#emc | Logs for 2009-02-01

[00:31:11] <lucasliam> Jepler: What is the correct command to do build-essential? sudo apt-get build essential?
[00:31:49] <jmkasunich> sudo apt-get install build-essential (I think)
[00:32:39] <lucasliam> jmk: thats doing it - thanks.
[00:38:30] <lucasliam> Hopefully the last question - Tried sudo comp --install millkins.c and got a FIle not found error. I did download the file from the wiki - where should I place it on my computer?
[00:40:36] <SWPadnos> anywhere
[00:40:56] <SWPadnos> then go to that directory and sudo comp --install millkins.c
[00:41:19] <lucasliam> how bout ontop of the monitor ).... Actually - it is on my desktop atm - still not being seen though'
[00:41:32] <SWPadnos> not being seen where?
[00:41:33] <lucasliam> kk
[00:41:37] <jmkasunich> are you in the desktop directory?
[00:41:41] <jmkasunich> (its a hidden dir)
[00:41:49] <lucasliam> how do I get the terminal to point there?
[00:41:50] <jmkasunich> I would not recommend using the desktop
[00:41:57] <lucasliam> open to suggestions
[00:42:07] <jmkasunich> mkdir a new directory, and copy or move the file there
[00:42:09] <SWPadnos> open the terminal and then type "cd ~/.Desktop" (without the quptes)
[00:42:19] <lucasliam> kk
[00:42:42] <robin_z> * robin_z ponders what quptes might be ;)
[00:43:15] <SWPadnos> actually, it's not hidden, it's just called ~/Desktop
[00:43:35] <SWPadnos> robin_z, they're similar to quotes
[00:43:39] <robin_z> ah ha
[00:43:40] <SWPadnos> bbl
[00:44:43] <lucasliam> still gettin error
[00:48:40] <lucasliam> grr capitalization counts
[00:48:59] <lucasliam> needed cd ~/"D"esktop
[00:58:27] <robin_z> yep, its case sensitive
[02:47:08] <JymmmEMC> Broke 3 mother fscking SS screws by hand! eeeeeesh
[03:17:06] <bglackin> looking for help with opengl issues on my emc box - getting vertical stripes down the screen
[03:17:29] <bglackin> have a deskpro EN Compaq
[03:17:37] <bglackin> Onboard video
[03:19:24] <bglackin> cannot figure the exact vid hardware - can't seem to find sysinfo command
[03:20:54] <SWPadnos> lspci will tell you a lot
[03:21:04] <SWPadnos> one of the lines will have the word "VGA" on it
[03:21:15] <SWPadnos> along with other words that may be descriptive
[03:21:33] <bglackin> ok - will give it go
[03:23:00] <bglackin> intel 82815 815 chipset
[03:23:30] <bglackin> I tried putting a outboard video on this box and all I could get was 600X800 resolution
[03:23:50] <SWPadnos> what kind of video card? (out of curiosity)
[03:25:06] <bglackin> found it in my junk box - cirrus Logic chipset - noname on it - holding it right now
[03:26:17] <SWPadnos> oh, nevermind
[03:26:22] <SWPadnos> if it's that old, it won't matter :)
[03:26:43] <bglackin> sounds like I should put it back in the junkbox
[03:26:51] <SWPadnos> (they had great cards in the ISA and some of the VLB era :) )
[03:26:58] <SWPadnos> maybe even PCI
[03:27:16] <SWPadnos> I think I still have the programming manual for one of their chips somewhere
[03:27:16] <bglackin> this is a pci board
[03:27:28] <SWPadnos> CL-GD5424 or some such
[03:28:16] <bglackin> cl-gd5440 here
[03:28:29] <SWPadnos> ah, 5440, that may have been it
[03:28:55] <SWPadnos> ok, there was a 5464 chip, that could have been the specific one
[03:29:07] <SWPadnos> but it's been 15 years or more since I've looked at that particular manual
[03:29:19] <bglackin> no need to start )
[03:29:23] <SWPadnos> nope
[03:29:35] <SWPadnos> oh, it was the 546x
[03:30:03] <SWPadnos> (looking at the wikipedia page, that one looks most familiar)
[03:30:22] <SWPadnos> anyway, there have been several issues mentioned lately with the Intel 810 or 815 chipsets
[03:30:42] <SWPadnos> I don't remember the specific fix(es), but I think someone put what they found in the wiki
[03:30:55] <bglackin> Aye - was searching gmane and google and that is all I saw - apears I have the same type issue though
[03:32:01] <bglackin> tried searching the wiki and did not get any hits of interest even on the 810
[03:32:09] <SWPadnos> can you put the contents of /var/log/Xorg.0.log on http://pastebin.ca ?
[03:32:14] <bglackin> perhaps they did not add the notes yet
[03:32:18] <SWPadnos> yeah, could be
[03:32:29] <SWPadnos> or I'm totally wrong and nobody has found a fix :)
[03:32:59] <SWPadnos> I'd like to see a log from the i815 chip, even if it's in 800x600 mode
[03:33:23] <SWPadnos> also, you can try changing the resolution while at the desktop by pressing ctrl-alt-keypad+ and leypad-
[03:33:34] <SWPadnos> you may need to use the left hand set of ctrl/alt keys
[03:33:39] <SWPadnos> (I don't recall)
[03:34:27] <bglackin> getting the log atm - brb
[03:34:49] <SWPadnos> no oproblem
[03:34:52] <SWPadnos> -0
[03:34:59] <SWPadnos> -o and -(-0)
[03:36:45] <bglackin> http://pastebin.ca/1324153
[03:37:41] <bglackin> The keypress works - still have the lines (
[03:38:01] <SWPadnos> ok, two issues here (of course)
[03:38:12] <SWPadnos> I don't know how to fix - err, well either one of them
[03:38:19] <SWPadnos> but I may be able to figure out the resolution problem
[03:38:39] <SWPadnos> this is cute: (II) I810(0): Not using default mode "1024x768" (unknown reason)
[03:38:54] <SWPadnos> what's the resolution of the monitor?
[03:39:51] <SWPadnos> is this 8.04 or 6.06? (or something else entirely)
[03:40:12] <SWPadnos> also, does the login screen come up at one resolution and then the desktop at another?
[03:40:30] <bglackin> at max now probabl 1024X 1200 or somesuch
[03:40:35] <bglackin> using 6.06
[03:40:55] <SWPadnos> ok, please pastebin /etc/X11/xorg.conf
[03:41:14] <bglackin> Hard to tell - I just plugged this monitor in (one for router is out in the garage
[03:42:08] <bglackin> this is a bigger unit - resolution for login was at 1024X 1200 but when I got it - it dumped to 600X800 - was a bear getting axis aligned (and the reason its in the house atm)
[03:42:31] <bglackin> getting xorg.conf brb
[03:42:36] <SWPadnos> it looks like a 1280x1024 17" LCD from the X log
[03:42:41] <SWPadnos> or maybe 18"
[03:42:45] <SWPadnos> ok
[03:43:32] <SWPadnos> the login screen comes up in the first usable resolution, the desktop goes to whatever resolution it's set for (or it starys the same as the login screen if you don't set it)
[03:45:35] <bglackin> http://pastebin.ca/1324156 is xorg.conf
[03:46:22] <SWPadnos> ok. what monitor do you intend to use back in the garage? (is it this one?)
