#emc | Logs for 2007-12-08

[01:25:22] <Ziegler> alex_joni: have you ever used grace?
[01:27:04] <jmkasunich> crap.... it's been so long since I ran the PC I want to use on my machine that I forgot how to turn it on
[01:30:40] <skunkworks> start shorting out pins on the header ;)
[01:32:23] <jmkasunich> I found the harness
[01:32:38] <jmkasunich> "downloading 1 of 151 updates"
[01:33:33] <archivist> you let windaz update!
[01:34:23] <jmkasunich> ubuntu
[01:34:43] <jmkasunich> I don't let windows exist
[01:34:57] <jmkasunich> (well, I have win95 on a virtual machine, but thats it)
[01:38:16] <skunkworks> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vBZZPXCstdw
[01:40:34] <cradek> that's pretty cool
[01:40:48] <jmkasunich> yep
[01:45:30] <skunkworks> cradek: no pressure.. any new pictures?
[01:45:37] <cradek> jepler: did all geeks our age have that machine?
[01:45:47] <cradek> skunkworks: nope, no more real progress yet
[01:46:05] <cradek> I got the C rotary table put together though. I have to put a motor on it
[01:46:57] <jmkasunich> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vzHpDDttIBU&feature=related
[01:48:11] <skunkworks> so - it has some sort of video recignition?
[01:48:34] <jmkasunich> not sure - the incoming parts seem to be randomly place at first glance, but there is actually a pattern
[01:48:35] <cradek> looks like the widgets are in a careful pattern
[01:48:51] <skunkworks> heh it says it has vision
[01:49:18] <jmkasunich> one of these days I'll get speakers
[01:49:41] <cradek> it doesn't sound like much
[01:49:45] <cradek> a bit rattly
[01:50:00] <jmkasunich> "says it has vision" implies narration?
[01:50:15] <cradek> nope
[01:50:21] <cradek> that's in the text
[01:50:25] <skunkworks> An Adept Quattro Robot and an Adept Cobra s800 inverted robot in an in-house demonstration using dual conveyor tracking and vision
[01:50:26] <jmkasunich> duh
[01:50:50] <archivist> it sucks (the noise of the vacuum pickup)
[01:50:57] <skunkworks> I bet the camera isn't on the bot.
[01:51:08] <jmkasunich> heh, it goes into a frenzy at the end
[01:51:23] <jmkasunich> (they stop moving widget and just run the adept as fast as it can
[01:51:38] <jmkasunich> it would probably be tossing stuff all over if it tried to pick them up
[01:52:08] <cradek> oh, at the end, they speed it up
[01:52:47] <archivist> and theres a nasty robot suffling them when it puts them back
[01:53:19] <jmkasunich> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vzHpDDttIBU&feature=related
[01:54:19] <jmkasunich> I've thought about making a cable/wire hexapod or tripod and doing something like this as a silly demo
[01:54:20] <jmkasunich> just move balls around on a board
[01:55:35] <cradek> wrong link?
[01:56:06] <jmkasunich> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tBLfc-0_IOQ&feature=related
[01:56:11] <jmkasunich> stupid clipboard
[01:56:44] <skunkworks> heh - that is neet
[01:58:23] <skunkworks> I am wondering why they didn't leap-frog the balls
[01:59:17] <SWPadnos> heh - delta robots are cool, no?
[02:00:42] <cradek> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v5eR0eHknZk&NR=1
[02:02:48] <SWPadnos> damn. that is a fast SCARA
[02:04:17] <jmkasunich> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=My0BKH3AMSo&feature=related
[02:04:34] <jmkasunich> I like the little clamp that pops out and turns to hold the part
[02:05:34] <SWPadnos> yeah, that's cool
[02:06:27] <jmkasunich> lol - the robotic butt
[02:06:32] <jmkasunich> aka, seat tester
[02:06:36] <SWPadnos> heh
[02:06:38] <jmkasunich> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bPU3NpuMdg0&feature=related
[02:08:31] <SWPadnos> it's a ro-butt
[02:09:37] <jmkasunich> remember the crazy people who slapped a chair on the end of a robot?
[02:09:46] <jmkasunich> now some big company is doing it, at a trade show
[02:09:47] <SWPadnos> yes
[02:09:50] <SWPadnos> eek
[02:09:56] <jmkasunich> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jn4KMDDxVLU&feature=related
[02:10:49] <jmkasunich> it doesn't bring their heads so close to the floor tho
[02:12:44] <toastydeath> oh my god i want to do that
[02:13:50] <cradek> you could ride the table of my mill back and forth...
[02:15:04] <toastydeath> yeah that's kind of boring though
[02:15:21] <toastydeath> that robot whirls you all over
[02:15:21] <toastydeath> maybe if you had like, a bridge mill
[02:15:38] <archivist> thats an evil ride
[02:16:25] <archivist> I wonder what the insurance bill was
[02:19:02] <toastydeath> if you'd trust it to do your process 24/7 unattended, i'd hope it wouldn't be a huge thing to insure
[02:19:45] <jmkasunich> the difference between wrecking a part, and killing a member of the public, is huge in an insurance man's eyes
[02:20:11] <toastydeath> right
[02:20:17] <toastydeath> my point is that the robot is high-reliability
[02:20:34] <archivist> and the "public" there would be expensive execs!
[02:20:42] <jmkasunich> low probability of failure, but very high stakes
[02:20:56] <toastydeath> lower probability of failure than a car accident
[02:21:30] <toastydeath> which seems to have the same stake
[02:21:34] <toastydeath> death of a person
[02:22:14] <toastydeath> i'd get on it!
[02:22:20] <toastydeath> hell, i'd ride it to work.
[02:22:28] <toastydeath> like a pony.
[02:33:03] <jmkasunich> I'd probably ride it too
[02:33:19] <jmkasunich> but no way would I be the programmer or person in charge
[02:33:31] <jmkasunich> the worst that can happen to the rider is death
[02:33:47] <jmkasunich> the person in charge will die the death of a thousand lawyers
[02:34:43] <toastydeath> man we've destroyed all the fun
[02:34:47] <toastydeath> in this country
[02:35:01] <toastydeath> or i guess other countries too
[02:35:05] <toastydeath> "we" being collective "world"
[02:49:28] <toastydeath> oh crap apparently they are using industrial robots in some theme parks as rides, on a full-time basis
[02:49:51] <toastydeath> one at legoland
[03:05:03] <Dogfishguzzler> It would be nice if at least one company that sells ball screws would list their prices.
[03:07:02] <toastydeath> they want their salespeople to have you by the ballscrew.
[03:09:49] <jmkasunich> mcmaster has prices listed (but they are probably high compared to more specialized companies)
[03:10:56] <Dogfishguzzler> haha toasty
[03:12:46] <Dogfishguzzler> What would be a ballpark estimate for a couple small diameter ball screws about 2-3' long?
[03:14:22] <jmkasunich> mcmaster, 5/8" diameter x 13/64 (0.201) lead, $1.27 per inch for the screw, and $23.85 for the nut
[03:14:42] <jmkasunich> other sizes (even smaller ones) are much more, 5/8 must be the sweet spot for them
[03:15:35] <jmkasunich> I think the "13/64" might really be 0.200 = 5tpi
[03:15:51] <jmkasunich> mcmaster sometimes does stupid things like using fractions for stuff that is really decimal
[03:15:54] <Dogfishguzzler> Dang, that could get pricey
[03:15:59] <jmkasunich> lol
[03:16:06] <jmkasunich> that is about the cheapest I've seen
[03:16:55] <Dogfishguzzler> So if thats what Mcmaster wants you guys think I could get them cheaper from someone who specializes in ballscrews?
[03:17:53] <toastydeath> what's wrong with calling them up
[03:17:55] <toastydeath> and asking
[03:18:13] <toastydeath> "hey i'm getting quotes on a 3' ballscrew of any arbitrary small size
[03:18:14] <toastydeath> "
[03:20:13] <Dogfishguzzler> Well since I have to call it makes me think they just want to ask lots of questions and advertise more stuff I don't want
[03:20:36] <jmkasunich> in many cases it means they don't want to deal with individuals
[03:20:42] <Dogfishguzzler> Because you know they don't say a word until they have your address and email.
[03:20:47] <jmkasunich> they won't sell just one, won't take credit cards, etc
[03:21:35] <Dogfishguzzler> I should open a ballscrew store in downtown Charlotte, I bet I would be a billionaire in a couple months.
[03:21:44] <toastydeath> dude just call and ask
[03:21:49] <toastydeath> i've never had a problem with a vendor yet
[03:22:00] <jmkasunich> http://www.roton.com/Screw.aspx?line=Recirculating
[03:22:10] <Dogfishguzzler> Okay so out of the myriad of companies who would you call?
[03:22:12] <jmkasunich> click on "buy" and it puts the item in your cart, with a price
[03:22:18] <jmkasunich> then you can cancel
[03:22:24] <jmkasunich> no info (name, etc) needed
[03:23:18] <jmkasunich> $62.30 for a 60" 5/8 x 5tpi screw, $34.69 for a matching nut
[03:24:31] <Dogfishguzzler> Holy shit, the screws aint terribly high but the nuts?!
[03:24:44] <toastydeath> the nut is harder to make than the screw, dude
[03:24:46] <jmkasunich> what were you expecting?
[03:24:46] <Dogfishguzzler> The nut I saw was $75
[03:25:22] <Dogfishguzzler> I wasn't expecting anything really. I was just wondering what they cost, and now I know.
[03:25:35] <Dogfishguzzler> And knowing is half the battle..
[03:26:42] <toastydeath> *psa music*
[03:27:02] <Dogfishguzzler> Your right jmk, 5/8 does indeed seem to be the sweet spot.
[03:27:56] <jmkasunich> this isn't the first time I've studied that mcmaster catalog page ;-)
[03:28:47] <Dogfishguzzler> Oh well, just one more thing to covet.
[03:29:27] <jmkasunich> thou shalt not covet they neighbor's ballscrew
[03:29:33] <Dogfishguzzler> lol
[03:29:44] <Dogfishguzzler> Hey, he can keep his damn ballscrew!
