial bearings wont fit =)
[12:23:11] <MrSunshine> i was thinking 1||-1 , where 1 is axial bearings and || is the ordenary bearing and the - is just a hole that the axel passes throiught that ive taken up so the axel wont rub against anything =)
[12:24:14] <MattyMatt> I would use cone nut + cup for both axial + radial
[12:24:34] <MrSunshine> cone nut? :)
[12:24:42] <MattyMatt> but most of my "engineering" experience is fixing bikes :)
[12:25:33] <MrSunshine> MattyMatt, well i got non egineering experience :)
[12:25:41] <MrSunshine> im just going as my gut tells me it should be =)
[12:26:31] <MattyMatt> like on a bike axle. the cone nut is threaded on the axle, and holds loose 1/4" balls in a cup in the hub, so you get an angular contact bearing
[12:27:08] <MattyMatt> one of those at each end of the axle, and you're sorted
[12:29:04] <MrSunshine> hmm, sounds complicated =)
[12:29:26] <MrSunshine> so a bearing that looks like <<->> you mean ? :) like on wheels on cars etc ?
[12:29:40] <MattyMatt> it's as simple as it can be. 90% of the world's bicycles use it. take apart a front wheel and see
[12:29:56] <MrSunshine> where the balls rolls between the <<'s :)
[12:30:49] <MattyMatt> yeah. the << are curved to hold the balls but yeah it's angular contact like a needle roller but cheaper to maintain
[12:31:32] <MattyMatt> when the balls wear, you can tighten it up.
[12:35:39] <MattyMatt> I completely failed to locate a source for them tho, except for a factory in china
[12:36:02] <MattyMatt> easy enough to make on a lathe I reckon
[12:37:05] <MattyMatt> but you'd have to heat treat the cone, it takes all the punishment
[12:37:32] <MattyMatt> the cup can be pressed steel
[12:43:29] <MattyMatt> oh yeah there's a place in holland may supply them, but they'll be 9x1mm thread only, like a bike wheel
[12:43:55] <MrSunshine> 9x1mm ?
[12:44:00] <MrSunshine> what dimensions is that? :)
[12:44:09] <MattyMatt> bike axles
[12:44:20] <MrSunshine> 9mm inner and 1mm thick or hwat? :)
[12:44:31] <MattyMatt> 9m diameter, 1mm pitch
[12:45:40] <MrSunshine>
[12:45:44] <MrSunshine> something like that is what im thinking
[12:46:08] <MattyMatt> that's the best kind
[12:46:19] <MattyMatt> tapered needle roller bearing
[12:46:46] <MattyMatt> that's what cars use at the ends of the crankshaft
[12:47:21] <MattyMatt> dunno if precision machine tools do tho
[12:48:23] <MattyMatt> I think they do it like you are, separate thrust bearing for axial and bushings for radial
[12:49:37] <MattyMatt> what kind of machine is it?
[13:08:27] <anonimasn> im back
[13:10:06] <anonimasn> Valen: http://www.io23.net/ul/files/DSC00302.JPG
[14:31:56] <Valen> anonimasn shiny
[14:32:26] <Valen> got any slightly less shiny ones? ;->
[14:45:15] <anonimasn> nope :)
[14:45:39] <anonimasn> let me try getting another one
[14:48:13] <anonimasn> http://www.io23.net/ul/files/DSC00305.JPG
[14:51:27] <Vernon> Is there a way to get EMC to always start Fullscreen without installing and running Devilspie?
[15:04:33] <EbiDK> EbiDK is now known as EbiDK|AWAY
[15:05:00] <SWPadnos> Vernon, I think there are two ways to do it. first, I believe you can use the standards "geometry" command-line option
[15:05:22] <SWPadnos> you'd probably have to put it in the run script, I don't know if that gets passed to the DISPLAY program
[15:06:00] <SWPadnos> or, if you're running AXIS, you can put some code to maximize or change the window geometry in an axisrc file, which axis runs at load time
[15:06:32] <Vernon> interesting, thank you... I'll try that. Yep, I'm running Axis.
