#emc | Logs for 2007-08-31

[00:00:36] <skyfox00> time to go back to slackware and try to get the cvs version working...
[00:05:03] <skunkworks> history channel has a ship building show - huge cnc plasma
[00:06:04] <skyfox00> I bet they do a better job than a mexican... (*puts on flame retardant suit*)
[00:09:03] <skyfox00> ok, I think the communication errors were due to the cable...
[00:15:33] <skunkworks> how long was the cable? I have found that parrallel zip drive cables work good - the are about 2 ft
[00:27:06] <skyfox00> the cable is around 3-4 feet long, it came with an old(new many years ago) parallel scaner...
[00:27:48] <skyfox00> the LED is still fading in/out and no com errors...
[00:28:13] <skyfox00> lets see if it will unload/reload...
[00:28:50] <skyfox00> cool!
[00:30:24] <skyfox00> can I do 'make install' to install the cvs version even though its compiled(configured) with 'run-in-place'?
[00:30:59] <ds2> don't think so
[00:31:13] <skyfox00> ok
[00:34:53] <jepler> skyfox00: you should probably 'make clean', 'configure' and 'make' if you are going to change configure options like --enable-run-in-place
[00:35:10] <SWPadnos> you use "sudo make setuid" to "install" run-in-place
[00:35:21] <jepler> you might get away with just configure and make but I don't recommend it
[00:35:44] <skyfox00> yeah, thats what I am doing/did(make clean,configure,make...)
[00:36:13] <skyfox00> and now as soon as I get the old version cleaned out...
[00:41:26] <skyfox00> emc keeps causing kernel 'Oops', is that normal?
[00:41:30] <fenn> no
[00:42:34] <fenn> * fenn highly suspects the patched kernel
[00:42:41] <skyfox00> * skyfox00 agrees
[00:43:05] <cradek> is the oops in ipipe-something?
[00:45:09] <skyfox00> no, its kinda cryptic... I cant tell whats it in... will reboot and try agian...
[00:46:56] <skyfox00> thats why I want to find a kernel that is prepatched and is known to work(is stable) that I can compile the the nvidia driver for, etc...
[00:47:31] <cradek> the binary nvidia driver and realtime are incompatible
[00:48:30] <skyfox00> um, I had to compile the nvidia driver, but to do so, I need the source for the kernel...(nvidia driver/kernel module)
[00:49:04] <cradek> I understand
[00:49:20] <cradek> last I knew, you can't use that and have acceptable realtime performance
[00:49:37] <cradek> you can use the vesa driver but it performs badly
[00:50:13] <cradek> best to use a different video card
[00:50:23] <skyfox00> so I might just be beating a dead horse trying to get emc running on that computer...
[00:50:26] <cradek> older matrox work great for me
[00:50:56] <skyfox00> isn't there a way to run emc without X?
[00:51:12] <cradek> sure that can be done in various ways
[00:51:27] <skyfox00> I saw one of the interfaces runs in an xterm...
[00:51:31] <cradek> right
[00:52:05] <cradek> you miss some nice features that way though.
[00:53:40] <skyfox00> oh rats, when I run emc and tell it to load the lathe-pluto it fails and says 'ImportError: No module name ext'...
[00:54:06] <cradek> ext?
[00:54:28] <skyfox00> the offending line: import xml.dom.ext
[00:54:46] <skyfox00> python issues....
[00:55:11] <Adam> Hi guys
[00:56:32] <cradek> skyfox00: on my system that might come from the package python-libxml2
[00:56:40] <cradek> hi adam
[00:58:05] <skyfox00> ok, axis wants vcpparse, who wants xml.dom.ext
[00:58:32] <jepler> skyfox00: another option is to comment out the PYVCP= line in the inifile
[00:58:49] <skyfox00> what does pyvcp do?
[00:59:01] <jepler> it shows the X and Z pid outputs and the spindle feedback speed, I think
[00:59:04] <cradek> gives a panel that can interface with hal
[00:59:11] <jepler> in the specific case of pyvcp that is
[00:59:16] <jepler> er, of lathe-pluto
[00:59:24] <fenn> it doesnt have anything to do with pluto
[00:59:33] <jepler> in that specific emc configuration ..
[00:59:37] <jepler> I'll say what I mean here in a second
[00:59:37] <Adam> So I have ordered my Mesa boards,a VFD, and a bunch of DIN-rail mountable relays and Feed-through terminal. Getting ready for the big build!
[00:59:40] <cradek> it's just stuff I wanted on my lathe
[00:59:48] <cradek> Adam: sounds exciting
[01:00:02] <cradek> Adam: get some of those parts for me too please
[01:00:12] <skyfox00> same here...
[01:00:25] <skyfox00> * skyfox00 grins
[01:00:31] <cradek> I got my 10" lcd today that should go on the bridgeport
[01:00:41] <Adam> yeah should be a good project, wokring on my pendant right now, adding coolant, rapid and axis buttons to the standard pendant I have right now.
[01:01:01] <Adam> It will be a beast.
[01:01:46] <Adam> I will try and blog the build, it will be of use to somebody. Hopefully someone wanting to do an anilam crusader upgrade.
[01:01:55] <skyfox00> when i do: halrun -I pluto.hal.... it says 'ERROR: parameter or pin 'pluto-servo.encoder-2-scale' not found
[01:02:33] <cradek> some of those pin names were standardized in trunk. you will have to update your hal file or use one from trunk
[01:02:52] <skyfox00> should some of those dashes '-' be dots '.' ?
[01:02:57] <cradek> yes
[01:03:27] <skyfox00> ok, thats the problem...
[01:04:29] <jepler> skyfox00: http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?UpdatingConfigurationsForDevelopmentVersions is the page that summarizes incompatabilities between the current development and the 2.1 version -- I think this particular item is on there
[01:04:39] <jepler> 1.2. pluto_servo changes
[01:04:39] <jepler> Most pins and parameters on pluto-servo were changed to use dots instead of dashes, in accordance with the HAL canonical naming conventions. For example, 'pluto-servo.encoder-0-velocity' has been renamed to 'pluto-servo.encoder.0.velocity' and 'pluto-servo.dout-00-invert' has been renamed to 'pluto-servo.dout.00-invert'.
[01:04:46] <jepler> check that page if you run into any more surprises
[01:04:56] <skyfox00> ok, thanks...
[01:07:28] <skyfox00> well, after exploding and kernel Oops'ing, it(cvs version) seems to be able to reset parport ok!
[01:10:09] <skyfox00> well, I think I am able to come to a conclusion... I need a different dedicated computer that I can plug the pluto board drictly into and maybe run the Ubunu version of emc(stable kernel)....
[01:10:56] <skyfox00> unless I can find a pre-patched kernel anyway.
[01:11:05] <cradek> that would sure be the easiest way to get a running machine
[01:11:40] <skyfox00> well thanks everybody for all the help!
[01:11:47] <cradek> come back anytime
[01:11:49] <skyfox00> * skyfox00 tips his hat.
[01:12:08] <skyfox00> dont have to much fun ;)
[01:13:00] <JymmmEMC> LawrenceG: Ah, very cool!
[01:14:27] <Adam> is EMC2 feisty compatible right now?