[03:30:14] <Dogfishguzzler> What do you guys think about 8020?
[03:30:23] <toastydeath> ..?
[03:30:29] <toastydeath> for machine dimensions?
[03:30:34] <Dogfishguzzler> yeah
[03:30:37] <Dogfishguzzler> no
[03:30:38] <toastydeath> lathe or mill
[03:30:43] <toastydeath> oh
[03:30:53] <Dogfishguzzler> brb
[03:31:07] <jmkasunich> you mean the extruded stuff?
[03:31:28] <Dogfishguzzler> http://www.8020.net/
[03:31:30] <Dogfishguzzler> yeah
[03:31:37] <jmkasunich> what do you want to use it for
[03:31:40] <Dogfishguzzler> For a gantry type cnc router
[03:31:52] <jmkasunich> what are you gonna use for slides?
[03:32:38] <Dogfishguzzler> I dont know. We build stuff at work out of it and we have had some sweet bearings that go with 8020 but I don't know where they got them. I can't find them on the website.
[03:32:55] <jmkasunich> you mean those plastic things that slide on the extrusion
[03:32:57] <jmkasunich> ?
[03:33:03] <Dogfishguzzler> no jmk
[03:33:33] <Dogfishguzzler> These were blocks that fit around the whole tube with bearings inside that rolled pretty free
[03:34:23] <jmkasunich> the whole idea of making machine tool ways out of aluminum makes me shudder
[03:34:36] <jmkasunich> but thats just me, and I have no firsthand experience to say it won't work
[03:34:37] <Dogfishguzzler> yeah me too but its for wood and plastic.
[03:35:25] <Dogfishguzzler> I'm hoping I can build one for the experience and then either sell it to my boss or get all the lexan jobs we are farming out right now.
[03:36:45] <Dogfishguzzler> Cause whoever is doing the lexan now is not doing a good job. I've had to fix every single one so far.
[03:37:14] <Dogfishguzzler> I'm talking about missing dimensions by 3-5mm
[03:37:22] <Dogfishguzzler> That's crazy
[03:37:30] <Dogfishguzzler> How do you do that?
[03:38:20] <Dogfishguzzler> I've fudged my share of +/- .005 but if I can't land withing a couple hundred thou the I need to go work somewhere else.
[03:39:08] <archivist> heh near enough for a clockmaker
[03:39:14] <Dogfishguzzler> Right now though I just want to learn about EMC and steppers etc.
[03:40:49] <Dogfishguzzler> I don't get you guys who have a shop full of machines, why arent you making cool shit right now?
[03:41:13] <Dogfishguzzler> I would be making a tesla turbine or a pistol right now if I had my machines.
[03:41:23] <Dogfishguzzler> Or something dammit.]
[03:42:04] <Dogfishguzzler> Hopefully I will have a lathe very soon.
[03:42:11] <Dogfishguzzler> Then the fun begins :D
[03:43:02] <Dogfishguzzler> I don't ever fell like hanging around after work for government jobs, I'm usually ready for a beer by that time.
[03:55:56] <jmkasunich> "Be carefully to your LCD monitor, it's very exquisite but easy to broken."
[04:23:26] <fenn> weird i was just talking about tesla turbines
[04:25:19] <fenn> Dogfishguzzler: you just need to camp out at HGR surplus with a cardboard sign 'will be a bum for machinery'
[04:29:27] <jmkasunich> heh
[04:29:39] <jmkasunich> the problem is that he is probably far away
[04:31:36] <jmkasunich> machinery is cheap, shipping isn't
[04:34:40] <fenn> well, there's components that one could build a machine from
[04:38:12] <fenn> heh HGR has a mobile home for $499
[04:43:36] <jmkasunich> their motto is "anything and everything"
[04:44:25] <fenn> i think i would probably go insane if i ever went there
[04:44:41] <jmkasunich> cause you couldn't fit everything in your car?
[04:44:45] <fenn> right
[04:45:37] <jmkasunich> got my "exquisite" monitor exquisitely mounted on the shoptask... woohoo!
[04:50:45] <jmkasunich> I just realised that this is Pearl Harbor day
[05:36:00] <dmes1> high all
[05:38:15] <fenn> here's one for toastydeath: http://www.hgrindustrialsurplus.com/search-products/product-detail.aspx?id=20-847-004
[05:38:32] <toastydeath> holy PISS
[05:38:41] <jmkasunich> why would he want that?
[05:38:41] <toastydeath> if that machine runs, that is damn cheap
[05:38:54] <toastydeath> davenports, used, usually go for 15-30k
[05:38:59] <toastydeath> depending on options and included tooling
[05:39:11] <toastydeath> which makes me believe it isn't working right
[05:39:12] <jmkasunich> usually HGR stuff has little or no tooling
[05:39:15] <toastydeath> but that's a great deal
[05:39:15] <cradek> nothing there "runs"
[05:39:26] <jmkasunich> if its not attached to the machine, its not included
[05:39:31] <cradek> I think everything is a project to some extent
[05:39:41] <toastydeath> for a screw machine, it's okay if tooling isn't included
[05:39:51] <toastydeath> because you usually have to cam it per job anyway
[05:40:05] <toastydeath> lots of custom tools required to run a job on one
[05:40:27] <toastydeath> man
[05:40:29] <toastydeath> if i had a shop, i'd buy it
[05:40:33] <toastydeath> even if it didn't work
[05:40:38] <jmkasunich> and a truck
[05:40:41] <toastydeath> they still make davenports and used crap can be had cheap
[05:41:09] <toastydeath> to get it running
[05:41:26] <jmkasunich> but then what?
[05:41:31] <toastydeath> make money
[05:41:55] <toastydeath> many a screw machine has run on nothing but those things
[05:41:56] <jmkasunich> unless you need lots of some small part, how are you gonna make money?
[05:42:12] <toastydeath> find people who need small parts
[05:42:34] <jmkasunich> get machine, then find customers?
[05:42:39] <toastydeath> some dudes only buy one or two screw machines and just underbid cnc shops
[05:42:46] <toastydeath> who bid on the same thing trying to run the job on a cnc lathe
[05:42:49] <jmkasunich> seems like you are doing the easy step first, and leaving the hard part for later
[05:43:06] <toastydeath> it's a 1500 dollar machine, plus not a lot in getting it running
[05:43:21] <fenn> actually it's on sale
[05:43:23] <toastydeath> even if there's no work, it's hardly like trying to justify a turning center
[05:43:38] <toastydeath> buy it and sit on it
[05:43:45] <jmkasunich> fenn's right, $1100 right now
[05:43:58] <jmkasunich> interesting - 550V motor
[05:44:02] <toastydeath> i'd buy it at 1500, but i don't have the space at all
[05:44:12] <jmkasunich> where are you located?
[05:44:15] <toastydeath> delaware
[05:44:19] <dmes1> screw in the righs hand are deadly..
[05:44:21] <toastydeath> in an apartment
[05:44:26] <jmkasunich> you'd pay 1500 freight
[05:44:56] <toastydeath> and stil manage to justify it easier!
[05:45:25] <toastydeath> it would be worth just sitting on, because like i said, davenports do not come along cheap that often
[05:45:29] <toastydeath> even ones that are not entirely running
[05:46:11] <toastydeath> even with 1500 in shipping
[05:46:12] <toastydeath> even with no tooling
[05:46:15] <dmes1> what model Davenport??
[05:46:21] <toastydeath> http://www.hgrindustrialsurplus.com/search-products/product-detail.aspx?id=20-847-004
[05:46:25] <jmkasunich> B5
[05:46:29] <toastydeath> that link, dmes1, courtesy of fenn
[05:46:32] <jmkasunich> made in 1942
[05:46:47] <dmes1> who cares when it ws made...
[05:47:10] <jmkasunich> I wasn't saying that was a bad thing
[05:47:16] <jmkasunich> my van norman was made in 1941
[05:47:33] <dmes1> that looks to be a pretty sweet machine... to me
[05:47:39] <toastydeath> yeah but that davenport can crank out parts faster than any cnc lathe on the market today
[05:47:50] <toastydeath> which is why they go for more serious money than most used machines
[05:47:59] <jmkasunich> how does brown & sharp compare to davenport?
[05:48:13] <toastydeath> davenport blows them away in speed but b&s has a larger capacity
[05:48:16] <dmes1> true toast... just a slower change over time..
[05:48:27] <toastydeath> yeah, very slow for the first job
[05:48:32] <toastydeath> verry slow
[05:48:48] <jmkasunich> http://www.hgrindustrialsurplus.com/search-products/product-detail.aspx?id=10-322-018&searchtable=1&sortExpression=&SortASC=&pageSize=50&currentPageIndex=0
[05:48:55] <dmes1> ive rolled cams by hand...
[05:49:00] <jmkasunich> I'm sure those are worth something to a person who knows what they are
[05:49:13] <toastydeath> hahah, some of those things in there are worth 399 by themselves
[05:49:17] <toastydeath> i see at least one die head
[05:49:20] <toastydeath> some rotary broaches
[05:49:23] <jmkasunich> http://www.hgrindustrialsurplus.com/search-products/product-detail.aspx?id=42-364-023&searchtable=1&sortExpression=&SortASC=&pageSize=50&currentPageIndex=0
[05:49:26] <toastydeath> box turning tool
[05:49:39] <dmes1> new they are 1000 bucks EACH
[05:49:50] <toastydeath> yeah
[05:49:54] <toastydeath> i'm talking ebay prices though
[05:49:57] <toastydeath> used stuffs
[05:50:10] <toastydeath> i'm not sure how useful a box of random cams is
[05:50:16] <dmes1> i have a die head like that in the back shed... boy burnt it...
[05:50:26] <toastydeath> but there's probably at least one thing in that box worth 199
[05:50:45] <dmes1> random cams???? random parts...
