#emc | Logs for 2007-12-31

[00:02:22] <eric_U> I just bought a nice big brushless servo for $30, shipped
[00:02:44] <eric_U> this is all due to the wonders of listing a servomotor in the wrong category
[00:02:47] <alex_joni> good night all
[00:03:23] <eric_U> I love the "other" category
[00:08:10] <gezr> gamma you hooked the machine up?
[00:08:58] <gezr> sorry I had to run to the store, to get a pound of putty, some epoxy brass screws and plastic nuts
[00:12:41] <Ziegler> gezr: sounds like a party
[00:13:11] <gezr> its going to be neat at least to make a little bittie machine
[00:14:02] <Ziegler> is that what its all for?
[00:14:25] <Ziegler> what are you going to power it with?
[00:15:01] <gezr> 5 and 12v dc
[00:19:41] <gezr> well, I need the epoxy to mount the nuts and stuff, the plaster to make the prototype
[00:20:30] <gezr> I just have to find something to pour the form with
[00:39:38] <gezr> gamma-x you there?
[00:45:50] <dmess> hi all
[00:49:21] <Gamma-X2> gezr yeah wuts up
[00:54:35] <gezr> gamma you ran your machine?
[00:56:27] <fenn> hmm plaster cnc machine
[00:56:46] <gezr> no not a plaster machine, using the plaster to make the prototype
[00:57:00] <fenn> what's the plaster for?
[00:57:00] <gezr> to get the idea right in ma brain
[00:57:19] <gezr> so I dont scrap the only large piece of aluminum i have
[00:57:26] <fenn> ah
[00:57:32] <fenn> you should take up casting as a hobby
[00:57:50] <gezr> ill piddle with a 3d model, then draw it out then do the machinging on the block and then put it together
[00:57:51] <fenn> its cheap as dirt (literally) and the results are amazing
[01:00:35] <gezr> I have a freiend who does casting
[01:05:06] <ALS> fenn: what do use as a furnace
[01:08:13] <JymmmEMC> steves_logging: Your 120 ($89), will it work ok with Parker Computmotor OEM750 and OEM650 drives by chance? Anything I should be aware of ?
[01:09:45] <Gamma-X2> i ran it!
[01:09:48] <Gamma-X2> i ran it!!!!
[01:10:25] <Gamma-X2> The bed was movin woooo!
[01:11:42] <gezr> so what power did you hook it up to?
[01:11:48] <gezr> 220v into the transformer?
[01:12:26] <gezr> gamma-x2 thats great by the way
[01:12:53] <gezr> but I wanna hear some details
[01:13:06] <Gamma-X2> lol
[01:13:14] <Gamma-X2> i plugged in the controller
[01:13:17] <gezr> to what?
[01:13:20] <Gamma-X2> hit estop, took estop off
[01:13:24] <Gamma-X2> and hit reset! lol
[01:13:31] <Gamma-X2> 110
[01:13:38] <gezr> all be darned
[01:13:44] <gezr> so you bypassed the transformer?
[01:14:08] <Gamma-X2> no
[01:14:09] <Gamma-X2> lol
[01:14:19] <Gamma-X2> didnt do anything! hahahah
[01:14:25] <Gamma-X2> i plugged it in and hit 2 buttons
[01:14:29] <Gamma-X2> boop boop
[01:14:40] <ALS> gambler
[01:15:01] <gezr> that seems odd to me,
[01:15:12] <Gamma-X2> lol
[01:15:15] <gezr> I would seriously check things out before you power it on more
[01:15:23] <Gamma-X2> i know what was wrong
[01:15:44] <Gamma-X2> limit switch was bein hit and the togglwe switch on the servo control box
[01:15:47] <gezr> if your control is getting half the power it should it wont last long
[01:15:47] <Gamma-X2> what a bitch!
[01:15:59] <Gamma-X2> nah nah its fine
[01:16:04] <gezr> okay
[01:16:05] <Gamma-X2> this is how it is supposed to be
[01:16:07] <gezr> grats then
[01:16:14] <Gamma-X2> lol thanks
[01:16:33] <Gamma-X2> when u asked for the picture i went out and studied it closely and then i was like wtf!
[01:17:13] <Gamma-X2> now all i need is a rs232 cable for testing
[01:21:17] <Gamma-X2> dnc is drip feeding right?
[01:21:54] <fenn> Gamma-X2: plug in the control and try spinning the motor.. if it doesnt spin easily you're going to burn it up
[01:22:17] <fenn> the spindle i mean
[01:22:35] <gezr> I dont trust what he has already done but hey, its his stuff
[01:22:37] <Gamma-X2> theres no power what so ever goin to the motor
[01:23:01] <Gamma-X2> the 3 phase powers spindle, and coolant pump.
[01:23:44] <gezr> gamma I would feel so much better knowing what sort of power your getting to the control, I know you pluged it in to 110 but if thats getting dropped down to 60 by the transformer, yeah things are going to work but they wont work for long
[01:24:16] <Gamma-X2> gezr if there dropped to 60 what would it matter?
[01:24:20] <fenn> spend the $3 for a multimeter, you wont regret it :)
[01:24:39] <Gamma-X2> there was a plug on the servo control box already for the 110...
[01:24:50] <gezr> gamma-x2 there was?
[01:25:03] <fenn> bah
[01:25:26] <Gamma-X2> lol
[01:25:28] <gezr> then your fine, seems odd there was a plug for it and you didnt see it before but cool, I wanna see a photo of that
[01:25:30] <Gamma-X2> i said that before lol
[01:25:36] <fenn> you said the opposite before
[01:25:48] <Gamma-X2> well before no one knew there was 2 control boxes lol
[01:25:55] <fenn> ugh
[01:25:57] <jmkasunich> lol lol lol lol
[01:25:59] <gezr> I heard nothing about a pig tail
[01:26:06] <jmkasunich> Gamma-X2: are you a teenager?
[01:26:15] <fenn> * fenn wishes he had op sometimes
[01:26:21] <Gamma-X2> i said it and i plugged it in and the control would light u but no movement lol
[01:26:33] <Gamma-X2> jmkasunich lol close
[01:26:44] <Gamma-X2> im 16!
[01:26:52] <jmkasunich> I guess "lol" is punctuation in gamma land
[01:26:52] <gezr> wait, give jmk a moment he is ridding the lolocoaster
[01:27:22] <dmess> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZkWWRTORMmg from my old mine... 5800 level to a sub...
[01:27:26] <gezr> im 34 and I use lol a lot
[01:27:30] <Gamma-X2> hahaha im not 16 im actualy 22, i work for a powerplant and i jsut got out of the navy. lol is a common term ur children would all know.
[01:27:37] <jmkasunich> gezr: every sentence?
[01:27:53] <jmkasunich> Gamma-X2: I know
[01:28:03] <jmkasunich> my stepson is 24 and still in the navy
[01:28:08] <jmkasunich> what ship were you on?
[01:29:02] <Gamma-X2> usns supply
[01:29:07] <Gamma-X2> based out of earle newyersey
[01:29:50] <jmkasunich> he's on a DDG out of Norfolk
[01:29:55] <jmkasunich> GSM3
[01:30:01] <gezr> jmkasunich : oh no, not every setence, oh good news, I did blow that chip out last night, but I have 2 good ones still, so I plugged one in, and got z back, and I have 1 spare
[01:30:47] <Gamma-X2> what is a gsm
[01:30:53] <Gamma-X2> gunners mate
[01:30:54] <Gamma-X2> ?
[01:31:00] <jmkasunich> gas turbine jockey
[01:31:30] <Gamma-X2> ahhhh nice
[01:31:33] <Gamma-X2> norfolik sucks!
[01:32:48] <gezr> whoot, its dinner time, ill be back in a bit
[01:32:58] <Gamma-X2> i had sushi
[01:32:59] <Gamma-X2> yay
[01:34:01] <jmkasunich> hmm, your ship has the same engines as his DDG
[01:35:05] <Gamma-X2> big ass turbine engines
[01:35:09] <jmkasunich> yep
[01:35:10] <Gamma-X2> ive been down there c ouple of times
[01:35:21] <jmkasunich> I see you did UNREPs
[01:35:21] <Gamma-X2> i work on turbines at work lol cant get away!
[01:35:26] <Gamma-X2> yes sir!
[01:35:28] <Gamma-X2> lol
[01:35:34] <Gamma-X2> plenty of unreps wich sucked
[01:35:37] <Gamma-X2> wich ddg was he on
[01:35:47] <jmkasunich> 72 - Mahan
[01:35:51] <Gamma-X2> lol
[01:36:06] <Gamma-X2> was he overseas about 1 1/2 years ago?
[01:36:25] <jmkasunich> he's been aboard about a year, first deployment was to europe this summer
[01:36:31] <Gamma-X2> ahhhh
[01:36:31] <Gamma-X2> ok
[01:37:21] <fenn> gosh they really use helicopters to go from one ship to another?
[01:37:37] <jmkasunich> sometimes
[01:37:41] <Gamma-X2> i was with them alol yeah
[01:37:45] <Gamma-X2> its crazy
[01:37:46] <jmkasunich> usually unrep is by cables and hoses though
[01:37:49] <Gamma-X2> yes
[01:37:50] <Gamma-X2> both
[01:37:55] <Gamma-X2> cables hoses and helo's
[01:37:56] <jmkasunich> http://www.navybuddies.com/ships/aoe6_5.jpg
[01:38:13] <Gamma-X2> oh god dont remind me lol
[01:38:34] <jmkasunich> those are hard work, eh?
[01:38:42] <Gamma-X2> no it jsut sucked
[01:38:52] <Gamma-X2> i was an it
[01:39:21] <Gamma-X2> IT3
[01:40:07] <jmkasunich> 'lectronical stuff
[01:40:15] <fenn> and you dont have a multimeter..