[01:14:47] <Adam> I cant find anything conclusive
[01:15:22] <cradek> the team does not distribute a realtime kernel for feisty OR emc2 feisty packages
[01:15:41] <cradek> we haven't yet decided which versions will be supported for the 2.2 series of releases
[01:16:16] <cradek> if you can build a realtime kernel, emc2 will certainly run on feisty (and any other modern linux distribution)
[01:17:50] <Adam> yeah a realtime kernel probably wont happen I am not that nerdy
[01:18:13] <cradek> then for today, dapper 6.06LTS is probably the way to go for you
[01:19:18] <cradek> I believe there will be security fixes for dapper until 2011 so it is still an excellent choice for a new system
[01:19:41] <Adam> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/RealTime/Feisty
[01:19:51] <Adam> something is happening feisty-wise it seems
[01:20:48] <cradek> I don't think this is RTAI, I'm not sure how it relates to EMC
[01:21:04] <Adam> neither am I haha
[01:21:14] <Adam> jsut throwing a bone out
[01:21:20] <cradek> an interesting one
[01:23:30] <Adam> http://www.mail-archive.com/linux-rt-users@vger.kernel.org/msg00375.html
[01:23:42] <Adam> that is an un-resolved issue with that kernel
[01:24:01] <Adam> I am not sure how that would effect EMC thought does it use the PIT clock? I dont know...
[02:11:37] <LawrenceG> JymmmEMC: it is the x version, I am hoping that the smart board can be removed
[02:17:38] <jepler> cradek: zenbot plays a 3-part version of daisy just great, except that the final chord really makes the whole table resonate...
[02:24:41] <cradek> neat
[02:25:56] <cradek> maybe we should make a video.
[02:26:08] <cradek> with four parts, mine might be better though
[02:26:26] <tomp> regrading feisty realtime... https://wiki.ubuntu.com/RealTime/Gutsy sez : "In some contexts (i.e. industrial automation, robotics and telco) the low-latency support is insufficient.
[02:26:35] <tomp> In order to push Ubuntu in these contexts it is necessary to add support for high resolution timers and full preemption in the Linux kernel.
[02:26:36] <tomp> These features have been implemented by Thomas Gleixner and Ingo Molnar ( http://people.redhat.com/mingo/realtime-preempt/).
[02:26:40] <tomp> end quote
[02:27:06] <SWPadnos> that's mostly true, and those patches might possibly be able to work for EMC
[02:27:16] <SWPadnos> but not with software step generation
[02:27:32] <jepler> they might deliver 1ms but not 20us, you mean?
[02:27:35] <cradek> it would be supergreat if we could use an unpatched kernel
[02:27:39] <SWPadnos> jepler, yes
[02:27:58] <SWPadnos> maybe even a few KHz, but not in the sub-50-us range
[02:28:28] <SWPadnos> this may have changed since I last kept up with the patchset though (which could be a year or more now)
[02:29:02] <SWPadnos> I will say this though - the SMP 2.6.20 kernel was waaaaaay better than the current released EMC-RTAI kernel
[02:29:22] <SWPadnos> (or 2.6.whatever cradek's experimental SMP kernel is)
[02:29:50] <cradek> I sure wish it would boot on everything
[02:34:31] <Ziegler> had to show this to you all... anyone interested in a lathe! :http://cgi.ebay.com/Mesta-Lathe-12-x-54-w-70-4-Jaw-Face-Plate_W0QQitemZ7630706186QQihZ011QQcategoryZ97230QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
[02:34:36] <Ziegler> :-P
[02:36:08] <cradek> Highest spindle speed: Less than 1500 RPM
[02:36:11] <jepler> cradek: http://emergent.unpy.net/index.cgi-files/sandbox/daisy.ngc uses more of the table .. table limits set by O101 sub
[02:36:35] <cradek> that might be good for yours, mine may not go fast enough
[02:36:53] <jepler> it doesn't change the speeds required
[02:36:56] <jepler> I'm not sure what you mean
[02:37:13] <cradek> oh I misunderstood then.
[02:37:34] <jepler> you'll understand if you load it
[02:37:37] <cradek> ok
[02:37:39] <Ziegler> well... I thought it was the biggest lathe I had ever seen
[02:38:20] <cradek> Ziegler: that's over $1/lb
[02:38:31] <jepler> cradek: instead of aiming back towards the origin every time, it wanders until it would bump up against a travel limit
[02:38:40] <cradek> oh I get it
[02:38:45] <jepler> so the song ends up spread out over a greater portion of the working area
[02:39:05] <jepler> make "Z" shallow enough and you could even cut the song in something
[02:39:33] <cradek> we forgot to list this in our accomplishments for last year
[02:39:50] <cradek> it would have been good for a few votes
[02:39:51] <jepler> to my great surprise, indirection in gcode actually works as documented .. #11=[#[#1] + #2]
[02:39:57] <jepler> #[#1]=#11
[02:40:04] <cradek> yargh
[02:40:24] <jepler> it made for shorter code .. otherwise I'd have had to repeat O300 sub many times, or used additional temporaries
[02:40:32] <jepler> but as it was I could just pass in a "pointer" to the parameter to modify..
[02:40:46] <cradek> wow.
[02:40:49] <cradek> I'm speechless
[02:40:58] <Ziegler> you all talking about cutting records? :-P
[02:41:07] <tomp> i like the guitar chords added, so you can strum along to your cnc harmonics
[02:41:17] <jepler> Ziegler: it actually makes a "song" by the frequency of the individual stepper motors
[02:41:43] <Ziegler> yeah.... I weired out the wife when I started playing music by controlling the speed
[02:41:45] <jepler> you have heard of people playing songs on their scanners or disk drives .. well, you can get full 3- or 4-part harmony with your cnc stepper machine
[02:41:51] <Ziegler> but are you talking about an actuall program?
[02:41:57] <cradek> it's gcode
[02:42:03] <Ziegler> right
[02:42:02] <jepler> yes -- http://emergent.unpy.net/index.cgi-files/sandbox/daisy.ngc
[02:42:07] <Ziegler> cool hehe
[02:42:22] <Ziegler> hand coded, or generated?
[02:42:24] <jepler> just change the numbers on the O100 call and O101 call to match your machine's SCALE and travel
[02:42:28] <cradek> well it's a bit hard to recognize as gcode if you're not familiar with emc's advanced features
[02:42:39] <Ziegler> looks fine to me
[02:42:40] <cradek> hand coded
[02:43:34] <jepler> goodnight
[02:43:35] <cradek> haha, there are 6 actual "G" codes in it
[02:43:47] <cradek> bye jepler
[03:02:31] <Ziegler> sounds pretty cool!
[03:26:19] <LawrenceG> JymmmEMC: cq _._. __._
[03:37:27] <JymmmEMC> LawrenceG: -.-. -. -.-. /  ...- .. .- /  .... ..-. 
[03:41:13] <LawrenceG> JymmmEMC: wtf.... all I got was a bunch of funny chars
[03:42:25] <LawrenceG> are you using the oem650's you got?
[03:43:00] <JymmmEMC> No, I'm working witht he 750's
[03:43:59] <LawrenceG> I am hoping to get a couple more drives to replace the weak kneed drver I am using now.... running 2amps into 3 amp steppers
[03:46:35] <LawrenceG> JymmmEMC: did your metal working magic help with the drive problems you were having?
[03:47:18] <JymmmEMC> LawrenceG: no comment (thus why I've taken a break)
[03:48:41] <LawrenceG> ok... well how about that irlp stuff? I just set up node 1130 on an old laptop
[03:48:59] <JymmmEMC> irlp???
[03:49:23] <LawrenceG> JymmmEMC: linked repeaters via internet (VOIP)
[03:49:45] <LawrenceG> http://status.irlp.net/statuspage.html
[03:50:58] <JymmmEMC> Oh, I'm a bit of a traditionalist... RF should be in the air, not through a router
[03:51:57] <LawrenceG> yea... NZ to CA on uhf pretty much has to go via the moon!
