#emc | Logs for 2005-09-28

[00:00:23] <Jacky^> just change the passwd ***** on line 25
[00:00:34] <Jacky^> to identify with the server
[00:00:52] <Jacky^> and the all nick* of course
[00:00:55] <Jacky^> :)
[00:01:41] <Jymmm> yeah.... we dont need two Jacky^'s in here =)
[00:01:41] <Jacky^> youll love it
[00:01:48] <Jacky^> hehe
[00:04:33] <Jacky^> Jymmm: you tried it ?
[00:04:35] <Jacky^> :P
[00:04:39] <Jacky^> try ..
[00:05:27] <Jymmm> nope. I like kvirc.... simpler to use, much like mirc
[00:05:32] <Jacky^> remove the numbers from lines when paste
[00:05:47] <Jacky^> Jymmm: bleahhh
[00:05:49] <Jacky^> :D
[00:06:50] <anna_emc> night
[00:06:52] <Jacky^> another great irc cliect is .. Erc
[00:06:54] <anna_emc> all
[00:07:00] <Jacky^> anna_emc: going to sleep ?
[00:07:14] <anna_emc> yes
[00:07:15] <Jacky^> office time tomorrow ? :P
[00:07:17] <Jacky^> ok..
[00:07:22] <Jacky^> happy night
[00:08:16] <Jymmm> Jacky^ Quit flurting with my woman!
[00:08:22] <Jymmm> flirting
[00:08:23] <Jacky^> :\
[00:08:44] <Jymmm> rptf
[00:08:46] <Jymmm> rotf
[00:09:03] <Jacky^> she must work tomorrow ..
[00:09:09] <Jacky^> its right
[00:09:11] <Jacky^> :(
[00:09:26] <Jymmm> no, she's coming over here tomorrow. Work is just the excuse
[00:09:35] <Jacky^> nahh
[00:09:55] <Jacky^> she work from 7am to 16 pm
[00:09:55] <Jymmm> Yep, just like last time. You want to see the photos?
[00:10:10] <Jacky^> here are 00:47 am ..
[00:10:29] <Jacky^> Jymmm: sure
[00:10:39] <Jymmm> Jack_emc2 you would, you pervert!!!
[00:10:44] <Jymmm> Jacky^ you would, you pervert!!!
[00:10:45] <Jacky^> haha
[00:10:48] <Jymmm> lol
[00:10:50] <Jacky^> :(
[00:10:53] <Jacky^> doh
[00:10:57] <Jacky^> nahh
[00:11:25] <Jacky^> Jymmm: just kidding
[00:11:40] <Jacky^> the life its hard enough :(
[00:11:53] <Jymmm> I know, just playing with you is all =)
[00:12:02] <Jacky^> :)
[00:40:38] <Jacky^> anyone has seen robin_sz around ?
[00:40:49] <Jacky^> i would ask for a plasma cutter
[00:41:05] <Jacky^> my cousin is going to start his machine :P
[00:41:30] <Jacky^> start building .. :\
[00:43:32] <Jacky^> Jymmm: sleeping ? :P
[01:02:00] <Jacky^> Jymmm: http://www.capriweb.com/web/Itineraries/itinerary.php?lan=Ita&id=16
[01:02:07] <Jacky^> see the tower ?
[01:02:19] <Jacky^> here is where anna_emc work :P
[01:06:34] <Jymmm> Jacky^ here's where I work =) http://pinkpoodle.com/
[01:07:01] <Jacky^> ouch
[01:09:39] <Jymmm> Jacky^: I'm the official bikini inspector. But, Igot fired becasue there are no bikini's to inspect =(
[01:09:45] <Jacky^> :(
[01:09:53] <Jacky^> ok ..
[01:10:13] <Jymmm> (it's a joke)
[01:10:26] <Jacky^> Jymmm: [nolog] here is where i work.. (adult only) http://www.cazzatelle.com/immagini/52.JPG
[01:10:29] <Jacky^> :D
[01:11:08] <Jymmm> Jacky^: If that's you, I think I have an idea why anna likes you =)
[01:11:14] <Jacky^> hahaha
[01:11:16] <Jacky^> :D
[02:21:16] <Jacky^> umpf ..
[02:22:30] <Jacky^> bed time
[02:22:34] <Jacky^> G night
[03:31:14] <Jymmm> LawrenceG you ol' hound dawg you!
