#emc | Logs for 2006-11-20

[00:01:20] <Jymmm> Poof!
[00:38:16] <tomp-tag> how many variables can be passed to an o-word sub?
[00:55:52] <robin_sz> blinking flip its windy!
[00:56:03] <robin_sz> and cold ... 8c
[00:56:19] <jmkasunich> beats 1C and snowing
[00:56:23] <robin_sz> nice
[00:56:25] <jmkasunich> slushing more like
[00:56:28] <robin_sz> I prefer snow
[00:56:34] <robin_sz> well, yeah slush sucks
[00:57:26] <jepler> tomp-tag: I think up to 30 may be passed.
[00:58:15] <jepler> http://linuxcnc.org/docs/devel/html/gcode/main/#817
[00:58:16] <robin_sz> jmkasunich, you are converting a mill or something now?
[00:58:25] <jmkasunich> not right now
[00:58:30] <jmkasunich> seems things keep coming up
[00:58:47] <robin_sz> jmkasunich, I have to agree re conversational programing ... its so 1970
[00:59:57] <robin_sz> so you actually have a machine to convert now?
[01:00:11] <jmkasunich> I've had a Shoptask 3-in-1 since 1998
[01:00:18] <jmkasunich> and its always been my plan to convert it
[01:00:23] <robin_sz> ahh ... long term project :)
[01:00:33] <jmkasunich> I just got so busy writing EMC I never got around to using it
[01:00:40] <robin_sz> drill-mill-lathe?
[01:00:44] <jmkasunich> yeah
[01:00:55] <jmkasunich> decent lathe, so-so mill, crap drill
[01:01:00] <jmkasunich> not enough Z travel
[01:01:20] <robin_sz> well, at least you have time to play with emc
[01:01:26] <robin_sz> im so busy these days ...
[01:01:52] <robin_sz> took on 2 new staff recently, opening a second factory and recruiting 2 more
[01:02:37] <robin_sz> so much work!
[01:59:52] <jtr_away> jtr_away is now known as jtr
[02:01:01] <jepler> jmkasunich: My reaction to CP is mostly like yours -- "I'd never use that!". but many people *do*, and I suspect that many of those things can be done in g-code with the o-word extensions... I hope lerman's project turns out to be beneficial for users.
[02:03:56] <jmkasunich> yeah
[02:04:45] <jmkasunich> but because of my own leanings, I really can't contribute much, so I backed out of the discussion
[02:09:00] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07HEAD * 10emc2/src/hal/utils/halcmd.c: when printing float values, if the absolute value is within the range .00001 to 100000, print without floating-point notation
[02:09:27] <jmkasunich> thats a good fix
[02:30:58] <jepler> it's a copy of cradek's earlier fix to halmeter
[02:31:54] <cradek> it's nice that they match
[02:50:30] <tomp-tag> jepler: thanks, I see they are global too ( R+W )
[02:51:33] <jepler> tomp-tag: actually I think that when a subroutine returns, the values of #1..#30 from before the subroutine call are restored .. so you can't communicate with the caller in this way
[02:52:22] <cradek> I think vars over 30 are global though
[02:54:47] <jepler> cradek: yes, above #30 is "global"
[02:57:31] <tomp-tag> yes, I mis-read, the vars ABOVE #30 are global, and can be written by subs, still very handy
[03:02:14] <tomp-tag> I see "while [#1 lt 10] " and then "if [#2 > 5] ".... which is proper? symbol or acronym?
[03:04:43] <jepler> "lt"
[03:04:46] <jepler> where did you see ">"?
[03:04:58] <tomp-tag> I was loking for a list of allowed relational op's when I noticed the above... but didnt find a list ... like != ~=\I saw it at the page you gave above
[03:05:51] <jepler> I see it now too; I'll fix it
[03:06:39] <tomp-tag> got it... very fanuc-y ( can we get 'named variables' ??) wish wish
[03:07:26] <jepler> tomp-tag: the NIST documentation does list the function and operator names .. looks like that section didn't get incorporated into our documentation.
[03:08:26] <tomp-tag> like SIN() and && ?