[03:53:18] <JymmmEMC> works for me =)
[04:01:02] <toast> does anyone have pictures of scraping
[04:01:16] <toast> like, the process itself, not the finished thing
[04:02:41] <skinnypuppy1334_> toast, i've played with it... flat scrapers
[04:03:53] <skinnypuppy1334_> Good for fixing a small high spot like resulting from a ding
[04:11:49] <toast> i'm more talking like, way and surface plate scraping
[04:12:17] <toast> although i discovered that, in the process of learning, the scraper is indeed a good way to remove dings
[04:12:27] <toast> but it is also an excellent way to put dings in the surface in the first place
[04:15:54] <lerman_> lerman_ is now known as lerman
[05:59:40] <x3rox> Good morning. Does somebody know the Allegro 3977 chip (stepper driver)?
[06:00:38] <x3rox> Would like to know it is also gets so hot as the L298.
[06:03:02] <Skullworks-PGAB> it gets hot - but less than a L298
[06:04:18] <Skullworks-PGAB> L298 uses the older MOS type switching which has a higher heat generation
[06:04:36] <Skullworks-PGAB> IIRC MOS not DMOS
[06:04:55] <Skullworks-PGAB> * Skullworks-PGAB needs a fresh look at the data sheet
[06:05:52] <Skullworks-PGAB> BUT since there are no internal diodes you can pair or even tripple up an L298 for higher current capacity
[06:07:08] <Skullworks-PGAB> * Skullworks-PGAB has seen a L298 / L297 cobo which used 3x L298 to allow almost 8amp motor current.
[06:07:22] <Skullworks-PGAB> s/cobo/combo
[06:08:19] <Skullworks-PGAB> has a link stashed somewhere with EAGLE files for the board
[06:08:47] <x3rox> Well, I currently use self built drivers based on L297/298. I cannot adjust a current higher tham 0.5-0.7A / phase, otherwise the chopper stops working and the result is some smoke. But for first steps and light CNC milling (plastic, PCB's, it will be sufficient). In case that it is not sufficient, I must change my layout, and I think about the allegro in this case...
[06:09:23] <Skullworks-PGAB> what did you use to do the current limiting?
[06:10:02] <x3rox> I actually used the scheme of the data sheet. 0.5 ohms sensing resistor.
[06:10:26] <Skullworks-PGAB> * Skullworks-PGAB thinks the L297 is an outdated hunk of crap
[06:10:32] <x3rox> But my PCM has less capacitors tham PMinMO's layout.
[06:11:07] <x3rox> I also got the impression that this L297 is not very reliable.
[06:11:34] <Skullworks-PGAB> a PIC to drive the bridge with an L6203 chopper would be the best bet - 8th or 10 step
[06:11:38] <x3rox> How ecpensive is one A-3977? Approx.?
[06:12:17] <Skullworks-PGAB> no idea - but I bought about 50 L298's to play with ( smoke as required)
[06:12:49] <x3rox> (I'm only afraid about this SMD parts.) You use single- or dualside PCB's?
[06:13:28] <Skullworks-PGAB> dual usually if needed.
[06:13:49] <Skullworks-PGAB> some real simple ones are single side
[06:13:50] <x3rox> So you use a PIC and control the L298 with it?
[06:14:01] <Skullworks-PGAB> try this idea
[06:14:44] <Skullworks-PGAB> use the PIC from the PIC-step and just replace the 18245(?) chips with L298
[06:15:10] <x3rox> I also had this idea at the beginning. But how to limit the current?
[06:15:17] <Skullworks-PGAB> L298's are 1/3 the cost but still require external freewheel diodes
[06:15:30] <Skullworks-PGAB> L6203
[06:15:39] <Skullworks-PGAB> chopper chip
[06:15:54] <Skullworks-PGAB> er - let me verify thats the right one...
[06:16:00] <x3rox> And the L6203 is better than the L297?
[06:16:27] <x3rox> Yes, the name could be right., I know which chip you mean.
[06:16:39] <Skullworks-PGAB> L6203 is used only for the current limiting chopper
[06:16:52] <x3rox> Has also the same enclosure as the L298...
[06:16:55] <Skullworks-PGAB> still need the PIC to provide step inputs
[06:17:19] <Skullworks-PGAB> the 297 does step/half step
[06:18:04] <Skullworks-PGAB> pic can drive the bridge as required for any step config you can put in the PIC oe AVR
[06:18:24] <Skullworks-PGAB> AVR is better than PIC but less popular
[06:19:12] <x3rox> What I wonder is that there is no driver IC with a better pin assignment.
[06:21:09] <Skullworks-PGAB> OK - I was wrong - 6506 is the chip
[06:21:47] <x3rox> Well, I have MikroPASCAL development system for PICs and I built many nice devices with PICs. I tried to put most of the logic into the PIC (even for 3 axes) and have the PIC do the rest (running the whole 3D-vector alone), but then I saw EMC... ;-)
[06:22:16] <Skullworks-PGAB> use 1 PIC per axis motor
[06:22:50] <Skullworks-PGAB> or try the the 18 pic from Bert at USBCNC.com
[06:23:45] <x3rox> Does the 6506 also run as chopper, or does it have better current limiting?
[06:24:37] <Skullworks-PGAB> L298 allows higher voltage and can be ganged - and when you use the 6506 you can set the current limit for the chopper
[06:25:10] <Skullworks-PGAB> just remember to use proper freewheel diodes
[06:25:50] <Skullworks-PGAB> * Skullworks-PGAB has both brief and verbos data sheets for the 6506
[06:26:33] <Skullworks-PGAB> even though I have pretty much given up on stepper drives
[06:27:05] <Skullworks-PGAB> I'm using the L298 as a servo amp
[06:27:20] <Skullworks-PGAB> and working on a ganged config
[06:27:28] <x3rox> Do you know "Tero Kontkanen"? I have a PCB layout of him for the Allegro. I wonder that he still has external diodes, while the datasheet does not require them.
[06:27:37] <Skullworks-PGAB> for about 9A
[06:27:59] <x3rox> What? 9A with L298s???
[06:28:10] <Skullworks-PGAB> Paranoia works in eletronics too
[06:28:12] <x3rox> So you need 5 in parallel!!
[06:28:21] <Skullworks-PGAB> 3x
[06:28:48] <x3rox> One is good for 2A, 9/2=5 (rounded up)
[06:28:53] <Skullworks-PGAB> 7.5 continous 9A peak
[06:29:19] <x3rox> Wouldn't it be better to use discrete powerMOS here?
[06:29:34] <Skullworks-PGAB> using 3 chips, 6x bridges
[06:29:39] <Skullworks-PGAB> yes
[06:29:42] <x3rox> So one PowerMOS can switch 50A?
[06:30:27] <Skullworks-PGAB> but I have them and am looking to make a very simple low part count pwm servo amp to play with.
[06:31:24] <Skullworks-PGAB> FET's and MOSFETS are beyond my current education level. ( that is changing...
[06:32:14] <Skullworks-PGAB> I got out of electronics about 1984.... and am jut now venturing back.
[06:32:19] <Skullworks-PGAB> just
[06:32:40] <x3rox> I tried to layout a PCB for 4A. It was horrible. I used one L298 for one phase (both halfs switched in parallel), but the wiring was horrible. Therefore I don't like the L298 very much.