[03:32:38] <jcolley> 'lo all
[03:33:13] <jcolley> looking for a recommendation on a control card
[03:35:11] <Jymmm> any details?
[03:37:00] <jcolley> well...
[03:37:06] <jcolley> 5 axis machine
[03:37:13] <jcolley> xyzac
[03:37:25] <jcolley> rotary encoders on servos
[03:37:53] <jcolley> would like to use dual loop feedback with linear encoders too
[03:38:02] <jcolley> *pipe dream*
[03:38:12] <jcolley> have all my drivers
[03:38:16] <Jymmm> let me guess... and you want to spend less than $200 ?
[03:38:23] <jcolley> just trying to pick a card for EMC
[03:38:29] <jcolley> no, just not more than 2l
[03:38:30] <jcolley> er 2k
[03:38:42] <Jymmm> ah, ok.
[03:38:45] <jcolley> i'm being realistic ;)
[03:39:21] <Jymmm> *I* don't know, but I know others will... maybe try Les if nobody else is around to respond.
[03:39:55] <jcolley> i posted on cced and cnczone, maybe on sourceforge tomorrow
[03:39:58] <Jymmm> I'm just using puny steppers
[03:40:03] <jcolley> just trying to get some feedback from people
[03:40:25] <Jymmm> I know for a fact that Les would lead you in the right direction.
[03:40:36] <jcolley> probably asleep
[03:40:45] <jcolley> my luck
[03:41:02] <Jymmm> More than likely in the music room with a sifter if brandy
[03:41:09] <Jymmm> or two ro four
[03:42:15] <Jymmm> but not like you're going to be buying tomorrow or anything
[03:42:19] <jcolley> no
[03:42:21] <jcolley> not at all
[03:42:36] <jcolley> i have put off building anything until i have everything
[03:42:46] <jcolley> and this is my last big thing
[03:42:49] <Jymmm> you know about us digital
[03:42:58] <jcolley> then i actually have to get off my ass and build
[03:43:04] <jcolley> us d?
[03:43:14] <jcolley> i've heard of them
[03:43:16] <Jymmm> usdigital.com makes encoders
[03:43:20] <jcolley> right
[03:43:32] <Jymmm> what are you using for amps?
[03:43:48] <jcolley> compumotor tq10
[03:44:13] <Jymmm> ah, ok.
[03:44:24] <jcolley> on sm232 servos
[03:44:59] <jcolley> hopefully they will have enough oomph if i get the rest of the design right
[03:45:00] <Jymmm> thats all greek to me, the other folks on here know all that.
[03:45:04] <Jymmm> lol
[03:45:19] <Jymmm> already got your PS done?
[03:45:24] <jcolley> hey, i can throw around part numbers like a pro
[03:45:45] <jcolley> just don't ask me to speak technical
[03:45:50] <jcolley> no
[03:45:52] <Jymmm> lol, np
[03:46:11] <jcolley> the tq10s are sweet though
[03:46:19] <jcolley> they plug in to 120v
[03:46:51] <Jymmm> oh, very cool
[03:47:23] <jcolley> makes it easy
[03:47:48] <jcolley> i'll probably build an enclosure and run a 120v bus, then tap off of that
[03:47:50] <Jymmm> yeah it does =)
[03:48:05] <Jymmm> what kind of machine?
[03:48:08] <jcolley> that's like way far down though
[03:48:17] <jcolley> homebrew
[03:48:31] <Jymmm> what kind though? mill, lathe, router, edm, etc
[03:48:37] <jcolley> mill
[03:48:48] <Jymmm> mini? full? desktop?
[03:49:26] <Jymmm> heh... a sherline with those servos you have! LOL
[03:50:10] <Jymmm> the sherlin might just be top heavy with those!
[03:50:26] <LawrenceG> hi Jymmm
[03:50:49] <jcolley> umm
[03:50:50] <Jymmm> what be da haps Sir LawrenceG
[03:50:53] <jcolley> benchtop
[03:51:21] <jcolley> i think my servo would be bigger than the spindle
[03:51:28] <jcolley> oooh! that's an idea
[03:51:35] <jcolley> live tooling, heh
[03:51:39] <Jymmm> lol
[03:51:52] <LawrenceG> Jymmm, well spent all day playing with qemu.... very cool, built a win98 image with all the tools... now windows runs on linux!
