#emc | Logs for 2007-05-04

[00:17:52] <toastydeath> BO JANGLES
[00:58:53] <Jymmmmmmm> Yeah, I have enough problems as it is to deal with, I like my STABLE pACKAGES
[01:00:20] <Jymmmmmmm> anonimasu: Yeah, I had been thinking about getting some geckos earlier today, especially after I got the cost of the encoders + cable = $100 + tax and shipping/each
[01:01:08] <Jymmmmmmm> Now to find a transformer and make a power supply.
[01:03:20] <Jymmmmmmm> I've had a cse for this for a year or so.... but I want to do it right.... SSR for the spindle control, another for the dust collection. a REAL ESTOP , etc =)
[01:03:24] <Jymmmmmmm> case
[01:04:27] <Jymmmmmmm> anyone have a greenlee DB25 punch by chance???
[01:04:53] <jmkasunich> no, we use CNC for that!
[01:05:14] <Jymmmmmmm> I can't, this is bent in a U shape
[01:06:02] <Jymmmmmmm> plus I really dont want to machine metals... no collant and more importantly the birds
[01:06:05] <cradek> http://timeguy.com/cradek/01166390211
[01:06:48] <Jymmmmmmm> Okey, a plastic plate it just might be =)
[01:08:45] <Jymmmmmmm> cradek: thank you
[01:08:55] <Jymmmmmmm> ~~~~~
[01:08:57] <cradek> sure
[01:09:45] <Jymmmmmmm> Just in case you guys were ever wondering WHY I do the ~~~~~ thing, it's so I can easily search the logs months/years from now even if I forget the subject matter
[01:10:25] <tomp> (now we can all put spurious ~~~~~~ into the files at will ;)
[01:10:31] <Jymmmmmmm> np
[01:13:09] <Jymmmmmmm> I some some tiny steppers the other day, maybe 1.5" sq, couldn't see their ratings though. thought it be cool for a portable milling/engraver of sorts. Just would like to find a low profile spindle. Dremel just doens't seem "right" if ya know what I mean.
[01:13:17] <Jymmmmmmm> ^found
[01:14:25] <tomp> use them for this arm engraver http://www.we-make-money-not-art.com/archives/006910.php
[01:14:48] <tomp> note use of clothespins
[01:15:41] <Jymmmmmmm> Yeah, wouldn't want a tattoo of a wrinkled nakkid chick on my arm now
[01:16:22] <Jymmmmmmm> Plus is I DO get geckos, I dont want the xylotex to go to waste.
[01:16:36] <Jymmmmmmm> s/is/if/
[01:47:35] <K`zan> Jymmmmmmm: Wow, you still haven't got for the Geckos?
[01:47:52] <K`zan> I'm still drooling on them and collecting my pennies :-(.
[01:50:46] <toastydeath> i read that "collecting pancakes"
[01:50:50] <toastydeath> and got hungry
[02:34:37] <Jymmmmmmm> K`zan: No, I HAVE xylotex already
[02:35:39] <Jymmmmmmm> K`zan: you could always collect cans and bottles, at least you'll get a nickle
[02:36:37] <K`zan> Here the gov takes those and sells them for itself...
[02:37:27] <K`zan> Jymmm: I knew you had the xylotex already but I figured you'd be on the geckos already (I may be living in a time warp here :-).
[02:37:40] <K`zan> Jymmmmmmm: I knew you had the xylotex already but I figured you'd be on the geckos already (I may be living in a time warp here :-).
[02:37:46] <Jymmmmmmm> fuck me... is this worth it? http://cgi.ebay.com/50V-10A-Power-Supply-Gecko-Driver-CNC-Servo-Stepper_W0QQitemZ270115906448QQihZ017QQcategoryZ11772QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
[02:38:16] <Jymmmmmmm> K`zan: nah, still trying to figure out what the problems are.
[02:38:35] <K`zan> Certainly a plug and play solutuon there fro the $130...
[02:38:50] <Jymmmmmmm> 50V caps seems a lil on the low side
[02:39:08] <K`zan> The xylotec is tempting at this point, at least it would get me going for a LOT less $$$.
[02:39:23] <K`zan> Err, didn't notice that, I'd want at least 100V caps...
[02:39:34] <Jymmmmmmm> Yeah, no doubt
[02:39:56] <K`zan> The big discourager there is all the problems you have had with it :-(.
[02:40:45] <Jymmmmmmm> Yeah, I just dont wnat to throw unfounded money at the problems, if I by the gekos, then foind out it's the motor or power supply as example.
[02:41:18] <K`zan> Understand, lots of potential points of failure and all expensive :-( :-( :-( :-(.
[02:42:09] <Jymmmmmmm> Yep, though after checking the pricing on encoders, I'd rather spend the money on the drives. $100/each for encoders to just help diagnose
[02:42:27] <K`zan> Would be nice to have the $$$ to be able to replace things one at a time until you found it...
[02:42:48] <K`zan> Err, you can get Geckos for not much more than that.
[02:43:07] <Jymmmmmmm> well xylotex is 3axis board, so I have to replace all aixses
[02:43:28] <Jymmmmmmm> Yep, thus why looking into PS parts - considering not playing aorund anymore.
[02:43:43] <K`zan> Understand, but it is (IIRC) $130 each for the Geckos, $30 more than the encoders...
[02:43:47] <Jymmmmmmm> even looking at jon elsens baord or something simular
[02:43:51] <K`zan> $90 more for 3...
[02:43:57] <Jymmmmmmm> exactly
[02:44:35] <K`zan> Geckos would seem a rational approach, what are you going to do with $300 worth of encoders once you find the problem?
[02:56:25] <Guest191> Guest191 is now known as skunkworks
[02:58:11] <skunkworks> cradek: again - the eagle script is awsome.
[02:58:16] <skunkworks> awesome
[02:58:22] <cradek> cool, glad you like it
[02:58:52] <skunkworks> I have it ready to go - I really want to add a tool lenght switch though. It would make things so much easier
[03:00:19] <cradek> yeah that's pretty neat, I'm sold on the idea here
[03:01:35] <skunkworks> I found a microswitch that requires very little force. I will flatten the plunger and see how repeatable it is
[03:02:08] <cradek> I bent the lever on mine so it triggers when the lever is horizontal (by eyeball) and it's surprisingly repeatable
[03:03:08] <skunkworks> I am afraid if it is metal that it could break the tip off of the tinker bits though.. My only issue.
[03:03:33] <cradek> I bet it's fine as long as they go straight down to the switch
[03:05:50] <skunkworks> going to see america tomorrow night ;)
[03:15:09] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i still haven't figured out which pcb i should mill for my first try.. maybe a db25 lpt breakout board... with interchangeable pins via screw terminals...
[03:15:39] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i could draw that easily in autocad i think...
[03:16:47] <cradek> heh I've drawn pc boards in autocad - doublesided even
[03:16:58] <cradek> it really sucks
[03:17:03] <cradek> even eagle is better :-)
[03:17:11] <ohiopctechDOTcom> sweet.. you can do the bottom points by mirroring...
[03:17:23] <skunkworks> So have I. My first 200watt per channel linear amlifier. Sucked
[03:17:24] <ohiopctechDOTcom> is eagle free?
[03:17:38] <cradek> there's a free-of-cost demo version with some limits
[03:17:39] <SWPLinux> eagle has a free (not Free) version
[03:17:41] <ohiopctechDOTcom> * ohiopctechDOTcom googles eagle
[03:17:48] <SWPLinux> try eagle cad
[03:17:57] <skunkworks> free as in beer - not speach?
[03:17:59] <SWPLinux> that should reduce the number of bird-related sites
[03:18:03] <SWPLinux> yes
[03:19:05] <ohiopctechDOTcom> is there a free .dxf library of elec. components?
[03:19:18] <skunkworks> trust us - use eagle.
[03:19:28] <ohiopctechDOTcom> lol, m'kay
[03:19:47] <skunkworks> It does schematic and board.
[03:20:16] <ohiopctechDOTcom> auto board gen from schematics?
[03:20:26] <CIA-8> 03jmkasunich 07TRUNK * 10emc2/src/emc/motion/ (command.c control.c mot_priv.h motion.c motion.h): rework soft limits - no fault, just limit the command
[03:20:27] <CIA-8> 03jmkasunich 07TRUNK * 10emc2/src/emc/task/taskintf.cc: rework soft limits - no fault, just limit the command
[03:20:28] <cradek> for some value of auto, yes
[03:20:29] <skunkworks> granted you will pull your hair out getting used to the gui - but once you are assimilated - life will be great.
[03:21:01] <ohiopctechDOTcom> can't be as bad as the emc software i heard about...
[03:21:08] <ohiopctechDOTcom> * ohiopctechDOTcom grins
[03:21:13] <ohiopctechDOTcom> ;)
[03:22:05] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i am totally kidding... i just cut another part tonight for a buddy.. in exchange for a pile of lexan!
[03:22:09] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i love emc!
[03:27:37] <ohiopctechDOTcom> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=320108391999&ssPageName=ADME:B:WNA:US:12
[03:27:47] <ohiopctechDOTcom> **a ballscrew i think...
[03:28:14] <ohiopctechDOTcom> **with an encoder possibly
[03:29:23] <skunkworks> doesn't look like a ballscrew. looks like a multi lead something or other
[03:29:35] <ohiopctechDOTcom> it's ended
[03:29:50] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i guess i opened the email too late
[03:30:09] <ohiopctechDOTcom> that seller has a buncha stuff for cnc building though
[03:30:42] <CIA-8> 03jmkasunich 07TRUNK * 10emc2/src/emc/motion/ (control.c mot_priv.h motion.c): add hal param for 'on-soft-limit', probably temporary, for debug and testing only
[03:31:45] <ohiopctechDOTcom> http://cgi.ebay.com/National-Laser-Company-Argon-ion-Laser-HN61BLalis_W0QQitemZ320109585501QQihZ011QQcategoryZ53141QQtcZphotoQQcmdZViewItem
[03:31:56] <ohiopctechDOTcom> diy laser cutter?
[03:33:27] <toastydeath> looks like a ballscrew to me
[03:34:02] <ohiopctechDOTcom> http://cgi.ebay.com/LOT-of-3-StepSyn-Stepping-Motors-1-8-Type-103H7126-Box_W0QQitemZ320109189418QQihZ011QQcategoryZ78196QQtcZphotoQQcmdZViewItem
[03:35:33] <ohiopctechDOTcom> http://cgi.ebay.com/Bimba-11-Air-Tanks-D-11846-A-8-Lot-of-4_W0QQitemZ320110681034QQihZ011QQcategoryZ109498QQtcZphotoQQcmdZViewItem
[03:35:50] <ohiopctechDOTcom> that's a good buy even if you don't need them for the air tanks
[03:36:36] <ohiopctechDOTcom> maybe part of a stripped out air cynlinder?
[03:37:43] <toastydeath> maybe an accumulator
[03:37:56] <toastydeath> they look like accumulators, but i can't see
[03:38:04] <ohiopctechDOTcom> yeah...
[03:38:08] <tomp> i have some 'Universal' brand leadscrews, i thought were ball, but arent, they're 2 soild nuts held in a tortion tube to remove backlash... and they're stiff to turn. any ideas on how to loosen? http://www.universal-thread.com/lead.htm
[03:38:15] <ohiopctechDOTcom> ther eis no bracket at the back like a cylinder...
[03:38:47] <ohiopctechDOTcom> put some clover all over them and run it back n forth till its smooth
[03:38:50] <toastydeath> tomp: some nuts have an adjustment
[03:38:53] <ohiopctechDOTcom> then wipe the clover off
[03:38:59] <toastydeath> like, a lock nut
[03:39:09] <toastydeath> where you can back the halfnut out a little bit
[03:39:12] <toastydeath> like on a bridgeport
[03:40:02] <ohiopctechDOTcom> http://cgi.ebay.com/Micro-Controle-Klinger-Scienfic-Manual-Linear-Stage_W0QQitemZ320109847350QQihZ011QQcategoryZ111541QQtcZphotoQQcmdZViewItem
[03:40:02] <SWPadnos> tomp, do you think it's dried-up lube causing a lot of stiction, or just an overtight nut?
[03:40:09] <tomp> these are solid nuts and the torq-tube is just a flexi-link between the two for tension and for any mis-alignment.
[03:40:35] <SWPadnos> well, is it tough but smooth, or a little rough also?
[03:41:04] <tomp> SWPadnos: i cant tell, i';ve been WD40ing and rung them back & forth for a couple hours... no change... maybe these are just stiff ( 10microinch accruacy)
[03:41:25] <ohiopctechDOTcom> that's some tight tolerance
[03:41:26] <SWPadnos> ok, I was going to suggest what you've been doing, so you're at the extent of my expertise now ;)
[03:41:32] <toastydeath> tomp:
[03:41:41] <toastydeath> you need to see if there's any way to reduce the pressure
[03:42:01] <toastydeath> ask the manufacturer, or something
[03:42:08] <toastydeath> also have you put it on the machine?
[03:42:40] <tomp> yep, i'm emailing the mfctr
[03:42:41] <toastydeath> what is this going into, by the way
[03:42:49] <ohiopctechDOTcom> http://cgi.ebay.com/LinTech-M2-Twin-Rail-Linear-Table-Positioning-Stage_W0QQitemZ320109241953QQihZ011QQcategoryZ55826QQtcZphotoQQcmdZViewItem
[03:42:50] <ohiopctechDOTcom> ok.. i'm done with the links
[03:42:57] <tomp> sink edm
[03:43:08] <toastydeath> don't worry about the pressure then
[03:44:29] <toastydeath> that rigidity is going to be good
[03:44:29] <toastydeath> for your application
[03:44:29] <toastydeath> since you don't have a ballscrew.
[03:44:29] <ohiopctechDOTcom> that machine will be moving slow anyways right?
[03:44:29] <toastydeath> if it was going on a manual machine, i could understand maybe wanting it loose
[03:44:43] <tomp> ? slow is hard to do! any bind stalls the motor at low speed, edm gotta be very free to handle very slow velocity, any bind and it'll stall at .000001mm/day ( edm area)
[03:45:07] <toastydeath> can you use a higher torque motor?
[03:45:18] <tomp> yeh, thats the alternative, more torq
[03:45:30] <toastydeath> i do not think that is the right screw for your application
[03:45:39] <toastydeath> that's the kind of screw you see in a horizontal
[03:45:41] <toastydeath> mill
[03:45:41] <ohiopctechDOTcom> gear it 4:1 or more?
[03:46:42] <tomp> 30:1 is the plan 1:5 and 1:6 combined
[03:46:50] <ohiopctechDOTcom> oh wow
[03:47:01] <tomp> low top evlocity, great lo velocity
[03:47:24] <tomp> and a backslide to get it close quicker
[03:48:26] <ohiopctechDOTcom> sink edm is jsut a copper probe with juice on i right?
[03:48:32] <ohiopctechDOTcom> it*
[03:48:46] <toastydeath> it can be one of several materials, but yes.
[03:49:57] <ohiopctechDOTcom> do you have any of it built yet?
[03:50:04] <ohiopctechDOTcom> or pics? i'm curious
[03:50:10] <tomp> i've cut wave guides for raytheon and door panels for ford, turbines for saab and spinnerrettes for kodak... its the stuf mills and lathes cant do :)
[03:50:12] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i've never seen one
[03:50:45] <toastydeath> it's similar in appearence to a small mil
[03:50:46] <toastydeath> l
[03:50:47] <tomp> the pics were on the wiki and one is at my site http://tag-edm.com
[03:52:05] <tomp> thats a small machine running at 300 amps :)
[03:53:12] <ohiopctechDOTcom> your products link is broked'd
[03:53:17] <ohiopctechDOTcom> fyi*
[03:54:12] <ohiopctechDOTcom> looks like a beast
[03:54:17] <ohiopctechDOTcom> the machine**
[03:54:17] <tomp> no products ! i scraped in that slide and converted the hydraulics to an ac drive, added a Taiwanese generator and tuned it, runs 24-7 in a forging house now
[03:55:01] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i'd like to build my on wire edm someday soon
[03:55:10] <ohiopctechDOTcom> own*
[03:55:23] <ohiopctechDOTcom> a small one..
