#emc | Logs for 2006-02-06

[01:15:50] <CIA-8> 03cradek * 10emc2/src/emc/ini/iniaxis.cc: stop rewriting AXIS sections in the ini file
[01:19:37] <CIA-8> 03cradek * 10emc2/src/emc/rs274ngc/rs274ngc_pre.cc: clean up hackery that was necessary with sudo usage
[02:07:10] <giacus> giacus is now known as giacus_afk
[02:28:58] <CIA-8> 03cradek * 10emc2/src/ (11 files in 6 dirs): warning cleanups: now compiles with -Werror
[02:30:52] <A-L-P-H-A> robin was that you 3 hours ago in #autocad in efnet?
[05:14:13] <bill__> bill__ is now known as bill20ir
[05:14:17] <bill20ir> bill20ir is now known as bill20r3
[06:27:13] <IkeKrull> hi there - i'm toying with the idea of building a small wankel engine, which i will have cnc-milled (housings, rotors, gears and eccentric shaft) by a machine shop - ideally i want to design the entire thing in the computer so i can just give the machine shop some files and get the machined parts back. I also want to do this with Linux. Am i dreaming?
[06:28:25] <bill20r3> yes
[06:28:25] <bill20r3> I
[06:28:25] <bill20r3> I've looked, there's not any really really good CAD for linux
[06:28:41] <IkeKrull> what abour brl-cad?
[06:28:41] <bill20r3> unless it's hiding really well.
[06:29:16] <bill20r3> I've not used that one.
[06:30:08] <bill20r3> there's a placeonline that will make parts from your models, if I could remember thier url..
[06:30:37] <IkeKrull> yeah i really need parametric 3d solids i think since polygonal modelling won't have the accuracy - i could model all the parts in blender, but accuracy i think would be an issue
[06:32:10] <IkeKrull> if thats not the case, it could be an option for me...
[06:32:55] <IkeKrull> well, let me ask another question - say i have a .DXF of a part - what is involved in turning that into a CNC-millable object i.e. G-Code?
[06:33:51] <bill20r3> disclaimer: I'm a newbie too.
[06:33:52] <IkeKrull> hehe ok :)
[06:33:52] <bill20r3> but you need CAM software, it actually plots tool paths
[06:33:54] <bill20r3> and "cheap" for cam means its under a grand
[06:34:17] <bill20r3> but if you're hiring out the milling, they'd handle the cam
[06:34:32] <bill20r3> why a rotary engine, just for fun?
[06:34:38] <IkeKrull> yeah pretty much
[06:34:43] <IkeKrull> i'm a bit of a rotor-head
[06:34:53] <IkeKrull> in that i own an RX-7 and a small sachs rotary
[06:35:24] <bill20r3> heh, ok
[06:35:24] <IkeKrull> which i plan to put in a scooter
[06:35:24] <IkeKrull> but thats another story
[06:35:24] <bill20r3> *schwing*
[06:35:37] <bill20r3> <-- vespa nerd
[06:35:49] <IkeKrull> yeah i'd like to put it in a vespa..
[06:36:46] <bill20r3> * bill20r3 thinks
[06:36:46] <bill20r3> a lammy would probablly be easier.
[06:37:19] <bill20r3> has this idea got past the "you know what would be cool..." stage?
[06:37:38] <IkeKrull> yeah anything i do i'd basically create a custom subframe/swingarm and use a bike gearbox/chain drive - the vespa would be just the body shell and front forks really..
[06:37:39] <IkeKrull> not exactly, i take delivery of the engine tomorrow
[06:37:52] <bill20r3> a vespa engine you mean?
[06:38:02] <IkeKrull> no, the rotary
[06:38:53] <IkeKrull> the previous owner fitted it with electronic ignition, a motorbike carb and a turbocharger.. its kind of begging to be put into a scooter ;)
[06:39:04] <bill20r3> oh, I thought you meant to build one.
[06:39:17] <IkeKrull> i do want to build one
[06:39:35] <IkeKrull> that would be another one
[06:39:42] <IkeKrull> i told you i was a rotorhead ;)
[06:40:13] <bill20r3> heh
[06:40:27] <bill20r3> you allready have a scooter frame?
[06:41:17] <bill20r3> if when it gets done mail me some pics to bill@scoot.net
[06:41:23] <bill20r3> and I'll love you forever
[06:41:31] <IkeKrull> k, will do ;)
[06:42:04] <bill20r3> what is the engine you're getting tomorrow from?
[06:42:50] <IkeKrull> its a sachs engine - i think they used them to power outboard motors
[06:44:24] <bill20r3> http://search-desc.ebay.com/sachs-rotary_W0QQfkrZ1QQfnuZ1QQftsZ2QQxpufuZxQ5A1
[06:44:27] <bill20r3> that kind?
[06:45:44] <IkeKrull> could be.. this one is about 150cc
[06:45:53] <IkeKrull> definitely same manufacturer
[06:47:11] <bill20r3> sachs made some mopeds too, you could do a sachs-sachs
[06:47:41] <IkeKrull> hehe i could i guess.. they make some pretty cool looking bikes like the sachs madass
[06:48:00] <bill20r3> totally
[06:48:22] <IkeKrull> i saw one of those the other day but its pretty expensive and seems to be rather underpowered
[06:48:23] <bill20r3> I vote lammy chopper.
[06:48:27] <bill20r3> the 50cc?
[06:48:32] <IkeKrull> yeah, the 50cc
[06:48:33] <bill20r3> I think there's a bigger one too.
[06:48:41] <bill20r3> it's like naked bike, in scooter form
[06:49:54] <IkeKrull> i have a little 50cc pgo (taiwanese) that i'm also wanting to hot up, but fitting the rotary would be a problem since its my daily rider
[06:50:15] <bill20r3> it's a smallframe, or P sized?
[06:50:39] <bill20r3> pick up a honda elite to ride..
[06:51:14] <IkeKrull> its a PMX-50.. quite large for a 50cc scooter... just needs an expansion chamber really
[06:51:19] <bill20r3> I have an et3
[06:51:24] <IkeKrull> nice
[06:51:24] <bill20r3> (among others)
[06:51:42] <IkeKrull> i'd like a 'proper' vespa/lambretta but too many $$$
[06:52:10] <bill20r3> with 50-special parts on it, the square headlight and tiny tail light
[06:52:10] <bill20r3> yeah, they're not cheap anymore
[06:52:13] <IkeKrull> cool.. i gotta go out to pick up dinner.. will be back in 15 minutes or so if youre still here
[06:52:34] <bill20r3> http://scoot.net/scooterist/Bill_in_SLC
[06:52:36] <bill20r3> k
[10:40:31] <cncuser> hello :)
[10:41:00] <cncuser> the hangs i had where related to some buggy patched kernel of mine.
[10:41:49] <cncuser> anyone ever seen that one ? : ImportError: libnvidia-tls.so.1: cannot handle TLS data
[10:42:27] <cncuser> the minigl import by axis leeds to this on my box :(
[10:42:34] <cncuser> i blame nvidia
[10:56:15] <cncuser> hmm, when i use softwarerendering it work. bad bad nvidia.
[11:01:23] <cncuser> hmm
[11:01:53] <cncuser> i also still see the graphical plot of axis wrong scaled when running
[11:02:02] <cncuser> got emc2 and axis form the last hour
[11:07:41] <alex_joni> morning
[11:07:52] <cncuser> morning alexjoni
[11:08:12] <alex_joni> what's wrong with the scale?
[11:09:11] <cncuser> the "white lines" on the screen would not get painted red. ninstead the cam job viewn in white is ploted in red very small in a corner
[11:11:01] <alex_joni> hrmm...
