#emc | Logs for 2007-11-23

[00:38:34] <dmess> heee haa.... 1st storm of the year... i call it the CULL... get the maximum # of morons off the road in 1 day.
[01:28:47] <cradek> unfortunately it's only a cull if it permanently removes them.
[01:33:26] <jlmjvm> cradek:if i make mods to my /usr/bin/axis file can that file also be used on a differant machine with the same configuration?
[01:33:55] <cradek> sure, that file is always the same if you have the same version of the emc package installed
[01:34:02] <cradek> however, you will lose the change when you update
[01:34:05] <jlmjvm> excellent
[01:34:29] <cradek> if it's a useful change for everyone, consider contributing it
[01:37:31] <jlmjvm> so far its just simple stuff like changing run from "r" to "Alt-R" or spindle fwd from "F9" to "Control-F9",keeps newbies from turning things on accidentally
[01:38:18] <cradek> ok I see
[01:38:46] <jlmjvm> working my way towards my goal of a toolset button
[01:39:50] <jlmjvm> also changing most commands to capitol letters,like the help menu shows
[01:41:15] <jlmjvm> but tell me,in order to actually place a new widget on the axis gui i have to do that in the source code,correct?Or can that be done from the file by juat adding something?
[01:41:27] <jlmjvm> just
[01:41:56] <cradek> I don't understand the distinction you're making between the file and the source code
[01:44:21] <cradek> brb
[01:45:02] <jlmjvm> let me rephrase,can a new widget be placed on the axis gui by adding info to the /usr/bin/axis file,or does that have to be done in whatever makes the file
[01:45:06] <jlmjvm> k
[03:35:34] <toastydeath_> fff
[06:23:12] <LawrenceG> turkeys of the world UNITE.... preferably next to the mashed potatoes and gravy
[06:34:44] <renesis> this is your cat. on turkey.
[06:34:47] <renesis> http://www.darkertechnologies.com/image/best_cat.jpg
[14:27:15] <jlmjvm> alex_joni:my latency numbers are really good again and were great all day yesterday,but its less than 50 degrees in here
[14:28:13] <jlmjvm> earlier in the week when it was warmer i had terrible latency,could that be the mb chipset getting warm
[14:30:50] <jlmjvm> i noticed yesterday when i was changing stuff that i never got a rt error when i started emc
[15:19:31] <jlmjvm> jepler:what editor are you using for python?would the emacs 21 be ok to use?
[15:34:02] <xemet> hello
[15:34:38] <xemet> someone could tell me what file should I look in order to translate the new "StepConf" utility in italian?
[15:34:51] <xemet> is it possible to include the translation in the next release?
[15:51:50] <alex_joni> xemet: sure... but you need to hurry :)
[15:51:59] <alex_joni> next release will be this weekend probably
[15:52:10] <jepler> jlmjvm: yes emacs should be able to edit text files
[15:52:14] <alex_joni> translation should be done just like translating AXIS
[15:52:16] <jepler> xemet: axis.pot
[15:53:11] <xemet> so, it is the same file for Axis and StepConf
[15:53:14] <jepler> yes
[15:53:18] <xemet> ok, thanks
[15:54:58] <jlmjvm> thanks jepler,already have idle downloaded,will get the emac now
[15:56:44] <xemet> is that: http://cvs.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/cvsweb.cgi/emc2/src/po/ the right files?
[15:57:32] <xemet> where is the original (english) axis.pot?
[15:57:57] <alex_joni> there is no original (english) axis.pot
[15:58:12] <alex_joni> when you make in the sources, the text gets extracted out of the software components
[15:58:29] <alex_joni> and the .pot gets created
[15:59:31] <xemet> ok thanks
[15:59:31] <jepler> src/po/README says what to do to get the initial .po for a new translation
[15:59:59] <xemet> because I think in the old I do not have the stepconf part...