[03:52:14] <Jymmm> qemu?
[03:52:24] <Jymmm> sounds cool. hows HW support?
[03:52:36] <LawrenceG> my last app that I was running on windows was acad and it runs great under qemu
[03:52:51] <jcolley> isn't that like installing a vw engine in an F-16? :P
[03:53:14] <LawrenceG> yes, but now I can dump my windows box!
[03:53:40] <jcolley> hmm, i wonder how pro/e would run
[03:53:58] <jcolley> i can't afford to go but the linux version
[03:54:03] <LawrenceG> probably ok
[03:54:44] <LawrenceG> the nice thing is the entire windows image (read c:) is just a file that qemu runs
[03:54:49] <jcolley> how's the speed compared
[03:55:01] <jcolley> right, i do similar with xp on my mac
[03:55:08] <jcolley> virtual pc
[03:55:19] <jcolley> solidworks chokes on it though
[03:55:21] <LawrenceG> I just burnt a backup copy on dvd... so when windows kills itself, I just restore the file instead of an all day reinstall
[03:56:49] <LawrenceG> speed is not bad as I am using the kqemu accelerator.... on my 2.4ghz p4, I would guess it emulates windows like a 500mhz box
[03:57:20] <LawrenceG> very usable in acad... pretty sure its faster than my old k6 233 windows box.
[03:58:45] <jcolley> nice
[03:58:49] <LawrenceG> I am still trying to figure out how to get the cdrom to behave.... I can start emu with a cd in the drive, but I cant change to a new cd without shutting down and restarting windows... time for some more reading
[03:59:14] <jcolley> i have hacked xp down to the bare minimum to get pro/e to run worth a crap
[03:59:22] <jcolley> i'm a little disappointed in my laptop
[03:59:29] <Jymmm> jcolley bet ya haven;t =)
[03:59:44] <jcolley> i would love to dump it and switch it to linux
[03:59:59] <jcolley> ?
[04:00:31] <Jymmm> jcolley if you haven't hacked the registry for a minimum of 12 hours, it's not 'bare minimum' =)
[04:00:47] <jcolley> i'm starting on that next
[04:00:53] <jcolley> there's so much crap that runs
[04:01:13] <jcolley> what i wouldn't give for the source
[04:01:29] <jcolley> "make xpconfig"
[04:01:31] <jcolley> heh
[04:01:36] <Jymmm> jcolley Strting bid $1000 USD
[04:01:36] <LawrenceG> how much disk space does pro-e take for an install?
[04:01:57] <jcolley> LawrenceG: let me look, hang on
[04:02:06] <LawrenceG> k
[04:03:09] <jcolley> pft, then i would be looking for a $200 control card
[04:03:26] <jcolley> LawrenceG: looks like 1.4 gig
[04:03:36] <Jymmm> jcolley mo, for the XP source code
[04:03:37] <jcolley> that's with *every* option
[04:03:39] <Jymmm> no,
[04:03:50] <jcolley> that's what i mean
[04:04:00] <jcolley> and then what would i have
[04:04:12] <jcolley> two terabytes of poorly written code
[04:04:17] <jcolley> ;)
[04:04:40] <LawrenceG> do you use it at work? I have only seena quick demo and it looks like a big project to learn
[04:04:42] <Jymmm> jcolley you mena 2Tb of poorly written code where the own er is the richest man in the world?
[04:04:53] <jcolley> well, that too
[04:05:32] <jcolley> LawrenceG- no, i wish at work. some of the design weenies use it but it's all classifed access stuff
[04:05:40] <jcolley> i just get to play at home
[04:05:58] <jcolley> self teaching and yes...good learning curve
[04:05:59] <Jymmm> oh pro engineer ?
[04:06:04] <jcolley> ya
[04:06:07] <Jymmm> ah
[04:06:19] <Jymmm> jcolley hard to learn?
[04:06:37] <Jymmm> SolidWorks is kinda nice
[04:06:45] <jcolley> but, with pro/nc option, i can eventually generate my g-cde straight from it
[04:07:03] <Jymmm> SolidWorks has SolidCAM fwiw
[04:07:04] <jcolley> i love SW, but can't get work to support it for me at home
[04:07:12] <jcolley> i wish
[04:07:13] <Jymmm> why?
