#emc | Logs for 2006-05-21

[00:00:25] <dmess> allo yous
[00:00:30] <dmess> tous
[00:11:28] <Guest332> Hello?
[00:12:39] <Guest332> Total Newb at IRC - still trying to figure out how to register a Nick. Any help?
[00:13:21] <SkunkWorks> registering I don't know off of the top of my head put you can do a /nick name
[00:13:31] <SkunkWorks> to change it?
[00:13:53] <Guest332> Thanks. I'll try that.
[00:14:08] <Guest332> Guest332 is now known as DaveF
[00:14:27] <DaveF> Great thanks SkunkWorks.
[00:14:30] <SkunkWorks> np
[00:16:13] <DaveF> Just bought a Taig Mill and wanting to pUt EMC on my box. I have Win 98 on already & would like to keep it. Can ubuntu be installed in a partition? Anyone?
[00:17:01] <K4ts> night
[00:18:27] <SkunkWorks> I sorry - I am not a linux person. Someone should be able to help you though.
[00:18:36] <SkunkWorks> I am sorry -
[00:19:20] <SkunkWorks> if not (there was a cnc workshop this week/weekend so this irc channel has been slow)
[00:19:36] <ccjoe> DaveF: yes it can, backup first - just in case, then follow the installer directions carefully
[00:19:43] <SkunkWorks> you could also try /join #ubuntu
[00:20:14] <SkunkWorks> although there channel is usually hopping :)
[00:20:43] <ccjoe> you will just have to be carefull during disk partitioning and setting up the boot loader
[00:21:08] <DaveF> Thanks! Can u tell me how to list the previous conversation prior to my logon so I'm not baging in to some topic?
[00:21:54] <DaveF> barging, I meant. not baging!
[00:24:23] <ccjoe> not sure what you mean, logon where?
[00:24:36] <jepler> logger_aj: bookmark
[00:24:36] <jepler> See
[00:24:54] <jepler> DaveF: logger_aj can tell you where the archive of irc conversations is
[00:25:22] <jepler> DaveF: just visit the URL listed (or bookmark and click the file for today)
[00:25:44] <jepler> or just start talking about whatever emc-related thing is on your mind, and we'll answer if we can
[00:26:12] <DaveF> Thanks jepler.
[00:27:11] <giacus> hello DaveF: see also http://www.giacus.org/emcstats/emc.html
[00:30:57] <DaveF> Hi giacus. Thanks for that. I just bought this Taig cnc ready mill and have steppers mounted. I downloaded ubuntu 5.10 but got a bad checksum. The HD on my regular box has just developed bad sectors so Im gonna have to put a new drive on that first. what a hassle. Any way to get ubuntu on cd by mail w/o waiting several weeks?
[00:32:00] <jepler> http://www.lukechueh.com/paintings/ham.html
[00:32:33] <jepler> DaveF: it's very slow to get the CDs from ubuntu.com.
[00:33:42] <jepler> DaveF: you can get it for a few bucks from these guys, and I think the shipping is fairly fast: http://shop.cheapbytes.com/cgi-bin/cart/0070011233.html?id=aFHwMPgG
[00:34:21] <DaveF> Yipes. What's with the painting jepler??
[00:35:04] <jepler> The painting has nothing to do with emc, I just thought it was extremely funny.
[00:35:22] <giacus> :P
[00:35:57] <jepler> * jepler <-- smug vegetarian
[00:36:27] <giacus> DaveF: maybe you could try coolcnc too
[00:36:36] <giacus> that's smallest
[00:37:23] <giacus> around 130 mb I guess
[00:38:03] <dmess> and quite cool...
[00:38:31] <dmess> im running it now,,
[00:38:47] <DaveF> Thanks. Ill look into that. Not so worried about the size. I have DSL. Mainly I just don't want to have to fix my on line box right now just to download linux.
[00:38:56] <dmess> and the puppy is fattenable
[00:39:31] <DaveF> coolcnc - can u import dxf files and get g code?
[00:40:01] <dmess> i dunno... probably somehow...
[00:42:51] <DaveF> I have a 7 X 12 lathe that I retrofitted. I wrote a VB program to contro; it, and I've only been using that up till now. I've just been hard coding whatever I needed to do with VB & sending it out to the drivers via the P. Port.
[00:42:53] <giacus> what is dxf , autocad format ?
[00:44:21] <DaveF> It's a generic file format similar to dwg that autocad and other progs can all use. It's cross platform autocad. I think autocad can both save and read in that format.
[00:44:29] <giacus> http://timeguy.com/cradek/autocad
[00:45:07] <giacus> not sure is the answer to your question, but could be interesting maybe
[00:46:20] <DaveF> awesome. Ill look into that for sure. Thanks. wonder how I missed that one in all my googling.
[00:47:50] <giacus> hehe, there are lot of 'hidden things' ;)
[00:49:15] <DaveF> I have an autocad knock-off I got at a big box store. TurboCad - only $19.00 but very sophisticated. Quite good, actually. It uses DXF format.
[00:50:13] <anonimasu> alibre express might work if you want a parametric cd program :)
[00:51:36] <DaveF> Can anyone give me an idea as to how one generally (typically) uses EMC? Do you have to pretty much brute-force generate the commands to make complex cuts & operations, or is there GUI type stuff that can cut from a drawing, etc?
[00:52:10] <DaveF> parametric? pls elaborate, I'm pretty green.
[00:53:09] <anonimasu> hm, where geometry drives other geometry
[00:53:44] <anonimasu> if you draw a circle aligned to the centre of the line, and you resize the line the circle will be stuck at the line ;)
[00:54:38] <DaveF> Oh, like vector graphics vs bitmaps?
[00:54:52] <anonimasu> yeah something like it..
[00:54:57] <anonimasu> makes drawing stuff so much easier
[00:55:16] <anonimasu> most/all higher end cad programs are parametric
[00:59:44] <SkunkWorks> emc for the most part takes g-codes (pretty much the fanuc standard) and generates motion.
[01:03:34] <dmess> there are some dxf2gcoder's out there but ive NOT tried any either linux or m$
[01:05:35] <giacus> G'Night all
[01:07:29] <DaveF> Sorry, lost my connection. Back now.
[01:08:47] <SkunkWorks> :)
[01:12:22] <DaveF> well, darn. can someone post the link again for viewing the chat log, so I can see what I missed. Im in the dark here. thanks.
[01:13:30] <SkunkWorks> logger_aj: bookmark
[01:13:30] <SkunkWorks> See
[01:13:36] <SkunkWorks> you can type it in
[01:15:57] <DaveF> Thanks!
[01:16:23] <SkunkWorks> have you seen some of the emc interfaces?
[01:16:50] <DaveF> No.
[01:17:46] <DaveF> I read some of the user manual last nite on line. That's about all I know of it.
[01:17:49] <SkunkWorks> I like axis - http://www.electronicsam.com/images/KandT/axisubuntu.png here http://axis.unpy.net/
[01:19:37] <DaveF> Im trying to figure out how to cut and paste that link so I dont lose this url. can it be done?
[01:20:01] <DaveF> im using the java ap on linuxcnc.org.
[01:20:15] <SkunkWorks> are you using the java client?
[01:20:52] <DaveF> yes.
[01:21:07] <SkunkWorks> you have to enable popups for that page iirc
[01:21:31] <DaveF> I just refreshed the log file in another frame and got it from there.
[01:21:38] <SkunkWorks> there you go
[01:21:40] <SkunkWorks> :)
[01:23:38] <DaveF> how did you do that?
[01:23:49] <SkunkWorks> do what?
[01:24:20] <DaveF> well, now when I click the line of text in my irc window, I get a popup.
[01:24:57] <DaveF> Before, I didn't. Thought you meant you did it when you said there you go.
[01:25:58] <SkunkWorks> good sources of info http://www.linuxcnc.org/ and http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl
[01:28:06] <DaveF> thanks for that too. I just clicked the max/min box in the upper rh corner of the client and got a bigger window. Much better.
[01:30:16] <DaveF> So EMC is primarilly the engine for outputting g code, and you need to either write it, or generate it some other way?