[05:50:48] <toastydeath> i'd run some of those "screw machine tools" on a regular ol' milling machine or engine lathe
[05:50:59] <jmkasunich> dmes1: the second link
[05:51:17] <toastydeath> second link is change gears and cams, apparently
[05:51:19] <fenn> those remind me of rotary broach holders
[05:51:37] <jmkasunich> there is a third box, similar to the second (and same price)
[05:51:39] <dmes1> scrap metal weight..
[05:51:48] <toastydeath> there's a few knee tools in that first one too
[05:52:02] <toastydeath> it would be neat if they had some shave tools in there
[05:52:04] <dmes1> 1st has nic tools
[05:52:05] <toastydeath> then they'd really be idiots
[05:52:15] <toastydeath> i priced out new shave tools, jesus christ
[05:52:30] <toastydeath> low end, tiny capacity starts at 1500?
[05:52:39] <dmes1> i just makemy own... ; )
[05:52:41] <toastydeath> hahaha
[05:52:52] <toastydeath> what do you use for gibs?
[05:53:11] <toastydeath> strip of iron or brass or something?
[05:53:22] <dmes1> no gibs... valenite cartrige...
[05:53:34] <toastydeath> no i meant the holder itself
[05:53:40] <toastydeath> not the actual cutting part
[05:54:20] <dmes1> 4140 heat treated to 46-48 Rc usually
[05:54:28] <toastydeath> http://www.hgrindustrialsurplus.com/search-products/product-detail.aspx?id=42-364-023&searchtable=1&sortExpression=&SortASC=&pageSize=50&currentPageIndex=0
[05:54:31] <toastydeath> that
[05:54:33] <toastydeath> not the cutting part
[05:55:44] <toastydeath> but whatevs
[05:56:03] <fenn> looks like a lunar lander with a gatling gun to me
[05:56:05] <toastydeath> i hope that my first lathe can be an American Pacemaker
[05:56:22] <toastydeath> dunno if i'll find one in my price range that runs
[05:56:24] <toastydeath> but i will try.
[05:56:55] <dmes1> look for a good lookin Hardinge...
[05:57:03] <toastydeath> fenn: the gatling gun is the bar feeder tube
[05:57:08] <fenn> yeah i know
[05:57:11] <toastydeath> oh
[05:57:25] <toastydeath> dmes1: i'd like the hardinge HC
[05:57:31] <fenn> its all the other "stuff" i dont know
[05:57:42] <dmes1> id like chnc II
[05:58:09] <toastydeath> is that the HC with the cnc kit
[05:58:16] <toastydeath> or is it the hlv
[05:58:36] <dmes1> no its a full CNC SUUPED up HC
[05:58:40] <toastydeath> nice
[05:58:49] <toastydeath> i think there was one one ebay for 6k?
[05:58:54] <toastydeath> real recently
[05:58:58] <toastydeath> dunno if it ran, probably not
[05:59:08] <dmes1> flat bed with .00001 resolution
[05:59:29] <toastydeath> yeah man, we have the HC-AT at school
[05:59:36] <toastydeath> thing is damn accurate
[05:59:53] <dmes1> guage tolerance.. not part
[06:00:06] <toastydeath> well yeah
[06:00:11] <toastydeath> but they're still more accurate than your average lathe
[06:00:34] <dmes1> well yeah
[06:00:56] <toastydeath> someone lost all the "adjustable height" inserts on the toolholders at school though
[06:01:01] <toastydeath> so like, if you want to use it, you need shims
[06:01:11] <toastydeath> every - last - one
[06:01:12] <jmkasunich> goodnight
[06:01:18] <toastydeath> nighty
[06:01:44] <dmes1> wow... slap HIM...
[06:01:49] <toastydeath> hahah.
[06:01:53] <toastydeath> dunno who it was
[06:01:54] <toastydeath> but imagine my rage
[06:02:00] <toastydeath> as i pull out toolholder after toolholder
[06:02:02] <toastydeath> each one
[06:02:05] <toastydeath> missing the damn insert
[06:02:17] <toastydeath> i think i yelled and startled everone when i got to the last one
[06:02:22] <dmes1> Zig Zag papers are .0005 thk... used on screw macines for yrs
[06:02:40] <toastydeath> zig zag?
[06:02:47] <toastydeath> is that like a rolling paper or some other thing?
[06:02:49] <dmes1> t/b
[06:02:52] <toastydeath> tb?
[06:02:59] <fenn> cigarette papers
[06:03:03] <toastydeath> cool
[06:03:06] <toastydeath> that's a good trick man
[06:03:11] <toastydeath> do they last under coolant
[06:03:28] <fenn> why wouldnt you just use shim stock?
[06:03:39] <toastydeath> because it's at school and i can never find what the hell it is i am looking for
[06:03:53] <toastydeath> if it was at work, i'd open the appropriate can of shim stock and pull a piece out
[06:03:54] <fenn> yes that's a problem
[06:04:03] <toastydeath> and every time i FIND what i am looking for
[06:04:04] <toastydeath> some asshat moves it
[06:04:20] <toastydeath> and then they ask me why it is taking me eighty hours to machine the simple part they saked for
[06:04:23] <toastydeath> *asked
[06:05:03] <toastydeath> whatever, school dude
[06:05:23] <toastydeath> keep your crap in the same place every week and i'll give you your part in five hours
[06:06:25] <maddash> look at the size of that monster at the bottom! http://www.treehugger.com/files/2007/12/printing_out_bu.php
[06:08:55] <toastydeath> serious business
[06:08:58] <toastydeath> the question i had
[06:09:02] <toastydeath> isn't that a lot of scrap?
[06:09:07] <toastydeath> do they recycle it into more boards?
[06:10:39] <maddash> I hope not. otherwise, the structure might be weakened
[06:13:25] <toastydeath> man
[06:18:50] <dmes1> slick
[06:20:33] <dmes1> toast.. once in wet or not they are .0005
[06:22:36] <toastydeath> nice
[06:22:39] <toastydeath> ty for that tip
[06:22:56] <maddash> so, what's been happening to EMC 2 since I left?
[06:23:08] <dmes1> screw machines i learned on all had instructions in # of papers as she wharmed up... and a pack to pull from
[06:29:00] <toastydeath> hahah
[06:29:32] <toastydeath> did you ever let the machines warm up dry
[06:29:39] <toastydeath> or just start doing parts
[06:30:14] <dmes1> gotta cut a prt to warm up
[06:30:48] <toastydeath> i keep trying to convince work to put this one bushing we make on a screw machine
[06:31:02] <toastydeath> we make a line of bushings, and it's always this ridiculous job and takes a week to finish
[06:31:18] <dmes1> bush.. ### how many??
[06:31:21] <toastydeath> and the machine it runs on has this ridiculous expansion as it warms up
[06:31:23] <toastydeath> like 200
[06:31:31] <toastydeath> not screw machine quantity, i know
[06:31:36] <toastydeath> but the part runs 7-10 minutes
[06:31:45] <toastydeath> so even if setup takes us a whole day or two days
[06:32:05] <toastydeath> we are still ahead on time, because at worst the machine will take 1 1/2 minutes to pop a part out
[06:32:15] <dmes1> 2 days to set up for a bushing???
[06:32:25] <toastydeath> i am talking "absolute worst case"
[06:32:32] <toastydeath> like, if the dude setting up has brain damage
[06:33:13] <toastydeath> it's got this o-ring profile on the OD, which would be easy to use a shave tool for
[06:33:21] <toastydeath> but we currently try to single point it and it takes a year
[06:33:34] <toastydeath> and the ID is +.0000/-.0005
[06:33:45] <dmes1> shite ihad pre made bushing programs sitting in the control . ... ust swap #/s
[06:33:55] <toastydeath> and the machine drifts real bad, so you have to babysit it every single time
[06:34:08] <toastydeath> because the drfit is a random value and if you don't check the bore every time, the next part comes out wrong
[06:34:44] <dmes1> so last pass is a crap shoot???
[06:34:57] <toastydeath> kind of
[06:35:22] <toastydeath> you have to really get to know the machine
[06:35:26] <toastydeath> and it makes a lot of scrap
[06:35:48] <dmes1> tell your boss you need a new machine to be reliable.... or screw up 3 pcs on a row...
[06:35:57] <toastydeath> dude we've screwed up 50% of a job one time
[06:36:02] <toastydeath> on multiple occasions
[06:36:06] <toastydeath> and they STILL won't do anything
[06:36:44] <toastydeath> i keep saying run it on a screw machine, drill it, bore it for geometry, and then run a ballizer or burnisher for the diameter
[06:36:48] <dmes1> want my telephone # i'll talk to him.. once i get a PO
[06:37:01] <toastydeath> haha, no, they'd flip out
[06:37:11] <toastydeath> but i appriciate the offer
[06:37:19] <toastydeath> if they were at all interested i'd take you up on it
[06:37:21] <dmes1> no bushing needs that...
[06:37:28] <toastydeath> well it's for an air bearing
[06:37:42] <dmes1> for??
[06:37:52] <toastydeath> a product line
[06:37:56] <toastydeath> it's a stock part
[06:38:06] <dmes1> of turbos?
[06:38:13] <toastydeath> we don't know, whoever buys them
[06:38:17] <toastydeath> we make the bearings, people buy them from us
[06:38:24] <dmes1> i see
[06:38:37] <toastydeath> but there's some material issues there and we have to have a tight fit
[06:38:42] <toastydeath> because of the TOP SECRET PROCESS
[06:38:44] <toastydeath> they use
[06:38:49] <dmes1> material??
[06:38:53] <toastydeath> graphite.
[06:39:11] <toastydeath> and that's about as much as i'm able to say =((
[06:39:18] <dmes1> and ALU
[06:39:23] <toastydeath> aluminum bushing, and graphite liner
[06:39:55] <toastydeath> the mori seiki lathe we have will hold +/-.0001 on any dimension for about three hours
[06:39:56] <dmes1> no sweat.. i have some of those... ;)
[06:39:58] <toastydeath> then it will shift
[06:40:06] <toastydeath> but that's a 20" swing
[06:40:13] <toastydeath> too slow for 2" and under bushings
[06:40:40] <dmes1> need a sweet little chnc II
[06:40:42] <toastydeath> or rather the chuck isn't rated
[06:40:47] <toastydeath> haha, true
[06:41:08] <toastydeath> but our turned parts are product lines!