[01:48:13] <Gamma-X2> nope lol
[02:16:41] <jmkasunich> http://www.navybuddies.com/ships/aoe6_5.jpg
[02:16:45] <jmkasunich> oops
[02:17:00] <jmkasunich> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s9zXweJ4O3s&feature=related
[02:17:10] <jmkasunich> gear up landing, but he does it perfectly
[02:28:03] <dmess> nice landing...
[02:29:36] <a-l-p-h-a> I'd be shitting my pants if I was in the plane
[02:30:04] <tomp> no burma-shave on runway
[02:30:37] <dmess> im surprised he didnt choose the grass..
[02:32:37] <dmess> what kinda plane is it a cessna mustang??
[02:34:08] <skunkworks> a weeks worth of work so far.. http://www.electronicsam.com/images/house/floor.JPG
[02:34:08] <eric_U> I guess they don't foam runways any more
[02:34:17] <eric_U> didn't even see a fire truck
[02:34:57] <a-l-p-h-a> small apart?
[02:35:12] <skunkworks> kitchen
[02:35:21] <a-l-p-h-a> the small airport near my work (a block away) I don't think has it's own FD...
[02:35:22] <eric_U> skunkworks: you've been laying tile?
[02:35:25] <a-l-p-h-a> err.
[02:35:27] <skunkworks> yes
[02:35:35] <a-l-p-h-a> eric_U, small air port.
[02:35:45] <a-l-p-h-a> I was looking as skunkworks's kitchen, and thinking apartment.
[02:37:15] <eric_U> I used to help fix f-16's that landed nosegear up
[02:37:58] <eric_U> I believe the pilot manual says to punch out for other gear-up situations
[02:39:22] <gezr> who is going to want to see the plaster mock up?
[02:39:41] <a-l-p-h-a> no one... but paste the link anyways, and I'll look.
[02:39:41] <a-l-p-h-a> ;)
[02:40:06] <eric_U> what kinda machine?
[02:40:29] <eric_U> build a "Joe's", the mockup is the machine
[02:41:35] <eric_U> skunky, I want to put down tile in my kitchen, dining room, powder room and entryway
[02:42:04] <eric_U> already have tile in the entryway, but it is a crummy job that looks dated
[02:55:19] <gezr> the computer isnt reading the photo card
[02:56:07] <eric_U> it's a poor craftsman that blames his tools
[02:59:14] <gezr> ill reboot and see if that works
[02:59:32] <eric_U> windows user
[03:06:06] <gezar> alrighy the photo is uploading
[03:06:25] <gezar> http://picasaweb.google.com/dagezar/RaidJunk/photo#5149968001570145474
[03:07:01] <gezar> what do ya think?
[03:07:52] <eric_U> I'm not sayin'
[03:08:17] <gezar> come on it does no justice to not say anything
[03:09:29] <eric_U> if you're going to do something unconventional, copy a deckel
[03:09:53] <gezar> thats a conventional tool design
[03:09:59] <gezar> its common on a lot of machines now
[03:10:35] <gezar> if I move the x axis under Y then all of a sudden ive got the makings for a horizontal
[03:13:59] <eric_U> that's the cool thing about a deckel, it's both a horizontal and vertical mill
[03:14:20] <eric_U> and you could buy a angle bracket, and your mechanical rigidity is done
[03:15:11] <eric_U> but it looks like they probably stink as a manual mill: http://www.lathes.co.uk/deckel/index.html
[03:15:47] <gezar> they are much more robust now too
[03:16:07] <gezar> but this this as you can see very tiny
[03:16:25] <eric_U> that's why I like the deckel configuration better
[03:16:40] <eric_U> it would be easy to get a tiny angle bracket
[03:16:55] <jmkasunich> how about copying a van norman?
[03:17:17] <eric_U> or "the Jabba the hutt of milling machines"
[03:17:45] <jmkasunich> http://jmkasunich.com/vannorman/
[03:18:37] <eric_U> I forgot they made them that small
[03:18:52] <eric_U> The only one I've seen in person was larger than my car
[03:19:01] <gezar> my original thoughts were to have a vertical X mount for various tables, but this is just something very simple and very small
[03:19:24] <eric_U> the moment on your vertical axis is going to kill you
[03:20:05] <gezar> well the plaster is just to see it in 3d, the Z axis is going to be much longer going back
[03:20:25] <eric_U> how big are you going to make it?
[03:20:28] <gezar> more like |\ type shape
[03:20:39] <eric_U> too bad sketchup doesn't work in linux
[03:20:54] <gezar> the footprint of the machine is going to be oh, 3"x4"
[03:21:21] <eric_U> what kind of ways?
[03:21:31] <gezar> almuinum on aluminum box
[03:21:57] <gezar> no gib with maybe .001 max clearance on the lips
[03:22:23] <eric_U> my mill has square ways with no gibs
[03:22:55] <gezar> ill use a small woodruff key cutter to do the ways
[03:23:00] <eric_U> anyone use one of the online metal suppliers?
[03:25:52] <gezar> eric_U: this is just so I can have something that moves in 3 axis, instead of just watching motors whirl
[03:26:17] <eric_U> that's a noble purpose
[03:32:18] <eric_U> $13, instant deckel: http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INSRIT?PARTPG=INLMKD&PMPXNO=946578&PMAKA=418-4415
[03:33:21] <eric_U> that would be a great use for all those 2" long ballscrews that people keep listing on ebay
[03:33:51] <gezar> eric_U: did you notice the size of my stepper motor?
[03:34:10] <eric_U> you don't have to move the angle plate :)
[03:35:46] <eric_U> you want smaller: http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INSRIT?PARTPG=INLMKD&PMPXNO=944748&PMAKA=418-4310
[03:37:31] <gezar> look, if I get frustrated over this, ill just give up, and it will be another 3 years before I plop back in here, I dont want that to happen this time
[03:38:21] <gezar> I have a machine idea, much like the deckel in my head for oh 8 years or so now, and I havent done jack, I want to do something this time
[03:38:31] <gezar> and I want to accually contribute to the software
[03:39:04] <gezar> instead of just being in here, or having emc runing and spinning a stupid stepper motor
[03:39:32] <jmkasunich> eric_U: regarding metal suppliers
[03:39:37] <jmkasunich> I've used metal express a lot
[03:39:52] <jmkasunich> haven't ordered online, since they have a local office - I call them instead
[03:40:13] <gezar> the deckel design is very wide open, for small cnc designs
[03:40:14] <jmkasunich> but I have had very good service from them, and recommend them
[03:41:29] <eric_U> john, thanks, my "local" steel supplier is over a mountain an hour away
[03:41:36] <jmkasunich> where are you?
[03:41:44] <eric_U> state college PA
[03:42:08] <gezar> eric_U: what ive wanted to build the X axis is a mounting table like the deckels, with these atatchemnts, fixed table top for milling, rotary axis for 4th axis, and then some gear cutting drives, and then to top it off, a vertical lathe like spindle
[03:42:30] <jmkasunich> looks like the closest metal express to you is either cleveland or baltimore
[03:42:37] <jmkasunich> but they ship anywhere
[03:42:56] <eric_U> I've mail-ordered metal before, worked out pretty well
[03:42:59] <jmkasunich> no minimum order, cut any size you want, and have online pricing
[03:43:21] <gezar> jmkasunich : wouldnt it be nice to have accually contribute to emc after all the hours ive spent yacking in her over the years?
[03:43:36] <eric_U> not required :)
[03:43:42] <jmkasunich> right
[03:43:58] <eric_U> you can always test on the simulator
[03:44:23] <gezar> yeah, never liked that idea much, i get too picky about things
[03:44:44] <eric_U> less risky
[03:44:45] <gezar> I think im going ot get a very small surface grinder this week though :)
[03:45:35] <gezar> eric_U: Im about to start going back to college after 17 years of being away, I love cutting metals, its what im good at, I just want to learn how to do other things now
[03:46:02] <eric_U> what are you going to study?
[03:46:26] <gezar> computer science, and either stick with that, and or go to another school and pick up EE or ME
[03:46:31] <Unit41> studies are for the determined no gezar is just going to relax
[03:47:21] <gezar> im not going to be playing around, I plan on banging it out
[03:47:24] <eric_U> don't do it
[03:47:32] <gezar> dont do it?
[03:47:45] <Unit41> gezar ?
[03:47:55] <gezar> heh, you guys have lost me
[03:49:14] <gezar> but yes, im registered and ready to go, got my classes and everything
[03:49:29] <eric_U> where are you going?
[03:49:46] <gezar> University of Central Arkansas
[03:50:13] <eric_U> independently wealthy?
[03:50:48] <gezar> no, what little bit of money i have left is a last ditch effort to put me through school so I can maybe make more money then what i do now
[03:51:18] <eric_U> are you going to be working?
[03:51:18] <Unit41> you need to get automated
[03:51:29] <gezar> that and I feel bad all the time for not having finished in the first place
[03:51:42] <gezar> yeah Ill be doing contract work for a new/used machine dealer
[03:51:51] <eric_U> I can understand that, it's partly why I got my Ph.D.
[03:52:08] <gezar> phd in?
[03:52:15] <eric_U> ME
[03:52:40] <gezar> I started off wanting to be a ChemE but I wasnt ready for college life at that age
[03:52:47] <eric_U> Lowes sells a welder for $12,756.25
[03:52:53] <Unit41> math would be nice to have right about now
[03:52:56] <eric_U> I had the same problem
[03:52:58] <Unit41> im weak
[03:53:16] <eric_U> I dropped out for a year and a half and made bicycles
[03:53:38] <eric_U> just long enough to get me into Reagan's recession right when I graduated
[03:54:03] <gezar> in a short bit ive got chapter 3 of algebra to read, Ive got a ton ofcatching up to do, starting with 5hours of calc this term
[03:54:22] <eric_U> math goes away quick
[03:54:51] <gezar> na, ive done enough with machinining to get me by but yeah, there is a ton of stuff to cram back into my head
[03:55:13] <gezar> and with that, im out of here yall
[03:55:19] <gezar> take care
[03:55:21] <eric_U> good luck
[03:56:21] <eric_U> my brother teaches computer science at a second tier college
[03:56:39] <eric_U> he says that his honors students are like the regular students at the schools he went to
[03:56:47] <eric_U> "they do their homework"
[03:58:27] <eric_U> presumably as opposed to "they couldn't get a hello world example from a text to compile"
[04:00:28] <Unit41> it was the same gig for me too
[04:00:50] <eric_U> you made bicycles?