[16:00:57] <jepler> if you have an axis_YOURLANG.po file, then you should follow the instructions a little further down in src/po/README to update your .po file with new and modified strings in the .pot. (second paragraph)
[16:04:51] <xemet> is that the readme: http://cvs.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/cvsweb.cgi/~checkout~/emc2/src/po/README?rev=;content-type=text%2Fplain
[16:05:22] <alex_joni> msgmerge -U xx_axis.po axis.pot
[16:05:38] <alex_joni> in your case it_axis.po
[16:06:40] <xemet> will try
[17:33:15] <Ziegler> hey gents... what is the name of the script that takes true type and converts it to g-code?
[17:34:13] <alex_joni> ttt
[17:34:32] <alex_joni> truetype-tracer
[17:34:41] <Ziegler> danke
[17:34:47] <alex_joni> http://www.timeguy.com/cradek/truetype
[17:34:52] <alex_joni> keine ursache
[17:35:07] <Ziegler> have it on the box... just couldnt rember what it was called
[17:35:11] <Ziegler> cya...
[18:02:03] <tomp> walmart 200$ mini-itx a candidate for emc? http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.do?product_id=7754614#Specifications
[18:02:49] <cradek> tomp: the only way I know to find out costs $200
[18:03:06] <tomp> :) ? return policy?
[18:03:18] <tomp> may try
[18:03:45] <alex_joni> tomp: ask if it has a parport first
[18:04:04] <tomp> looking at everex's home now
[18:05:48] <alex_joni> (1) Parallel Port,
[18:05:53] <alex_joni> might be ok :)
[18:06:25] <alex_joni> too bd it's ubuntu 7.10 on it ;)
[18:06:54] <tomp> right, got pport, no pci slots :(
[18:11:09] <jmkasunich> never thought I'd find myself saying this, but "Yea WalMart"
[18:11:51] <alex_joni> 200$ sounds like a good deal
[18:13:10] <jmkasunich> getting Linux into the hands of the masses is the good deal
[18:13:10] <tomp> reported to have a free pci slot, and the mobo is VIA ID-PCM7G ITX mb (not mini-ITX) read at http://www.silentpcreview.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=44307
[18:14:14] <tomp> conflicting reports... :(
[18:14:45] <jmkasunich> take a screwdriver to your local walmart?
[18:15:03] <alex_joni> get one there :)
[18:15:15] <jmkasunich> that would cost money
[18:15:22] <alex_joni> ask if you can try out the screwdriver :D
[18:16:04] <tomp> if it is what 'wired' updated it's claim to be then it has 2 pci http://www.via.com.tw/en/initiatives/empowered/pc2500_mainboard/index.jsp
[18:17:08] <jmkasunich> if walmart is selling it as an "appliance" for newbs, they could easily be changing the mobo and other features as costs and availablity change
[18:17:24] <jmkasunich> so all the reports could be correct - each reviewer got a different version of the machine
[18:43:49] <jlmjvm> i had a laptop with a via 1.4 processor and it was terribly slow
[19:00:39] <tomp> got the other parts? then $60 with free shpg http://www.clubit.com/product_detail.cfm?itemno=A4842001#
[19:24:41] <alex_joni> http://www.techamok.com/?pid=3693
[19:25:29] <alex_joni> (the cables might be a problem)
[19:56:08] <alex_joni> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JX3VmDgiFnY
[20:07:53] <JymmmEMC> hola
[20:08:09] <LawrenceG> hi JymmmEMC
[20:09:35] <alex_joni> hahahaha http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tvGVir25EJc&eurl=http://www.techamok.com/
[20:09:47] <JymmmEMC> LawrenceG: well, looks like you didn't get arrested
[20:11:44] <LawrenceG> too cheap to make bail!
[20:11:59] <JymmmEMC> spent it all on presents huh?
[20:13:31] <LawrenceG> sorry I didnt get you one :{.... I am busy wiring my oem750 control box
[20:14:11] <LawrenceG> do your 750's get warm?