[06:41:16] <toastydeath> we hardly do ANY custom turning work
[06:41:29] <toastydeath> so I say set up a box of tools and papers for each part, and buy a screw machine
[06:41:45] <dmes1> tthe best air chuck in japan is made in the USA -
[06:41:47] <toastydeath> it's not like they're going to change the parts that haven't been changed in five years
[06:42:02] <toastydeath> ha
[06:42:51] <dmes1> they WILL change the part... no worries
[06:43:01] <toastydeath> well, we do get the occasional custom order
[06:43:11] <toastydeath> but we have six lathes sitting around, and only one of them running at any one time
[06:43:29] <toastydeath> so please, sell four, buy two screw machines, and have even more capacity than you did before
[06:44:10] <toastydeath> set up in the morning, and be done with the job by five
[06:44:11] <dmes1> i DO the custom FIXES / orders for alotta stuf.. and the engineering orders CHANGING stuff are quite common
[06:44:27] <toastydeath> our engineers don't actually change crap, they just move crap around on the drawing
[06:44:29] <toastydeath> and confuse everyone
[06:44:37] <toastydeath> "this is different.. but... it says the same thing?"
[06:44:46] <toastydeath> "yeah, i didn't like where the dimension was on the drawing."
[06:44:48] <toastydeath> "uh... okay."
[06:45:02] <dmes1> not for me they dont...
[06:45:24] <toastydeath> hah =(
[06:47:11] <toastydeath> i'm much better at drafting now
[06:47:14] <toastydeath> that i have been machining
[06:47:23] <toastydeath> i'm also getting real good at checking my own prints
[06:47:29] <toastydeath> very few errors, if any, get by me
[06:50:36] <dmes1> so become a dwg checker...
[06:50:54] <toastydeath> hell no
[06:50:57] <toastydeath> helll no
[06:51:03] <toastydeath> i'd rather cut my hands on chips all day
[06:58:53] <Skullworks-PGAB> I feel your pain - had to make 5000 oilite bushings @ .478" +.00015 / -0
[07:01:10] <Skullworks-PGAB> Someone had tooled up the mating part wrong so the bores these bushings were for were the wrong size.
[07:02:08] <toastydeath> damn
[07:02:12] <toastydeath> what do you use to bore with?
[07:02:30] <toastydeath> like all our lathes but one drift too far to be reliable past a total .0005" of error
[07:02:37] <Skullworks-PGAB> not bore - O.D.
[07:02:39] <toastydeath> oh
[07:02:52] <toastydeath> still, .0001
[07:03:23] <toastydeath> we'd have to set indicators up and do it on our hlv
[07:03:27] <toastydeath> manually
[07:03:31] <Skullworks-PGAB> used a 1/4 degree tapered mandril
[07:03:37] <dmes1> doable on the right equipment
[07:04:06] <toastydeath> like that's my big concern about being like, yes use screw machines
[07:04:17] <Skullworks-PGAB> just kinda slide them on until tight
[07:04:19] <toastydeath> the bore is surface finish rms 16
[07:04:28] <toastydeath> and the tolerance is -.0005
[07:04:34] <toastydeath> can a screw machine hold that with a boring bar?
[07:04:42] <dmes1> NOT
[07:04:49] <toastydeath> yeah that's what i figured
[07:05:11] <toastydeath> and is why i'd want to use burnishing or some other doodad
[07:05:20] <dmes1> good tooling... is the always the answer
[07:05:28] <Skullworks-PGAB> ha oilite is all porus - even if PCD diamond is used its still full of craters
[07:05:52] <toastydeath> haha
[07:06:07] <toastydeath> ridiculous
[07:06:16] <toastydeath> dmes1: what would you use to hold .0005 on a screw machine?
[07:07:43] <dmes1> i probably wouldn't try unless i was close to start with....
[07:08:24] <dmes1> or it would be a ground form tool...
[07:08:29] <toastydeath> or a reamer?
[07:08:36] <Skullworks-PGAB> oilite is basically a powder metal pressed/sintered bronse - then submerged in oil in a vaccuum - then returned to normal pressure which forces oil into all the porus areas that had been full of air.
[07:08:37] <toastydeath> a reamer might do it i guess
[07:09:18] <dmes1> reamers dont alway run straight
[07:09:33] <toastydeath> i'd use a boring bar to give it a nice track to run on
[07:09:36] <Skullworks-PGAB> as an oilite bushing heats up - it sweats oil at the hot spot - self lubricating.
[07:09:41] <toastydeath> and if the boring bar drifted a couple thou, nobody cares
[07:09:47] <toastydeath> the reamer would give us the finish and size
[07:10:00] <toastydeath> skullworks-pgab: i always wondered how that worked, the self lubricating thing
[07:10:31] <Skullworks-PGAB> I don't trust reamers much anymore...
[07:10:58] <Skullworks-PGAB> had too many that would not hold size repeatedly
[07:11:01] <dmes1> i turned alot of PM ... some miserable shite
[07:11:24] <toastydeath> i've heard ballizing and burnishing hold .0002
[07:11:34] <toastydeath> but they're apparently sensitive to a thou or so on diameter
[07:11:34] <Skullworks-PGAB> sure
[07:11:46] <dmes1> yup
[07:11:52] <toastydeath> which sort of leaves me with the same problem i had when i started
[07:12:00] <toastydeath> though less severe
[07:12:46] <toastydeath> though i suppose .001 is well inside reamer turf
[07:12:46] <dmes1> gotta head for bed...
[07:12:48] <toastydeath> or boring bar
[07:12:53] <toastydeath> goodnight, thanks for your insight
[07:13:43] <dmes1> .001 is NOT enuff for a reamer
[07:13:56] <dmes1> or a bbar..
[07:15:33] <dmes1> SMALL reamers NEED .004-.006... and b/bars need 1/2 toolnose rad or so..
[07:16:12] <toastydeath> i meant tolerance
[07:16:21] <toastydeath> not like, stock left to remove
[07:16:34] <toastydeath> this is from solid bar, so we can use whatever drill we want
[07:16:44] <dmes1> and out to 20 to 1 ist fun.. thats where i play lately
[07:17:08] <toastydeath> lol
[07:18:05] <dmes1> 4.5 inches 56 inches down the bore
[07:19:47] <dmes1> see you in the AM
[07:19:55] <toastydeath> bye!
[09:24:08] <pierp> http://cgi.ebay.it/ASUS-F5VL-AP008C-2DUOT5450-2GB-TFT15-4-GLARE-X2300128MB_W0QQitemZ130181476375QQihZ003QQcategoryZ46323QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
[15:03:25] <skunkworks> join emc-deve
[15:03:28] <skunkworks> oops
[16:46:24] <Skullworks-PGAB> CompUSA is closing - http://money.cnn.com/2007/12/07/technology/compusa.ap/index.htm?postversion=2007120719
[16:52:09] <skunkworks> I don't think I have ever ordered anything from them
[17:05:04] <eric_U> their sales haven't been good
[17:05:33] <eric_U> when they have to lower the prices enough that people will buy, they sell everything to liquidators
[17:18:56] <alex_joni> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UWMhMAHAFTo
[17:23:08] <skunkworks> what? I can't hear you..
[17:24:47] <skunkworks> would like to have seen what it was cutting.
[18:02:41] <fenn> once they get to 1Mrpm you wont be able to hear it at all
[18:04:00] <skunkworks> you will just have an aneurism?
[18:04:19] <fenn> things will randomly catch fire around the room
[18:04:53] <skunkworks> heh - the tool will break - go strait tru you, wall, and 6 cars. and you won't even know it
[18:05:30] <fenn> i read something on rcm where a guy drilling .001" holes just keeled over dead one day
[18:05:48] <fenn> after x-raying they found the drill bit in his spine
[18:05:53] <skunkworks> yikes
[18:06:22] <Vq^> :/
[18:06:50] <anonimasu> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L34TLsKElnQ&feature=related
[18:07:15] <anonimasu> when emc does that I'll be happy
[18:07:43] <fenn> when emc does the dishes and cooks me pancakes, i'll be happy
[18:08:09] <alex_joni> anonimasu: why shouldn't it now?
[18:08:10] <skunkworks> when emc retro-fits our mill by itself...
[18:08:21] <anonimasu> alex_joni: I just havent heard of anyone doing that kind of speeds..
[18:08:25] <anonimasu> or seen any clip or anything
[18:08:46] <Ziegler> emc should be able to do that
[18:08:57] <anonimasu> at that speed?
[18:08:59] <Ziegler> you just have to have the equipment for it
[18:09:02] <Ziegler> sure why not?
[18:09:05] <anonimasu> hm
[18:09:25] <alex_joni> anonimasu: that's a fairly simple contour
[18:09:34] <anonimasu> alex_joni: it's damn fast..
[18:09:38] <anonimasu> :)
[18:10:05] <Ziegler> its looks like a very small item... and is probably running servos
[18:10:17] <fenn> of course it's running servos
[18:10:18] <Ziegler> and in my dream world ball screws too
[18:10:28] <anonimasu> ofcourse.
[18:10:40] <Ziegler> fenn... I have seen stepper setups that run fast.
[18:11:00] <alex_joni> anonimasu: I saw a guy doing 3-4m/min with emc2 a couple years ago
[18:11:07] <anonimasu> that's dead slow :/
[18:11:12] <alex_joni> with steppers, so it wasn't really much
[18:11:18] <anonimasu> well, my rapids are at 4m/min right now..
[18:11:25] <anonimasu> it's slow :)
[18:11:40] <anonimasu> my motors are the limit though
[18:12:14] <Ziegler> my mill rapids at 2 meters/min roughly
[18:12:18] <anonimasu> -_-
[18:12:56] <Ziegler> (80 ipm)
[18:13:05] <fenn> Ziegler: steppers at 900in/min?