[04:01:00] <Unit41> c++ was a bitch to learn from vb the nightmare was mostly the OS.... winblows
[04:01:18] <Unit41> windblows*
[04:01:33] <eric_U> you forgot the trademark symbol
[04:01:46] <Unit41> windblows XP ?
[04:02:07] <Unit41> the XP is for experiance.
[04:02:16] <eric_U> experimental
[04:02:53] <Unit41> and bill never knew what he had when he decided to scrap windows 2k
[04:02:55] <eric_U> too bad I don't have a MIG
[04:03:14] <Unit41> im tring to get an AC tig
[04:03:15] <eric_U> I think XP is a little better than 2k
[04:03:41] <Unit41> not by much
[04:03:52] <Unit41> a dibble of cosmetic and security
[04:03:56] <eric_U> correct
[04:04:15] <eric_U> I thought Vista was going to be MSFT's downfall, but I was wrong
[04:04:32] <Unit41> linux aint far behind
[04:05:15] <Unit41> 8 more years and it'll be a tie for usability
[04:06:05] <eric_U> linux is pretty nice nowadays
[04:06:12] <eric_U> since the introduction of the update managers
[04:06:34] <Unit41> its dam hard to keep track of whats running though without a custom wm
[04:06:43] <eric_U> when you had to build packages for yourself, that was a chore
[04:07:20] <eric_U> I made the mistake of upgrading from fedora 5 to fedora 7 instead of reinstalling
[04:07:39] <eric_U> I have two sound systems running
[04:07:49] <eric_U> echo ... echo .... echo....
[04:08:05] <Unit41> wana have a mix off ?
[04:08:16] <Unit41> im rigged here too
[04:08:43] <eric_U> I mean on my linux system, not the good kinda sound system
[04:09:45] <Unit41> CCRMA sounds worth switching for
[04:09:55] <eric_U> I tried that once
[04:09:57] <Unit41> i'de dump suse for fedora
[04:10:09] <eric_U> it would be nice to have a dedicated music computer
[04:11:11] <Unit41> my brain is jelly, I just spent a day hacking on a scenegraph for a game engine
[04:11:46] <Unit41> its the guts of a game engine
[04:12:32] <Unit41> im not even 10% there yet
[04:12:48] <eric_U> I need to move my milling machine, which is no fun at all
[04:13:02] <jmkasunich> how far?
[04:13:08] <jmkasunich> and are there any stairs involved?
[04:13:09] <eric_U> about 15 feet
[04:13:17] <eric_U> flat ground
[04:13:24] <eric_U> still no fun
[04:13:27] <jmkasunich> ground as in dirt? or concrete?
[04:13:31] <eric_U> concrete
[04:13:35] <Unit41> lol
[04:13:45] <eric_U> still no fun :)
[04:13:52] <Unit41> I bought 3 50 lb bags on someone's word that it works good
[04:14:09] <Unit41> cost 50 bux
[04:14:29] <Unit41> I need to make a plasma cutter with it
[04:14:34] <eric_U> for 150lb of concrete?
[04:14:42] <Unit41> ya
[04:14:50] <eric_U> sounds a little expensive
[04:14:59] <Unit41> the bags were fucking heavy
[04:15:24] <eric_U> how much does that 50lb bag weigh exactly?
[04:15:26] <Unit41> haha just before work I had to take them out wile it was freezing cold
[04:15:31] <jmkasunich> 50 pounds isn't that heavy
[04:15:50] <jmkasunich> not something I'd want to carry all over the place, but not that bad
[04:16:13] <eric_U> I'd hate to have to carry those things around all day like some people do
[04:16:20] <jmkasunich> thats for sure
[04:16:40] <jmkasunich> although if we carried them around all day we'de be in better shape and it wouldn't seem so hard
[04:16:51] <Unit41> maybe it was more cause I dam near pulled my back lifting it
[04:16:57] <eric_U> and we'd be physical wrecks by the time we were 50
[04:16:59] <Unit41> from knee height
[04:18:00] <eric_U> my fingernail finally gave up the fight, it's falling off
[04:18:14] <Unit41> ahhhh
[04:18:30] <Unit41> lol what kind of monstrosity ?
[04:18:40] <Unit41> why the hell is it so heavy
[04:19:02] <jmkasunich> why is what so heavy?
[04:19:13] <Unit41> his rock
[04:20:02] <jmkasunich> Unit41 <-- not making sense
[04:20:10] <Unit41> im stoned again
[04:20:12] <eric_U> happens to the best of us
[04:20:13] <Unit41> sorry
[04:22:20] <Unit41> why am I so dam lazy that I wont admit defeat and start cutting angle iron slides out of steel
[04:22:42] <Unit41> the aluminum ones wont work unless i can get a tig
[04:25:22] <jmkasunich> why do you want to weld on them?
[04:25:42] <jmkasunich> usually thats not a good idea - it makes things warp and bend and leaves residual stresses
[04:25:55] <Unit41> but I have thick steel here
[04:26:13] <Unit41> kinda saving it for the rails but...
[04:28:57] <Unit41> there's allways more at crappy tire
[04:29:10] <Unit41> Canadian tire
[04:29:41] <jmkasunich> what kind of steel do you get there?
[04:30:12] <Unit41> angle iron and angle aluminum... but work gives me tons of free aluminum
[04:30:49] <Unit41> I have thick alu flatstock 6' long
[04:31:16] <jmkasunich> nice
[04:31:40] <Unit41> and aluminum H beam
[04:31:40] <jmkasunich> free metal is a good thing
[04:33:54] <Unit41> no its a curse
[04:34:12] <Unit41> a huge sink of time
[04:34:26] <jmkasunich> send it to me
[04:34:43] <cradek> me me me
[04:36:11] <eric_U> we got a new machinist at work and my supply of scrap material pretty much dried up
[04:36:43] <eric_U> I've been kissing his ass for 3 years, still no metal
[04:37:07] <Unit41> brb
[04:44:14] <cradek> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?action=browse&diff=1&id=Videos
[04:44:21] <cradek> a couple neat new videos
[04:52:16] <eric_U> koppi's toy makes some really neat sounds
[04:52:53] <eric_U> he needs a z axis though
[04:58:32] <fenn> thats definitely the weirdest cnc video i've ever seen
[04:58:40] <cradek> yeah
[05:00:59] <eric_U> I forgot it was time lapse, that would change the sounds a little
[05:02:29] <eric_U> anyone ever tried inkscape? looks interesting
[05:02:52] <toastydeath> i tried it once
[05:03:01] <eric_U> you did not
[05:03:03] <toastydeath> if i had anything to do with art it would have been cool
[05:03:08] <fenn> inkscape is neat
[05:03:27] <fenn> i'm an inkscape journeyman
[05:03:33] <eric_U> I'm an engineer, not an artist
[05:03:53] <fenn> i'm a.. comprehensive generalist
[05:04:12] <fenn> anyway, it's not a cad program
[05:05:37] <fenn> eric_U: http://fennetic.net/sketches/emc-splash/fanuc-illust.png
[05:06:10] <eric_U> now that's art :)
[05:06:20] <fenn> http://fennetic.net/sketches/emc-splash/hextatic.png
[05:06:44] <fenn> it's much easier to do 2d stuff of course
[05:07:07] <eric_U> makes me remember what a crime it is that Solidworks can't render worth a darn
[05:08:29] <eric_U> http://www.hektor.ch/Work/In+a+Beautiful+Place/Article.jpg/
[05:09:00] <eric_U> wonder how they get the spray paint to turn on?
[05:09:20] <jmkasunich> solenoid probably
[05:10:02] <eric_U> almost looks like a hobby servo
[05:12:35] <eric_U> with one of those bipods, and this program: http://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~alanb/ps2gc.html I can publish my next paper on the wall in the hallway
[05:15:56] <fenn> does that trace the outline or do some sort of fill?
[05:16:38] <fenn> ah just outlines :(
[05:16:47] <eric_U> looks like it's probably a straight translation of the ps commands
[05:17:28] <eric_U> I like the way inkscape works
[05:17:36] <eric_U> no more open office draw for me :)
[05:17:48] <fenn> i never used oo.. didnt see the point
[05:18:16] <eric_U> works with powerpoint
[05:18:28] <eric_U> i mean impression
[05:18:54] <fenn> whatever that is
[05:19:13] <eric_U> the presentation software in open office
[05:19:51] <fenn> powerpoint killed the space shuttle
[05:20:29] <eric_U> no it didn't
[05:20:34] <fenn> did too
[05:20:55] <eric_U> we used to lie just as effectively with Harvard blahdyblah
[05:21:06] <eric_U> presentation software that I forget the name of
[05:21:23] <fenn> well, its the presentation software, by whatever name
[05:21:35] <fenn> no good for engineering
[05:21:45] <eric_U> people were lying very effectively with overhead slides
[05:21:46] <Unit41> well there you have it... visual studio for the first time on any of my computers
[05:22:10] <Unit41> big waste of time and resources
[05:22:16] <eric_U> too bad none of the linux developers ever used visual studio
[05:23:06] <Unit41> im glad I say
[05:23:11] <Unit41> anjuta rocks
[05:23:21] <eric_U> never heard of anjuta
[05:23:45] <eric_U> fenn: how you make lighting effects with inkscape?
