#emc | Logs for 2009-02-02

[00:22:37] <jmkasunich> yay, worm gears gashed and hobbed
[01:09:12] <bglackin> for future search reference
[01:10:48] <bglackin> When trying to configure a linksys wireless G card - good information at http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=919964
[01:12:43] <bglackin> and http://rt2X00.serialmonkey.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=4970
[01:13:06] <bglackin> not actually working yet - at least I can see my card now.
[01:27:24] <bglackin> wireless
[01:27:49] <bglackin> grrr - gotta stop using two keyboards
[02:29:36] <jmkasunich> yay, finished outside milling just as the temp is dropping back below freezing
[03:28:58] <jst_home> jmkasunich: you've got a mill sitting outside? :)
[05:59:01] <UncleG> Hi guys~
[05:59:43] <UncleG> Anyone in here familiar with the GA-370 Glentek boards?
[05:59:57] <eric_unterhausen> what is it?
[06:00:23] <UncleG> Board to drive my Glentek 370 servo
[06:01:24] <eric_unterhausen> too hard to look it up on their site
[06:01:26] <UncleG> I have an old Shadow CNC and am trying to convert the system to EMX
[06:01:32] <UncleG> EMC
[06:02:05] <UncleG> Nah, I have all the info on the boards and drives I just wanted to know if any of you got it working with EMC
[06:02:47] <SWPadnos> UncleG, I've never heard of anyone using those (with EMC2 or without)
[06:03:14] <UncleG> I figured as much... I guess im an entrapenuer
[06:03:16] <SWPadnos> what does the GA-370 do exactly? (analog output to the drives, resolver feedback, ...)
[06:03:26] <UncleG> analog output?
[06:03:49] <eric_unterhausen> I think it's 10v analog
[06:03:53] <SWPadnos> one common servo control interface is +- 10 V analog
[06:04:27] <UncleG> Im useless with this stuff. I'm a machinist, not a cnc buff :( seems I can't even set up the encoder
[06:04:47] <UncleG> My first step was to connect the encoder to the PC
[06:04:54] <SWPadnos> well,at least you have the manuals. start reading :)
[06:05:58] <SWPadnos> ah, the GA-370 is the servo drive board
[06:06:11] <SWPadnos> I wasn't sure if it was a controller to tell the servo drives what to do
[06:06:34] <UncleG> well. you see I have a 15 pin D connector from the encoder to the old cnc box with the pinouts. Im assuming I would be able to rewire it into my lpt and I don't even know what wires go where~
[06:06:53] <UncleG> I attempted reading the manual for EMC and am so completely lost.
[06:07:11] <SWPadnos> do you have a 15-pin D connector for each motor?
[06:07:14] <UncleG> yes
[06:07:29] <SWPadnos> I doubt a parallel port will be sufficient
[06:07:35] <SWPadnos> certainly not a single one
[06:07:39] <UncleG> I just need one drive to work
[06:07:51] <SWPadnos> you need a 1-axis CNC?
[06:08:01] <UncleG> until I learn enough to make it 2
[06:08:04] <SWPadnos> heh
[06:08:23] <eric_unterhausen> it's an analog drive, mesa or equivalent required
[06:08:28] <SWPadnos> I suspect that there's an interface that can run several of them
[06:08:54] <SWPadnos> the mesa card eric_unterhausen mentions is probably a good match
[06:10:00] <UncleG> At minimum all I want to know is 1. can I just run the 15pin D to the lpt and get a readout from my encoder.
[06:10:05] <SWPadnos> no
[06:10:12] <UncleG> ok
[06:10:14] <SWPadnos> not without some work
[06:10:23] <UncleG> well, I don't mind work.
[06:10:31] <UncleG> I just need to know where to start.
[06:10:36] <eric_unterhausen> do you have a pinout of the encoder?
[06:10:39] <UncleG> yes
[06:10:41] <SWPadnos> it is possible to make it work, but of course you'll need to rewire things, since you have a 15-pin connector and a parallel port is 25 pins
[06:10:56] <UncleG> I have all the wires in front of me ready to wire up
[06:11:11] <SWPadnos> are there A B and Z wires?
[06:11:12] <eric_unterhausen> do your motors have tachs?
[06:11:16] <UncleG> yes
[06:11:17] <UncleG> and yes
[06:11:45] <SWPadnos> what about ~A /A or some other A (and corresponding B and Z)?
[06:11:45] <UncleG> I can give you the existing pinout for the 15-pin D
[06:11:54] <eric_unterhausen> I think the glentek is going to want a tach
[06:12:10] <eric_unterhausen> emc doesn't need it
[06:12:23] <UncleG> can I scrap the tach then?
[06:12:28] <SWPadnos> EMC isn't a servo drive, so the 70 still needs the tach
[06:12:31] <SWPadnos> no
[06:12:42] <UncleG> ok
[06:12:49] <eric_unterhausen> sorry I was confusing
[06:12:53] <SWPadnos> you have 3 components: motor, drive, computer
[06:13:47] <SWPadnos> the connection between the motor and drive needs to carry some information (and power), the connection between the PC and the drive carries other info, and the motor also needs to feed position information back to the PC
[06:14:11] <SWPadnos> from motor to drive should be motor power wires and tach feedback (probably)
[06:14:29] <SWPadnos> from motor to PC is encoder feedback
[06:14:42] <UncleG> which is where I want to start
[06:14:44] <UncleG> the encoder.
[06:14:59] <SWPadnos> from PC to drive is probably analog, which may work somewhat with no hardware other than the parallel port, but it won't be pretty
[06:15:07] <UncleG> I should be able to turn the servo by hand and get an encoder feedback correct?