[11:11:03] <alex_joni> running G21 ?
[11:11:12] <alex_joni> can you make a screenshot?
[11:11:20] <alex_joni> and give me the program & ini ?
[11:11:21] <cncuser> yes
[11:11:59] <alex_joni> this is latest AXIS? (from CVS? or axis-latest.tar.gz ?)
[11:12:12] <cncuser> axis-latest.tar.gz
[11:12:22] <alex_joni> ok
[11:12:27] <alex_joni> does the program contain G21?
[11:12:39] <alex_joni> or did you run G21 manually from MDI ?
[11:12:55] <cncuser> no
[11:13:29] <alex_joni> which one?
[11:15:56] <cncuser> http://puppysit.hinternet.at/shot.jpg
[11:16:02] <cncuser> which one ?
[11:16:04] <cncuser> what ?
[11:19:40] <alex_joni> 13:16 < alex_joni> does the program contain G21?
[11:19:40] <alex_joni> 13:16 < alex_joni> or did you run G21 manually from MDI ?
[11:19:40] <alex_joni> 13:16 < cncuser> no
[11:20:06] <cncuser> no no
[11:20:54] <alex_joni> ok
[11:21:02] <alex_joni> go to Code Entry
[11:21:08] <alex_joni> and look at the list of active G-codes
[11:21:31] <alex_joni> check for G20 or G21
[11:21:32] <cncuser> ahh ok, there is 21
[11:21:41] <alex_joni> ok, that means it's in metric mode
[11:21:53] <alex_joni> I suspect the first time the program gets loaded it's in G20 (inch mode)
[11:21:59] <cncuser> hmmm
[11:22:03] <alex_joni> and afterwards it gets switched to G21
[11:22:12] <cncuser> hmm
[11:22:16] <alex_joni> try to use G21 in the ini file for g-codes at startup
[11:22:21] <alex_joni> or in the program at the beginning
[11:22:28] <cncuser> ok
[11:22:41] <alex_joni> let me know if it works
[11:24:15] <cncuser> looks good
[11:24:16] <cncuser> :)
[11:25:07] <cncuser> damit the cam routing of cam.py seems random :)
[11:27:58] <alex_joni> lol
[11:43:02] <cncuser> really
[11:43:28] <cncuser> the routing is kriss kross. one objectform after the other... all circles, all squares....
[11:44:33] <alex_joni> lol
[11:44:41] <alex_joni> * alex_joni goes away for a while
[13:36:52] <cncuser> hmmm
[13:38:15] <cncuser> anyone got a clou how to get the gerber drillcode (drl, txt, gg1) into gcode ?
[13:41:09] <Jymmm> http://engraving.majosoft.com/html/body_making_plt_files_for_circuit_board_milling.html
[13:44:36] <cncuser> thanks jymmm
[13:45:05] <Jymmm> theres more, but I can't find the link(s), might google gerber to gcode
[13:45:18] <cncuser> did that, thanks
[13:48:28] <alex_joni> cncuser: I know cradek has some tools to get eagle files into g-code
[13:50:59] <cncuser> alex_joni: yes, i allready used it.
[13:51:32] <cncuser> alex_joni: but thisone i only have in gerber. and i cant import into eagle. so i use cam.py. alls except the drillingstuff seems to work
[13:52:12] <cncuser> just downloadet caexpert
[13:52:20] <cncuser> lets see, maybe it can do something with it
[13:53:23] <cncuser> hmm, ok, thisone only knows dxf :)
[14:20:21] <A-L-P-H-A> hey folks.
[14:20:31] <A-L-P-H-A> Anyone have experience with the ndiswrappers?
[14:20:45] <cncuser> hi A-L-P-H-A , sorry, no clou
[14:20:53] <A-L-P-H-A> 'ight. :)
[14:28:30] <lilo> [Global Notice] Hi all. If you have a moment, please stop by #freenode-survey and answer a few questions which may help us with feature design. Please check the topic or join notice for the questions and answer briefly on channel. Thanks.
[15:09:24] <giacus> morning ..
[15:09:28] <giacus> nice black out here :)
[15:21:36] <A-L-P-H-A> damn it's bright outside.
[15:48:57] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni * 10emc2/tcl/scripts/ (DIO_Exercise.tcl IO_Exercise.tcl IO_Show.tcl): obsoleted by halconfig
[15:59:22] <les_w> hey swp saw your posts about grex
[15:59:34] <les_w> so it's limited to 1 ms updates?
[16:08:26] <SWPadnos> around there, I think
[16:08:40] <SWPadnos> the interrupt generator on the FPGA can likely go faster, but I'm not sure by how much
[16:11:04] <SWPadnos> ok - 256Hz to 2048 Hz INT rates
[16:14:20] <SWPadnos> hmmm - and it looks like it's either 256, 512, 1024, or 2048 Hz, not truly "variable"
[16:16:50] <A-L-P-H-A> so who's currently on the board of directors now?
[16:17:42] <SWPadnos> same as last week
[16:18:23] <SWPadnos> Chris Radek (Chairman), Ray Henry (Loudmouth), Jon Elson, John Kasunich, and Alex Joni
[16:18:29] <SWPadnos> in no particular order
[16:25:32] <A-L-P-H-A> SWPadnos? you didn't make it?
[16:25:33] <A-L-P-H-A> :(
[16:25:37] <SWPadnos> nope
[16:25:40] <A-L-P-H-A> i voted for yeah.
[16:25:47] <SWPadnos> thanks :)
[16:26:29] <les_w> well, I guess grex is fairly slow
[16:26:36] <les_w> for hsm anyway
[16:26:54] <SWPadnos> the servo rate is, plus there's a 1 or 2 cycle update delay due to the latching mechanism
[16:27:06] <les_w> yuck.
[16:27:56] <les_w> The TP smoothing is a moving average . Not the best.
[16:28:00] <SWPadnos> the basic design is pretty simple, it's the FPGA code that's hard to develop
[16:28:12] <SWPadnos> but there's FPGA source in the M5I20 EMC driver
[16:28:19] <fenn> why are fpga's so icky?
[16:28:40] <SWPadnos> the G-Rex is also geared toward step generation, not analog control
[16:28:55] <SWPadnos> FPGAs aren't icky, they're just so flexible, it's hard to define what they should
[16:28:57] <SWPadnos> do
[16:29:04] <SWPadnos> it's the restrictions that get you
[16:29:11] <SWPadnos> (ie, defining them :) )
[16:29:26] <les_w> Tom k is also using a moving average...have to get him away from that
[16:29:54] <SWPadnos> moving average is just a second-order FIR filter
[16:30:37] <les_w> a rectangular convolution. Run a trapezoidal wave through one. nasty.
[16:31:31] <SWPadnos> hmmm, it's not a convolution, because you don't have a second set of coefficients "sliding" over the input waveform
[16:31:58] <SWPadnos> unless you consider the window itself to be a positive step function, then a negative one superimposed
[16:32:58] <les_w> I always considered the term "moving average" as the convolution of the signal with a rectasngular window
[16:33:20] <les_w> that's what tom k is doing anyway
[16:33:30] <SWPadnos> ok - that makes sense
[16:34:12] <les_w> It makes for less than ideal paths anyway
[16:34:42] <SWPadnos> the ideal FPGA basd controller would be something like the Mesa card, but with the I/O protection on the G-Rex, and a bit of analog on the board
[16:35:20] <SWPadnos> there are even FPGAs with analog sections on them now ( O_O )
[16:36:45] <fenn> well an a/d converter would be hella useful
[16:37:12] <SWPadnos> A/D, scaling, plus other stuff, all reconfigurable
[16:37:23] <SWPadnos> 32 channel mux
[16:37:38] <fenn> what do you think about the fpga/processor combos? is that just a gimmick or is it really useful?