[01:31:00] <dan_falck> yes
[01:31:19] <dan_falck> are you interested in making a machine move around?
[01:31:34] <dan_falck> if so, EMC is a good choice
[01:32:00] <dan_falck> If you need to generate the G-code, you will need a CAM program or something equiv
[01:32:16] <DaveF> yes. I have a new Taig micro mill ready to go and also a retrofitted 7x12 mini lathe.
[01:32:18] <dan_falck> depending on how complex the G-code, you can do it by hand
[01:32:47] <dan_falck> or write custom programs to generate complex geometric routines
[01:33:12] <dan_falck> I use a program called "vector", a windows program running under wine in linux
[01:34:14] <DaveF> right. I have been using a VB ap I wrote myself, to directly generate the movements I want w/o g code, but I want to start taking advantage of dxf - to g-code conversion or something easier.
[01:34:45] <DaveF> wine?
[01:35:03] <dan_falck> wine is a windows emulator for linux
[01:35:35] <DaveF> cool. does most win 98 software run ok?
[01:35:40] <dan_falck> it's pretty cool. I wrote a python program that communicates between linux and windows
[01:36:23] <dan_falck> it depends... I got vector, rhino3d (version 2), and intellicad running, but not Autocad 2000
[01:36:46] <dan_falck> although I know others have gotten Autocad to work
[01:37:11] <DaveF> wow. I looked into py awhile back. It looks like a fun languge. But I didn't have time to really get into it. I mostly just use VB but I can write pretty well in c & c++.
[01:37:34] <dan_falck> I wrote a small app that calculates polar arrays for bolt circles
[01:37:59] <DaveF> VB got me really spoiled cause its so fast to get up & going with the UI.
[01:37:59] <dan_falck> I made it communicate with 'vector' through the linux clipboard to the windows clipboard
[01:38:28] <dan_falck> I don't really have much access to windows, so I never got into VB
[01:38:47] <dan_falck> I'm using MacOSX right now
[01:38:55] <DaveF> Cool! that seems like a novel approach.
[01:38:57] <dan_falck> I've got a linux machine in the shop
[01:39:13] <dan_falck> yea, I'm kind of demented
[01:39:20] <DaveF> hah.
[01:39:24] <dan_falck> weird, strange...
[01:39:40] <dan_falck> you can run emc via remote gui a
[01:39:47] <dan_falck> and the main app on another box
[01:40:06] <dan_falck> at one time, I had the gui on this machine and the
[01:40:14] <dan_falck> engine running on a linux box
[01:40:22] <dan_falck> it was fun
[01:40:33] <dan_falck> I think you can do that with windows machines too
[01:40:39] <DaveF> via network?
[01:40:43] <dan_falck> ask alex_joni about it somethime
[01:40:46] <dan_falck> sometime
[01:40:51] <dan_falck> yep, network
[01:40:58] <DaveF> ok.
[01:41:19] <dan_falck> it's a very versatle program/system
[01:42:29] <DaveF> I have this brand new mill all ready to go, and just when I tried to download ubuntu, I discovered bad sectors on my HD on my online box, so I got a bad checksum. wah!
[01:44:05] <DaveF> I have Master 5 cad cam software for windows, so Im going to try that out for now, but I really want to get into Linux completely at some point. It's a steep learning curve just to figure out how to get started.
[01:51:45] <A-L-P-H-A> DaveF? what's your current knowledge?
[01:54:19] <DaveF> Well, I have an ancient EE & CoE as background. I have retrofited a mini lathe, and wrote my own VB software to drive that. I worked for a few months doing CAD/CAM for cnc.
[01:54:48] <A-L-P-H-A> then you shouldn't have that much of a problem.
[01:54:52] <A-L-P-H-A> the people in here are really helpful.
[01:55:02] <DaveF> I have virtually no knowledge of linux, but want to migrate away from Bill's monster.
[01:55:42] <DaveF> Yes, Ive seen that in spades already.
[01:55:44] <A-L-P-H-A> DaveF, uh... it's a pretty simple install process... but the setup to get EMC was a pain... i was asking so many questions...
[01:55:56] <A-L-P-H-A> There really needs to be a gui that helps out newbs to get setup.
[01:56:13] <A-L-P-H-A> maybe I should figure out the phpGTK... to write one.
[01:56:47] <DaveF> right. I downloaded BDI awhile ago, and couldn't get past the very first prompt: Root ? totally embarassing.
[01:57:05] <A-L-P-H-A> "root" <cr><cr> that was it.
[01:57:12] <SkunkWorks> ubuntu with cradeks emc2 script is very easy to setup.
[01:57:46] <A-L-P-H-A> yeah, I downloaded that a few days ago... still haven't burned it, as I have no CDs... just DVDs.
[01:57:51] <DaveF> I figured something like that, meaning what dir do you want as root, right?
[01:58:02] <A-L-P-H-A> where's swampy??
[01:58:09] <A-L-P-H-A> dang it... I need to talk to him.
[01:58:29] <A-L-P-H-A> DaveF. root = admin = god
[01:58:40] <A-L-P-H-A> it's just to login...
[01:59:04] <A-L-P-H-A> if you read the documentation, it'd say that... but it's handy to have a print out, or a second computer to run linux... as the other could be the manual.
[01:59:34] <A-L-P-H-A> SkunkWorks, know what's the progress between the geckodrive G10x and EMC/linux?
[02:00:05] <SkunkWorks> have not heard anything yet. but that doesn't say much
[02:00:18] <A-L-P-H-A> i haven't followed that geckodrive forum in over a year.
[02:00:45] <SkunkWorks> I thougth that was going to have its own interface
[02:00:51] <A-L-P-H-A> and I want to get my mill up and running, but I don't have the pulses required to make my system go well...
[02:00:56] <A-L-P-H-A> it has a few things...
[02:01:09] <A-L-P-H-A> you could send it a setup file... and then start uploading gcode files or something to it.
[02:01:19] <A-L-P-H-A> swpadnos knows... he wrote something for it...
[02:01:52] <A-L-P-H-A> I would call Mariss, but he's really long winded... nice guy... just that if I ask something, he'll start talking about the topic, move to something else, and then continue on.
[02:02:45] <SkunkWorks> I met him this weekend swpadnos - nice guy
[02:03:01] <A-L-P-H-A> yeah... if he comes up to Toronto, I'm gonna buy him a beer.
[02:04:41] <DaveF> alpha: Just curious - what do you mean by 'don't have the pulses' - not fast enough?
[02:07:53] <A-L-P-H-A> my parallel port isn't fast enough for my stepper drivers.
[02:08:01] <A-L-P-H-A> so I need some pulse creating electronics.
[02:08:17] <A-L-P-H-A> I start to weld alu to my endmills when I mill.
[02:08:46] <SkunkWorks> A-L-P-H-A: how many pulses per inch do you have (or mm)
[02:08:55] <DaveF> how are your coils wired, // or series?
[02:09:11] <A-L-P-H-A> SkunkWorks, I'd have to check... but it's freak'n slow...
[02:09:32] <A-L-P-H-A> DaveF, that's a good question... it's been over two years since I wired them...
[02:09:42] <A-L-P-H-A> the mill and lathe haven't been turned on in over a year now I think.
[02:10:17] <A-L-P-H-A> I'll try to wire the stuff in a different config... series (that's faster right, but half the torque?)
[02:11:00] <DaveF> parallel gives more torque on low end but craps out quickly on high end, series gives lower overall torque but can go faster with considerably more torque at high speeds.
[02:11:50] <A-L-P-H-A> I'll re-wire when I get the chance.
[02:11:52] <SkunkWorks> with a 450mhz and 10k steps per inch - we where able to run a good 60ipm
[02:12:15] <A-L-P-H-A> I'm no were near that... as I'm also microstepping with the G201 geckos
[02:12:33] <A-L-P-H-A> bbiab... shower
[02:12:39] <SkunkWorks> this would be 1000 steps per rev - 10 tpi
[02:43:27] <DaveF> Goodnight - thanks for all the help from everyone.
[02:43:30] <A-L-P-H-A> I think I'm getting like something like 10-20 ipm.