[03:47:10] <bglackin> viewsonic E70fb will be the one
[03:47:17] <SWPadnos> ok
[03:47:39] <bglackin> work affectionately called them "Boat anchors"
[03:47:43] <SWPadnos> well, let's try the easy way
[03:47:44] <SWPadnos> heh
[03:47:53] <bglackin> I was happy to offload them )
[03:48:12] <SWPadnos> with the correct monitor attached, hit ctrl-alt-F1 to get a text console
[03:48:14] <SWPadnos> then type:
[03:48:27] <SWPadnos> dpkg-reconfigure -phigh xserver-xorg
[03:48:30] <SWPadnos> err
[03:48:32] <SWPadnos> sudo dpkg-reconfigure -phigh xserver-xorg
[03:48:46] <SWPadnos> you may have to do this first:
[03:48:56] <SWPadnos> sudo /etc/init.d/gdm stop
[03:49:13] <SWPadnos> but I think it may be done for you
[03:50:37] <bglackin> making notes
[03:50:43] <SWPadnos> heh
[03:53:29] <SWPadnos> note that tab-completion will help you a lot
[03:54:05] <SWPadnos> sudo dpkg-r<tab><tab> rec<tab> -phigh xser<tab><tab> (or similar) will do most of the typing for you
[03:57:57] <bglackin> never knew that regarding tab completions - new linux user (<6 months
[03:58:08] <SWPadnos> enjoy
[03:58:19] <bglackin> doing the submarine strokes atm
[03:58:20] <SWPadnos> it works in a lot of places (but not everywhere)
[03:59:18] <bglackin> I have a second monitor of the type I plan to rehook so I am going to reboot and see if I can get through it
[03:59:28] <SWPadnos> there's probably a basic tutorial somewhere on the system. it could help to familiarize you with some of the concepts that may be different from waht you're used to
[03:59:35] <bglackin> swimming is used comp boxes and monitors atm
[03:59:46] <SWPadnos> CRT or LCD?
[04:00:02] <bglackin> crts aka boat anchors (by others)
[04:00:11] <SWPadnos> yep, I agree :)
[04:00:36] <bglackin> I call it a shop and kid's computer - and beats buying new stuff )
[04:00:36] <SWPadnos> though my center monitor is still a nice CRT - itll suck when it dies
[04:01:12] <bglackin> I have a E790B on this atm - 21" display - not too shabby
[04:01:15] <SWPadnos> you have to spend a lot of cash to get an LCD that's as good as a reasonably good CRT
[04:01:21] <SWPadnos> oh, 21. hmmm
[04:01:25] <SWPadnos> your fonts will look weird
[04:01:46] <bglackin> so will I if I can't get something working )
[04:02:17] <SWPadnos> the display reports that it's 360z270 mm, which I think is 18"
[04:02:23] <SWPadnos> 360x270
[04:02:39] <bglackin> <looks for a ruler>
[04:02:57] <SWPadnos> I think 360x270 comes out to 18"
[04:03:31] <SWPadnos> yep, 17.72
[04:03:42] <SWPadnos> oh, I'm used to LCDs now ;)
[04:03:49] <SWPadnos> that may be the visible area :)
[04:04:48] <bglackin> 15X11 - I need glasses and a perspective thats accurate
[04:05:27] <bglackin> be back shortly
[04:05:36] <SWPadnos> ok
[04:17:37] <bglackin> executed that command it it tossed me to text mode - reran it with a start command to get back
[04:17:47] <SWPadnos> ?
[04:17:56] <SWPadnos> it should put in text mode
[04:18:05] <bglackin> sudo /etc/init.d/gdm stop
[04:18:15] <SWPadnos> yes, that would result in text mode
[04:18:23] <SWPadnos> gdm is the Gnome display manager
[04:18:25] <bglackin> lol - ok - no idea what to do then
[04:18:38] <SWPadnos> I think you can't reconfigure the X server with the X server running ...
[04:18:53] <SWPadnos> you log in at the text console (if presented with a login prompt)
[04:19:00] <bglackin> ahh - so hit text mode and run the reconfigure then?
[04:19:02] <SWPadnos> and then type those commands into the termina;
[04:19:04] <SWPadnos> terminal
[04:19:07] <SWPadnos> yes
[04:19:12] <bglackin> kk - brb
[04:19:21] <SWPadnos> that's why I mentioned ctrl-alt-F1 to get a text console ...
[04:19:33] <SWPadnos> (that makes it less surprising, since you did it yourself :) )
[04:20:05] <toastydeath> he might want to use screen and a text mode irc client while he's doing this
[04:21:51] <SWPadnos> if I knew how to get him through that, I might suggest it
[04:22:03] <SWPadnos> but since I don't use screen yet, I'm no help there
[04:22:28] <toastydeath> oh
[04:22:45] <SWPadnos> I really should, it would be very helpful for me
[04:22:49] <bglackin> it ran and saved a"possibly previously customized version
[04:22:54] <toastydeath> screen is the bee's knees
[04:23:06] <SWPadnos> indeed
[04:23:45] <bglackin> did not clean up the lines but perhaps it will clear up the resolution issue
[04:25:06] <SWPadnos> yep. I'm afraid you'll have to google for the i815 problem fix
[04:25:23] <SWPadnos> and it's likely that the first thing people will suggest is to switch to a later distribution
[04:26:03] <SWPadnos> if you can put your config infor on a USB stick or something, you may want to try the 8.04 CD (unless you did that without success)
[04:27:50] <bglackin> ack - I can't just use the update manager for 8.04?
[04:28:12] <bglackin> no RT kernal automagially right?
[04:28:55] <bglackin> guess I should have done the 8.04 update before emc-dev install
[04:29:00] <SWPadnos> well, you may be able to, but I don't know if it will jump straight from 6.06 to 8.04
[04:29:07] <bglackin> along with the millkins (
[04:29:16] <SWPadnos> it may make you go through a few in betweens (6.10/7.04/7.10) ...
[04:29:21] <SWPadnos> heh
[04:29:31] <SWPadnos> if you're on dial-up, it'll be painful ;)
[04:29:50] <bglackin> cable - it could be reasonabley painful
[04:29:53] <SWPadnos> the CD is 700M, there are 300M or so of updates, and then there are the extra packages
[04:30:03] <SWPadnos> (emc2-dev and build-essential)
[04:30:37] <bglackin> aye - perhaps I should just bite the bullet and redo this box
[04:30:51] <bglackin> good practice loading all that stuff over
[04:30:54] <SWPadnos> incidentally, is the problem you're having actually skew?
[04:31:14] <bglackin> and perhaps I can get my wireless working at the sametime (g)
[04:31:15] <SWPadnos> well, reloading isn't the preferred way to fix things most of the time, but it may be best in this situation
[04:31:18] <SWPadnos> heh
[04:31:21] <SWPadnos> what kind of woreless?