[05:24:25] <fenn> gaussian blur or linear gradients
[05:24:27] <eric_U> fractalize is a cool effect, don't know what good it is though
[05:24:41] <fenn> i like 'pattern on path'
[05:25:01] <eric_U> gradient tool is nice
[05:26:07] <fenn> the penguins were distorted with pattern on path: http://fennetic.net/pub/irc/emc-chips.png
[05:26:28] <eric_U> how you do that?
[05:26:42] <fenn> one of the python scripts.. its a little buggy but it works
[05:27:08] <fenn> click on your penguin, then on the path, then extensions->mumble->pattern on path
[05:27:26] <fenn> shift click
[05:28:04] <fenn> eventually it will be part of the UI with live updates
[05:31:10] <eric_U> Is that possibly the same thing as "object to path"?
[05:38:02] <fenn> eric_U: first make sure your pattern is all paths with object to path
[05:38:12] <fenn> then group it together
[05:38:21] <fenn> then draw the path you want it to follow
[05:38:56] <fenn> now shift click on first the pattern and then the path, and do effects->generate from path->pattern along path
[05:42:01] <eric_U> I just wanna know how they made that sphere they use at the bottom of every page in the manual
[05:43:00] <eric_U> probably just a radial gradient
[05:43:21] <fenn> no, the drop shadow is blurred, dunno about the other parts
[05:43:35] <eric_U> I mean the shiny part on top
[05:43:47] <eric_U> the shadow effects was gaussian blur
[05:46:33] <eric_U> maybe the gradient was gaussian blur too
[05:47:21] <fenn> dammit i cant find anything now
[05:49:44] <fenn> there's a page with all of the feature demonstrations, and here's one of them http://www.inkscape.org/screenshots/gallery/inkscape-0.45-3D-rope.png
[05:50:37] <eric_U> that makes a lot of sense
[05:50:57] <fenn> ok found it - duh: http://www.inkscape.org/screenshots/
[05:51:10] <fenn> and look at the ones for older versions too
[05:55:25] <eric_U> have you ever used it on windows?
[05:56:41] <fenn> no
[05:56:44] <fenn> wait, yes
[05:56:51] <fenn> it was much the same
[05:57:18] <eric_U> that's good, I'm going to install it on my daughter's computer, I think she'll like it
[05:58:31] <eric_U> fenn: thanks for your help
[06:25:40] <Unit41> haha you have to eat food to live
[06:25:55] <fenn> not if you're a breatharian
[06:26:52] <Unit41> why
[06:52:27] <Unit41> 5 dollar box of chocolate at dickies
[06:52:35] <Unit41> 2 layers
[07:03:11] <Jymmm> LawrenceG: you got your breakout board finished and tested yet?
[07:10:16] <fenn> eric_U: i was wrong, they used gradients: http://tavmjong.free.fr/INKSCAPE/MANUAL/html/Spheres-Gradient.html
[07:35:56] <fenn> howdy RifRaf
[07:36:53] <fenn> this guy sure knows how to crank out some casting molds: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dlQ54WATvzA
[07:38:12] <RifRaf> g'day fenn, all the best to you etc.
[07:39:44] <RifRaf> am tryin to get your programmer workin
[07:39:45] <fenn> linux box?
[07:41:03] <RifRaf> nah on windows now, just hooking up some adapter wires to convert to the 6pin header i use, driver is installed but avrstudio is not seeing it yet
[07:45:36] <fenn> does avrstudio use avrdude to flash the chip?
[07:47:02] <fenn> i dont think it works with avrstudio
[07:50:36] <RifRaf> there appears to be a little hack to make it work, muckin about with it a bit but need to find a project to flash now
[10:10:17] <fogl2> hello
[10:13:02] <fogl2> Can you tell me, what real time linux is emc based on? I saw RTAI and RTLinux links at linuxcnc.org - is this the same real time linux or are there more distributions?
[10:16:25] <fenn> rtai
[10:17:05] <fenn> it may work with rtlinux but afaik nobody is using it
[11:03:08] <alex_joni> RifRaf: I always flash using ponyprog
[11:05:14] <gezar> hmm, morning ya'll
[11:15:57] <kloeri> [Global Notice] Hi all, we're celebrating New Years in #freenode-newyears. Happy New Years from freenode staff and thank you for using freenode.
[11:16:42] <gezar> I have 2 service calls to try and bang out today
[11:17:24] <gezar> first one is a machine randomly shutting down... the other I have no idea what its about
[12:03:54] <gezar> sweet, im accually liking the new beta fl studio
[12:04:29] <gezar> I had some issues with tracks that I had done in stable, that wern't being imported properly but this is nice now
[12:04:56] <gezar> the orchestra stuff is much smoother sounding
[12:10:54] <gezar> shucks, its almost time to hit the road
[12:21:31] <gezar> see you all much later this evening
[12:52:03] <SWPadnos_> SWPadnos_ is now known as SWPadnos
[14:13:33] <maddash> what's the difference between homing_state_t and home_sequence_t?
[14:13:42] <maddash> functionally, I mean
[14:15:07] <maddash> home_sequence_state_t*, not home_sequence_t
[14:15:53] <jepler> maddash: one controls the sequence of actions for homing a single joint (homing_state_t). The other controls the sequential or parallel homing of several joints.
[14:16:55] <maddash> jepler: thanks
[14:32:47] <BigJohnT> When homing can you go to home position at any other speed than max_vel?
[14:33:39] <jepler> BigJohnT: no, I don't think that's possible. Can you tell me why you want to go at a lower speed?
[14:33:55] <BigJohnT> my max vel is 450 IPM
[14:34:28] <BigJohnT> normally I won't go that fast
[14:34:48] <BigJohnT> and it would be smoother on the equipment at a lower vel
[14:36:02] <jepler> what about G0 moves -- those will go at 450IPM as well, if you set your inifile velocity to that value
[14:36:56] <BigJohnT> yep the do but it seems to jerk when coming off the home switch
[14:37:24] <BigJohnT> maybe it's just my eyes
[14:38:00] <skunkworks259> I thought there was a homing velocity..
[14:38:06] <maddash> BigJohnT: no
[14:38:13] <jepler> skunkworks259: that's only for the initial moves, which find the switch position
[14:38:25] <jepler> skunkworks259: the final move, from the home switch to the home position, is done at the machine's max speed
[14:38:35] <skunkworks259> ah - that makes sense..
[14:38:47] <maddash> BigJohnT: max_vel is a stepgen param, and stepgen is motion component closest to the hardware
[14:39:06] <skunkworks259> on the machines I have played with - home was the switch position.
[14:39:49] <BigJohnT> I just thought you might be able to set the velocity for move to home as you can set the other two velocities
[14:40:01] <BigJohnT> for a smoother home with fast machines
[14:40:15] <maddash> BigJohnT: that would be search_vel and latch_vel
[14:40:33] <BigJohnT> yes
[14:40:49] <BigJohnT> if there was a home_vel it would be nice
[14:41:19] <maddash> what do you mean by, "home_vel"?
[14:41:37] <maddash> or, "move to home"?
[14:41:57] <maddash> the initial motion towards the home switch?
[14:42:20] <skunkworks259> but as jepler said - if your machine can do g0 moves at 450ipm - what is the difference if your final home move is at that speed
[14:42:21] <BigJohnT> no that's search_vel I mean after latch and the final move to home
[14:42:57] <maddash> BigJohnT: I think that's the g0 speed
[14:43:00] <BigJohnT> reversing directions at 450IPM is hard on the machine so I try to avoid it
[14:43:19] <maddash> then decrease your max_accel?
[14:43:45] <BigJohnT> yes I know I can do that
[14:49:54] <toastydeath> why wouldn't you do that
[14:50:55] <BigJohnT> It would slow down all my direction changes
[14:51:46] <cradek> if you have to avoid some combinations of moves in gcode because the motion is hard on the machine, the machine is surely just misconfigured
[14:51:48] <maddash> where's that music-playing g-code file?
[14:51:59] <cradek> maddash: in cvs I think
[14:52:09] <maddash> cradek: do you remember the name?
[14:52:28] <maddash> nvm, daisy.ngc
[14:52:30] <maddash> haha
[14:52:59] <maddash> this file wouldn't damage my cnc, would it?
[14:53:10] <jepler> it's just a gcode part program
[14:53:12] <cradek> see what I just said above
[14:56:13] <maddash> noooooooooooooooo!
[15:08:05] <BigJohnT> cradek: why do you say my machine is misconfigured
[15:08:33] <cradek> you have to avoid certain moves because they harm the machine
[15:09:01] <cradek> besides, a direction reversal has the same acceleration as any start or stop, only it takes twice as long
[15:10:27] <cradek> emc moves the machine within the velocity and acceleration constraints you set. if you think certain motions are harmful, you have set them wrong
[15:10:36] <BigJohnT> and if it is possible to set the search_vel and the latch_vel shouldn't it be possible to set the home_vel
[15:11:19] <cradek> I don't see why you would want it different from any other rapid. at that point the machine is fully homed and operating normally
[15:12:48] <BigJohnT> ok nevermind
[15:13:48] <cradek> maybe there is another reason, please keep convincing me/us if so
[15:17:36] <maddash_> [sigh]
[15:18:41] <maddash_> have any of you ever tried building the multi-touch screen?
[15:19:08] <BigJohnT> cradek: why go wide open when you don't need to
[15:19:50] <skunkworks259> why go wide open at all then?
[15:20:09] <skunkworks259> :)
[15:21:05] <BigJohnT> why not just go wide open when you "need/want to"
[15:21:56] <maddash_> is 'wide open' a sexual innuendo?