[18:13:30] <Ziegler> check your math
[18:13:39] <fenn> iirc mariss' unstallable stepper demo with the crazy drives was only aroudn 1500in/min
[18:13:47] <skunkworks> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a_OUNLruaVQ
[18:14:03] <Ziegler> http://www.google.com/search?q=2+meters+per+minute+to+inches+per+minute
[18:14:05] <anonimasu> fenn: why isnt that in production already?
[18:14:19] <fenn> Ziegler: i was talking about the spiral milling video
[18:14:42] <Ziegler> sure fenn... why not?
[18:15:03] <fenn> um, because steppers only go up to about 1000 rpm
[18:15:23] <Ziegler> rack and pinion
[18:15:45] <Ziegler> :-P
[18:15:46] <anonimasu> big steppers?
[18:15:56] <fenn> linear steppers maybe :P
[18:16:00] <Ziegler> I wouldnt do it that way... but it can be done
[18:16:07] <anonimasu> yeah
[18:16:27] <Ziegler> (besides I like getting fenn all riled up.)
[18:17:00] <fenn> rarr
[18:17:07] <Ziegler> * Ziegler pokes the bear
[18:17:15] <fenn> * fenn hibernates for the winter
[18:17:23] <Ziegler> heh
[18:17:33] <anonimasu> I cant help but to adore fast machines
[18:17:50] <Ziegler> they are fun to watch arnt they
[18:17:55] <anonimasu> yeah
[18:18:04] <anonimasu> and probably even more fun to run
[18:18:06] <Ziegler> I would love to convert my machine to servo's
[18:18:27] <Ziegler> (thats for next year)
[18:18:34] <skunkworks> ^ was done with http://www.electronicsam.com/images/engraver/stepper.JPG
[18:19:14] <Ziegler> that video skunkworks?
[18:19:43] <skunkworks> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a_OUNLruaVQ
[18:19:46] <Ziegler> cool
[18:20:13] <Ziegler> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZPqJTPvvFMI&NR=1
[18:20:29] <fenn> skunkworks: what's the thread pitch on the hermes?
[18:21:01] <skunkworks> * skunkworks was hoping no one would ask
[18:21:04] <skunkworks> ;)
[18:21:09] <skunkworks> 4tpi
[18:21:17] <skunkworks> direct drive
[18:21:20] <anonimasu> uh
[18:21:26] <Ziegler> is there a better surface finish when you take light cuts really fast?
[18:21:32] <anonimasu> :)
[18:21:32] <Ziegler> compared to
[18:21:43] <Ziegler> standard cut at standard speeds?
[18:22:03] <fenn> there's less distortion/stress left in the metal compared to the same surface after a heavy cut
[18:22:47] <skunkworks> youtube seems to be every spastic
[18:23:03] <Ziegler> heh
[18:23:15] <fenn> every spastic's best friend
[18:23:38] <skunkworks> input scale on the engraver was 4000
[18:24:25] <skunkworks> Ziegler: did you see my question? he is using mach.
[18:24:39] <skunkworks> (on the last video you posted)
[18:24:41] <Ziegler> what?
[18:25:12] <skunkworks> samcoinc
[18:25:20] <Ziegler> I didn't see any question.
[18:25:36] <Ziegler> a guy who was asking me for help a couple weeks ago ... his input scale was around 800
[18:25:44] <Ziegler> dunno what he plans to do with that machine
[18:27:09] <Ziegler> im I still here?
[18:27:33] <skunkworks> yes
[18:28:51] <anonimasu> howcome all mach3 machines I see are slow?
[18:29:14] <Ziegler> no reason
[18:29:39] <skunkworks> the video Ziegler posted (high speed facing) was running mach
[18:29:40] <Ziegler> but mach3 doesnt do real time if I remember correctly
[18:29:59] <skunkworks> but that is strait lines.. not contouring.
[18:30:00] <Ziegler> welll windows doesnt do real time
[18:30:48] <cradek> who needs high speed? get a face mill and do that in one pass :-)
[18:30:57] <Ziegler> ya hehe
[18:31:24] <Ziegler> the people who need it are probably the ones with the micro mills that cant handle a large face mill
[18:31:43] <Ziegler> (just a guess)
[18:31:52] <cradek> right, I was just teasing
[18:32:19] <skunkworks> not everyone has a nice big bridgeport in thier shop...
[18:32:25] <skunkworks> ;)
[18:33:55] <Ziegler> isn't there someone here who has emc running on a large machining center?
[18:34:48] <anonimasu> we are all waiting for skunkworks to try it out
[18:34:55] <skunkworks> heh
[18:35:05] <skunkworks> * skunkworks isn't feeling any pressure
[18:35:17] <Ziegler> * Ziegler applies pressure
[18:35:18] <skunkworks> there is a mazak running emc at the cnc workshop
[18:35:22] <cradek> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8VUvocnIfek
[18:35:26] <Ziegler> oh right
[18:35:26] <skunkworks> tool changer and all
[18:35:31] <cradek> wow look at this terrible contouring performance
[18:35:34] <Ziegler> thats what I am thinking of
[18:36:07] <cradek> I think it's very low accel and exact stop at each segment
[18:36:51] <skunkworks> there is another guy running a mazak on the west cost.
[18:37:39] <skunkworks> losts of bridgeport style machines running it
[18:37:43] <skunkworks> lots
[18:37:58] <skunkworks> youtube is running really slow for me
[18:38:14] <anonimasu> rsame for me
[18:39:13] <alex_joni> nope
[19:06:49] <alex_joni> err... I mean it doesn't really work well
[19:07:18] <skunkworks> eh
[19:07:20] <skunkworks> heh
[19:22:01] <skunkworks> Ziegler: http://youtube.com/watch?v=vNn-Yr7it5s
[19:24:17] <eric_U> there is the guy on cnczone that says he has a large machine running emc
[19:25:30] <eric_U> I'm hoping to get my bp running it this weekend, but I'm not making much progress sitting here on IRC
[19:25:52] <eric_U> my speeds should be fairly decent with the servomotors I have
[19:27:47] <JymmmEMC> http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20071208/ap_on_fe_st/odd33_cent_gas
[19:28:22] <JymmmEMC> eric_U: If it'll help, you cna always be kicked up of the channel for a day or so =)
[19:28:29] <JymmmEMC> s/up/out/
[19:28:50] <eric_U> cool
[19:28:54] <JymmmEMC> lol
[19:30:29] <jmkasunich> wow, videos actually have sound!
[19:30:37] <eric_U> really?
[19:30:38] <alex_joni> hahaha
[19:30:47] <alex_joni> jmkasunich: welcome to the world of sound :)
[19:31:01] <eric_U> I hate to listen to machine tools
[19:31:05] <jmkasunich> $6.99 speakers
[19:31:16] <eric_U> too much
[19:31:18] <jmkasunich> first computer in as long as I can remember that I put speakers on
[19:31:39] <eric_U> I like to listen to music so I usually have speakers
[19:32:11] <eric_U> don't know if I'd do that on my mill though
[19:32:12] <jmkasunich> I should go digital one of these days
[19:32:22] <JymmmEMC> jmkasunich: digital speakers?
[19:32:30] <jmkasunich> I have some stuff on vinyl and cassette that I ought to burn onto CD
[19:32:54] <eric_U> that would be nice, but my turntable and tape players are broke
[19:33:14] <jmkasunich> my turntable is OK, tape player has problems
[19:33:19] <eric_U> someone sells a laser scanner for albums
[19:33:20] <jmkasunich> as does the receiver
[19:34:19] <eric_U> don't know how they get enough horizontal resolution though, that's gotta be hard
[19:34:23] <JymmmEMC> there IS a USB turntable
[19:34:42] <eric_U> that's just silly
[19:34:57] <SWPadnos> there was some program to digitize audio from digital images of records
[19:35:05] <SWPadnos> I imagine it's mono though
[19:35:38] <eric_U> I have a machine at work that could probably do it given enough time
[19:35:57] <eric_U> white light interferometer surface measuring device
[19:36:01] <eric_U> from zygo
[19:36:36] <eric_U> I'll have to take one of my records in to see how it works
[19:39:47] <JymmmEMC> eric_U: Not really, USB turntable is direct to digital and jsut record on the PC
[19:40:13] <JymmmEMC> and burn to cd/dvd
[19:40:28] <eric_U> I guess if you were digitizing and wanted to buy a turntable
[19:40:51] <JymmmEMC> it's pretty inexpensive, about $89-$130
[19:40:58] <eric_U> that's the part that's silly
[19:41:08] <JymmmEMC> especially if you have a massive collection
[19:41:49] <eric_U> if you have a massive collection that's worth digitizing, it's probably not good enough
[19:42:25] <eric_U> I should resurrect my turntable, but it was belt driven, and the belt died
[19:43:18] <eric_U> I sure wish there was a schematic of the mesa 3i77
[19:44:01] <eric_U> 7i37
[19:45:05] <eric_U> illustration of this: " The opto-isolated inputs have 4.4K Ohm series resistors and reverse input
[19:45:05] <eric_U> protection diodes across the opto-isolator LEDS.
[19:45:05] <eric_U> "
[19:58:08] <eric_U> wonder if my wife would notice if I bought one of these:
[19:58:10] <eric_U> http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=8553326&type=product&id=1188561324689
[20:00:09] <JymmmEMC> kinda high price, and brightness a tad low
[20:00:22] <JymmmEMC> refresh rate a little on the low side too
[20:00:49] <eric_U> I'm using one of the 22" that has all of those problems
[20:00:57] <eric_U> it's pretty nice
[20:01:28] <JymmmEMC> I boyoctted BestBuy years ago due to the lawsuit and now Ricco Charges
[20:01:41] <eric_U> rebate problems?
[20:01:53] <JymmmEMC> oh no, much worse
[20:02:02] <JymmmEMC> hang on I'll get it...