[16:38:27] <SWPadnos> do you mean the FPGAs that have processor cores in them, or the embedded processor cores that you can include as part of the logic?
[16:38:50] <fenn> the fpga's with cores on the same chip
[16:39:47] <SWPadnos> actaully, I'd say it's pretty useful in either case, but the IP cores are more cost-effective (but not as fast, in general)
[16:40:17] <SWPadnos> think about an IP stack - that's not really a logic function, though it could be done in "hardware)
[16:41:00] <SWPadnos> having the checksums / CRCs accelerated by some FPGA fabric is excellent, but wasting space on e.g. routig tables might not be the best thing
[16:41:07] <SWPadnos> routing
[16:41:11] <fenn> i'm talking about an FPSLIC
[16:42:29] <SWPadnos> that's actaully more expensive than a high-end FPGA
[16:42:39] <SWPadnos> they're cool though
[16:43:43] <fenn> thats one thing about fpga's.. the high end ones sure are pricey :)
[16:44:00] <SWPadnos> yeah - I'd have a har dtime spending $9500 on a single chip
[16:44:04] <SWPadnos> hard time
[16:46:28] <les_w> hey running on wood heat again...one stack dried enough to burn
[16:46:49] <les_w> hate giving 500-$1000/mo for natural gas
[16:48:02] <les_w> the shop is all NG though
[16:48:22] <les_w> might get one of those outside wood fired boilers
[16:48:38] <les_w> then I could heat all buildings with one
[16:48:52] <les_w> and have it thermostatically controlled
[16:50:46] <fenn> * fenn hates being cold all the time no matter how much money goes to the gas company
[16:51:03] <SWPadnos> you could even get a chiller, and have combined cooling in the summer
[16:51:15] <les_w> yeah
[16:51:30] <les_w> I'm just sick of these high bills
[16:51:32] <fenn> just run the pipes underground
[16:51:47] <fenn> in the summer that is
[16:51:50] <les_w> I can pay it...it's just the principle.
[16:51:57] <les_w> and
[16:52:12] <les_w> I have unlinitetd wood supplies pretty much
[16:52:13] <fenn> make a passive solar design then when you re-build
[16:52:33] <fenn> less work overall
[16:52:46] <SWPadnos> or, you could put up a satellite, and beam microwave energy down
[16:52:50] <les_w> ha
[16:52:52] <SWPadnos> that would be direct heating in the winter
[16:53:22] <fenn> just build a maxwell demon
[16:53:53] <les_w> I have to spend a good bit to keep some heat in the shop at all times
[16:54:06] <SWPadnos> or move to Pennsylvania, where the coal mines are burning
[16:54:10] <les_w> If I power it down everything cold soaks
[16:54:25] <les_w> then turn on the heat...all the cast iron sweats
[16:54:37] <SWPadnos> yeah - tell me about it
[16:54:42] <SWPadnos> you should see my garage
[16:54:54] <SWPadnos> lots 0' sweaty iron
[16:55:02] <les_w> unvented gas heater?
[16:55:09] <les_w> they make a lot of water
[16:55:29] <SWPadnos> no heater (other than the portable Kerosene one), Vermont
[16:55:40] <les_w> yikes
[16:56:00] <SWPadnos> it it werent for the coolant and metal chips, I could sell bottled water
[16:56:21] <les_w> today was supposed to be snowy, but so far none
[16:56:56] <alex_joni> it was damn cold over here last night
[16:57:01] <alex_joni> -15 or so (C)
[16:57:21] <les_w> mountain tops are getting some snow...cold too
[16:57:25] <les_w> http://ils.unc.edu/parkproject/webcam/webcam.html
[17:00:21] <bill2or3> anyone have any experience with the Centent stepper drivers?
[17:00:55] <les_w> sorry not that brand...
[17:02:56] <bill2or3> they claim a 'Anti-Resonance' feature, there's some used ones on ebay I've bid on.
[17:03:41] <bill2or3> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7585877453 is a set of 5 Appli3ed Motion drivers at $130 too, I may bid if they dont get too high.
[17:06:24] <les_w> looking
[17:07:39] <bill2or3> here's the Centent's: http://www.centent.com/cn0142.htm
[17:09:06] <alex_joni> looks like a gecko to me
[17:09:10] <alex_joni> just a different package
[17:09:33] <bill2or3> yeah, I did read something that said they were the same.
[17:09:47] <bill2or3> maybe an older version, I guess.
[17:09:52] <alex_joni> yup
[17:09:55] <SWPadnos> aren't they atually more expensive than the Geckos?
[17:10:13] <alex_joni> "Look on e-bay for some drives by the name of OMC or CENTENT.
[17:10:14] <alex_joni> They are Older Gecko drives sold under another name. I know a guy who has several sets of them."
[17:10:15] <bill2or3> probablly if they're new, but I'm bidding on used ones.
[17:10:25] <alex_joni> SWPadnos: 5 for 130$ seems reasonable
[17:10:27] <alex_joni> ;)
[17:10:38] <bill2or3> anyone know the difference between the gecko G201 and G202?
[17:10:43] <SWPadnos> that is cheap, but the drives in that acution aren't the centent ones
[17:11:10] <bill2or3> besides "$20"
[17:11:13] <SWPadnos> the filter cap is built into the G202, plus I think you can't kill it by shorting motor leads, disconnecting the motor, etc.
[17:11:16] <bill2or3> the centent's are in another auction.
[17:11:57] <bill2or3> ahh, so no additional features that'll affect operation once it's set up.
[17:12:05] <SWPadnos> yep - the G202 has some of the features of the "vampire" drive tha Mariss has designed (an FPGA based drive)
[17:12:06] <alex_joni> yup, the G202 is the one with protection on shorts
[17:12:19] <SWPadnos> yes, if a stepper coil shorts, you'll lose a G201, a G202 will shut down
[17:12:27] <alex_joni> there is a smarter G201 (G210 I think), which has a multiplier
[17:12:41] <bill2or3> I almost ordered some the other night, until I realized maybe my judgment wasn't the best at 2:30am.
[17:12:52] <cncuser> bye
[17:12:53] <SWPadnos> yep - the G210 is a G201 + step multiplier, the G212 is the G202+step multiplier (G901)
[17:12:59] <alex_joni> bye cncuser
[17:13:05] <bill2or3> byee.
[17:13:17] <alex_joni> SWPadnos: any idea what's different between G901 and G902?
[17:13:30] <alex_joni> I KNOW what they are used for..
[17:13:36] <SWPadnos> it's some detail about which drives they get plugged into
[17:13:45] <alex_joni> but I'm wondering if a G902 might fit into a G201
[17:13:55] <alex_joni> I have the G902 in a G340 (DC)
[17:14:15] <SWPadnos> well - the website says that the G901 is for the stepper drives, and the G902 is for the servo drives
[17:14:26] <alex_joni> yup, I know that
[17:14:54] <alex_joni> * alex_joni decides to ask mariss
[17:15:09] <SWPadnos> it's just some detail about the polarity of the inputs or something - I think the question was answered on the Gecko list in the past year or so
[17:19:33] <alex_joni> it was? couldn't find it
[17:19:45] <SWPadnos> hmmm - one sec
[17:20:54] <SWPadnos> here it is:
[17:21:13] <SWPadnos> Simple. The G901 / G902 runs on 5VDC. The logic in the G201 works on
[17:21:14] <SWPadnos> +12VDC while the logic in the G320 is +5VDC.
[17:21:16] <SWPadnos> To accomodate both, the G901 carries a 78L05 +5VDC regulator.