[06:15:13] <SWPadnos> yes
[06:15:40] <SWPadnos> turning by hand is slow though, and there's a speed limit as to how fast the motor shaft can turn before the PC can't keep up
[06:16:12] <SWPadnos> there is no stock "sample" configuration that uses the parallel port for encoder feedback
[06:16:27] <SWPadnos> unless you set it up as spindle feedback
[06:17:13] <UncleG> oh
[06:17:13] <UncleG> ok
[06:17:29] <UncleG> so i could potentially use spindle feedback to get a read
[06:18:03] <SWPadnos> there's a program included with EMC2 that lets you set up some types of machines which use the parallel port. it's called stepconf
[06:18:31] <SWPadnos> using that program, you could select some parallel port pins to be spindle phase A, spindle phase B and spindle index inputs
[06:18:35] <UncleG> would you mind looking at my D-pin layout? and getting the titles up to date because I think the old names for the hardware differ from the new
[06:19:07] <SWPadnos> if you connect A B and Z (Z is index) to those parallel port pins, then the spindle feedback should show you something when you spin the motor
[06:19:22] <UncleG> that would very good.
[06:19:24] <SWPadnos> I can take a quick look
[06:19:29] <SWPadnos> it's past my bedtime :)
[06:19:30] <UncleG> ty, I will get you the link
[06:20:07] <UncleG> http://www.shadowcnc.com/shadowmanual.htm
[06:20:23] <UncleG> then find amplifier and the layout will be on the left
[06:20:35] <UncleG> ctrl + f amplifier
[06:21:49] <eric_unterhausen> glentek 40 series motors?
[06:21:52] <SWPadnos> well, it's not simple. you need a 5V supply for the encoder
[06:22:07] <SWPadnos> you can get that from a USB connector, but the parallel port has no good power output
[06:22:23] <UncleG> I can handle that
[06:22:30] <UncleG> yeah~
[06:22:58] <SWPadnos> the GA-370 does need a tach on the motor
[06:23:00] <eric_unterhausen> index is called "mark not" ?
[06:23:04] <SWPadnos> or at least it has a tach input
[06:23:06] <SWPadnos> yes
[06:23:09] <UncleG> ohhh
[06:23:10] <SWPadnos> I think so anyway
[06:23:10] <UncleG> ok
[06:23:15] <UncleG> I was curous about mark not
[06:23:18] <UncleG> it confused me
[06:23:42] <SWPadnos> the "not" means that it's an active low signal, so check the "invert" checkbox for the pin you select as spindle index input
[06:23:46] <eric_unterhausen> most older brushed motor controls require a tach
[06:23:52] <SWPadnos> yep
[06:24:16] <UncleG> ok, im in stepconf right now setting things up as we speak.
[06:25:11] <SWPadnos> and yes, the drive takes +- 10V control signals
[06:25:42] <SWPadnos> (9 pin shell, pin 1 "SERVO COMMAND -10V to +10V)
[06:25:55] <eric_unterhausen> I told you that after dloading the manual
[06:25:59] <SWPadnos> heh
[06:26:10] <eric_unterhausen> had to register and everything
[06:26:16] <SWPadnos> I thought you were complaining that you didn't want to wade through the site :)
[06:26:21] <SWPadnos> I didn't want to do that
[06:26:37] <UncleG> invert "spindle index" and Spindle Phase A/B and I have 2 more open pins for input will that be enough?
[06:26:38] <eric_unterhausen> I registered as Joe Mader
[06:27:11] <SWPadnos> you don't need to invert A and B
[06:27:23] <UncleG> I didnt. I wrote that poorly
[06:27:29] <SWPadnos> heh, ok
[06:27:33] <eric_unterhausen> next time I'm going to register as terry mader, which means your mother in Hindi
[06:27:50] <SWPadnos> it doesn't hurt if you do, generally each inversion will reverse the effective direction of the encoder
[06:28:05] <UncleG> ok
[06:28:28] <eric_unterhausen> which may need to be done after that motor runs away
[06:28:29] <SWPadnos> so if you see the numbers going up where you think they should go down, you can either swap the pins in the connector, or invert one (but not both) inputs
[06:28:42] <UncleG> got ya
[06:28:50] <SWPadnos> I'm thinking there won't be any power to anything except the encoder at first (hint hint)
[06:29:00] <eric_unterhausen> where's the fun in that?
[06:29:09] <UncleG> so, not all hope is lost with this servo setup :)
[06:29:11] <SWPadnos> in the immortal words of Monty Python
[06:29:15] <SWPadnos> Run Away!
[06:29:38] <UncleG> I did manage to connect the servo drive board to minicom and make it run with that :p
[06:29:44] <SWPadnos> UncleG, you won't be able to make a useful system by going down this path, but it should be a learning experience for you
[06:29:49] <UncleG> in one direction at full blast :)
[06:29:55] <SWPadnos> yeah
[06:29:56] <UncleG> yes
[06:30:01] <SWPadnos> 20% over full blast even
[06:30:24] <UncleG> ni!