[02:43:36] <A-L-P-H-A> something too slow.
[02:44:05] <A-L-P-H-A> I forget how many pulses I'm able to generate.
[02:44:17] <SkunkWorks> what is the computer?
[02:44:19] <dmess> ive been feelin my way thru llinux for a few yrs now... and i like coolcnc on puppylinux...
[02:44:32] <A-L-P-H-A> the compy is a AMD 1800?
[02:44:33] <Jymmm> coolcnc??????????
[02:44:35] <A-L-P-H-A> 1700?
[02:44:47] <A-L-P-H-A> wth is coolcnc?
[02:45:10] <dmess> live cd distro... with emc2
[02:45:11] <SkunkWorks> wow that should put out a pretty decent pulse train. I would think a .00002 period atleast
[02:45:22] <A-L-P-H-A> No. it doesn't.
[02:45:29] <A-L-P-H-A> it's pulse train was ASS.
[02:45:36] <dmess> it SHOULD do etter than that... for sure
[02:45:47] <A-L-P-H-A> I'll turn it tomorrow... I guess.
[02:46:27] <dmess> maybe i should drop by with the laptop...
[02:47:14] <A-L-P-H-A> hmm... that could be an idea...
[02:47:18] <A-L-P-H-A> beers afterwards?
[02:47:26] <dmess> but your gecko drives>>
[02:47:38] <dmess> for certain
[02:48:30] <DaveF> Alpha, how fast can you go with just 1/2 step?
[02:48:50] <SkunkWorks> dmess: is that the live cd that alex_joni made up?
[02:49:01] <dmess> i believe so...
[02:49:03] <Jymmm> SkunkWorks yes
[02:49:10] <SkunkWorks> neat
[02:49:35] <dmess> its sweet,... ive fattened it up.. have xnap running
[02:49:46] <dmess> the wife loves me again
[02:49:48] <A-L-P-H-A> DaveF, I can't do halfstep... the G201 is set perm to 1/10 stepping
[02:50:09] <Jymmm> And if lazy butt alex_joni hasn't but up the MD5 file, it's f0804f12b160ef6b2d4ecad08d6a963a
[02:50:12] <A-L-P-H-A> dmess... I need to clean the house first... so that may take a while. hah
[02:50:15] <Jymmm> s/but/put/
[02:50:30] <A-L-P-H-A> why not just add the damn MD5 string to the file name??
[02:50:32] <dmess> not for me....LOL
[02:51:22] <dmess> i didnt check it.... and it worked... ; )
[02:52:03] <A-L-P-H-A> if barry bonds did use steroids, will his record be null and void?
[02:52:15] <Jymmm> A-L-P-H-A: It's usually a file with the same_name.iso.md5, then you can just do md5sum -s same_name.iso.md5 and it'll verify every md5 againest every file listed within
[02:52:21] <SkunkWorks> so would 1/10 microstepping with 200 steps per rev stepper - that would be 20k steps per rev - is that how it works?
[02:52:38] <A-L-P-H-A> Jymmm, oh... so that's how you use them.
[02:52:56] <A-L-P-H-A> I always typed "type <file>.md5" "md5sum <file>
[02:52:56] <A-L-P-H-A> "
[02:52:57] <Jymmm> A-L-P-H-A Yeah, if you're downloading multiple files
[02:53:02] <dmess> yes... and thats high
[02:53:14] <SkunkWorks> right
[02:53:39] <SkunkWorks> A-L-P-H-A: do you remember you leadscrew pitch?
[02:53:56] <dmess> plus that...
[02:54:08] <SkunkWorks> and are they direct-drive or is there a belt reducion?
[02:54:15] <dmess> his reolution is too fine..
[02:54:25] <dmess> resolution
[02:54:29] <DaveF> re k steps - sort of. In Microstepping, the coils are gradually energized from the current position to the next. So say the motor is stopped at coil 1 exactly, then you start a 10 microstep excursion...
[02:54:35] <A-L-P-H-A> it's 5tpi 1" ballscrew
[02:54:40] <A-L-P-H-A> SkunkWorks, above
[02:54:50] <SkunkWorks> nice - direct drive?
[02:54:53] <A-L-P-H-A> there is a belt reduction. :/
[02:54:57] <SkunkWorks> of what?
[02:54:59] <A-L-P-H-A> 3:2 I believe.
[02:55:07] <SkunkWorks> wow
[02:55:14] <A-L-P-H-A> I had the gears...
[02:55:14] <dmess> not enuf
[02:55:29] <A-L-P-H-A> I could go one to one... but like $40... just need to buy some new gears, and bore it out.
[02:55:31] <Jymmm> A-L-P-H-A: 3:2 ??? Measure the diameter of both gears or count the teeth on both gears
[02:55:33] <DaveF> first the coil at position 0 gets 90% current, and 10% is applied to the next, then 80 / 20, 70 / 30, and so on till the next detent.
[02:55:47] <A-L-P-H-A> Jymmm, i think it was 48 to 32.
[02:56:06] <Jymmm> A-L-P-H-A: seems strange to me, but what do I know.
[02:56:15] <A-L-P-H-A> whatever... the step rates and shit are correct... to like 0.002" accuracy/repeatability.
[02:56:16] <Jymmm> mine are 24/12... 2:1
[02:56:50] <A-L-P-H-A> absolutely too lazy to go check the room's step rate and stuff.
[02:57:04] <SkunkWorks> 150k per inch? did I do that right
[02:57:22] <dmess> sounds reasonable
[02:57:25] <SkunkWorks> wow
[02:58:49] <SkunkWorks> at a period of .00005 that would be a max of 4ipm
[03:00:22] <A-L-P-H-A> I think I got it to 6ipm... which is ASS.
[03:00:33] <A-L-P-H-A> so I'll re-wire the motors for faster response.
[03:00:54] <SkunkWorks> at .00002 it would be 10ipm
[03:01:42] <DaveF> Thing is, with microstepping, you are dividing the current between the first coil and the next, so the intermediate steps are weaker. That can contribute to losing steps, especially the faster you try to go.
[03:02:28] <DaveF> Alpha, what is the holding torque of your motors?
[03:03:03] <A-L-P-H-A> huge... 720 oz/inch
[03:03:17] <A-L-P-H-A> 220 for another.
[03:03:19] <A-L-P-H-A> (z)
[03:03:26] <DaveF> Wow. What kind of machine?
[03:03:47] <A-L-P-H-A> just a desktop bench mill... chinese... ~28x8x4
[03:03:54] <A-L-P-H-A> 4=3.5"
[03:04:56] <A-L-P-H-A> http://lloydleung.com/gallery/Mill%20Photos/
[03:05:06] <A-L-P-H-A> http://lloydleung.com/gallery/Mill_Related/
[03:05:30] <dmess> you could make my releases on ther ,,, 50 $ a piece
[03:05:45] <A-L-P-H-A> what release?
[03:06:40] <dmess> hg releases...
[03:08:01] <A-L-P-H-A> does google have a photosharing service?
[03:08:20] <dmess> not sure
[03:10:38] <A-L-P-H-A> getting gallery for my website
[03:10:39] <A-L-P-H-A> :/
[03:11:12] <A-L-P-H-A> dmess? hg releases?
[03:11:48] <DaveF> Nice pics.
[03:11:51] <SkunkWorks> A-L-P-H-A: seems like your going to need an external pulse multiplier ;)
[03:11:54] <dmess> yes.. the device that allows us to UNHOOK from the tow line
[03:12:00] <A-L-P-H-A> dmess? got a lathe able to hand 2" dia x 8-10" in total length? Able to be supported at the end?
[03:12:13] <A-L-P-H-A> SkunkWorks, hench the G10X from geckodrive... :/
[03:12:26] <A-L-P-H-A> dmess. oh.
[03:12:27] <dmess> i can put it to work to.. ; )
[03:12:43] <dmess> wanna be my new bestes friend??
[03:12:47] <A-L-P-H-A> DaveF, thanks.
[03:12:53] <A-L-P-H-A> dmess... thought we were already. ;)
[03:13:33] <A-L-P-H-A> is it CNCd?