[06:33:03] <Skullworks-PGAB> old dogs, new tricks, can learn them given time and motivation.
[06:33:21] <x3rox> How old are you, if I am allowed to ask? I am 46.
[06:33:29] <Skullworks-PGAB> try the L6203
[06:33:38] <Skullworks-PGAB> 44
[06:33:57] <x3rox> I see. You have the same problems than me.
[06:34:01] <x3rox> ;-D
[06:34:46] <Skullworks-PGAB> yeah In college I chased A's and B's when I should have studied C
[06:36:16] <Skullworks-PGAB> worse most my circuits books are half ( or more ) full of tube circuits.
[06:36:41] <Skullworks-PGAB> old school hard cover books I bought
[06:36:50] <x3rox> Well, I will have a look on my mill and how it works with 1.4A per motor. It it works, it is fine. If not, I must change something. But I see good chances that it will work for my fine milling tools (ø0.4 - ø2 mm), here no high forces are possible.
[06:36:59] <Skullworks-PGAB> back when they were new. :~
[06:37:23] <Skullworks-PGAB> RPM?
[06:37:31] <x3rox> ?
[06:38:23] <Skullworks-PGAB> planned RPM for your mill?
[06:39:01] <Skullworks-PGAB> small tools need high rpm and low T.I.R.
[06:39:51] <x3rox> I will be happy when all 3 axes are under control. This is an old engraving machine I plan to convert into a CNC mill. It has a regulable spindle included, will be somewhere around 30.000 rpm, I estimate. (Didn' mesure, it simply runs).
[06:40:09] <x3rox> What is T.I.R.?
[06:40:27] <Skullworks-PGAB> * Skullworks-PGAB used to do engraving .01" wide x .014 deep.
[06:40:44] <Skullworks-PGAB> "total idicated runout"
[06:40:59] <x3rox> Whow. And what does that mean?
[06:41:19] <x3rox> How much material it can cut at once?
[06:41:41] <x3rox> My english is not such perfect.
[06:41:40] <Skullworks-PGAB> how close the tool runs to perfect spidle centerline
[06:42:00] <Skullworks-PGAB> or how much whobble in the tool/holder
[06:42:23] <Skullworks-PGAB> your native language?
[06:42:31] <x3rox> Oh, yes. Native: German.
[06:42:44] <x3rox> (I'm from Austria)
[06:42:54] <x3rox> And you?
[06:43:13] <Skullworks-PGAB> * Skullworks-PGAB regreets dropping German language classes in college
[06:43:45] <x3rox> ?
[06:44:17] <Skullworks-PGAB> I'm U.S. native - Formorely from Los Angeles/Hollywood now living in Colorado
[06:44:42] <x3rox> So you do not have real language problems, right?
[06:44:42] <Skullworks-PGAB> I'm German Swede mix
[06:44:52] <Skullworks-PGAB> not with english
[06:45:00] <x3rox> :D
[06:45:50] <Skullworks-PGAB> have good associates to help with german and russian as needed.
[06:46:49] <x3rox> Du sprichst also auch deutsch?
[06:47:05] <Skullworks-PGAB> nine
[06:47:12] <x3rox> hehe... ;-)
[06:47:22] <x3rox> No problem.
[06:47:43] <Skullworks-PGAB> never really learned it - not anyone to practice with until recently
[06:48:54] <x3rox> Until now I got the drivers working. I fed in a squarewave signal from my frequency oscillator (~100 kHz), and the stepper turned. So it should work, right? :D
[06:50:12] <Skullworks-PGAB> sounds like the bridge is working - you going to now drive it with Stepper.ini?
[06:50:58] <Skullworks-PGAB> * Skullworks-PGAB doesn't have a spare Freq gen to play with.
[06:51:19] <x3rox> Well, I must now put all this electronics into the mill, then I plan to setup an old PC with EMC and try it this way.
[06:51:54] <Skullworks-PGAB> I'm going to try and use the 3x L298 to drive a regular servo motor via pluto-servo
[06:52:12] <Skullworks-PGAB> what Iron you have?
[06:52:48] <x3rox> I also built a isolator board to protect my PC. What you mean with Iron?
[06:52:55] <Skullworks-PGAB> I have a U.S. (Grizzley) version of the SEIG X3
[06:53:05] <Skullworks-PGAB> machine
[06:54:20] <Skullworks-PGAB> I figure the whole point of all this is to drive a machine - even though I've spent nealy 2 years playing with just parts....
[06:54:45] <x3rox> Oh! Just a moment, I prepare a photo...
[06:54:57] <Skullworks-PGAB> I own 2 mills - an IH and the SEIG X3
[06:55:22] <Skullworks-PGAB> and still I play with parts...
[06:56:40] <x3rox> Look here: http://www.hantsch.co.at/_temp/VX92.jpg - This is my mill.
[06:58:25] <x3rox> I will remove this little vice and replace it with a mounting plate across the whole surface.
[06:59:19] <x3rox> On the right, the old electronics is behind the control panel. I removed it and ther emy new electronics will come in.
[07:01:36] <x3rox> Oh, your mill seems to be a little bit bigger?
[07:03:04] <x3rox> * Did you get the photo?
[07:07:50] <anonimasu_> morning
[07:08:27] <x3rox> morning!
[07:08:26] <anonimasu_> brb
[07:08:38] <anonimasu_> going to take a shower and head to work
[07:08:46] <anonimasu_> I've got a order for some stuff I need to send today
[07:09:22] <x3rox> Skullworks-PGAB: Are you here?
[13:15:57] <CIA-24> 03jepler 07TRUNK * 10emc2/src/hal/utils/comp.g: 'comp --view-doc' shows documentation for a .comp file
[14:07:45] <mess> hi all
[14:08:21] <skunkworks_> Hi
[14:08:38] <skunkworks_> skunkworks_ is now known as skunkworks
[14:08:57] <mess> whats up skunk??
[14:09:23] <mess> im ebaying for a machine this mornrin??
[14:09:43] <anonimasu_> hehe
[14:10:21] <anonimasu_> I just had a shave :)
[14:10:36] <mess> leaning on this one ...http://cgi.ebay.ca/1-625-CNC-LATHE-Hardinge-CHNCII-Fanuc-10TF_W0QQitemZ150150636968QQihZ005QQcategoryZ633QQrdZ1QQssPageNameZWD1VQQcmdZViewItem
[14:11:31] <skunkworks> heh - once a month if I need it or not
[14:12:11] <mess> 1 per week for me.. : )
[14:12:32] <skunkworks> wife doesn't like when I start looking like a moutain man.
[14:12:37] <mess> in between i put milk on it..
[14:12:54] <mess> the cats take care of the stuble... LOL
[14:14:01] <mess> me neither but im sporting a mowhawk right now so whats she got to do with my stubble..
[14:15:23] <anonimasu_> :)
[14:16:01] <mess> http://cgi.ebay.ca/3-Axis-CNC-Stepper-Motor-Driver-mill-lathe-router_W0QQitemZ260154170131QQihZ016QQcategoryZ71394QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
[14:16:28] <mess> is that any good for anything usefull?? 2.6 A/phase??
[14:17:42] <skunkworks> heh - cnczone is the seller
[14:19:58] <mess> means noyhing to me.. :(
[14:20:06] <skunkworks> http://www.electronicsam.com/images/engraver/stepper.JPG
[14:21:04] <skunkworks> although I doubt if that drive will run it this fast.. not high enough voltage. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a_OUNLruaVQ
[14:23:59] <CIA-24> 03jepler 07TRUNK * 10emc2/src/hal/classicladder/symbols.c: when a %I, %Q or %X is connected to a signal in HAL, display the HAL signal name in preference to the classicladder symbol name
[14:24:08] <skunkworks> the 2 drives running x and y are 170v drives - the z is 75v.