[15:06:36] <SWPadnos> (I don't recall exactly where the axisrc file is, or the exact name of it, but you should be able to find it on the wiki or in the docs)
[15:07:40] <Vernon> Yes, I'll certainly try, those sounds like helpful leads, for sure.
[15:07:49] <Vernon> er.. sound.
[15:07:59] <SWPadnos> them there sounds sounds like it
[15:08:33] <mozmck> the run script is just called "emc" and I guess is in /usr/bin
[15:08:47] <mozmck> here's the line that would run AXIS: $EMCDISPLAY -ini "$INIFILE" $EMCDISPLAYARGS $EXTRA_ARGS
[15:08:56] <Vernon> ah yes I've been there earlier
[15:09:21] <SWPadnos> the run script is at `which emc` :)
[15:09:41] <mozmck> so it looks like you can pass in arguments to AXIS from the command line, if you know what to pass in :-)
[15:10:03] <SWPadnos> geometry=1024x768+0+0 or similar
[15:10:11] <Vernon> not a clue :D maybe (fullscreen) ?
[15:10:13] <SWPadnos> or maybe it's 1024x768@0,0
[15:10:28] <Vernon> yeah that sounds good, a size and location.
[15:10:47] <Vernon> I have NO idea but I'm willing to try.
[15:11:12] <mozmck> I broke my emc by upgrading ubuntu, so I can't test anything right now :(
[15:12:18] <SWPadnos> mozmck, sim mode, dude! :)
[15:12:27] <Vernon> hahaha
[15:13:01] <SWPadnos> there's a gdk call named "gdk_window_fullscreen", but I'm not sure if that's propagated somehow to tcl/python in AXIS
[15:13:23] <mozmck> oh yeah, I forget about that. I'm working on compiling an rtai kernel for 9.10 :/
[15:13:29] <SWPadnos> heh
[15:15:28] <cradek> what's wrong with devilspie? it works great.
[15:16:24] <Vernon> I don't want to add another running program, and the name is dumb. :)
[15:16:36] <cradek> hahaha
[15:16:54] <mozmck> never heard of devilspie til now...
[15:17:45] <Vernon> delusions of demonic culinary grandeur, or something :)
[15:18:05] <cradek> mozmck: it lets you control position/size of windows easily
[16:03:17] <Vernon> How about... starting Axis with something other than the demo program loaded?
[16:04:53] <SWPadnos> there's an ini setting for that, I believe
[16:04:56] <Vernon> ( "Read the manual" is a valid answer.) :)
[16:04:59] <SWPadnos> take a look at the manual
[16:05:02] <Vernon> hahaha
[16:05:07] <Vernon> ok, thanks
[18:05:27] <bluntz_> anyone following the reprap devel?
[18:05:53] <bluntz_> http://forums.reprap.org/read.php?1,12143
[18:18:54] <cradek> EMC2 now allows both (comment) and ;comment
[18:31:32] <mozmck> in gcode
[18:32:33] <mozmck> ?
[18:35:12] <micges> mozmck: yes
[18:42:49] <MrSunshine> MattyMatt, Seig X1
[18:42:53] <MrSunshine> off for a while again =)
[18:49:21] <bluntz_> I was looking for a controller board design when I came across it
[18:50:41] <bluntz_> they got alot of nice toys for their controller
[18:51:59] <bluntz_> but I dont think I need the arduino with emc2?
[18:54:54] <bluntz_> does emc2 controll the drivers directly from the parport bus?
[18:55:55] <awallin> bluntz_: emc2 can output step/dir signals through the parport. most stepper drives take step/dir as input
[18:57:03] <bluntz_> how many axis can the parportdrive at once?
[18:58:29] <micges> 4 axes for sure
[18:58:42] <bluntz_> wish I was an electrical engineer
[19:00:10] <bluntz_> seems like I would need some kina central controller for all the other functions tho like lube tool change ect
[19:04:13] <bluntz_> I got 3 drivers to interface with (uln2003an) that are just switches really
[19:05:50] <awallin> bluntz_: you can get another parport with a pci-card. or get an IO card for emc2
[19:06:31] <bluntz_> ahh good id
[19:06:59] <bluntz_> so 2 parports would run 8 drivers?