[17:21:17] <SWPadnos> For the G201 step motor drives, it's used to bring the +12VDC down to
[17:21:19] <SWPadnos> +5VDC for what's required for it to operate.
[17:21:20] <SWPadnos> For G320s, whose logic runs at +5VDC anyway, this regulator is
[17:21:22] <SWPadnos> twisted out and thrown away.
[17:21:23] <alex_joni> got un url?
[17:21:24] <SWPadnos> Otherwise there is no difference.
[17:21:25] <SWPadnos> Mariss
[17:21:29] <alex_joni> an
[17:21:33] <SWPadnos> the thread title is "g902 manual", from 12/2/2004
[17:21:41] <SWPadnos> nope - I just searched local messages
[17:21:53] <alex_joni> ahh..
[17:22:07] <SWPadnos> you could search the archive for both G901 and G902
[17:23:01] <alex_joni> that's dec.02 ? or 12.Feb ?
[17:23:10] <SWPadnos> heh Dec 2
[17:23:28] <alex_joni> thanks, found it http://finance.groups.yahoo.com/group/geckodrive/message/3802
[17:23:35] <SWPadnos> cool
[17:23:55] <SWPadnos> just a detail about the internals of the units - 12V or 5V supply coltage
[17:24:25] <alex_joni> guess I need a 7805 ;)
[17:24:32] <SWPadnos> heh
[17:24:42] <SWPadnos> or some really good internal heatsinks :)
[17:25:20] <alex_joni> not sure if the chips won't barf
[17:25:42] <alex_joni> if there are TTL chips in there, running them at 12V might be problematic ;)
[17:25:49] <SWPadnos> true
[17:25:52] <alex_joni> btw, you had a different name back then :)
[17:26:07] <alex_joni> From: Stephen Wille Padnos <spadnos@...>
[17:26:36] <fenn> too many padnos's
[17:26:53] <SWPadnos> not so different
[17:27:03] <alex_joni> Wille != Willie
[17:27:16] <SWPadnos> Willie is wrong - I never spell it that way ;)
[17:27:24] <alex_joni> really?
[17:27:38] <SWPadnos> but no matter how many times I type it, it still gets misspelled about 90% of the time
[17:27:45] <SWPadnos> (by others transcribing)
[17:27:59] <SWPadnos> I get mail for Stephen Willlie Padnos even :)
[17:28:22] <SWPadnos> (or Sleplen Pedros, or Stephen Pegmos, or ... )
[17:28:50] <alex_joni> fenn: a few Padnos'es over here: http://www.geocities.com/hewlettalumni/wherenz.html
[17:29:01] <SWPadnos> one of these days, I'll fix the AUTHORS file, to make the W into Wille (since it's not a middle name)
[17:29:08] <alex_joni> so it's Wille or Willie?
[17:29:28] <alex_joni> ok, Wille I guess..
[17:29:33] <SWPadnos> there's a Psdnos Stell company in Michigan, and there's even a Padnos college (or a building at a college)
[17:29:37] <alex_joni> I always thought you says Willie
[17:29:41] <SWPadnos> steel, not stell
[17:29:49] <SWPadnos> geez
[17:29:56] <SWPadnos> Padnos Steel - there we go :)
[17:30:32] <SWPadnos> here we go - the Padnos school of Engineering: http://www.gvsu.edu/engineering/
[17:30:51] <SWPadnos> http://gvsu.edu/pcec/
[17:30:58] <alex_joni> http://www.js.spokane.wa.us/kimerav4n2/padnos.htm
[17:31:01] <fenn> agh everywhere i look there's FIRST robotics
[17:31:16] <alex_joni> Self-Fertilization ?
[17:31:18] <SWPadnos> that's my stepsister :)
[17:31:26] <alex_joni> SWPadnos: really?
[17:31:29] <SWPadnos> half-sister - whatever
[17:31:31] <SWPadnos> yep
[17:31:38] <alex_joni> lot cuter than you
[17:31:42] <SWPadnos> yep
[17:31:43] <alex_joni> you're not related :P
[17:31:44] <fenn> * fenn cackles
[17:31:46] <SWPadnos> but not in person :)
[17:31:49] <alex_joni> * alex_joni laughs
[17:31:50] <SWPadnos> same Father
[17:31:56] <SWPadnos> if that counts
[17:32:42] <SWPadnos> I guess she got the "weirdo artistic" genes ;)
[17:32:56] <alex_joni> how about you?
[17:33:03] <fenn> he just got the weirdo genes
[17:33:14] <SWPadnos> I got the weirdo analytic / scientific genes
[17:33:26] <SWPadnos> I'm the mad scientist type of my generation
[17:33:45] <alex_joni> heh..
[17:33:50] <alex_joni> so how about Wille
[17:34:00] <alex_joni> where does that come from? you said it's not a middle name
[17:34:06] <SWPadnos> that's my wife's maiden name. we both took both names when we got married
[17:34:15] <alex_joni> coo
[17:34:36] <SWPadnos> yep. lots of people have never heard of anyone doing that
[17:34:37] <fenn> how'd you decide who's name goes first?
[17:34:57] <SWPadnos> dunno - I guess it just ended up that way
[17:35:27] <SWPadnos> she changed her name first, and it's normal to use maiden_name married_name
[17:35:36] <SWPadnos> so I did the same thing, so we'd have the same last names
[17:35:38] <alex_joni> google likes you pretty much
[17:35:49] <alex_joni> Results 21 - 30 of about 937 for stephen wille padnos
[17:35:55] <SWPadnos> heh - I look like a gcc / linux kernel expert according to google ;)
[17:36:03] <alex_joni> indeed
[17:36:24] <alex_joni> but google likes me better ;)
[17:36:27] <alex_joni> ROFL
[17:36:31] <alex_joni> Results 1 - 10 of about 1,100,000 for alex joni
[17:36:32] <SWPadnos> heh
[17:36:56] <fenn> damn my evil twin has gotten the upper hand.. how many ben lipkowitz's could there be really?
[17:37:14] <SWPadnos> 472.9, +- 471
[17:39:13] <fenn> :)
[17:40:22] <fenn> i should go to spain to visit my alter ego
[17:40:29] <SWPadnos> heh
[17:44:35] <les_w> I have to cut a bunch of slabs of walnut....got talked into giving a wood finishing class at the high school for a local woodworker club
[17:44:54] <les_w> " basics of french polishing"
[17:46:36] <alex_joni> * alex_joni will be back in a while
[17:46:47] <SWPadnos> see you later
[17:47:17] <bill2or3> byeeee
[17:55:03] <fenn> something sounds vaguely dirty about "french polishing"
[17:55:08] <anonimasu> hehe
[17:55:13] <anonimasu> yeah
[17:55:24] <SWPadnos> it's a good sort of dirty though :)
[17:55:58] <les_w> haha
[17:56:11] <les_w> was just trowing wood on the fire
[17:56:22] <les_w> throwing
[17:56:28] <anonimasu> ^_^
[17:57:07] <les_w> A lot of hobby woodworkers seem to have trouble doing nice finishes
[18:14:00] <anonimasu> * anonimasu yawns
[18:23:36] <A-L-P-H-A> * A-L-P-H-A puts a fly in anonimasu's mouth
[18:23:40] <A-L-P-H-A> ;)
[18:30:12] <anonimasu> *burps'
[18:30:53] <alex_joni> back
[18:37:07] <anonimasu> wb
[18:38:41] <alex_joni> ty :)
[18:54:53] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni * 10emc2/tcl/scripts/ (Set_Coordinates.tcl emchelp.tcl): updated licensing info
[19:11:02] <orpheus> howdy
[19:11:36] <alex_joni> howdy
[19:11:43] <orpheus> anyone have any useful resources for doing a bdi on a machine that won't boo from cd?