[20:15:02] <LawrenceG> I am wondering how much I need to heatsink them.... I have them bolted to a rack chassis floor, but no heat sink
[20:15:10] <JymmmEMC> LawrenceG: WIP, so I don't know, but I have them mounted on a 1/4" aluminim plat that's apx 7" x 12"
[20:15:18] <JymmmEMC> with heatsink grease
[20:16:08] <JymmmEMC> LawrenceG: I think I'm going to buy this breakout board... http://www.cnc4pc.com/Store/osc/product_info.php?cPath=33&products_id=45
[20:16:38] <LawrenceG> ok... I will try it.... my steppers are in the 3 amp range, so less than 1/2 the drive capacity... p/s puts out about 48 volts, so agian only about 1/2 the capacity... so if I'm lucky 1/4 the max heat
[20:16:48] <JymmmEMC> None of the BB I've seen with on-board relays can handle more than 10A
[20:17:34] <JymmmEMC> LawrenceG: I haven't powered my mine other than self-test, but if you want REAL heat sink for them.... hang on...
[20:18:31] <LawrenceG> I have seen the stock heat sinks
[20:19:18] <JymmmEMC> LawrenceG: http://cgi.ebay.com/HEATSINK-ALUMINUM-EXTRUSION-12-BIG-AMP-MATERIAL_W0QQitemZ170171724736QQihZ007QQcategoryZ31489QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
[20:19:36] <LawrenceG> if things get too warm, I can always bolt a heatsink on the bottom of the case
[20:19:50] <JymmmEMC> this guy has been selling this stuff for months, and is 100% positive
[20:20:13] <LawrenceG> nice
[20:20:13] <JymmmEMC> He'll cut it as you like it too
[20:20:48] <JymmmEMC> If you want a total of 24" in 3 8" pieces, no problem and no extra charge
[20:21:36] <JymmmEMC> base is 3/8" thick
[20:22:27] <LawrenceG> probably a nice little ebay business
[20:22:49] <JymmmEMC> probably snags it from work.
[20:22:49] <LawrenceG> he has a lot of ++ feedback
[20:23:36] <LawrenceG> "unlimited supply" until I get caught
[20:24:09] <JymmmEMC> He probably gets it at cost, especially if he works in a foundary
[20:25:18] <LawrenceG> custom extrusions are not that expensive if you are willing to buy several hundred feet
[20:26:28] <JymmmEMC> HE HAS to work in a foundry... 6063 alloyT5 temper
[20:28:59] <JymmmEMC> LawrenceG: So, if you don't already have heatsink, I think those would be perfect, as per the manual you only need 2" spacing cneter-to-center.
[20:29:18] <JymmmEMC> really only need 8" for three drives
[20:29:55] <JymmmEMC> LawrenceG: I was thinking of getting 24" cut into 8" lengths
[20:31:54] <LawrenceG> drives are about 1 1/2" wide.... a slice the same size as the drive would probably be lots of heat sink... one is only dealing with the fet switching losses
[20:32:39] <JymmmEMC> LawrenceG: the manual tells you the heatsink mounting spacing... minimum 2"
[20:33:24] <JymmmEMC> LawrenceG: I wanted ONE heatsink for all the drives, easier to mount.
[20:33:42] <LawrenceG> is that because of mechanical or thermal issues???? I am not sure
[20:34:17] <JymmmEMC> what's that?
[20:35:11] <LawrenceG> I have mine mounted on about 2 1/4" centers so there is room for wiring between them
[20:35:44] <LawrenceG> I just took my available panel space and spaced things so 4 drives would fit
[20:36:50] <JymmmEMC> minimum 6" from the the far end mounting holes?
[20:37:02] <JymmmEMC> err 8" I mean
[20:37:24] <LawrenceG> ?