[03:13:35] <dmess> these are simple high $$ items...
[03:14:02] <A-L-P-H-A> cool... my stupid lathe is only 93mm x 130mm... (ZX)
[03:14:46] <dmess> its a chucker...
[03:15:05] <dmess> rpm>>???
[03:15:08] <A-L-P-H-A> no it's not... it's a schublin 102.
[03:15:17] <A-L-P-H-A> I can get it up to 2000rpm...
[03:15:34] <dmess> turn ss with it fine...
[03:15:54] <A-L-P-H-A> it's a jewellers lathe.
[03:16:01] <A-L-P-H-A> great precision and repeatability.
[03:16:18] <dmess> turned parts are 1/2" dia max
[03:17:17] <Jymmm> Weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
[03:17:27] <SkunkWorks> I'm still here :)
[03:17:38] <dmess> arent I
[03:18:20] <dmess> WHO forgot their meds???
[03:18:41] <SkunkWorks> someone tripped over a network cable
[03:19:09] <Jymmm> SkunkWorks we can blame alex_joni, casue he's not here to defend himself!
[03:19:22] <dmess> be nice
[03:19:32] <A-L-P-H-A> :)
[03:19:36] <Jymmm> dmess: I was, I COULD have blamed you!!!
[03:20:07] <dmess> go for it... i havent got the capacity
[03:20:28] <dmess> to defend myself
[03:20:28] <Jymmm> SkunkWorks: I blame dmess, he's just that kind of guy!!!
[03:20:50] <Jymmm> SkunkWorks: Probably has 50,000 trojans on his computer
[03:21:14] <dmess> i grow them... it keeps the hacks away
[03:21:36] <Jymmm> heh
[03:21:47] <A-L-P-H-A> dinner and da divinci code... maybe I sould stay up and finish reading the damn book before I watch the movie.
[03:22:17] <dmess> LOL :-$
[03:22:28] <Jymmm> A-L-P-H-A: Why? So you can be disappointed when they cut/alter 75% of the book?
[03:23:50] <A-L-P-H-A> I'm dissapointed by the book already
[03:23:56] <dan_falck> I'm not all the way through the book and I'm starting to root for Silas
[03:23:56] <A-L-P-H-A> I read angels and deamons first.
[03:23:58] <Jymmm> bummer
[03:24:22] <dan_falck> Dan Brown's style...
[03:24:27] <A-L-P-H-A> k... no more discussing the book
[03:25:05] <A-L-P-H-A> dmess. can you recieve and send PMs?
[03:25:55] <dmess> yup on the pup
[03:26:08] <A-L-P-H-A> I can't recieve your PMs.
[03:26:22] <A-L-P-H-A> I wonder why
[03:26:23] <A-L-P-H-A> sec.
[03:26:34] <Jymmm> A-L-P-H-A what server are you on?
[03:26:43] <A-L-P-H-A> clarke.freenode.net
[03:26:50] <Jymmm> dmess and you?
[03:26:54] <A-L-P-H-A> irc.freenode.net
[03:26:58] <dmess> but i got yours
[03:27:08] <A-L-P-H-A> try sending one back... jymm.
[03:27:14] <Jymmm> [05/20 20:29:05] *A-L-P-H-A* test
[03:27:29] <A-L-P-H-A> yeah, i got a reply back from jymmm.
[03:27:35] <A-L-P-H-A> [23:28:59] <Jymmm> yo momma
[03:27:39] <Jymmm> * Jymmm is indentified
[03:27:46] <A-L-P-H-A> indentified.
[03:27:52] <A-L-P-H-A> oh he's NOT
[03:27:58] <Jymmm> [05/20 20:29:49] *dmess* boo to you
[03:28:05] <Jymmm> I got a msg from dmess
[03:28:13] <A-L-P-H-A> brb... switching servers
[03:29:10] <Jymmm> /msg A-L-P-H-A bitch
[03:29:14] <A-L-P-H-A> I got that Jymmm.
[03:29:25] <Jymmm> /msg dmess whore
[03:29:33] <A-L-P-H-A> nothing from dmess...
[03:30:07] <dmess> NOTHIN
[03:30:26] <A-L-P-H-A> dmess, /msg nickserv identify <password>
[03:30:43] <Jymmm> [05/20 20:32:21] <Jymmm> whore 2
[03:30:44] <Jymmm> [05/20 20:32:35] <dmess> ham not
[03:30:45] <A-L-P-H-A> then try again.
[03:30:54] <A-L-P-H-A> WTF... how come he can message you. and not me?
[03:31:30] <dmess> your jinxed... its usually me...
[03:31:30] <Jymmm> A-L-P-H-A: /msg mickserv set unfiltered on
[03:31:36] <A-L-P-H-A> just did that
[03:31:37] <Jymmm> nickserv
[03:31:40] <A-L-P-H-A> dmess, try again.
[03:32:10] <Jymmm> A-L-P-H-A dmess client is funky, make sure it's not in another window
[03:33:07] <A-L-P-H-A> got it dmess
[03:33:09] <Jymmm> [05/20 20:34:34] <dmess> whats you up
[03:33:24] <Jymmm> oh, he's using gaim
[03:33:39] <Jymmm> let me see something...
[03:34:13] <Jymmm> oh, I have unfiltereed on
[03:34:27] <Jymmm> ok dmess try again
[03:34:29] <dmess> is that bad
[03:34:54] <Jymmm> if you are not identified, I won't get the troll messages
[03:35:04] <Jymmm> if unfiltered is off
[03:35:28] <Jymmm> dmess: check your main window for server messages
[03:35:38] <Jymmm> dmess you are not identified
[03:35:55] <Guest501> Am I here?
[03:35:57] <Jymmm> /msg nickserv identify <password>
[03:36:18] <Guest501> S/B DaveF, not guest 501.
[03:36:47] <Jymmm> A-L-P-H-A msg me again
[03:37:06] <Jymmm> A-L-P-H-A msg me again, and tell me when you have done so.
[03:37:29] <SkunkWorks> ok - bed time.
[03:37:35] <Jymmm> G'Night SkunkWorks
[03:37:36] <SkunkWorks> have fun
[03:37:43] <SkunkWorks> night
[03:39:06] <A-L-P-H-A> done so
[03:39:13] <Jymmm> [05/20 20:41:07] *A-L-P-H-A* boo
[03:39:22] <A-L-P-H-A> [23:40:42] -> *Jymmm* boo
[03:39:22] <A-L-P-H-A> [23:40:44] <A-L-P-H-A> done so
[03:39:22] <A-L-P-H-A> [23:40:51] <Jymmm> [05/20 20:41:07] *A-L-P-H-A* boo
[03:39:29] <Jymmm> dmess: msg me again, and tell me when you have done so.
[03:39:42] <Jymmm> A-L-P-H-A: LOL, I pasted that in the channel =)
[03:40:02] <A-L-P-H-A> I think you're time is a little off.. or maybe mine is.
[03:40:21] <Jymmm> mine is off by a minute
[03:41:20] <dmess> done so
[03:41:40] <Jymmm> dmess: nothing. Ok, so check your client's server window
[03:42:45] <DaveF> 'night guys. Thanks for the help. 'Ill be back...' :)
[03:43:16] <Jymmm> laters
[03:43:16] <dmess> i still see no msgs in there
[03:43:21] <A-L-P-H-A> later
[03:43:22] <dmess> be well
[03:43:39] <Jymmm> * Jymmm is still here, telling DaveF laters
[03:44:12] <Jymmm> dmess Yeah, see if there's an update to Gaim for ya
[03:44:13] <DaveF> yup. good luck!
[03:44:21] <A-L-P-H-A> gaim beta 3
[03:44:24] <A-L-P-H-A> that's about it.
[03:44:27] <Jymmm> dmess you are not getting the server's error messages.
[03:44:40] <A-L-P-H-A> use xirc.
[03:44:40] <dmess> no
[03:46:02] <Jymmm> dmess you might see if an update is available for your client.