[19:11:49] <orpheus> *boot
[19:12:00] <alex_joni> orpheus: if you want my advice: install a stock debian
[19:12:11] <SWPadnos> you might be able to use a grub / syslinux boot disk
[19:12:15] <alex_joni> debian has installers from floppy
[19:12:22] <orpheus> yeah
[19:12:38] <SWPadnos> I haven't had any luck with that lately, though
[19:12:42] <alex_joni> install debian till it suit you, then follow the wiki
[19:12:52] <alex_joni> apt-get install emc, and you're done :P
[19:12:54] <orpheus> how about the kernel tho? anyon have .deb's of a rt kernel?
[19:12:59] <SWPadnos> (trying to install from a SCSI CDROM on a mcachine that doesn't quite have BIOS support for CD boot)
[19:13:05] <alex_joni> yup, they are available
[19:13:20] <alex_joni> wiki.linuxcnc.org has the exact steps
[19:13:31] <orpheus> SW: laptop w/ no cd drive
[19:13:31] <alex_joni> you need to add a repository, then apt-get install emc
[19:13:38] <orpheus> k
[19:13:38] <alex_joni> and it'll pull the kernel & rtai too
[19:13:40] <orpheus> cool
[19:13:57] <alex_joni> orpheus: older laptop?
[19:14:09] <orpheus> i'm a debian user already, so cool
[19:14:17] <orpheus> yeah
[19:14:24] <alex_joni> if you have debian already you are almost set :)
[19:14:27] <orpheus> 300 mhz
[19:14:30] <SWPadnos> net install tjen - that should be interesting
[19:14:34] <SWPadnos> *then
[19:14:49] <alex_joni> no need, if he already has deb
[19:15:08] <orpheus> sorry for typing so slow... broken hand
[19:15:17] <SWPadnos> 300 MHz is a little slow for running a milling machine, unless you have external hardware for step generation / servo interface
[19:15:18] <alex_joni> ouch.. skateboarding?
[19:15:23] <orpheus> different machine
[19:15:38] <orpheus> biking, hit a car
[19:15:43] <SWPadnos> bummer
[19:15:46] <alex_joni> hope you broke the car
[19:15:52] <fenn> u-lock justice
[19:16:08] <orpheus> yeah well, neither of us stopped like we shoul have
[19:16:32] <orpheus> i put my right pedal throug his door
[19:16:43] <orpheus> we called it even
[19:17:44] <alex_joni> orpheus: coo
[19:18:30] <orpheus> SW: is it really gonna be too slow? i have no clue what i'm doing here, just looking to convert a mill, and figured a live install would be informative
[19:18:48] <alex_joni> 300 MHz is a bit slow
[19:19:05] <alex_joni> I do run emc2 on a 300 MHz box, but it's not very nice
[19:19:07] <fenn> * fenn was hoping to convert a pentium 100mhz
[19:19:11] <SWPadnos> it depends on what you want to do, and how you expect to do it (but you knew that already :) )
[19:19:13] <alex_joni> I forward X on another machine
[19:19:25] <alex_joni> and run the X server over there..
[19:19:41] <orpheus> makes sense
[19:19:52] <fenn> maybe i should port keystick over to emc2 since nobody else seems to want it
[19:19:54] <SWPadnos> fenn, there's a bookk called "How to Write Your Own 32-Bit Operating System" - maye you could use that for a P100 :)
[19:20:11] <orpheus> heh
[19:20:25] <SWPadnos> it's not the UI that kills you, it's the RT latency / atatinable interrupt rate
[19:20:28] <fenn> * fenn scratches his head..
[19:20:32] <SWPadnos> (though the UI doesn't help much)
[19:20:52] <SWPadnos> on a P100, I'd use some DOS program, like TurboCNC
[19:21:04] <SWPadnos> or extra hardware to take care of the "real work"
[19:21:31] <fenn> i would be controlling servos.. how bad could the latency be?
[19:21:46] <SWPadnos> 25-100 uS, maybe more
[19:22:02] <orpheus> just... mill slower
[19:22:17] <SWPadnos> luckily, some things are fairly constant, like the amount of time it takes to do an outb instruction
[19:22:22] <les_w> I get 2k servo update on a P200...
[19:22:33] <SWPadnos> you have an STG card, right?
[19:22:51] <les_w> right...and that's the limiting factor...isa
[19:23:10] <les_w> so higher cpu would not help unless I get another card
[19:23:33] <fenn> SWPadnos: what were you talking about 32bit OS?
[19:23:34] <SWPadnos> right - the near-constant-time inb/outb does that to you
[19:23:46] <SWPadnos> Linux may not cut it on that CPU ;)
[19:23:51] <fenn> i've already got linux on it
[19:23:55] <SWPadnos> RT?
[19:23:57] <fenn> no
[19:24:07] <orpheus> are there any interfaces that would probably work with a 300mhz?
[19:24:11] <alex_joni> RS
[19:24:18] <SWPadnos> it'll work, but you'll need hardware to do the motor driver control
[19:24:18] <alex_joni> RS=Real Slow
[19:24:18] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni * 10emc2/scripts/emc.in: export the EMC2_BIN_DIR
[19:24:28] <alex_joni> ROFLMAO :)
[19:24:34] <alex_joni> fenn: just teasing
[19:24:42] <les_w> I really need to get a motenc and sell the stg or stick it on something else
[19:25:05] <fenn> i really just want to see if all this stuff about laptops is true.. dont have any other laptops with parallel ports
[19:25:13] <SWPadnos> orpheus, pico systems Universal Stepper controller, Mesa Electronics M5I20, a PCI Vigilant or Motenc card
[19:25:17] <fenn> would be a lot easier to mount a laptop than a crt + keyboard + mouse
[19:25:20] <les_w> 2k is fine for a bridgeport
[19:25:23] <orpheus> thnks
[19:25:33] <alex_joni> fenn: there are parport cards for laptops these days
[19:25:38] <SWPadnos> but then, you're limited to the USC with a laptop, since it's the only one that isn't an internal card
[19:25:56] <fenn> alex_joni: this laptop doesn't like most pcmcia cards
[19:26:02] <orpheus> thanks yall, it's cool that there are people in this channel, i think i'll come back when i have 2 hands to type with...
[19:26:10] <alex_joni> I was talking about modern laptops
[19:26:18] <alex_joni> orpheus: this is where you are wrong
[19:26:24] <alex_joni> orpheus: we are not people
[19:26:36] <orpheus> do tell
[19:26:37] <SWPadnos> actually, you could get a PCMCIA analog/digital I/O card, and write a driver for it (like the ones from Measurement Computing or national Instruments)
[19:26:42] <fenn> speak for yourself alex.. i take the intentional stance
[19:26:50] <alex_joni> orpheus: but you are welcomed anytime
[19:26:51] <SWPadnos> turing test, baby :)
[19:27:23] <alex_joni> alan?
[19:27:36] <fenn> SWPadnos: just using the PPMC drivers seems a lot easier
[19:27:44] <SWPadnos> yes it does
[19:27:50] <SWPadnos> it's also probably cheaper
[19:27:53] <SWPadnos> $250
[19:28:12] <fenn> i meant the driver software
[19:28:16] <SWPadnos> ad it has stepper / encoder interfaces, rather than just I/O bits
[19:28:23] <fenn> but yeah buying one would be easier than building one.. but i wanna build one
[19:28:27] <SWPadnos> how do you mean?