[03:10:24] <tomp-tag> the section that describes Indirection can also be used for indexed look ups ( base + offset ), allowing data tables
[03:10:55] <jepler> there's this: http://www.linuxcnc.org/handbook/RS274NGC_3/RS274NGC_39a.html#1002769
[03:11:16] <jepler> but I don't find the comparison operators in there either
[03:11:53] <tomp-tag> got it, ... comparison and operations ( bit fiddling? )
[03:12:09] <tomp-tag> nope, got buit fiddling in that list
[03:12:14] <tomp-tag> bit
[03:12:31] <jepler> not sure if "and" is like C's && (logical) or & (bitwise)
[03:12:43] <jepler> n0120 x [2 and 2] (x should be 1)
[03:12:46] <jepler> must be logical
[03:16:55] <tomp-tag> hmm, the section labled 'Indirection' really is just indexed look up, indirection is more like ##1, indexed lookup is like (#100 + 1 )
[03:17:43] <jepler> You can write #[#1] as well
[03:18:15] <jepler> That code under 'indirection' is intended to show that you can call a different subroutine by computing its number
[03:18:28] <jepler> Parameter Value
[03:18:33] <jepler> The # character may be repeated; for example ##2 means the value of the parameter whose index is the (integer) value of parameter 2.
[03:19:03] <tomp-tag> understood, the xmpl under indirection just isnt an xmpl of indirection ( just indexing ) ;-)
[03:19:32] <tomp-tag> your xmpls are xmpls of indirection
[03:25:03] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07HEAD * 10emc2/docs/src/gcode/main.lyx: document relational operators; remove bogus example using > instead of GT
[03:32:51] <CIA-8> 03jmkasunich 07HEAD * 10emc2/src/hal/components/ (sampler.c sampler_usr.c streamer.c streamer_usr.c): fix some minor bugs in streamer and sampler
[03:33:40] <jepler> tomp-tag: thanks for spotting these problems with the documentation.
[03:35:16] <CIA-8> 03jmkasunich 07HEAD * 10emc2/docs/man/man1/ (halsampler.1 halstreamer.1): added man pages for sampler and halsampler, minor tweaks to halstreamer man page
[03:35:18] <CIA-8> 03jmkasunich 07HEAD * 10emc2/docs/man/man9/sampler.9: added man pages for sampler and halsampler, minor tweaks to halstreamer man page
[03:41:07] <CIA-8> 03cradek 07HEAD * 10emc2/nc_files/g76.ngc: doc bug
[03:44:38] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07HEAD * 10emc2/docs/man/man3/ (23 files): having a blank first line makes 'groff -Tps' put a blank page at the start of the output
[03:46:22] <CIA-8> 03cradek 07HEAD * 10emc2/src/emc/rs274ngc/ (9 files):
[03:46:21] <CIA-8> fix bug with checking against tool table size when reading h word
[03:46:21] <CIA-8> with g76; accept e word at appropriate times with g76 to get
[03:46:21] <CIA-8> ready for angled in/outfeed.
[03:51:18] <A-L-P-H-A> anyone order from harbour freight?
[09:26:59] <Lerneaen_Hydra> 'lo
[09:39:26] <alex_joni> hi
[09:45:08] <Dallur> hi
[09:46:32] <Lerneaen_Hydra> what's happening?
[09:47:26] <Dallur> not much, .. to early I think ;D
[09:58:02] <alex_joni> earl y?
[10:09:17] <alex_joni> Dallur: hi, you were the one playing with classicladder.. right?
[10:09:30] <alex_joni> and you said that some parts were missing from it (something added lateron)
[10:09:49] <alex_joni> in the meantime jepler has integrated CL 0.7.100 into emc2
[10:10:03] <alex_joni> was wondering if you can test & report any problems / pitfalls
[10:18:36] <Dallur> alex: Hey, I have not tested anything but I will
[10:20:12] <Dallur> alex: What I found missing was the ability to assign varables to timers, I talked tot he CL guy (can't remember his name) and he added it to CL, so it probably should be in 0.7.100 but im not sure if jepler hooked it up so that it can be connected to a signal
[10:31:04] <alex_joni> ahh.. I see what you mean
[10:31:23] <alex_joni> it's Marc Le Douarain or something like that
[10:31:28] <Dallur> yup
[10:31:51] <alex_joni> hmm.. so variables should be HAL floats?
[10:31:59] <Dallur> yup
[10:32:00] <alex_joni> HAL pins of type float
[10:32:18] <alex_joni> I think that's not there..
[10:32:24] <Dallur> kk
[10:33:22] <alex_joni> anyways, testing would still be greatly appreciated ;)
[10:35:24] <Dallur> I think I might get around to do some testing this week or next weekend, been working like crazy on LGPLing a bunch from my old company
[10:36:34] <alex_joni> a bunch?