[20:39:52] <JymmmEMC> +--------------------------------------+
[20:39:53] <JymmmEMC> | o o o <--2"-> o |
[20:39:53] <JymmmEMC> | |
[20:39:53] <JymmmEMC> | |
[20:39:53] <JymmmEMC> | |
[20:39:53] <JymmmEMC> | |
[20:39:55] <JymmmEMC> | o o o o |
[20:39:57] <JymmmEMC> +--------------------------------------+
[20:39:59] <JymmmEMC> |<--------- 8" ----------->|
[20:40:53] <LawrenceG> yea... mine are 2 1/4 between hole centers, so a little wider.... just mounted on Al chassis... not heatsink
[20:41:18] <JymmmEMC> I mounted mine on just 1/4" plate
[20:41:29] <JymmmEMC> It's what I had available to me.
[20:41:51] <JymmmEMC> I think I gave it 2.5" between each drive
[20:42:24] <JymmmEMC> and lots of heatsink grease
[20:43:42] <JymmmEMC> they tell you EXACTLY where to measure the temp from as well.
[20:46:27] <LawrenceG> http://imagebin.ca/view/JXV3cF.html
[20:47:01] <LawrenceG> lots ow wiring to do, but everything is mounted now
[20:47:35] <LawrenceG> a recycle rack mount box
[20:48:23] <JymmmEMC> Hey that works, I had a hell of a time finding a metal enclosure without costing an arm and a leg
[20:49:04] <JymmmEMC> what size are your caps?
[20:49:10] <LawrenceG> I had a smaller hoffman box, but things just got too tight
[20:49:27] <SkinnypuppY34> That looks good , so did that heatsink on ebay. I used something similar from an audio amp
[20:49:36] <JymmmEMC> I have 3900uF @ 400V, so they're 2.5" diameter suckers
[20:49:53] <LawrenceG> I think they are 6300uF each
[20:49:58] <JymmmEMC> voltage?
[20:50:55] <LawrenceG> they came with the transformer.... It looks like they were used for an audio amp project as it was originally wired for +-35v
[20:50:56] <JymmmEMC> LawrenceG: Also note, the TOP of the drives have tuning pots, so make sure that you can get to them if needed.
[20:51:15] <SkinnypuppY34> http://imagebin.org/11955 , http://imagebin.org/11956 Barely runs warm to the touch without the fan .
[20:51:54] <JymmmEMC> SkinnypuppY34: Damn dude, you must be asian!
[20:52:07] <LawrenceG> the caps are 50v I believe... right on the edge as I measured 48vdc no load
[20:52:14] <JymmmEMC> Only someone asian can pack crap together that tightly =)
[20:52:23] <SkinnypuppY34> Naah did car audio for years
[20:52:43] <SkinnypuppY34> I'll take that as a compliment though
[20:52:43] <JymmmEMC> SkinnypuppY34: I'd hate to see your hands (scars)
[20:53:00] <SkinnypuppY34> I can't deny that
[20:53:17] <JymmmEMC> SkinnypuppY34: Nah, haven't you ever bought something and never could get it back in the box... I hate that! lol
[20:54:12] <JymmmEMC> I think I'm going to buy this breakout board, any comments? ... http://www.cnc4pc.com/Store/osc/product_info.php?cPath=33&products_id=45
[20:54:15] <SkinnypuppY34> Sure enough ! But I have been happy with the geckos
[20:54:49] <JymmmEMC> SkinnypuppY34: Oh I dont have an issue with the drives you use, just the compactness would drive be nuts =)
[20:55:04] <SkinnypuppY34> ;o)
[20:55:15] <JymmmEMC> I'd be cussing up a storm the first time I have to test or rewire it
[20:56:18] <JymmmEMC> LawrenceG: I like your use of the DIN rail terminal strips. I never considered that.
[20:56:35] <LawrenceG> that BOB looks pretty good JymmmEMC .. not sure how they can make it for that price.. the connectors cost more than they want for the whole board
[20:57:31] <JymmmEMC> LawrenceG: Yeah, I WAS going to buy the fancy one with VFD and charge pump, but I've heard questionable operations of it.