[15:22:37] <BigJohnT> I can see this is pointless
[15:24:40] <maddash_> sexual intercourse is NOT pointless
[15:25:02] <maddash_> * maddash_ has gone mad
[15:29:24] <jmkasunich> BigJohnT: when I wrote the homing stuff, I was trying to avoid adding 100 items to the ini file
[15:29:50] <jmkasunich> I figured if your machine can do G0 anytime, it ought to be able to do G0 after homing
[15:30:05] <jmkasunich> and you'd probably like to start making parts, so why diddle around
[15:33:05] <BigJohnT> jmkasunich: I understand and my machine can do G0 anytime, If it was possible I just wanted to slow down the homing. It's not so I'll live with it. Thanks
[15:33:40] <jmkasunich> anything is possible - but I'm reluctant to add another item to the ini file that would affect everyone else
[15:34:49] <maddash_> jmkasunich: it doesn't have to be set explicitly
[15:34:52] <BigJohnT> If you left home_vel out of the ini it goes G0?
[15:35:00] <maddash_> jmkasunich: the new item, I mean
[15:35:11] <maddash_> BigJohnT: no,it doesn't home at all
[15:35:39] <jmkasunich> there are two home vels now - HOME_SEARCH_VEL, and HOME_LATCH_VEL
[15:35:39] <BigJohnT> maddash: there is no home_vel at this time...
[15:35:46] <maddash_> maddash_ is now known as maddash
[15:35:55] <jmkasunich> the first one tells it how fast to go when looking for the switch
[15:36:16] <jmkasunich> the second tells it how fast to go once it knows roughly where the switch is, to get the final precise position
[15:36:17] <maddash> actually, you can be more specific than that
[15:36:43] <jmkasunich> it sounds like you are requesting HOME_FINAL_VEL, to set how fast it goes to the final home position after finding the switch and setting the position
[15:36:49] <maddash> the first one is the velocity when going TOWARDS the switch, and the second is velocity when going AWAY from the switch
[15:36:52] <BigJohnT> yes
[15:36:59] <jmkasunich> maddash: you oversimplify
[15:37:09] <maddash> jmkasunich: what did I miss?
[15:37:24] <jmkasunich> just a sec
[15:37:39] <maddash> jmkasunich: btw, I'd be happy to write the code for HOME_FINAL_VEL
[15:37:44] <jmkasunich> http://www.linuxcnc.org/docview/html//config_ini_homing.html
[15:37:56] <jmkasunich> maddash: its not a question of writing the code - I'm willing to do that
[15:38:13] <maddash> jmkasunich: and if HOME_FINAL_VEL Isn't explicitly stated in the ini, then give it a default value (like HOME_SEQUENCE)
[15:38:14] <jmkasunich> its a question of adding another parameter to the ini file, and updating docs, and educating users, etc
[15:39:05] <BigJohnT> jmkasunich: could HOME_FINAL_VEL just default to G0 if it is not set
[15:39:22] <jmkasunich> BigJohnT: if we chose to do it, it MUST default to G0
[15:39:43] <maddash> er, sans caps
[15:39:46] <jmkasunich> there is no way I would inflict a new param on every user unless the default was to do what it did before
[15:39:55] <maddash> jmkasunich: of course
[15:40:00] <BigJohnT> that only makes sense
[15:40:17] <maddash> can code it in now? can I? can I?
[15:40:25] <jmkasunich> maddash: no
[15:40:30] <BigJohnT> I'll update the docs
[15:41:37] <maddash> :(
[15:42:32] <jtr> Wasn't there a "feed override" that also affected G0 speeds? Could a user set that set to a low value before homing in HAL?
[15:43:06] <cradek> I think feed override is ignored during homing, because it could potentially change the resulting home position or cause an overrun of the switch
[15:43:08] <BigJohnT> jtr: tried that and it doesn't change the home speed
[15:43:36] <jmkasunich> BigJohnT: I guess the main issue here is "why do you want it"
[15:43:38] <BigJohnT> that is the speed after final position when moving to the home position
[15:43:50] <jmkasunich> any change should have some demonstratable advantage
[15:44:00] <maddash> jtr: FO does nothing to homing
[15:44:40] <BigJohnT> jmkasunich: so when I do a homing it is done at a speed of my choice
[15:44:58] <maddash> BigJohnT: you answered the question with the question
[15:45:10] <maddash> "why?"
[15:45:41] <jmkasunich> the homing itself _IS_ done at a speed (actually two speeds) of your choice
[15:45:55] <BigJohnT> hmmm, because I want to go to the home position at a slower rate for better accuracy
[15:45:58] <jmkasunich> after the home switch detection is complete, it rapids to the final position
[15:47:05] <jmkasunich> G0 X0 and G1F100X0 and G1F1X0 all go to the same spot, and unless your machine has lots of slop, they all have the same accuracy
[15:47:24] <maddash> BigJohnT: if final_vel = g0 and g0 causes step loss, then cradek is right about your machine config
[15:47:56] <BigJohnT> ok, I was just trying to come up with a valid reason besides I want it to go slower
[15:48:13] <jmkasunich> lol - at least you're honest about it
[15:48:23] <BigJohnT> I try to be
[15:49:44] <BigJohnT> I guess we have spend enough time hashing this out, thanks
[15:49:51] <maddash> this is amusing
[15:50:38] <BigJohnT> glad I could make you smile today
[15:50:55] <jmkasunich> the basic rule is "add complexity only when you have a valid reason", because every line of code is a potential bug
[15:51:26] <jmkasunich> and every ini file parameter is a potential confused user, or inaccurate documentation paragraph
[15:52:04] <jmkasunich> I hope I'm not coming across as stubborn
[15:52:38] <BigJohnT> LOL, well kinda
[15:52:49] <BigJohnT> but I understand your reasons
[15:52:55] <Unit41> hahaha
[15:53:19] <Unit41> miserable old cunts on irc are too few and many
[15:54:11] <maddash> yes, and the sun is too bright and dark
[15:54:24] <Unit41> you said it
[15:54:43] <maddash> only in parody of what you've declarred
[15:55:13] <Unit41> I speak only in contradictions though while I dont
[15:55:30] <Unit41> thus is life
[15:56:19] <maddash> alex_joni: any new vids of that bot arm yet?
[16:36:02] <maddash> maddash is now known as _
[16:39:20] <barum> Hello and happy new year
[16:40:30] <_> not happy -- I thought yesterday was new year's eve and pushed my schedule one day ahead
[16:42:16] <barum> for me 7 hours till 2008
[16:43:09] <skunkworks259> 13 here
[16:43:20] <barum> :)
[16:43:50] <_> 12.25 here
[16:44:00] <_> YES!!!!!!!! a leap year!!!!!!!
[16:48:01] <toastydeath> lol underscore
[16:48:12] <barum> Im beginer and tryin to connect my drivers to parallel port
[16:49:04] <barum> so I come to this chanel to ask for shematics where to find for
[16:49:38] <barum> existing configuration on Ubuntu+emc
[16:51:16] <_> roar! fear me, for I am lowly!
[16:51:39] <barum> Or just which LPT pin is for what
[16:54:27] <barum> I think that can be sawed in some config file but dont know which one. Is that HAL for is?
[16:55:41] <jepler> barum: that is configured in HAL. The "standard" pinout has X direction on pin 2, X step on pin 3, and so on for Y and Z on pins 4 through 7.
[16:55:53] <jepler> barum: that is the file standard_pinout.hal
[16:56:02] <jepler> you can edit that file with a text editor to change to whatever pinout you need
[16:56:18] <jepler> barum: or you can change your .ini to use xylotex_pinout.hal, which swaps step and direction pins compared to standard_pinout.hal
[16:56:43] <barum> That`s what I needed. Thanks.
[16:56:55] <_> _ is now known as s6x
[17:00:49] <barum> And my CNC is crapp and somtimes looses steps. So I build one quadrature encoder and 12bit counter
[17:01:51] <barum> and want to build two more like that and to use it somehow with emc
[17:02:16] <barum> to provide feedback
[17:02:26] <barum> closed loop
[17:05:04] <jepler> barum: if you have a "feedback position" in HAL, you can connect it to e.g., axis.0.motor-pos-fb. then you will get a following error if the motor stalls.
[17:05:12] <barum> can I upload stream with this data using serial port (PIC microcontrolers UART)
[17:05:51] <jepler> barum: yes but you will have to write the HAL realtime driver to do it.
[17:07:42] <barum> does more standard way (already implemented) exist?
[17:08:45] <jepler> no. there are drivers for some specific cards with quadrature counting hardware included with emc -- some for the parport, some for ISA, some for PCI -- but there is not a generic solution for reading hardware quadrature counters.
[17:09:33] <jepler> if you have enough parport pins and a slow enough quadrature signal you can read it directly in emc by using the component called 'encoder' (but there aren't enough pins on the standard parport in output mode to read 3 quadrature signals)
[17:10:17] <cradek> plenty in input mode though
[17:11:16] <jepler> there aren't presently any realtime drivers for serial devices, either. A driver for old fashioned PC serial ports (16450, 16550 chips) to talk to specific external hardware would not be hard, while a driver for "USB serial" ports would be very very hard.
[17:18:06] <barum> Thanks
[17:31:10] <ottos> happy new year to all... hope every one got a 5-axis HSM centre.. for x-mass .. :D
[17:33:39] <skunkworks259> sounds good. :)
[17:35:22] <klick0> hahah
[18:11:57] <maddash> what does loadrt timedelta do?
[18:25:29] <jmkasunich> loads the timedelta hal component
[18:26:00] <maddash> is there a component that takes an input value and outputs the same value but only after a certain delay?
[18:26:11] <jmkasunich> not yet
[18:26:22] <jmkasunich> you mean something like a fifo?
[18:26:33] <maddash> no, a hal component
[18:26:36] <jmkasunich> output(now) = input(n samples ago)
[18:26:49] <jmkasunich> a hal component that is a fifo
[18:26:51] <maddash> somewhat...
[18:27:11] <maddash> kind of a like a delayed latch
[18:27:17] <maddash> if that make sense
[18:27:23] <jmkasunich> it doesn't
[18:27:36] <jmkasunich> all realtime hal components produce an output every time they run
[18:28:05] <jmkasunich> that output could be the value that was on their input a while ago
[18:28:09] <jmkasunich> but that makes it a fifo
[18:28:30] <maddash> so there's a hal fifo?