[20:02:10] <eric_U> oh, the bait and switch problems
[20:02:16] <eric_U> secret web sites
[20:02:21] <eric_U> forgot about that one
[20:02:32] <JymmmEMC> no, the bestbuy sending your credit card info to M$ and signing you up to MSN
[20:02:41] <JymmmEMC> racketeering
[20:03:10] <JymmmEMC> http://www.tgdaily.com/content/view/31975/118/
[20:03:13] <eric_U> I'd never buy a computer from them anyway
[20:03:32] <JymmmEMC> I'll never buy ANYTHING from them, unless someone gave me a gift card.
[20:04:04] <eric_U> I knew someone that had that problem with AOL and Circuit City
[20:04:28] <eric_U> when they sign you up for aol, it's much worse because that's like giving your credit card to russian mafia
[20:04:53] <eric_U> you will -never- be able to cancel
[20:05:39] <eric_U> I knew someone that allowed CC to sign him up, never used AOL, ended up paying them hundreds of dollars, they wouldn't let him cancel
[20:06:13] <eric_U> credit card company wouldn't help
[20:09:01] <eric_U> maybe I should just buy a 24" from newegg
[20:10:13] <eric_U> I'm confused about how to run the m5i20 python ui
[20:11:57] <eric_U> this one: http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?M5i20_Halvcp_Test_Panel
[20:13:19] <eric_U> i suppose I could just run the shell script
[20:15:15] <SWPadnos> yep, looks like that's the way
[20:15:39] <SWPadnos> or you could probably put a loadusr line of some sort in a hal file so it loads when you run emc
[20:25:24] <eric_Unter> bleah
[20:27:54] <eric_U> shell script only works on anders' computer
[20:30:57] <eric_U> where is emc install directory?
[20:32:32] <eric_U> well, there is a usr/share/emc that's not too useful
[20:35:22] <eric_U> anyone know where the emc scripts directory lives in a standard liveCD install?
[20:36:24] <alex_joni> eric_U: what are you looking for?
[20:36:37] <alex_joni> you can find each file part of the emc2 install by issuing "dpkg -L emc2"
[20:36:48] <eric_U> thx
[20:40:33] <eric_U> that didn't work, trying to fix this line: ~/emc2.dev/scripts/realtime start
[20:40:51] <eric_U> if I had a cvs, that would work, but I have vanilla livecd install
[20:41:08] <alex_joni> it's: sudo /etc/init.d/realtime start
[20:41:29] <alex_joni> how didn't the previous command now work?
[20:41:42] <eric_U> said it couldn't find realitme
[20:42:02] <alex_joni> "dpkg -L emc2" ?
[20:42:10] <eric_U> I didn't grep for realtime
[20:42:22] <alex_joni> dpkg -L emc2 | grep realtime
[20:42:32] <alex_joni> bbl
[20:43:19] <eric_U> I'm never going to ask where emc is installed again, it's everywhere and nowhere
[20:43:49] <eric_U> all around us
[20:45:32] <jmkasunich> you know you're a geek if you take a new item apart before you even plug it in
[20:45:42] <eric_U> I only do that at work:)
[20:46:23] <jmkasunich> goes double if you see the tiny torx head screws that they try to keep you out with and say "sorry fsckers, I got the tools for that"
[20:46:39] <eric_U> do you have security ones? I need some of those
[20:46:53] <jmkasunich> nope
[20:47:16] <jmkasunich> these are tiny, there's no way they could put one of those security pins in the middle
[20:47:27] <eric_U> nintendo can s--k on their stupid proprietary fasteners
[20:48:26] <eric_U> of course, for those you can heat up a ball point pen casing and form your own wrench
[20:49:04] <jmkasunich> this is what I'm taking apart: http://www.cirque.com/cpages/?page=24
[20:49:18] <jmkasunich> need to figure out where it's safe to install mounting screws
[20:49:53] <eric_U> I had a computer that had one of those embedded in the monitor
[20:50:07] <eric_U> not usb unfortunately
[20:51:15] <jmkasunich> this is the keyboard that is going to go with it:
[20:51:16] <jmkasunich> http://www.adesso.com/products_detail.asp?productid=298
[20:51:26] <jmkasunich> gotta figure out where and how to mount both
[20:53:37] <eric_U> is the keyboard usable?
[20:53:48] <eric_U> $35 not bad
[20:54:39] <jmkasunich> I haven't really used the kb either
[20:54:55] <jmkasunich> the feel isn't terrible, in fact it seems nicer than a laptop keyboard
[20:55:00] <jmkasunich> (which ain't saying much)
[20:55:13] <jmkasunich> * jmkasunich goes in search of a piece of aluminum
[20:56:54] <BigJohnT> Any one know why ubuntu 6.06 the one that comes on the live EMC does not upgrade Python from 2.4 to 2.5 automaticly?
[21:05:07] <dmes1> http://www.water-4-fuel.com/
[21:09:48] <jmkasunich> dang... need 18x6, biggest I have is 16 x 16
[21:11:03] <jmkasunich> unless I mount the mouse replacement somewhere other than right next to the keyboard
[21:17:01] <BigJohnT> what are you building?
[21:18:31] <jmkasunich> CNCing my shoptask 3-in-1
[21:18:49] <jmkasunich> mounted the monitor last night, gotta mount a kb and mouse now
[21:18:49] <BigJohnT> Sweet!
[21:19:05] <jmkasunich> http://jmkasunich.com/cgi-bin/blosxom/shoptask/mounted-monitor-12-07-07.html
[21:19:13] <BigJohnT> I'm building a CNC portable plasma table
[21:20:51] <BigJohnT> the X and Y are for both the mill and the lathe?
[21:22:18] <skunkworks> jmkasunich: does the head go up and down?
[21:23:24] <jmkasunich> no
[21:23:34] <jmkasunich> thats the main suckage about the machine
[21:23:42] <jmkasunich> the 2nd main suckage is lack of rigidity
[21:24:27] <BigJohnT> Is it ok cutting aluminum?
[21:24:33] <skunkworks> it seems to have a ton of space between the head and the tabel
[21:24:35] <skunkworks> table
[21:24:48] <skunkworks> for not having the head move
[21:24:53] <jmkasunich> yep
[21:25:02] <BigJohnT> how does it do a Z move?
[21:25:10] <jmkasunich> you wind up doing weird ass things like blocking the vice up on spacers
[21:25:14] <skunkworks> yikes
[21:25:19] <jmkasunich> it has a quill, but only about 3" of travel
[21:25:29] <BigJohnT> ok i see it now
[21:26:05] <BigJohnT> don't feel too bad my bridgeport CNC mill only has about 4" of quill travel
[21:26:14] <jmkasunich> yeah, but it has a knee!
[21:26:19] <BigJohnT> at least I can crank the knee up and down
[21:26:27] <BigJohnT> about 16" or so
[21:27:01] <BigJohnT> you need some kind of quick knee for your vise
[21:27:44] <skunkworks> you could make some sort of mount so the head would mount on the tail of the machine lower... maybe. (other then I bet it would be a pain to swap ;))
[21:27:59] <jmkasunich> I have a real mill: http://jmkasunich.com/vannorman/VN_Home.htm
[21:28:09] <jmkasunich> but it lives in the garage, which kind of sucks in the winter
[21:28:19] <skunkworks> heh - but it isn't cnc... ;) yet
[21:28:21] <BigJohnT> are you CNCing the XYand Z?
[21:28:30] <jmkasunich> on the shoptask? yes
[21:28:38] <jmkasunich> I have no intention of CNCing the van norman
[21:29:04] <BigJohnT> I see the mount for the quill in the picture
[21:29:16] <BigJohnT> are you using steppers?
[21:29:27] <jmkasunich> I added that ballscrew, it originally had rack-and-pinion, like a drill press
[21:29:32] <jmkasunich> yes, NEMA 34 steppers
[21:30:40] <BigJohnT> have you ever looked at the steppers at automationdirect.com?
[21:30:50] <jmkasunich> no
[21:30:54] <BigJohnT> I bought some for my plasma project
[21:30:56] <jmkasunich> got mine from kelinginc.com
[21:31:05] <BigJohnT> very cost effective
[21:31:26] <BigJohnT> I buy a lot of electrical from them for my business
[21:31:56] <BigJohnT> I didn't use their amps tho
[21:32:22] <BigJohnT> I used gecko G203v's
[21:32:49] <BigJohnT> with a C1G parallel port interface card
[21:32:57] <BigJohnT> seems to work on the bench well
[21:50:42] <jmkasunich> not good - the PC locked up again
[21:50:52] <jmkasunich> crap and corruption
[21:51:08] <BigJohnT> on your cnc?
[21:51:18] <jmkasunich> the one that I was gonna use for the CNC
[21:51:28] <jmkasunich> (its not on there yet, it's sitting on my bench)
[21:51:30] <BigJohnT> I like that 'was'
[21:51:57] <jmkasunich> I booted it last night and updated everything, it locked up around midnight
[21:52:06] <jmkasunich> rebooted today around 1pm, and its locked now
[21:52:15] <BigJohnT> you running ubuntu?
[21:52:20] <jmkasunich> yeah
[21:52:49] <BigJohnT> I had to replace my hard drive on this box before linux would run right
[21:53:04] <jmkasunich> I'm not sure what is dying
[21:53:08] <BigJohnT> it's a p4 something or other
[21:53:09] <jmkasunich> the mobo is an older P3
[21:53:32] <jmkasunich> I noticed a bulging electrolytic cap on it yesterday, thats never a good sign
[21:53:43] <BigJohnT> nope
[21:54:05] <jmkasunich> time to dig through the piles again
[21:54:18] <jmkasunich> I had mixed feelings about that board anyway, it used rambus memory
[21:56:54] <Skullworks-PGAB> * Skullworks-PGAB Deli uses rambus - I feel the pain...
[21:58:21] <jmkasunich> something tells me I'll have a couple of spare sticks of it soon
[21:58:23] <jmkasunich> interested?
[21:59:15] <BigJohnT> I don't even know what rambus is...