[20:58:14] <LawrenceG> I like the din rail stuff for all the heavy 120vac wiring... Most of the stuff came from the junk box... I have been hoarding some of it for years.. I fuigured it was time to use it.
[20:58:37] <LawrenceG> It would be very expensive to duplicate!
[20:59:01] <JymmmEMC> LawrenceG: no doubt, I want to install an 120vac outlet too split into two seperate controls.
[20:59:41] <JymmmEMC> I was VERY LUCKY and I found an IEC power cord and panel mount socket both rated at 15A
[21:00:06] <JymmmEMC> the socket has all the EMI filtering in it too
[21:00:49] <LawrenceG> note the 3 plugs on the back.... one for spindle motor, switched, one for the computer/monitor non-switched, and one extra that is one only when control power is on
[21:02:17] <JymmmEMC> I dont really have the room for three outlets, so what I'm going todo is snap the strips off a sinlge outlet so I can control each socket seperately
[21:03:14] <JymmmEMC> I am STILL trying to figure out the control voltages and whatnot for the REAL estop circuit
[21:03:16] <LawrenceG> that was the nice thing with the rack chassis... lots of rear panel room
[21:03:38] <JymmmEMC> My biggest issue is I can't machine metal,
[21:04:20] <JymmmEMC> I'm probably going to mount EVERYTHING up front
[21:04:46] <JymmmEMC> I still need to find panel mount lamps.
[21:05:04] <JymmmEMC> I want to see at a glance what everything is doing.
[21:05:50] <JymmmEMC> Industrial controls (like you have) and just too darn expensive, I'll use toggle switches instead
[21:06:13] <LawrenceG> I have a table with the machine mounted on it... the rack just sits on a couple of pieces of angle iron suspended under a shelf.. the estop and drive disable button are remotely mounted
[21:07:19] <SkinnypuppY34> Have either of you done a joystick or jog pendant?
[21:08:01] <JymmmEMC> SkinnypuppY34: I used an external NUMPAD as a pseudo pendant (for jogging) works great
[21:08:10] <LawrenceG> not me, although some of the new game controllers have interesting I/O for a remote
[21:08:40] <JymmmEMC> SkinnypuppY34: but I think you want something like this http://www.cnc4pc.com/Store/osc/product_info.php?products_id=158
[21:09:23] <JymmmEMC> SkinnypuppY34: but I did this instead http://www.backshop.nl/uploadfoto/KinesisNUMPAD%20for%20MiniTypeITK-591.jpg
[21:09:51] <JymmmEMC> PGUP and PGDN being Z axis
[21:09:53] <SkinnypuppY34> Now thats nice. Keyboard is just awkward doing touch off
[21:10:50] <JymmmEMC> SkinnypuppY34: Well I mentioned to cradek or jepler a long time ago of incoroarating a normal speed/slow speed option like TurboCNC has
[21:11:27] <JymmmEMC> I remapped the '5' as the slow speed jog
[21:11:44] <JymmmEMC> so 5+PGDN would move very slowly
[21:12:16] <JymmmEMC> 5 alone would move normal speed (as set in config file)
[21:12:32] <SkinnypuppY34> I'll make note of that, the keypad is in my practical budget. Damn nice pendant though
[21:12:56] <JymmmEMC> $20 vs $180
[21:27:31] <dmess> hi all
[21:39:01] <JymmmEMC> howdy dmess
[21:39:36] <alex_joni> good night all
[21:53:30] <dmess> how's development on the best hsm control on the planet going??
[21:54:33] <JymmmEMC> Night alex
[21:59:59] <dmess> http://www.countryrain.com/WhatIsACSM.htm anyone ever seen one of these???
[22:02:55] <SkinnypuppY34> Neat
[22:08:14] <JymmmEMC> I saw an industrial sock knitting machine... pretty amazing feat of machinery
[22:08:29] <dmess> i wonder if i could get EMC2 to run it and make strings a socks.... My ganma isnt getting any younger
[22:09:00] <dmess> these were war effort.. for ww1
[22:10:10] <dmess> not cheap.. for old equipment... 1000-1500 bucks for anything with wool on it...