[03:55:25] <tomp> the old iron is better than a new machine, the neck is several times bigger than a new machine, just way stiffer.
[03:56:11] <Jymmm> Do these look about right? http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-4-Cornell-Dubilier-26-000mf-85vdc-capacitors_W0QQitemZ230124388052QQihZ013QQcategoryZ111603QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
[03:56:27] <Jymmm> thinking 48VDC PS around 10A
[03:57:08] <ohiopctechDOTcom> charge 4 of those up in series and hook them with aligator clamps to someones nipples
[03:57:33] <Jymmm> if by nipples you mean steppers, sure.
[03:57:46] <ohiopctechDOTcom> **don't try that at home, stunt geeks are trained professionals***
[03:58:19] <tomp> for 48V= should be good ( 1.5 x ) and i dont think you need all 4, maybe just 1 ( 2000uF/amp is overkill )
[03:58:52] <ds2> Jymmm: if you dumpster dive at work, you might find 48V PS
[03:59:11] <Jymmm> ds2 most PC's dont have that sized caps.
[03:59:19] <ds2> not the caps, the 48V rectifiers
[03:59:25] <ohiopctechDOTcom> **if i didn't have a job 8-4 i would be in dumpsters all over the ity every night
[03:59:32] <ohiopctechDOTcom> city*
[03:59:49] <CIA-8> 03jmkasunich 07TRUNK * 10emc2/src/emc/motion/command.c: refuse to jog farther out of limits
[04:00:11] <tomp> if you dont see the voltage rise with cap #2, then cap #1 is sufficient
[04:00:13] <ds2> prehaps stuff tossed out from a nonpaying customer ;)
[04:00:51] <ohiopctechDOTcom> ... oh no i just got an email from the old redhead i was doin a few months ago... should i read it .. :o
[04:01:01] <SWPadnos> Mariss recommends 80000*I/V microfarads
[04:01:09] <SWPadnos> (in case you ever switch to geckos)
[04:01:36] <ds2> for large caps, I'd look at deanza before spending a dime
[04:01:42] <SWPadnos> that works out to around 17000 uF for a 48V/10A supply
[04:01:45] <Jymmm> SWPadnos it's a lot of four 26000 - close enough inparallel you think?
[04:01:56] <SWPadnos> no, parallel adds to capacitance
[04:02:06] <ds2> just 17mF?
[04:02:07] <SWPadnos> just one should be sufficient, if it has the current capacity
[04:02:09] <Jymmm> thhought you sais 80000uF
[04:02:23] <SWPadnos> 80000 * I (current) / V (voltage)
[04:02:25] <tomp> mariss sez 16666.666666667 for 10amp at 48V (check my math )
[04:02:41] <SWPadnos> I did the math, that's why I rounded up to 17000 ;)
[04:02:55] <SWPadnos> (I was only using my head, so I thought it would be OK :) )
[04:02:57] <ds2> hmmm that's 20J of energy
[04:03:40] <SWPadnos> right - plenty
[04:03:43] <Jymmm> ok so that's 13000uF if a parallel two of then
[04:03:57] <SWPadnos> no, capacitors add in parallel
[04:03:59] <ds2> 20J could do a lot of damage to a screw driver
[04:04:04] <Jymmm> ok series
[04:04:16] <SWPadnos> you're better off with only one
[04:04:24] <Jymmm> why?
[04:04:32] <tomp> didnt see you state it, sorry, just caught formula
[04:04:32] <SWPadnos> or you need power resistors to balance the voltages on the series caps
[04:04:38] <SWPadnos> heh ;)
[04:04:50] <SWPadnos> just use one, it'll be fine
[04:04:59] <SWPadnos> the worst thing you can do is blow up your transformer
[04:05:15] <Jymmm> so is that cap too much or ok?
[04:05:23] <Jymmm> the auction closes in 30
[04:05:28] <SWPadnos> 26k should be fine, but it is a little high
[04:05:40] <Jymmm> and that's too much filtering?
[04:05:40] <tomp> yeh . too much caps look like a short to your charging system ( trafo and bridge )
[04:05:45] <SWPadnos> the pains of series-connected caps aren't worth it
[04:05:46] <Jymmm> ah, ok
[04:06:15] <SWPadnos> actually, too high a capacitance reduces the time duration of the current pulse from the transformer that recharges the cap
[04:06:42] <SWPadnos> since you're still trying to draw all the power, that means the current goes up (shorter time * higher current = same power)
[04:06:45] <ds2> but the core saturation should keep the current in check
[04:06:45] <Jymmm> ok, makes sense
[04:07:00] <SWPadnos> since transformer heating is proportional to I^2, the transformer heats up more
[04:07:19] <SWPadnos> saturation causes more losses in the xformer, doesn't it?
[04:07:33] <SWPadnos> loss == heating ...
[04:07:44] <ds2> yes, more loss but it is short term
[04:08:10] <ds2> one would hope you cap will hold a charge ;)
[04:08:37] <SWPadnos> sure, but since it's I^2, if you have 10x the current for 1/10 the time, the average power is still 10x (100x power * 0.1x time)
[04:09:06] <tomp> Jymmm: if you can get those for 12$, grab 'em and built 4 20 amp supplies. it's a good deal
[04:09:08] <SWPadnos> average power loss, that is - the average delivered to the load is the same
[04:09:54] <ds2> yes but it also has the effect of limiting the current a bit so it isn't as bad as it looks
[04:10:07] <SWPadnos> ok - fair enough
[04:10:16] <SWPadnos> I was surprised at that failure mode actually
[04:10:28] <ds2> it looks like tau is about 0.1 sec so if the surge rating has a suitable max time....
[04:10:28] <SWPadnos> I wouldn't have thought that more filtering would cause that kind of problem
[04:10:58] <ds2> with that much current, I wonder if a choke is better
[04:12:22] <Jymmm> I REALLY need to find a better source for caps than ebay
[04:12:22] <SWPadnos> are you thinking of inrush current, or normal operation?
[04:12:22] <ds2> Jymmm: deanaz
[04:12:22] <ds2> both
[04:12:22] <Jymmm> ds2 this weekend?
[04:12:22] <SWPadnos> don't knock eBay - I've gotten some very good ones there
[04:12:22] <ds2> and chokes don't dry out
[04:12:23] <SWPadnos> of course, they're dielectrics and I haven't put them under full power yet ...
[04:12:23] <ds2> Jymmm: let me look it up
[04:12:27] <Jymmm> SWPadnos just hard to find on ebay
[04:12:34] <SWPadnos> hmmm
[04:12:54] <Jymmm> I had to enter in '000' just to get 16 or 17 KuF
[04:12:58] <ds2> May 12
[04:13:09] <Jymmm> ds2 Ah
[04:13:21] <Jymmm> I work that night so I doubt I'll be there
[04:13:27] <ds2> oh
[04:13:36] <Jymmm> I usually arrive at 6am
[04:13:41] <Jymmm> or earlier
[04:13:52] <Jymmm> I'm gone by 8am
[04:13:55] <ds2> can't move it so you work the day before?
[04:14:02] <ds2> then just go after work ;)
[04:14:16] <Jymmm> ds2 I wish, my days off are Th and Fr
[04:14:33] <Jymmm> ds2 that would be perfect
[04:16:44] <ds2> there are always those in the brake controller on the Prius ;)
[04:17:52] <Jymmm> Nah, I stopped carrying portable impact wrenches and cinder blocks anymore
[04:17:58] <SWPadnos> heh -I take it you got to the teardowen on one or two occasions?
[04:23:00] <Jymmmmmmm> to get 48VDC, I need what voltage xfmr?
[04:23:42] <tomp> i see Universal screw says the stiffness of these leadscrews is "5 lb /.0001"" http://www.universal-thread.com/lead2.htm what are they trying to say? ( it doesnt look like torq needed to begin motion )
[04:23:45] <SWPadnos> 48 / sqrt(2)
[04:23:58] <tomp> Jymmm: yep what SWPadnos said
[04:24:17] <SWPadnos> plus a little to allow for losses in the bridge rectifier
[04:24:49] <ds2> SWPadnos: *nod*
[04:24:51] <Jymmmmmmm> 1.4V for the bridge loss?
[04:25:05] <SWPadnos> around a volt or so
[04:25:15] <SWPadnos> or 1.4 - that's probably fine too
[04:25:15] <tomp> 34v AC -> bridge and caps -> about 48V=
[04:25:16] <ds2> the prius has to be good for something... even if it just as a parts store ;)
[04:25:27] <Jymmmmmmm> I was always under the impression that a diode has a 0.7 volt loss
[04:25:31] <SWPadnos> kind of an expensive store though
[04:25:42] <SWPadnos> power full bridges are closer to 1 or 1.1 V
[04:25:43] <ds2> a bridge has 2 diodes in a series
[04:25:57] <Jymmmmmmm> right like I said 1.4V
[04:26:14] <Jymmmmmmm> 34VAC ?! more like 68VAC isn't it?
[04:26:17] <ds2> but then you could start with schottky
[04:26:19] <SWPadnos> I don't think your supply will be accurate to 0.4V, so I wouldn't worry about that decimal ;)
[04:26:38] <SWPadnos> 34VAC * sqrt(2) ~= 49.3V or some such
[04:26:47] <Jymmmmmmm> wtf am I thinking
[04:27:16] <ds2> isn't it easier to find a used telco rectifier?
[04:27:22] <SWPadnos> hmm - actually, it's 48.03, so you might want 35VAC
[04:27:30] <ds2> 10A should be pretty small, 1U or less
[04:27:55] <Jymmmmmmm> ds2: I dont know of any place to find them from
[04:28:04] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i have a bunch of old pc power supplies here with transformers in themm.. i read there should be a bridge rectifier in them but i dont see one...
[04:28:16] <ohiopctechDOTcom> do they look different sometimes from the black square type?
[04:28:35] <SWPadnos> it may look like a large-ish flat package with 4 pins (in a straight line) sticking into the PCB
[04:28:50] <tomp> 1/2 kW power is not built with a small bridge ( and use a full wave 4 diode bridge if using single phase current source )
[04:28:52] <SWPadnos> almost like a large transistor with an extra pin, but much larger
[04:29:08] <ohiopctechDOTcom> ahh
[04:30:10] <ohiopctechDOTcom> ok i found something.. it's labeled dp6 on the circut board
[04:30:22] <ohiopctechDOTcom> 4 pins.. flat black.. standing on it's side
[04:30:31] <SWPadnos> this page shows several typeshttp://dkc3.digikey.com/PDF/T072/P1144.pdf
[04:30:36] <SWPadnos> this page shows several types: http://dkc3.digikey.com/PDF/T072/P1144.pdf
[04:31:04] <ohiopctechDOTcom> pc power supplies are a good source for heatsinks also
[04:31:09] <SWPadnos> figure 1 (in the lower section) is what I was thinking of, but 6 and 7 (at the top) could also be in there
[04:31:12] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i tore about 5 apart yesterday
[04:31:40] <ohiopctechDOTcom> ok.. the one in the PS in my hand is like fig. 6
[04:31:46] <ohiopctechDOTcom> sweet
[04:31:56] <ds2> his should work good -
[04:31:59] <ds2> http://www.allelectronics.com/cgi-bin/item/FWB-156W/110/15_AMP,_600_VOLT_BRIDGE_RECTIFIER_.html
[04:32:00] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i should be able to do something with these
[04:32:56] <ds2> oh any one has opinions on Fowler measuring tools?
[04:33:02] <ds2> micrometers in particular
[04:33:05] <ohiopctechDOTcom> ehh this power supply was from a chicks computer the insideof it smells like baby powedr ... (i was looking close and smelled it..)
[04:33:25] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i used to have a few fowlers from the days when my grandpa was in the shop
[04:33:33] <Jymmmmmmm> http://cgi.ebay.com/35-35V-600VA-Toroid-Toroidal-Transformer-Power-Amp-HiFi_W0QQitemZ7612485272QQihZ017QQcategoryZ4660QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
[04:33:37] <Jymmmmmmm> whats 35+35
[04:33:39] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i don't have them only because my dad is holding my tools hostage....
[04:33:45] <SWPadnos> here's my rectifier: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=270075323856
[04:33:45] <ohiopctechDOTcom> (for 4 years now)
[04:33:59] <ds2> 35V CT
[04:34:02] <tomp> design is for 10 amp, then device is min rated at 15, maybe figure 3 at 15amps, but for 30 cents get the next up, and bolt it to metal (else de-rate it when it gets hot )
[04:34:16] <Jymmmmmmm> ah
[04:34:38] <ds2> ohiopctechDOTcom: were they worth it? or complete trash?
[04:34:40] <SWPadnos> that seller has others that may be better
[04:34:47] <ohiopctechDOTcom> they are nice
[04:35:02] <ds2> so they are definitely measuring class, not C clamps =)
[04:35:13] <ohiopctechDOTcom> ds2: built way better than this 30 dollar chinese import i jsut bought
[04:35:23] <ds2> the fowler digital mics seem to be about 1/2 the cost ofa Mitutoyo
[04:35:31] <ds2> and around the same as a chinese import
[04:35:36] <ohiopctechDOTcom> fowler ha sbeen around for a loooong time
[04:35:45] <ds2> hmm
[04:35:51] <SWPadnos> Jymmmmmmm, you should remember that you need to get a transformer rated for roughly 1.8x the number of watts you want (in VA)
[04:35:58] <SWPadnos> ie, you want 48V * 10A = 480W
[04:36:18] <ohiopctechDOTcom> fowler gauges look neat... very minimalistic
[04:36:26] <ohiopctechDOTcom> the gauge faces**
[04:36:26] <SWPadnos> so you need a transformer with at least 480*1.8 = 864 VA rating
[04:36:47] <ds2> look is fine... but are they accurate and repeatable?
[04:37:26] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i only used mine for +/_ .002 - .005 work
[04:37:33] <ohiopctechDOTcom> so it seemed great for that
[04:37:35] <tomp> fowler, newton, mass. yep, still made in USA ( i checked after being in the taiwanese factory that builds bridgeport brand vmc's )
[04:37:51] <ohiopctechDOTcom> well i lied.. i used them for grinding to .001
[04:38:00] <ohiopctechDOTcom> and .0005 sometimes
[04:38:10] <ds2> grinding just to 0.001?were you using sand paper? ;)
[04:38:35] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i never really got to grind the really precision stuff
[04:38:39] <ohiopctechDOTcom> they let the foreman do it
[04:38:50] <ohiopctechDOTcom> he was old and slow so he was good at tight grinding
[04:39:08] <Jymmmmmmm> could wind my own.... http://www.toroid.com/standard_transformers/transformer_kits/transformer_kits.htm
[04:39:35] <SWPadnos> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7540253745
[04:39:48] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i had to re-wind the pickup coil in our new(old) digitizer puck the other day
[04:39:57] <ohiopctechDOTcom> and solder the tiny ass enamel coated wires
[04:40:00] <SWPadnos> as long as a little over 48V won't kill anything, I'd use that
[04:40:34] <SWPadnos> they also have some 35V+35V 700 VA ones, which will be close to what you need (since it's unlikely you'll be using the supply at full power for very long periods)
[04:40:37] <ohiopctechDOTcom> 24"x 26"... i digitized the first part with it today...
[04:40:40] <ohiopctechDOTcom> works like a champ
[04:40:48] <SWPadnos> or maybe that was 39+39 as well
[04:42:04] <Jymmmmmmm> SWPadnos: thanks
[04:42:07] <ohiopctechDOTcom> 24 x 36"
[04:42:09] <SWPadnos> http://www.toroid-transformer.com/
[04:42:09] <ohiopctechDOTcom> **
[04:42:20] <SWPadnos> the model 8436 looks right for you
[04:42:23] <ohiopctechDOTcom> hehe.. there is a website for everything!