[03:46:53] <dmess> i just tried it cuz it supported yahoo, msm , icq and all those others
[03:47:40] <Jymmm> dmess: I understand, you just might want to see if an update for it is available
[03:47:58] <dmess> i did install xirc recently but haven tried it
[03:59:41] <dmess> well im off to bed...
[03:59:47] <A-L-P-H-A> later
[03:59:48] <dmess> night all...
[04:16:45] <CIA-8> 03jepler 07HEAD * 10emc2/tcl/bin/pickconfig.tcl: prompt the user to copy a read-only configuration
[04:17:48] <cradek> cool
[04:42:11] <LawrenceG> trying gaim instead of xchat....
[04:42:26] <Lawrence1> ok... so far
[04:42:52] <Lawrence1> Jymmm: you still around?
[04:57:09] <A-L-P-H-A> how would you join the halves together? http://www.coe.ufrj.br/~acmq/spinning/
[06:43:09] <Jymmm> LawrenceG or the moment
[06:43:15] <Jymmm> LawrenceG for the moment
[06:44:51] <Jymmm> A-L-P-H-A he says he uses epoxy, but I guess you could braze/sweat/soldder them depending on the material
[08:53:06] <anonimas1> anonimas1 is now known as anonimasu
[09:33:30] <robin_sz> * robin_sz pinches himself
[09:33:40] <robin_sz> errm ... what year is it?
[09:35:04] <chinamill> 2006, verified ;)
[09:40:32] <alex_joni> indeed
[09:41:15] <alex_joni> anyone want to play? http://www.addictingclips.com/Clip.aspx?key=7903FD1A94CEEAD2
[09:48:33] <alex_joni> chinamill: how did you verify?
[09:48:54] <alex_joni> yay I won.. didn't shoot the puppy ;)
[09:56:18] <A-L-P-H-A> alex_joni, that's stupid that game
[09:59:16] <giacus> morning all
[10:04:35] <giacus> summer is in the air here, 30° C
[10:13:15] <alex_joni> A-L-P-H-A: did you manage it?
[10:14:17] <robin_sz> 2006. you certain?
[10:14:30] <robin_sz> not 1972?
[10:15:29] <robin_sz> weird ... I could swear KISS just won the Eurovision Song Contest
[10:54:37] <giacus> does anyone know how to get a browsable dir in a website ?
[10:55:30] <giacus> http://www.giacus.org/files/
[10:55:58] <giacus> I tried to chmod it by ftp without luck ..
[10:56:31] <giacus> It should be browsable for the permission it have
[10:57:29] <Bo^Dick> giacus: what ftp software do you use?
[10:58:18] <giacus> gftp
[10:58:22] <giacus> or ftp
[10:58:49] <giacus> wonder if it depend on permission
[10:59:02] <giacus> I don't have ssh access to my webspace
[11:01:00] <Bo^Dick> giacus: maybe your situations is the same as mine. when i click "properties" on one of my folders there is a text that says "this server does not support modifications of the access-rights"
[11:01:54] <giacus> a solution could be to create and index.html, but its silly .. to update it anytime
[11:02:36] <Bo^Dick> i agree
[11:09:57] <robin_sz> giacus, it depends on the server settings
[11:10:02] <robin_sz> you running apache?
[11:11:15] <giacus> yes, apache
[11:11:42] <robin_sz> and you have mod_index ?
[11:11:51] <robin_sz> (i think its that ... let me check)
[11:11:56] <giacus> in the / ?
[11:12:22] <robin_sz> no, you installed mod_index and enabeld it in apache.conf?
[11:13:00] <giacus> robin_sz: I just have ftp access there
[11:13:09] <robin_sz> eh?
[11:13:10] <giacus> limited access
[11:13:17] <robin_sz> oh, its not your server?
[11:13:21] <giacus> nope
[11:13:35] <robin_sz> ahh, well, lets assume they have mod_index
[11:13:48] <giacus> I just bought domain name and webspace
[11:16:35] <robin_sz> mod_index is probably disabled, but you can enable it in your .htaccess file
[11:16:51] <giacus> http://hosting.aruba.it/hosting_con_spazio.asp?Lang=EN&offerta=2
[11:17:19] <giacus> see the Web Space Features section
[11:17:42] <robin_sz> its mod_autoindex ... I was a bit wrong
[11:18:25] <giacus> htaccess acces is available for what I see
[11:19:00] <robin_sz> right ... you know how to use the .htaccess file?
[11:20:01] <giacus> never used
[11:20:07] <giacus> I can google ..
[11:20:25] <robin_sz> put this line:
[11:20:44] <robin_sz> Options +Indexes
[11:21:07] <robin_sz> in your .htaccess file in your directory
[11:21:31] <giacus> in the root / I suppose
[11:21:54] <robin_sz> no
[11:22:02] <giacus> in /files/ ? ok ..
[11:22:09] <robin_sz> you dont have access to / do you?
[11:22:28] <robin_sz> in which ever directory you want to be indexed
[11:22:44] <giacus> giacus.org/files/
[11:22:56] <robin_sz> in which ever directory you want to be indexed
[11:23:28] <robin_sz> mod_autoindex is part of the Apache base distribution, so it should work
[11:23:45] <giacus> now tryng ..
[11:23:58] <robin_sz> depending on the AllowOveride setting in the master configguration
[11:24:33] <giacus> I was playng with the web interface at mywebsite/login
[11:24:45] <giacus> it just allow to define protected areas
[11:25:07] <giacus> with user/passwd, but do not browsable directory
[11:25:17] <giacus> resetting now..
[11:29:40] <robin_sz> not sure what "resetting" is ...
[11:31:15] <giacus> uhmm
[11:31:17] <giacus> http://www.giacus.org/files
[11:31:37] <giacus> after I put the .htaccess
[11:32:00] <robin_sz> and you put the line "Options +Indexes"
[11:32:04] <robin_sz> yes?
[11:32:31] <giacus> sure
[11:32:33] <robin_sz> not options or OPTIONS, or index or INDEXES
[11:32:54] <giacus> looking..
[11:33:12] <giacus> Options +Indexes
[11:33:57] <robin_sz> maybe they dont have mod_autoindex then
[11:34:12] <robin_sz> youd be better off running your own server on your ADSL line
[11:35:27] <giacus> I'm reading Php is installed as CGI not as module
[11:35:42] <robin_sz> nothing to do with it
[11:37:10] <robin_sz> sounds like their install is broken .. go find a better ISP or run your own
[11:37:44] <giacus> robin_sz: I could run my website on my dsl linux-box, but:
[11:38:04] <giacus> dsl has limited upload, (i'm sharing the connection)
[11:38:18] <giacus> dinamic IP
[11:38:23] <giacus> dns issue ..
[11:38:25] <robin_sz> how many visitors do you expect huh?
[11:38:34] <robin_sz> dynamic IP? how crappy.
[11:39:19] <robin_sz> ah well, you are just going to have to find a better ISP for the website then
[11:39:41] <giacus> aruba work pretty nice for me
[11:39:48] <giacus> and its cheap
[11:40:01] <giacus> the only issue i'm havig is just that ..
[11:43:03] <robin_sz> is it an important issue for you?
[11:44:15] <robin_sz> yes? or no?
[11:44:25] <giacus> yes,
[11:44:32] <robin_sz> then leave for somewhere else.
[11:44:45] <giacus> but not enough to spend much more $$ :(
[11:44:53] <robin_sz> then stay, and live with it
[11:45:11] <giacus> I could setup a fast server on my linux box
[11:45:18] <giacus> i.e boa
[11:45:31] <giacus> to avoid that issue
[11:45:49] <giacus> with dyndns
[11:46:51] <giacus> when I'll get a good dsl upload line i'll do it for sure..
[11:47:06] <robin_sz> bored now
[11:47:07] <giacus> actually its a poor upload
[11:47:18] <robin_sz> boa? wtf is that?
[11:47:31] <giacus> its a cool webserver, very fast
[11:47:42] <giacus> most used in embedded systems
[11:47:56] <robin_sz> sounds useless
[11:48:01] <giacus> http://www.boa.org/
[11:48:20] <giacus> I used it for a remote webcam streaming
[11:48:46] <giacus> of course it doesnt have all features as apache ..