[06:30:34] <SWPadnos> there are several boards that can drive your system
[06:30:36] <SWPadnos> heh
[06:31:35] <SWPadnos> the Mesa boards start at $200 fora PCI card + $70 or so for a 4-servo interface (analog out and encoder in for each of the 4 channels)
[06:32:00] <SWPadnos> there's a parallel port connected card also, which is $90
[06:32:06] <eric_unterhausen> needs breakouts
[06:32:11] <SWPadnos> yep
[06:32:20] <eric_unterhausen> almost doubles the cost
[06:32:24] <SWPadnos> yep
[06:32:29] <SWPadnos> more, for the 7i43
[06:32:39] <SWPadnos> since you need I/O and analog/encoder cards
[06:32:48] <UncleG> man, with all these companies going out of business in the US I should be able to pick up a full blown cnc system for about the same price at auction
[06:33:06] <SWPadnos> if you can pick it up and bring it home, that may be true
[06:33:25] <SWPadnos> but not with controls
[06:33:29] <UncleG> Yeah, I have the means but I really would like to learn this
[06:34:40] <UncleG> um
[06:34:43] <SWPadnos> it is possible to use parallel ports to do this, but at some point you'll have to buy more ports, build or buy interface cards and whatnot, and you'll still have a system that's limited by the PC
[06:34:45] <UncleG> on that page I sent you
[06:34:56] <SWPadnos> and you'll be on your own, since nobody really does that :)
[06:35:01] <SWPadnos> yes?
[06:35:08] <UncleG> cw limit and ccw limit home and comm
[06:35:16] <SWPadnos> switches
[06:35:21] <UncleG> I have no idea what those are for, could you explain?
[06:35:33] <UncleG> limit switches and ???
[06:35:41] <SWPadnos> home switch
[06:35:43] <UncleG> home position and
[06:35:50] <SWPadnos> common (ground)
[06:35:53] <UncleG> ohhh
[06:35:55] <UncleG> ok
[06:36:20] <UncleG> I wont need the limit switches right?
[06:36:39] <SWPadnos> if the motor isn't moving machine parts around, probably not
[06:36:48] <UncleG> heh
[06:37:02] <UncleG> Im running this in a cam system anyhow
[06:37:08] <SWPadnos> ok, bedtime. good luck and enjoy
[06:37:10] <SWPadnos> good night
[06:37:17] <UncleG> thank you very much.
[06:37:24] <UncleG> Goodnight.
[06:37:47] <KimK> UncleG: Which CAM system? (goodnight SWP)
[06:38:14] <UncleG> no...
[06:38:24] <UncleG> the servos drive cams
[06:38:27] <UncleG> not screws
[06:38:42] <KimK> Oh, OK.
[06:38:43] <UncleG> like a mechanical cam
[06:38:44] <UncleG> :)
[06:38:50] <UncleG> old index machine
[06:44:10] <eric_unterhausen> what did it do?
[06:45:18] <UncleG> like a turret lathe with barloader
[06:57:02] <UncleG> ok.
[06:57:07] <UncleG> I just wired up the encoder.
[06:57:54] <UncleG> I used a/b/index and home and added the usb 5vdc for the power to the encoder. now where will it give me a readout of the encoder position?
[06:58:29] <UncleG> the hal scope didnt give me any readout of encoder.0.position or phase A
[07:02:28] <eric_unterhausen> it's possible that it isn't electrically compatible with your parport
[07:02:39] <UncleG> :(
[07:03:13] <UncleG> Would you happen to know how one might check for such a scenario?
[07:03:47] <eric_unterhausen> are you sure you are powering your encoder? multimeter looking at voltages?
[07:04:07] <eric_unterhausen> I would like to be able to see changes on the a/b/i lines
[07:04:10] <UncleG> well, I did wire into it with a 5vt line from the usb
[07:04:15] <eric_unterhausen> before I paniced
[07:04:27] <UncleG> and it checked out as 5vt
[07:04:44] <eric_unterhausen> with the encoder attached?
[07:04:51] <UncleG> no..
[07:05:03] <eric_unterhausen> but you should be able to see changes on the a/b/i lines
[07:05:07] <UncleG> where on the line should I check it, right at the encoder?
[07:05:12] <eric_unterhausen> by moving very, very slowly
[07:05:37] <eric_unterhausen> don't bother, check the outputs of the encoder
[07:06:06] <eric_unterhausen> what pins did you hook up on the parport?
[07:06:20] <UncleG> 10 11 um....lemme see what else
[07:07:18] <UncleG> 10 11 12 13
[07:08:11] <UncleG> spindle phase A B Index and home-x
[07:08:32] <eric_unterhausen> wiki is being served by hamsters typing
[07:08:43] <UncleG> maybe I am using scope wrong
[07:11:06] <eric_unterhausen> did you check your a/b lines for voltage changes?
[07:11:19] <eric_unterhausen> you probably are using scope wrong, it isn't trivial stuff
[07:13:01] <UncleG> I see a flat line.
[07:13:07] <UncleG> What am I looking for?
[07:13:21] <UncleG> I get a voltage output on phase A with the voltmeter nothing for phase b
[07:13:42] <eric_unterhausen> does phase a change when you turn the encoder?
[07:14:00] <UncleG> on the scope I get a flat line and nothing changed when the encoder moves
[07:14:28] <eric_unterhausen> I'm talking about voltmeter changes
[07:14:35] <UncleG> nothing happens
[07:14:44] <UncleG> it just stays less than 5 v
[07:14:47] <UncleG> no changes
[07:15:04] <eric_unterhausen> if the voltages going into the computer aren't changing, the scope inside the computer isn't going to see any changes?
[07:15:17] <UncleG> understood.
[07:16:04] <eric_unterhausen> some encoders take a reasonable amount of power to actually get working
[07:16:18] <eric_unterhausen> for example, gecko drives can't power up all known encoders
[07:17:11] <UncleG> reasonable amount of power?
[07:18:10] <UncleG> I just do not understand I put 5vdc to the encoder and spin it , phase A should cause fluxuations on voltmeter correct?