[22:12:44] <dmess> Jymmm.. there are 48 of them on ebay.... but that machine scares me.... i'd be socked IN
[22:20:51] <dmess> they also lack motors....
[22:27:55] <Unit41> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PPsUmhqncAg&NR=1
[22:41:51] <Hugomatic> I'm trying to create a simple python gcode export for inkscape paths. In my script, I get all the control points from the selected path, but I don't know how to interpolate. Any ideas?
[22:43:30] <cradek> are they spline control points? what order are they?
[22:46:23] <Hugomatic> cradek: I get the path information from the SVG data. They are "commands" and params
[22:46:44] <cradek> sorry that doesn't mean anything to me
[22:46:56] <cradek> I don't understand what you have to work with
[22:50:10] <Hugomatic> cradek: Paths look like this "d="M 574.28571 350.93362 A 230.00000 230.00000 0 1 1 114.28571,350.93362 A 230.00000 230.00000 0 1 1 574.28571 350.93362 z" M commands are followed by x and y coordinates.
[22:51:03] <Hugomatic> cradek: C commands have 4 parameters, so they must be control points. Z commands are ignored
[22:52:26] <cradek> 4 points is probably a cubic spline
[22:52:49] <cradek> so you just have to interpolate using the usual parametric formula for cubic splines
[22:53:33] <cradek> which is A(1-t)^3 + 3Bt(1-t)^2 + 3Ct^2(1-t) + Dt^3, for t in [0,1]
[22:53:49] <cradek> with input points A,B,C,D
[22:54:18] <Hugomatic> cradek: wow. Great stuff.
[22:54:25] <cradek> for gcode, you have to either fit lines or arcs
[22:54:44] <cradek> lines are easy, just pick some number of lines per cubic spline for the simplest implementation
[22:54:59] <Hugomatic> cradek: I'm thinking lines must be simpler
[22:55:09] <Hugomatic> :-)
[22:55:09] <cradek> yes but less smooth of course
[22:56:30] <dmess> set an intol/outol... and MANY components are still made that way
[22:56:50] <Hugomatic> cradek: thank you for your help.
[22:56:54] <cradek> sure
[22:58:53] <Hugomatic> cradek: one last thing... whats your prefered vector to gcode tool?
[22:59:18] <cradek> I guess I don't have one
[23:01:42] <Hugomatic> cradek: I mean, I can't find anything to convert from svg to gcode that is open source and runs on EMC Ubuntu.
[23:02:04] <cradek> then it's great that you are going to write it
[23:02:55] <Hugomatic> cradek: but I have a very strong feeling that I'm reinventing a wheel.
[23:03:54] <cradek> don't be too sure
[23:04:16] <cradek> as far as I know there aren't a lot of vector/gcode tools
[23:06:06] <Hugomatic> Then that's encouraging. I'll be happy to help in that area. I can't wait to try that interpolation equation.
[23:06:23] <cradek> cool.
[23:06:30] <cradek> lots of info online I bet
[23:06:42] <cradek> also, jepler did some work with "biarcs" (smooth arc fitting)
[23:06:52] <cradek> I don't know if he still has the code though
[23:14:17] <dmess> yes... APT360 does alot on that wheel
[23:15:54] <dmess> if things are parametric/mathamatical.. she's sweet
[23:28:10] <jepler> http://axis.unpy.net/01171767993 <-- biarcs in python
[23:29:53] <cradek> cool
[23:30:05] <cradek> jepler: you should redo that velocity plot (that is fixed)
[23:35:39] <jepler> now it looks perrrrrfect
[23:36:12] <dmess> sweet info bro'
[23:37:10] <Hugomatic> jepler: nice biarcs.
[23:41:15] <jepler> also updated the .py file to have a GPL license block (it had none)
[23:49:21] <cradek> whee, that plot does look nice.