[11:49:04] <robin_sz> hardly has ANY features
[11:49:35] <robin_sz> and .. most importantly, it doesnt seem to even have the feature you want!
[11:50:44] <robin_sz> just install apache and be done with it ... even on a slow old 486 apache si fast enough to saturate a T1 line
[11:50:56] <robin_sz> right ...
[11:50:57] <robin_sz> im off
[12:43:37] <Bo^Dick> could someone understand the internal block diagram on page 4? http://www.compel.ru/pdf/IR/IR2108.pdf
[13:41:55] <Bo^Dick> btw, does the geckodrive have any kind of protection? that would happen if the motor broke or got short circuited?
[14:57:54] <A-L-P-H-A> Anyone got a good/easy method to machine spheres (like balls)? I want to make like 6-10 of them... maybe like 1" in dia. I've got a 4jaw chuck... machine is CNCd.
[14:58:07] <A-L-P-H-A> I'll be drilling a hole in them at the end... [or beginning]
[15:15:42] <A-L-P-H-A> I guess a better description would be beads.
[16:25:55] <robin_sz> * robin_sz watches another Lordi video ...
[16:26:13] <robin_sz> amusing, and quite fun
[16:27:43] <robin_sz> sort of a cross between Iron Maiden, Alice Cooper and KISS
[16:41:43] <giacus> hey robin_sz
[16:41:59] <giacus> do you like heavy metal?
[16:45:53] <giacus> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QjA5faZF1A8&search=guitar
[16:46:23] <giacus> oops
[16:46:25] <giacus> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QjA5faZF1A8
[16:46:36] <giacus> this guy iz great :P
[16:55:07] <Jymmm> * Jymmm needs a damn laser engraver
[16:59:03] <dmess> bonjour tous
[16:59:13] <giacus> hi dmess
[16:59:27] <dmess> what up??
[16:59:52] <giacus> pretty calm day
[17:00:07] <giacus> relaxing a bit
[17:00:24] <dmess> started out nice here but went to pot... rain and wind
[17:00:47] <anonimasu> dmess: so, how's the stuff with the potential differential going?
[17:00:58] <dmess> im trying to heal my eyeball... i scratched it somehow yesterday
[17:01:12] <dmess> the math still works
[17:02:07] <dmess> i have ben buyin neobidium magnets evey now and then when i can afford them
[17:03:17] <dmess> i was contacted by Oxford University last year... wanted to discuss a post i made on their site
[17:05:04] <Jymmm> dmess stop posting nakkid pics of yourself!
[17:05:10] <dmess> the easiest way to put it is.. it acceleates on diffrential mass... and generates with its potential mass
[17:05:49] <dmess> the wife has all of those if your finding them its her fault
[17:06:00] <Jymmm> lol
[17:06:45] <dmess> she takes them while im sleepin'..... i never woud do those things to my pets
[17:07:19] <Jymmm> why dont i believe you
[17:07:39] <dmess> :-/
[17:08:39] <dmess> but i'll use classic ladder on it... and try to get the feedback loop to register as position
[17:13:12] <dmess> xnap was nice to see as a puppy add-on
[17:17:26] <Jymmm> you installed puppy?
[17:22:19] <dmess> im running from ramdisk...
[17:22:25] <dmess> on the laptop
[17:22:34] <Jymmm> ah
[17:23:19] <dmess> it seems VERY complete
[17:23:35] <john____> Oh joy... Looks like the Magma realtime kernel doesn't support my wireless network card. o.o
[17:25:06] <dmess> i havent tried the wireless devices on puppy... but it deals with usb fine
[17:25:47] <dmess> i may put puppy on a usb stick for craps and giggles
[17:26:44] <john____> I suppose it couldn't hurt to burn a CD of CoolCNC and try that.
[17:27:10] <dmess> thats what in on now... its puppy based
[17:27:30] <dmess> im
[17:27:41] <john____> I figured. :-)
[17:27:56] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07v2_0_branch * 10emc2/src/Makefile.inc.in: removed genhexkins because of possible copyright infringements
[17:28:22] <dmess> i'll send ya a neat little program to demo emc2
[17:28:44] <john____> A G-Code program?
[17:28:54] <dmess> yes
[17:29:05] <dmess> from the wiki
[17:29:49] <john____> Point me to it and I'll download it when I get the network on the mill controller running again.
[17:30:26] <dmess> its not a d/load there...
[17:31:06] <dmess> can you do file transfer??
[17:32:20] <john____> From where to where? I have not yet tried from my Mac to the PC running the mill. I only got Ubuntu installed yesterday.
[17:32:45] <dmess> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl/emcinfo.pl?Oword
[17:32:57] <dmess> from me to you... was what i was thinkin
[17:33:37] <john____> I probably can, but then I'd need to move it from here to the PC.
[17:34:00] <dmess> its short you can type it in in 5 minutes
[17:34:07] <john____> Wow... CoolCNC fits in 52MB?
[17:34:23] <dmess> its tiny... but feedable
[17:35:07] <john____> I see the samples. Which one were you thinking of?
[17:35:40] <dmess> the ball in cage one i have and enjoy showig to programmers... ; )
[17:35:50] <dmess> im an a-hole LOL
[17:36:44] <Jymmm> 8000 feet hole
[17:36:48] <dmess> i believe in doinhe fewest lines of code possible...g things in t
[17:37:02] <dmess> Jymmm is one too
[17:37:30] <Jymmm> nope, not me... I'm only goin solar or thermal power
[17:37:35] <CIA-8> 03compile-farm 07BDI-2.18 (2.2.18-rtl3.0) * 10v2_0_branch/: build FAILED ; see http://linuxcnc.org/compile_farm/v2_0_branch_slot2_log.txt
[17:38:27] <dmess> i have a solar panel that would give YOU NOTHING today.... but gravity is still FREE and available
[17:39:04] <john____> I'm looking at the "ball in a cage" picture (4 sides done). Looks pretty cool for a demo. Just need a way to clamp it to do the 6th side. :-)
[17:39:04] <Jymmm> your solar panel sucks then... my solar blanket gives me 24VDC @ 1A
[17:39:08] <dmess> geo themal... requires a major drill hole
[17:39:35] <dmess> its raining and 100% overcast today.... NOT a chance
[17:39:48] <dmess> maybe this am
[17:41:22] <dmess> i know what your sayin though... i was 1 of you too... untill gravity took over
[17:43:13] <CIA-8> 03compile-farm 07BDI-TNG (2.4.18-rtai) * 10v2_0_branch/: build FAILED ; see http://linuxcnc.org/compile_farm/v2_0_branch_slot3_log.txt
[17:46:25] <CIA-8> 03compile-farm 07BDI-4.20 (2.6.10-adeos) * 10v2_0_branch/: build FAILED ; see http://linuxcnc.org/compile_farm/v2_0_branch_slot5_log.txt
[17:50:20] <CIA-8> 03compile-farm 07BDI-Live rc46 (2.4.25-adeos) * 10v2_0_branch/: build FAILED ; see http://linuxcnc.org/compile_farm/v2_0_branch_slot4_log.txt
[17:54:00] <dmess> jymmm what your latitude and elevation??
[17:55:25] <dmess> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sukhoi_Russian_Regional_Jet
[17:56:30] <dmess> we're doing the landing gear design in toront so they an build it in europe from russian titanium... i dont like the sounds of this one for some reason...; (
[18:01:35] <giacus> I just done the translation of TkEmc it.msg and rs274_err.po to italian. Files can be found here: http://www.giacus.org/files/it.msg and here http://www.giacus.org/files/it_rs274_err.po. If anyone can/want to commit it to the CVS, it would be appreciated. Also, if some irc OP can add the #emc stats url: http://www.giacus.org/emcstats/emc.html in the chan Topic, I think would be useful too. Thanks.
[18:03:49] <dmess> bon travaille mon ami ; )
[18:08:02] <giacus> love and piece DaveF :)
[18:08:39] <dmess> giacus... cann you accept a tune??
[18:09:23] <giacus> sure
[18:09:42] <giacus> dcc you mean ?