[04:42:23] <SWPadnos> or 10435
[04:43:27] <SWPadnos> hmmm - maybe not that last one. it's listed as 35VAC, but it's actually 25VAC
[04:43:29] <Jymmmmmmm> ds2: http://makerfaire.com/
[04:43:39] <tomp> why are they putting that big bolt thru the torroid? clamp it from left and right on the outside. leave that center field alone.
[04:43:49] <ds2> you going, Jymmm?
[04:43:49] <SWPadnos> oops - no, I clicked the wrong link ;)
[04:45:14] <SWPadnos> interesting - antek has a nice looking 50V 500W DC supply for $100
[04:45:24] <SWPadnos> the PS-5N50
[04:45:30] <Jymmmmmmm> ds2: I JUST saw the banner ad for it, looks interesting
[04:46:18] <SWPadnos> oh man - that looks fun
[04:46:23] <SWPadnos> maybe I'll get to the one in Austin
[04:46:45] <tomp> 1/2 kw, uses 20000 uF
[04:47:43] <ohiopctechDOTcom> anyone tried using cdrom hub motors for some ride-along type of bearings?
[04:47:58] <SWPadnos> nobody I know of
[04:48:26] <ohiopctechDOTcom> two of them face to face would make a sorta-v-groove bearing
[04:49:09] <ds2> Jymmm: I have a conflict otherwise, I'd go
[04:50:06] <Jymmmmmmm> ds2: Bummer
[04:50:22] <Jymmmmmmm> I know I have to work those nights, but could go during the day
[04:51:04] <tomp> no, i read wrong, antec only used 10000 uF, thats light
[04:54:45] <ohiopctechDOTcom> my website got some hits from thailand... hmmm
[04:54:53] <ohiopctechDOTcom> sirry hackers...
[04:55:16] <ohiopctechDOTcom> *283 hits to be ecaxt
[04:55:21] <ohiopctechDOTcom> exact*
[04:57:41] <tomp> and the 100V p/s at 5amps is 56000uF, disagrees with mariss's formula just a little , and its 'x2' so is 112000uF while the formula says 4000 (80000 x 5 / 100)
[04:57:55] <josesito> hey all
[04:58:10] <tomp> theres something skwewy goin on awound here
[04:58:12] <SWPadnos> well, he started from basic principles
[04:58:18] <SWPadnos> Q=CV
[04:58:32] <SWPadnos> dQ/dT = C dV/dT
[04:58:48] <SWPadnos> dQ/dT = I (current), so I=C * dV/dT
[04:59:16] <SWPadnos> the 80000 is close enough to 83333, which is 1/120 (Hz of a rectified AC supply in the US)
[04:59:52] <josesito> guys, i need to do something (anything) cool on an 50x80 Acrylic cube with a .....thing that's not a lathe...how is it called?
[04:59:58] <SWPadnos> the only reason he divides by voltage is to make the value a ripple percentage instead of a constant number of volts
[05:00:05] <SWPadnos> mill?
[05:00:11] <josesito> yeah exactle SWPadnos
[05:01:03] <josesito> well, i want to do something really cool, so i was wondering if any of you know where could i get some code ideas??
[05:01:19] <josesito> i was thinking on doing tux as shown here: http://streetpc.free.fr/img/Tux.png
[05:01:29] <ohiopctechDOTcom> google images search
[05:01:37] <SWPadnos> you could try the nested cubes thing, but it would probably be a real pain in acrylic
[05:02:11] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i made two of those as keychains and my little brother begged me for one
[05:02:24] <ohiopctechDOTcom> out of aluminum*
[05:02:25] <toastydeath> thing that's not a lathe?
[05:02:31] <josesito> ohiopctechDOTcom: do you have the code?
[05:02:43] <josesito> toastydeath: yeah =) i meant a mill
[05:02:52] <SWPadnos> there's a sample of one face in the emc wiki, I believe
[05:03:11] <ohiopctechDOTcom> it was a .875" pocket, and two smaller pockets by .125 and .125 deeper in a 1 inch cube
[05:03:18] <SWPadnos> hmmm - nope, it's a ball in a cage
[05:03:18] <tomp> cool is i the eye of the beholder, http://www.rainnea.com/cnc_gallery.htm
[05:03:20] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i don't have the code it was years ago
[05:03:39] <josesito> :S
[05:03:40] <SWPadnos> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?Oword#Sample_1_One_side_of_a_ball_in_cage
[05:04:03] <ohiopctechDOTcom> nice work tomp?
[05:05:15] <tomp> i didnt know emc understood G17 18 19 ( different planes for circular interpolation ) cool
[05:05:21] <SWPadnos> here's info on how to make the code for the cube thing yourself: http://www.token.crwoodturner.com/magiccube/
[05:05:34] <SWPadnos> EMC invented it! ;)
[05:05:43] <SWPadnos> (or close enough anyway :) )
[05:06:08] <ohiopctechDOTcom> when i did my cube... it ended up so that all 3 cubes were connected.. and there was a 4th tiny cube floating in the center
[05:06:24] <ohiopctechDOTcom> then i drilled a keychain through the one corner big enough for a keyring
[05:06:47] <ohiopctechDOTcom> drilled a hole* (not a keychain thourgh)_
[05:06:52] <ohiopctechDOTcom> through*
[05:07:00] <SWPadnos> there's code for turboCNC, plus other stuff here: http://www.sherline.com/CNCproj.htm
[05:07:02] <ohiopctechDOTcom> time for bed...typos are creeping in
[05:07:12] <tomp> we used to edm those cubes as a teaching aid so the guys learned to carefully load parts ( you have to put it in the holder many times , exactly , no cocking, no teeny dirt )
[05:08:14] <ohiopctechDOTcom> later folks!
[05:08:21] <SWPadnos> see you
[05:09:12] <josesito> does emc support other distros than ubuntu?
[05:09:41] <tomp> me too, nite all , thanks all
[05:09:43] <SWPadnos> yes, though there aren't any pre-built EMC or realtime kernel packages
[05:09:46] <SWPadnos> see you tomp
[05:10:15] <SWPadnos> at least, there aren't any that are maintained by the development team
[05:11:13] <josesito> SWPadnos: i tried to install it last year on archlinux....it didn't go well
[05:11:38] <SWPadnos> arch - I've heard of that, but don't remember what it's based on ..
[05:12:00] <cradek> building a working realtime kernel can be a chore
[05:12:06] <cradek> building emc2 after that is quite easy
[05:13:09] <josesito> arch is based on crux....or something like that
[05:13:13] <josesito> idk
[05:13:14] <josesito> =)
[05:13:34] <josesito> cradek: i just need to simulate...
[05:13:42] <josesito> the actual machines are on the university
[05:13:47] <josesito> though they don't use emc
[05:13:50] <cradek> oh then you can build it on any modern linux just fine
[05:13:54] <cradek> you don't need realtime
[05:14:24] <cradek> there are quite a few dependencies but nothing special - your distro should have them packaged
[05:14:41] <cradek> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?EMC2_Pure_Simulator
[05:14:44] <josesito> i'll check it out
[05:14:55] <cradek> of course the package names will be a little different from these instructions, but this is the general idea
[05:15:25] <josesito> thanks cradek
[05:15:33] <cradek> welcome, and goodnight
[05:16:26] <josesito> night
[05:16:45] <SWPadnos> hmm. I guess I should get to bed as well. good night all
[05:17:02] <josesito> what's the code to make a parabolic interpolation?
[05:17:56] <ohiopctechDOTcom> http://ohiopctech.com/cnc/cubes/ <- i found my pics i had of the nested cubes i made a few years back on my hd still and threw together a quick display page for them
[05:18:05] <ohiopctechDOTcom> they are sweeet
[05:18:13] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i should amade like 100 of em
[05:19:05] <josesito> ohiopctechDOTcom: where could i get the code to make that?
[05:19:24] <ohiopctechDOTcom> it's only 3 pockets...
[05:19:48] <ohiopctechDOTcom> .875", .750", .625"
[05:19:58] <ohiopctechDOTcom> .125 deeper each
[05:20:11] <ohiopctechDOTcom> on a 1 inch cube
[05:20:16] <josesito> pockets?
[05:20:23] <ds2> just that just a matter of boring each side progressively deeper?
[05:20:33] <ohiopctechDOTcom> yes
[05:20:54] <josesito> oh
[05:20:56] <ohiopctechDOTcom> pockets=milled out circles
[05:21:15] <ohiopctechDOTcom> it should only be a few lines of code at most
[05:21:21] <ds2> so circular interpol. is enough?
[05:21:31] <ohiopctechDOTcom> you could write it by hand easily with the g-code reference page
[05:21:40] <ohiopctechDOTcom> yeah that would do the trick
[05:21:53] <ds2> sounds tempting to make myself a few
[05:22:02] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i am going to re-write the code soon when i get some 1" aq stock... i'l post it on my site when i do
[05:22:22] <ds2> you need to do one cube at a time, right? so all the reclamping is a pain?
[05:22:38] <josesito> actually i still want to do tux!!!
[05:22:44] <josesito> http://streetpc.free.fr/img/Tux.png
[05:23:11] <ohiopctechDOTcom> .875 pocket is .125 deep... the .750 pocket is .250 deep... the .625 pocket would be .375 deep
[05:23:33] <ohiopctechDOTcom> do 3 pockets in one side
[05:23:36] <ohiopctechDOTcom> dthen turn it
[05:23:43] <ohiopctechDOTcom> repeat till you got all 6 sides done
[05:24:09] <ohiopctechDOTcom> de-burr the outside pocket each time you are finished before you turn it
[05:24:59] <ohiopctechDOTcom> if you make the pockets a little less deep.. they will stay together
[05:25:01] <josesito> brb
[05:25:01] <ds2> that don't seem too horrible. it looked like you got to do one cube at a time
[05:25:10] <ohiopctechDOTcom> say.. each pocket only .110 deep
[05:25:26] <ohiopctechDOTcom> then start the next deeper pocket at .125
[05:25:30] <ds2> then just snap it off?
[05:25:37] <ohiopctechDOTcom> then there will be some stock left to hold it together
[05:25:53] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i like them to stay together
[05:26:11] <ohiopctechDOTcom> but that's me.. experiment with depths
[05:26:34] <ohiopctechDOTcom> maybe do a rough pass then a cleanup pass for all sides at the end to prevent it from breaking too early
[05:26:39] <ds2> Oh I see the math behind it... each successive cube is the size of an inscribed square
[05:26:46] <ds2> repeat that in 3D and you have that
[05:26:52] <ohiopctechDOTcom> yeah
[05:27:20] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i drew the whole cube in mastercam as a 3d solid.. it looked coolio
[05:27:22] <ds2> so the cubes in theory can come out?
[05:27:47] <ohiopctechDOTcom> can.. but the circle pocket above them are keeping it in
[05:28:09] <ds2> but if you pull it straight, it should slide out, no?
[05:28:10] <ohiopctechDOTcom> the one page had an idea to use a small dovetail cutter to release the cubes from each other at the end of the machining
[05:28:29] <ohiopctechDOTcom> hmm.. maybe
[05:28:31] <ohiopctechDOTcom> try it!
[05:28:32] <ohiopctechDOTcom> lol
[05:28:35] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i never tried
[05:28:42] <ds2> i need to find time for these projects
[05:29:24] <ohiopctechDOTcom> * ohiopctechDOTcom spends too much time on silly projects
[05:30:10] <josesito> i'm back....so can someone help me make that tux?
[05:30:27] <ohiopctechDOTcom> how big you want the engraving to be?
[05:30:45] <josesito> well, the acrylyc's size is 50x80 mm
[05:30:59] <josesito> i would like it to be about 40 x 40
[05:31:06] <ohiopctechDOTcom> inches?
[05:31:10] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i don't do metric lol
[05:31:13] <josesito> and be placed in the middle so i can put some other things
[05:31:22] <josesito> omg!!!
[05:31:24] <josesito> metric!!
[05:31:33] <ohiopctechDOTcom> <- in the usa... ;)
[05:31:57] <ohiopctechDOTcom> jsut tell me what 50 x 80 mm is in inches
[05:32:16] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i'll whip up a drawing for the outline
[05:32:28] <josesito> oh...
[05:32:29] <ohiopctechDOTcom> can you do the g-code if i give you a .dxf?
[05:32:28] <josesito> ok
[05:32:31] <josesito> wait
[05:32:45] <josesito> ohiopctechDOTcom: what's a dxf??? lol
[05:33:04] <ohiopctechDOTcom> ehhh... how you gonna run a cnc if you don't know what a .dxf is? ;)
[05:33:13] <ohiopctechDOTcom> but.. it's a file format
[05:33:22] <ohiopctechDOTcom> that autodesk cad priducts use
[05:33:29] <ohiopctechDOTcom> products*
[05:33:53] <SWPadnos_> SWPadnos_ is now known as SWPadnos
[05:34:00] <josesito> oh
[05:34:07] <ohiopctechDOTcom> soo you got emc?
[05:34:12] <ohiopctechDOTcom> is that your controller?
[05:34:14] <josesito> well... i think it would help
[05:34:20] <josesito> ohiopctechDOTcom: nopes...
[05:34:42] <ohiopctechDOTcom> well if i'm gonna write the code.. i'd need to know the type of machine it's running on
[05:34:44] <josesito> emc didn't work with my distro so i had to install windoze and work from there
[05:35:02] <josesito> i know the program is called wslm
[05:36:12] <toastydeath> i don't know what a .dxf is
[05:36:23] <ohiopctechDOTcom> hmm
[05:36:24] <toastydeath> what do file formats have to do with cnc =(
[05:36:38] <toastydeath> i can run a cnc without touching a computer?
[05:36:45] <ohiopctechDOTcom> lol..i was just thinking if you have a cnc.. someone should know .dxf
[05:36:53] <toastydeath> not rly?
[05:37:20] <toastydeath> i mean it's a good idea
[05:37:25] <toastydeath> i know autocad, but not the file formats
[05:37:30] <toastydeath> also solidworks
[05:38:30] <toastydeath> i need to take a mastercam class =(
[05:38:38] <toastydeath> i am having a hard time figuring out this whole "surfaces" thing
[05:38:49] <ohiopctechDOTcom> josesito: i apologize for saying that.. it was out of line
[05:39:13] <josesito> ??
[05:39:25] <toastydeath> i bet if you saved the autocad drawing as a .gif
[05:39:26] <josesito> don't worry!
[05:39:27] <toastydeath> and gave it to him
[05:39:32] <toastydeath> he could do the g-code
[05:39:41] <toastydeath> if autocad is the problem here
[05:40:09] <josesito> ohiopctechDOTcom: know the program?? wslm?
[05:42:01] <ohiopctechDOTcom> josesito: no, i don't
[05:42:13] <ohiopctechDOTcom> but it should run generic fanuc g-codes right?
[05:42:22] <ohiopctechDOTcom> lines and arcs...
[05:43:07] <josesito> YES
[05:43:11] <josesito> it should
[05:43:13] <josesito> btw
[05:43:29] <josesito> 100mm=3.937 inches
[05:43:38] <josesito> oh noes
[05:43:56] <josesito> i meant 80mm=3.149606 inches
[05:44:11] <josesito> and 50mm=1.968503 inches
[05:44:23] <toastydeath> is anyone here a mastercam X expert
[05:46:42] <ohiopctechDOTcom> http://phiopctech.com/tux.png-cad.jpg <-- how does that look for the outlines that would be milled?
[05:46:48] <ohiopctechDOTcom> damnit!
[05:46:55] <ohiopctechDOTcom> http://ohiopctech.com/tux.png-cad.jpg <-- how does that look for the outlines that would be milled?
[05:47:00] <ohiopctechDOTcom> **right url
[05:47:13] <toastydeath> what about this thing now?
[05:47:21] <ohiopctechDOTcom> ok.. the file is there if you clicked and got an error
[05:47:27] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i had it spelled wrong
[05:47:37] <josesito> seems cool
[05:48:10] <ohiopctechDOTcom> ok.. so 40 mm tall?
[05:48:16] <josesito> yes
[05:48:29] <ohiopctechDOTcom> convert that to inches.. please.. lol
[05:48:40] <toastydeath> why?