[04:07:31] <jcolley> our organization is all pro/e now
[04:07:41] <jcolley> at least that way i can get help
[04:07:42] <Jymmm> is it better/worse/same?
[04:07:46] <jcolley> umm
[04:07:55] <jcolley> i can't speak for solidcam
[04:08:06] <Jymmm> k
[04:08:11] <jcolley> but i tend to believe pro/e has *way* more ability
[04:08:14] <Jymmm> SW -vs proE?
[04:08:17] <Jymmm> ah, ok
[04:08:22] <jcolley> and with that
[04:08:25] <jcolley> harder to use
[04:08:34] <Jymmm> along with it a steeper learning curve I'd susptect
[04:08:38] <jcolley> in sw, i could whip stuff up willy nilly
[04:08:47] <jcolley> in pro/e i have to think a lot more
[04:08:54] <Jymmm> lol
[04:09:01] <jcolley> but, it is designed as a parametric system
[04:09:03] <Jymmm> as we all have to do in life
[04:09:14] <jcolley> so you can design from the assembly down to the part
[04:09:23] <jcolley> instead of in sw, from parts up to assembly
[04:13:32] <Jymmm> ah, ok
[04:13:39] <LawrenceG> hey Jymmm, you know windows.... what version of ie can I download that will run on win98... currently have version 4
[04:13:51] <Jymmm> IE6
[04:14:01] <Jymmm> but why would you want to?
[04:14:43] <LawrenceG> well maybe not...
[04:17:02] <Jymmm> LawrenceG you need it to install updates, but it installs a LOT of shit too
[04:25:25] <LawrenceG> well this is win98 original.... its best kept off the internet!
[04:27:28] <jcolley> it's too bad everyone using windows doen't feel that way...
[04:27:31] <LawrenceG> I wanted to get acad running to try out cradeks dwg to gcode
[04:38:43] <Jymmm> LawrenceG you arent using any other cad software that can export to acad?
[04:49:30] <jcolley> oh well...i'll try later
[04:49:32] <jcolley> night guys
[04:50:03] <Jymmm> G'Night jcolley
[04:50:13] <LawrenceG> gnight
[13:49:54] <les> morning
[13:50:18] <les> I need a nice cheap 1 MHz PLL
[13:50:25] <les> like under a buck
[13:51:07] <les> way under a buck
[13:55:40] <jepler> $.53 qty 1, looks like it will give you center frequences around 1MHz. http://www.mouser.com/index.cfm?handler=displayproduct&lstdispproductid=480237&e_categoryid=266&e_pcodeid=59510
[13:55:44] <jepler> what are you cooking up?
[13:55:53] <jepler> oops, I should head in to work...
[13:56:05] <les> thanks looking
[13:56:11] <les> ultrasonics stuff
[13:58:22] <les> -55 to +105c
[13:58:37] <les> $.16 in quantity
[13:58:42] <les> PERFECT
[13:59:12] <les> thanks Jeff
[14:12:28] <jepler> np
[15:20:59] <Jacky^> hello bosoneee
[15:21:04] <Jacky^> :)
[15:34:01] <les> hi jacky
[15:35:57] <Jacky^> hi les :)
[15:58:56] <bosone> hi all !
[19:38:13] <alex_joni> evening all
[19:38:41] <Jymmm> howdy alex
[19:38:54] <alex_joni> howdy cowboy
[19:45:49] <Jymmm> alex_joni http://lyrics.duble.com/V/thevandalslyrics/thevandalsurbanstrugglelyrics.htm
[19:47:14] <Jymmm> alex_joni (grab the mp3, sounds much better than reading the lyrics)
[19:48:02] <alex_joni> firefoy just choked on that page
[19:48:04] <alex_joni> fox
[19:56:48] <Jymmm> try another browser
[19:57:48] <alex_joni> where's the mp3?
[19:58:11] <Jymmm> your favorite bit torrent site
[19:58:22] <alex_joni> don't have any bittorrent sw installed
[19:58:23] <alex_joni> :)
[19:59:05] <Jymmm> what am I going to do with you?!