[18:28:36] <jmkasunich> no
[18:28:51] <jmkasunich> but you could make a fifo hal component if you want
[18:29:28] <maddash> okay, just wanted to know all my options before hacking into the source
[18:29:37] <jmkasunich> are you trying to process "analog" values (floats or ints), or just a boolean?
[18:29:44] <maddash> boolean
[18:29:50] <jmkasunich> because I think there is a delay block for booleans
[18:30:12] <maddash> "loadrt blocks"?
[18:30:21] <jmkasunich> no, blocks is deprecated
[18:30:34] <jmkasunich> everything in blocks (and more) is now available as distinct modules
[18:30:40] <jmkasunich> most with their own man pages
[18:30:57] <maddash> yes, I'm going through every entry in docs/man/man9/
[18:34:08] <tomp> the comp is called timedelay but i dunno how to man it
[18:34:27] <tomp> look at the src
[18:34:33] <jmkasunich> it doesn't seem to have a manpage
[18:34:47] <jmkasunich> components built with comp have man pages automatically
[18:35:02] <jmkasunich> ones built manually don't, unless the builder went to the trouble of making one
[18:35:08] <tomp> ah
[18:35:25] <tomp> walmart linux mobo has nvidia onboard. i plugged in matrox pci but see no bios way to disable nvidia. what does live cd's "boot to safe video mode" do?
[18:35:57] <jmkasunich> maddash:
[18:35:58] <jmkasunich> * Description: timedelay.c
[18:35:58] <jmkasunich> * Time delay relay for HAL
[18:35:58] <jmkasunich> *
[18:35:58] <jmkasunich> * See the "Users Manual" at emc2/docs/Hal_Introduction.pdf
[18:36:00] <jmkasunich> *
[18:36:04] <jmkasunich> * This component is the equivalent of a time delay relay. There are
[18:36:06] <jmkasunich> * separate parameters for "on delay" and "off delay". The delays
[18:36:08] <jmkasunich> * are specified in milliseconds.
[18:36:10] <jmkasunich> *
[18:36:26] <jmkasunich> src/hal/components/timedelay.c - there is a nice long block of comments describing the component, I only pasted the first few lines
[18:36:45] <JymmmEMC> lol, spam subject --> Turn your trouser mouse into a one-eyed giant bird
[18:37:20] <tomp> can we filter lol from this node?
[18:37:28] <jmkasunich> heh
[18:37:48] <jmkasunich> a lol kickbot?
[18:38:33] <JymmmEMC> tomp: if we did, you would have just been kicked.
[18:38:50] <jmkasunich> it would be a smart one - only kicking people who use it a lot
[18:39:17] <maddash> grepping hal user manual.pdf for timedelay gives nothing!
[18:39:21] <tomp> well,, happy new year to all & a years thanks to the devs of emc2, it's quite a chunk of chocolate :)
[18:39:48] <jmkasunich> maddash: I guess that means somebody could help the project by writing something about that module
[18:39:59] <jmkasunich> did you see the description in the source file?
[18:40:18] <maddash> yes, but it wasn't very clear
[18:40:31] <maddash> "* There are two pins, an input bit and an output bit. The output is
[18:40:31] <maddash> * changed only if the input remains at the same state for the duration
[18:40:31] <maddash> * specified in the corresponding delay parameter."
[18:40:46] <jmkasunich> what do you want to know?
[18:41:07] <jmkasunich> loadrt it, and then show
[18:41:13] <maddash> whether you're having a happy new year
[18:41:20] <jmkasunich> you'll see two pins and three params
[18:41:29] <jmkasunich> its not new years yet
[18:41:40] <maddash> it's ok, I'm going to write my own comp
[18:42:13] <jmkasunich> hmm, I see that SWPadnos didn't follow the naming conventions - he used _ instead if - for things like "off_delay"
[18:42:29] <maddash> but for posterity, here's what I was look for: two pins, named in and out. two params, named down-delay and up-delay.
[18:42:51] <jmkasunich> seems damned similar to timedelay.c
[18:43:01] <jmkasunich> are you just being ornery?
[18:43:08] <maddash> in and out are bits, so when in is raised from 0 to 1,
[18:43:29] <maddash> out also raises from 0 to 1, but only after up-delay time
[18:43:34] <jmkasunich> seems damned similar to timedelay.c
[18:44:15] <maddash> timedelay does the opposite of mine -- it raises "out" only after "in' is held up for a certain period
[18:44:29] <jmkasunich> assume delay is 1 second
[18:45:01] <maddash> aw hell, you're right.
[18:45:01] <jmkasunich> what if in is only on for half a second? do you want out to also be on for half a second, but one second later?
[18:46:06] <jmkasunich> if you want to propogate pulses shorter than the delay time, you need a fifo, otherwise you can just use timers (counters)
[18:46:14] <jmkasunich> timedelay uses timers
[18:46:54] <maddash> hm, this comp deserves a manpage
[18:49:04] <tomp> what does the option 'start in safe video mode' do on the live cd?
[18:49:24] <jmkasunich> sorry tomp, dunno
[18:49:38] <jmkasunich> probably something like 640x480, so its safe on any old monitor
[18:49:48] <tomp> ah
[18:49:50] <tomp> thx
[19:07:34] <maddash> what the hell
[19:08:00] <maddash> timedelay's off_delay and on_delay are specified in secs, not millisecs
[19:10:56] <maddash> wtf, SWPadnos?
[19:12:14] <jmkasunich> good catch, I'm correcting the comments
[19:12:27] <jmkasunich> we do tend to use seconds for everything, trying to be consistent
[19:12:33] <jepler> tomp: it may also choose the 'vesa' graphics driver instead of a video chip specific driver
[19:12:41] <jmkasunich> (we use nanoseconds when the times are gonna be short and we want to use integer values)
[19:13:33] <maddash> yeah, but the 'doc' stated millisecs
[19:13:38] <maddash> geez
[19:14:03] <jmkasunich> fixed and committed
[19:14:14] <tomp> jepler: thx, it does boot to 1024x768 but i didnt find any hdwr mgr to tell me which driver it was using. i.m trying to make sure the onboard nvidia is defeated and not eating mem
[19:15:55] <maddash> brb, my dad's leaving w/o me
[19:16:14] <jmkasunich> kids these days
[19:19:15] <tomp> the auto-cfg'd xorg.conf file sez it's using the matrox mga 2064W (Millenium) and doesnt mention to onboard nvidia.. hmmm glxgears is doggy slow and uneven
[19:19:26] <JymmmEMC> maddash take the hint ;)
[19:19:42] <cradek> tomp: don't trust glxgears, it does that
[19:20:03] <tomp> ohh, hope blooms eternal :-)
[19:20:13] <tomp> onto the wiki notes for testing
[19:21:07] <cradek> here's a pretty simple gl program: /usr/lib/xscreensaver/gltext
[19:21:17] <skunkworks259> I think I have only had glxgears run smooth with 1 video card.
[19:22:14] <tomp> sudo makedev /dev/wtf :-)
[19:23:42] <LawrenceG> JymmmEMC: yes, breakout board is built and running
[19:34:40] <gezar> howdy yall
[19:34:55] <gezar> fixed one saw, need a new plc for the other
[19:37:09] <cradek> dangit, the QC weldon adapters at enco doubled in price while I wasn't looking - I should have ordered a couple more
[19:39:38] <jmkasunich> wait for a sale I guess?
[19:54:20] <tomp> walmart linux pc : no unexpected realtime errs so far, with ogg video, (smooth sound, choppy vid) emc2 simaxis running supplied engraving file, gimp editing and OOword processor, no overruns, and "lat max" is 15584
[19:55:03] <skunkworks259> wamart is still selling a linux pc?
[19:55:16] <jepler> does it have a real parport?
[19:55:25] <tomp> yes, real parport
[19:55:37] <tomp> 199$, google "gOS"
[19:56:27] <tomp> 'still' selling I dunno, got mine just vefore 6 week stint on the road
[19:56:44] <tomp> before
[19:57:15] <tomp> i had to put in a matrox pci ( 2 pci slots ) so far
[19:57:51] <tomp> there are 2 slots, i used one of 'em, tossed the supplied modem card out
[19:58:04] <tomp> ran live cd
[19:58:11] <jmkasunich> this one?: http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.do?product_id=7754614
[19:59:47] <tomp> think so , checking number
[20:00:34] <tomp> yep, thats on the box
[20:00:57] <tomp> i voided all warranties, they got break-um stickers on the covers
[20:01:16] <jepler> tsk tsk
[20:02:34] <JymmmEMC> LawrenceG: any issues with it?
[20:02:42] <jmkasunich> what's a warranty?
[20:03:40] <tomp> running the gltext too
[20:03:58] <skunkworks259> what kind of lateny numbers are you getting?
[20:04:20] <tomp> 15584 max, no overruns
[20:04:27] <skunkworks259> not bad..
[20:04:51] <tomp> i thought it sucked but didnt blow ;)
[20:05:16] <JymmmEMC> less than 20000 isn't too shabby
[20:05:46] <tomp> i'll let it cook over the holiday, and tease it when i pass by
[20:06:12] <JymmmEMC> have you tried glxgears?
[20:06:29] <tomp> yeh, choppy, but no errs
[20:06:55] <skunkworks259> you isntalled ubuntu on it? dapper?
[20:07:45] <JymmmEMC> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GOS_(Linux_distribution)
[20:07:48] <tomp> live cd 2.2.1
[20:08:06] <tomp> emc2 live cd 2.2.1
[20:08:17] <skunkworks259> did you install or just running the live cd?
[20:08:57] <skunkworks259> I thought ray had used the via proccessor with no issues.. or was that someone else.
[20:09:21] <tomp> gltext smooth, glgears choppy, emc2 sim axis engraving smooth, nelson mandela .ogg example file smooth audio choppy vid, gimp smooth zoom ....