[19:28:37] <SWPadnos> you won't be building a USC any time soon, I suspect
[19:28:42] <fenn> like icee's board.. it uses the same protocol
[19:28:45] <SWPadnos> (not to put a demper on your enthusiasm)
[19:28:52] <SWPadnos> damper
[19:29:04] <fenn> it wont be implemented the same way, but i'll have basically the same thing
[19:29:08] <SWPadnos> you mean it uses a parallel port - not the same protocol
[19:29:11] <fenn> nowhere near the performance
[19:29:11] <SWPadnos> right
[19:29:29] <SWPadnos> well - you can only get 2 or 2.5 MHz from the USC ;)
[19:29:30] <fenn> well it uses EPP and probably a similar protocol
[19:29:48] <SWPadnos> no - I'd bet that the actual data will be a worlf different
[19:29:56] <fenn> why?
[19:30:00] <SWPadnos> if it's not, come over here so I can hit someone with a hammer
[19:30:26] <SWPadnos> the USC / UPM is meant to operate in a system that may have multiple cards
[19:30:39] <fenn> that was my original idea
[19:30:42] <SWPadnos> so Jon split the256-byte EPP address space into 16 slots of 16 bytes
[19:30:59] <fenn> yep
[19:31:00] <SWPadnos> the USC and UPM each use two slots, or 32 bytes
[19:31:10] <SWPadnos> there's no real need to limit yourself to that.
[19:31:19] <SWPadnos> you can make counters that are 32-bit, for example
[19:31:21] <fenn> what do they need 32 bytes for?
[19:31:24] <SWPadnos> (rather than 24)
[19:31:36] <SWPadnos> it's 4 axis + 24 I/O
[19:31:53] <fenn> 24 bit is way plenty anyway
[19:32:00] <SWPadnos> 3 bytes for I/O, a couple for control, 4x3 bytes for encoder counters, 4x2 for step rates ...
[19:32:03] <SWPadnos> no it isn't
[19:32:40] <fenn> 24 bit is 1677 inches at .0001 resolution
[19:32:56] <SWPadnos> I have 40,000 steps per inch
[19:32:56] <fenn> or am i missing something?
[19:33:15] <fenn> you have more than 400 inches of travel?
[19:33:26] <SWPadnos> no :)
[19:33:33] <jepler> surely handling the overflow in the PC-side software is not terribly difficult
[19:33:43] <fenn> that too
[19:33:58] <SWPadnos> well - you're right. it may take less time to do that than another inb ;)
[19:34:00] <jepler> in fact, you only need to have an external counter that is at least 2 * maximum travel per polling interval
[19:34:12] <SWPadnos> true enough
[19:35:11] <SWPadnos> I just had some trouble with the operation of the device itself, the register set may be OK
[19:35:26] <jepler> The X protocol is an example of one where the wire-width of a counter is 16 bits, but the true width is 32 bits, though in the X protocol, the serial number only increases which makes it a bit easier
[19:35:28] <SWPadnos> writing the drivers for it was interesting, due to some oddities I can't remember
[19:35:36] <fenn> so each card drives 4 axes? i was thinking 1 card per axis
[19:35:43] <SWPadnos> yes, each is 4
[19:35:59] <SWPadnos> you probably don't want the control overhead that you'll get with multiple cards
[19:36:02] <alex_joni> oh. jeff
[19:36:07] <jepler> oh alex?
[19:36:09] <alex_joni> just the guy I needed :)
[19:36:18] <alex_joni> quick.. hide <(
[19:36:20] <SWPadnos> (ie, an address select for every axis)
[19:36:20] <alex_joni> ;)
[19:36:25] <alex_joni> jepler: hello
[19:36:33] <SWPadnos> oh boy
[19:36:34] <jepler> alex_joni: It's nice to be needed.
[19:36:50] <alex_joni> yeah, but not for this stuff :/
[19:36:56] <fenn> SWP dont i need an address anyway for EPP to work?
[19:37:04] <fenn> for stuff like homing
[19:37:08] <alex_joni> jepler: can we move to emc-devel ?
[19:37:34] <SWPadnos> yes, but you can use a single address cycle, then have the location auto-increment for successive reads/writes
[19:38:24] <SWPadnos> if you had to select the address for each byte, it would make the transfer take roughly 4x as long
[19:38:33] <fenn> yeah
[19:38:57] <fenn> there will be a communications microcontroller that will know the protocol
[19:39:21] <fenn> it acts sorta like a network switch
[19:39:30] <SWPadnos> that's good, but it doesn't help the addressing thing on the PC end
[19:40:00] <fenn> so how would you do it with one board?
[19:40:30] <SWPadnos> one board for multiple axes?
[19:40:48] <fenn> well, i dont really understand how you would get rid of the overhead
[19:41:22] <SWPadnos> the ppmc driver uses an auto-increment addressing mode
[19:41:36] <fenn> does it reset the base address each servo cycle?
[19:41:46] <SWPadnos> we keep track of the address range that needs to be read or written, and the
[19:41:52] <SWPadnos> yes
[19:42:02] <fenn> ok so same idea
[19:42:04] <SWPadnos> you don't know what other hardware may be on the port, or what drivers are using it
[19:42:25] <SWPadnos> but you do it once, then do successive reads or writes
[19:42:51] <SWPadnos> with multiple cards, I think you have to do the address select for each card, to activate that card
[19:43:33] <fenn> i would just step through all the cards each servo cycle
[19:43:38] <fenn> on the microcontroller end of things
[19:44:19] <fenn> like "here's the data" in one big block
[19:44:33] <SWPadnos> yes, and if you have say 8 bytes per card (next power of 2 after 2 control, 2 encoder, 2 step rate), then you'll be doing at least 3 addressing outb for 6 or 8 inb
[19:44:33] <fenn> the micro chops it up and delivers it to the right card
[19:44:43] <SWPadnos> roughly 33-50% overhead
[19:45:11] <SWPadnos> hmmm - that'll be interesting
[19:46:07] <SWPadnos> you'll have an interesting initial bootstrap process
[19:46:21] <fenn> the first thing you send is basically a configuration file
[19:46:38] <SWPadnos> how does the PC know what's there?
[19:46:41] <fenn> you tell it
[19:46:55] <SWPadnos> when loading the driver?
[19:47:01] <fenn> i hadn't thought that far ahead yet
[19:47:08] <SWPadnos> keep thinking ;)
[19:47:12] <fenn> probably insmod parameters
[19:47:19] <fenn> or however hal modules get loaded in the future
[19:47:44] <SWPadnos> the ppmc driver actually finds anything attached to the parallel port (ports, actually), and exprts pins for all found functions
[19:47:59] <fenn> that sounds like a lot of work for little gain
[19:48:07] <SWPadnos> you could have 24 of these cards on one machine
[19:48:19] <fenn> it is pretty cool though
[19:48:22] <SWPadnos> no - what happens if you make an encoder-only card?
[19:48:36] <SWPadnos> or a PWM card?
[19:48:40] <SWPadnos> or a step generator ...
[19:48:40] <fenn> does it only do the encoder-read function that thread?
[19:49:01] <SWPadnos> there's a single read function and a single write function for all cards
[19:49:13] <SWPadnos> (ie, 2 functions, regardless of what's connected)
[19:50:12] <SWPadnos> sorry - I almost always think in terms of deliverable product, rather than something for me to use (or one-off stuff)
[19:50:17] <fenn> what do you think of using the i2c bus to talk between cards?
[19:50:28] <SWPadnos> so I think about what all the dumb users will do later, and it makes things a lot more complicated
[19:50:36] <fenn> well its probably better that way
[19:50:45] <fenn> i would be cursing my crappy implementation
[19:50:51] <SWPadnos> I don't like it for off-card comms
[19:51:20] <SWPadnos> it's not meant to be a long distance bus, it's meant for inter-chip communication (Inter Integrated Circuit = IIC = I2C)
[19:51:37] <SWPadnos> like on the same PCB
[19:51:42] <fenn> well all the cards would be in the same box
[19:52:12] <SWPadnos> it could work, but I wouldn't design a system that way -just my personal preference
[19:52:20] <SWPadnos> it's limited to 400kbits/sec, right?