[10:36:42] <Dallur> a bunch of code
[10:36:46] <alex_joni> ahh.. ok ;)
[10:36:59] <Dallur> I got them to agree to release one of the projects I worked on
[10:38:03] <Dallur> but I still have to donate the work to take out all proprietary stuff and copyrighted material
[10:39:34] <Lerneaen_Hydra> alex_joni: is there a non-rt emc in head?
[10:40:03] <Lerneaen_Hydra> aka axis sim
[10:40:51] <Dallur> btw, I was watching a Google Video a couple of days back, it was a Techtalk on a fusion research problem, the name might sound a bit familiar, EMC2
[10:42:12] <Dallur> I never realized that version 2 of EMC is emc2 = Einstein's equation :D
[10:42:49] <alex_joni> Lerneaen_Hydra: yes, configure --enable-simulator
[10:43:05] <alex_joni> e=mc^2
[10:43:09] <alex_joni> Dallur: close enough ;)
[10:43:19] <alex_joni> Dallur: there are about 200 different meanings to emc2
[10:46:26] <Lerneaen_Hydra> as a matter of fact emc2~=2.706
[10:47:25] <Lerneaen_Hydra> as in e the constant, m the atomic mass constant, c the speed of light in vacuum, and multiplied by 2
[10:47:37] <Lerneaen_Hydra> :p
[10:47:41] <alex_joni> not by 2
[10:47:43] <alex_joni> c^2
[10:47:52] <Dallur> to the power of two
[10:47:54] <alex_joni> yeap
[10:48:00] <Lerneaen_Hydra> ah but it's called emc2 not emc^2
[10:48:06] <Lerneaen_Hydra> as it is emc version two
[10:48:07] <alex_joni> but irc is not good for superscripts
[10:48:31] <Lerneaen_Hydra> damn, I should have chosed a different c and m
[10:48:34] <Lerneaen_Hydra> hmm
[10:49:12] <alex_joni> http://cvs.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/cvsweb.cgi/~checkout~/emc2/emc2.gif?rev=;content-type=image%2Fgif
[10:49:33] <Dallur> lol
[10:50:06] <Dallur> When is EMC Squared up for release ? :Þ
[10:50:28] <Lerneaen_Hydra> it's hard finding another constant other than c for speed of light, and an m that doesn't have to do with mass
[10:51:37] <Lerneaen_Hydra> ah nm. I'm feeling slow today
[10:55:41] <Lerneaen_Hydra> alex_joni: were you here any longer after I left yesterday?
[10:55:50] <Lerneaen_Hydra> do you know if cradek had any other questions?
[11:33:48] <alex_joni> Lerneaen_Hydra: no idea
[11:54:37] <A-L-P-H-A> bonjour mes amies!
[11:54:47] <A-L-P-H-A> mon?
[11:54:49] <A-L-P-H-A> mes?
[11:55:31] <A-L-P-H-A> rt oui... c'est mes.
[11:55:36] <A-L-P-H-A> rt=et
[11:56:10] <A-L-P-H-A> Je m'ennuie...
[11:58:23] <alex_joni> bonjour
[11:58:26] <alex_joni> ca va?
[11:58:33] <A-L-P-H-A> bien.
[11:58:48] <A-L-P-H-A> je suis somnolent.
[11:59:02] <alex_joni> moi aussi :)
[11:59:15] <alex_joni> quelle heur est la?
[11:59:22] <alex_joni> darn.. my french is really bad :(
[11:59:39] <A-L-P-H-A> c'est 0700hrs
[12:00:02] <alex_joni> oh.. ici c'est 2pm
[12:00:22] <A-L-P-H-A> I think I'll go buy a french phrase book for kicks and brush up on my french.
[12:00:35] <alex_joni> ha
[12:00:44] <A-L-P-H-A> what's up AJ?
[12:00:47] <A-L-P-H-A> more travelling?
[12:02:28] <alex_joni> not at the moment
[12:02:34] <alex_joni> semi-busy at work
[12:03:08] <A-L-P-H-A> fun...shit
[12:28:49] <alex_joni> ??
[14:34:08] <CIA-8> 03rayh 07HEAD * 10emc2/docs/src/config/ (configuration-selector1.png launcher.png term1.png): initial addition
[14:35:07] <cradek> looks like they are not set right by default, I was wrong
[14:35:18] <cradek> oops
[14:36:36] <CIA-8> 03rayh 07HEAD * 10emc2/docs/src/config/copy_and_run.lyx: initial draft
[14:39:06] <CIA-8> 03rayh 07HEAD * 10emc2/docs/src/Master_User.lyx: added config selector
[14:39:51] <rayh> Want me to fix with cvs admin or can you cradek?