[04:31:23] <SWPadnos> wireless
[04:31:55] <bglackin> linksys G - the one that does not work automatically
[04:32:07] <SWPadnos> a PCMCIA card?
[04:32:15] <bglackin> pci
[04:32:20] <SWPadnos> odd
[04:32:35] <SWPadnos> is that a carrier with PCMCIA or an actual card?
[04:32:52] <bglackin> looks like a carrier
[04:32:59] <SWPadnos> ok
[04:33:19] <bglackin> there is some deal that several of the librarues do not automatically load with the RT kernal
[04:33:21] <SWPadnos> I only ask because I had about the same thing for my old laptop, and the card hardware had problems
[04:33:48] <SWPadnos> yes, you'll have to install linux-ubuntu-modules or some such (for the RT kernel)
[04:34:13] <SWPadnos> there was an issue that prevented it from being able to connect to secure hotspots
[04:34:19] <SWPadnos> this was under Windows or Linux
[04:34:31] <bglackin> I think sullivan on the list found the solution - I asked him to post his notes to the wiki - havent checked for em yet
[04:34:40] <SWPadnos> I think I eventually found out that the early version of the card I had was a defective design
[04:34:45] <SWPadnos> ok
[04:36:23] <bglackin> regarding the secure hotspots issue - I think there was a worm that exploited the defect - my company's IT locked down all lappies hard recently - half the time - I can see the network but get a catch 22 on the handshake - and I travel alot so it sucks
[04:37:05] <SWPadnos> with that card, it made no difference
[04:37:33] <SWPadnos> I even used the Linksys wireless manager application when using Win2k
[04:37:37] <bglackin> and this box ) Not gonna lug this thing around - not too mention my sneakernet is starting to wear out
[04:37:42] <SWPadnos> heh
[04:40:22] <bglackin> burning the cable line now - Comcast's super highway appears to have been parked (1mb/sec verus advertised 6)
[04:42:16] <SWPadnos> heh
[04:42:54] <SWPadnos> funny. they're supposed to have some boost thingy that makes the first XX amount go really fast, but it looks like they're throttling instead :)
[04:44:05] <bglackin> I am getting ready to dump em and just get DSL - I do not do heavy downloading so no point and thier basic cable stinks - time for direct
[04:44:40] <SWPadnos> DSL isn't all that speedy
[04:44:48] <SWPadnos> I've been looking at cable instead ;)
[04:44:56] <bglackin> as to your earlier question regarding SKEW
[04:45:38] <bglackin> but Comcast is 110 a month now and they are cutting channels - all the kiddie channels and mine are still little - need those toons
[04:45:54] <bglackin> direct +dsl =60 bucks
[04:46:45] <bglackin> My gantry is cocked - not sure whats causing it - I want to rework the mahine but I have several other things I need to rebuild before pulling it apart
[04:46:58] <toastydeath> gantry is cocked?
[04:47:04] <SWPadnos> it wasn't clear whether the offsets you mentioned were on the axis you moved or the other axis
[04:47:23] <bglackin> when I pull it against the "-" X Axis stops - one side of the gantry hits .25" before the other
[04:47:58] <toastydeath> why is that a problem
[04:48:02] <bglackin> my gantry does not wrack at all so it sould just be along the Y and uniform
[04:48:10] <SWPadnos> ok, so as you move the head across the gantry in Y, the X position changes
[04:48:17] <toastydeath> oh
[04:48:22] <toastydeath> that's a problem.
[04:48:24] <bglackin> exactly
[04:48:47] <bglackin> its a hobby machine for woodworking so less of a problem
[04:48:49] <toastydeath> is one of the legs of your gantry free to unbolt so you can tap it in
[04:48:55] <bglackin> .25"/26"
[04:49:58] <bglackin> I could probably shim one side - but I figure if I do the corrections - it should work just as well and takes less measurement time
[04:50:19] <SWPadnos> do you have home switches?
[04:50:40] <bglackin> No - stepper machine - was planning on limits - just not enough time
[04:50:55] <bglackin> limits and home that is
[04:51:06] <toastydeath> what do you mean by corrections, specifically
[04:51:10] <SWPadnos> you must have home switches to make non-trivial kinematics work
[04:51:36] <SWPadnos> gantrykis needs to know its absolute position along the Y axis
[04:51:38] <bglackin> using the millkins module - it will do a correction to take out the skew
[04:51:49] <SWPadnos> right - that one ;)
[04:52:09] <bglackin> ack - looks like at least one switch is in my future
[04:52:11] <toastydeath> so it's going to move Y to correct for x?
[04:52:22] <SWPadnos> it may be easier to tap tap :)
[04:52:44] <toastydeath> my experience is that you're going to get a ratty finish if you rely on that kind of error correction
[04:52:56] <toastydeath> i would humbly suggest taking the hour and shimming or tapping it in
[04:53:25] <bglackin> hmmm - wasted enough time already - guess it can't hurt
[04:54:48] <toastydeath> only because very few machines have the step resolution to make it work properly, most machines move in quantized steps, not a smooth line
[04:55:21] <bglackin> if it won't tap out - no wories on the finish - at least for now since I am just building stuffy for the kids out of wood and mdf
[04:55:29] <toastydeath> of course there's a valid rebuttal in that i could be nitpicking for most folk's purposes
[04:56:02] <SWPadnos> the machine has that resolution anyway, so it doesn't matter too much
[04:56:13] <bglackin> well -to your favor - had I spent an hour today - I would have already finished it and not be here waiting for another distro to download...
[04:56:23] <SWPadnos> heh
[04:56:23] <toastydeath> lol
[04:56:26] <bglackin> but it does get me to tune up this box more )
[04:56:29] <SWPadnos> while you're waiting, you could fix it
[04:56:49] <bglackin> garage is 18 degrees - heck no )
[04:58:26] <bglackin> speaking of tuning. I am using the hobbycnc baord - it uses Allegros' sla707X version chips - I found a spec sheet - what do I need off it to figure the base period -
[04:59:15] <bglackin> not sure how to translate the jargon they use with what is described in the integrator's manual
[05:00:15] <SWPadnos> heh
[05:00:28] <SWPadnos> does the board have optoisolation?
[05:00:41] <SWPadnos> (that can change timing)
[05:02:00] <bglackin> I believe it is optoisolated
[05:02:46] <SWPadnos> ok, then you need to ask hobbycnc
[05:03:00] <SWPadnos> or take some measurements with a good scope
[05:04:33] <bglackin> Queries to Hobbycnc were met with little response - the canned response they give (mainly Mach users) is to turn down velocity and acceleration
[05:04:44] <SWPadnos> lovely
[05:05:11] <SWPadnos> well, you can try to use the spec sheet numbers, but maybe add a little to wach measurement
[05:05:34] <bglackin> I could probably get a buddy at work to scope it for me - he's heavy into instrumentaion and RT control (cement palnt stuff)
[05:05:49] <SWPadnos> what happens with optoisolators is that if they aren't symmetric in turn-on and turn-off, you need longer timing to account for the difference
[05:05:55] <SWPadnos> oh, cool
[05:06:00] <SWPadnos> know Bob Dawson?
