#emc | Logs for 2007-03-27

[00:01:24] <eric_u> probably the best choice
[00:02:11] <anonimasu> the heaviest tool weighs something like 1 kg.. max..
[00:02:52] <anonimasu> though inertia may be a problem
[00:03:21] <anonimasu> hm 4kg is what commercial changers state as max.
[00:04:34] <eric_u> that's a big tool
[00:04:39] <anonimasu> yeah
[00:04:46] <eric_u> tapping head
[00:04:50] <anonimasu> nothing I'd have at this mill
[00:07:12] <eric_u> I don't forsee using anything that big on my bridgeporr
[00:08:33] <anonimasu> this machine is much smaller then your bp :)
[00:08:44] <anonimasu> though I have a 100mm facemill..
[00:14:09] <anonimasu> that's the biggest
[00:14:19] <eric_u> that's huge
[00:36:14] <anonimasu> night
[01:40:30] <jmkasunich> silencer for a tank: http://www.panzerbaer.de/monat/monat_0210.htm
[01:40:45] <jmkasunich> shhhhh, people are sleeping!
[01:43:40] <Guest732> Not very stealthy :)
[01:43:57] <Guest732> Guest732 is now known as skunkworks
[02:01:01] <eric_u> is that a real picture?
[02:01:12] <jmkasunich> yeah
[02:01:45] <jmkasunich> apparenly they do some kind of testing, but the range is near a town, so they muffle the gun to keep the neighbors happy
[02:01:57] <eric_u> I can see that
[02:02:01] <jepler> and it's just a coincidence it looks like stylized male genitals
[02:02:21] <jmkasunich> you have a dirty mind
[02:02:43] <eric_u> I was out jogging once on an Air Force Base, and they had somebody driving a tank for a test
[02:02:50] <eric_u> I swear the gun was tracking me
[02:02:58] <jmkasunich> maybe it was
[02:03:13] <eric_u> probably, that had to be a pretty boring job
[02:03:43] <eric_u> I used to kid my boss about doing stuff like that in his f-16, but pilots don't like that kind of joke
[02:06:22] <eric_u> don't know what's wrong with those Germans, don't they know it's the sound of freedom????
[02:07:51] <jmkasunich> on that topic: http://www.bigbrotherstate.com/
[02:19:43] <eric_u> nice video, I like the tie-in to trusted computing
[02:20:30] <eric_u> last I heard, on 64 bit vista, you can't even write your own device driver without paying verisign $500 a year
[02:21:35] <cradek> what's that? the sound of freedom again?
[02:21:50] <eric_u> perzackly
[02:22:00] <eric_u> freedom isn't free
[02:22:08] <eric_u> it costs about $500
[02:22:16] <Jymmm> !+enter
[02:22:46] <cradek> Jymmm: time to change your password?
[02:23:02] <Jymmm> cradek: LOL, not pw, command in the wrong window
[02:24:14] <eric_u> http://bash.org/?244321 -- if you type in your password, we'll just see a string of stars
[02:25:31] <Guest661> wow
[02:25:34] <Guest661> that is funny
[02:26:03] <Guest661> Guest661 is now known as skunkworks
[02:26:50] <jmkasunich> on a completely different topic: http://youtube.com/watch?v=vQ8tHyPkovQ
[02:35:05] <cradek> no flash!
[02:35:19] <jmkasunich> bummer
[02:35:25] <jmkasunich> its a really cool short
[02:35:40] <cradek> later
[02:35:56] <skunkworks> very cool short
[02:36:14] <eric_u> I sure hope they don't cast vin diesel in that role
[02:36:38] <jmkasunich> they are really making a movie of it?
[02:36:51] <skunkworks> so I am running my wrt54g on a 5 volt wall wart.. and it is supposed to be running on 12
[02:37:04] <jmkasunich> its a great 8 minute short... I don't think its a movie
[02:37:06] <eric_u> that's what they say in the comments
[02:37:47] <renesis> anyone ever have any probs running axis in any other wm besides gnome?