[14:40:49] <cradek> please do
[15:34:40] <Lerneaen_Hydra> cradek: was there anything else you wondered about wrt canned threading?
[15:35:53] <cradek> are depths usually measured from the drive line, or x=0, or something else?
[15:37:33] <Lerneaen_Hydra> afaik from the original OD of the thread
[15:37:40] <Lerneaen_Hydra> if that makes any sense
[15:38:22] <cradek> so it makes sense to specify the thread depth
[15:38:59] <Lerneaen_Hydra> yeah
[15:39:01] <Lerneaen_Hydra> total thread depth
[15:39:07] <Lerneaen_Hydra> typically radially
[15:39:14] <cradek> currently I'm using drive line to first pass and first pass to last pass distances
[15:39:30] <Lerneaen_Hydra> oh, that may not be the very best
[15:39:52] <Lerneaen_Hydra> as most books with specifications have the total thread depth specified
[15:40:15] <Lerneaen_Hydra> ie to cut thread foo, you want a total depth of bar
[15:40:17] <cradek> to use those numbers you would waste the first pass I guess
[15:40:58] <cradek> I could have it skip the first pass using the current algorithm
[15:41:23] <cradek> so you'd specify distance to the outside R, first pass depth, total depth
[15:41:32] <cradek> first pass would be at R - first depth
[15:41:51] <Lerneaen_Hydra> that sounds good
[15:42:13] <Lerneaen_Hydra> as well as final cut increment and degression
[15:42:43] <cradek> yes degression, I don't have final increment
[15:42:49] <cradek> that seems overspecified to me
[15:43:04] <Lerneaen_Hydra> oh, right, yeah
[15:43:11] <Lerneaen_Hydra> you have numberof passes instead?
[15:43:16] <Lerneaen_Hydra> err
[15:43:17] <Lerneaen_Hydra> wait
[15:43:19] <cradek> no
[15:43:24] <cradek> first pass depth
[15:43:29] <Lerneaen_Hydra> yeah, first cut and degression
[15:43:30] <cradek> and degression
[15:45:53] <Lerneaen_Hydra> right
[15:46:33] <Lerneaen_Hydra> did you find a good idea of how to not run out of charachters yesterday?
[15:46:53] <cradek> I'm going to use E for the angle (or number of pitches)
[15:47:03] <cradek> one of the remaining ints to specify what to do with it
[15:47:28] <Lerneaen_Hydra> oh, ok
[15:47:45] <Lerneaen_Hydra> nice, what about where the angle is to be applied?
[15:47:55] <Lerneaen_Hydra> front/back/both/none
[15:47:59] <cradek> I'd rather have two floats, but it's not to be
[15:48:02] <cradek> that's the int
[15:48:57] <Lerneaen_Hydra> how do you choose if it's angle or number of pitches then?
[15:49:11] <cradek> I have to pick one way or the other
[15:49:20] <cradek> and the user will have to obey
[15:49:56] <Lerneaen_Hydra> oh
[15:50:03] <Lerneaen_Hydra> IMO angle would be better
[15:50:30] <Lerneaen_Hydra> seeing as how a resolution of +-1 pitch is quite coarse
[15:50:54] <cradek> E is a float
[15:51:06] <cradek> brb
[15:51:26] <Lerneaen_Hydra> oh
[15:51:50] <Lerneaen_Hydra> hmm, I would still prefer angle myself, as it's the most intuitive for me
[15:54:18] <cradek> ok
[15:58:57] <cradek> I'm leaning toward pitches (or just a length) because I can imagine it's normal to say "I want the taper this long"
[15:59:24] <cradek> otherwise you have to use trig to figure that out
[15:59:55] <cradek> it seems like since distances are easier to work with than angles, we should use distances where possible
[16:00:07] <Lerneaen_Hydra> oh, I was thinking more along the lines of a drawing of the part, afaik mostly the angle is defined
[16:01:01] <cradek> not the projected distance too?