[05:06:30] <bglackin> Nay - I am new to the industy - jumped into it 2 years ago
[05:06:39] <SWPadnos> ah
[05:06:44] <bglackin> and I work on the dirt side - digging rocks
[05:06:59] <SWPadnos> Bob was a professor of mine in the late '80s. he wrote some concrete plant control software way back when
[05:07:16] <bglackin> originally got into this trying to figure a way to cut terrain models
[05:07:44] <SWPadnos> huh
[05:07:46] <SWPadnos> interesting
[05:08:15] <bglackin> Perhaps he is downstream of what I am in - Concrete is the batching plants - cement is the burning process that makes the powder for the concrete plants
[05:08:38] <SWPadnos> oh, probably
[05:08:46] <SWPadnos> his stuff was used to control the mix recipes
[05:09:05] <bglackin> I waste too much time teaching upper managers how to read topo maps - I was looking for a way to translate them quickly into a model
[05:09:37] <bglackin> Cool - similar to batching software for asphalt plants then - I used to deal with some of that stuff
[05:09:55] <SWPadnos> yep
[05:10:13] <SWPadnos> I think he got the second software patent (ever) on that process
[05:10:50] <bglackin> last place I worked the IT manager cried everytime a batch computer crashed - he would take a new box and dump MSDos 3.10 into it
[05:11:47] <bglackin> everything was dos based and still is to my knowledge (at that operation
[05:12:08] <SWPadnos> nothing wrong with that
[05:12:25] <bglackin> very stable - just not fancy - stable is good
[05:15:34] <bglackin> comcast is cooking along at 9.1kbs - glad i am spending 100 bucks a month on "high speed" internet
[05:16:19] <SWPadnos> heh
[05:25:57] <bglackin> SW - what was command to provide hardware details?
[05:26:05] <SWPadnos> lspci
[05:26:10] <bglackin> Thanks
[05:26:14] <SWPadnos> that's one of them anyway
[05:26:16] <SWPadnos> sure
[05:28:32] <JymmmEMC> one of many =)
[05:29:10] <bglackin> Night - thanks for the help SW
[13:17:37] <motioncontrol> good mornig.i have sometimes the error message axis: encoder.00 <= dt how you can this....This allarm is present sometime for axis 00, axis01 and 02. because?
[13:34:24] <pjm__> afternoon all, would someone here have a simple example of closed loop spindle speed control? I have a VFD now hooked up and of course an encoder on the spindle, but I'd like to see some examples of how others have done this
[13:51:37] <alex_joni> pjm__: some of the sample configs have that
[13:55:14] <JymmmEMC> http://failblog.files.wordpress.com/2008/12/fail-owned-price-tag-placement-fail.jpg
[13:56:33] <alex_joni> heh...
[13:56:47] <BigJohnT> pjm__: I belive the stepconf wizard will do that automagiclly
[13:58:02] <alex_joni> BigJohnT: assuming you connect the encoder to parport
[13:58:20] <alex_joni> if he has some other hardware to count the encoder, than he'll have to figure it out
[13:58:28] <BigJohnT> yep
[14:00:37] <BigJohnT> pjm__: did you look in the Integrators manual?
[14:08:17] <pjm__> BigJohnT yeah i have that, i have the encoder connected and linked to a bargraph display in axis and it reads the proper spindle speed
[14:08:41] <pjm__> but i will do some further digging
[14:09:55] <BigJohnT> pjm__: here is how I did the GS2 example http://www.linuxcnc.org/docs/devel/html/examples_gs2_example.html
[14:10:36] <BigJohnT> and this is the pyvcp part http://www.linuxcnc.org/docs/devel/html/hal_pyvcp_examples.html#sec:GS2-RPM-Meter
[14:10:44] <alex_joni> BigJohnT: I think he already has that
[14:10:55] <BigJohnT> ok, didn't know
[14:11:04] <BigJohnT> or remember :(
[14:11:09] <pjm__> ok thanks, well i shall read and digest!
[14:11:15] <alex_joni> pjm__: hang on
[14:11:26] <alex_joni> you just said you have the spindle speed in a bargraph in vcp
[14:11:53] <alex_joni> pjm__: right?
[14:11:56] <pjm__> yep
[14:12:06] <alex_joni> ok.. there is not much else to do
[14:12:12] <pjm__> so this was just to check if I could do it first, it only uses a 4 ppr encoder tho
[14:12:17] <pjm__> something i made quickly
[14:12:20] <alex_joni> you can use the at-speed input to the motion controller
[14:12:42] <alex_joni> that way you can have some movements wait for the spindle to reach the commanded speed
[14:12:52] <alex_joni> for example transitions from G0 to G1
[14:12:54] <pjm__> ah yes interesting
[14:13:16] <alex_joni> another interesting thing to do is to do rigid tapping (if mill) or threading (if lathe)
[14:13:20] <pjm__> so for example what i'm aiming for is say i command 3000rpm and take a cut, i want to keep at 3000rpm under load
[14:13:42] <pjm__> yeah rigid tapping is on my list, not sure on the encoder res needed for that, i think 4ppr is too low
[14:14:04] <pjm__> i have a nice heidenhain 125ppr that may do, this is using parport tho, nothing fast..
[14:14:10] <alex_joni> right
[14:14:23] <alex_joni> well for the first part you probably want to implement some PID
[14:14:40] <alex_joni> motion.spindle.speed-out -> pid
[14:14:49] <alex_joni> pid.out-> VFD
[14:14:53] <pjm__> yes pid's will be a new learning area for me
[14:15:00] <alex_joni> encoder.speed -> pid
[14:16:11] <alex_joni> pjm__: probably the closest is looking at some servo configs
[14:16:27] <pjm__> ok will take a look and digest
[14:17:01] <pjm__> what do u recommend for spindle encoder ppr for reliable rigid tapping?
[14:26:29] <alex_joni> sorry.. no experience
[15:37:46] <KimK> pjm__: The "best" spindle encoder would be the one that has the highest resolution possible, but just low enough that it will not be above its speed (frequency) specs at the highest anticipated RPM. Does that help?
[15:46:28] <alex_joni> pjm__: what's your max rpm? and the current BASE_PERIOD ?
[15:47:08] <jepler> fwiw the mazak has 1440 counts/revolution according to its hal file
[15:50:09] <alex_joni> yeah, but it doesn't use parport to count it
[16:02:21] <KimK> Now I have a Q: Is there anything that I have to do in AXIS to set up the perspective view? I have a g-code program that shows up fine in ZzXY but is blank in P. I can go load chips_3d and it shows fine. Reload my g-code and I can't see anything in the perspective view, except for the XYZ numbers changing. I've tried zooming out a few steps. Any ideas?
[16:03:28] <alex_joni> KimK: pastebin your code
[16:09:32] <KimK> OK, here you go. http://www.pastebin.ca/1324548
[16:10:59] <jepler> using TRUNK
[16:11:00] <jepler> ?
[16:11:12] <KimK> Using 2.2.8
[16:11:38] <alex_joni> I wonder why you have all those (AXIS,show) comments
[16:13:12] <KimK> Just because I'm writing it by hand from Qcad and fooling around with it. The plot gets pretty busy-looking when everyting is enabled, so sometimes I hide parts of it while debugging,
[16:13:47] <alex_joni> oh, ok
[16:13:49] <jepler> indeed, removing those I see something
[16:14:07] <KimK> Oh, did I miss a "hide"? Oops.