[19:59:17] <alex_joni> lol.. at this hour? nothing :)
[19:59:24] <alex_joni> * alex_joni is just too tired to care
[20:00:03] <alex_joni> and I am pissed that I almost got scammed
[20:00:05] <Jymmm> * Jymmm just doens't care, period.
[20:00:15] <alex_joni> thx to jepler & cradek for opening my eyes :)
[20:00:24] <Jymmm> ?
[20:00:32] <Jymmm> what did THOSE two do now?
[20:00:48] <alex_joni> first I found this: http://www.usaphotonation.com/products.asp?product_id=11860&engine=froogle#
[20:01:56] <alex_joni> looked ok, buuut
[20:02:09] <alex_joni> http://www.resellerratings.com/seller8278-p1-s1-d1.html#reviews
[20:05:04] <alex_joni> Jymmm: check this out www.clocky.net/videos/gma.mov
[20:05:30] <Jacky^> evening guys
[20:05:37] <alex_joni> buona sera
[20:05:40] <Jacky^> :)
[20:07:27] <Jacky^> this afternoon I get the steppers running with stepgen type 2
[20:07:29] <Jymmm> alex_joni oh gawd...
[20:07:37] <Jacky^> an old printer board
[20:09:04] <Jacky^> now I need to get the third additional pin for any axis to turn on-off the current
[20:09:14] <alex_joni> Jymmm: ain't that the stupidest thing ever
[20:11:20] <Jacky^> alex_joni: any idea about how to get the 3rd pin ?
[20:11:46] <Jacky^> should I edit source code in stepgen.c ?
[20:12:17] <alex_joni> I'd use the estop signal from iocontrol
[20:12:26] <alex_joni> iocontrol.0.estop iirc
[20:12:44] <alex_joni> let me look
[20:12:52] <Jacky^> mmh thanks
[20:13:20] <Jymmm> alex_joni pretty much... The "bookshelf stereo" I have has a wake-up feature. You can program it to play the radio, cd, etc at a specific time in the morning AND you can set the 'wake up volume' too. So you can listen to it softly before going to bed, then wake up BLARING to the cd =)
[20:13:55] <alex_joni> lol
[20:14:00] <alex_joni> * alex_joni uses gradients
[20:14:12] <Jymmm> ?
[20:14:19] <alex_joni> starts slowly
[20:14:23] <alex_joni> then progressive increases
[20:14:24] <Jymmm> ah
[20:14:27] <alex_joni> till I wake up
[20:14:38] <Jacky^> :)
[20:15:12] <Jymmm> This turns on, then you can watch the volume dial turn up, then goes to the cd track you programmed in and H E L L O !!!!!!!!!
[20:15:29] <alex_joni> nice
[20:15:36] <alex_joni> so you still have a chance to run away
[20:15:37] <alex_joni> :D
[20:16:00] <Jymmm> no need, has remote control =)
[20:37:43] <Jymmm> you here?
[20:38:02] <alex_joni> not here
[20:38:03] <alex_joni> :D
[21:07:06] <Jymmm> Jymmm is now known as Red70sShow
[21:07:06] <Red70sShow> DUMBASS -----> alex_joni <----- DUMBASS
[21:07:06] <Red70sShow> Red70sShow is now known as Jymmm
[21:31:27] <les> I got up at 5am. It's 4 pm now. Can I quit work for today?
[21:31:53] <alex_joni> nope
[21:31:57] <les> awww
[21:32:01] <Jymmm> les hell no
[21:32:01] <alex_joni> you need to finish the secodn shift
[21:32:07] <les> slaving over a hot lathe
[21:32:10] <Jymmm> and the third shift too
[21:32:16] <les> bluh
[21:32:18] <les> haha
[21:32:51] <alex_joni> * alex_joni got up at 6 am
[21:32:57] <alex_joni> and finished working at 1800
[21:33:08] <les> argh
[21:34:13] <les> ok. I'll keep working. However I will work in the music room, and have a beer also.
[21:34:31] <Jymmm> les but you can't turn anything on
[21:34:38] <Jymmm> in the music room
[21:34:40] <les> awww
[21:35:01] <alex_joni> he can turn a beer
[21:35:21] <Jymmm> if he wants sex with a beer can... to each his own.
[21:35:28] <les> gulp
[21:35:37] <Jymmm> lol
[21:38:16] <Jymmm> anyone have a fairly good rule to go by when going from making tool changes -vs- more passes with a smaller tool?