[05:48:43] <toastydeath> g21
[05:48:48] <josesito> ohiopctechDOTcom: can you make the inner eyeballs rounder?
[05:49:04] <josesito> 40mm=1.574803
[05:49:07] <josesito> inches
[05:49:50] <josesito> and i think i will be using a 1 mm eh...thing that mills (or cuts?)
[05:50:01] <ohiopctechDOTcom> toastydeath: i am pretty good with mastercam v9.. and learning vX
[05:50:02] <josesito> 1mm=0.03937
[05:50:37] <ohiopctechDOTcom> what i'll program it for is to follow those lines that you see.. then the size of the cutter will only make the lines fatter or smaller
[05:51:04] <josesito> ok thanks!
[05:51:25] <ohiopctechDOTcom> how deep? like .010?
[05:51:27] <toastydeath> i cannot figure out this whole surfaces thing
[05:51:29] <ohiopctechDOTcom> inches*
[05:51:34] <ohiopctechDOTcom> ten thousandths of an inch
[05:51:36] <ohiopctechDOTcom> ??
[05:51:54] <josesito> hmmm....yes
[05:52:04] <josesito> maybe a little deeper
[05:53:07] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i'll set it for .010, if you need it deeper you'll be able to set a (fake) zero on the z axis.. a little bit into the part... following me?
[05:53:26] <toastydeath> lol it's one cutter
[05:53:46] <josesito> ohiopctechDOTcom: not sure...
[05:54:18] <josesito> i'll have to try do it....i'm just a noob in cnc =S
[05:54:28] <ohiopctechDOTcom> touch off the top of the part... then tell it that is -.010
[05:54:40] <ohiopctechDOTcom> it will think -.010 from the top of the part is really 0
[05:54:45] <josesito> oh
[05:54:46] <josesito> yeah
[05:55:00] <toastydeath> close!
[05:55:02] <josesito> sure, i remember
[05:55:50] <toastydeath> just don't go too deep with the length offset
[05:55:54] <toastydeath> or you'll rapid into the part
[05:56:08] <josesito> k
[05:56:12] <josesito> thanks
[05:57:58] <ohiopctechDOTcom> you gonna have clamps or anything in the way ?
[05:58:07] <ohiopctechDOTcom> what z clearance height should i set?
[05:58:23] <josesito> 35mm
[05:58:33] <josesito> 1.37795 inches
[05:58:40] <josesito> clamps??
[05:58:48] <josesito> let me get my dictionary
[05:58:50] <ohiopctechDOTcom> how will you be holding the part down?
[05:58:51] <toastydeath> .1
[05:58:55] <josesito> oh
[05:59:03] <josesito> yes...by the longer sides
[05:59:11] <toastydeath> .1
[05:59:25] <toastydeath> g28 z0 on exit
[05:59:36] <toastydeath> that way your clearance plane can be close and no worry about hitting fixtures
[06:00:02] <ohiopctechDOTcom> mastercam sends the machine home when the program is over
[06:00:13] <ohiopctechDOTcom> unless you delete that section out of the g-code
[06:00:15] <toastydeath> you're missing what i'm saying
[06:00:16] <ohiopctechDOTcom> after it's done
[06:00:19] <toastydeath> clearance plane is .1
[06:00:30] <ohiopctechDOTcom> ya.. i'm with ya
[06:00:33] <toastydeath> k
[06:01:06] <toastydeath> g28 z0 doesn't just send the tool home
[06:01:07] <toastydeath> is my point
[06:01:15] <toastydeath> (just to make sure we're both on the same page)
[06:02:46] <ohiopctechDOTcom> g28 z0 would send the tool to the point he sets as zero... wether it be the top of the part or -.010" into the part
[06:02:52] <toastydeath> no
[06:02:54] <toastydeath> g28 z0
[06:02:58] <toastydeath> sends the Z axis home first
[06:03:02] <toastydeath> the homes everything else
[06:03:12] <ohiopctechDOTcom> oh.. i was thinking... g0
[06:03:26] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i keep a copy of the g-code ref. page printed by the machine
[06:03:34] <toastydeath> that way if he has clamps in the way, he can still use a .1 clearance plane
[06:03:39] <toastydeath> and avoid clampage
[06:03:40] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i get confused with all the #'s easily
[06:03:43] <toastydeath> lol
[06:03:46] <toastydeath> s'ok
[06:04:36] <toastydeath> i have a hard time remembering the other words
[06:04:39] <josesito> ohiopctechDOTcom: if it helps i'll try to vectorize and remove colors from the original png
[06:04:50] <toastydeath> like what all the extra words do in canned cycles
[06:04:54] <toastydeath> i have to look that crap up
[06:05:51] <ohiopctechDOTcom> http://ohiopctech.com/TUX.PNG.NC the zero is the point at which a vertical line dropps down from his left hand and a horizontal line (drawn left) from his left foot would intersect
[06:06:11] <ohiopctechDOTcom> ?me is not responsible for machine crashes... VERIFY THE CODE FIRST!
[06:06:24] <josesito> i'll do that now...but the page doesn't open
[06:06:28] <ohiopctechDOTcom> it should be 40 mm tall and .. ??mm wide
[06:06:28] <toastydeath> refresh
[06:06:33] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i didn't check that part
[06:06:35] <toastydeath> it didn't work at first for me either
[06:06:42] <toastydeath> backplot it?
[06:06:57] <ohiopctechDOTcom> OHHHH
[06:06:59] <toastydeath> or use the verify
[06:07:01] <josesito> 5 refreshes...still doesn't work :'S
[06:07:13] <toastydeath> i like mastercam's verify thinger
[06:07:16] <ohiopctechDOTcom> http://ohiopctech.com/cnc/TUX.PNG.NC
[06:07:27] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i had the directory in my link wrong
[06:07:33] <josesito> thanks
[06:07:43] <toastydeath> trying to read mastercam g-code is like pulling goddamned teeth
[06:07:51] <ohiopctechDOTcom> lol..
[06:08:05] <toastydeath> i wonder if i could learn to write my own postprocessor
[06:08:08] <toastydeath> to include spaces
[06:08:08] <ohiopctechDOTcom> that's why i only read it to delete out the crap that makes emc choke
[06:08:12] <toastydeath> and not include line numbers
[06:08:19] <josesito> :(
[06:08:24] <josesito> it didn't work
[06:08:28] <ohiopctechDOTcom> line #'s are great for de-buggin programs
[06:08:33] <toastydeath> lol what
[06:08:42] <toastydeath> maybe if you have a machine from 1940
[06:08:46] <toastydeath> vaccuum tubes
[06:08:53] <toastydeath> and punch tape
[06:09:17] <josesito> i meant the verify
[06:09:42] <josesito> i have to wait until tomorrow to test it on the machine...but normally, since it's the same program, it should work
[06:09:48] <toastydeath> huh?
[06:10:24] <ohiopctechDOTcom> it loads fine into my emc machine
[06:10:36] <josesito> the nc code did not work for me.. :(
[06:10:37] <ohiopctechDOTcom> and verify looked awesome on mastercam
[06:10:47] <toastydeath> <3 mastercam
[06:10:51] <ohiopctechDOTcom> gimme a link to the control software you are using...
[06:10:58] <josesito> ohiopctechDOTcom: would it be good if i sent you the link...ogh
[06:10:59] <josesito> ok
[06:11:19] <toastydeath> what's crapping it out
[06:11:32] <ohiopctechDOTcom> any error messages?
[06:11:48] <josesito> yeah something about axis
[06:11:50] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i can hit run right now and cut that on my mini mill
[06:12:02] <toastydeath> huh
[06:12:12] <toastydeath> axis overtravel?
[06:12:34] <josesito> http://www.zigonstuff.com/cnc/cnc-millsw.htm
[06:12:36] <josesito> there
[06:13:13] <josesito> toastydeath: warning: 4th axis is ignored in verify and 3-axis modes -press f5 to continue
[06:13:27] <toastydeath> lol
[06:13:29] <toastydeath> do a search for A words
[06:13:32] <josesito> ohiopctechDOTcom: you just have to install V1
[06:13:38] <josesito> and run wslm
[06:13:50] <ohiopctechDOTcom> there is no A-axis...
[06:13:55] <toastydeath> yeah
[06:13:57] <toastydeath> there is
[06:13:57] <ohiopctechDOTcom> it's only a 3 axis post
[06:14:08] <toastydeath> there are A words
[06:14:09] <toastydeath> in this NC
[06:14:17] <toastydeath> at the very end
[06:14:30] <toastydeath> and at the beginning
[06:15:06] <toastydeath> sometimes mastercam's postprocessor throws A words in for toolchanges and stuff
[06:15:09] <toastydeath> when there are only 3 axes
[06:15:14] <toastydeath> i do not know why
[06:15:25] <ohiopctechDOTcom> josesito: just ignor the errors
[06:15:35] <ohiopctechDOTcom> ** should run fine
[06:15:54] <toastydeath> or delete the 2 A0.
[06:16:04] <toastydeath> 2 lines from the start, and 2 lines from the very end
[06:16:27] <toastydeath> i think his software doesn't like the A words
[06:16:32] <toastydeath> and may not run at all
[06:16:39] <toastydeath> may work fine on emc
[06:17:12] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i'm installing the program to check into it
[06:17:16] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i'm just curious
[06:17:21] <toastydeath> yeah
[06:17:28] <josesito> ohiopctechDOTcom: thanks
[06:17:39] <josesito> btw.. i removed the lines and the error was gone
[06:17:44] <toastydeath> woah woah
[06:17:45] <toastydeath> the whole line
[06:17:48] <toastydeath> or just the A word
[06:18:00] <josesito> but the milling occurs only in the lower left corner
[06:18:05] <josesito> the whole line toastydeath
[06:18:07] <ohiopctechDOTcom> load that file up into your text editor.. do a search and replace for "A0" and replace it with nothing
[06:18:08] <toastydeath> wooaaah buddy
[06:18:10] <toastydeath> put that line back
[06:18:21] <toastydeath> just remove the A0.
[06:18:27] <toastydeath> remember to remove the period
[06:18:30] <toastydeath> "A0."
[06:18:33] <ohiopctechDOTcom> OH YEAH
[06:18:34] <josesito> ok
[06:18:50] <ohiopctechDOTcom> do the search and replace with "A0." replace it all with nothing
[06:19:01] <ohiopctechDOTcom> but leave everything else
[06:19:13] <josesito> done
[06:19:29] <josesito> but still it mills only in the lower left corner...a really small area btw
[06:19:52] <toastydeath> ?
[06:20:05] <ohiopctechDOTcom> zoom!
[06:20:11] <ohiopctechDOTcom> it's 1.57 inches
[06:20:16] <ohiopctechDOTcom> tall*
[06:20:20] <josesito> IT WORKS!
[06:20:22] <ohiopctechDOTcom> aka 40mm
[06:20:29] <josesito> me dumb...
[06:20:35] <josesito> i had it working in milimeters
[06:20:46] <josesito> now it works PRETTY NEAT!!
[06:20:54] <ohiopctechDOTcom> interesting...
[06:21:07] <ohiopctechDOTcom> glad i could help... (don't crash any machines trying to cut it!)
[06:21:14] <josesito> HEH
[06:21:23] <josesito> just something else
[06:21:36] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i installed that program and it didn't give me errors trying to load
[06:21:51] <ohiopctechDOTcom> even withthe a words
[06:21:51] <josesito> can you center it more?
[06:21:59] <toastydeath> that's your job, josesito
[06:22:10] <ohiopctechDOTcom> just set the zero on your part where you want it to cut!
[06:22:36] <ohiopctechDOTcom> x/y zeroes...
[06:22:44] <josesito> OH YES
[06:22:48] <ohiopctechDOTcom> move them around untill you are ok with the cut
[06:23:05] <josesito> well, what if i wanted to rotate it 90 degrees to the left??
[06:23:18] <ohiopctechDOTcom> turn the plastic!
[06:23:20] <ohiopctechDOTcom> lol
[06:23:36] <josesito> well, i cant!
[06:23:39] <toastydeath> does emc support g50
[06:23:45] <josesito> i had that problem today
[06:23:48] <toastydeath> there's some rotation commands
[06:23:49] <toastydeath> and scaling
[06:23:53] <toastydeath> i forget what rotation is
[06:23:57] <josesito> the teacher used some command i think it was g61
[06:24:02] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i'm not sure on the rotation
[06:24:12] <ohiopctechDOTcom> ask your teacher josesito?
[06:24:20] <ohiopctechDOTcom> are you using a mill at school?
[06:24:30] <josesito> at the university
[06:24:34] <toastydeath> what brand
[06:24:39] <toastydeath> + what controller
[06:24:40] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i could rotate the drawing...
[06:24:41] <josesito> light machines
[06:24:48] <ohiopctechDOTcom> some controllers will rotate for you
[06:25:01] <toastydeath> uh, light machine isn't a brand i'm familiar with
[06:25:12] <ohiopctechDOTcom> are you in usa josesito?
[06:25:16] <josesito> or something like that
[06:25:20] <josesito> nopes... in colombia
[06:25:33] <toastydeath> you need to find the name of the controller
[06:25:42] <toastydeath> and download the manual for that controller from the mfg's website
[06:26:00] <toastydeath> that will have the rotational gcode and the other words you'll need
[06:26:18] <toastydeath> different controllers do rotation and scaling vastly differently
[06:26:26] <toastydeath> so it's important to have the controller manual in hand
[06:26:38] <josesito> oh ok
[06:26:40] <ohiopctechDOTcom> why can't you rotate the plastic?
[06:26:40] <josesito> thanks
[06:26:47] <toastydeath> josesito:
[06:26:49] <josesito> the clamps wont let me
[06:26:50] <toastydeath> once you get the right g-code
[06:27:00] <toastydeath> go into MDI
[06:27:03] <toastydeath> and enter it there
[06:27:10] <josesito> something else...on the last part, tux's foot is milled!!
[06:27:20] <toastydeath> the machine should leave it rotatated when you run the live program
[06:27:34] <toastydeath> just remember to cancel the rotation in MDI before you walk away
[06:27:37] <toastydeath> or someone's going to crash it
[06:28:46] <josesito> hehe what's MDI??
[06:28:52] <toastydeath> manual data input
[06:28:57] <toastydeath> it's like, on the fly g-code
[06:29:00] <josesito> ok
[06:29:08] <ohiopctechDOTcom> ahhh
[06:29:11] <ohiopctechDOTcom> not his foot!
[06:29:13] <toastydeath> v. useful
[06:29:25] <toastydeath> josesito, do your machines have actual controllers
[06:29:28] <toastydeath> like, with screens
[06:30:14] <josesito> well it is connected to a computer with wslm program
[06:30:20] <toastydeath> oh
[06:30:21] <josesito> we operate the machine from the program
[06:30:36] <toastydeath> then find the wslm program's g-code reference
[06:30:35] <toastydeath> and manual
[06:30:47] <ds2> eh? one should always check the settings prior to running any program or bad things will happen.... i.e. those mystery Z-1.000 in the G54 that appear out of nowhere ;)
[06:30:57] <ohiopctechDOTcom> it's in the help section
[06:31:02] <ohiopctechDOTcom> under "cnc codes"
[06:31:23] <ohiopctechDOTcom> in the wslm program
[06:31:26] <josesito> http://www.zigonstuff.com/cnc/cnc-millsw.htm
[06:31:32] <josesito> G68Invokes rotation.
[06:31:33] <josesito> heh
[06:31:34] <josesito> thanks!
[06:31:45] <toastydeath> what are the words it wants
[06:33:41] <ohiopctechDOTcom> http://ohiopctech.com/cnc/TUX.PNG-ROTATE.NC
[06:34:35] <toastydeath> i does not sees a g68 in that program?
[06:35:34] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i rotated it in the cam
[06:35:40] <toastydeath> oh
[06:35:44] <ohiopctechDOTcom> mastercam...
[06:35:44] <josesito> thanks
[06:35:44] <toastydeath> a+
[06:35:48] <ohiopctechDOTcom> 90 to the left
[06:35:49] <toastydeath> also going to bed!
