#emc | Logs for 2007-08-26

[00:14:10] <sed__> fenn do you have any experiance editing a post processor for MC?
[01:13:07] <robin_sz> meep?
[03:05:37] <fenn> sed__ nope, never used a post processor myself, just heard that's what worked for others
[03:08:03] <toast> never used a post processor?
[03:08:10] <toast> you write all your g-code by hand?
[03:08:26] <fenn> yeah, that's why i dont make much stuff
[03:12:26] <maddash> omg, my neighbors are high
[03:25:07] <toast> brb visiting maddash's neighbors
[03:28:32] <maddash> too late, they're finished
[03:28:38] <Jymmm> ?
[03:28:57] <Jymmm> they skinny dipping or something?
[03:29:01] <maddash> ^^toast
[03:29:09] <maddash> no, just giggling excessively
[03:29:49] <maddash> woohoo, i just chop-chopped another ap
[03:32:10] <maddash> no FBI affiliates here, right?
[03:32:17] <fenn> you are being monitored
[03:33:24] <Skullworks-PGAB> NSA is reading everything...
[03:33:58] <maddash> I wonder if they care about my activities...
[03:36:22] <fenn> no
[03:39:02] <maddash> wonderful.
[03:40:46] <toast> pew pew
[03:41:05] <toast> does anyone own or use a large lathe
[03:41:19] <Skullworks-PGAB> large = ?
[03:41:27] <toast> 30+ swing
[03:41:29] <toast> inches
[03:41:42] <toast> something like 30"x120" or larger
[03:42:26] <Skullworks-PGAB> nope
[03:42:58] <Skullworks-PGAB> best Ive done was a 24" - and that was long ago and far away
[03:43:12] <Skullworks-PGAB> top speed of 470rpm
[03:43:34] <toast> that's close
[03:43:46] <toast> but probably too low on rpm to be a valid thing for what i'm about to ask
[03:44:03] <toast> i've seen a bunch of those size lathes, 25/30/35" swing
[03:44:08] <toast> that will spin about 1k rpm
[03:44:13] <toast> or a bit under
[03:44:28] <toast> so I was wondering if there was an advantage to running smaller jobs on a bigger machine
[03:44:32] <toast> or if it was just too awkward
[03:45:01] <Skullworks-PGAB> it was a PITA
[03:45:16] <toast> what parts bothered you
[03:45:34] <Skullworks-PGAB> I used that monster to make a bunch of 1/2-20 studs
[03:45:55] <Skullworks-PGAB> single point
[03:46:12] <toast> why did it suck, though
[03:47:14] <Skullworks-PGAB> for one thing you did not want to get in close to the work with a huge chuck swinging right next to you
[03:47:50] <Skullworks-PGAB> a 24" 4 jaw is a lot of iron with plenty of ways to grab you
[03:48:05] <toast> yeah, we have a CNC with a chuck near that size
[03:48:11] <toast> it is quite frightening to see it move at 3000 rpm
[03:48:42] <toast> but i can always put a smaller chuck on the thing, like a 12"
[03:48:53] <Skullworks-PGAB> they mainly had 3 or 4 jaw chucks - hated to swap them out cause its a 2 man job to lift them out of the machine
[03:49:03] <toast> no crane?
[03:49:34] <toast> that's a bear man
[03:50:06] <toast> but was there anything about the machine itself
[03:50:08] <toast> that sucked?
[03:50:09] <Skullworks-PGAB> I did get to use it with a 5C adaptor once - since we were going to be mounting a faceplate to bore some tooling plates
[03:50:38] <Skullworks-PGAB> so I put that up between jobs
[03:51:18] <toast> haha
[03:51:53] <Skullworks-PGAB> I like a good sized machine - they cut smoother with all that iron to damp things
[03:52:04] <Skullworks-PGAB> 15-17"
[03:52:05] <toast> i agree
[03:52:16] <Skullworks-PGAB> same on CNC
[03:52:18] <toast> the Leblond at school is a 16" swing
[03:52:39] <Skullworks-PGAB> want a 10" chuck and a big turret
[03:52:43] <toast> but i'm kind of curious if there's a functioning difference between working on a 16" machine versus a huge 30" machine
[03:52:58] <Skullworks-PGAB> and min 2" thru the draw tube
[03:53:25] <Skullworks-PGAB> lag and inertia
[03:53:26] <toast> 16/25c collets!
[03:53:56] <Skullworks-PGAB> harder to stop on an exact Z
[03:54:11] <toast> yeah, but most of our stuff have hard depth stops
[03:54:21] <toast> makes repeatable Z pretty easy on our stuff
[03:54:26] <Skullworks-PGAB> 16C doesn't mean big
[03:54:28] <toast> only one machine is bar fed
[03:54:43] <toast> what do you mean?