[16:01:41] <cradek> I'm picturing a drawing of a bolt: 1" of thread, .1" of tapered thread, .5" of no thread, hex head
[16:01:47] <Lerneaen_Hydra> not the ones I've seen, at least here in europe it's a bad thing to have an overdefined sketch
[16:02:02] <Lerneaen_Hydra> oh, must be different standards or something
[16:02:22] <cradek> no I just made it up in my head, that seems like an obvious way to draw it
[16:02:25] <Lerneaen_Hydra> I wonder if alex has seen more of the angled type drawing
[16:02:55] <cradek> you could be right that it's uncommon everywhere, I don't know at all
[16:03:52] <Lerneaen_Hydra> I'm not sure either, I'm just talking from the little amount of things I've seen
[16:04:00] <Lerneaen_Hydra> s/little/small
[16:05:40] <cradek> brb
[16:10:32] <alex_joni> bbl
[18:07:53] <Lerneaen_Hydra_> Lerneaen_Hydra_ is now known as Lerneaen_Hydra
[18:09:56] <eholmgren> is 6v too much to safely drive 5v logic?
[18:10:57] <eholmgren> ~800ma split into 3 controllers
[18:25:06] <anonimasu> eholmgren: I wouldnt do that..
[18:25:16] <anonimasu> eholmgren: can you put a diode on the input ?
[18:25:40] <eholmgren> sure
[18:25:56] <anonimasu> so you get a voltage drop :)
[18:26:00] <eholmgren> will end up using the 5v off the computer's power supply
[18:26:11] <anonimasu> * anonimasu nods
[18:26:14] <eholmgren> but I have a 6v wall transformer as well
[18:26:44] <eholmgren> * eholmgren needs to brush up on his electronics
[18:29:23] <eholmgren> how much drop will a plain old diode give me?
[18:29:26] <eholmgren> 1v?
[18:30:17] <skunkworks> .6
[18:31:53] <eholmgren> should I use 2 in series then, or is 5.4v safe enough
[18:35:31] <skunkworks> what are you trying to run?
[18:47:44] <jepler> for instance, this HC logic is specified to run with vcc=6v -- but make sure your "6V" transformer is a good, regulated 6V because that the maximum operating voltage. http://w3.id.tue.nl/fileadmin/id/objects/E-Atelier/doc/Datasheets/74hcXX/74hc_hct00.pdf
[18:48:34] <jepler> 5.4v (1 drop) and 4.8v (2 drops) would both be fine too, it operates down to 2.0v
[18:48:35] <anonimasu> http://users.bestweb.net/~hobbs/footprints/fpspie11.pdf
[18:48:37] <anonimasu> wrong place
[18:56:27] <jepler> anonimasu: but interesting anyway
[19:01:31] <eholmgren> just some old centent stepper drives
[19:02:16] <eholmgren> specifically the CN0142
[19:02:57] <eholmgren> should have picked up the 4.7v transformer that I saw
[19:03:24] <eholmgren> suppose the extra gas to go back and get it would have been worth the $1.99
[19:05:40] <eholmgren> looks like 5v is max then
[19:06:12] <jepler> You're talking about terminal 10?
[19:07:20] <eholmgren> yes
[19:08:08] <jepler> if the voltage is much higher than the "high" voltage on the step & direction signals, then current will flow through the optoisolator all the time, and the step pulses won't be seen
[19:10:19] <jepler> well, maybe -- I'm not sure
[19:10:35] <jepler> but if it says 5V then I'd use 5V
[19:11:50] <jepler> did you measure the actual voltage from your "6V" wall-wart?
[19:19:12] <cradek> can someone tell me the full thread height of 1/4-20 when using a pointed tool?
[19:23:05] <eholmgren> no, haven't dug out my meter from all the moving crap yet
[19:23:18] <eholmgren> guess it might not be exactly 6v, huh
[19:47:51] <CIA-8> 03cradek 07HEAD * 10emc2/nc_files/g76.ngc: use i word to specify the offset to the full radius, j is the first cut depth, k is the full thread height. this seems to make more sense.
[19:47:53] <CIA-8> 03cradek 07HEAD * 10emc2/src/emc/rs274ngc/interp_convert.cc: use i word to specify the offset to the full radius, j is the first cut depth, k is the full thread height. this seems to make more sense.
[20:08:45] <anonimasu> yeah :)
[20:09:39] <Tamarisk> Wondering what is the min pc recommendations and would a PII 800 Mhz work OK?
[20:09:59] <Tamarisk> Printing off the docs now 185 pages of it
[20:10:01] <anonimasu> yes, but it depends on your desired pulserate..
[20:10:28] <cradek> are you sure it's not a PIII? I'm not sure there was a PII 800
[20:10:36] <Tamarisk> I run a vey basic self built CNC max rate was 6 inch per min
[20:10:41] <anonimasu> oh..