[14:25:26] <mess> this looks sweeter.... http://cgi.ebay.ca/WASINO-L5J3-CNC-LATHE-TURNING-CENTER-LIVE-TOOLING_W0QQitemZ130148313373QQihZ003QQcategoryZ97230QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
[14:26:41] <mess> Could EMC2 be used to feed the old fanuc drives on a machine like that???
[14:27:38] <skunkworks> depends on the drives
[14:28:23] <mess> that machine probably the old yellow headed steppers.
[14:29:13] <CIA-24> 03jepler 07TRUNK * 10emc2/src/hal/classicladder/symbols.c: remove debugging statement
[14:34:10] <skunkworks> I didn't know fanuc ever used steppers.
[14:36:08] <gene> morning guys
[14:36:30] <mess> way back... on some 6's too..
[14:36:47] <skunkworks> gene: morning
[14:36:55] <mess> gday
[14:45:01] <anonimasu_> mess: why not use the standard control?
[14:45:14] <CIA-24> 03jepler 07TRUNK * 10emc2/share/axis/tcl/axis.tcl: add a menu item to start the classicladder GUI if classicladder_rt is loaded
[14:45:16] <CIA-24> 03jepler 07TRUNK * 10emc2/src/hal/halmodule.cc: add a menu item to start the classicladder GUI if classicladder_rt is loaded
[14:45:16] <CIA-24> 03jepler 07TRUNK * 10emc2/src/emc/usr_intf/axis/scripts/axis.py: add a menu item to start the classicladder GUI if classicladder_rt is loaded
[14:45:39] <anonimasu_> mess: Spindle will not come on might be a broken drive.. or something
[14:46:18] <anonimasu_> mess: I dont see the point in replacing a working control unless it messes with you(but that's just me)
[14:47:36] <CIA-24> 03jepler 07TRUNK * 10emc2/lib/python/rs274/glcanon.py:
[14:47:36] <CIA-24> special comments (AXIS,hide) and (AXIS,show) allow parts of the program to be
[14:47:36] <CIA-24> hidden in the preview. This is useful for instance to hide the "probe for tool
[14:47:36] <CIA-24> length" actions; hidden motions also do not contribute to the program bounding
[14:47:36] <CIA-24> box, so this feature must be used with care
[14:47:35] <CIA-24> 03jepler 07TRUNK * 10emc2/src/emc/usr_intf/axis/scripts/axis.py:
[14:47:39] <CIA-24> special comments (AXIS,hide) and (AXIS,show) allow parts of the program to be
[14:47:41] <CIA-24> hidden in the preview. This is useful for instance to hide the "probe for tool
[14:47:43] <CIA-24> length" actions; hidden motions also do not contribute to the program bounding
[14:47:45] <CIA-24> box, so this feature must be used with care
[14:48:25] <CIA-24> 03jepler 07TRUNK * 10emc2/src/emc/usr_intf/axis/scripts/axis.py: missed part of the classicladder patch
[14:53:14] <CIA-24> 03jepler 07TRUNK * 10emc2/share/axis/tcl/axis.tcl: background classicladder GUI
[15:00:17] <CIA-24> 03jepler 07TRUNK * 10emc2/share/axis/tcl/axis.tcl: "save gcode as" allows gcode output from a filter to be saved to disk
[15:00:17] <CIA-24> 03jepler 07TRUNK * 10emc2/src/emc/usr_intf/axis/scripts/axis.py: "save gcode as" allows gcode output from a filter to be saved to disk
[15:04:30] <skunkworks> jepler: nice :)
[15:14:20] <mess> 4 girls.. walking up in the living room....this mornin.... yaaa... i still got it....
[15:17:45] <mess> all right it was my daughter's 12th birthday party turned slumber slaughter of the entire household..
[15:49:34] <CIA-24> 03jepler 07TRUNK * 10emc2/src/hal/classicladder/symbols.c: show signal direction with unicode arrow
[16:03:38] <dmess> back for another kick at the APT360 can... can anyone help??
[16:06:03] <jepler> dmess: I don't think we have a lot of people familiar with APT360, but on IRC you should always just ask your question, not ask whether you should ask your question.
[16:07:02] <cradek> dmess: also you might want to try on #cam
[16:09:19] <dmess> im there... ok im an idiot... and have lost most unix/linux abilities i usedtahave...
[16:10:13] <dmess> windows wastes the mond and destoys active sysapses...
[16:10:19] <dmess> mind
[16:13:20] <CIA-24> 03cradek 07TRUNK * 10emc2/configs/demo_sim_cl/ (demo_sim_cl.clp demo_sim_cl.hal demo_sim_cl.ini): fix confusing signal names
[16:37:34] <gene> humm, odd goings on guys, my recesses I'm carving for the bearings have tight spots at the 90 degree points, by about 2 thou, wth?
[16:38:08] <Bo^Dick> has anyone of you ever used the avr-gcc compiler ever?
[16:38:28] <Bo^Dick> it's part of the winavr package
[16:39:38] <fenn> gene could be backlash or leadscrew windup
[16:39:59] <fenn> Bo^Dick: try #avr?
[16:40:14] <archivist> or ##asm
[16:40:22] <jepler> Bo^Dick: ##microcontrollers is probably a good place for questions about avr-gcc -- better than here at any rate
[16:40:34] <Bo^Dick> thanks
[16:41:52] <gene> I've got more wear lash in x than the ini files is set for, but in dig cutting, I'd think that would leave a big spot at the turnaround?
[16:44:22] <cradek> gene: do you have a boring head? without very careful backlash controls you can't really expect to mill holes for bearings
[16:44:45] <cradek> control, not controls
[16:44:48] <fenn> cradek: what if you cut divets out of the corners? :P
[16:45:10] <cradek> it still won't be round
[16:45:35] <fenn> in that case the issue is accuract, not backlash
[16:45:46] <gene> no, no boreing head darnit
[16:47:14] <cradek> if it's for a small bearing, you could get a reamer for not much $
[16:47:23] <gene> I'm going to zero everything, add some more lash to x & maybe even y, and restart, i can see the wide place at about 9:30 in the cut.
[16:52:42] <optimum> 'lo
[16:52:44] <optimum> oops
[16:52:50] <optimum> optimum is now known as ler_hydra
[16:52:54] <skunkworks> heh
[16:53:01] <ler_hydra> 'lo
[16:53:33] <gene> while I'm in the ini file, my display update rate is obviously much more than .1 seconds. main loop is 40 u-secs on a 1600mhz cpu, how can I get a bit more priority there?
[17:02:03] <fenn> what is traj_period
[17:03:26] <gene> TRAJ_PERIOD = 10000000
[17:04:23] <gene> 10 milliseconds
[17:06:32] <anonimasu_> *hm
[17:07:39] <gene> I can see it removeing some of that on another pass after adjusting the backlash settings to more accurate values.
[17:08:59] <gene> I can also see what looks like segments of straight lines about 3/32" wide all the way around, yeah, I know, shitty screws
[17:12:46] <gene> Chris, the bearings are sloppy themselves, McMaster-carr's 5911974, approximately 2.100", I'm fitting the dust cover wrapper.
[17:18:01] <fenn> gene does it make the lines if you go slower?