[21:38:58] <les> on the router?
[21:40:17] <Jymmm> router, but mostly when makign the toolpaths
[21:40:40] <les> I generally use the largest diameter I can get away with. Saves a lot of time.
[21:41:22] <Jymmm> is that with or without an auto tool changer =)
[21:41:23] <les> Millwrite can automatically calculate a corner etc cleanup with a smaller tool.
[21:41:28] <les> heh
[21:41:42] <Jymmm> I looked it briefly, I didn't care for it.
[21:41:47] <Jymmm> mostly UI
[21:42:20] <les> the ratio of large tool to small cleanup tool is almost always about 4:1 for minimum machining time.
[21:43:07] <les> The UI is a little different
[21:43:49] <Jymmm> Well, I'd have to stop the machine, stop the spindle, open the dust cover, jog it over, change out the tool, re zero the tool, close the dust cover, start the spindle, start going again.
[21:44:59] <Jymmm> in the 20-30 minutes to do all that it just might be easier to let it go with a smaller tool.
[21:45:12] <les> yeah...too much. I use my router positive stop toolholders, so all that is taken care of. No rezeroing
[21:46:41] <Jymmm> and I have to wait 5 minutes from the time I stop the spindle to the time I can open the dust cover - unless I dont want to breath that is
[21:46:41] <les> I jog over to the side where I can reach it under program control, then a programmed M00 pauses it.
[21:47:18] <les> Hitting resume after the change continues the program
[21:47:44] <les> still it takes 3 min or so
[21:47:58] <jepler> sounds similar to a toolchange on cradek's mill
[21:48:10] <jepler> jog up in "z" to get enough clearance to remove the tool, put in the new tool, and continue
[21:48:15] <les> That's my problem....imagine 100 changes a day...
[21:48:31] <alex_joni> les needs more hands :)
[21:48:57] <Jymmm> I wish I had access to a lathe, I'd try making the tool changer idea I have.
[21:49:44] <les> I was doing lathe stuff where bores had to be lapped to 0.0001 today
[21:50:55] <les> steel plunger had to fit in a .0625 deep hole.... with an oil tight fit
[21:51:14] <les> but still free to move
[21:54:02] <les> It's for some tiny, tiny adjustable ultrasonic resonators.
[21:55:47] <Jymmm> les ok, I'll send over the drawings to you to machine up =)
[21:56:29] <LawrenceG> hi les.... sounds like fun
[21:57:03] <Jacky^> hi LawrenceG :)
[21:57:16] <LawrenceG> I finally got acad running on my linux box.... yea no more windows box
[21:57:58] <les> Hi Lawrence
[21:58:45] <LawrenceG> qemu works wonders... now have a virtual win98 machine that cant mess with much.
[21:59:02] <les> fairly fast?
[22:00:01] <Jacky^> * Jacky^ is happy with vmware
[22:00:02] <LawrenceG> not bad.... I would guess it makes a 2.5ghz linux box run like a 500mhz windows box... very usable in acad... will time some big drawing regens
[22:00:22] <les> k
[22:01:05] <les> tool path generation in cam is what takes the most resources for me
[22:01:28] <les> sometimes it can take an hour
[22:01:38] <Jacky^> uah ..
[22:01:44] <Jacky^> O_O
[22:01:47] <LawrenceG> its great... the only way for windows to escape is via putty ssh client or psftp
[22:01:49] <les> yeah.
[22:01:56] <les> but usually quicker.
[22:02:12] <LawrenceG> wnat are you do cam with?
[22:02:12] <Jacky^> les wich video card ?
[22:02:36] <les> just a poor quality nvidea that is on the mb
[22:02:41] <LawrenceG> typing skills not graded....
[22:02:49] <les> 32k
[22:02:52] <Jacky^> mmhh.. thats why
[22:03:06] <les> yeah
[22:03:19] <Jacky^> :(
[22:03:53] <les> could use better...I practice flying navigation on flight simulator...it needs good video
[22:04:54] <les> I mean 32 meg not k
[22:04:55] <les> haha
[22:05:01] <les> still not very good
[22:05:04] <Jacky^> yeah ..