[20:10:48] <anonimasu> how many steps per inch?
[20:10:49] <cradek> it'll be fine :-)
[20:10:54] <anonimasu> yeah..
[20:11:06] <anonimasu> unless you have like a million steps per inch :)
[20:12:09] <Tamarisk> Steps per inch is only 400, using a basic full mode stepper with a 2:1 reduction to working out here!
[20:12:38] <eholmgren> has to be p3
[20:12:40] <jepler> that's only 40 steps per second -- your machine will be just fine
[20:13:02] <Tamarisk> has to be p3?
[20:13:07] <cradek> half step mode would work better, you should try it if your drivers can do it
[20:13:43] <Tamarisk> using the stepper kit from Camtronics 3 axis pic controller stuff
[20:14:23] <Tamarisk> present software is CNCpro but would like to use tool offset as in the G42 (I think)
[20:14:57] <cradek> emc has both length and radius offset g40/41/42/43
[20:15:03] <Tamarisk> dam out of paper back in a tic
[20:15:21] <jepler> http://linuxcnc.org/docs/html/gcode/main/#sub:G40_-G41_-G42:
[20:15:58] <jepler> also http://linuxcnc.org/docs/html/gcode/tool_compensation/index.html
[20:17:31] <Tamarisk> I should find it all in the printed does I hope, a point raised above has to be P3 is this the case as will need to ebay for an old P3?
[20:17:56] <jepler> Tamarisk: an 800MHz machine will be fine
[20:18:20] <Tamarisk> excellent!
[20:18:22] <jepler> I think that eholmgren means he's pretty sure your machine is a PIII (P3), not a PII.
[20:18:44] <Tamarisk> No P2 800MHz
[20:18:59] <eholmgren> doesn't exist
[20:19:09] <Tamarisk> or celeron! will need to power up to check
[20:20:25] <jepler> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?Hardware_Requirements
[20:20:57] <Tamarisk> downloading now
[20:28:10] <billy_kid> hi
[20:28:17] <cradek> hi
[20:28:48] <billy_kid> my english is poor
[20:29:03] <billy_kid> italy
[20:29:18] <cradek> that's ok
[20:29:28] <eholmgren> my english is poor and I am from u s of a
[20:29:34] <eholmgren> what up dawg?
[20:29:40] <billy_kid> i have installed emc2 + ubuntu
[20:30:48] <billy_kid> somebody help me?
[20:31:16] <cradek> just ask your question, someone will help
[20:31:49] <billy_kid> i set BASE_PERIOD to 100000
[20:32:01] <billy_kid> 10000
[20:32:23] <billy_kid> for speed increase
[20:32:55] <billy_kid> cpu athlon 1800
[20:33:14] <jepler> If you choose too low a BASE_PERIOD, you machine may be unresponsive or even crash. If it does, the only solution is to use a larger BASE_PERIOD.
[20:33:49] <billy_kid> the default base_period is 50000
[20:34:04] <billy_kid> for slow cpu
[20:34:17] <cradek> many machines can run 20000 just fine, 10000 is pretty fast
[20:34:37] <billy_kid> i try 10000 work fine
[20:36:23] <jepler> if it works, then what is your question?
[20:37:05] <billy_kid> if that is for athlon 1800 cpu
[20:37:16] <billy_kid> the best setting
[20:37:57] <jepler> any setting is a trade-off: a smaller BASE_PERIOD means there is less time left for other applications to run
[20:38:42] <jepler> The best setting depends on the step rate you need -- If you only need 4000 steps per second, then 50000 is probably a good value. If you need 10000 steps per second, then it is too large a PERIOD.
[20:39:20] <jepler> you should not choose the smallest PERIOD that doesn't lock up your machine -- you should chose the largest PERIOD that runs your motors properly.
[20:39:30] <jepler> so we chose a large PERIOD, 50000, for our sample configurations
[20:39:57] <billy_kid> the max speed is 2000
[20:40:07] <billy_kid> at 50000
[20:40:27] <billy_kid> motor 3600 step/rev
[20:41:11] <ChrisSmol> anyone here use this cnc conversion kit? http://www.cncfusion.com/micromill1.html
[20:44:15] <jepler> 3600 steps/rev is very high
[20:44:37] <jepler> 1/18 microstepping?