[02:37:51] <eric_u> problem is VD would feel compelled to say something
[02:37:56] <jepler> renesis: I always use icewm, it works like a charm
[02:38:08] <renesis> i wanted to try blackbox or fluxbox
[02:38:10] <jepler> a long time ago there was a problem reported by a user of fluxbox or ion, but i forget the details
[02:38:24] <renesis> ion is weird
[02:38:36] <renesis> fluxbox is only light looking
[02:39:05] <renesis> blackbox=home
[02:39:08] <bytecolor> any axis authors about?
[02:39:10] <jepler> 'The "increment" combobox now works correctly on certain window managers where it did not before (twm, fluxbox)' -- from a really old axis changelog
[02:39:18] <jepler> bytecolor: yes
[02:39:20] <bytecolor> there's one now!
[02:39:25] <bytecolor> hey jepler
[02:39:27] <jepler> hi
[02:39:35] <renesis> jepler: neat ty, ill try one
[02:39:42] <renesis> well, when this long as cycle finishes
[02:40:05] <renesis> is pretty neat i can do stuff with the linux computer running the mill and the mill dont hiccup
[02:40:35] <jepler> * jepler assumes bytecolor is busy typing in his question
[02:40:38] <bytecolor> jepler, wondering about the nf module in axis, did you guys write that?
[02:40:48] <bytecolor> jepler, I lost my train of thought!
[02:41:54] <jepler> bytecolor: yes, axis is probably the only project where nf.py has appeared, and yes I wrote it
[02:42:15] <bytecolor> ah, I was trying to recreate your code to open the File dialog
[02:42:31] <bytecolor> but the rabbit hole went too deep
[02:42:34] <bytecolor> :)
[02:43:17] <jepler> f = root_window.tk.call("tk_getOpenFile", "-initialdir", open_directory,
[02:43:17] <jepler> "-defaultextension", ".ngc",
[02:43:17] <jepler> "-filetypes", types)
[02:43:41] <bytecolor> nod, it's the types definitions where I found the _()
[02:44:04] <jepler> _("...") is a function which translates the string from english to the user's language, assuming a message catalog is available
[02:44:33] <bytecolor> hrm, is it required for that tk.call() ?
[02:44:58] <jepler> no -- if you're an american, _(arg) is just a function that returns arg
[02:45:14] <skunkworks> http://bash.org/?5273
[02:45:17] <skunkworks> sounds like me
[02:45:20] <bytecolor> ah, so I can just stuff strings in it
[02:45:26] <bytecolor> coolio
[02:46:22] <jepler> bytecolor: probably you should use the python 'tkFileDialog' module to open file dialogs, instead of calling Tk directly like I did
[02:46:50] <bytecolor> ah, didnt know it existed, still learning Tkinter
[02:47:05] <bytecolor> I'll grep graysons book for that
[02:47:16] <jepler> axis is a terrible place to learn. I often don't do things the "real" Tkinter way, and 95% of those are for no good reason
[02:47:47] <bytecolor> hehe, I've been sneaking looks at it :)
[02:47:53] <bytecolor> it's a nice app
[02:47:54] <jmkasunich> you just like to be contrary?
[02:47:56] <cradek> run away!
[02:48:01] <bytecolor> haha
[02:48:08] <cradek> jepler's a closet tcl programmer
[02:48:14] <bytecolor> ah
[02:48:20] <jepler> this is one of the correct python ways to prompt for a file: tkFileDialog.askopenfile(initialdir="/etc")
[02:48:41] <bytecolor> I probaly wouldnt know Tcl from TGI
[02:48:57] <jepler> I do a lot of tcl for my real job, and sometimes I see writing tcl as the fastest way to get something done, even if I'm supposed to be writing in python
[02:49:15] <cradek> jepler: when I see your @ I think someone must be causing trouble
[02:49:26] <jepler> cradek: oops, I forgot I had it
[02:49:34] <jepler> I did some big check-in a few weeks ago and quieted CIA-18
[02:49:38] <bytecolor> well, sounds like it removes a layer, lets you get down to the metal, so to speak
[02:50:03] <jmkasunich> closer to the metal maybe
[02:50:06] <bytecolor> nod
[02:50:14] <jepler> bytecolor: I don't do it because I think it makes the program faster or more efficient, but I do it beacuse I think it'll let me write the software more quickly (and I could be wrong about that part)
[02:50:17] <jmkasunich> python or tcl are still a lot of layers away...