[06:35:51] <toastydeath> goodnight
[06:35:53] <ohiopctechDOTcom> same zero point
[06:35:54] <josesito> ohiopctechDOTcom: can you send me mastercam file?
[06:36:28] <ohiopctechDOTcom> for $37.95...
[06:36:30] <ohiopctechDOTcom> lol
[06:36:33] <josesito> ohiopctechDOTcom: heh...it seems it mills the air ;)
[06:36:36] <josesito> lol
[06:37:40] <ohiopctechDOTcom> http://ohiopctech.com/cnc/TUX.PNG.MC9
[06:38:27] <ohiopctechDOTcom> MC v9 file
[06:38:37] <josesito> thanks
[06:38:49] <ohiopctechDOTcom> np.. g'night!
[06:38:54] <josesito> ohiopctechDOTcom: wait
[06:38:59] <ohiopctechDOTcom> ehh?
[06:39:08] <josesito> can i ask you for just one more thing =)
[06:39:16] <ohiopctechDOTcom> get rid of that wslm and use emc2 ;)
[06:39:16] <josesito> there is one little problem with the code...
[06:39:23] <ohiopctechDOTcom> hmm?/
[06:39:49] <josesito> it's too complex! xD
[06:40:09] <ohiopctechDOTcom> one line at a time my son... use the force to decipher it
[06:40:26] <josesito> i meant the shape...
[06:40:32] <ohiopctechDOTcom> huh?
[06:40:39] <ohiopctechDOTcom> it's tux...
[06:40:44] <josesito> can you give me 1 minute and i'll show you??
[06:40:47] <ohiopctechDOTcom> he is a simple creature
[06:40:51] <ohiopctechDOTcom> yes
[06:40:56] <josesito> k
[06:41:09] <ohiopctechDOTcom> if you have mastercam you can take the file i gave you and use the filtering to smooth out the lines
[06:41:27] <ohiopctechDOTcom> it will take 3 lines that form an arc and turn the into real arcs
[06:43:22] <josesito> k
[06:43:32] <josesito> done, i'm uploading it
[06:44:26] <josesito> http://img444.imageshack.us/my.php?image=tuxyu4.png
[06:44:43] <josesito> ohiopctechDOTcom: i want something simpler...like that
[06:45:21] <ohiopctechDOTcom> josesito: google for a program called "traceart"
[06:45:34] <ohiopctechDOTcom> that would be a good start on doing your own programming
[06:45:47] <ohiopctechDOTcom> traceart along with mastercam.. =you can engrave anything
[06:46:02] <josesito> but i don't have mastercam xD
[06:46:09] <josesito> is traceart free?
[06:46:13] <ohiopctechDOTcom> there is a nice help file to help you learn how to tweak the program
[06:46:19] <ohiopctechDOTcom> shareware
[06:46:45] <josesito> mmm....
[06:46:58] <ohiopctechDOTcom> you can use any free/open source cad almost to open the ,dxf traceart will give you
[06:47:02] <ohiopctechDOTcom> then edit from there...
[06:48:28] <ohiopctechDOTcom> and there is .dxf to g-code convertors...
[06:48:28] <ohiopctechDOTcom> mastercam does it all in one program.. but it's possible to get the same results with the free/open source tools
[06:48:28] <josesito> actually, i used inkscape to vectorize the original tux
[06:48:31] <ohiopctechDOTcom> google.. "dxf to g-code" you should be able to sort through the search results and find something you can use
[06:48:41] <ohiopctechDOTcom> along with traceart*
[06:48:50] <josesito> ok
[06:49:00] <ohiopctechDOTcom> and read up about .dxf file format ;)
[06:49:24] <ohiopctechDOTcom> it comes in really handy for exchanging file sbetween different cad/cam programs
[06:50:06] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i'd like to be able to program all day for people.. but i hafta work n stuff.. :D
[06:50:19] <josesito> ok
[06:50:25] <ohiopctechDOTcom> and sleep ;) have a g'night.. and good luck withtux...
[06:50:33] <josesito> thanks a lot!! good night!
[07:37:06] <Jymmmmmmm> http://ams2000.com/stepping101.html
[07:37:10] <Jymmmmmmm> ~~~~~
[07:42:33] <anonimasu> Jymmmmmmm: I still think you should borrow a gecko off someone and try it..
[07:43:15] <anonimasu> Jymmmmmmm: I've never had trouble with lost steps.. not even when the coupling on the plasma machine between the 2 driven rails went loose.. or when we ran it when the rails werent perfectly aligned..
[07:43:33] <Jymmmmmmm> anonimasu: have a spare?
[07:44:02] <anonimasu> actually right now yes.. but not for shipping back to usa..
[07:44:09] <Jymmmmmmm> bummer
[07:44:21] <Jymmmmmmm> I didn't realize your NOT in the US
[07:44:28] <anonimasu> :/
[07:44:36] <anonimasu> if you were a bit closer I'd borrow you one..
[07:44:42] <Jymmmmmmm> where are you?
[07:44:47] <anonimasu> north sweden
[07:44:53] <Jymmmmmmm> Ah, ok
[07:45:03] <anonimasu> shipping here/from here is a mess
[07:45:09] <anonimasu> really a mess..
[07:45:18] <Jymmmmmmm> yeah, lets not go there, customs is a pain
[07:45:42] <anonimasu> the expensive stuff about ordering us stuff here is customs..
[07:46:09] <anonimasu> if I remember it right 110eur for 2 gekcos in customs fee
[07:46:11] <Jymmmmmmm> Well, gecko has a 20day money back, I just need to build a PS before hand so it's ready to go.
[07:46:21] <Jymmmmmmm> err 30 day
[07:46:27] <anonimasu> I'm running a old welder..
[07:46:29] <anonimasu> :)
[07:46:44] <anonimasu> the trouble is just my rectifier that's puny..
[07:46:58] <Jymmmmmmm> the transformer?
[07:47:02] <anonimasu> no
[07:47:04] <anonimasu> rectifier
[07:47:08] <Jymmmmmmm> bridge?
[07:47:09] <anonimasu> the ->->->->
[07:47:15] <anonimasu> diode bridge.. or whatever you call it
[07:47:23] <anonimasu> that makes the ~ to -
[07:47:34] <anonimasu> tomp: are you there?
[07:47:39] <Jymmmmmmm> ok, yeah I have a 600A bridge I bought about a year ago
[07:47:58] <Jymmmmmmm> maybe 60 A dont recall, just obscene specs
[07:48:08] <anonimasu> :)
[07:48:12] <anonimasu> the specs on mine lied..
[07:48:13] <anonimasu> .d
[07:48:14] <anonimasu> :D
[07:48:36] <Jymmmmmmm> I have a VERY nice case for the PS/geckos too...
[07:48:45] <anonimasu> im running a battery charger in series with my powersupply.. to get enough voltage.
[07:48:55] <Jymmmmmmm> Just need xfmr and caps now
[07:48:59] <anonimasu> yep
[07:49:26] <Jymmmmmmm> I've been looking for a xfmr for years now, hard to come by as most dont list their specs
[07:49:40] <Jymmmmmmm> surplus, swap meets, etc
[07:49:48] <anonimasu> it might be for the best to just try a gecko..(sanity wise)
[07:50:08] <Jymmmmmmm> I already thought about it, just need the PS before hand
[07:50:17] <anonimasu> a non working machine is well crap..
[07:50:29] <Jymmmmmmm> oh gawd... tell me about it.
[07:50:31] <anonimasu> I know that when my mill dosent work too well I avoid it.
[07:50:52] <anonimasu> :)
[07:51:02] <Jymmmmmmm> See, I want to KNOW what the problem is, I can't just be tossing money at it guessing that'll fix it
[07:51:25] <Jymmmmmmm> It might be the motors for all I know, maybe bad cabling, etc
[07:51:59] <anonimasu> Yeah, but if a gecko fixes it, be happy.. and make parts.. :)
[07:52:07] <Jymmmmmmm> I'll look around for caps and xmfr
[07:52:21] <Jymmmmmmm> time to call it a night I think.
[07:52:39] <Jymmmmmmm> I got a hot date with a pillow =)
[07:52:39] <anonimasu> I wish I could say the same
[07:52:47] <anonimasu> i'm reinstalling my laptop
[07:52:55] <anonimasu> something I installed crapped my visual studio
[07:53:03] <Jymmmmmmm> oh joy.... ok I'm outta here. G'Night
[07:53:13] <anonimasu> night
[11:35:11] <awallin> hmm, they huygens-principle offset paper was a bit of a dissapointment. it only deals with discretized geometry, i.e. brake down your part geometry and toolpath into a grid of 0,01mm (say) resolution and then do the calculations - was looking for an exact algorithm
[12:13:15] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07TRUNK * 10emc2/share/axis/tcl/axis.tcl:
[12:13:15] <CIA-8> * fix bug reported by cradek: arrows in mdi area would send "ABORT" messages
[12:13:15] <CIA-8> * improve KP_ cursor movement keys in text entry fields
[12:13:47] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07TRUNK * 10emc2/src/emc/usr_intf/axis/scripts/axis.py: make keypad keys (up, down, enter) work better in MDI entry field
[12:44:03] <Martin_Lundstrom> Hello everyone
[12:47:10] <alex_joni> hi Martin
[12:49:28] <Martin_Lundstrom> Hi alex_joni, how are you?
[12:49:36] <alex_joni> err.. I am
[12:49:48] <alex_joni> not so sure about the rest
[12:49:56] <Martin_Lundstrom> :)
[12:50:05] <awallin> ergo you think? :)
[12:50:16] <alex_joni> awallin: don't stretch it
[12:50:18] <alex_joni> lol
[12:50:53] <Martin_Lundstrom> any new frankensteins in our workplace alex_joni ?
[12:51:59] <alex_joni> alive ones?
[12:52:08] <alex_joni> errrm.. I hope not
[12:53:01] <Martin_Lundstrom> Dallur: are you around?
[12:53:43] <Martin_Lundstrom> Dallur, im going to set up an invironment for me to make some test on your config
[12:54:09] <Martin_Lundstrom> Dallur, Ill start with setting up the latest CVS
[12:55:49] <skunkworks> is there a way to set the g30 home position? or do you need to physically set the 5181-5186 variables?
[12:56:14] <skunkworks> (secondary home position
[12:56:15] <skunkworks> )
[12:57:47] <skunkworks> and that is set in machine coordinates - correct?
[12:59:22] <skunkworks> (not affected by selecting other coordinate systems - ie g54-g59)
[13:02:54] <skunkworks> chirp. chirp. (cricket) ;)
[13:11:10] <alex_joni> well.. I'm off
[13:11:14] <alex_joni> back on sunday
[13:11:27] <anonimasu> ok
[13:11:29] <anonimasu> laters..
[13:11:32] <Martin_Lundstrom> alex_joni, have a nice weekend!
[13:12:46] <skunkworks> bye alex.
[13:14:46] <skunkworks> Duh - I can set values in the var file from gcode - can't I
[13:44:00] <cradek> skunkworks: #5181=1.234
[13:45:52] <skunkworks> sweet.. I think I answered all my other questions. thanks
[13:46:10] <jepler> * jepler learns that there is a limit of 50 named parameters at each level, including the global level
[13:48:14] <skunkworks> vfor?
[13:48:20] <skunkworks> for?
[13:49:51] <jepler> in gcode
[13:50:10] <cradek> I forgot we had those...
[13:50:25] <jepler> named parameters are demonstrated here: http://cvs.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/cvsweb.cgi/emc2/nc_files/flowsnake.ngc?rev=1.2;content-type=text%2Fx-cvsweb-markup
[13:57:29] <skunkworks> forgot about that also.
[14:19:31] <skunkworks> jepler: did you get the limit looking at the source - or where you making a program that went over it ;)
[14:20:51] <jepler> skunkworks: looking at the source
[14:21:13] <jepler> I would switch to another language like python long before I reached that level of complexity
[14:24:27] <skunkworks> :) I was wondering
[14:26:28] <skunkworks> I didn't get to actually cutting the boards last night. Dad had gotten a 60amp plasma (solid state - small package weighs about 25 lbs. 110/220v) and it wasn't working. would fire up but would not jut any thickness. supposed to cut up to 1 inch at 7ipm
[14:26:42] <skunkworks> cut
[14:28:06] <skunkworks> It had a pigtail - 3 wires green-black-red. He hooked a 220v plug to it. well we decided to take the cover off. they had the black wire hooked to the case. green was hooked to one side of the double pole breaker. I guess green isn't ground world around.
[14:28:21] <cradek> wow
[14:28:30] <cradek> harbor freight?
[14:28:36] <skunkworks> ebay
[14:28:44] <cradek> ok even worse :-)
[14:28:45] <skunkworks> it works now :)
[14:29:23] <skunkworks> lucky we didn't get a nasty shock - or killed ;)
[14:29:58] <jepler> geez
[14:34:12] <skunkworks> this is it (don't think it is the company he bought it from) http://cgi.ebay.com/60D-Dual-Voltage-110-220-Amps-Plasma-Cutter_W0QQitemZ110119629773QQihZ001QQcategoryZ113743QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
[14:35:48] <skunkworks> It does cut inch. pretty well.
[14:39:21] <skunkworks> better than our old 40amp plasma we have.
[14:43:41] <skunkworks> it gets into the gantry though ;)
[14:44:30] <Dallur> interference issues ?
[14:44:57] <skunkworks> no clue - probably just a bit too messy.
[14:46:47] <skunkworks> things like this http://www.electronicsam.com/images/KandT/servostart/breakout.JPG just hanging out - don't help ;)
[14:47:26] <skunkworks> it needs to be cleaned up.
[14:51:24] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07TRUNK * 10emc2/src/emc/usr_intf/axis/scripts/axis.py: use correct name for the keypad enter key
[15:01:21] <Dallur> skunkworks: lol , no I bet they don'-t I just bought $300 worth of copper and I already dug a pretty big hole on my property for a new ground system,
[15:01:34] <Dallur> skunkworks: damn high frequency
[15:02:28] <skunkworks> :)
[15:29:23] <dmwaters> {global notice} Good day all. We had a problem with one of our rotation servers that segfaulted. We are currently working on the problem, and i will give any further updates in wallops, thank you for your time, and thank you for using freenode!
[15:32:45] <orpheus> hi all
[15:33:04] <awallin> hi
[15:33:11] <orpheus> i'm currently setting up my machine to use a joystick as input
[15:33:17] <orpheus> i currently have:
[15:34:13] <orpheus> joypad.axis.0->integ->multiplier->conv_float_s32->axis.0.jog-counts
[15:34:41] <orpheus> and everythin is running off of the servo thread
[15:35:18] <orpheus> however, it seems like emc is only updating what it does with axis.0.jog-counts a few times every seconds
[15:35:48] <awallin> do you have jog-speed high enough ?
[15:36:00] <orpheus> i don't know
[15:36:09] <orpheus> what exactly does it set?
[15:36:17] <awallin> the jog speed :)
[15:36:42] <orpheus> as in, some kind of update speed for jogging->motor control ?
[15:36:45] <awallin> the speed the machine moves at when you jog. so if it's low it will look lime emc is sluggish to respond to your commands
[15:36:59] <orpheus> oh, no, that's not it
[15:37:07] <orpheus> my steppers end up moving in bursts
[15:37:20] <awallin> then look with halmeter at jog-counts. does that change 'instantaneously' ?
[15:37:32] <orpheus> yep
[15:37:40] <orpheus> which is why it's so wierd
[15:37:57] <awallin> and your jog-scale is something reasonable, i.e. move 0.1mm or something per count
[15:37:59] <orpheus> i can't mind much info on the actual "axis" hal module
[15:38:13] <awallin> that is the motion controller
[15:38:13] <orpheus> *mind=find
[15:38:32] <orpheus> i could be that jog-scale is set too low
[15:38:36] <orpheus> *it
[15:38:39] <orpheus> right?