[07:18:28] <eric_unterhausen> you may have to spin slowly to see it on a voltmeter
[07:18:39] <eric_unterhausen> very, very slowly
[07:18:46] <UncleG> ohh
[07:18:48] <UncleG> k
[07:19:01] <eric_unterhausen> ch a/b are 50% on
[07:22:02] <eric_unterhausen> and there is the possibility that they are open collector, which means they need pullup resistors to work at all
[07:24:04] <UncleG> yeah, I read about that.
[07:24:11] <UncleG> Wish I knew wth I was doing.
[07:24:44] <UncleG> Seeing anything more than a flat line would be big improvement on this scope.
[07:24:56] <UncleG> Looks like I have a lot of learning to do.
[07:40:40] <JustinXJS2_> so, this page can be changed; http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?EMC2_Supported_Hardware
[07:40:52] <JustinXJS2_> I have the linistepper working with EMC
[07:52:41] <UncleG> gj dood
[07:52:59] <UncleG> You should look into making a GA370 servo work with it :)
[07:53:11] <UncleG> I'll send you kudos.
[07:56:48] <JustinXJS2_> JustinXJS2_ is now known as JustinXJS2
[09:06:30] <Lerman_______> Lerman_______ is now known as Lerman
[09:58:39] <piasdom> g'mornin all
[10:11:39] <alex_joni> 'lo
[10:12:02] <pjm__> good morning
[10:13:17] <piasdom> anyone know if BigjohnT is out of electricity again ?
[10:13:58] <archivist> he is on dial up
[10:14:55] <piasdom> last week he was out because of ice
[11:15:26] <alex_joni> piasdom: he's probably asleep now
[11:15:29] <alex_joni> robin_z: howdy
[11:24:21] <Guest709> hello everyone
[11:24:28] <Dr_Phreakenstein> hi
[11:24:49] <Guest709> I have a question..
[11:25:38] <Guest709> in : addf funct_name servo-thread -1
[11:26:00] <Guest709> what is the number -1 standing for?
[11:29:53] <Vq^_> Vq^_ is now known as Vq^
[11:31:55] <robin_z> hey alex
[11:32:00] <robin_z> alex_joni, hi hi
[11:44:52] <alex_joni> robin_z: what's new?
[11:55:21] <robin_z> hehe
[11:55:24] <robin_z> we got snow!
[11:55:32] <robin_z> and a fantastic boomin economy
[11:55:34] <archivist> not enough snow
[11:55:43] <robin_z> well, 150mm
[11:55:55] <archivist> not here in eastmids
[11:56:06] <robin_z> im in kidderminster
[11:56:32] <archivist> sunny swadlincote
[11:56:48] <robin_z> oh ... hmmm
[11:56:55] <robin_z> dry ski slope IIRC
[11:57:19] <archivist> yup
[11:57:33] <archivist> with added real snow today
[11:57:41] <robin_z> yeah, totally awesome
[11:57:48] <alex_joni> 150mm of booming economy?
[11:57:54] <robin_z> at least
[11:57:57] <alex_joni> ha
[11:58:08] <alex_joni> sounds like .. a lot? .. not really
[11:58:27] <archivist> we haz no ekonomee
[11:59:04] <robin_z> sure we have ..
[11:59:29] <robin_z> its just that this months orders are probably stuck in the snow ...
[12:00:17] <alex_joni> heh
[12:00:32] <robin_z> could be worse
[12:00:46] <pjm__> archivist we have had about 40-50mm down in poole
[12:01:04] <archivist> still burger all
[12:01:40] <archivist> wimps on London moaning about 8 inches
[12:03:36] <pjm__> they have closed the skools here!!! unbelieveable
[12:04:36] <archivist> I dont remember schools being closed as a kid
[12:13:01] <BigJohnT> I used to have to take a dog sled to school
[12:14:45] <JymmmEMC> BigJohnT: So, how does whale/seal blubber taste like??
[12:18:42] <BigJohnT> pretty greasy
[12:18:51] <JymmmEMC> heh
[12:18:58] <BigJohnT> salted salmon is much better
[12:29:29] <archivist> pjm__, part the kit (but a little over priced these days) fleabay 110345883898
[12:35:04] <pjm__> archivist did u see that cnc spindle + VFD 180324271889
[12:37:00] <archivist> hmm looks like he is making them or something
[12:57:49] <eric_unterhausen> on friday, the forecast was for "crushing" amounts of snow today
[12:58:04] <eric_unterhausen> now they say 1"
[13:01:51] <fenn> neutron enriched snow
[13:03:03] <eric_unterhausen> that's not snow, it's titanium dioxide!
[15:10:23] <leito2> hello everybody, i need help with the user defined M codes, if someone could help me i would really appreciate it, thanks
[15:10:58] <SWPadnos> what are you trying to do?
[15:11:40] <leito2> i need to read a parport input
[15:12:23] <SWPadnos> ok, but what are you trying to do? :)
[15:12:50] <SWPadnos> the parallel port input will already be read by the HAL parallel port driver, and its status will be available
[15:13:39] <leito2> i need the g code program wait for the M code and when de M code reads that the parport pin is TRUE then the program continues with the next line
[15:13:59] <SWPadnos> ok, you don't need custom M codes to do that
[15:14:01] <leito2> sorry for my english i'm from argentina and i'm not used to talk in english
[15:14:14] <SWPadnos> if you have a recent version of
[15:14:20] <SWPadnos> no problem, you're doing well
[15:14:26] <leito2> thanks
[15:14:46] <leito2> so what can i do?
[15:15:12] <SWPadnos> there are M codes to wait for an input to be true (or false)
[15:15:18] <leito2> the m66 ?