[02:50:22] <cradek> it's turtles all the way down
[02:50:33] <bytecolor> haha
[02:50:43] <bytecolor> at least one snake :)
[02:51:16] <bytecolor> I've put together a fairly useful gl widget, and a splitter widget
[02:51:25] <bytecolor> Tk really isnt that bad
[02:51:59] <jepler> if it wasn't "the devil I know" I don't think I'd use it .. surely one of the other, newer toolkits is better for programming
[02:52:22] <bytecolor> I wanted to go with wx, but the gl widget just ... sucked
[02:52:24] <jepler> that said I couldn't figure out how to get a python+gtk+opengl window the last time I looked
[02:52:52] <bytecolor> never tried gtk, although wx uses it on linux, must be the same/similar problem
[02:52:55] <jepler> I've looked at wx a few times and it just didn't click for me
[02:53:55] <bytecolor> I've got to fugure out cut/copy/past and file dialogs and I'll be good for a while
[02:54:03] <jepler> (in wxpython I was particularly offended that I had to manually assign ID numbers for apparently everything, as shown here: http://wiki.wxpython.org/index.cgi/Getting_Started#head-33e6dc36df2a89db146142e9a97b6e36b956875f)
[02:55:10] <bytecolor> those are already assigned... um I thought. I read the wx book
[02:55:33] <jepler> I'm too cheap to buy books
[02:55:41] <jepler> besides, books create piles and piles are bad
[02:55:52] <bytecolor> hehe, has a _large_ pile of books!
[02:56:07] <jepler> goodnight
[02:56:10] <jepler> have fun with your file dialogs
[02:56:18] <bytecolor> thanks jepler
[02:56:19] <jmkasunich> goodnight jeff
[02:58:31] <CIA-18> 03jmkasunich 07TRUNK * 10emc2/docs/src/config/emc2hal.lyx: document jogwheel velocity mode
[03:14:51] <skunkworks> wow - just wasted about an hour reading bash.org
[03:15:13] <skunkworks> it is funny though..
[03:17:32] <eric_u> I love the one about the smores
[03:21:31] <skunkworks> I like the - baried in sand one
[03:22:07] <skunkworks> buried
[03:23:33] <eric_u> apparently you don't want to go to tubgirl.com
[03:32:25] <skunkworks> :)
[03:33:09] <skunkworks> night
[03:33:22] <bytecolor> I wrote a python script to grab a random quote off bash.org
[03:34:07] <bytecolor> it was an exercise in caching
[04:14:06] <twice2> anyone ever use jack audio rt?
[04:15:26] <twice2> seems like, long ago i played with it using an smp kernel
[04:18:57] <twice2> zzzzzzz
[05:37:22] <Jymmm> anyone know whats up with the live cd? I can't get it to startup in 800x600
[06:18:02] <renesis> heh
[06:18:17] <renesis> ive used jack audio
[06:18:20] <renesis> fun stuff
[06:19:08] <renesis> carbide + baby oil = aluminum crumbs
[06:19:18] <toastyde1th> push it harder?
[06:19:28] <renesis> naw is perfect
[06:19:39] <renesis> tiny mill, crumbs are good
[06:19:44] <toastyde1th> lol.
[06:20:10] <renesis> 1/4hp spindle, tiny pulley belt
[06:20:38] <renesis> im amazed by this baby oil thing tho
[06:20:44] <Jymmm> just hook it to thte driveshaft of your car!