[15:38:57] <awallin> with steppers your machine won't move until the change in position is more than one step
[15:39:12] <SWPadnos> the module that provides axis* HAL pins is called motmod
[15:39:25] <orpheus> thanks
[15:39:35] <SWPadnos> you're welcoms
[15:39:39] <SWPadnos> -s +e
[15:39:39] <orpheus> it's actually jumping ~ 45 degrees
[15:39:57] <awallin> SWPadnos: but the pins are somewhat cryptically named 'axis', 'motion' etc...
[15:40:10] <SWPadnos> right, that's why I pointed out the module name :)
[15:40:15] <awallin> orpheus: is jogging with the keyboard arrows smooth? with MDI?
[15:40:18] <orpheus> with microstepping, my steppers sould be going something like 1.8/10 degrees on a step
[15:40:38] <orpheus> with the keyboard or from .nc code it's just fine
[15:41:08] <awallin> are you setting jog-enable on/off yourself somehow automagically ?
[15:41:56] <orpheus> ooh, i'll have to double check (I started from the sample joystick config, so i have all kinds of extra stuff in there)
[15:42:08] <orpheus> that would explain quite a lot
[15:42:47] <orpheus> also, is there a better place under axis.0.* to dump my float input?
[15:43:22] <awallin> jog-count can(should?) be an int I think. then you set the jog-scale to determine how much the machine moves
[15:43:29] <orpheus> yeah
[15:43:59] <orpheus> i was just thinking, i'd prefer to tell the machine where to go by way of a float
[15:44:38] <orpheus> but i guess axis.*.jog-counts is the only way to tell the machine to jog to a place
[15:45:18] <awallin> there is halui, but axis.N.jog-counts is really the one you want to use for jogwheels and joysticks
[15:45:33] <orpheus> alright
[15:45:42] <SWPadnos> halui has the advantage of having a direct joystick input pin though
[15:45:48] <orpheus> well, thanks for all the info, i'm gonna go poke at it some more
[15:45:59] <orpheus> really? what all does it do?
[15:46:25] <SWPadnos> it gives you proportional jogging from an analog input, such as a joystick axis :)
[15:46:54] <orpheus> dang... like everything I already set up... oh well
[15:46:56] <SWPadnos> I'm pretty sure that was added after someone had difficulty setting up a joystick -> encoder -> motion system, such as yours
[15:47:00] <SWPadnos> lemme check though
[15:47:11] <orpheus> i'm not using an encoder to do it, btw
[15:47:20] <orpheus> it seemed hackish
[15:47:32] <SWPadnos> also, the joystick component only seems to update its pins when a change occurs
[15:47:34] <orpheus> so i rebuilt it with the integral module
[15:48:13] <orpheus> thanks tho, I'll look at that as well
[15:48:25] <SWPadnos> I'm not sure how often you're getting updates from userspace (joystick)
[15:48:29] <orpheus> * orpheus has to go to another machine to work on emc
[15:48:34] <SWPadnos> enjoy
[15:49:54] <SWPadnos> ok - the halui pins are called halui.jog.N.analog
[15:50:53] <jepler> orpheus: documentation of axis. and motion. pins is in this chapter of the manual: http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.1/html/config/emc2hal/index.html
[15:53:22] <Martin_Lundstrom> I get insmod: error inserting '/home/martin/emc2.1.4/rtlib/rtapi.ko': -1 Invalid module format when I try to run from my compiled thing from CVS
[15:53:47] <Martin_Lundstrom> why dont I have a rtlib from the CVS?
[15:54:10] <Martin_Lundstrom> (the .deb version works fine)
[15:54:21] <jepler> Martin_Lundstrom: look in dmesg, there may be a more complete error message shown there.
[15:54:38] <Martin_Lundstrom> the insmod: error inserting '/home/martin/emc2.1.4/rtlib/rtapi.ko': -1 Invalid module format
[15:54:43] <Martin_Lundstrom> does not exist
[15:55:03] <Martin_Lundstrom> (the file)
[15:55:04] <SWPadnos> do you mean that error isn't in dmesg?
[15:55:09] <SWPadnos> ah
[15:55:28] <jepler> you mean the named file does not exist? If that's the case, then you haven't sucessfully built emc. Look carefully at the output of "configure" and "make"; there is probably an error there that you overlooked.
[15:55:39] <SWPadnos> this is on a machine that has an installed EMC2, correct?
[15:55:48] <Martin_Lundstrom> yep
[15:56:01] <SWPadnos> ok - just checking the basics ;)
[15:56:05] <jepler> hum, that's not the error my system gives when a module that does not exist is given to insmod: insmod: can't read '/tmp/does-not-exist.ko': No such file or directory
[15:56:06] <awallin> apt-get emc-dev
[15:56:49] <SWPadnos> actually, it's apt-get build-dep emc2
[15:57:25] <SWPadnos> emc-dev includes some other stuff, like for building documentation and things (I think)
[15:57:29] <SWPadnos> emc2-dev, that is
[15:57:33] <jepler> the emc2-dev package is for building additional HAL components to go with your installed version of emc
[15:57:41] <awallin> nice that someone remembers the details...
[15:57:51] <SWPadnos> heh - yeah, it is ;)
[15:58:13] <Martin_Lundstrom> checking for RT dir... Using /usr/realtime-2.6.15-magma/bin/rtai-config as the RT signature
[15:58:37] <jepler> actually I'm just paraphrasing the Description of the emc2-dev package printed by "apt-cache show emc2-dev"
[16:17:41] <Martin_Lundstrom> I cant seem to compile rtapi corectly
[16:17:45] <Martin_Lundstrom> hmm
[16:19:41] <skunkworks> You did do a sudo apt-get build-dep emc2
[16:19:43] <skunkworks> ?
[16:19:55] <Martin_Lundstrom> yep, Ill do it again
[16:20:24] <cradek> did you find a better error in dmesg?
[16:20:38] <Martin_Lundstrom> no, too much info for me
[16:20:56] <cradek> are you running the -magma kernel that it's compiling against?
[16:21:00] <skunkworks> pastebin.ca it
[16:21:24] <Martin_Lundstrom> ill do new compilation and try again
[16:21:41] <jepler> OK let's start from the beginning -- does "apt-get build-dep emc2" successfully complete?
[16:22:15] <Martin_Lundstrom> yep
[16:22:34] <jepler> what is the last line that "sudo apt-get build-dep emc2" prints?
[16:23:09] <Martin_Lundstrom> 0 upgraded, 0 newly installed, 0 to remove and 3 not upgraded.
[16:23:23] <jepler> OK, good
[16:23:38] <Martin_Lundstrom> configure seemes fine
[16:23:45] <Martin_Lundstrom> make seemes fine
[16:24:06] <SWPadnos> is this run in place?
[16:24:13] <Martin_Lundstrom> yep
[16:24:21] <SWPadnos> and you did "sudo make setuid" ?
[16:24:35] <Martin_Lundstrom> yep
[16:24:43] <SWPadnos> ok, I'm out of ideas ;)
[16:25:13] <jepler> clearly make is not fine if it didn't create rtlib/rtapi.ko
[16:25:16] <skunkworks> are you running a config from the rip?
[16:25:19] <cradek> why not look at THE ERROR that's probably in dmesg?
[16:25:28] <cradek> error inserting '/home/martin/emc2.1.4/rtlib/rtapi.ko': -1 Invalid
[16:25:34] <cradek> module format
[16:25:44] <cradek> why do you think this means the file doesn't exist??
[16:26:31] <Martin_Lundstrom> http://pastebin.ca/470916
[16:27:02] <cradek> rtapi: version magic '2.6.15-magma 586TSC gcc-4.1' should be '2.6.15-magma 586TSC gcc-4.0'
[16:27:08] <Martin_Lundstrom> now I took the dev version and I have the rt dir
[16:27:09] <cradek> you are using the wrong compiler
[16:27:29] <Martin_Lundstrom> ok
[16:27:49] <Martin_Lundstrom> how do I roll back?
[16:28:04] <Martin_Lundstrom> oups newbe linux question
[16:28:27] <cradek> ii gcc-4.0 4.0.3-1ubuntu5
[16:28:33] <cradek> this is the version that's installed on my machine
[16:28:34] <jepler> how did you install gcc 4.1?
[16:29:06] <Martin_Lundstrom> so apt-get gcc ?
[16:29:46] <Martin_Lundstrom> maybe the compiler was there before
[16:29:55] <jepler> I don't even know how you'd get gcc 4.1 on ubuntu 6.06.
[16:33:39] <Martin_Lundstrom> maybe I dont have 6.06
[16:35:24] <jepler> in that case it's no surprise it doesn't work right...
[16:36:12] <Martin_Lundstrom> How do I check wich version I have?
[16:36:27] <cradek> % cat /etc/lsb-release
[16:36:27] <cradek> DISTRIB_ID=Ubuntu
[16:36:27] <cradek> DISTRIB_RELEASE=6.06
[16:36:32] <Martin_Lundstrom> I have 6.10
[16:37:28] <SWPadnos> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?Installing_EMC2#Simulator_on_Ubuntu_6_10_Edgy_Eft
[16:37:31] <Martin_Lundstrom> So do I go to sleep now :p
[16:37:34] <jepler> then 6.10 and 6.06 have different versions of gcc -- but the kernel and emc must be compiled with identical versions of gcc
[16:37:45] <Martin_Lundstrom> ok
[16:38:16] <SWPadnos> unfortunately, those are the only instructions for edgy. if you follow the instructions onn the RTAISteps wiki page, it may help
[16:38:59] <cradek> if this is a new install and you don't need edgy for some reason, you'd be much better off installing dapper
[16:39:09] <SWPadnos> but those instructions are somewhat old (late 2005), so many of the names have changed
[16:40:10] <cradek> if you want to run 2.1.4 you can just install the package, you do not need to compile it
[16:45:38] <Martin_Lundstrom> now I get
[16:45:40] <Martin_Lundstrom> ddt: dlsym: /home/martin/emc2.1-branch/rtlib/ddt.so: undefined symbol: rtapi_app_main
[16:45:40] <Martin_Lundstrom> HAL:9: ERROR: /home/martin/emc2.1-branch/bin/rtapi_app exited without becoming ready
[16:45:40] <Martin_Lundstrom> HAL:9: ERROR: insmod failed, returned -1
[16:45:40] <Martin_Lundstrom> HAL config file /home/martin/emc2.1-branch/configs/sim/core_sim.hal failed.
[16:45:40] <Martin_Lundstrom> Shutting down and cleaning up EMC2...
[16:45:41] <Martin_Lundstrom> MOTION: cleanup_module() started.
[16:45:42] <Martin_Lundstrom> HAL: threads stopped
[16:45:44] <Martin_Lundstrom> MOTION: cleanup_module() finished.
[16:46:56] <Martin_Lundstrom> i think I better make a fresh install of 6.06
[16:47:53] <cradek> http://www.linuxcnc.org/content/view/21/4/lang,en/
[17:22:50] <ds2> ds2 is now known as ds2-
[17:23:22] <ds2-> ds2- is now known as ds2
[17:49:38] <tche> hello friends
[17:50:12] <tche> i want to make a small machine for emc with mainboards mini-itx
[17:50:24] <dmwaters> {global notice} Hi all! freenode is currently looking for both main rotation servers and a hub in Europe. if you are interested in sponsoring a server for freenode please see: http://freenode.net/hosting_ircd.shtml Thank you for your patience, and thank you for using freenode!
[17:50:24] <tche> i have one list
[17:53:58] <tche> somebody to help-me im mi decison
[17:54:01] <tche> please
[17:54:12] <tche> for exemple:
[17:54:30] <tche> EPIA-5000
[17:54:44] <tche> is good option for emc?
[17:55:32] <tche> please
[17:57:27] <tche> ?
[17:59:10] <JymmmEMC> EMC seems to do better with OFF-BOARD video
[17:59:40] <skunkworks> what do you mean by offboard?
[17:59:55] <JymmmEMC> Not ONBOARD video
[18:00:08] <skunkworks> ah - yes.
[18:00:10] <JymmmEMC> a pci/agp/pcie video
[18:00:26] <skunkworks> JymmmEMC: how is the machine running?
[18:00:31] <tche> friends
[18:01:06] <tche> i belive thats you know very emc
[18:01:14] <JymmmEMC> skunkworks: no comment, but I'm looking fro a 39VAC XFMR ~800VA
[18:01:31] <tche> the list off mu distibuitor
[18:01:33] <tche> is:
[18:01:40] <tche> http://www.cortex.com.br/familia2.php?familia_id=17
[18:01:47] <JymmmEMC> skunkworks: and 17000uF 100VAC cap(s)
[18:02:04] <tche> in hear any mother boards
[18:02:27] <tche> plese give me one idea for one
[18:02:30] <tche> please
[18:03:12] <JymmmEMC> tche: D oyu have a P3 motherbaord?
[18:03:25] <JymmmEMC> tche: Do you have a P3 motherbaord?
[18:03:25] <tche> ?
[18:03:32] <tche> i dont undestand
[18:03:40] <JymmmEMC> Pentium 3
[18:03:44] <tche> no
[18:03:46] <JymmmEMC> old
[18:03:56] <tche> i want to shop one
[18:04:11] <JymmmEMC> I'd avoid the mini boards
[18:04:13] <tche> i want use mini itx in one machine
[18:04:29] <skunkworks> rafa: we don't know what board work vs what doesn't your going to have to try one. This is really all the info we have http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?Hardware_Requirements
[18:04:47] <tche> ok <skunkworks>
[18:04:53] <skunkworks> 'guide lines'
[18:05:06] <skunkworks> JymmmEMC: gecko?
[18:05:12] <tche> friend
[18:05:14] <JymmmEMC> tche: Grab the LIVECD and try the RTAI Test (Real Time Test)
[18:05:20] <tche> no idea?
[18:05:46] <tche> i dont to adquiri this mother if no function
[18:05:48] <tche> ok :)
[18:06:14] <tche> in the list some mother
[18:06:25] <tche> if somebody have one idea
[18:06:33] <tche> this mother is:
[18:06:38] <tche> EPIA-5000
[18:06:43] <tche> EPIA-5000
[18:06:45] <JymmmEMC> skunkworks: After checking prciing on encoders yesterday for the sole purpose of diagnosing ($100/each), I'mconsidering geckos. But I HATE troubleshooting blind like this. But Marriss has a 30day return policy (just in case) but I need the PS running first.
[18:06:54] <tche> EPIA-M10000
[18:07:01] <tche> EPIA-MII6000E
[18:07:03] <JymmmEMC> tche: Find an old P3 mobo insteaidn of buying a new one
[18:07:23] <ohiopctechDOTcom> http://ohiopctech.com/ratio.html <- a calculator for a formula to find a scale ratio (the value of X) for scaling drawings. (i use it almost everyday)
[18:07:39] <tche> i want to but one
[18:07:55] <tche> for this my ask
[18:08:26] <tche> somebody to make one machine witc miniitx?
[18:09:14] <ohiopctechDOTcom> tche: i'd say buy the one you like that is also supported by ubuntu and give it a try
[18:09:38] <ohiopctechDOTcom> Without: onboard video..
[18:11:24] <tche> please
[18:11:32] <tche> i need one idea
[18:11:57] <tche> dont to buy the mother if she no function with emc
[18:12:00] <tche> :)
[18:12:51] <tche> please
[18:13:06] <tche> if somebody want to help-me
[18:13:15] <tche> the list hear:
[18:13:24] <tche> http://www.cortex.com.br/familia2.php?familia_id=17
[18:15:12] <tche> please i need very you help
[18:17:00] <tche> somebody have a idea?
[18:19:09] <JymmmEMC> ohiopctechDOTcom: free-cad.sf.net
[18:19:30] <JymmmEMC> ohiopctechDOTcom: jepler found that yesterday
[18:19:54] <ohiopctechDOTcom> wow, the screenshot has me sold already on the front page
[18:20:11] <JymmmEMC> ohiopctechDOTcom: I got a bridge for sale too, cheap
[18:20:41] <tche> please
[18:20:46] <tche> help-me
[18:21:10] <ohiopctechDOTcom> JymmmEMC, i'm going to use some i pulled out of an old pc power suppl
[18:21:16] <ohiopctechDOTcom> y*
[18:21:22] <ohiopctechDOTcom> at least try first
[18:22:02] <tche> no idea people?