[17:18:28] <fenn> or faster
[17:23:07] <ler_hydra> hmm anyone here know parports well?
[17:23:33] <ler_hydra> I seem to be having some issues...
[17:24:03] <ler_hydra> I have an external pendant box with some control buttons and jogwheels
[17:25:21] <ler_hydra> the buttons work fine, however the jogwheels don't anymore (after changing computer). Without the computer attached voltages are 0/4V for high/low, but when attached they're pulled down to 0/1V. the parport is configured as an input
[17:26:40] <skunkworks> what pins?
[17:27:40] <ler_hydra> uh... buttons on 10-13, jogwheels on 2-9
[17:30:08] <skunkworks> kinda sounds like it isn't working as input
[17:32:16] <gene> fenn, yes
[17:32:20] <gene> to both
[17:38:17] <ler_hydra> skunkworks: yeah, probably. any ideas?
[17:38:51] <skunkworks> I have never used a printer port a input in hal. Could there be an issue with how it is setup in the bios?
[17:39:03] <skunkworks> or is this one of th pci cards?
[17:39:40] <skunkworks> do any of the other printer ports work as input?
[17:44:04] <fenn> i think a SPP configured port will only allow certain pins as inputs (10-15 or something)
[17:58:28] <jepler> the "bidirectional mode" is supposed to allow pins 2-9 to be switched to inputs, in addition to the pins that are inputs in the normal ("out-mode") port
[17:59:18] <jepler> if you set input mode in hal, use a resistor to pull pin 2 up, and measure 1V at pin 2, that means your port doesn't support input mode, or your BIOS is not configured correctly.
[18:00:16] <jepler> if you hook pin 2 directly to VCC and the port is not in input mode, you can permanently damage the port
[18:01:47] <ler_hydra> jepler: hmm, this is on a PCI parport card
[18:02:49] <jepler> I guess there's no hope of correcting the BIOS setting then
[18:02:53] <cradek> since you have 3 parports are you positive you know which is which?
[18:03:33] <ler_hydra> well the buttons (pin 10-13) work
[18:03:42] <ler_hydra> and show up correctly
[18:04:10] <cradek> ok, just starting at the 'beginning'
[18:06:08] <ler_hydra> right :)
[18:19:59] <jepler> if it is an ECP-compatible port, then writing 32 to the ECR port may be required to select the bidirectional mode
[18:20:23] <jepler> unfortunately I am sure that is greek to you
[18:21:01] <fenn> hey didnt jon elson have a little c progra that did that
[18:21:27] <jepler> not exactly -- it probably sets the ECR port to 128 for EPP mode
[18:21:48] <jepler> for parallel-port cards I don't even know how to determine the address of the ECR..
[18:23:16] <fenn> you mean we cant just blindly poke at random addresses in memory?
[18:23:49] <JymmmEMC> ECR ???
[18:23:54] <ler_hydra> jepler: I understand the concept, though I won't be able to do it in reality :)
[18:24:00] <jepler> that's certainly what I'd do if it was my own machine, but not what I think I can successfully talk someone through on IRC
[18:24:02] <SWPadnos> extended crontrol register or something like that
[18:24:07] <JymmmEMC> ty
[18:24:10] <jepler> JymmmEMC: http://www.beyondlogic.org/ecp/ecp.htm#10
[18:24:14] <SWPadnos> err - control
[18:24:32] <jepler> it's a port defined by the ECP "standard", sometimes located at the parport's I/O base address plus 0x402 bytes
[18:24:50] <anonimasu_> ler_hydra: theres a tool to do it by jon elson
[18:25:14] <jepler> no, jon elson's tool sets EPP mode, not bidirectional mode
[18:25:21] <anonimasu_> ah
[18:25:22] <jepler> the great thing about the parport is how many modes it has
[18:26:31] <SWPadnos> and how many ways companies have implemented them
[18:26:37] <SWPadnos> nothing like choice!
[18:26:46] <jepler> another thing you might try is making sure 0xff is written to the parport data register, in case selecting out mode with bit 5 of the control port (a different control port than the ECP port!) actually gives Open Collector pins
[18:26:54] <fenn> i _only_ us genuine HP parallel ports
[18:27:04] <fenn> *snort*
[18:27:36] <SWPadnos> I wonder why my openmoko came with a guitar pick
[18:27:49] <fenn> to pry the case apart
[18:28:00] <SWPadnos> could be, though that's easy enough to do by hand
[18:33:00] <ler_hydra> hmm, I suppose I could try to use the integrated motherboard parport
[18:33:13] <ler_hydra> which mode would be what I want (input mode)?
[18:33:18] <ler_hydra> bidirectional?
[18:33:54] <fenn> bidir
[18:34:22] <ler_hydra> right, brb
[18:36:37] <ETA_lokal> ETA_lokal is now known as ler_hydra2
[18:36:41] <ler_hydra2> 'lo again
[18:37:02] <ler_hydra2> apparently the bios only has EPP, ECP, EPP/ECP, and NORMAL modes
[18:38:33] <SWPadnos> the BIOS will be irrelevant to the add-on PCI ports
[18:38:58] <jepler> you can't do much but try all of them...
[18:39:12] <skunkworks> * skunkworks guesses NORMAL
[18:39:26] <SWPadnos> oh - after reading back, I'd say you want one of the ones that includes EPP
[18:39:34] <SWPadnos> normal should be output only
[18:39:50] <SWPadnos> EPP should include bidirectional capability
[18:40:12] <SWPadnos> but one never knows what the heck those BIOS writers mean when they say "NORMAL", so try them all ;)
[18:40:56] <archivist> heh EPP is evil to program on an Acorn Riscos computer
[18:41:13] <SWPadnos> you have an Acorn?
[18:41:16] <fenn> acorn? really?
[18:41:31] <SWPadnos> that's he NS32016/32032-based PC, isn't it?
[18:41:32] <archivist> was at work some years ago
[18:41:34] <fenn> the mythical long lost acorn of the isle of avalon
[18:41:35] <SWPadnos> ah
[18:41:41] <JymmmEMC> http://zone.ni.com/devzone/cda/tut/p/id/3466
[18:41:53] <archivist> writing a printer driver
[18:42:03] <SWPadnos> JymmmEMC, how dare you post a link to that eveil site?
[18:42:07] <SWPadnos> evil too
[18:42:20] <JymmmEMC> evil?
[18:42:36] <SWPadnos> they provide LabView, which means they're evil by definition
[18:42:45] <JymmmEMC> SWPadnos: Ah
[18:42:51] <jepler> those are some terrible tables
[18:45:24] <skunkworks> I take it labview is closed source?
[18:45:31] <SWPadnos> hahahahahahaha
[18:45:33] <SWPadnos> yes
[18:45:38] <archivist> just a bit
[18:45:42] <SWPadnos> even your source is closed when you use it
[18:45:43] <JymmmEMC> SWPadnos: If LabView is so evil, why not develop SWPView
[18:45:51] <SWPadnos> I don't have the time
[18:45:57] <SWPadnos> or the inclination
[18:46:02] <JymmmEMC> SWPadnos: for $999
[18:46:10] <archivist> here have 5 minutes
[18:46:23] <fenn> here's a degree
[18:47:05] <SWPadnos> what I really loved about doing FPGA work with LabView was that my own "code" was closed, even to me. LV encrypts the interim VHDL files, so you can't even look there to find problems
[18:47:36] <archivist> ew
[18:47:48] <fenn> would it be a violation of DMCA to crack your own encryption?