[19:52:24] <fenn> no idea
[19:52:30] <SWPadnos> (or have they extended the spec?)
[19:52:32] <SWPadnos> ok
[19:52:48] <fenn> it's built in for avr's
[19:53:04] <fenn> i could use SPI or pseudo-rs232 also
[19:53:51] <fenn> still have a lot to learn
[19:56:41] <SWPadnos> SPI is OK, and can run at 20 MHz or so, I believe
[19:56:58] <SWPadnos> but I still don't like it for off-board comms.
[19:57:14] <SWPadnos> you need to think about static protection and the like when you go through a connector
[19:57:26] <SWPadnos> and what happens if the user plugs/unplugs with power applied, etc.
[19:57:39] <SWPadnos> those questions go away when things are on the same board
[19:57:41] <fenn> hmmm "dont do that"
[19:58:04] <SWPadnos> but what happens when they do? ;)
[19:58:19] <fenn> designing for operator error is tough
[19:58:20] <SWPadnos> static is a killer even powered down
[19:58:40] <fenn> arent pretty much all new chips supposed to be more or less static-proof?
[19:58:44] <fenn> due to CE regs
[19:58:48] <SWPadnos> low signal quality, longer distances, etc can all screw up this kind of bus
[20:01:07] <SWPadnos> though the PIC and AVR are both programmed using an SPI bus
[21:13:20] <giacus> wow
[21:13:25] <giacus> alex_joni: http://digilander.libero.it/jackydgl0/02.jpg
[21:13:40] <giacus> how it seems to you this ? :P
[21:13:57] <giacus> ;P
[21:14:32] <SWPadnos> you may want to overlap the frames more to reduce edge distortion (especially necessary with wide shots)
[21:14:55] <giacus> hey SWPadnos , i'm learning something :P
[21:15:03] <giacus> yeah ..
[21:15:22] <SWPadnos> I see the right side seam (though it's pretty good) - it's in the second large building on the waterfront
[21:15:38] <SWPadnos> the giveaway is the angle change, plus a slightly different exposure
[21:15:53] <SWPadnos> (unless I'm wrong :) )
[21:16:17] <giacus> look at how was the first try http://digilander.libero.it/jackydgl0/panoramica.jpg
[21:16:20] <giacus> LOL
[21:16:38] <anonimasu> lightyears better
[21:16:39] <anonimasu> :D
[21:16:45] <giacus> :P
[21:16:51] <SWPadnos> heh
[21:16:57] <SWPadnos> you needa RoundShot :)
[21:16:58] <SWPadnos> need a
[21:17:04] <SWPadnos> or a Noblex
[21:17:17] <giacus> should be nice
[21:17:23] <anonimasu> hm, machine one
[21:17:35] <SWPadnos> har
[21:20:52] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni * 10emc2/tcl/bin/halconfig.tcl: made some changes to allow halconfig to be run from tkemc, and for installed systems. hope I didn't break anything
[21:24:18] <skunkworks> I think I may have finally had an unsuccessful install of emc/emc2 ;)
[21:24:42] <skunkworks> the splash screen goes away on emc2 and the computer either locks up or reboots ;)
[21:24:43] <SWPadnos> is that a good thing?
[21:25:05] <skunkworks> first time. I am really happy on how easy it has been.
[21:25:07] <SWPadnos> increase the BASE_PERIOD in the ini file
[21:25:53] <skunkworks> could it be that easy. Will check. This is a 1.5ghz pentium.
[21:26:01] <SWPadnos> hmmm
[21:26:21] <SWPadnos> the BASE_PERIOD being too fast is what usually causes lockups, so it's an easy check
[21:26:30] <skunkworks> could be my video as I just pick the generic gforce when it was installing
[21:26:38] <SWPadnos> but that machine should be fine with the 50 uS default
[21:26:40] <skunkworks> right - I have had that happen before
[21:27:01] <skunkworks> the menu is pretty cool. first time I have used it
[21:27:33] <SWPadnos> there may be a recently introduced problem with emc2, since there seem to be a few people having trouble with BASE_PERIOD lately
[21:27:36] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni * 10emc2/tcl/tkemc.tcl: added halconfig to the scriptsmenu
[21:27:41] <SWPadnos> heh - that's a nice thing
[21:27:56] <SWPadnos> and halconfig will be excellent when it's done as well
[21:28:04] <alex_joni> it's almost done
[21:28:14] <alex_joni> nice work from ray
[21:28:21] <SWPadnos> yep - looking at it now :)
[21:28:23] <skunkworks> yah - I had just downloaded the latest as of saturday and had issues with the period
[21:28:37] <skunkworks> Don't know if it is me yet or not
[21:28:44] <alex_joni> skunkworks: tried an older one and it worked ok?
[21:29:43] <SWPadnos> hmmm - need to make a tree click only add watches if the clicked node is a leaf
[21:30:46] <skunkworks> alex: - not yet.
[21:30:52] <alex_joni> ok sam
[21:31:27] <skunkworks> can you force quit a program in linux?
[21:31:35] <skunkworks> say something hangs?
[21:31:48] <alex_joni> sure
[21:31:58] <alex_joni> kill -9 <process_id>
[21:32:12] <alex_joni> you can 'ps aux' for a list of processes
[21:32:26] <alex_joni> or maybe killall -9 'process name'
[21:32:41] <skunkworks> ;) Ok - I will just hit the reset.
[21:33:23] <SWPadnos> that's not as good an idea
[21:33:28] <skunkworks> something else - set the period to .0001 and still locking
[21:33:37] <alex_joni> that's bad...
[21:33:41] <SWPadnos> what config are you using?
[21:33:47] <skunkworks> stepper_inch
[21:33:51] <alex_joni> try sim
[21:33:54] <skunkworks> ok
[21:34:17] <SWPadnos> hmmm - does the run script kill halconfig instances?
[21:34:29] <alex_joni> don't think so.. but it should
[21:34:34] <SWPadnos> I agree ;)
[21:34:35] <alex_joni> although...
[21:34:46] <alex_joni> halconfig should run without emc, only with hal
[21:34:49] <SWPadnos> it's Bad to exit from emc with halconfig running
[21:35:00] <alex_joni> ok.. I'll do it now
[21:35:11] <SWPadnos> because the run script kills off the halcmd that halcmd keeps open
[21:35:22] <SWPadnos> that halconfig keeps open, that is
[21:35:57] <SWPadnos> it's killable, but stops responding
[21:36:04] <alex_joni> hrmmm...
[21:36:04] <SWPadnos> to GUI stuff
[21:36:11] <alex_joni> hard to kill halconfig..
[21:36:21] <alex_joni> it runs as wish
[21:36:26] <alex_joni> killing all wish is not nice
[21:36:36] <SWPadnos> hmmm
[21:36:38] <skunkworks> sim does the same thing - mouse locks up and I have no keyboard input
[21:36:46] <skunkworks> I must have hosed something
[21:36:56] <SWPadnos> yes, you need to find the line using grep, and awk/sed for the pid
[21:37:02] <skunkworks> or my hardware isn't set up correctly
[21:38:13] <SWPadnos> ok - a stepper_inch (checked out maybe an hour ago) works fine on my celeron 500
[21:38:33] <alex_joni> skunkworks: you might want to try rtai examples
[21:38:33] <SWPadnos> I suppose I should detach the USC before sending any steps though ;)
[21:39:25] <skunkworks> yah - the only thing I am not sure about was the video - it defaulted to vesa even though it was a gforce card. I changed it to gforce (I bet that was my mistake)
[21:39:29] <skunkworks> rtai?