[20:09:58] <tomp> not installed, not real hdwr yet.
[20:10:12] <tomp> dont buy one on this advise ;)
[20:10:21] <skunkworks259> heh :)
[20:10:56] <skunkworks259> I remember it being a big deal (199 dollars for a computer from walmart) but it seemed like years ago.
[20:11:02] <tomp> the mombo sez it's only 35w
[20:11:27] <JymmmEMC> tomp: $35 2G http://newspaperads.mercurynews.com/ROP/ads.aspx?advid=32664&adid=5580252&subid=19308688&type=
[20:11:33] <JymmmEMC> err $40
[20:12:28] <JymmmEMC> make sure it can take 2GB in a single module first though.
[20:13:17] <jepler> 512MB RAM should not be any serious limitation for emc
[20:13:21] <tomp> ah, it comes with 0.5G, didnt think about expanding till i thought it was emc-able
[20:14:16] <gezar> i ran emc for years on an amd k6,2-350 mhz cpu with 128M of ram
[20:14:44] <jmkasunich> emc can still run on that, but a reasonably modern Linux distro with desktop and such can't
[20:14:52] <skunkworks259> eww.. k6-2 - you could boil your coffee even with the heat sink on it.
[20:14:53] <gezar> thats true
[20:14:59] <tomp> my store didnt have one, and none local, so i had it delivered for about 25$, was unopened box, but dunno where it came from
[20:15:14] <gezar> that thing ran great, still runs great, just not efficient anymore to run it
[20:15:36] <gezar> thats not bad at all
[20:15:42] <jepler> I recently threw out a k6-2 350MHz .. hadn't booted it for years, it was just taking up space
[20:16:00] <jepler> but it was a very nice mail / web server until I upgrade it
[20:16:00] <gezar> im about to toss out a ppro dual
[20:16:17] <skunkworks259> 200mhz?
[20:16:20] <gezar> 200mhz x 2 = still sucking
[20:16:28] <tomp> i got an olpc too, but it came & left to a nephew for christmas before i got to play with it :-(
[20:16:52] <gezar> skunkworks : it has been a joy to own :)
[20:17:09] <gezar> I may just pull the mobo out and frame it, and haing it on a wall in the house
[20:17:19] <tomp> tyan tiger dual ?
[20:17:32] <gezar> this is an old computer
[20:17:49] <tomp> tyan is pretty old
[20:17:52] <gezar> the mobo is a dell I think, I cant really remember
[20:18:10] <gezar> it had dell bios in it but I had to flash that to add the 2nd cpu
[20:18:13] <skunkworks259> heh - we had a compaq server with dual pro. Worked great.
[20:18:38] <gezar> I had 9 drives in the thing
[20:19:56] <gezar> so anyone else want to make fun of my 2x2x2 sugar cube cutting machine before I go sit down and draw it up so i can do the maching?
[20:20:57] <gezar> figure ill have a sweet mini table with micro slots in it, so it looks uber cool
[20:21:13] <gezar> then Ill just glue sugar cubes to it and go to town
[20:23:42] <skunkworks259> what do you glue sugar cubes down with? frosting?
[20:23:57] <gezar> that is a sweet idea
[20:24:05] <skunkworks259> <rimshot>
[20:24:30] <gezar> you see the photo of the mockup in plaster skunk?
[20:25:07] <tomp> ok, it finally blowed up, rebooted. dont expect walmart to run emc2 ( no overuns, no larger lat max than 15584, but eventually emc stopped responding, then blank screen and boot splash )
[20:25:30] <gezar> omg
[20:26:29] <skunkworks259> gezar: no
[20:26:52] <gezar> do you want to see it?
[20:26:57] <skunkworks259> yes
[20:27:36] <gezar> http://picasaweb.google.com/dagezar/RaidJunk/photo#5149968001570145474
[20:28:16] <gezar> thats just a mock up, for visual recognition for my brain
[20:28:29] <skunkworks259> wait - I did see that. (those are the leadscrews?)
[20:28:44] <gezar> yeah, I have to cut the ends off and machine them some
[20:28:52] <skunkworks259> cool.
[20:29:40] <skunkworks259> gezar: this is our current slow going project. http://www.electronicsam.com/images/KandT/DSCCurrent.JPG
[20:30:29] <gezar> oh wow
[20:31:00] <tomp> olpc's sugar booted on the walmart ok ( using redhat's sdk iso )
[20:32:46] <gezar> skunkworks259: do think I should have more of a ridgid support for the screws?
[20:33:16] <gezar> I wont be able to truly connect them to the steppers, sorta drill a small hole, then crimp them onto the motor shaft
[20:33:23] <tomp> gezar: did you look at the steppers with built in leadscrews? http://www.hsi-inc.com/canstack_linear_actuators.php
[20:34:00] <gezar> tomp : yeah I did, those are neat, but the im using are like 3/4 of an inch in diameter, maybe 1/4oz at best
[20:35:11] <gezar> they are fairly strong it seems too
[20:35:31] <gezar> i can shove the shaft under my finger nail, and they keep spinning
[20:35:46] <tomp> floppy steppers?
[20:35:59] <BigJohnT> good way to clean out your finger nails
[20:36:07] <gezar> accually out of cdrom drives, they are the rough positioner steppers for the optics
[20:36:19] <gezar> they have a spline shaft end
[20:36:26] <tomp> ah, didnt look familiar, great recycling
[20:37:03] <gezar> at 12v finger nail dirt wont stall them
[20:37:14] <BigJohnT> 5 1/4 floppy steppers would be larger if you have them
[20:37:58] <skunkworks259> what are you going to use for a spindle?
[20:37:59] <gezar> I dont know what ill do about home/limit switches yet, maybe make some reed type switches with wire and a dab of hot glue
[20:38:20] <jmkasunich> why would you bother with limits
[20:38:23] <gezar> ah, spindle motor is going to be one of the type that pull the print head around on a printer
[20:38:31] <jmkasunich> even home can be ignored, just use touch-off
[20:38:37] <BigJohnT> do you think you woill have enough torque to bother with limit switches
[20:38:43] <gezar> yeah, but I want a mini machine
[20:38:57] <gezar> heck no not enough torque, but its the cool factor
[20:38:59] <jmkasunich> ah, a big machine that is small
[20:39:37] <gezar> the motor is going to make it look like an old madison surface grinder
[20:40:07] <gezar> I dont even have a viable tooling option for it
[20:40:12] <skunkworks259> horizontal spindle?
[20:40:17] <jmkasunich> dremel tooling
[20:40:18] <gezar> no vertical
[20:40:21] <skunkworks259> ah
[20:40:51] <gezar> but its small enough that I can make it on my shaper and lathe(i have the y axis atatchment)
[20:41:22] <gezar> i dont have any woodruff cutters, so ill have to make pesdo dove tails using the shaper
[20:41:32] <skunkworks259> it would be nice to have a small 6X6 machine for making circuit boards.. maybe 12X12
[20:41:58] <skunkworks259> shaper.. as in resipricating(sp) head?
[20:42:02] <gezar> and I like to use the shaper since its such a fun machine to run
[20:42:16] <gezar> skunkworks259: hell yeah, its an atlas 7"
[20:42:32] <skunkworks259> heh - we have one that is 24" or there abouts..
[20:42:41] <skunkworks259> I have been meaning to take a picture of it.
[20:42:49] <skunkworks259> it would be a cool machine to cnc - a brute.
[20:42:57] <gezar> they are by far the most dangerous machines
[20:43:26] <skunkworks259> I think it was the first machine we got. made a lot of keyways and flattend a lot of metal.'
[20:43:40] <gezar> makes you very sleepy, the stroke-o-matic
[20:43:56] <gezar> if I run it at max speed it bounces all over the place
[20:44:34] <skunkworks259> gezar: grandfather made one (ginery) http://sokolik.com/images/shaper/shaperside.JPG
[20:44:36] <gezar> it has the power to chew an arm right off in one stroke too, scarry thing
[20:45:13] <gezar> that is awsome Skunk :)
[20:45:45] <gezar> nice kick plate and everything
[20:46:19] <skunkworks259> as you can see - he used it a lot.
[20:46:24] <gezar> I dont know the old school methods of using one, so I just baby the heck out of mine, ive heard roumors of them being able to take massive cuts
[20:47:13] <gezar> and yes, I think a cnc one would be very neat
[20:47:48] <ds2> Mmmm shapers
[20:48:27] <skunkworks259> I think jmkasunich has a picture of a shaper taking a huge cut.
[20:49:08] <skunkworks259> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BZYe-b-iGb0
[20:49:20] <skunkworks259> that is around the size we have
[20:50:30] <skunkworks259> doesn't atlas = southbend? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DuytMe3dDjI
[20:51:08] <gezar> omg the comments on the first one hahahaha
[20:51:17] <jmkasunich> its running backwards
[20:51:35] <gezar> atlas is not as good as southbend
[20:51:41] <skunkworks259> yes it is.
[20:51:53] <skunkworks259> (running backwards)
[20:52:04] <jmkasunich> * jmkasunich reads the comments too late
[20:52:36] <gezar> thats a beauity, southbend used a dovetail way, atlas used the square way
[20:52:59] <gezar> last time I used my shaper was to hold my twin 049 motor creation
[20:54:32] <gezar> I wish it would have ran, but when it was sucking for fuel on one cylinder, the other was pushing air back into the crank, I do not know how to overcome this
[20:54:49] <gezar> and yes, I made the crank, and the block
[21:00:34] <jmkasunich> you can't make a multi-cylinder two-stroke using the crankcase for scavenging unless you divide the crankcase - one section per cylinder
[21:04:03] <gezar> I didnt know :(
[21:12:38] <JymmmEMC> jmkasunich: are you running ubuntu-server?
[21:12:43] <JymmmEMC> on any of your boxes?