[18:10:07] <dmess> i guess so..
[18:10:22] <giacus> oh.. sorry nope
[18:10:26] <giacus> I'm firewalled
[18:10:43] <dmess> if i rename it>>??
[18:11:22] <giacus> can't understand you :/
[18:11:28] <DaveF> Hi all.
[18:11:30] <dmess> im firewalled too... ; )
[18:12:56] <dmess> find this song... Greatful Dead- Uncle John's Band.mp3.... its worth the wait
[18:13:06] <giacus> ok
[18:13:49] <DaveF> If I might break in... I was just looking at coolcnc +Axis - looks good.
[18:14:07] <dmess> i told ya so...LOL
[18:14:50] <DaveF> Yes, thanks for the tip. I was wondering how one gets from drawing / art (say for a PCB) to G-Code.
[18:15:27] <DaveF> LIke in the example screen shots on the site - know what they were using?
[18:16:43] <DaveF> Oh, and same to ya giacus :)
[18:17:09] <dmess> im not a pcb kinda guy
[18:17:21] <giacus> http://www.yty.net/cnc/
[18:17:52] <giacus> scroll that page, should be something of 'old' inside
[18:18:00] <giacus> but probably working ..
[18:18:38] <DaveF> Well, that's just for example. Looks like the developers of axis are using something pretty good from the screen shots.
[18:18:44] <DaveF> Thanks Giacus.
[18:18:58] <giacus> yep, developers are jepler and cradek
[18:20:45] <DaveF> They mention Eagle on that link. Seems like that costs as I recall.
[18:22:05] <giacus> I just tried it one time, it should work for <99 lines for free
[18:22:34] <giacus> that was enough for my needs
[18:25:09] <DaveF> AS for cutting spheres there is a tool for the lathe called a ball cutter. I've seen a couple articles on making a cutter. Basically it is a swing arm that sits on the tool post and swings the cutter thru an arc.
[18:27:11] <DaveF> Here's one: http://www.bedair.org/Ball/ball.html
[18:28:08] <giacus> nice
[18:29:24] <DaveF> Yea, looks pretty simple. I've seen them with ball bearings too. Don't thingk you'ld need it though. Just a good tight fit.
[18:30:31] <alex_joni> DaveF: there is a free version of Eagle
[18:30:52] <alex_joni> yet it is somehow limited (2 sides, some max. size, only one schematic / PCB)
[18:31:11] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni 07v2_0_branch * 10emc2/src/Makefile: removed genhexkins because of possible copyright infringements
[18:32:37] <DaveF> Thanks alex. What's that last mean?
[18:33:01] <alex_joni> only one schematic / PCB ?
[18:33:25] <alex_joni> you can have big boards, which you design in more than one schematic page.
[18:33:36] <alex_joni> then you can link them together to form a single layout
[18:33:44] <alex_joni> that doesn't work in the free version
[18:34:36] <alex_joni> more info here: http://www.cadsoft.de/freeware.htm
[18:37:14] <DaveF> Yes I see. That looks like it would be fine for my purposes. Thanks.
[18:37:44] <DaveF> But what was that about Makefile: removed, etc.
[18:37:50] <DaveF> Above.
[18:41:47] <alex_joni> DaveF: CIA-8 is a bot that pastes commit logs in here
[18:42:06] <alex_joni> when we work on the emc2 software, we commit our code to the CVS server once in a while
[18:42:25] <alex_joni> those commits usually are accompanied by a descriptive message
[18:43:37] <CIA-8> 03compile-farm 07BDI-2.18 (2.2.18-rtl3.0) * 10v2_0_branch/: build PASSED
[18:44:26] <alex_joni> DaveF: this time the CIA-8 bot tells me that my last commit really fixed what I intended
[18:44:49] <alex_joni> we have a compile_farm (several distributions) which test the latest code
[18:45:11] <alex_joni> http://linuxcnc.org/compile_farm/
[18:45:53] <alex_joni> * alex_joni is waiting for the other slots to report success
[18:46:19] <alex_joni> in about 4-5 minutes :D
[18:46:56] <DaveF> Oh, I'd like to say 'I see..' But it might be better paraphrased as 'I knew that...' :)
[18:48:06] <alex_joni> DaveF: where from?
[18:48:49] <CIA-8> 03compile-farm 07BDI-TNG (2.4.18-rtai) * 10v2_0_branch/: build PASSED
[18:50:13] <DaveF> I was joking. I get the gist, but that's about it. I am a programmer, mostly just PC based stuff, but I worked for awhile with a company on a unix-like system with (I think) CVS type storage where you check versions in and out, etc.
[18:50:41] <DaveF> That about right?
[18:51:07] <alex_joni> I would say we're doing only PC based stuff ;) even if it's linux.. it's still PC ;)
[18:52:59] <Bo^Dick> is it possible to get away cheap with the powerstage for a stepper driver?
[18:53:31] <CIA-8> 03compile-farm 07BDI-4.20 (2.6.10-adeos) * 10v2_0_branch/: build PASSED
[18:53:55] <DaveF> I haven't ever worked on an open source project or anything like that. Is this going through SourceForge, or what?
[18:54:15] <alex_joni> DaveF: yes and no
[18:54:23] <alex_joni> the project is registered at Sourceforge
[18:54:38] <alex_joni> but because they have a very crappy CVS service, we moved CVS to our own server
[18:55:17] <alex_joni> we still have mailing lists & file releases at Sourceforge (along with Feature Requests & Bug reports from users)
[18:55:23] <DaveF> B0-Dick: You can use any transformer with the proper voltage / amperage and a diode bridge / Cap filter.
[18:55:31] <alex_joni> http://sourceforge.net/projects/emc/
[18:56:03] <alex_joni> DaveF: Bo^Dick is struggling to get some better drives (PWM, midband compensation, etc)
[18:56:16] <DaveF> I'll check it out. What language are you using - C?
[18:56:26] <alex_joni> yes and no ;)
[18:56:39] <alex_joni> mostly C, but also C++, tcl, shell scripting
[18:56:55] <alex_joni> and there is an interface for emc called AXIS, which is written in python
[18:59:16] <DaveF> Re Bo-Dick Right, but the power source should not be critical as long as the logic Power is well filtered and regulated.
[19:00:24] <CIA-8> 03compile-farm 07BDI-Live rc46 (2.4.25-adeos) * 10v2_0_branch/: build PASSED
[19:00:40] <DaveF> Isn't Python an interpreter type thing?
[19:01:58] <alex_joni> so is tcl/tk
[19:02:01] <Bo^Dick> DaveF: well i'm mostly concerned about the switching bridge
[19:05:18] <DaveF> You mean the output stage of the driver, then, right? The PWM chopper section?
[19:10:17] <Bo^Dick> DaveF: yepp
[19:10:55] <Bo^Dick> DaveF: i want as much power and performance as i can get for the lease possible amount of money
[19:11:24] <DaveF> Are you wanting to buy your controllers or build them?
[19:12:41] <Ephexis> Ephexis is now known as Pe_de_Mesa
[19:12:41] <Bo^Dick> DaveF: i'd be happy to build the powerstage myself is that is most powerful for the money
[19:13:19] <Pe_de_Mesa> Pe_de_Mesa is now known as Telefunken
[19:14:35] <Bo^Dick> DaveF: sorry we were talkin' about the controller part. the controller part is already designed
[19:18:14] <DaveF> So just the final stage output driver section then, right?
[19:18:46] <Bo^Dick> DaveF: right
[19:22:50] <DaveF> I'm a EE, but I don't know much about PWM drivers except the basic principles and theory. I had considered building a BJT constant current output section using op-amp input with power transistor followers before I discovered the Parkers. Then I decided what the heck, go for it.
[19:23:57] <Bo^Dick> DaveF: the advantage of pwm is the speed and efficiency
[19:24:37] <DaveF> I have seen several discussions and a couple circuit examples on the 'net for MOSFET PWM circuits. Have you looked much?