[18:48:01] <SWPadnos> I don't know/care
[18:48:07] <JymmmEMC> SWPadnos: encrypts or non-disclosed protocol
[18:48:11] <jepler> altera's tools shit altera copyright notices into files that you create in their GUI
[18:48:20] <SWPadnos> encrypted source, happily supported by the Xilinx tools
[18:48:50] <jepler> I hate the world of fpgas, except for the things that can be done with fpgas
[18:48:50] <fenn> i really dont get why anything FPGA has to be so evil
[18:49:12] <fenn> you could start a company based solely on not being evil and make a nice business
[18:49:11] <SWPadnos> I drag an "integer adder" block onto a diagram (the labview equivalent of programming), and when I output the VHDL code for synthesis etc, I can't look at it
[18:49:48] <SWPadnos> fenn, that could possibly work *if* the FPGA vendors would actually tell you everything you need to kow about their hardware
[18:50:03] <fenn> i meant to fab your own chips etc
[18:50:25] <skunkworks> I could etch my own silicon
[18:50:27] <skunkworks> sure
[18:50:27] <SWPadnos> oh. well, the next time I have a couple billion dollars to build a fab, I'll give you a call
[18:50:41] <fenn> no no, you send it to a fab house
[18:50:48] <fenn> its only like $10k per chip
[18:50:59] <fenn> er, per design
[18:51:03] <skunkworks> I mean jeeze - they did it in the 60's
[18:51:12] <anonimasu_> fenn: and still you need the knowhow to design a fpga..
[18:51:13] <jepler> I noticed an "fpga" vhdl core on opencores
[18:51:16] <fenn> yeah, they did lots of cool stuff in the 60's
[18:51:21] <anonimasu_> fennand the toolchain
[18:51:23] <SWPadnos> that's only true when the chip is built up of blocks they already have
[18:51:26] <skunkworks> like lsd?
[18:51:31] <SWPadnos> and it's more like $50k
[18:51:51] <fenn> anonimasu_: i dont believe the toolchain is all that hard
[18:51:57] <SWPadnos> VHDL is used to design the chips as well as the stuff FPGAs do
[18:52:11] <SWPadnos> actually, you can do an entire circuit board in VHDL, but you wouldn't want to
[18:52:23] <anonimasu_> fenn: Well, I think you should belive less and know more
[18:52:25] <SWPadnos> (not the layout, of course, just the circuit description)
[18:52:32] <fenn> skunkworks: well i was thinking more like space rockets but lsd is cool too i guess
[18:52:45] <skunkworks> heh
[18:53:05] <skunkworks> dad made a fregency counter out of 7400 series chips..
[18:53:11] <fenn> anonimasu_: i'm not going to start an fpga manufacturing business
[18:53:23] <fenn> not until i'm in orbit at least
[18:54:07] <JymmmEMC> http://enterthegrid.com/primeur/07/articles/monthly/AE-PR-08-07-12.html
[18:55:11] <jepler> with Free tools you can get from verilog or vhdl to netlists, but you still need FPGA-specific knowledge to 'place and route' onto a particular chip..
[18:56:09] <fenn> JymmmEMC: so?
[18:56:14] <jepler> (iverilog -t fpga produces something called EDIF which I understand can be read by the xilinx toolchain..)
[18:56:48] <SWPadnos> EDIF is a generic file format for electrical circuit data (Electronic Data Interchange Format, I think)
[18:57:18] <JymmmEMC> fenn: pricing
[18:57:34] <fenn> jymmm altera and xilinx are cheap enough (sub-$10)
[18:57:39] <fenn> but that's not the problem
[18:57:39] <SWPadnos> PCB / schematic packages also support it, but I believe it's lke XML in that the format is more of a container definition, and programs can throw away anything they don't understand
[18:57:39] <JymmmEMC> k
[18:58:40] <archivist> EDIF came from the pcb industry iirc
[18:59:19] <SWPadnos> I know there are EDIF import/export options in altium, but that's about where it ends for me :)
[18:59:21] <fenn> it seems fairly nebulous, like XML
[20:43:23] <LawrenceG> I need help understanding g53,54... the docs say the offsets for g54 etc have to be set before running the program... but they give no clue on how to set the fixture offsets
[20:44:32] <cradek> LawrenceG: G10 L2 Px, or just use Touch Off in AXIS gui
[20:46:05] <LawrenceG> so if I want g54 to have an offset of 1,2 I would put "G10 L2 P1 X1 Y2" near the front of the program?
[20:46:14] <cradek> yes
[20:46:27] <cradek> that would set G54's origin to be 1,2 in machine coordinates
[20:46:37] <jepler> or you can enter G10 L2 ... in MDI
[20:46:40] <cradek> right
[20:46:51] <cradek> setting them in gcode is very rarely useful
[20:47:06] <LawrenceG> cool... I am trying figure out how to move strings from TTT around the part
[20:47:10] <cradek> since if you knew where the fixture/part is, why use the offset?
[20:47:14] <cradek> ah
[20:47:31] <cradek> for that, I'd probably use G92
[20:48:07] <cradek> g0 x12.3 y23.4; g92 x0 y0; [ttt output here]; g92.1
[20:48:41] <cradek> that will put the ttt text at 12.3,23.4
[20:49:05] <LawrenceG> hmmm I was playing with g92 and got some interesting parts! I thought using fixture offset might be easier
[20:49:26] <LawrenceG> will try your suggestion... Thanks
[20:49:29] <cradek> welcome
[20:52:41] <skunkworks> I can't belive your telling someone to use g92 ;)
[20:52:59] <cradek> there's nothing wrong with g92
[20:53:46] <skunkworks> what - who are you and what did you do with chris?
[20:53:59] <cradek> abusing it for fixture offsetting is what makes it suck
[20:55:13] <fenn> is there some tutorial on offsetting somewhere?
[20:56:11] <cradek> http://article.gmane.org/gmane.linux.distributions.emc.user/2600/
[20:56:33] <cradek> no but there should be... it comes up a lot.
[20:58:25] <roltek> you might want to set up the program as a sub program and run absolute moves between the parts
[21:01:22] <roltek> if you don't care about tool changes
[21:53:19] <Ziegler> http://images.myonlinesite.com/cnc/use/20070830/videos.html
[21:53:26] <Ziegler> that play sound for you all?
[21:54:25] <fenn> yup
[21:54:56] <Ziegler> thanks
[21:57:05] <Ziegler> is there a cmi for running emc?
[21:57:11] <Ziegler> cli
[22:07:11] <fenn> depends what you mean
[22:07:22] <fenn> there's a program called "emcsh" which sends nml commands
[22:07:40] <fenn> there's a console interface called "keystick" but it has no command line per se
[22:09:42] <Ziegler> I guess to be specific... is there a way I can avoid using X?
[22:13:04] <fenn> yes, use keystick
[22:13:24] <Ziegler> thanks!
[22:13:28] <fenn> although, iirc you have to modify some line in the startup script because it expects to be running in an xterm
[22:13:36] <Ziegler> oh ok
[22:13:46] <fenn> another way would be to run the GUI on a different computer from across the network
[22:14:17] <Ziegler> really?
[22:14:39] <Ziegler> latency issues?
[22:14:49] <skinnypuppy1334> I only have it on one machine but ssh -X and run EMC
[22:14:57] <skinnypuppy1334> from the other pc
[22:15:47] <fenn> latency doesnt matter much with a gui
[22:16:06] <fenn> i mean, dont run it on a wireless connection over a 56k dialup line bounced through a satellite link
[22:16:18] <fenn> but a LAN should be fine
[22:16:23] <Ziegler> so the interpreter is still running on the main machine... but axis can comunicate with it remotley
[22:16:45] <fenn> yep
[22:16:51] <Ziegler> docs in the wiki?