[19:07:34] <awallin> yes, probably.
[19:08:13] <awallin> then it depends what you want the 8 axes to do. I think emc2 internally has 6-deg of freedom xyz, pitch yaw roll
[19:08:30] <awallin> you need to map that somehow onto the 8 axes (call them joints!)
[19:08:54] <bluntz_> 3 axis is fine
[19:09:15] <bluntz_> need others for other functions
[19:09:27] <bluntz_> like lube an such
[19:10:40] <bluntz_> I wonder how emc will like 2 parports tho
[19:12:24] <bluntz_> Id like a light and blower/vac at spindle as well
[19:14:04] <bluntz_> I kina doubt this will work
[19:21:01] <archivist> bluntz_, I have a 5 axis off one parport but that does mean no limit switches
[19:21:57] <bluntz_> yea thats not good
[19:22:31] <bluntz_> and what about tool sense ,estop,ect...
[19:23:10] <bluntz_> direct drive doesnt seem practicle
[19:23:13] <archivist> I use the pc keyboard...I remember where the ESC key is :)
[19:26:31] <bluntz_> and are you running your drivers straight out of the parport ?
[19:27:28] <awallin> did some anodizing tests today: http://www.anderswallin.net/2009/10/anodizing-aluminium/ anyone else done this?
[19:29:30] <archivist> awallin, I used to work at an anodising company for a short while, you dont mention the strip stage
[19:30:10] <archivist> caustic bath
[19:30:19] <bluntz_> improves strength alot
[19:30:47] <bluntz_> great for corrosion too
[19:31:03] <awallin> I washed the part in mild NaOH by hand first. if this is what you mean. I heard some people leave them in NaOH for longer before they go into acid/anodizing
[19:31:15] <archivist> and the finish lasts longer if you rub lanolin on it
[19:31:39] <bluntz_> neatest thing Ive seen tho is the deep freeze treating
[19:31:40] <tarzan_> archivist, why do you need it?
[19:31:55] <archivist> its porous
[19:33:37] <bluntz_> got any access to liquid nitrogen?
[19:34:54] <awallin> in theory yes... :)
[19:35:04] <bluntz_> hehe
[19:35:23] <bluntz_> huge strength gains
[19:35:29] <awallin> there are some advantages of working at a university...
[19:37:38] <bluntz_> think any kind of metal will work
[19:38:50] <bluntz_> but all my bearings and bushings would get nitro if I could
[19:40:21] <awallin> so you freeze them rapidly just after anodizing?
[19:40:52] <bluntz_> think maybe after freezing dunno
[19:42:05] <bluntz_> I would think if frozen last finish may get crazed
[19:42:23] <bluntz_> from the shrinkage
[19:42:46] <bluntz_> like ceramics do
[19:42:55] <bluntz_> dunno
[19:43:37] <bluntz_> but I wouldnt be surprised by 100% improvement in strenght
[19:43:48] <archivist> I wwould
[19:44:32] <gene_> Gene asks why isn't adept showing the update?
[19:47:00] <bluntz_> awallin do a washer and then shear test it please,would be nice to know
[19:47:09] <L84Supper> bluntz_ : were they freezing after sealing the anodize?
[19:47:39] <bluntz_> dont think so,think parts were raw
[19:47:49] <bluntz_> many years ago
[19:48:28] <bluntz_> but as far as finish goes
[19:49:05] <bluntz_> Ive seen the anodised alum last 10 times as long as painted in the feild
[19:50:27] <bluntz_> I dont think this tech ever made it to commercial production far to spensive
[19:51:04] <frallzor> anyone got tips on where to get nice spindles for cnc? =)
[19:51:12] <frallzor> dont say the chinese ebay spindle :P
[19:51:28] <bluntz_> german
[19:52:17] <pjm> i got a MT3 spindle etc from 'little machine shop' in the US and its been pretty good so far
[19:52:23] <frallzor> link?
[19:52:50] <pjm> 1 sec
[19:53:35] <archivist> pjm is it the sieg (badged) ?