[21:39:45] <alex_joni> what distro are you running?
[21:39:48] <cradek> try all six tests in the rtai testsuite
[21:39:52] <skunkworks> 4.30
[21:39:56] <skunkworks> bdi
[21:39:57] <SWPadnos> there have been rumors of nvidia cards not playing nice with RT
[21:40:01] <skunkworks> magma
[21:40:10] <alex_joni> not sure testsuite is in there..
[21:40:16] <SWPadnos> that's what I'm running
[21:40:16] <alex_joni> check /usr/realtime something
[21:40:18] <cradek> oh
[21:40:37] <cradek> SWPadnos: the closed-source driver from nvidia certainly doesn't work right with realtime
[21:40:38] <alex_joni> SWPadnos: any rtai testsuite in there?
[21:40:53] <SWPadnos> not seeing it - looking around a bt
[21:40:55] <SWPadnos> bit
[21:41:54] <skunkworks> rebooting ;)
[21:42:22] <SWPadnos> there is a calibration program, but not the latency-test and other files I'm expecting
[21:42:32] <alex_joni> bleah
[21:43:20] <SWPadnos> rtai-config, rtai-info, rtai-load, calibrate, calibration-helper, run
[21:43:27] <SWPadnos> those are the executables
[21:45:01] <dave-e> hi swp
[21:45:16] <SWPadnos> hi there
[21:45:23] <dave-e> need help...
[21:45:47] <dave-e> just loaded bdi438 and find that there is not a gcc installed.
[21:45:59] <SWPadnos> uh - can't help you there
[21:46:00] <dave-e> where do I get the correct version
[21:46:06] <SWPadnos> but I guarantee that gcc is on the CD
[21:46:13] <SWPadnos> apt-cdrom add
[21:46:27] <dave-e> well then with luck I should be able to fix the problem.
[21:46:30] <SWPadnos> I'd be very surprised if gcc weren't installed
[21:47:03] <alex_joni> dave-e: apt-cdrom add
[21:47:20] <alex_joni> apt-get install gcc make ...
[21:47:26] <alex_joni> most of it should be in the wiki
[21:47:30] <alex_joni> maybe under 4.30
[21:47:38] <alex_joni> but 4.38 should install those by default
[21:47:44] <alex_joni> what kind of install did you chose?
[21:47:58] <dave-e> non-custom...ie regular install
[21:48:19] <dave-e> no devel option as least not that I saw
[21:48:31] <SWPadnos> ah - I think there's an option to install development tools (which I always check)
[21:48:44] <SWPadnos> or "extra tools" or something
[21:48:56] <dave-e> hmmmm.... guess I missed that or certainly would have checked it.
[21:49:10] <dave-e> be back in awhile
[21:49:21] <SWPadnos> see you after the intalls ;)
[21:49:24] <SWPadnos> installs
[21:50:44] <SWPadnos> actually - I've got to run as well. be back later sometime
[21:50:47] <SWPadnos> SWPadnos is now known as SWP_Away
[21:52:48] <CIA-8> 03alex_joni * 10emc2/scripts/emc.in: stop halconfig on shutdown if it was loaded, as leaving it on leads to bad things.
[21:53:04] <alex_joni> ok guys.. I'm off to bed
[21:53:06] <alex_joni> night all
[21:53:12] <Jymmm> G;night alex_joni
[21:56:51] <anonimasu> night
[22:00:50] <dave-e> well the install was almost painless but: I seem to be missing the /etc/include or where ever the default is... gcc complianed about stdio.h, etc
[22:05:48] <les_w> oh, hi dave
[22:08:02] <dave-e> hi les
[22:09:02] <dave-e> brb
[22:09:52] <les_w> k
[22:10:36] <Jymmm> Howdy Folks!
[22:10:49] <les_w> hey jymmm
[22:11:54] <Jymmm> how ya doin les?
[22:12:20] <dave-e> I'm back
[22:12:48] <les_w> oh, ok. I am setting up some stuff. I was talked into giving some wood finishing lessons for a local wooodworker group
[22:12:53] <dave-e> still confused...absolutely none of the standard .h files on system
[22:16:53] <les_w> logger on...
[22:17:34] <les_w> still have not done anything with my log....4 foot x 16 foot red oak
[22:17:52] <les_w> oh well...it ain't gonna walk away
[22:18:00] <dave-e> no joke
[22:18:04] <dave-e> might float tho
[22:18:42] <les_w> we have to drag it out to saw it
[22:18:59] <les_w> but our wood miser can only do 36" diameter
[22:19:20] <dave-e> too bad
[22:19:24] <les_w> would be a shame to make it firewood
[22:19:30] <skunkworks> 1/4 it with a chain saw ;)
[22:19:33] <dave-e> bad idea
[22:19:37] <skunkworks> 4 passes
[22:19:57] <les_w> with a rip chain perhaps...
[22:19:57] <dave-e> pretty fancy firewood
[22:20:10] <les_w> but I am seeing if someone else can saw it
[22:20:44] <les_w> oh it's good...130 years old. The outer stuff is firsts and seconds...clear wood
[22:20:45] <skunkworks> nice if you could find a large bandsaw mill.
[22:20:48] <skunkworks> less waist
[22:20:51] <skunkworks> waste
[22:20:53] <les_w> yeah
[22:21:08] <les_w> 2500 board feet on the stump
[22:21:18] <skunkworks> we could probably do 4 ft - would take a few turns
[22:21:28] <les_w> yeah?
[22:22:52] <skunkworks> I think I showed you - have to ask what he has sawed - http://www.electronicsam.com/images/KandT/DSC02968.JPG
[22:23:05] <les_w> Well anyway the turkey calls are a little disappointing this year
[22:23:25] <les_w> my customer has some financial problems I guess
[22:23:28] <les_w> some
[22:23:34] <les_w> but not like last year
[22:24:04] <les_w> I am looking at alternatives to keep the cnc spindle turning
[22:24:26] <les_w> I think we will do a run of a few hundred of something
[22:24:34] <les_w> some furniture item
[22:24:41] <les_w> trying to decide
[22:24:46] <les_w> what's hot?
[22:25:32] <skunkworks> good question
[22:26:01] <les_w> I need to research it
[22:26:13] <les_w> it need to be cnc
[22:26:31] <les_w> and it needs to use the power of the new spindle system
[22:26:56] <les_w> same deal as turkey calls...
[22:27:03] <les_w> one day of cnc...
[22:27:27] <les_w> supports a weeks of my guys sanding , finishing, and shipping
[22:27:41] <les_w> the other 4 days I do engineering...
[22:34:14] <les_w> oopsie
[22:34:26] <les_w> blue screen o'death
[22:37:45] <les_w> Anyway, contemplating direct competition with Ikea/ Badcock chinese junk furniture
[22:38:04] <les_w> conventional wisdom says no way, right?
[22:52:38] <websys> les_w - do you sell table top routers?
[22:53:34] <websys> sorry - something that would handle a 4x8 sheet?
[22:53:46] <fenn> thats not exactly tabletop
[22:54:28] <websys> pool table?
[22:58:12] <dave-e> thanks alex, swp... with no more than the usual stumbling over my feet I now have a functioning gcc.
[23:00:37] <les_w> websys we are considering maketing routers yes
[23:01:27] <les_w> we have some technical problems to overcome though
[23:13:38] <websys> any idea when you might be ready to market?
[23:46:46] <CIA-8> 03cradek * 10emc2/debian/emc2.files: I didn't mean to commit this