[03:55:04] <Skullworks-PGAB> have some tiny Mazaks that use 16C collet chucks
[03:55:06] <toast> bigger than a 5c
[03:55:29] <toast> all our machines take 16c
[03:55:33] <toast> even the super tiny ones, i know
[03:55:41] <Skullworks-PGAB> machine is like a 5x5x4 cube
[03:55:46] <toast> but we have two that take 25C, and those take 2.5"
[03:55:50] <toast> or something
[03:56:06] <Skullworks-PGAB> yeah25 is getting up there
[03:56:12] <toast> easier to set than a chuck
[03:56:17] <toast> nice size
[03:56:18] <Skullworks-PGAB> we use those on the inertia welder
[03:56:24] <toast> too bad they're expensive
[03:57:16] <Skullworks-PGAB> I think those Mazaks are like 3hp
[03:57:17] <toast> my favourite lathe at work is our big Mori Seiki
[03:57:31] <toast> lots of room to work, can stand inside the machine to change stuff out
[03:57:52] <Skullworks-PGAB> ooooh the Rolls Royce of Nippon lathes
[03:57:56] <toast> Nippon?
[03:58:09] <toast> ohhh
[03:58:09] <Skullworks-PGAB> Japan
[03:58:21] <toast> it really is
[03:58:32] <toast> all our other lathes drift over time except that mori
[03:58:38] <toast> and the mori is real old
[03:59:04] <toast> turns stuff more accurately than the other machines, and hogs a lot harder
[03:59:12] <toast> easy to set up, easy to prove programs on
[03:59:15] <Skullworks-PGAB> to bad they sold off all there manual machine stuff to there Korean subsiderary Hwacheon
[03:59:42] <toast> did they?
[03:59:44] <toast> that sucks a lot
[03:59:48] <Skullworks-PGAB> but manual machines don't have the profit margine of CNC
[04:00:15] <toast> indeed
[04:00:16] <Skullworks-PGAB> yeah years ago - early 90's or late 80's
[04:00:29] <toast> the only manual lathes I'm really familiar with are the old brands
[04:00:49] <toast> modern stuff I only know of Sharp, Birmingham, Ikeagi, Mori, and Mazak
[04:00:57] <Skullworks-PGAB> and we don't make any in the U.S. anymore
[04:01:13] <toast> yar =(
[04:01:43] <Skullworks-PGAB> Harding makes small stuff - nothing you'd want to use on anything over 6"
[04:01:46] <toast> if I had to buy a manual machine I'd rather pay for an old American or Axleson and get it refitted
[04:01:54] <toast> for a business, anyway
[04:02:45] <Skullworks-PGAB> I'd like to find a LeBlond - simply because they were designed to have feild replaceable ways
[04:03:43] <Skullworks-PGAB> just bolt up a fresh set and the bed will be good as new - hopefully the gearbox has been treated well.
[04:05:34] <Skullworks-PGAB> I like the Mori and Okuma manual lathes better - they run much quiter - but you are out of luck if anything goes wrong - they have been out of production a good 20+ years
[04:06:10] <Skullworks-PGAB> Makino dropped the LeBlond lathe in the late 90's
[04:06:13] <toast> unfortunately from what I've seen, finding a leblond is easy
[04:06:18] <toast> in great condition, no less
[04:06:26] <toast> they're just 5k for a machine with no accessories
[04:06:28] <Skullworks-PGAB> so spares might be found
[04:06:38] <toast> Leblond parts are still made
[04:06:43] <toast> even from the very first conehead lathes
[04:06:58] <toast> call them up, they will either send you the drawings for the part or make it for you
[04:07:09] <Skullworks-PGAB> call who?
[04:07:17] <toast> Makino/Leblond
[04:08:06] <Skullworks-PGAB> far as I know all leblond stuff was phased out before Y2K
[04:08:12] <toast> it is phased out
[04:08:14] <toast> you can't buy new lathes
[04:08:24] <toast> but they still support all of the old gear.
[04:08:33] <toast> it's not cheap, but they still support it if you MUST have a factory part.
[04:09:38] <Skullworks-PGAB> I need a building to put machines in
[04:09:45] <toast> there are guys on practialmachinist with details on how to get stuff from them, and I believe my school also gets stuff the same way
[04:09:50] <toast> haha yeah =(
[04:10:03] <toast> are you using a garage right now?
[04:10:19] <Skullworks-PGAB> I get offers of great deals I have to turn down cause theres no place to put it
[04:10:27] <Skullworks-PGAB> house has no garage
[04:10:33] <toast> damn
[04:10:56] <Skullworks-PGAB> I have my big mill in my kitchen
[04:11:19] <Skullworks-PGAB> and thats just to keep it stored in a temp controlled area
[04:11:40] <Skullworks-PGAB> I was going to buy a ranch and move when I ordered it
[04:12:37] <Skullworks-PGAB> I backed out - company was doing 'strange' things that made me nervous.