[18:22:44] <JymmmEMC> tche: No on board video
[18:23:02] <tche> friend i use emc in any boards
[18:23:11] <tche> M810
[18:23:18] <ohiopctechDOTcom> http://juergen-riegel.net/FreeCAD/Docu/index.php?title=David <- did you seee that JymmmEMC?
[18:23:18] <tche> video onboard
[18:27:11] <tche> please
[18:27:14] <tche> help-me
[18:28:12] <ohiopctechDOTcom> wait.. did you mean.. a bridge over water
[18:28:22] <ohiopctechDOTcom> or a bridge rectifier?
[18:29:01] <JymmmEMC> over water
[18:29:07] <ohiopctechDOTcom> ha
[18:29:09] <anonimasu> hm
[18:29:23] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i bought one yesterday, they should be delivering it any day now
[18:29:51] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i think it was brooklyn bridge or something ...
[18:30:08] <skunkworks> http://www.electronicsam.com/images/KandT/conversion/diodes.JPG
[18:30:09] <tche> thanks
[18:30:34] <JymmmEMC> London Bridge is what I have for sale....
[18:31:24] <skunkworks> that was already sold - it is in arazona somewhere :)
[18:31:29] <ohiopctechDOTcom> if i hadn't already bought broklyn bridge .. i'd take it for sure
[18:33:55] <JymmmEMC> dumb question, but how do you install a already downloaded deb ?
[18:34:16] <anonimasu> dpkg --install "package"
[18:34:26] <anonimasu> I think it was..
[18:34:27] <anonimasu> :D
[18:34:32] <anonimasu> I'm not sure about the --
[18:34:33] <anonimasu> ;)
[18:34:41] <alex_joni> dpkg -i
[18:34:41] <ohiopctechDOTcom> "man dpkg"
[18:34:52] <JymmmEMC> that was it, I was trying to use apt-get
[18:35:56] <skunkworks> alex_joni: thought you where leaving.. I already said good bye..
[18:36:05] <alex_joni> skunkworks: I did leave
[18:36:16] <alex_joni> but strangely my laptop found it's way into the luggage
[18:36:16] <skunkworks> ;)
[18:36:24] <ohiopctechDOTcom> lol..
[18:36:35] <ohiopctechDOTcom> cellular modem?
[18:36:42] <alex_joni> initially I planned to let it at home
[18:36:47] <alex_joni> ohiopctechDOTcom: yeah, similar
[18:36:55] <alex_joni> 2.4Mbit though
[18:37:03] <alex_joni> that's max (not around here though..)
[18:37:14] <alex_joni> * alex_joni is somewhere in the mountains again ;)
[18:37:17] <ohiopctechDOTcom> that service would cots billions a month here
[18:37:21] <ohiopctechDOTcom> cost*
[18:37:27] <alex_joni> 30$ for 100 hours / month
[18:37:37] <alex_joni> no up/download limits
[18:37:43] <ohiopctechDOTcom> ok, maybe a hundred or so
[18:37:57] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i looked it up once at sprint
[18:37:58] <alex_joni> and now they included another version at 35$ unlimited
[18:38:12] <alex_joni> this is a strange network, not GSM
[18:38:24] <alex_joni> it only exists in a couple of countries
[18:38:41] <alex_joni> it's called CDMA, and the high speed version EVDO
[18:38:54] <JymmmEMC> Oh Gawd... Try to install that FreeCAD, but one dependancy has the dependancy of the other and neither will install
[18:39:05] <alex_joni> JymmmEMC: install them both at once
[18:39:12] <alex_joni> dpkg -i foo1 foo2
[18:39:42] <skunkworks> my uncle who lives in the boonies finally can get a wireless service.. but it is capped at 1Gb per month. Just crazy these days.
[18:40:01] <skunkworks> with an ungodly overage charge.
[18:40:06] <alex_joni> 1Gb or 1GB ?
[18:40:20] <skunkworks> gB I guess byte
[18:40:29] <skunkworks> so 1 iso
[18:40:37] <skunkworks> aprox
[18:42:19] <JymmmEMC> For the record, communications are rated in bits per second, storage in BYTEs
[18:42:37] <alex_joni> JymmmEMC: how about bandwidth?
[18:42:48] <alex_joni> I mean.. download limits
[18:43:00] <JymmmEMC> communications = bandwidth, modem, isdn, dsl, etc
[18:43:17] <JymmmEMC> well sounds like storage to me
[18:43:24] <JymmmEMC> evne if it's not being stored
[18:43:40] <JymmmEMC> if it's per socend, usually bits
[18:43:45] <jepler> "b" means "bits" and "B" means bytes, so 1Gb and 1GB are different. But people frequently misuse "b" and "B", just like you'll see people say they have a "3000mHz" CPU...
[18:43:52] <skunkworks> alex_joni: what color is ground over there? Wire
[18:44:02] <JymmmEMC> what jepler said
[18:44:16] <JymmmEMC> 300 baud is 300 BITS ps
[18:44:35] <JymmmEMC> 10GigE is 10G BITSps
[18:44:51] <JymmmEMC> 10/100 is bits
[18:44:56] <JymmmEMC> etc
[18:45:59] <jepler> "I typically get downloads of 150kB/s on my DSL line, which has a nominal speed of 1.5Mbps"
[18:46:25] <JymmmEMC> jepler: you just gotta love browsers showing it all in Bytes, confusing
[18:46:49] <JymmmEMC> I always have to pull out my calculator and /8
[18:47:48] <skunkworks> http://www.electronicsam.com/images/ground.JPG
[18:48:31] <JymmmEMC> skunkworks: wth?
[18:48:38] <skunkworks> that is what we said.
[18:49:13] <JymmmEMC> jepler: I can't get freecad installed... linux-kernel-headers >=
[18:49:30] <JymmmEMC> jepler: I can't get freecad installed... linux-kernel-headers >=
[18:49:37] <JymmmEMC> just fyi
[18:50:05] <jepler> huh that's an odd requirement for a program that I wouldn't expect to have any kernel modules
[18:50:23] <JymmmEMC> libc6-dev dependancy
[18:50:35] <JymmmEMC> I'm in SMP kernel right now, let me go single
[18:51:40] <alex_joni> skunkworks: yellow & green
[18:52:28] <skunkworks> odd
[18:52:44] <alex_joni> skunkworks: how so?
[18:53:03] <skunkworks> did you see the picture link above?
[18:53:07] <alex_joni> nop
[18:53:11] <alex_joni> can you paste again?
[18:53:25] <skunkworks> http://www.electronicsam.com/images/ground.JPG
[18:53:27] <alex_joni> sorry.. seen it now
[18:53:37] <alex_joni> eek
[18:53:52] <skunkworks> It was a 60a plasma we got off of ebay. wondered why it wasn't cutting. :)
[18:54:05] <skunkworks> works now though.
[18:54:18] <JymmmEMC> just connect it to the red wire
[18:55:33] <ohiopctechDOTcom> ok, so i can say it looks kinda ghetto... since you didn't build it.. ;)
[18:55:33] <skunkworks> we just rewired the plug on the pigtail. (220v plug)
[18:55:34] <ohiopctechDOTcom> anyways... i'm kidding...
[18:55:34] <JymmmEMC> ohiopctechDOTcom: I'd say ti anyway
[18:55:34] <ohiopctechDOTcom> if it works who cares what it looks like!
[18:56:03] <JymmmEMC> jepler: Pok, added it to the end of the list of other pkgs to install, going now
[18:56:09] <JymmmEMC> -P
[18:57:43] <ohiopctechDOTcom> http://www3.telus.net/public/aschoepp/tapdrill.html
[19:04:53] <Martin_Lundstrom> It worked!
[19:08:21] <JymmmEMC> Martin_Lundstrom: just thank the makers of viagra for that
[19:08:30] <Martin_Lundstrom> lol
[19:10:57] <CIA-8> 03jmkasunich 07TRUNK * 10emc2/src/hal/utils/ (bfmerge.c Submakefile): bfmerge: used to merge driver 'hints' into FPGA bitfile for 5i20
[19:14:43] <JymmmEMC> jepler: I got freecad installed, but.... well
[19:15:44] <toastydeath> pirate mastercam
[19:15:44] <toastydeath> figure it out
[19:15:50] <toastydeath> and then tell me how to use surfaces
[19:15:58] <JymmmEMC> lol
[19:16:02] <toastydeath> ty
[19:16:09] <JymmmEMC> RTFM
[19:16:29] <JymmmEMC> isnt mastercam windows?
[19:17:30] <JymmmEMC> toastydeath: you could just blame petev too
[19:17:30] <ohiopctechDOTcom> yup
[19:17:55] <ohiopctechDOTcom> surfaces still dumbfound me
[19:17:58] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i figured otu solids
[19:18:02] <ohiopctechDOTcom> out*
[19:18:16] <JymmmEMC> you mean like shading and texture relief?
[19:18:50] <ohiopctechDOTcom> well like how to take a 2d drawing and extrude it to a 3d form as a solid
[19:19:26] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i drew the nested cubes last night in 3d.. and started turning the faces into a solid... looks neat
[19:19:49] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i only got the outside finished, the inside is still only wireframe
[19:20:52] <Martin_Lundstrom> how do I add gantrykins functionality?
[19:21:09] <Martin_Lundstrom> http://axis.unpy.net/01162326817
[19:21:23] <alex_joni> night all
[19:21:28] <Martin_Lundstrom> night
[19:21:47] <ohiopctechDOTcom> cya
[19:22:31] <Martin_Lundstrom> in what library shall I place the files?
[19:25:03] <toastydeath> jymmmemc: mastercam surfaces are like
[19:25:04] <toastydeath> arcane
[19:25:30] <toastydeath> and TFM isn't helping
[19:25:34] <jepler> Martin_Lundstrom: the existing kinematics modules are in src/emc/kinematics, and the lines that cause them to be compiled are in src/Makefile
[19:25:59] <Martin_Lundstrom> ?
[19:26:36] <Martin_Lundstrom> shall I add the files in ../kinematics dir?
[19:27:07] <jepler> yes, but merely putting the source file in that directory is not enough -- you have to add lines to src/Makefile to cause it to be compiled.
[19:27:46] <jepler> look at the lines about "trivkins" -- you'll need to add similar lines for "gantrykins".
[19:28:21] <ohiopctechDOTcom> axis related question: if i do m6t2 in mdi... then touch off in manual. will that save t2 letgth in the tool table?
[19:28:32] <ohiopctechDOTcom> length*
[19:28:34] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07TRUNK * 10emc2/bin/.cvsignore: new binary to ignore
[19:28:37] <cradek> ohiopctechDOTcom: no
[19:28:38] <jepler> ohiopctechDOTcom: no, Touch Off sets the (G54, usually) offset
[19:28:48] <ohiopctechDOTcom> hmm
[19:29:04] <cradek> ohiopctechDOTcom: if you want to change the tool table, you need to edit it yourself
[19:29:33] <ohiopctechDOTcom> what i did is to post my different tools as seperate programs... 1 uses tool 1, 2 uses tool 2. (in the cam prog)
[19:30:02] <cradek> ok you don't really need the tool table then - just touch off each tool before you run its program
[19:30:15] <ohiopctechDOTcom> ok...
[19:30:28] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i did it that way because i don't have fixed holders.. (yet
[19:30:45] <cradek> of course if you machine away the top of your work with tool 1, you're in trouble! you have to plan ahead
[19:31:06] <ohiopctechDOTcom> you mean where i would touch off tool 2 right?
[19:31:09] <cradek> yes
[19:31:11] <ohiopctechDOTcom> ;)
[19:31:25] <skunkworks> cradek: you guys are 'dialed' in to your computers at home - correct? how is that setup? is it some sort of remote control?
[19:31:27] <cradek> two separate programs is a good way to deal with your setup
[19:31:31] <cradek> skunkworks: ssh
[19:31:42] <skunkworks> * skunkworks goes off to google
[19:32:19] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i use putty/vnc/samba
[19:32:40] <jepler> yes, putty is a good ssh client for windows
[19:32:42] <cradek> yes, putty is a decent ssh client for windows
[19:32:44] <cradek> haha
[19:33:03] <jepler> I use winscp3 when I want to copy files between linux and windows, but thankfully that's rare
[19:33:04] <ohiopctechDOTcom> hmm, what does that all mean..
[19:33:06] <ohiopctechDOTcom> * ohiopctechDOTcom ponders
[19:33:16] <ohiopctechDOTcom> oh yeah winscp too!
[19:33:26] <Martin_Lundstrom> jepler: I cant find in ../src/Makefile where to add / modyfy????
[19:33:29] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i have so many little utils on here i forget what they all are
[19:34:36] <cradek> Martin_Lundstrom: http://article.gmane.org/gmane.linux.distributions.emc.user/1634/match=kinematics+makefile
[19:35:02] <cradek> err http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.linux.distributions.emc.user/1633/focus=1634
[19:36:25] <jepler> Makefile:617:obj-m += trivkins.o
[19:36:25] <jepler> Makefile:618:trivkins-objs := emc/kinematics/trivkins.o
[19:36:25] <jepler> Makefile:741:../rtlib/trivkins$(MODULE_EXT): $(addprefix objects/rt,$(trivkins-objs))
[19:38:04] <Martin_Lundstrom> ? shall I add those lines?
[19:38:36] <jepler> no, those are the existing lines about the trivial kinematics module
[19:38:36] <cradek> Martin_Lundstrom: did you read that link I pasted?
[19:39:02] <Martin_Lundstrom> yep, but there is no lines to copy paste
[19:39:17] <Martin_Lundstrom> I have to find out myself what to add
[19:39:25] <Martin_Lundstrom> and im lost
[19:39:49] <cradek> please read it again
[19:39:56] <skunkworks> * skunkworks wants his nick to be on here all the time also.. ;)
[19:40:14] <Martin_Lundstrom> "You will have to update your kins file to add the lines necessary to make it loadable. Look in one of the existing files to see how."
[19:41:01] <Martin_Lundstrom> would be nice with a wiki for this
[19:41:30] <cradek> it would be great if you would write a wiki page as you figure it out
[19:41:40] <skunkworks> Martin_Lundstrom: your nominated.. ;)
[19:41:56] <Martin_Lundstrom> ehhh, Dallur, how did you do it?
[19:42:17] <cradek> Martin_Lundstrom: look at the paragraph above that one you pasted. The one you pasted is there because goettler was asking about kins he wrote for emc 2.0
[19:43:26] <jepler> here are the changes made to src/Makefile when another kinematics module, "rotatekins", was added: http://cvs.linuxcnc.org/cvs/emc2/src/Makefile.diff?r1=1.121;r2=1.122;f=h
[19:45:03] <Martin_Lundstrom> this is arabic for me!
[19:46:25] <cradek> brb
[19:47:07] <Martin_Lundstrom> now I open a beer, I hope that helps ;)
[19:49:36] <jepler> on the left hand side you see the file before "rotatekins" was added. On the right you see the file after "rotatekins" was added. The lines added are shown in green to make them easier to spot.
[19:49:37] <ohiopctechDOTcom> sweet... the tool changing stuff worked out perfect, posting each tool to a seperate program...
[19:49:52] <jepler> you would add similar lines for "gantrykins"
[19:50:33] <Martin_Lundstrom> OK, I give it a try
[19:52:57] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i programmed 7 pockets through 1/4" lexan with a 1/8 endmill with a diameter of .144" and i got between .140 & .145 for all 7 holes. cut at 8ipm, around 12,000 rpms (spindle)
[19:53:17] <ohiopctechDOTcom> a second cleanup pass would surely make them all the same size or within .002
[19:53:29] <cradek> two flute or one?
[19:53:38] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i couldn't be happier with this machine
[19:54:12] <ohiopctechDOTcom> it's a two flute carbide w/ 1/8" shank - 1/8" cut
[19:55:20] <ohiopctechDOTcom> the holes are arranged randomly in a 1.5" x 3" rectangle
[19:56:24] <Martin_Lundstrom> Dallur: Are you there?