[20:45:53] <ChrisSmol> i was going to use the xylotex board http://www.xylotex.com/3axBoard.htm
[20:47:58] <ChrisSmol> i'll still need to come up with some homing solutions i guess
[20:48:14] <cradek> you can just add switches to the leftover pins on the parport
[20:48:30] <ChrisSmol> yeah, i meant physically mounting them
[20:48:47] <cradek> oh, that can be the challenging part
[20:48:47] <jepler> ChrisSmol: I don't know anything about that conversion kit. I think xylotex is a fine driver, as long as you use adequate cooling and do not use too high a supply voltage.
[20:49:32] <ChrisSmol> they seem to recommend 24 volts, or at least that is what they sell
[20:49:40] <ChrisSmol> i'll keep a fan on it ;-)
[20:50:11] <jepler> IIRC the "absolute maximum" voltage is 35V or 36V, and that includes "back EMF" from the motor, which can spike higher than the supply voltage
[20:51:21] <ChrisSmol> looks like they're just selling a simple switcher
[20:51:37] <ChrisSmol> need to see what i have laying around for power supplies
[20:52:51] <jepler> yep, looks like a basic switching power supply
[20:53:30] <ChrisSmol> i could always add some transzorb diodes on the stepper lines for protection
[20:53:50] <jepler> I'm not familiar with "transzorb" -- is that a brand name?
[20:54:43] <ChrisSmol> that's what i call them ;-) moment...
[20:57:03] <ChrisSmol> yeah, it's the trade name for the ones by vishay
[20:57:16] <ChrisSmol> old general semi
[20:58:07] <skunkworks> Depends on what you want - how much is the xylotex kit? are you getting steppers with it?
[20:58:46] <ChrisSmol> i'd probably get the steppers with it. i have found some elsewhere for a little less, around $40 each, but the $10 each in savings would probably be eaten up by the extra shipping costs
[20:58:46] <skunkworks> btw cutting cement board is messy
[20:58:50] <ChrisSmol> heh
[20:59:41] <ChrisSmol> $295 for 3 steppers and the board
[20:59:51] <skunkworks> in-oz?
[20:59:58] <skunkworks> suppose I could look ;)
[21:00:02] <ChrisSmol> 269
[21:00:25] <skunkworks> that isn't bad at all. depends on how much scrounging you want to do
[21:00:36] <ChrisSmol> yeah
[21:00:42] <ChrisSmol> vs how much i just want to start using it ;-)
[21:00:47] <skunkworks> right
[21:01:35] <Tamarisk> Sorry but I lost my connection before. PC is a Celeron processor, 800 MHz, 192 Meg Ram so looks as though I need to get some more, also running an on board video card Intel 82810 graphics controller
[21:01:55] <ChrisSmol> i make and sell my own stuff. a few hours of my time will pay for this stuff. so unless i enjoy doing the work, i don't really "save" any money scrounging around
[21:02:08] <skunkworks> Good point
[21:02:21] <ChrisSmol> btw http://www.blackcatsystems.com/ ;-)
[21:02:34] <jepler> ChrisSmol: some people around here would benefit from advice like that
[21:02:50] <skunkworks> Tamarisk: you may have issues with the on board video - Is it shared memory?
[21:03:37] <Tamarisk> It could be not sure how to tell, bios I guess?
[21:05:18] <eholmgren> skunk: cement board is heavy too
[21:05:43] <jepler> Tamarisk: I think all intel video chipsets use shared memory
[21:05:50] <Tamarisk> Memory range is D0000000 toD3FFFFFFF and D41000000 to D417FFFFF maybe to many 000 andFFF's there so guess it is shared memory
[21:06:17] <eholmgren> got to carry pallet loads of 3/4" 4'x8' of that stuff up a few flights of stairs for a construction job years ago
[21:06:31] <jepler> tamarisk: if you can add a PCI or AGP video card to the system, it will be fine.
[21:06:32] <skunkworks> I used to cut it with a utitlity knife until someone had mentioned that old carbide circle saws work great - and they do
[21:06:48] <Tamarisk> somewhere I have an old S3 video card may try that, I think the last time I tried was with a DELL and that had on board video
[21:06:54] <eholmgren> at least it bends around corners
[21:07:14] <ChrisSmol> hmm... i wonder if i need to look into the shaft size on the steppers vs the motor couplings that come with this kit, or are they standardized for nema23?
[21:08:25] <skunkworks> Tamarisk: If you go ubuntu - you will probably need a bit more memory - atleast for the install. I have found 256 works great - others have needed 512
[21:08:29] <Tamarisk> Question, When one refers to half step 1/4 step etc what is the benefits, when I looked at the torque curves of a stepper motor it appeared to have the best at full step?