[04:13:10] <Skullworks-PGAB> did not want to start a new mortgage and find the plant was closing
[04:13:28] <Skullworks-PGAB> and my gut was right
[04:14:07] <Skullworks-PGAB> seems a deal went thru and we are in a buy out from our parent company
[04:14:19] <toast> snap
[04:14:35] <Skullworks-PGAB> so plant is not closing - but is forming a seperate LLC
[04:14:50] <toast> is that good news for you or bad news?
[04:15:22] <Skullworks-PGAB> but it means we have to re-apply for our jobs, and all new benefit package has to be worked out
[04:15:35] <toast> union shop?
[04:15:57] <toast> and that re-applying thing might be a blessing or a curse, i guess
[04:16:20] <Skullworks-PGAB> has yet to be seen - if not hired by the break away LLC I will get a severence pkg from parent corp
[04:17:10] <Skullworks-PGAB> some are thinking of taking the severence package and applying later - like an extended vacation
[04:17:21] <Skullworks-PGAB> 4-6 months
[04:17:29] <Skullworks-PGAB> that would be nice
[04:17:40] <toast> provided they can get their jobs
[04:17:45] <Skullworks-PGAB> not union
[04:19:33] <toast> i've considered trying to find a better paying place, which would be very easy
[04:19:48] <toast> but the place i am working now is giving me experience and they're willing to take me on field trips
[04:19:49] <Skullworks-PGAB> they lost most of there best people in the last year - management was cutting corners to horde cash for the buyout - and pissing off people in a bad way on how the did things
[04:20:01] <toast> oh crap
[04:20:32] <Skullworks-PGAB> I'll have been there 3yrs in OCT
[04:20:36] <toast> oct?
[04:20:38] <toast> oph
[04:20:41] <toast> october
[04:20:44] <toast> i thought that was some department
[04:20:46] <Skullworks-PGAB> yes
[04:22:00] <Skullworks-PGAB> and I'm up to about 6th in day shift seniority
[04:22:49] <Skullworks-PGAB> thats counting down from the machine shop production manager
[04:22:53] <toast> how large a department
[04:23:52] <Skullworks-PGAB> 24 people on days - 20 on nights
[04:24:31] <Skullworks-PGAB> but we are understaffed at those numbers
[04:25:23] <Skullworks-PGAB> and they are hiring - plus putting on a crew of 7 for a weekend skeleton shift
[04:25:50] <toast> what kind of jobs do you guys do
[04:27:40] <Skullworks-PGAB> start with extruded AL tubing and form end journals - cut to lenth, paint the ID, finish turn, grit blast, teflon coat, final caotings - silicon moldings, and pack for shipment
[04:28:02] <toast> cool
[04:28:09] <Skullworks-PGAB> make fuser rollers for high speed laser printers and copy machines
[04:28:27] <Skullworks-PGAB> about 4800 a day
[04:28:36] <toast> oh yes
[04:28:38] <toast> you mentioned this
[04:29:08] <Skullworks-PGAB> zombie work
[04:29:22] <Skullworks-PGAB> same part familys - over and over
[04:29:31] <Skullworks-PGAB> nothing new
[04:30:15] <toast> yar
[04:30:24] <toast> i'm familiar with that kind of thing =(
[04:30:24] <Skullworks-PGAB> wish I could go back to doing proto type work - but the work flow isn't there - no money in it.
[04:30:49] <toast> we are fortunate in that our product is expensive enough that prototype work is profitable
[04:31:06] <toast> so we do get that kind of thing through the shop if a person wants to work on it
[04:32:32] <Skullworks-PGAB> I used Solidworks, and Bobcad/cam plus the built in Hurco conversational as well as the CAM output for the Mori & Okuma mills.
[04:33:15] <Skullworks-PGAB> I used to go to lunch with a client and go over print details - or even a rough sketch
[04:33:39] <Skullworks-PGAB> then drop buy with the finished part by 4pm
[04:33:59] <toast> haha
[04:34:25] <Skullworks-PGAB> That is what really built my rep - same day working parts
[04:35:07] <Skullworks-PGAB> but most of the customers we had have gone overseas - not much local work
[04:36:33] <Skullworks-PGAB> so now I push the green button making fuser rollers becuase the work is steady and enough OT to choke on.
[04:36:50] <toast> damn man.
[04:37:17] <Skullworks-PGAB> there is good work ing other cities
[04:37:39] <Skullworks-PGAB> but I'm not sure I want to migrate
[04:39:13] <Skullworks-PGAB> there is still enough proto work to make a good sideline - just don't count on it being steady
[04:53:27] <maddash> does the g43 h* setting affect the coordinates returned in manual mode?
[05:33:27] <toast> maddash: in emc or what
[07:01:32] <toast> ff
[10:50:15] <dede> helle everybody