[19:53:47] <pjm> umm not too sure, i'll get the link
[19:55:23] <pjm> http://littlemachineshop.com/products/product_view.php?ProductID=2636
[19:55:45] <pjm> the only thing I have left of that is the actual MT3 spindle and its housing!
[19:55:56] <pjm> all the other bits have been replaced with faster / better / red things
[19:55:59] <frallzor> ahh too big and single phase :(
[19:56:26] <frallzor> but thats a whole assembly :P
[19:57:19] <awallin> tormach has BT30 or R8 spindles http://www.tormach.com/Product_PCNC_maint.html
[19:57:26] <awallin> anyone using those?
[19:57:47] <archivist> pjm have you had it apart and adjusted the spindle preload
[19:58:49] <pjm> yes when i first got it i stripped it and re-did it all properly
[19:58:58] <L84Supper> awallin : what did you use for cooling during your anodize step?
[19:59:20] <bluntz_> looks like the russians were doing magnetic treatment of aluminum back in 73 got 50% increase
[19:59:26] <frallzor> hmm guess I have to go with cheap chinese ebay spindle or a german elektromotor spindle then
[19:59:36] <archivist> pjm, was helping commission a sieg last night that also needs a strip and set up
[19:59:44] <bluntz_> http://www.springerlink.com/content/t6743h2512mr34r2/
[19:59:50] <pjm> frallzor u can get just the spindle / bearings etc from that company
[20:00:06] <L84Supper> awallin : is the plastic pail just there for spills or did you add some crushed ice to keep the temp down?
[20:00:57] <frallzor> the plan was something like this http://www.teknomotor.com/
[20:01:02] <awallin> L84: I was not cooling the acid. Eventually it got quite warm. The plastic pail was for safety only. The powersupply shows output in watts also, after 1-2 hours at 10-15W the acid was maybe +40C, don't know if that is good or bad
[20:01:12] <pjm> archivist ah yes i read that u set up a sieg, presumable that was a manual mill? how did it all go?
[20:01:49] <archivist> pjm, didnt get time to do the spindle, but otherwise ok
[20:04:26] <L84Supper> awallin : the temperature of the acid should be controlled since it has an effect on how thick the porous layer gets
[20:05:03] <archivist> rate and porosity, time sets thickness as well
[20:05:40] <awallin> ok, maybe a more shallow bath with more surface area for cooling is better
[20:05:44] <archivist> some vats were cooled and some heated by the process
[20:14:14] <bluntz_> http://www.springerlink.com/content/vq20257j730108r1/
[20:15:20] <bluntz_> nitrogen bath had no effect on corrosion resistance
[20:18:01] <L84Supper> ok, quenching for strength and then anodize for corrosion resistance
[20:18:08] <bluntz_> yup
[20:19:21] <bluntz_> 10 amps overnight in a 5 gallon bucket
[20:19:29] <bluntz_> hehe
[20:20:37] <bluntz_> gives a pickled look to castings
[20:22:20] <bluntz_> but just barely cuttable with a hacksaw
[20:29:14] <bluntz_> need a test
[20:33:01] <awallin> ?
[20:33:12] <archivist> thats just a deep anodised surface, the core is still in its soft/previous state
[20:35:22] <bluntz_> yes its the oxidized surface thats hard
[20:35:58] <awallin> check this http://www.focuser.com/atm/anodize/anodize.html
[20:41:46] <L84Supper> he's got a pretty good guide for DIY, finishing.com has lots of Q&A as well
[20:42:06] <archivist> where I worked the tanks had no covers, the atmosphere would affect your lungs for the first few days working there, after that you notice you never catch a cold
[20:42:27] <archivist> he has all the steps
[20:56:36] <gene_> Gene asks why isn't adept showing the update?
[20:57:41] <MrSunshine> gaaah i need my multimeter .. now! =)
[23:05:19] <bluntz_> Think I will try to get this...http://store.makerbot.com/electronics/electronics-kits/reprap-motherboard-kit-v1-1.html
[23:05:58] <bluntz_> to work with emc
[23:24:58] <oPless> :)
[23:36:42] <frallzor> fuck! I want to go to the states!
[23:37:13] <frallzor> all the great fucking bands I would watch live... I'd die happy if I died there!