[16:14:13] <jepler> I had to make multiple changes -- getting rid of cutter comp too (presumably my tool table doesn't match kim's)
[16:14:27] <jepler> but you said that it was different in perspective view from other views. are you prepared to recant that now?
[16:14:49] <alex_joni> KimK: I don't think you missed a hide..
[16:16:08] <jepler> no, it's all (AXIS,show) comments in that file
[16:16:11] <KimK> No, but I can restart AXIS to be sure, I think I did already though. I have run the code, no errors, I can push ZzXY and see those plots just fine. Nothing in P.
[16:16:36] <jepler> but the show/hide feature was written by a programmer
[16:16:54] <jepler> it turns out that if you write (AXIS,show) without a prior (AXIS,hide) then your plot disappears
[16:18:20] <KimK> I guess that rates a patented #emc "heh". "It's impossible to make something foolproof because fools are so ingenious."
[16:18:26] <jepler> axis keeps track of a quantity called "suppress", and it's always 0 at the start of a preview. When it encounters (AXIS,hide), it increases "suppress" by 1. When it encounters (AXIS,show) it decreases it by 1. If the value is not zero, then the preview plot is hidden
[16:18:37] <jepler> if used as intended, this works just fine
[16:18:51] <jepler> but "as intended" includes "never write show without an earlier hide"
[16:18:54] <alex_joni> maybe you should check > 0, not !=0
[16:19:26] <alex_joni> that will still be odd if you have 3 show's you need 4 hide's to hide things again
[16:19:31] <jepler> right
[16:20:03] <alex_joni> why not make suppress = 1 when it finds a hide, and 0 when it finds a show
[16:20:07] <jepler> at some point you have to say to the human: suck it up, this is how the program works
[16:20:12] <jepler> alex_joni: because they should nest
[16:20:24] <alex_joni> you think someone actually does tha?
[16:20:27] <jepler> yes, me
[16:20:30] <jepler> :-P
[16:20:33] <alex_joni> (sorry.. my spelling is crap..)
[16:20:45] <jepler> imagine you have some subroutine you don't want to see, so you put (AXIS,show) and (AXIS,hide) around it
[16:20:47] <alex_joni> I bet you can hide it even without (AXIS,hide) :P
[16:20:51] <jepler> now you want to also hide part of your main program
[16:21:02] <alex_joni> yeah, I get the point
[16:21:10] <jepler> maybe it calls the subroutine, maybe it doesn't; with my scheme you don't have to worry about it
[16:21:11] <alex_joni> then I guess it's a job for BigJohnT to fix it :)
[16:21:47] <BigJohnT> fix what? who me?
[16:22:17] <KimK> From a programmer's standpoint, why does the "supress" value affect P display differently from ZzXY displays?
[16:22:29] <jepler> KimK: it doesn't.
[16:22:34] <KimK> Why doesn't it hide all or none?
[16:22:51] <jepler> KimK: there's something else going on that we haven't discovered yet
[16:23:07] <KimK> OK. I'm happy to help if I can
[16:23:31] <alex_joni> BigJohnT: yeah, the docs
[16:23:49] <BigJohnT> ok looking
[16:23:55] <alex_joni> specify that you _always_ need to use a pair of (AXIS,hide) <-> (AXIS,show) and in that order
[16:25:28] <KimK> I was relying on the very bottom of the page http://linuxcnc.org/docs/html/gui_axis.html
[16:28:05] <alex_joni> well... it does say "Anything between the (AXIS,hide) and (AXIS,show) will not be drawn during the preview."
[16:28:09] <jepler> even though it won't be surprise-free for users, I made alex's proposed change
[16:28:19] <jepler> the > 0 check
[16:28:55] <alex_joni> jepler: that, and a small docs fix to emphasize that you always need to use the pair of hide/show ..
[16:29:09] <alex_joni> should take care of most surprises
[16:32:06] <KimK> Would there be any advantage to having (AXIS,show) be like G40, you can say it as often as you like?
[16:32:51] <jepler> no. stacking in one direction only is the worst of all worlds, and I want it to stack in the "hide" direction.
[16:32:59] <jepler> G40 doesn't "stack" in either direction
[16:33:29] <KimK> Stack? As in subroutines?
[16:34:32] <KimK> As in multiple invocations?
[16:35:11] <jepler> if you 'hide' when you're already hidden, it's not an error; but the preview doesn't reappear until an equal number of 'show' are encountered
[16:35:18] <jepler> I think of this as nesting or stacking
[16:35:49] <jepler> the motivating example I gave earlier also involved gcode subroutines, but that's not a requirement
[16:36:56] <KimK> And what will it do if you 'show' when you're already showing?
[16:37:14] <jepler> you mean after the change I made on TRUNK?
[16:37:19] <jepler> or do you mean now, in 2.2.8?
[16:37:40] <KimK> I was just talking about the complement to your example above
[16:38:25] <jepler> in 2.2.8, if the net number of shows minus hides is nonzero, it hides
[16:38:37] <KimK> You said "if you hide when you're already hidden..." I was just asking what if you show when you're already showing
[16:38:40] <jepler> so if the only thing you have is an '(AXIS,show)' then everything subsequent is hidden
[16:38:58] <jepler> now to me that's nonsensical, like writing the following and pretending it's algebra: )x+1
[16:39:19] <jepler> so I didn't write the software to do anything useful in that situation
[16:39:30] <jepler> actually, your part program said something like this: )x+))1
[16:39:36] <jepler> it's nonsense, and so you got garbage
[16:40:53] <KimK> I see. I think of the shows and hides as start/stop buttons. You should be able to push stop if it's already stopped, and the reverse. But you're the programmer, so OK. We'll "suck it up".
[16:41:36] <jepler> yes, the problem with software is how it's written by people who think like computers
[16:42:34] <KimK> Any thoughts on why I can still see ZzXY ?
[16:42:59] <KimK> Shall I take out all the hides and rerun it? (Maybe I'll do that...)
[16:43:17] <KimK> Oops, I meant shows
[16:46:11] <jepler> ah, what you didn't tell me is that what you see is not the preview plot but is the backplot
[16:47:49] <jepler> axis sizes the perspective plot according to the extents of the preview plot. when there is no preview plot, it uses a default that is bad.
[16:49:58] <jepler> that's fixed in TRUNK, by the way
[16:50:53] <KimK> Taking out the four shows seems to have restored the perspective view. Both preview and backplot.
[16:53:59] <KimK> Since I have the opportunity to ask, will there be a 2.2.9, or is 2.2.8 the end of the 2.2 line due to the coming 2.3?