[15:15:29] <SWPadnos> I think they are in the M66 range, but I'm not sure
[15:15:32] <SWPadnos> yes, that would be it :)
[15:16:46] <leito2> yes i tried that but nothing happens, i mean when the program reaches that line (the m66 line) the program stops until the Q time reaches 0 and then continues the program
[15:17:16] <leito2> and when the m66 is waiting i changed the port from false to true state but nothing happened
[15:17:23] <SWPadnos> hmmm
[15:17:24] <leito2> was waiting
[15:17:49] <SWPadnos> did you connect the port pin to one if the motion controller digital inputs?
[15:17:53] <SWPadnos> (in HAL)
[15:18:05] <leito2> yes
[15:18:39] <leito2> and i checked that in the hal show panel
[15:19:11] <leito2> it seems to be ok but when i change the port to true nothig happens.. the Q time reaches 0 and then the program continues
[15:20:03] <SWPadnos> ok. well, if I knew more about the motion controller I/O M codes, I might be able to help
[15:20:06] <SWPadnos> but I don't
[15:20:11] <leito2> i need to do this because i'm using an external measurement system with and encoder.. so when the encoder reaches the value that i need sends a signal to the port
[15:20:39] <SWPadnos> ok, got it
[15:20:54] <leito2> well, thanks for your help and i'll keep trying to make it work
[15:21:20] <jepler> what version of emc are you using?
[15:21:44] <leito2> i downloaded the linux hardy heron from the linux cnc web
[15:22:05] <leito2> it's the emc 2.X i don't know exactly what version is
[15:22:06] <jepler> emc 2.2.3 includes the following change: * fix #1853953 M66 doesn't work with parport inputs
[15:22:47] <jepler> determine your version of emc and upgrade if it's older than 2.2.3
[15:23:06] <jepler> If you are using the AXIS user interface, the version should appear in the title bar and in the window shown by Help > About
[15:23:16] <jepler> otherwise, you can look in the packagemanager
[15:23:41] <leito2> ok, thank you very much im gonna look that and if it's older i'll upgrade the emc
[15:23:58] <jepler> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?InstallingUpdates
[15:24:44] <leito2> thank you very much you are very helpfull
[15:24:56] <jepler> you're welcome
[15:24:58] <SWPadnos> heh. I figured someone would be :)
[15:25:25] <leito2> i'm gonna take a look and then i tell you if i solved the problem
[15:33:38] <skunkworks> btw - I think I all but liquified one of the mosfets.. (I kept turning the current up while testing) needless to say - it is the first 2 mosfets I have destroyed so far.
[15:33:49] <skunkworks> (shorted them)
[15:34:40] <SWPadnos> come back when you've gassified them :)
[15:34:52] <skunkworks> oh - and then I took the bridge out. (it was way too small)
[15:35:33] <skunkworks> heh - It was cool - the metal on the back of the mosfet looked 'rough' and it had 'leaked' around the edges
[15:43:59] <jepler> skunkworks: this thread is useless without pics
[15:44:29] <archivist> with smello vision
[15:44:50] <skunkworks> the bridge really smoked.. The mosfets really didn't smell all that much.
[15:45:03] <skunkworks> I will see if I still have the mosfet.
[15:45:27] <jepler> which component(s) do you mean when you say "the bridge"?
[15:45:54] <skunkworks> rectifier I was using in the power supply
[15:45:59] <jepler> oh!
[15:46:03] <jepler> not H-bridge
[15:46:13] <skunkworks> yah - sorry - that was confusing
[15:55:51] <alex_joni> http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/industry_sectors/technology/article5639463.ece interesting
[16:12:43] <alex_joni> "Boffins at Stanford University say they have managed to write "SU" in letters smaller than atoms."
[16:13:42] <SWPadnos> I'll believe it when I see it
[16:13:43] <alex_joni> "Manoharan and his nanohologram collaborator Chris Moon say it's difficult to properly express the size of their stacked S and U, but the equivalent would be 0.3 nanometres."
[16:14:05] <alex_joni> sounds about right for a new "big" DRO :)
[16:25:47] <alex_joni> SWPadnos: the 10$ laptop you mean?
[16:26:36] <SWPadnos> no, the subatomic letters :)
[16:26:48] <alex_joni> I find the 10$ laptop harder to believe ;)
[16:26:55] <alex_joni> SWPadnos: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/02/02/nanohologram_small_script/
[16:27:00] <SWPadnos> RS500 could be a lot in India
[16:27:24] <archivist> IBM claimed something a few years back as well regarding moving atoms
[16:27:26] <SWPadnos> that's just a rendering. I want to *see* it :)
[16:27:59] <alex_joni> SWPadnos: guess your sight is not as good
[16:28:30] <skunkworks> The researchers encoded the letters "S" and "U" (as in Stanford University) within the interference patterns formed by quantum electron waves on the surface of a sliver of copper. The wave patterns even project a tiny hologram of the data, which can be viewed with a powerful microscope
[16:28:47] <skunkworks> scary
[16:29:34] <skunkworks> didn't the ibm one actually show a picture. I vaugly remember that.