[21:08:51] <ChrisSmol> fwiw, i could not install ubuntu with 256, i needed to go to 512
[21:09:00] <ChrisSmol> but it boots with 256 fine
[21:09:50] <alex_joni> greetings
[21:09:59] <skunkworks> Hi alex
[21:10:07] <Tamarisk> The machine was running Suse10 with 192 but will try to get more before trying
[21:10:23] <alex_joni> Tamarisk: you could probably install Xubuntu
[21:10:27] <skunkworks> jepler - you where talking about bo^dick - right ;)
[21:10:36] <alex_joni> it's a leightweight oriented Ubuntu distribution
[21:10:44] <alex_joni> skunkworks: you think>
[21:10:47] <alex_joni> ?
[21:10:59] <skunkworks> I could be applied to me :)
[21:11:12] <alex_joni> hehehe, feelind unsecure?
[21:11:25] <skunkworks> :)
[21:11:25] <alex_joni> feeling.. darn my typing sux tonight
[21:13:27] <skunkworks> This week is basement work. I don't know if I am going to get to the servo. (the encoder is doa) :(
[21:13:42] <Tamarisk> I am still basic with Linux so will try when I have a suitable PC or not at all as I do not wish hardware to be the problem
[21:14:33] <jepler> Tamarisk: folks seem to prefer microstepping because it is "smoother" -- closer to the ideal of driving the stepper with sine-wave currents. however, if you have too small a microstep size then a PC can't generate the step pulses fast enough
[21:14:36] <skunkworks> Tamarisk: it doesn't take much to test - You could try with the memeory on had (boot from the live cd - and run the rtai latency test)
[21:15:08] <skunkworks> had <- hand
[21:16:25] <Tamarisk> I downloaded the EMC2 live cd last night so could try that, I will look for the other Video card first
[21:19:48] <alex_joni> 192 is probably critical for the LiveCD
[21:20:02] <alex_joni> it "might" just work
[21:20:51] <Tamarisk> I got my steps wrong before, on my home built it is 100 steps per 1 mm
[21:21:30] <alex_joni> I have 1800/mm on my sherline slides
[21:21:37] <alex_joni> surely overkill
[21:22:28] <Tamarisk> That is why I asked about microstepping?
[21:22:52] <alex_joni> this is 10 microsteps, and 1mm/rev screws
[21:23:09] <alex_joni> hmm.. think it is 2000 afterall
[21:23:15] <alex_joni> 200 steps / rev stepper
[21:23:22] <alex_joni> 1.8 degrees on each step
[21:26:07] <alex_joni> but I'm seriously limited by the max step rate
[21:26:29] <Tamarisk> my lead screww is 4 mm per rev and a 200 step motor with a 2:1 reduction should give me in theory0.01mm accuracy my workholding and coloum is not that ridgid
[21:51:39] <cradek> it's tiny
[21:51:49] <cradek> ?
[21:52:52] <alex_joni> what is?
[21:53:07] <cradek> http://www.fpga4fun.com/board_pluto-P.html
[21:53:30] <alex_joni> yeah, that's nice
[21:53:44] <alex_joni> I'd like that and that scope board they have
[21:54:05] <jepler> it's not very "big" as FPGAs go, though
[22:14:42] <alex_joni> * alex_joni heads to bed
[22:14:45] <alex_joni> good night all
[22:19:12] <Lerneaen_Hydra_> 'night
[22:20:38] <eholmgren> night
[22:33:14] <jepler> "2006-11-20: We are aware of an issue involving mailing list archives being out of date for many projects. We are currently working towards deploying a solution that should remedy the issue. We apologise for the inconvenience this causes."
[22:33:23] <jepler> yay, SF finally have fessed up that there's a problem with the mailing list archives
[22:33:31] <jepler> I wonder what took them so ****ing long to realize it?
[22:43:20] <cradek> good thing it's just an issue - I was thinking for a while that it was a problem
[22:52:57] <Lerneaen_Hydra_> 'night peolpe
[22:53:02] <Lerneaen_Hydra_> *people
[23:47:22] <Jymm> Howdy Ladies!
[23:47:55] <Jymmmm> For those in the USA http://officemax.shoplocal.com/officemax/Default.aspx?action=browsepagedetail&storeid=2420336&rapid=338482&pagenumber=3&listingid=-2094097887