[16:54:15] <alex_joni> KimK: if there are bugs in 2.2.8 we'll fix them in 2.2.9
[16:54:34] <alex_joni> there are 2-3 minor things in v2.2x (after 2.2.8) atm, but nothing to justify a new release
[16:55:30] <KimK> OK, I was just curious what you developers are planning for us mere mortals
[16:55:38] <alex_joni> (in the past we didn't have new versions after a enw majour was out.. but that's not a rule)
[16:56:15] <alex_joni> depends on you
[16:56:38] <jepler> list of 2.3 features, subject to change: http://cvs.linuxcnc.org/cvs/emc2/debian/changelog?rev=HEAD;content-type=text%2Fplain
[17:01:42] <KimK> Quite a long list there. There is also this (a summary?) http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?Emc2.3Status
[17:02:01] <alex_joni> yup
[17:02:28] <alex_joni> that's a todo list for 2.3
[17:02:38] <alex_joni> the things in the changelog are already done
[17:07:18] <micges> alex_joni: look at last mail at emc-list from brian, is there any warning to worry about ?
[17:07:31] <alex_joni> no, I don't think there's anything to worry about
[17:07:46] <alex_joni> it's just that it's a more modern compiler, that is easier to freak out :)
[17:10:07] <micges> lol
[17:58:26] <bglackin> Greetings all - reinstalled 8.04 and emc2-dev - added a millkins component (not activated yet and trying to fix a few last items before packing this back to the garage. I checking screen resolution, my monitor is not recognized? Any suggestions?
[17:58:56] <bglackin> I did stop GDM but my computer hung and I could not access the text terminal mode to reconfigure
[18:07:13] <bglackin> if anyone is looking,the log and config files are uploaded - xorg.0.log at http://pastebin.ca/1324636 and xorg.conf at http://pastebin.ca/1324640
[18:08:23] <alex_joni> bglackin: switching to a text console via ctrl-alt-F1 should always work
[18:08:30] <alex_joni> (before you try to kill/stop gdm)
[18:09:31] <cradek> looks like the monitor is read just fine to me
[18:09:33] <bglackin> I need to find a list of all the shortcut keystrokes )
[18:09:37] <cradek> it picks 1024x768
[18:09:42] <cradek> what's the symptom?
[18:11:44] <bglackin> perhaps not any - went into the reolution settings under preferences and saw monitor unknown - perhaps I am worrying too much - last eve this same setup had the hashes running across it must be a little twitchy now that that is gone with new install
[18:12:13] <cradek> so it's working fine?
[18:12:24] <eric_unterhausen> my monitor shows as unknown too. Some sort of programmer incompetence involved because the driver knows what it is
[18:13:22] <bglackin> Cr - yes - it appears fine - just unecesary worry on my part perhaps. Thanks for the clarification Eric
[18:13:34] <cradek> (II) intel(0): EDID vendor "VSC", prod id 8209
[18:14:08] <bglackin> last Item - my linksys wireless G card does not appear on my network connection list - I have added all the restricted rtai modules
[18:14:16] <cradek> sure, if you think it's incompetence that someone didn't know what vendor VSC id 8209 is
[18:14:47] <bglackin> card is PCI wireless
[18:15:09] <cradek> what do you mean by all the restricted rtai modules?
[18:15:12] <alex_joni> bglackin: does it work on a regular kernel?
[18:15:50] <alex_joni> there is linux-ubuntu-modules-2.6.24-16-rtai
[18:16:14] <bglackin> I don't have the actual name - I cut and pasted it from an older Alex Joni email to the list - Added it in the hopes it would show up
[18:16:21] <alex_joni> and linux-restricted-modules-2.6.24-16-rtai
[18:16:22] <eric_unterhausen> cradek: good point, but unknown monitor is less than helpful
[18:16:24] <bglackin> thats the one
[18:16:43] <eric_unterhausen> seems like wireless is not going to be a good idea with a rt kernel
[18:17:01] <alex_joni> bglackin: there is also linux-backports-modules-2.6.24-16-rtai
[18:17:08] <alex_joni> eric_unterhausen: why not?
[18:17:22] <eric_unterhausen> non-rt safe modules?
[18:17:34] <alex_joni> I didn't understand that..
[18:17:55] <alex_joni> bglackin: did you install from LiveCD ?
[18:18:06] <bglackin> AJ - Yes
[18:18:17] <alex_joni> hmm, ok.. then it's a bit harder to test
[18:18:32] <alex_joni> one thing you could do is try a regular Ubuntu 8.04 LiveCD and check if wireless works
[18:18:41] <alex_joni> if it does, look for the module (driver) it uses
[18:18:44] <bglackin> New to linux so not sure how to switch kernals
[18:18:55] <alex_joni> bglackin: that's why I said it's a bit harder to test
[18:19:11] <alex_joni> but you can download a 8.04.2 CD from Ubuntu.com, and boot with that one
[18:19:21] <bglackin> looks like I need to invest in a new pair of converses
[18:19:36] <alex_joni> if wireless works, then we can look what's missing from the -rtai kernel
[18:20:13] <bglackin> I'll burn a copy and try it out
[18:20:32] <alex_joni> bglackin: if wireless works, get online and go to pastebin.ca
[18:20:40] <alex_joni> open a terminal on your PC, and type dmesg
[18:21:01] <alex_joni> put the output from dmesg on pastebin.ca, and we can see what goes
[18:22:11] <bglackin> running it now - brb
[18:24:10] <bglackin> http://pastebin.ca/1324658 is the dmesg dump
[18:25:34] <alex_joni> that was fast
[18:25:44] <alex_joni> bglackin: not the right CD :)
[18:25:47] <bglackin> I am learning
[18:25:52] <alex_joni> that's our LiveCD
[18:26:19] <alex_joni> I said you should try the Ubuntu LiveCD
[18:26:24] <bglackin> ahh - I thought you meant the Linuxcnc Livecd
[18:26:36] <alex_joni> sorry if I wasn't clear
[18:27:21] <bglackin> I did understand - just got wires crossed - gonna burn the non emc distro now
[18:27:36] <alex_joni> heh, ok
[18:27:59] <bglackin> btw - I am on a hardwire with the box right now
[18:28:21] <bglackin> allowing me to work over the net
[18:28:50] <alex_joni> that's always better if available ;)
[18:31:23] <bglackin> Aye - Pulled the machine in last eve to get it sorted out
[18:32:03] <bglackin> deciding whether to move everything into my basement - would certainly be warmer
[18:35:01] <bglackin> I will report back later - download is crawling along on this "high speed connection"
[19:07:29] <Roguish> anyone out there good with AC 3 phase drives?
[19:10:20] <eric_unterhausen> Roguish: ?
[19:10:47] <Roguish> got a 10hp dirve that runs a plunger type machine.
[19:11:17] <Roguish> good on the up stroke, but on the back stroke the motor becomes a generator and oveloads the the DC bus.
[19:12:05] <Roguish> think i need either something to suck up or burn off a lot of energy.
[19:12:17] <eric_unterhausen> external braking resistor
[19:12:18] <Roguish> resistors or capacitors? not sure.
[19:12:36] <alex_joni> resistors usually
[19:12:41] <alex_joni> but big and hot
[19:12:58] <eric_unterhausen> Haas uses electric stove elements
[19:13:27] <eric_unterhausen> there is a place on the drive to attach
[19:13:34] <eric_unterhausen> on almost all drives
[19:13:46] <Roguish> gotta figure the actual amount of energy.