[06:20:59] <renesis> cuz i can run out, and like get more at 3am, for maybe $3
[06:21:14] <renesis> almost anywhere
[06:21:29] <renesis> i wish i knew what 'fragrance' was, tho
[10:25:05] <renz> okies i officially like emc
[10:36:11] <Dallur> Great, not many of us are brave enough to admit to it :D
[10:52:13] <slundell> Anyone used MyNC? (http://mync.sourceforge.net) I cannot figure out if its an cam or if its a motion controller or both...
[13:10:39] <cradek> slundell: the author is sometimes here, but I forget his name
[13:11:12] <eric_u> looks like cad and machine controller rolled into one
[13:35:10] <alex_joni> slundell: motion controller for edm mainly I think
[13:35:39] <alex_joni> his irc name is erdiz iirc
[14:40:27] <nohulohe> i have a noob question- i have no para or serial port, is there a usb 3-4 axis controller , that would be ease to configure under emc
[14:40:48] <cradek> no
[14:41:11] <cradek> if you have pci slots you can easily add a parallel port (or other interface card)
[14:41:21] <cradek> if not, you need a different computer
[14:41:43] <nohulohe> is there a pcmci solution
[14:41:51] <cradek> no
[14:42:21] <cradek> all of emc's supported hardware is parallel port, PCI or ISA
[14:44:00] <nohulohe> thats not good, i wanted to make a portable demonstration set
[14:44:47] <cradek> lots of laptops have parallel ports
[14:45:17] <cradek> you can demo the software without hooking it to any hardware of course
[14:45:42] <cradek> bbl
[14:46:48] <nohulohe> thats the point, i have to hook up hardware, otherwise the impression would be weak (have to hunt 4 laptop now)
[14:52:51] <nohulohe> thanx for help, bye
[14:54:14] <skunkworks> cradek: really - a pcmcia card will not work for a printer port?
[14:55:28] <jepler> probably not right away
[14:55:54] <jepler> even when a pcmcia card is a standard device, it doesn't appear at the standard address without OS intervention
[14:56:34] <jepler> you'd have to either disable the port exclusive access checks in hal_parport and use the linux kernel driver to enable the pcmcia card, or write something like probe_parport that knows about pcmcia
[14:57:53] <tomp> jepler: did you get to look at lefty? ( lefty is a .dot file editor in the graphviz bundle )
[14:58:25] <jepler> tomp: nope, not yet
[15:00:36] <tomp> jepler: if you do, lemme know. i never got it to open the 2 window panes it says it has, and many menu/mouse events dont seem to produce any result.
[15:07:06] <skunkworks> jepler: thanks
[15:25:16] <tomp> hmm, i checked with xev to see that the app could get valid X mouse events, thats fine. and tried 'lneato' editor which did same thing. ( like 'el neato' but that uses lefty so same result )
[17:11:19] <anonimasu> hi
[17:15:35] <crepincdotcom`> hi
[17:56:04] <alex_joni> hi
[17:56:56] <mschuhmacher> hi
[17:57:58] <mschuhmacher> hihi
[18:00:12] <alex_joni> hi michael :-P
[18:00:57] <mschuhmacher> hi alex
[18:58:10] <robin_sz> meep?
[18:58:25] <robin_sz> bah, cars. Hateful things
[18:59:13] <robin_sz> anonimasu, you are a petrolhead, what is it with OBD2 interfaces .. I bought one for our Volvo and finding software that actually works seems painful
[18:59:29] <robin_sz> played with OBD2 much??
[19:00:30] <Jymmmm> OBD2 to a PC ?
[19:13:10] <skunkworks> obd1
[19:13:49] <skunkworks> cradek: welcome back - raining there?
[19:19:13] <cradek> not this second, but it's pretty wet
[19:23:22] <ds3> there are very few OBDII software available for free
[19:23:35] <ds3> robin_sz: what interface do you have?