[16:30:43] <skunkworks> http://news-service.stanford.edu/news/2009/january28/videos/427_flash.html
[16:37:19] <archivist> skunkworks, I saw a picture but cannot remember where it was (could have been in a magazine)
[16:39:30] <fenn> $10 laptop is a piece of cake, with proper fudging of the definition of "laptop"
[16:40:17] <fenn> think monochrome e-ink segment display, arm processor, solar powered
[16:41:22] <fenn> what amazes me is that TI graphing calculators are still $100
[16:42:34] <eric_unterhausen> they should probably be a lot better than they are for that much
[16:43:18] <fenn> they have to suck in order to prevent students from shortcutting around the problem with the advanced computing device in their hands
[16:43:32] <fenn> * fenn wonders is that sentence made any sense
[16:43:50] <eric_unterhausen> I used to write programs during tests
[16:44:31] <fenn> "everything has changed but our thinking"
[16:45:12] <eric_unterhausen> I think calculators should be banned from tests
[16:45:39] <fenn> and then they should ban tests after that
[16:46:23] <eric_unterhausen> possibly
[16:46:40] <eric_unterhausen> so much cheating going on
[16:46:50] <fenn> cheating is the least of the problem
[16:47:50] <eric_unterhausen> my advisor gave one problem that was a total non sequitur -- if you got it right you were cheating, I'm almost positive about that
[16:49:46] <jepler> ugh, I'm so glad school is behind me
[16:51:04] <fenn> what did you go to school for?
[16:51:42] <jepler> for about 7 years
[16:52:05] <jepler> I studied comp sci and french
[16:52:14] <jepler> but quit without a degree
[16:53:37] <alex_joni> first they should ban students
[16:54:06] <eric_unterhausen> can't do that, who would do my work for me?
[16:55:06] <fenn> yep somebody needs to automate those students out of a job
[16:55:26] <fenn> or maybe we could just outsource it
[16:56:03] <eric_unterhausen> outsourcing part is done, try finding an American grad student
[17:00:04] <fenn> does anyone still have xemet/manfredi's nurbs patch?
[17:00:12] <fenn> i thought i saved it but i guess not
[17:02:16] <eric_unterhausen> trying to talk myself into riding two bikes into town today, racing bike needs work
[17:03:31] <fenn> remember to put some padding on your shoulder
[17:03:41] <eric_unterhausen> I just push the second one
[17:03:57] <fenn> guess i dont see how that works
[17:04:29] <eric_unterhausen> one time I was taking my tandem to the shop and the cable to the only brake I was using broke
[17:04:56] <eric_unterhausen> that was fun
[18:29:38] <christel> [Global Notice] Hi all, It would appear one of our client servers just dropped off the face of the planet. We're looking into the issue and should hopefully have it back soon. Affected users just over 2,000. Apologies for the inconvenience and have a good day.
[18:56:34] <motioncontrol> good evening.some people can help me for problem in rigid tapping with 5i20?thanks
[18:57:11] <alex_joni> they can surely try if you state what the problem is..
[18:58:59] <motioncontrol> alex i have configure my spindle whith analog */_10volt and when i command in mdi m3s1000 and m4 s2000 the velocity is ok
[19:00:51] <motioncontrol> but i create one program : g0 z0;m3 s200;g33.1 z-5 k1;g0 x10 y10;m2. the z axix down in z-15.00 and stop not move at z=0 z position .
[19:00:57] <motioncontrol> because
[19:02:38] <motioncontrol> this is my hal file for spindle:
[19:02:50] <motioncontrol> #Load a ddt and scale to get spindle-speed from spindle-position#
[19:02:50] <motioncontrol> loadrt ddt count=1
[19:02:50] <motioncontrol> loadrt scale count=1
[19:02:50] <motioncontrol> net Spos hm2_5i20.0.encoder.03.position => ddt.0.in
[19:02:50] <motioncontrol> net Svel ddt.0.out => scale.0.in
[19:02:51] <motioncontrol> setp scale.0.gain 0.00445
[19:02:53] <motioncontrol> net Srpm scale.0.out
[19:02:55] <motioncontrol> #link together the spindle encoder, motion module and PWM generator#
[19:02:57] <motioncontrol> net Spos => motion.spindle-revs
[19:02:59] <motioncontrol> net Srpm => motion.spindle-speed-in
[19:03:01] <motioncontrol> net Scmd motion.spindle-speed-out => hm2_5i20.0.pwmgen.03.value
[19:03:03] <motioncontrol> setp hm2_5i20.0.pwmgen.03.scale 3000.0
[19:03:05] <motioncontrol> setp hm2_5i20.0.pwmgen.03.output-type 1
[19:03:07] <motioncontrol> net Sidx hm2_5i20.0.encoder.03.index-enable => motion.spindle-index-enable
[19:03:09] <motioncontrol> #enable the PWM gnerator too#
[19:03:11] <motioncontrol> net Enable => hm2_5i20.0.pwmgen.03.enable
[19:03:17] <motioncontrol> #calculate spindle speed
[19:03:18] <motioncontrol> addf ddt.0 servo-thread
[19:03:18] <motioncontrol> addf scale.0 servo-thread
[19:03:54] <SWPadnos> does your spindle encoder have an index, and if so is it connected to the 5i20?
[19:04:42] <motioncontrol> yes my spindle have index and is connect at m5i20 the encoder is 2048 cout/rev(quadrature encoder)
[19:05:26] <SWPadnos> what version of emc2?
[19:05:35] <motioncontrol> 2.2.8
[19:05:38] <SWPadnos> ok
[19:06:06] <motioncontrol> please read my hal file and if you can control is it ok
[19:06:12] <alex_joni> where is the hm2_5i20.0.encoder.03.* connected to motion?
[19:06:23] <alex_joni> the index-enable or whatever it's called
[19:06:37] <SWPadnos> net Sidx hm2_5i20.0.encoder.03.index-enable => motion.spindle-index-enable
[19:06:45] <cradek> Spos and Sidx both seem right
[19:07:01] <SWPadnos> cradek, 2.2.8 doesn't have the at-speed thing, does it?
[19:07:14] <cradek> motioncontrol: do m3/m4 cause spindle forward and reverse?
[19:07:33] <motioncontrol> yes the spindle move ok in m3 and m4
[19:07:54] <cradek> did you put halmeter on motion.spindle-revs and see that it increases 1.0 for each turn in the M3 direction and decreases 1.0 for each turn in the M4 direction?