[21:59:33] <jmkasunich> consider yourself lucky
[21:59:33] <BigJohnT> I take it is different from regular memory
[21:59:52] <jmkasunich> it was intel's attempt to ram their standard down the markets throat
[21:59:58] <jmkasunich> the market spit it back up
[22:00:07] <jmkasunich> think Beth video tapes
[22:00:10] <jmkasunich> Beta
[22:00:32] <BigJohnT> gotcha
[22:00:56] <BigJohnT> my neighbor has a bunch of Beta machines and tapes
[22:02:15] <jmkasunich> hmm, I think this mobo is really done now
[22:02:21] <jmkasunich> on power up I get beep codes
[22:02:25] <jmkasunich> 1-3-3-1
[22:02:30] <BigJohnT> smell the smoke now
[22:07:41] <BigJohnT> is the pattern 1 short 3 short
[22:07:44] <jmkasunich> reseating the memory seems to have fixed it
[22:07:58] <jmkasunich> one, pause, three, pause, three, pause, one, stop
[22:08:22] <BigJohnT> 3 is memory problems and 1 is ram refresh failure
[22:09:11] <BigJohnT> http://www.pcmech.com/article/beep-codes/
[22:09:23] <jmkasunich> http://www.bioscentral.com/beepcodes/phoenixbeep.htm
[22:09:31] <jmkasunich> "autosize dram"
[22:09:54] <jmkasunich> (my board has phoenix, not AMI)
[22:10:51] <jmkasunich> this thing has been sitting idle for a year, might just be dimm contacts
[22:11:03] <jmkasunich> I'll let it run overnight and see what happens, maybe try memtest
[22:11:17] <BigJohnT> sounds like you got a handle on it
[22:11:42] <BigJohnT> if that don't work I'd shoot it to put it out of its memory
[22:15:55] <BigJohnT> your link is much better...
[22:17:53] <alex_joni> yay.. finished a first part
[22:20:09] <BigJohnT> on what alex?
[22:21:32] <alex_joni> BigJohnT: wanted to build something like this http://imagebin.org/12227
[22:21:40] <alex_joni> but my CNC is way too small for that
[22:21:46] <alex_joni> so I started to do it by hand :)
[22:23:24] <BigJohnT> I'll be able to plasma that kind of stuff soon I hope
[22:23:39] <BigJohnT> what material are you using
[22:23:42] <alex_joni> I somehow doubt you can plasma it out of wood :)
[22:23:47] <alex_joni> some plywood
[22:23:53] <alex_joni> (scraps I found..)
[22:24:01] <alex_joni> http://imagebin.org/12264 <- kinda bad picture from my cell
[22:24:02] <BigJohnT> I'd have to put a router on there then...
[22:25:13] <BigJohnT> you have plans for that or are you laying it out by hand?
[22:25:37] <alex_joni> I even have ngc programs :)
[22:25:50] <BigJohnT> Sweet!
[22:25:53] <alex_joni> but for this I converted them to an image, and printed out to paper
[22:26:04] <alex_joni> then cut out the paper, traced with a pen
[22:26:19] <alex_joni> cut out with a fret saw
[22:26:27] <alex_joni> took me about 3 hours for that part
[22:26:29] <alex_joni> :/
[22:26:33] <BigJohnT> lots of fretting
[22:26:42] <BigJohnT> I can imagine
[22:27:04] <alex_joni> especially the outside contour
[22:27:30] <BigJohnT> It would be interesting to look at the ngc programs if they are available
[22:28:14] <alex_joni> let me find them
[22:28:21] <BigJohnT> ok
[22:30:48] <alex_joni> http://pastebin.ca/809454
[22:30:54] <alex_joni> that's one of the parts
[22:31:02] <alex_joni> bbl..
[22:31:48] <BigJohnT> is that in mm?
[22:31:54] <alex_joni> yup..
[22:32:09] <alex_joni> that's rescaled to match my tiny machine
[22:32:19] <BigJohnT> I was fixing to say it is a big part if it was inches
[22:32:27] <alex_joni> usually it's about 2-3x the size
[22:32:49] <alex_joni> about 1-2 feet wide
[22:33:01] <alex_joni> now I gotta run :)
[22:33:13] <BigJohnT> ok thanks
[22:43:38] <CIA-8> 03tissf 07TRUNK * 10emc2/docs/src/ (Master_HAL_fr.lyx Submakefile index.tmpl index_fr.tmpl): French translation
[22:43:42] <CIA-8> 03tissf 07TRUNK * 10emc2/docs/src/config/stepconf_fr.lyx: French translation
[22:43:42] <CIA-8> 03tissf 07TRUNK * 10emc2/docs/src/hal/ (8 files): French translation
[22:46:47] <eric_U> I need to get a better router
[22:46:51] <eric_U> mine lets my kids kill my network speed when they watch movies
[22:52:27] <jmkasunich> you need better kids
[22:52:37] <jmkasunich> * jmkasunich <-- curmudgon
[22:52:55] <eric_U> you got any?
[22:53:19] <jmkasunich> one stepson
[22:53:24] <jmkasunich> 24 and in the navy
[22:53:25] <eric_U> moved the router, helped my ping by a factor of 1000
[22:56:13] <BigJohnT> I just noticed that when using the EMC2 G code quick reference that the links from the first page do not work
[22:58:07] <eric_U> everybody knows the first page
[22:59:02] <jmkasunich> are you looking at the ref on the web, or one that is intstalled on your system?
[22:59:28] <BigJohnT> it is the file:///usr/share/doc/emc2/gcode.html one
[22:59:36] <BigJohnT> It was in the menu
[22:59:48] <jmkasunich> what version are you running?
[23:00:03] <BigJohnT> EMC?
[23:00:19] <eric_U> yes
[23:00:31] <BigJohnT> 2.2.2
[23:01:05] <jmkasunich> where do the links point to?
[23:01:46] <BigJohnT> the G0 one is http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.2/html/gcode_main.html#sec:G0:-Rapid-Linear
[23:02:01] <eric_U> link works for me
[23:02:40] <jmkasunich> works here too
[23:02:50] <eric_U> that's because we're special
[23:03:01] <jmkasunich> seems a little odd that an installed doc would link to online info instead of installed info
[23:03:02] <BigJohnT> hmmm, the tab says untitled and the screen is blank
[23:04:44] <BigJohnT> works on my windows box...
[23:05:08] <jmkasunich> "untitled" ?
[23:05:37] <jmkasunich> firefox I guess, never mind me
[23:05:47] <BigJohnT> yes the tab in firefox says (Untitled)
[23:06:04] <BigJohnT> is firefox a problem?
[23:06:11] <eric_U> no
[23:06:15] <jmkasunich> you have the quick ref open in firefox, and you right click on G0 and say "open in new tab" ?
[23:06:35] <BigJohnT> yep thats when i get a new blank tab
[23:07:00] <jmkasunich> and if you don't say to open in a new tab, just left click on it, what happens?
[23:07:17] <BigJohnT> nothing happens
[23:07:48] <jmkasunich> if you just hover the mouse over the link, it displays down in the bottom left...
[23:07:51] <eric_U> box is known to be connected to internet using linux?
[23:07:53] <jmkasunich> is that what you posted?
[23:07:55] <BigJohnT> it show the path down there
[23:08:05] <BigJohnT> yes
[23:08:12] <BigJohnT> google works
[23:08:12] <jmkasunich> really strange
[23:08:21] <BigJohnT> yea
[23:09:07] <jmkasunich> can you access http://www.linuxcnc.org/docview/html//gcode_main.html directly?
[23:09:34] <BigJohnT> yes
[23:09:40] <jmkasunich> I noticed the double / after /html and before gcode_main.html, I wonder if that is a problem?
[23:10:02] <BigJohnT> I drilled down from the main page and got to the G0 page ok
[23:10:23] <jmkasunich> thats exactly the same link!
[23:11:05] <BigJohnT> I know!
[23:11:13] <toastydeath> exclamation point!
[23:11:15] <eric_U> freaky!
[23:11:24] <BigJohnT> yea it worked yesterday
[23:11:51] <BigJohnT> maybe I need to reboot
[23:13:08] <jmkasunich> sigh
[23:13:16] <toastydeath> lol
[23:13:27] <jmkasunich> windows has brainwashed people
[23:13:27] <toastydeath> rebooting is never the answer
[23:13:32] <toastydeath> haha
[23:14:05] <jmkasunich> 18:13:25 up 87 days, 1:01, 5 users, load average: 0.43, 0.42, 0.81
[23:14:12] <jmkasunich> and I don't even consider that very high
[23:14:47] <skunkworks> our novell server was up for almost 2 years before a drive started acting flakey.
[23:15:28] <skunkworks> I will have to look - I bet it has been up for atleast 6 months so far.
[23:15:55] <skunkworks> we had a main breaker trip randomly..
[23:16:33] <skunkworks> odd walking into my office and it being totally quiet.
[23:17:08] <skunkworks> he is back - everyone be quiet
[23:17:35] <BigJohnT> This is the link from the quick g code page http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.2/html/gcode_main.html#sec:G0:-Rapid-Linear
[23:17:57] <BigJohnT> this is the link if I drill down from linuxcnc http://www.linuxcnc.org/docview/html//gcode_main.html#sec:G0:-Rapid-Linear
[23:18:10] <BigJohnT> the second one works
[23:18:34] <skunkworks> both work for me
[23:18:35] <jmkasunich> odd
[23:18:39] <jmkasunich> from here both work
[23:18:49] <jmkasunich> the difference is just the www, right?
[23:19:04] <jmkasunich> duh, no
[23:19:31] <skunkworks> //
[23:19:41] <jmkasunich> and 2.2 instead of docview
[23:19:45] <jmkasunich> but both work
[23:19:57] <BigJohnT> if i insert www. in front of linuxcnc it works
[23:20:14] <jmkasunich> ok, that seems like a DNS thing
[23:20:35] <toastydeath> both work for me
[23:20:45] <toastydeath> except the first one is a different page
[23:20:48] <BigJohnT> I might need to reboot my server that is where the modem is
[23:21:07] <BigJohnT> yea the first on is easier to read
[23:21:14] <jmkasunich> don't reboot anything
[23:21:16] <toastydeath> very much easier to read
[23:21:18] <BigJohnT> ok
[23:21:20] <jmkasunich> (unless your server is running windows)
[23:21:31] <skunkworks> heh
[23:21:32] <BigJohnT> yes it is windows 2000 pro
[23:21:39] <jmkasunich> lol
[23:21:45] <toastydeath> epic
[23:21:52] <BigJohnT> why is that
[23:22:00] <jmkasunich> you are browsing from a linux box though, right?