[19:24:21] <robin_sz> elm323, thats iso
[19:24:49] <cradek> depending on what you want to get from it, you can just use a serial terminal
[19:24:54] <ds3> Hmmmm... I think there is a "beta" windows package that should work with it... also a free PalmOS one
[19:25:09] <robin_sz> it does 'waiting for ecu timeout' ok
[19:25:12] <cradek> I also use 'obdgauge' (I think) for palm
[19:25:25] <robin_sz> then 'bus init error' when i askit to read codes
[19:25:25] <ds3> yep, ODBgauge is what I use too
[19:25:33] <robin_sz> this was scantool.net
[19:25:36] <ds3> robin_sz: what vehicle and ear?
[19:25:39] <ds3> year
[19:25:51] <robin_sz> volvo v70, '98
[19:25:53] <ds3> ODBgauge has problems pulling codes for me :/
[19:26:19] <ds3> have you checked to see if they could be using CAN?
[19:26:27] <robin_sz> or "the school bus" as we call it
[19:26:27] <ds3> that's another ISO spec
[19:26:27] <cradek> on my volkswagen I have to plug it in a few times before it starts communicating - after it's working it's fine
[19:52:07] <robin_sz> ds3: when you say "have you checked if its using CAN" ... how would I go about this checking?
[19:58:29] <alex_joni> buy a service manual off ebay
[20:05:36] <anonimasu> robin_sz: no, not really
[20:05:42] <anonimasu> robin_sz: buy a commercial OBD2 tool..
[20:09:21] <anonimasu> robin_sz: I never had to mess with it
[20:10:03] <anonimasu> cradek: there's a paralell port pcmcia card..
[20:10:07] <anonimasu> quatech makes them..
[20:10:18] <anonimasu> but they are expensive.
[20:15:24] <jepler> 09:55:53 <jepler> even when a pcmcia card is a standard device, it doesn't appear at the standard address without OS intervention
[20:15:28] <jepler> 09:56:34 <jepler> you'd have to either disable the port exclusive access checks in hal_parport and use the linux kernel driver to enable the pcmcia card, or write something
[20:15:32] <jepler> like probe_parport that knows about pcmcia
[20:15:43] <jepler> I also found a pcmcia parport card when I looked but I think you'll run into troubles ^^^
[20:16:06] <jepler> I wouldn't suggest to a noob user (as nuhulohe identified himself) to try that
[20:20:58] <robin_sz> anonimasu, I considered that, but ... I was worried that if it didn't work, well I was stuck with a brick. at least with an interface and some softawre, its just a question of getting the right software
[20:22:00] <cradek> robin_sz: if you want to rule out software, just use a serial terminal
[20:22:16] <robin_sz> ooh.
[20:22:21] <robin_sz> really?
[20:22:28] <cradek> robin_sz: you type strings (like "01 00"), it prints strings (like "81 00")
[20:22:40] <robin_sz> great
[20:22:44] <cradek> yeah you can run the thing that way
[20:22:57] <robin_sz> is there some dictionary of what to type?
[20:23:53] <cradek> it's a raw obd data stream
[20:24:06] <cradek> I think 01 00 is "hey! you!"
[20:24:39] <cradek> 81 00: "yeah what?"
[20:24:49] <robin_sz> heh
[20:26:03] <alex_joni> hahaha
[20:26:08] <alex_joni> cradek: u serious?
[20:27:15] <cradek> err the response is 41 00 xx xx xx xx
[20:27:47] <cradek> 01 00 is "tell me which mode 1 PIDs you support"
[20:30:52] <anonimasu> jepler: I use it to program plc's at work..
[20:32:31] <cradek> robin_sz: http://www.elmelectronics.com/obdstandard.html
[20:34:49] <alex_joni> * alex_joni wonders if it's plausible to have 2 CDs generate the same MD5SUM
[20:35:00] <Jymmmm> of course
[20:35:04] <anonimasu> yes
[20:35:09] <Jymmmm> if they're the same
[20:35:15] <alex_joni> no, I meant different ones
[20:35:18] <toastyde1th> yes
[20:35:27] <Jymmmm> yes
[20:35:26] <toastyde1th> it's called a collision
[20:35:32] <robin_sz> cradek, ta.