[19:07:55] <alex_joni> SWPadnos: right, no at-speed
[19:08:41] <motioncontrol> if i command m3 s2000 the motion.spindle-speed-in is 2000 value
[19:09:08] <alex_joni> motioncontrol: cradek asked specifically about motion.spindle-revs
[19:09:50] <motioncontrol> ok i control in my office after this variable.this variable motion.spindle-rev whath is?
[19:10:19] <motioncontrol> spindle revolutiuon?
[19:10:24] <cradek> motion.spindle-revs should increase 1.0 for each turn of the spindle in the positive (M3) direction
[19:10:26] <alex_joni> it's called motion.spindle-revs (spindle revolutions)
[19:10:58] <motioncontrol> ok i control after 10 minut thanks for now.
[19:19:43] <pjm__> archivist are u here?
[19:21:02] <fasting> ok i return i'm motioncontrol, but now stay in office
[19:21:53] <fasting> i ceck the motion.spindle-rev and this variable is = couter encoder not revolution increment
[19:22:22] <cradek> fasting: then you need to set the encoder scaling
[19:23:57] <fasting> i don't have scaled encoder but pwm.03.scale at 3000
[19:24:22] <cradek> that is not relevant. you need to set the encoder scale.
[19:24:24] <fasting> please control my hal file i thing is no correct
[19:24:46] <fasting> i don't have scale encode .03 signal
[19:27:36] <cradek> encoder.03.scale
[19:28:36] <fasting> yes i add scale encoder.03 and now the splindle-rev increment at 1.0 at one turn the spindle.i prove wait please 5 mints
[19:36:56] <fasting> ok the rigid tapping is ok, only one problem when revert the motor the z axis move is fast and for one istand vibration , after finish to z=0 pos and now z axis fast revert for one istand.The axis position is ok.i ceck my max velocity is 300mm/min.because?
[19:37:28] <alex_joni> fasting: that didn't make sense, try expressing it otherwise
[19:38:55] <fasting> excuse for my english i reppet
[19:39:32] <alex_joni> fasting: no need to excuse, just try to say it differently
[19:40:13] <cradek> it is normal for Z to move up past 0 at the end of the tap cycle
[19:40:24] <cradek> it then moves back down to the original height (0)
[19:40:57] <cradek> here is the explanation of the rigid tap cycle: http://www.linuxcnc.org/docs/html/gcode_main.html#sec:G33,-G33.1:-Spindle-Synchronized
[19:42:02] <fasting> my command is :g0 z0;m3s200;g33.1 z-5 k1;m3 s1000;m2.the move when the z axis revet at -5 to 0 is very immediately(very fast) because.the axis z receive the meccanical shock when z revert the movement
[19:42:40] <alex_joni> fasting: it starts moving from Z0 down to -5 .. right?
[19:42:54] <fasting> yes
[19:42:59] <alex_joni> then just before -5, it starts stopping the spindle, and changing direction
[19:43:13] <alex_joni> at Z-5, spindle speed is 0 and direction changes
[19:43:25] <fasting> yes , the direction change
[19:43:48] <alex_joni> is that when Z makes a jump?
[19:43:50] <fasting> the problem is when the direction change
[19:44:07] <fasting> yes is jump
[19:44:23] <alex_joni> I think it depends how fast your spindle stops/changes direction
[19:44:54] <fasting> ok i decreese the accelereation spindle
[19:45:30] <cradek> is Z/K in mm?
[19:45:56] <cradek> it seems like a very short tap
[19:46:00] <fasting> yes i use mm
[19:46:15] <cradek> ok
[19:46:47] <fasting> ok thanks for all.very important for me your help.at after.
[19:47:01] <cradek> welcome
[19:49:43] <alex_joni> is it better with slower spindle accel?
[19:50:13] <cradek> I am not sure I understand the problem
[19:50:36] <cradek> but if the axis accel cannot keep up with the spindle accel, it will break the tap
[19:52:04] <alex_joni> I think he's air-cutting for now .. maybe
[20:28:45] <toastatwork> http://www.onesentence.org/stories/2283/
[20:33:02] <Martinp23> [Global Notice] Hi folks! Earlier one of our leaf (client) servers had a few connection issues. This was due to latency issues on the sponsor's network. Fortunately, the sponsor now reports that the problems have been resolved and so everything is back to normal. We're very sorry for the inconvenience. Thanks for using freenode and have a nice day!
[20:34:14] <BigJohnT> I don't think an apple would help him at that point
[20:51:46] <UbunUbun> How do I set up my udev devices on Ubuntu 8.04?
[20:53:40] <UbunUbun> I found some help here - http://www.britishideas.com/2007/11/07/how-to-install-emc2-on-unbuntu-710-gutsy-from-scratch/ Would they be the same for 8.04?
[20:55:20] <UbunUbun> Read this too but don't know what to do - http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?Debian_Lenny_Compile_RTAI
[20:55:36] <SWPadnos> did you install from the EMC2 liveCD, or stock Ubuntu then install EMC2/RTAI?
[20:55:43] <cradek> 8.04 is the currently supported version so you could just install our packages.
[20:55:53] <cradek> otherwise, please describe what exactly your goal is
[20:55:55] <UbunUbun> I have a smp box
[20:56:06] <UbunUbun> Had to compile from scratch
[20:56:24] <cradek> do you already have a rtai patched smp kernel that works?