[19:59:08] <toastydeath> ffff
[20:18:13] <robin_sz> meep?
[20:25:20] <JymmmEMC> alex_joni: you have a board from Jon, don't you?
[20:26:59] <anonimasu> robin_sz: hey
[20:27:53] <JymmmEMC> Hey, who has started using their mesa boards you all went in on the group purchase thing?
[20:28:12] <anonimasu> robin_sz: wake up I'm in big trouble
[20:36:56] <robin_sz> dude! ...
[20:37:19] <anonimasu> :)
[20:37:26] <robin_sz> let me guess, the girl in question spotted you in the restaurant with her mother?
[20:37:35] <anonimasu> yeah
[20:37:47] <robin_sz> could have been worse ...
[20:37:55] <anonimasu> yeah, it could have been her grandmother..
[20:37:59] <anonimasu> she looks good too
[20:38:00] <robin_sz> brother ...
[20:38:06] <anonimasu> ^_^
[20:38:19] <robin_sz> so ... apart from that ?
[20:38:26] <anonimasu> pm
[20:41:26] <ohiopctechDOTcom> i always wondered...in mastercam, why does it spin the part like it's in a blender when you hit the end key?
[20:41:51] <ohiopctechDOTcom> it's doesn't seem to be useful for anything other than a fun break for a few seconds
[20:41:57] <anonimasu> they added it so they can claim they've invented it.
[20:42:35] <ohiopctechDOTcom> well, that's just silly
[20:45:44] <anonimasu> just kidding
[20:46:43] <ohiopctechDOTcom> you may be right!
[21:39:28] <toastydeath> cnc/manual hybrid machines seem to be awesome
[21:39:34] <toastydeath> someone confirm this y/n
[21:46:59] <JymmmEMC> 48vDC PS with 50V caps?!
[21:47:54] <dmwaters> {global notice} hi all! I need to do some emergency maintenence on 2 rotation servers to help get more rotation servers back into the rotation. This will be mildly disruptive, and i will give more information in wallops as i go. /mode your_nick +w to see them. Thank you for your patience, and thank you for using freenode!
[21:50:18] <ds2> how's your barrel of luck?
[21:53:01] <anonimasu> :)=
[21:53:30] <anonimasu> toastydeath: I find the concept not too excelent..
[21:54:07] <anonimasu> toastydeath: cnc machines are awesome
[21:54:13] <toastydeath> why not
[21:54:31] <toastydeath> full cnc control with full manual controls
[21:54:55] <toastydeath> seems like a pretty decent machine for toolmakers, etc
[21:55:53] <JymmmEMC> Hmmm http://cgi.ebay.com/48-volt-linear-power-supply-stepper-telecom-6-amp_W0QQitemZ290063550446QQihZ019QQcategoryZ11772QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
[22:03:36] <JymmmEMC> tap tap tap... is this thing on?
[22:04:39] <anonimasu> :)
[22:04:49] <JymmmEMC> no comments?
[22:04:55] <anonimasu> nope, looks good
[22:05:00] <JymmmEMC> uncommon for this group
[22:05:10] <anonimasu> toastydeath: I guess I never found a reason for handwheels on a cnc machine..
[22:05:18] <JymmmEMC> Just wondeirng if 6a is really enough
[22:05:20] <anonimasu> jog wheels are great for zeroing, but that's about it..
[22:05:39] <anonimasu> depends on your current limit I guess
[22:06:32] <JymmmEMC> over engineering sorta thing, happy with 10 even if not needed, no need to add in more issues down the road
[22:06:50] <JymmmEMC> Just need cpas mostly
[22:06:57] <anonimasu> well, cpas?
[22:06:57] <JymmmEMC> caps
[22:07:12] <JymmmEMC> 17000uF 100VAC
[22:07:14] <anonimasu> :)
[22:07:18] <JymmmEMC> err dc
[22:07:20] <anonimasu> or a damn stable powersupply..
[22:07:32] <JymmmEMC> I found a torroid
[22:07:48] <JymmmEMC> http://item.express.ebay.com/39-39V-800VA-Toroidal-Toroid-Power-Amp-Transformer_W0QQitemZ7540253745QQihZ017QQfromsoiZ1QQcmdZExpressItem
[22:07:48] <ds2> how much is the torroid, wire, and caps going to cost?
[22:08:00] <robin_sz> with chopper drives, PSU stability is not that important
[22:08:01] <JymmmEMC> cant find the caps
[22:08:10] <ds2> what is it so far w/o the caps?
[22:08:17] <JymmmEMC> $80
[22:08:23] <JymmmEMC> +S&H
[22:08:30] <robin_sz> in effect each drive is a small switch mode PSU
[22:09:10] <JymmmEMC> dman telecom all going digital....wtf!! Can't find 48VDC PS anymore
[22:09:21] <JymmmEMC> damn
[22:09:24] <robin_sz> one bit of advice?
[22:09:29] <JymmmEMC> Tequilia?
[22:09:32] <robin_sz> close
[22:09:35] <JymmmEMC> Got it
[22:10:01] <robin_sz> before getting a stupidly large PSU ... actually MEASURE the current you draw from the one you have
[22:10:20] <anonimasu> robin_sz: he knows what he's current limit is at too
[22:10:26] <JymmmEMC> This is before I order geckos
[22:10:50] <robin_sz> well, what current are your motors rated for?
[22:11:18] <robin_sz> 3A?
[22:11:28] <JymmmEMC> http://item.express.ebay.com/39-39V-800VA-Toroidal-Toroid-Power-Amp-Transformer_W0QQitemZ7540253745QQihZ017QQfromsoiZ1QQcmdZExpressItem
[22:11:35] <JymmmEMC> doh
[22:11:48] <JymmmEMC> http://www.xylotex.com/StepperMotor.htm
[22:11:54] <robin_sz> well, what current are your motors rated for?
[22:12:00] <JymmmEMC> ^^^
[22:12:08] <JymmmEMC> http://www.xylotex.com/StepperMotor.htm
[22:12:36] <robin_sz> 2.8A
[22:12:52] <robin_sz> so 3 motors .. thats a maximum of 5.6A ...
[22:13:25] <robin_sz> in practice, you'll be happy with half that ... 5.6A is a generous figure
[22:13:34] <ds2> Jymmm: http://cgi.ebay.com/NOKIA-BATA-CS71505-02-48V-1300W-RECTIFIER-POWER-UNIT_W0QQitemZ330042577423QQihZ014QQcategoryZ51268QQcmdZViewItem\
[22:13:37] <JymmmEMC> why 2/3rd's?
[22:13:38] <ds2> remove the trailing \
[22:14:03] <JymmmEMC> ds2: it's switching
[22:14:03] <robin_sz> JymmmEMC, I presume you read Mariss white paper on it?
[22:14:13] <ds2> JymmmEMC: why not switching?
[22:14:14] <JymmmEMC> robin_sz: a while back.
[22:14:33] <robin_sz> 2.8A is the peak, when moving, .. so its a sine wave .. peak 2.8 etc
[22:14:55] <JymmmEMC> robin_sz: but isn't mariss assuming that only two will be moving at a time?
[22:15:14] <robin_sz> 2/3rds is a theoretical maximum ... if you have the gearing perfect and can run all the motors at full speed at just below the stall
[22:15:22] <robin_sz> no
[22:15:23] <anonimasu> no
[22:15:56] <robin_sz> a motor driven at just below the stall torque at the corner frequency will pull its rated current at full volts
[22:16:02] <JymmmEMC> got a link to the PS sheet marriss wrote up?
[22:16:13] <robin_sz> http://www.geckodrive.com
[22:16:35] <robin_sz> thats a theorietical case
[22:16:43] <robin_sz> in practice, they usually pull a lot less
[22:16:49] <robin_sz> a lot less
[22:16:54] <JymmmEMC> I think jmkasunich mentioned something about that a ways ago, I wanted a lil more than that for loss, not running the PS at PEAK all the time etc
[22:17:24] <robin_sz> well, as you like .. youve had the advice, I expect you will ignore it
[22:17:38] <robin_sz> I doubt you will ever EVER pull 5.6A from it
[22:17:43] <robin_sz> even for a second
[22:17:59] <JymmmEMC> realistic pull?
[22:18:06] <robin_sz> 2.5 .. 3 maybe
[22:18:18] <JymmmEMC> due to the switching?
[22:18:22] <robin_sz> yes
[22:18:26] <JymmmEMC> err pulse trian I mena
[22:18:50] <robin_sz> my 8 by 4 foot gantrt plasma, runing both axes at 5m/min pulled about 2.5A
[22:19:01] <robin_sz> that was 2 x 4A motors at 55V
[22:19:37] <robin_sz> and that was a big gantry weighing perhaps 100lb
[22:19:46] <robin_sz> well, 70lb maybe
[22:20:05] <JymmmEMC> If this has >50V caps.... http://cgi.ebay.com/48-volt-linear-power-supply-stepper-telecom-6-amp_W0QQitemZ290063550446QQihZ019QQcategoryZ11772QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
[22:21:07] <robin_sz> looks perfect. buy it
[22:21:14] <robin_sz> err
[22:21:17] <robin_sz> it says regulated
[22:21:20] <robin_sz> thats not so good
[22:21:44] <robin_sz> umm, but it will be OK
[22:21:56] <robin_sz> a 300VA toroid would be ideal
[22:21:58] <JymmmEMC> could bypass the regulator
[22:22:08] <robin_sz> could do
[22:23:12] <JymmmEMC> fsck ebay makes everything a PITA anymore
[22:23:59] <robin_sz> bigger psus are more trouble thasn they are worth ... inrush current etc makes em a pain
[22:24:27] <robin_sz> a 6A supply sounds ideal
[22:24:59] <robin_sz> $35 is a bargain too
[22:25:08] <JymmmEMC> used, but
[22:26:41] <JymmmEMC> Gawd, I wish I had a scope
[22:27:12] <robin_sz> scopes are great for solving dc PSU problems
[22:27:28] <JymmmEMC> and lookng at pulse trains too
[22:27:32] <robin_sz> yep
[22:27:45] <SWPadnos_> SWPadnos_ is now known as SWPadnos
[22:27:52] <JymmmEMC> Though, I'm not sure how to connect to the motor side
[22:27:56] <robin_sz> now .. who canfix my modem problem?
[22:28:09] <JymmmEMC> robin_sz: mastercard
[22:28:44] <robin_sz> JymmmEMC, use a x10 probe, or two x 10 probes in differential mode .. do not clip a ground clip to one side of the motor wiring ...
[22:29:22] <JymmmEMC> robin_sz: If I ever get a scope, I'll bug ya then
[22:29:41] <robin_sz> pieces of seven ... pieces of seven
[22:29:43] <JymmmEMC> I ALMOST had a 100MHz for $140
[22:29:58] <JymmmEMC> display model
[22:29:58] <robin_sz> parroty error
[22:30:35] <robin_sz> did it have the correct markings?
[22:30:52] <dmwaters> {global notice} Good day folks. We're done with the emergency maintenence for the time being. We had this scheduled for 6am utc for the 5th but do to some dificulties it had to be pushed up a bit. I apologize for the inconvenience, and thank you for using freenode!
[22:30:56] <JymmmEMC> yeah, but the sign was on the wrong model - sold out
[22:31:15] <robin_sz> when buying scopes always look for the correct markings
[22:31:26] <JymmmEMC> oh it was 100MHz
[22:31:50] <robin_sz> it should say "hewlett packard" or "tektronix" or "philips" on any decent scope
[22:32:00] <JymmmEMC> ds2: it has todo with the BEMF iirc
[22:32:08] <robin_sz> cheap ones ahould say "hameg"
[22:32:10] <ds2> ah
[22:32:15] <ds2> B&K scopes ;)
[22:32:24] <robin_sz> euwww
[22:32:39] <robin_sz> B&K audio analysers yes
[22:32:47] <robin_sz> scopes? I thnik not.
[22:33:06] <JymmmEMC> robin_sz: no ds2 asked about why not switching PS
[22:33:44] <cradek> JymmmEMC: anywhere near dayton ohio? in a few weeks there will probably be as many free/almost free scopes as you can haul away
[22:33:44] <ds2> I think you can work around the back emc
[22:33:57] <robin_sz> switching psus, are not too bad on steppers, but can be troublesome on servos
[22:33:59] <JymmmEMC> cradek: calif
[22:34:08] <cradek> hm, not even close
[22:34:24] <robin_sz> servos place sudden short term large loads ...
[22:34:36] <JymmmEMC> cradek: also looking for something post 1980's not just a boat anchor.
[22:34:43] <ds2> could always hook up a telco 48V battery in parallel
[22:34:53] <JymmmEMC> ds2: you have any?
[22:35:04] <ds2> JymmmEMC: which? scopes or ?
[22:35:13] <robin_sz> linear supplies, especially toroids, have large overload margins and can do 5X rated for 2 seconds, no problem .. regualted/switching supplies just current limit and shut down
[22:35:15] <JymmmEMC> ds2: you keep mentioning telco equip, you have a source I don't know about?
[22:35:28] <cradek> JymmmEMC: any scope is much better than no scope
[22:35:36] <ds2> JymmmEMC: dumpsters and ex-coworkers when they clean out their labs
[22:35:39] <robin_sz> get a Hameg for $50
[22:35:48] <cradek> I used a tube based scope for a long time - you can fix them yourself when they go wrong
[22:35:59] <JymmmEMC> cradek: I have enough "junk" as it is. Could use a osund card at that rate.
[22:36:14] <ds2> JymmmEMC: look for people who deal with DSL... a lot of the DSLAMs were 48V; so 48V rectifiers are common even labs
[22:36:36] <JymmmEMC> ds2: well, if you see/hear of anything let me know.
[22:36:48] <ds2> JymmmEMC: they come in bursts
[22:37:35] <robin_sz> http://cgi.ebay.com/HAMEG-20MHZ-OSCILLISCOPE-GOVERNMENT-SURPLUS_W0QQitemZ160113452043QQihZ006QQcategoryZ104247QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
[22:38:43] <robin_sz> you need about 500mhz sampling digital scope to look half as good as a 20mhz crt scope
[22:39:09] <ds2> used tek scopes can be had for about $120ish
[22:39:11] <cradek> crt scopes are definitely the way to go
[22:39:15] <robin_sz> id always recommend the little hamegs as a cheap workshop scope
[22:39:19] <ds2> or at least can be a few years ago
[22:39:50] <robin_sz> tektronix are nice, but they are built with almost entirely custom components
[22:39:57] <robin_sz> liek HP
[22:40:07] <JymmmEMC> Yeah, I have no issues with analog scoppes
[22:40:09] <ds2> but there are lot of restorers of those
[22:40:13] <robin_sz> cost a fortune to fix .. .but rarely go wrong
[22:40:23] <JymmmEMC> something just seems "wrong" with digital scopes
[22:40:28] <robin_sz> yep
[22:40:36] <JymmmEMC> like icky
[22:40:44] <robin_sz> avoid telequipment scopes .. too old now
[22:40:59] <robin_sz> I have a D65 doorstop somewhere
[22:41:13] <JymmmEMC> hmmm, no probes... I wonder how much for a 1x/10x
[22:41:26] <robin_sz> $5
[22:41:56] <JymmmEMC> not any place I've seen
[22:42:05] <cradek> huh, no EICOs on ebay, people must not bother with the really old stuff
[22:42:20] <ds2> EICO scopes? aren't they AF only?
[22:42:49] <cradek> not sure, pretty slow but I bet 1MHz or better
[22:43:10] <robin_sz> JymmmEMC, theres planety of new scop probes on ebay for $9.99 ... theres a pack of 2 for $9.99 onm there now
[22:43:12] <cradek> don't know really, I suppose there were lots of different ones
[22:43:23] <ds2> used to have one of those and all it used was 5way binding posts for the probes
[22:43:36] <cradek> ah right
[22:43:38] <JymmmEMC> robin_sz: link?
[22:43:40] <cradek> I think mine are that way too
[22:44:44] <robin_sz> JymmmEMC, http://ebay.com/ put 'scope probe' in the search box