[19:25:32] <Bo^Dick> DaveF: yeah but this requires not less than eight mosfets for one stepper motor but worst of all is that the driver circuits for the mosfets are so damned expensive
[19:26:09] <DaveF> Right. The power efficiency is far superior to BJT's since the MOSFETS are completely on or off, hence very little internal restance/power disipation. But...
[19:27:15] <DaveF> Really, well, who cares? If you're worried about the cost of the electricity, it's on the same order as the lights in your shop.
[19:27:51] <DaveF> The main thing I see is the power disipated by the BJT's must me properly heat sunk, etc.
[19:28:33] <Bo^Dick> DaveF: well the electricity cost hasn't concerned me really. the motors won't run for 12 hrs a day really
[19:28:52] <Bo^Dick> DaveF: i'm a lot more converned about the electronics parts cost
[19:29:45] <Bo^Dick> DaveF: i don't think heatsinks can be considered a problem here. in fact i'm thinking about fan cool the sinks
[19:30:15] <Bo^Dick> DaveF: so if i can get better power efficiency with mosfets i'm not prepared to pay for it
[19:30:55] <Bo^Dick> DaveF: i want power and cheapness but not necessarily efficiency
[19:31:12] <Bo^Dick> DaveF: are BJT:s way to go then?
[19:31:23] <alex_joni> Bo^Dick: I only used optocouplers to drive my MOSFETS
[19:32:10] <DaveF> Off the top of my head, I recall a technique I've used in the past for a constant current op amp circuit, with a pair of BJT's in the output/feedback loop in a push-pull arrangement that follows the op amp output voltage, which does whatever is needed to keep the output current constant, just like chopper types do, but with a steady waveform rather than spikes that average out to the desired current.
[19:33:22] <DaveF> That way there is little or no 'noise' and RF emission either from fast rising voltage spikes.
[19:33:23] <Bo^Dick> DaveF: sounds intresting. what about speed? how does the current rise and decay curves look like?
[19:34:28] <DaveF> I'll look into it when I get time & post a link if possible. I'm no expert on this, but I do have a pretty good handle on it.
[19:34:47] <Bo^Dick> DaveF: you could take a look a this simulation image where i compare the performance between fast and normal decay modes. please observe that 20kHz is too slow for the fast mode! http://www.carmi.se/misterstarshine/img/comparison.gif
[19:36:04] <DaveF> The wave shape is only limited by the slew rate of the op amp and that of the BJT's (bipolar junction tranistors) commonly called power tranisters. There are very generic types that are pretty cheap.
[19:39:15] <Bo^Dick> DaveF: well the decay rate is dependent on the architecture of the bridge
[19:41:46] <DaveF> Bo-Dick: Hmm, not sure what I'm looking at there. Is that a control voltage signal in violet, and the output to the motor in yellow?
[19:42:30] <Bo^Dick> DaveF: the violet is the control voltage yes and the yellow is the current through the coils in the motor
[19:42:48] <DaveF> OK...
[19:43:26] <Bo^Dick> DaveF: this image proves what i've suspected a long time namely that 20kHz pwm frequency is too slow for a fast decay mode
[19:43:48] <Bo^Dick> DaveF: the image reveals the inefficiency
[19:44:49] <DaveF> Bo: (hope you don'y mind the abreviation - haven't learned how to get a user name automatically inserted yet...)
[19:45:17] <Bo^Dick> DaveF: it
[19:45:22] <Bo^Dick> 's allrigt
[19:45:27] <DaveF> Enlighten me here. Are you concerned about the latency of the output rise vs the input?
[19:46:39] <alex_joni> DaveF: type the first few letters, then hit 'tab' most IRC clients expand to the proper Nick
[19:47:03] <DaveF> alex_joni thanks. works.
[19:47:05] <Bo^Dick> DaveF: not really the difference between them if there is any but rather that the speed is fast so that the end result gets responsive
[19:47:23] <Jymmm> al<tab> == alex_joni
[19:47:40] <Jymmm> da<tab><tab> == DaveF
[19:47:48] <alex_joni> Jymmm: something to chear you up: http://dsplabs.utt.ro/~juve/blog/index.cgi/photography/01148239064
[19:48:00] <Jymmm> Gawd I hope so
[19:48:02] <DaveF> Jymmm: right. jy tab = Jymmm
[19:48:15] <alex_joni> Jymmm: and I don't mind blaming me even when I'm around ;) so go ahead...
[19:48:30] <alex_joni> 06:23 #EMC: < Jymmm> SkunkWorks we can blame alex_joni, casue he's not here to defend himself!
[19:48:40] <Jymmm> alex_joni: Thanks, I told dmess, but he didn't believe me.
[19:49:09] <DaveF> Bo^Dick: you're losing the there.
[19:50:14] <Jymmm> alex_joni: If you could have caught the girls eyes looking at the bunnyys, that would have been a perfect shot.
[19:50:42] <alex_joni> Jymmm: that's my gf :)
[19:50:55] <alex_joni> and I had a few more where you can see her eyes, but not as good as this one
[19:51:05] <Jymmm> alex_joni: Oh, she looks like 9yo there
[19:51:09] <alex_joni> lol
[19:51:16] <alex_joni> 26 going on 27 :)
[19:51:23] <Jymmm> alex_joni young facial complextion
[19:51:38] <Bo^Dick> i'm also a bunny-lover
[19:51:57] <alex_joni> Jymmm: how about this one? http://dsplabs.utt.ro/~juve/blog/index.cgi-files/photography/01147700866/mast.jpg
[19:52:42] <Jymmm> alex_joni: Ah, nice. Let me found and post a few of mine. Will take a bit, all on dvd
[19:53:24] <alex_joni> Jymmm: maybe another time.. I'm half way in bed
[19:53:39] <alex_joni> but I'd like to see some..
[19:53:39] <Jymmm> alex_joni: np
[19:53:45] <alex_joni> some day that is
[19:53:59] <alex_joni> here's another one I like.. http://dsplabs.utt.ro/~juve/blog/index.cgi-files/photography/01145956957/tree.jpg
[19:54:16] <Jymmm> very nice
[19:54:22] <DaveF> Very cute! Sorry guys, guess I got OT talking about stepper motors and stuff. :) Just kidding.
[19:54:44] <alex_joni> DaveF: half of the time we're OT :)
[19:55:18] <DaveF> My 4 cats would absolutely LOVE your bunnies! Especially the baby ones. :)
[19:55:57] <DaveF> Don't worry though, I won't tell them.
[19:56:03] <alex_joni> I bet they would :)
[19:56:10] <alex_joni> 7 small bunnies this time..
[19:56:17] <alex_joni> anyways.. have a nice day
[19:56:21] <alex_joni> * alex_joni goes to bed
[19:56:28] <alex_joni> good night all..
[19:57:44] <DaveF> I have one that's really into moles. Thankfully for my lawn. I get one or two a week deposited on my front porce right in front of the door where I can't miss them. Like her trophys or something. Guess she thinks she's contributing to the household food budget.
[19:58:09] <DaveF> nite alex_joni.
[19:59:31] <DaveF> So Bo^Dick: What did you mean about 'the end result gets responsive...'
[20:00:05] <DaveF> Or are we hanging up on this for now?
[20:07:30] <anonimasu> alex_joni: just dont let them reproduce freely ;)
[20:18:01] <Jymmm> anonimasu: Hell, we dont let alex_joni reproduce freely either!!!
[20:20:32] <DaveF> Bo^Dick: Oh, I see. Just looked at the second trace (Fast decay) I see what you mean. The output is not following the input at all correctly.
[20:20:57] <DaveF> Hello?
[20:22:45] <DaveF> Anybody home?
[20:26:36] <VNR> hi from Argentina
[20:32:02] <DaveF> Are we down?
[20:33:35] <anonimasu> 3
[20:58:55] <giacus> http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=1850340777259368670&q=hard
[21:47:18] <giacus> augh
[21:47:25] <giacus> O_O
[22:05:41] <dmess> where does the time go....
[22:32:32] <K4ts> hello
[22:35:28] <giacus> hi
[22:39:58] <giacus> :-)
[23:13:40] <K4ts> night
[23:28:20] <davef> Hi.
[23:44:00] <giacus> bye