[20:56:39] <UbunUbun> The kernel is running now, and I have compiled the rtai modules
[20:56:49] <UbunUbun> I have not installed them yet
[20:57:10] <cradek> sounds good
[20:57:59] <cradek> about the only special thing emc2 packages do to is disable the loading of the parport_pc kernel module: http://cvs.linuxcnc.org/cvs/emc2/debian/extras-Ubuntu-8.04/etc/modprobe.d/emc2?rev=1.1
[20:59:00] <UbunUbun> I disabled parport in the kernel when I compiled it.
[20:59:19] <UbunUbun> Is that enough?
[20:59:43] <cradek> I think that would work, but I have not done it that way
[21:00:10] <UbunUbun> I will find out I guess. :)
[21:00:27] <UbunUbun> Just need to get past the udev thing.
[21:01:17] <cradek> what is your specific question about udev? maybe I don't understand what you're asking.
[21:01:55] <UbunUbun> I have to make a file called /etc/init.d/create-rtai-devices.sh
[21:02:17] <UbunUbun> Don't know if that is right for 8.04
[21:02:34] <cradek> I don't know about any such file
[21:02:51] <cradek> recent rtai versions have udev support. I suggest you just try it without any trickery first.
[21:03:13] <cradek> install rtai and run their test suite. if they work, it's probably fine
[21:03:51] <UbunUbun> I guess it is for the rtai_shm, and rtf[0-9] devices?
[21:04:09] <alex_joni> UbunUbun: yeah, but those should get created by default by rtai
[21:04:22] <alex_joni> if you use a fairly recent rtai package
[21:04:32] <alex_joni> (newer then 3.6. or so)
[21:04:46] <UbunUbun> I used rtai 3.6 cv
[21:05:25] <UbunUbun> I'll give it a whirl
[21:06:20] <UbunUbun> one more question. do I have to sudo to install the rtai modules, or just my user account?
[21:07:36] <SWPadnos> in general, you need to use sudo to install things. I'm sure this will be the case for kernel modules
[21:07:50] <UbunUbun> ok, thanks!
[21:08:24] <SWPadnos> you're welcome
[21:08:36] <alex_joni> 3.6-cv would have been my choice too
[21:09:27] <UbunUbun> Ok, they are installed. going to reboot and run the test suite.
[21:11:35] <skunkworks> well - good thing you guys piped up - I was going to point him to the wiki on setting up a joystick
[21:48:58] <jepler> cradek: on that board I recently milled, I realized after almost all the trace isolation milling was done that I'd done it all at 200% FO. It didn't seem to hurt the finish, and I figure with my tendency to break tools due to dumb mistakes it doesn't matter so much if I'm shortening my tool life
[21:49:20] <cradek> that's funny
[21:49:56] <jepler> I think that means I was going at F40..
[21:50:07] <jepler> zip zip zip
[21:50:18] <cradek> have you never yet replaced one because it was dull?
[21:50:37] <jepler> no
[21:51:25] <jepler> well, sort of -- I I junked all the tools I had tried in the dremel, their tips were not very sharp anymore
[21:51:52] <jepler> which was 2 of the nice ones, plus several those cheaper ebay ones that I never got satisfactory results on
[21:52:00] <cradek> there must be a use for dremels, but I don't know what it is
[21:52:19] <cradek> the ones with one flat face don't work as well?
[21:52:33] <jepler> I am trying to remember if I ever tried one in the wolfgang spindle..
[21:56:42] <jepler> now that I'm using all tools with depth rings, I should test how consistent my tool lengths are and find out whether I can skip using the tool length probe
[21:57:41] <jepler> the ring setting is said by the manufacturer to be +-.002" which is fine if I touch off and start with the fine trace isolation tool
[22:06:10] <jepler> they give a recommended Z-Axis-Offset for each tool: http://www.precisebits.com/Reference/drillfeedspeed.asp http://www.precisebits.com/Reference/diamondcutfeedspeed.asp
[22:06:26] <jepler> I assume this is the amount you should change the depth by when cutting with this tool
[22:06:49] <jepler> instead of cutting to Z-.063, cut to Z[-.063-.020]
[22:06:57] <jepler> or whatever it happens to be
[22:16:57] <cradek> bizarre - I wonder why
[22:31:55] <jepler> because of the vee at the tip of the drill? I dunno.
[22:45:42] <alex_joni> SWPadnos: around?
[22:45:49] <SWPadnos> yes
[22:46:27] <alex_joni> do you remember the link fenn posted a couple days ago?
[22:46:32] <SWPadnos> no
[22:46:34] <alex_joni> regarding double belt drive?
[22:46:37] <SWPadnos> yes
[22:46:43] <alex_joni> there was a movie and all
[22:46:46] <SWPadnos> I don't remember the link, but I remember the subject matter
[22:46:53] <alex_joni> ah, too bad
[22:46:57] <alex_joni> logger_emc: bookmark
[22:46:57] <alex_joni> Just this once .. here's the log: http://www.linuxcnc.org/irc/irc.freenode.net:6667/emc/2009-02-02.txt
[22:47:03] <SWPadnos> ding :)
[22:47:55] <alex_joni> was it devel maybe?
[22:48:54] <ehj> Alex - I have a new bare install of ubuntu 8.04, no packages other than the default packages are loaded at this point. Which specific source tar balls should I download? linux_2.6.24-16.30.linuxcnc.4.tar.gz and rtai_3.6.1-linuxcnc.4.tar.gz?
[22:49:27] <alex_joni> http://www.designnews.com/article/160365-A_Better_Belt_Drive.php?nid=2337&rid=1696394
[22:49:30] <alex_joni> found it
[22:49:45] <alex_joni> ehj: lets move to devel
[22:49:57] <alex_joni> but yes, those seem right
[22:50:00] <ehj> oops, I thought I was in devel.