[19:14:07] <Roguish> there are terminals straight to the dc buss on the drive.
[19:14:46] <Roguish> how about diodes between the buss and the resistors?
[19:15:44] <eric_unterhausen> there should be a braking resistor internal to the drive which you then bypass
[19:16:26] <eric_unterhausen> there is a braking transistor
[19:16:32] <Roguish> yeah, could be. not sure. gonna speak with ACTech tomorrow.
[19:16:56] <eric_unterhausen> which drive?
[19:17:11] <Roguish> SCF4100w, ACTech
[19:17:30] <Roguish> 10hp 480v
[19:20:57] <eric_unterhausen> look at an0008
[19:21:16] <Roguish> application note? 0008
[19:21:23] <eric_unterhausen> yes
[19:28:22] <eric_unterhausen> uses a programmable output, looks like a relay and a braking resistor may be needed, hard to say without more thought
[19:29:21] <Roguish> check http://www.actechdrives.com/cgi-bin/site.pl?scf~f
[19:29:26] <Roguish> under options.
[19:30:07] <Roguish> hope it is an external option. i don't want to have to replace the drive. too much $$$
[19:45:16] <eric_unterhausen> the AN0008 mentions an external module
[21:09:01] <JymmmEMC> I'm confused.... How can a 10HP 3PH AC motor muck up a DC bus?
[21:09:42] <alex_joni> most AC motors are driven by a servo drive
[21:09:48] <alex_joni> those are usually powered from a DC bus
[21:10:03] <JymmmEMC> opto-isolation?
[21:10:13] <alex_joni> what do you mean?
[21:10:31] <JymmmEMC> and it sounds like BEMF is what he's dealing with.
[21:10:35] <alex_joni> right
[21:10:56] <JymmmEMC> which is usually "balanced" out with the energy going to other motors
[21:11:03] <alex_joni> the motor is powered through a 3 legged H-bridge directly from the DC bus
[21:11:04] <JymmmEMC> iiuc
[21:11:11] <alex_joni> what if he only has a spindle?
[21:11:17] <JymmmEMC> no clue
[21:11:28] <alex_joni> then there are no other motors to "balance"
[21:11:46] <alex_joni> otoh, I think it's unlikely to think that other motors are to balance things out
[21:11:58] <alex_joni> usually the motors start/stop pretty together
[21:12:25] <JymmmEMC> I'm only speaking from multiple stepper drives as Mariss had explained it
[21:12:29] <alex_joni> unless you have a multi-machine DC bus, which is uncommon
[21:12:33] <JymmmEMC> s/drives/motors/
[21:13:12] <JymmmEMC> get a motor from the junk yard and use it to turn the garden gnome ?
[21:14:09] <alex_joni> at 10HP it's gonna be a big gnome
[21:14:16] <JymmmEMC> no doubt =)
[21:14:46] <alex_joni> Mariss had some schematics how to dump BEMF into resistors
[21:14:54] <alex_joni> that's probably ok to do on his drives
[21:15:06] <alex_joni> I would be scared to do that myself on bigger servos though
[21:15:07] <JymmmEMC> Ok, garnden gnome, pink flamingo, water fountain pump, wooden orinmental windmill, and porch frog gribbiting! How's that?
[21:15:26] <alex_joni> sounds better :)
[21:15:45] <alex_joni> the servos we use take 380~ and rectify it to about 560V DC
[21:15:55] <alex_joni> that's the servo DC bus, which powers all drives
[21:16:03] <JymmmEMC> @ 10HP that would be like a crap load of 500W resisters
[21:16:16] <JymmmEMC> or like someone mentioned stove element
[21:16:28] <JymmmEMC> they're already rated for 220VAC
[21:16:46] <JymmmEMC> and gawd knows they suck up the juice!
[21:17:09] <JymmmEMC> Maybe use them to heat up lunch or something =)
[21:17:20] <alex_joni> they're sure nice in winter
[21:17:54] <JymmmEMC> yeah, could make some kind of radiant heat thingy and a fan
[21:25:15] <alex_joni> good night all
[21:25:23] <JymmmEMC> G'Night alex_joni
[21:47:26] <ZbuffeR> Hello people
[21:48:33] <ZbuffeR> I am pretty new to EMC2, just did a quick simulation with the liveCD yesterday
[21:50:39] <ZbuffeR> Did anybody try to run EMC2 on an embedded CPU ?
[21:50:50] <ZbuffeR> such as ARMè/9, AVR32, ... ?
[21:51:49] <ZbuffeR> meant ARM7/9
[22:08:12] <ZbuffeR> not a lot of people around here ...
[22:10:42] <eric_unterhausen> don't think anyone here has done it
[22:11:03] <eric_unterhausen> looks like the Atom will probably work
[22:11:53] <eric_unterhausen> there are people using ARM processors with RTAI, but that might not be enough processor for step/dir generation
[22:12:27] <ZbuffeR> so the limitations are more on the processing power side ?
[22:12:44] <jmkasunich> EMC does most of its work in floating point - on a PC, FP is just as fast as integer math, not sure if that's true on ARM and such
[22:13:04] <jmkasunich> the biggest hurdle is probably building the realtime kernel for your platform of choice
[22:13:21] <ZbuffeR> that's true, often the floating point is much slower on these processors
[22:13:35] <eric_unterhausen> the kernel does seem to be a bit of a project
[22:13:51] <ZbuffeR> so EM2 is not dependant on CPU architecture, given that sufficent floating point computation power is available ?
[22:14:13] <jmkasunich> I wouldn't go that far
[22:14:26] <jmkasunich> you would be treading on unexplored ground, I'm sure there are some traps
[22:14:44] <ZbuffeR> I imagine.
[22:15:23] <eric_unterhausen> it's probably fairly close to being hardware independent as long as RTAI runs
[22:15:34] <ZbuffeR> ok
[22:15:44] <ZbuffeR> I ask because it is not easy to convince some people that a PC can belong to an actual workshop
[22:15:57] <jmkasunich> heh
[22:16:06] <ZbuffeR> and they would be reassured if an embedded system is used
[22:16:21] <jmkasunich> use an embedded PC ;-)
[22:16:28] <jmkasunich> PC-104 or something like that
[22:16:35] <eric_unterhausen> my opinion of embedded pc's is in the tank
[22:16:50] <jmkasunich> why's that?
[22:16:58] <eric_unterhausen> too much wasted time
[22:17:17] <eric_unterhausen> embedded bios are very badly tested
[22:17:30] <ZbuffeR> really ?
[22:17:38] <eric_unterhausen> the pc ones
[22:17:40] <jmkasunich> speaking of which, I should stop talking and start milling - we're having a warm spell, and I'm way behind on making gears
[22:18:03] <eric_unterhausen> and PC104+ is a nightmare
[22:18:22] <ZbuffeR> and I understand laptops are not ideal either ...
[22:18:31] <eric_unterhausen> not for emc
[22:19:10] <eric_unterhausen> the problem is mostly the energy saving nonsense
[22:19:35] <ZbuffeR> ah yes, I read something about latency spikes on the doc
[22:21:13] <ZbuffeR> different question : the parallel port driver seem quite easy to use
[22:21:52] <ZbuffeR> is there an advantage to use dedicated control boards, ie. for steppers ?