[23:22:05] <BigJohnT> yep
[23:22:18] <jmkasunich> open a shell, and try "dig www.linuxcnc.org" and then "dig linuxcnc.org"
[23:22:44] <jmkasunich> dig queries the DNS servers for the IP associated with that hostname
[23:22:58] <BigJohnT> ok
[23:23:01] <jmkasunich> if both don't give the same IP (or if one fails) something in DNS is messed up
[23:23:46] <jmkasunich> http://www.linuxcnc.org/docview/html//gcode_main.html
[23:23:48] <BigJohnT> both are the same IP's
[23:23:56] <jmkasunich> really weird
[23:24:20] <jmkasunich> if adding www fixes it, but DNS returns the right IP whether www is there or not, what else could make that happen?
[23:24:22] <SWPadnos> on my Win2k machine, I can load either URL, but they're somewhat different
[23:24:52] <SWPadnos> the www... url has the theme stuff around it, but the other one doesn't
[23:24:53] <BigJohnT> the docview one show up ok
[23:24:55] <jmkasunich> SWPadnos: right, one is being viewed thru a joomla wrapper
[23:25:05] <SWPadnos> they should both be. I'll check into it later this evening
[23:26:21] <toastydeath> is the joomla wrapper the ugly one or the easy to read one
[23:26:26] <BigJohnT> doing dig http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.2/html/gcode_main.html#sec:G0:-Rapid-Linear came up N A
[23:26:28] <toastydeath> keep the easy to read on!
[23:26:30] <toastydeath> *one
[23:26:33] <SkinnypuppY34> I'm poking at my 17" clausing improving things since it was an old production machine. Anyhow there's a few small high spots in the tailstocks mt5 receiver. I've blued it and lightly inserted a new mt5 adapter to see the highs two at 1oclock and 7 oclock from a damaged toolshank. . Question mt5 reamer, turn a mt5 lap or handscrape ID anyone?
[23:26:51] <toastydeath> mt5 reamer.
[23:27:09] <jmkasunich> BigJohnT: dig maps hostnames to IP addresses - you don't give it a complete URL
[23:27:17] <alex_joni> dig linuxcnc.org
[23:27:19] <BigJohnT> ok didn't know
[23:27:20] <SkinnypuppY34> K just haven't done this repair b4 thanks toast
[23:27:21] <alex_joni> dig www.linuxcnc.org
[23:27:28] <jmkasunich> "www.linuxcnc.org" is the host
[23:27:39] <toastydeath> it's a tailstock, you don't need a lap or hone
[23:27:53] <BigJohnT> dig worked on that
[23:27:57] <alex_joni> jmkasunich: might get different responses (dig only checks the first cache)
[23:28:01] <alex_joni> BigJohnT: both?
[23:28:10] <BigJohnT> yes
[23:28:10] <alex_joni> try "dig www.linuxcnc.org +trace"
[23:28:16] <BigJohnT> ok
[23:28:39] <SkinnypuppY34> ty again toast ... back to dirty work
[23:28:40] <alex_joni> and "dig www.linuxcnc.org @ip_of_your_local_dns
[23:29:15] <BigJohnT> how do I find the ip of my local dns?
[23:29:27] <SWPadnos> oh right, duh. the URLs aren't the same (aside from missing www.)
[23:29:36] <alex_joni> SWPadnos: docs vs. docview
[23:29:48] <alex_joni> they have the same structure, operate on the same files
[23:29:56] <BigJohnT> dig came up with
[23:30:10] <alex_joni> docs is a simple html interface, docview is a joomla wrapper
[23:30:17] <alex_joni> BigJohnT: that sounds busted
[23:30:17] <SWPadnos> alex_joni, right -I noticed that one was viewed through joomla (and jmk had pointed out)
[23:30:35] <alex_joni> just to clarify.. double or triple "/" don't cause any issues :)
[23:30:40] <SWPadnos> but didn't notice the different URLs - so I thought it could be a mapping thing with www.linuxcnc.org vs linuxcnc.org
[23:30:56] <alex_joni> SWPadnos: nope.. don't think so
[23:31:10] <SWPadnos> me either, now that I noticed docview vs. not :)
[23:31:20] <alex_joni> I only know of one difference between linuxcnc.org and www.linuxcnc.org, and that's some internal joomla thingie
[23:31:36] <alex_joni> (the editor fails to set URL links in pages when you use the short addy)
[23:31:38] <SWPadnos> good, because it's dinnertime here :)
[23:32:30] <BigJohnT> we must be in the same time zone
[23:33:25] <BigJohnT> I'll try and reboot both machines and see what happens
[23:34:49] <toastydeath> lol
[23:34:51] <toastydeath> him and his reboots
[23:35:02] <toastydeath> problem solving steps:
[23:35:05] <toastydeath> 1) reboot
[23:35:07] <toastydeath> 2) test
[23:35:11] <toastydeath> 3) did it work? no?
[23:35:15] <toastydeath> 4) maybe another reboot
[23:40:55] <alex_joni> BigJohnT: let me guess.. no improvement?
[23:40:58] <BigJohnT> This one is blank http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.2/html/gcode_main.html#sec:G0:-Rapid-Linear
[23:41:13] <BigJohnT> but if I shorten it up to http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.2/html/
[23:41:16] <BigJohnT> it works
[23:41:25] <cradek> * cradek takes a 7" cut through 4" of aluminum...
[23:41:48] <BigJohnT> If I just delete the sec it still the same
[23:42:08] <alex_joni> what if you put a www. infront of it?
[23:42:20] <alex_joni> with the #sec & all
[23:42:24] <alex_joni> cradek: ouch
[23:42:35] <BigJohnT> let me try that
[23:42:59] <BigJohnT> yep that brings it up fine
[23:43:42] <BigJohnT> alex_joni: yes I got a glass of wine so things are improving
[23:44:02] <skunkworks> * skunkworks thinks cradek should expand on what he said
[23:44:30] <cradek> (horizontal band saw)
[23:44:38] <skunkworks> did you alread have one?
[23:44:43] <skunkworks> or new toy?
[23:45:40] <BigJohnT> from this page http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.2/html/ if I click on The RS274NGC language nothing happens
[23:45:50] <BigJohnT> If i click on the (fr) that comes up fine
[23:46:00] <alex_joni> BigJohnT: do you have a proxy?
[23:46:15] <BigJohnT> I don't know
[23:46:23] <alex_joni> check firefox settings
[23:46:42] <cradek> I have had it for a long time but this is a big cut for it
[23:46:49] <cradek> I'll have to cut from both ends I think
[23:47:07] <alex_joni> BigJohnT: Tools->Options->Advanced->Network->Settings
[23:47:23] <BigJohnT> no proxy just direct connection to the internet
[23:48:09] <alex_joni> BigJohnT: maybe your isp routes you through a proxy then
[23:48:10] <jmkasunich> cradek: what you making?
[23:48:18] <jmkasunich> besides sawdust?
[23:48:26] <alex_joni> BigJohnT: sounds like a stale copy of the document in a proxy on the way
[23:48:44] <alex_joni> BigJohnT: try wget http://linuxcnc.org/.../ in a terminal
[23:48:53] <BigJohnT> ok
[23:48:58] <alex_joni> if that doesn't work either.. then something is really borken there
[23:50:12] <BigJohnT> ERROR 404: Not Found
[23:50:29] <cradek> Z axis mount
[23:50:32] <alex_joni> you sure got the right link?
[23:51:17] <BigJohnT> yep
[23:53:08] <BigJohnT> If I do http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.2/html/gcode_main.html from my linux machine it is blank
[23:53:18] <BigJohnT> if I do it from the windows machine it works
[23:53:36] <BigJohnT> the linux box connects to the internet through the windows machine
[23:53:52] <alex_joni> BigJohnT: I guess the issue is somewhere in the windows machine then..
[23:54:07] <alex_joni> but I can't help you there
[23:54:33] <alex_joni> if it's what I think it is, it'll fix itself after a longer period of time (stale doc inside a proxy)
[23:54:35] <jmkasunich> argh
[23:54:46] <BigJohnT> ok
[23:55:26] <skunkworks> can you do a ipconfig /flushdns on the 2000 machine.
[23:55:31] <jmkasunich> harbor freight 4x6 band saw can't cut a 6" slice of a 16 x 16 sheet
[23:56:36] <cradek> this is a JET. from pre-HF days
[23:57:01] <cradek> I don't think it was expensive. probably chinese. but it cuts square.
[23:57:05] <jmkasunich> mine is HF
[23:57:24] <jmkasunich> I have a piece that is 16 x 16 x 3/32, and I want a 6 x 16 slice
[23:57:27] <jmkasunich> (vertical mode)
[23:57:52] <jmkasunich> my kingdom for a foot shear
[23:57:59] <BigJohnT> use a table saw
[23:58:05] <cradek> you can get that, but the other 10" will be in 3 pieces
[23:58:15] <jmkasunich> BigJohnT: excellent idea
[23:58:30] <jmkasunich> I've cut aluminum that way before, I was having a brain fart
[23:58:36] <cradek> with the blade on backward?
[23:58:50] <BigJohnT> I do it all the time have the blade all the way up so you have the min number of teeth contacting the alum
[23:59:01] <BigJohnT> no right way around use a carbide blade
[23:59:01] <skunkworks> they tried that with a hand circle saw at work.. I walked away fast.
[23:59:05] <eric_U> at work the shear is in the hallway, but they locked it up
[23:59:22] <eric_U> the reason being that one of the faculty has 12 kids, and she can't control them