[21:18:10] <jmkasunich> no
[21:18:27] <LawrenceG> hey JymmmEMC
[21:18:38] <jmkasunich> I have a laptop stashed away somewhere that is running xubuntu, made by loading ubuntu-server and then loading some packages
[21:18:48] <jmkasunich> thats running breezy era code tho
[21:18:49] <JymmmEMC> jmkasunich: thanks.
[21:18:54] <JymmmEMC> LawrenceG: yo
[21:19:31] <LawrenceG> I built a box using the server disk because I didnt have a big enough cdrom to burn the standard iso image....
[21:19:32] <JymmmEMC> jmkasunich: I'm running ubuntu server on SWP suggestion, but having serious issues with it and I can't find anyone else that's running it for comparison
[21:20:03] <JymmmEMC> Random lockup of sshd primarily
[21:20:15] <LawrenceG> I just added the ubuntu-desktop package after the install
[21:20:19] <jmkasunich> sorry, can't really help
[21:20:24] <JymmmEMC> jmkasunich: np
[21:20:28] <jmkasunich> never ran sshd on that machine
[21:20:39] <JymmmEMC> LawrenceG: no this is for a server, no gui at all
[21:21:58] <JymmmEMC> oh gawd, I can never remember that name of that utility to stop services - console based
[21:22:07] <LawrenceG> I dont know why you would have sshd problems..... that has got to be pretty stable code.... I have it running on just about every machine here... I use ssh and sftp to move stuff around the boxes
[21:22:13] <JymmmEMC> displays them in a tabular format
[21:22:48] <LawrenceG> /etc/init.d/sshd stop/start/restart ????
[21:22:49] <JymmmEMC> LawrenceG: Me neither, it could be the HW, but I have nothing to compare it againest.
[21:22:54] <gezar> ps aux lists stuff
[21:23:09] <JymmmEMC> LawrenceG: No, the util that will let me set the run levels
[21:23:10] <gezar> killall <appname> kill them
[21:23:42] <gezar> nice sets run levels
[21:23:46] <gezar> or is one way
[21:23:55] <gezar> oh you mean during start up
[21:24:01] <SWPadnos> hey, it's not my fault
[21:24:03] <SWPadnos> much
[21:24:14] <gezar> um, rc.d is the main, and you have to change the #s lower numbers are started first I believe
[21:24:18] <JymmmEMC> SWPadnos: are you running it?
[21:24:30] <SWPadnos> why no, no of course not. not me
[21:24:42] <gezar> then in or maybe its in init.d then in the rc.xxxx dir is where they are called
[21:25:03] <LawrenceG> init ??
[21:25:27] <SWPadnos> /etc/init.d/ is where the scripts are, /inti/rc<n>.d/ is where there are links to the scripts that you want started or stopped for runlevel <n>
[21:25:39] <ds2> rcX.d is the run level directory
[21:25:52] <ds2> they are started in the order of SXXfoo where XX determines the order
[21:26:17] <SWPadnos> and stopped in the same order, for anything that begins with a KXXfoo
[21:26:18] <LawrenceG> see man init
[21:26:27] <JymmmEMC> sysv-rc
[21:26:48] <ds2> the directories are determined by other scripts; these names are just tradition
[21:27:15] <ds2> /etc/inittab determines what gets called in each run level and from there, the directories are iterated by distro specific scripts
[21:27:19] <SWPadnos> I guess I should rev up the snowblower - back in a bit
[21:27:52] <JymmmEMC> nope, it's sysv-rc-conf
[21:30:55] <JymmmEMC> apt-cache search sysv-rc-conf
[21:32:07] <jepler> JymmmEMC: like almost all packages, sshd (openssh-server) would be the exact same package on desktop or server ubuntu. the kernel might be different--for instance, this article points out some differences between the "-server" and "-generic" kernel in Ubuntu 7.10.
[21:34:08] <JymmmEMC> jepler: well, the kernel might be where the issues is, as sshd/iptables run partly at that level.
[21:34:50] <JymmmEMC> jepler: have a url to that article?
[21:37:06] <jepler> er oops
[21:37:10] <jepler> http://www.serverwatch.com/tutorials/article.php/3715071
[21:37:12] <jepler> meant to paste it
[21:37:18] <JymmmEMC> thanks =)
[21:39:25] <JymmmEMC> Well, it might just be easier to install debian instead of attempting to see if this is an ubuntu issue or HW one.
[22:19:26] <alex_joni> HAPPY NEW YEAR
[22:20:18] <cradek> is it next year there already?
[22:20:46] <alex_joni> yup.. 22 minutes past
[22:20:55] <alex_joni> (if my ntpdate has been run lately)
[22:21:08] <jepler> 16:20:44 <alex_joni> yup.. 22 minutes past
[22:21:18] <jepler> one of us is wrong
[22:21:25] <alex_joni> I think it's me :)
[22:21:38] <alex_joni> my laptop show 21 now, the irssi box is at 23
[22:22:21] <alex_joni> bbl
[23:32:22] <gezar> I cant find my magic pencil
[23:33:08] <BigJohnT> you can use my pen
[23:33:47] <BigJohnT> gezar: if you don't have a dovetail cutter just make square ways on you microminimill
[23:35:33] <gezar> I was going to do square, but the only option I really have is to use my shaper to do it, so its going to be interesting
[23:36:21] <BigJohnT> make them in pieces
[23:37:01] <BigJohnT> one piece for the table and three pieces for each edge sandwiching the table in
[23:37:30] <BigJohnT> that way all parts are just flat parts
[23:37:34] <gezar> I can shape at an angle :)
[23:37:49] <BigJohnT> cool
[23:37:51] <gezar> i cant draw without my special pencil though
[23:38:00] <BigJohnT> darn
[23:38:22] <gezar> that brings up an interesting point where x and y meet, Im not sure I can back the tool out at the right time, we shall see
[23:38:45] <gezar> and if thats the case, then yes, I would be better off having X on the very front like a deckel
[23:38:51] <BigJohnT> cool take some pictures
[23:39:08] <BigJohnT> hmmm deckel?
[23:39:30] <gezar> or monarch pmc
[23:39:53] <gezar> its where the X axis faces the front of the machine, and uses say an angle table for normal mill work
[23:40:45] <gezar> no, ill have to think about this some now
[23:41:02] <gezar> my little motors dont line up correctly on the side in that direction :(
[23:41:17] <BigJohnT> ok, still trying to get a visual
[23:41:20] <gezar> I have a cad system, but I like to draft in my book
[23:41:29] <gezar> my metal is only 1 inch thick
[23:41:40] <gezar> oh about the front facing X?
[23:41:46] <BigJohnT> yes
[23:41:51] <gezar> let me find a link
[23:43:11] <gezar> http://www.kreuznacher-forum.de/WMS-Viehl/FP4Mneu.htm
[23:43:48] <gezar> see how the table top is accually an angle table bolted to the X which faces outward
[23:44:00] <BigJohnT> yes
[23:44:08] <gezar> I cant simply do that with the material i have
[23:44:23] <BigJohnT> and y is on the top?
[23:44:27] <gezar> yeah
[23:44:35] <gezar> on that machine or those like it
[23:44:39] <BigJohnT> and Z is with X?
[23:44:44] <gezar> yep
[23:44:58] <BigJohnT> got ya now
[23:45:40] <BigJohnT> interesting...
[23:46:19] <gezar> hmm, yeah, the shaper may have issues with trying to do that sort of work
[23:46:28] <gezar> argh
[23:46:41] <BigJohnT> darn
[23:46:58] <gezar> Ide have to hold the part at an angle
[23:47:18] <BigJohnT> does your table tilt
[23:47:53] <gezar> I can arange the vise so its at an twisted angle, and then swing the tool down
[23:48:07] <gezar> its the kick back I have to prepare for is all
[23:48:26] <gezar> and the y and X channels would meet per say
[23:48:42] <gezar> I can control the stroke that good, but I can stroke into a fixed wall
[23:48:52] <gezar> cant stroke into a wall that is
[23:48:55] <BigJohnT> sounds like a challange
[23:49:13] <BigJohnT> you have to have just a bit of overtravel right?
[23:49:34] <BigJohnT> for the tool bit to kick up for the return stroke
[23:49:45] <gezar> na , I dont need the over travel, and hell, if I need to i can grind a dove tail like cutter with no problem
[23:49:57] <gezar> yeah, I do need that but not much
[23:50:25] <BigJohnT> It's been a long time since I've seen a shaper in action...
[23:50:32] <gezar> it wont be a problem, however, I can get a ton of precision out of the shaper compared to my mill well, hmm
[23:50:46] <gezar> my mill might accually be fine for this
[23:51:38] <gezar> I can shape the bottom true, then mill things out, then shape the tops of the ways in
[23:51:59] <BigJohnT> sounds like you have a plan now...
[23:51:59] <gezar> problem is, mill is horizontal
[23:52:28] <gezar> and I dont have the belt or the pulley block for the vertical atatchment
[23:53:03] <gezar> so to make a mill, I would have to make my mill work, or just hold hmm, i have that 3rd axis atatchment for the lathe
[23:53:39] <gezar> but thats a weak setup
[23:55:38] <gezar> i think the shaper will be just fine, offset the cutter at 45deg, then go with a tool with a sharp angle so I dont eat into the base
[23:56:17] <gezar> and use the lathe to do the rough pocket milling for the screws, then after I get it aligned make the screw bushing ends
[23:57:01] <gezar> that way the screw is supported between teh stepper and the fixed end
[23:58:41] <BigJohnT> take pictures so we can see
[23:58:47] <gezar> and then as far as matching tails together, the table will be easy enough to match up, and Z should be fine as well
[23:58:58] <BigJohnT> cool
[23:59:02] <christel> [Global Notice] From all of us in #freenode-newyears to all of you out there; the best wishes for 2008! Happy GNU^WNew Year, hope it brings you all you wish for..
[23:59:21] <gezar> well, its going to be 3 matching ways, x to table, Y to Z then Z to motor mount