[22:17:00] <fenn> one problem with doing that is you need to have the part program on both machines
[22:17:27] <Ziegler> or maybe it might work with a network shared folder
[22:17:32] <skinnypuppy1334> or map remote drive to local directory
[22:17:32] <Ziegler> nfs mount
[22:17:37] <fenn> ziegler its sort of an advanced topic, might be in integrators manual or developers manual
[22:17:54] <fenn> you edit the emc.nml file
[22:18:21] <fenn> ah
[22:18:28] <fenn> look at configs/common/client.nml
[22:18:32] <Ziegler> looking
[22:18:36] <skinnypuppy1334> I run full gui on both machines, but basically all I did was install open ssh onto the machine hosting EMC
[22:18:55] <fenn> and server.nml
[22:18:56] <Ziegler> yeah... im looking to avoid needing X running on the one machine
[22:19:23] <fenn> skinnypuppy1334: that's a different method, i think you need X to run a gui remotely by ssh
[22:19:29] <Ziegler> yes
[22:20:07] <skinnypuppy1334> May not work for zieg then
[22:24:04] <skinnypuppy1334> Last day of that gecko sale, I had thought of G210's with the pmdx 131 mb just for the ease of it all, but after SWP told me to look at the 203v's I think it will be 4 of them that I order. I didn't realize the were able to be driven straight from paraport pins without a breakout board.
[22:27:38] <skinnypuppy1334> I'm reading in the EMC2 manual pdf now, and just wanted to bounce the question and be sure ..all I'm doing here is mapping paraport pins to the dir and step inputs on the geckos.. right?
[23:06:28] <SWPadnos> skinnypuppy1334, the g203V specs imply that it will work without a breakout board, but it's probably a good idea to use something to protect the PC
[23:07:54] <SWPadnos> I wouldn't want you to get the 203V's, hook them up to your PC, and blame me if it doesn't work ;)
[23:08:13] <skinnypuppy1334> SWP thank you for your reply, I'm set and ready to order the G203's I've been reading the EMC2 manual again to make certain I'm up to task.
[23:08:47] <skinnypuppy1334> I won't blame if my paralell port isn't up to spec,
[23:08:50] <SWPadnos> it should be easy. you'll need a physical breakout of some sort, even if it doesn't need much by way of buffers and electrical protection
[23:08:51] <SWPadnos> heh :)
[23:09:08] <fenn> meh just chop up a printer cable
[23:09:25] <skinnypuppy1334> what type of board do you recomend for that SWP
[23:09:25] <SWPadnos> that's a physical breakout (broke-out?)
[23:09:27] <fenn> at least it'll be shielded that way
[23:09:43] <SWPadnos> I don't have any experiance with any of them - that's not how my machine(s) will work
[23:09:51] <SWPadnos> experience
[23:09:59] <SWPadnos> I can tell you about some I've heard of though
[23:10:11] <SWPadnos> PMDX has several - I'm not sure how "low end" they get
[23:10:18] <SWPadnos> cnc4pc
[23:10:23] <SWPadnos> candcnc (I think)
[23:10:27] <SWPadnos> Homann Designs
[23:10:31] <skinnypuppy1334> Sure that is what I was looking for, I didn't see any pmdx that listed 203's
[23:10:58] <SWPadnos> you don't needa "motherboard" style board, just a protection card for the parport, plus maybe a safety charge pump
[23:12:01] <SWPadnos> other than a chopped-up cable, here's about as basic as you can get: http://www.cnc4pc.com/Store/osc/product_info.php?cPath=33&products_id=131
[23:13:22] <skinnypuppy1334> Ok so a pmdx 122 breakout board with charge pump would be just right for the 203v's
[23:13:40] <SWPadnos> yep, that's the kind of board I'd suggest
[23:15:03] <skinnypuppy1334> SWP, thank you again... I'm just not familiar with this hardware.
[23:15:44] <SWPadnos> no problem. hopefully I haven't steered you in the wrong direction
[23:16:03] <skinnypuppy1334> That c13 breakout board was what I was thinking of piecing together to receive a printer cable instead of hack tap
[23:16:32] <SWPadnos> you can also use a 25-pin RS232 brreakout, like the ones Radio Shack used to sell
[23:16:49] <SWPadnos> they used to have those ones you could rearrange the connections on
[23:17:14] <SWPadnos> but that one for $8.95 seems to be a good deal - that's about what the connectors would cost you from DigiKey
[23:17:14] <skinnypuppy1334> I don't think you have, it's just gecko doesn't recomend anything and pmdx didn't mention 203v's hence the apprehension
[23:17:38] <SWPadnos> right - I'd check with Steve Stallings before buying the PMDX122
[23:17:47] <skinnypuppy1334> Yeah I used to get a lot of IRFZ mosfets and opamps from them years ago
[23:17:52] <SWPadnos> I'm sure it will work, but it's best to ask the source
[23:18:58] <skinnypuppy1334> Ok Steve is the contact at PMDX ?
[23:19:06] <SWPadnos> cool - DigiKey has those RS232 breakouts: http://rocky.digikey.com/WebLib/Assmann/Web%20Photos/AB947.jpg
[23:19:19] <SWPadnos> yep - he's steves_logging most of the time
[23:19:21] <skinnypuppy1334> that digikey one is cool
[23:19:38] <SWPadnos> $14.62
[23:20:18] <skinnypuppy1334> Not much in the grand scheem, I think my machine eats 14.62 every time I turn my back ....
[23:20:27] <SWPadnos> probably true
[23:20:43] <SWPadnos> I think I've spent 1000 times that on my stuff over the past 3 years
[23:21:02] <skinnypuppy1334> I ordered a r8 er40 set with an mt3er40 adapter this week already..
[23:21:16] <skinnypuppy1334> mt3 for my lathe
[23:23:46] <ds2> who sells a MT3 to ER40 adapter?
[23:23:55] <skinnypuppy1334> Thanks again SWP, it's been about 9 months now since I last had time to stick my head under the hood of emc and wonder about pins and signals
[23:24:09] <SWPadnos> heh - have fun
[23:24:09] <skinnypuppy1334> ebay seller 800
[23:24:16] <ds2> oh
[23:24:26] <SWPadnos> and on that note, I think it's time for dinner. bbl
[23:24:33] <SWPadnos> do you mean 800watt?
[23:24:36] <SWPadnos> (the ebay seller)
[23:24:41] <skinnypuppy1334> yeah 800watt
[23:24:57] <SWPadnos> hmmm. interesting. how have your experiences with him been?
[23:25:05] <skinnypuppy1334> read he was slow and doesn't reply but it will show up one day... first time buyer
[23:25:32] <skinnypuppy1334> with 800watt
[23:25:35] <SWPadnos> ok. that's exactly the problem both a friend of mine and I had
[23:26:15] <skinnypuppy1334> From what I found on "the google" he presells and waits on the china boat
[23:26:27] <SWPadnos> yeah. that's a no-no
[23:26:34] <SWPadnos> you aren't supposed to sell what you don't have
[23:27:13] <skinnypuppy1334> Yeah not too nice, but if it shows in the next 6 weeks i'll deal with it
[23:27:25] <SWPadnos> heh
[23:27:32] <SWPadnos> anyway - see you later. hungry time
[23:27:39] <skinnypuppy1334> CYA thanks again