[20:35:47] <Jymmmm> but if you can do it consistantly, you will be richer than Bill Gates =)
[20:36:42] <toastyde1th> and if you can do it with something useful, you will OWN THE WORLD
[20:36:48] <alex_joni> * alex_joni has a plan
[20:37:05] <toastyde1th> A MAN, A PLAN, A CANAL
[20:38:30] <toastyde1th> a toastydeath, a keyboard, a caps lock
[20:43:59] <cradek> robin_sz: a useful find: http://www.elmelectronics.com/DSheets/ELM323DS.pdf
[20:44:56] <alex_joni> good night guys
[20:45:07] <cradek> goodnight
[20:46:17] <jepler> night alex
[20:47:41] <jepler> cradek: ooh uck -- I remember that rs232 level-translator-on-the-cheap from page 18
[20:48:04] <cradek> I don't remember if we built one of those
[20:48:13] <cradek> um, and if so, I don't remember if it worked
[20:48:41] <jepler> is that the one I couldn't get to work on my subaru?
[20:49:15] <cradek> I bet so
[20:49:33] <cradek> you gave it to me, I didn't try to fix it, and then I lost it
[20:50:05] <cradek> but now I have a newer model that reads all three standards
[20:50:46] <jepler> I think there was some question about what standard my car had
[20:51:22] <cradek> it's nice there are three, it would be confusing if there was only one standard
[20:52:00] <cradek> robin_sz probably doesn't have to deal with that so much in europe - it's the american manufacturers that use the other two
[20:52:25] <cradek> (unless europeans import a lot of fords)
[21:00:43] <eholmgren> gah! got smp working but now the network doesn't work
[21:30:51] <Jymmmm> What color is the stuff from leaky caps? kinda beige? and do leaky caps buldge out a bit?
[21:31:51] <cradek> yes, yes
[21:31:59] <Jymmmm> thank you =)
[21:32:24] <robin_sz> yiewuuu leaky caps
[21:32:43] <robin_sz> wanna hear my leaky caps story?
[21:33:12] <robin_sz> ahh, you do really :)
[21:34:27] <robin_sz> we bought some caps, and by some I mean a few tens of thousand ... and, they were problematic. failures in service .. infact when we examined them, they were leaking dielectric oil ... some boxes were so bad you could see oily patches developing
[21:35:08] <robin_sz> so .. we called the rep in ... but instead of apologising for supplying crap product, he argued and evaded, and tried to wiggle out and argued some more ...
[21:35:22] <jepler> http://www.sparkfun.com/tutorial/PG2C/Images/leakycap-4.JPG
[21:35:57] <jepler> robin_sz: I can't say I'm surprised
[21:36:10] <jepler> * jepler drives home
[21:36:14] <jepler> well .. to the gas station first
[21:36:28] <Jymmmm> jepler fill mine up too while you're there.
[21:36:34] <robin_sz> Simon, who is occasionally a bit of fun, got bored with the reps arguments and while he wasnt looking ... hung his laptop on the powder coating conveyor .. and so it started its slow, but sure, journey towards the ovens ... he argued more... we just smiled and watched it passing behind him and off ...
[21:37:43] <robin_sz> we did tell him before it went in, but he had to scramble over a pile of scrap metal and powder coating mess to get to it in time .. in his nice suit .. we laughed at him ;)
[21:38:36] <robin_sz> ahh, fun times :)
[21:39:01] <Jymmmm> jepler Yep, that be why I asked... gotta toss out a mobo (and the ONE that I really wanted to keep too)
[21:44:35] <robin_sz> whats that hyperterm like tjing ... not minicom, something else ...
[22:16:10] <robin_sz> bah :(
[22:16:23] <robin_sz> >0100
[22:16:23] <robin_sz> BUS INIT: ...ERROR
[22:16:23] <robin_sz> >
[23:33:55] <robin_sz> bliomey ... these modern machines are FAST ... the Trumpf 3050 has a G0 speed of ...
[23:34:04] <robin_sz> 300m/minute
[23:34:08] <robin_sz> :blink
[23:45:22] <Guest393> Guest393 is now known as skunkworks