[22:22:27] <eric_unterhausen> better stepping
[22:23:11] <ZbuffeR> one hardware I have in mind would need up to 4000 steps/sec
[22:23:26] <ZbuffeR> is that doable with the parallel port ?
[22:24:25] <ZbuffeR> I did the latency test, and it said 15 microseconds jitter, looks doable
[22:25:39] <JustinXJS2> I have 8us and am doing about 10k steps/sec right now, your results my vary
[22:25:51] <ZbuffeR> ok thanks
[22:26:01] <eric_unterhausen> JustinXJS2: what mobo?
[22:26:10] <JustinXJS2> K8N
[22:26:14] <JustinXJS2> Asus
[22:26:15] <ZbuffeR> yeah 8us seem very low :)
[22:26:56] <eric_unterhausen> this computer has done that, but I'm not going to run a mill with it
[22:27:17] <JustinXJS2> I was in the 14us range, until I disabled the onboard LAN and pulled the wireless card
[22:27:47] <eric_unterhausen> do you have an add-in lan?
[22:28:20] <JustinXJS2> so far the motors are just on the bench, but I am getting 2100RPM out of them with 100% accuracy
[22:28:45] <eric_unterhausen> nice
[22:28:48] <JustinXJS2> no, no lan for now, I have more than one computer in my garage, so it is no big deal
[22:29:14] <eric_unterhausen> I should try that
[22:30:35] <JustinXJS2> I was shocked how much it lowered the jitter
[22:31:15] <JustinXJS2> I bet one of those 3com server cards would be good to put in the machine, I bet they would have less effect on the jitter
[22:31:16] <ZbuffeR> it is good to know anyway
[22:31:53] <JustinXJS2> yes, basically my machine has all the hardware that is not being used disabled
[22:32:17] <JustinXJS2> and I have a matrox videocard in it now, I had bad luck with ATI
[22:32:34] <eric_unterhausen> which one?
[22:32:55] <eric_unterhausen> putting a matrox g450 didn't help my jitter at all
[22:33:15] <JustinXJS2> P650, it was the only matrox card I had laying around
[22:33:17] <eric_unterhausen> thinking about putting the nvidia back in
[22:34:06] <eric_unterhausen> some people suggest that digging out an old pci millennium is the best choice, never tried it myself
[22:34:17] <ZbuffeR> and same for unnecesary software, you disabled extra running programs ?
[22:34:24] <JustinXJS2> haha, i have not seen one of those for years
[22:35:04] <JustinXJS2> well, I am just using the default install off the livecd so far, I have not changed any of the software yet
[22:36:00] <ZbuffeR> does the number of CPU cores help reduce latency, or it doesn't matter ?
[22:37:21] <JustinXJS2> It sounds like it can or cant, depending on the chipset
[22:37:55] <ZbuffeR> so it is not clear cut
[22:38:20] <JustinXJS2> from my understanding, no, but I am a newbie at all this
[22:38:58] <The_Ball> it can increase latency if cpu affinity is not setup properly
[22:39:13] <ZbuffeR> mmh ok
[22:40:38] <ZbuffeR> I also have an old robotic arm, that was designed for teaching uses, 25 years ago
[22:41:06] <ZbuffeR> 6 step motors (5 joints + clamp)
[22:41:28] <ZbuffeR> driven by parallel port, but with a strange protocol
[22:41:50] <ZbuffeR> I wondered if EMC2 is modular enough to accomodate this ?
[22:42:42] <ZbuffeR> pic of the beast : http://michel.roemhild.free.fr/IMG/jpg/image-youpi.jpg
[22:42:56] <The_Ball> it doesn't have a "strange protocol" module, but you could write one... you would be better off converting it
[22:43:04] <jepler> it may be, but you would have to write a component that turns emc's position commands into whatever it needs
[22:43:13] <ZbuffeR> ok
[22:43:45] <ZbuffeR> what block would that be ?
[22:43:50] <jepler> emc produces commanded positions every servo-period (typically 1ms) .. most people use that to drive a step generator or a PID loop
[22:45:16] <jepler> you'd also have to write kinematics, which describe how to turn cartesian positions into joint positions
[22:46:00] <ZbuffeR> I saw a Puma example, with 3D model
[22:46:44] <ZbuffeR> I should be able to modify it to suits my needs
[22:47:04] <jepler> http://www.linuxcnc.org/docview/html/motion_kinematics.html
[22:47:21] <jepler> this document describes kinematics, which translate between cartesian and joint coordinate systems
[22:47:48] <ZbuffeR> yep, I read that
[22:49:02] <jst_home> jepler: Thank you for the work you did on biarc's!
[22:49:22] <jepler> ugh, is this the system for communicating steps with the robot? http://youpi.forler.ch/prog.htm a system which is designed to move only one motor at a time is going to work very badly with emc
[22:49:42] <jst_home> jepler: I don't know if you saw my post on the emc lists, but I've been hacking on your inkscape exporter a bit lately, and incorporated your biarc.py script into it
[22:49:54] <jepler> jst_home: yes I did see it
[22:50:13] <jepler> jst_home: nice work
[22:50:52] <jst_home> jepler: Thanks! Took a while to get my head around a couple of things, but it sure seems to work nice now
[22:51:07] <jepler> I don't think I'll be doing an updated version soon, but if anyone asks I'll point them at the mailing list posts
[22:51:13] <ZbuffeR> @jepler: what has to be done separately for each motor is only the direction choice
[22:51:36] <ZbuffeR> the steps can be done for all 6 at any time
[22:52:12] <jepler> ZbuffeR: ah, rusty french + only skimming, I am not surprised if I misunderstood
[22:52:35] <jst_home> jepler: Feel free. I'll probably be posting more as I make more progress
[22:52:36] <jepler> sorry, have to go
[22:52:37] <jepler> bbl
[22:52:48] <ZbuffeR> kthxbyez
[22:54:10] <ZbuffeR> I am still not sure where in EMC2 I would plug my custom step generator module ?
[22:54:37] <ZbuffeR> anybody can point the relevant part in the documentation ?
[23:00:43] <ZbuffeR> do I have to build a custom hardware driver such as the ones described in Chapter 12 in the Integrator Manual ?
[23:01:56] <ZbuffeR> or would that be a HAL component ?
[23:15:22] <bglackin> brief update on loading a wireless card on 8.04
[23:16:04] <bglackin> it appears that the card I have (linksys wmp54g v4.1) needs a restricted driver and firmware
[23:16:16] <bglackin> therefore getting it running is at my risk....
[23:16:47] <bglackin> got the firmware (search ralink in synaptic) loaded - still struggling with the driver portion
[23:17:09] <bglackin> New sneakers are looking good atm
[23:22:54] <ZbuffeR> did you try the rt2x00 ?
[23:23:01] <ZbuffeR> http://rt2x00.serialmonkey.com/wiki/index.php/Hardware
[23:33:51] <ZbuffeR> ok bye guys, time to sleep
[23:41:54] <jtr_> jtr_ is now known as jtr