[22:05:12] <Jymmm> les try 256MB video ram
[22:05:13] <Jacky^> i used nvidia for many years
[22:05:41] <Jacky^> latest time i switched to Ati 256 mb
[22:05:51] <Jacky^> great
[22:05:57] <les> yeah I looked at some cards
[22:06:01] <les> read some reviews
[22:06:19] <Jacky^> Jymmm: probably les cant insert recent agp card 8x ..
[22:06:22] <les> but my office box is getting old too...
[22:06:27] <les> 1.8g p4\
[22:06:36] <Jacky^> maybe changing the mobo ..
[22:06:42] <Jacky^> not cheaper at all
[22:07:14] <les> yeah...well I would say it is about two thirds done with it's useful life
[22:07:24] <les> I try to get 3 years out of a box
[22:07:45] <alex_joni> sounds resonable
[22:09:55] <les> have good mass storage in this one
[22:10:12] <les> 2 x 80 hardware raid mirror
[22:10:32] <les> and a third 80 extra
[22:10:34] <Jacky^> $ glxgears
[22:10:34] <Jacky^> 7561 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1512.200 FPS
[22:10:35] <Jacky^> 8086 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1617.200 FPS
[22:11:24] <Jacky^> this is ati 256
[22:11:49] <icee> hm, you use flight simulator to practice navigation, les? ;) i use it to practice flying under bridges :P
[22:11:51] <les> sounds fast
[22:12:33] <les> That card was highly reccomended on flight sim forums
[22:13:19] <les> Flight sim is really very accurate....I am a pilot for real planes and use fs for practice
[22:13:27] <les> mostly nav skills
[22:13:37] <les> in case they turn off the gps
[22:13:45] <icee> I'm a private pilot
[22:13:50] <les> cool
[22:14:00] <icee> If I flew the same as I do in flight simulator in real life
[22:14:13] <icee> well, i wouldn't be flying :P
[22:14:19] <les> haha
[22:14:43] <icee> my best FS landing is about the same as the worst i put my instructor through
[22:15:12] <les> couple models are not good...
[22:15:24] <icee> I think it's mostly the input devices
[22:15:39] <les> piper cub CAN'T be that hard to land in a x wind
[22:15:56] <les> and helicopters CAN'T be that hard to fly
[22:15:57] <icee> then there's the fun PIO trying to trim out the simulator
[22:16:49] <les> well it seems to model inverse pitch hyteresis fairly well....
[22:17:13] <les> but as you know some real planes don't trim to speed well
[22:18:05] <icee> Well, I'm more saying: when I trim a real aircraft, I get the thing flying level with a couple fingers on the yoke, and then slowly trim off the forces with the pitch trim wheel or the trim actuator
[22:18:22] <les> what do you fly?
[22:18:24] <icee> there's no analog to that in FS, other than, letting go of the yoke, and moving the trim, and hoping it lines up
[22:18:52] <icee> still mostly c172; a sr-22 at times
[22:19:15] <icee> and a tailwheel endorsement is on the soon-to-do list
[22:19:22] <les> I fly 172 here...but not much lately
[22:19:44] <les> learned in a warrior and flew archer/dakota a lot earlier
[22:20:33] <icee> i really need to get checked out in some of the pipers. would make aircraft availability a lot better to rent
[22:21:06] <icee> i hope to build a vans rv-8 before too long.
[22:21:11] <les> wow
[22:21:34] <les> warrior/cherokee is just too easy to fly
[22:21:51] <les> easier to land in x wind than 150 or 172
[22:22:58] <les> max demonstrated is 17 kt but 20-25 is no problem with a little power in for some rudder authority
[22:23:26] <les> less flap helps slightly too
[22:23:47] <icee> i don't get near enough xwind landing practice here
[22:24:20] <les> I learned on a single runwy in the windy city....
[22:24:46] <icee> meigs?
[22:25:01] <les> Schaumburg
[22:25:14] <les> 8.4 dme from ohare
[22:25:57] <les> class bravo was pattern +300 ft
[22:26:18] <icee> all my flying to date has been in california. lots of interesting mountain flying, etc.. but relatively few challenges from weather (other than marine layer)
[22:26:53] <les> yeah it would be bad to get stuck on top of that
[22:27:18] <icee> it comes in late; it more tends to delay departures in the morning
[22:27:19] <alex_joni> night guys
[22:27:36] <icee> and is fairly unpredictable for when it'll go away
[22:27:49] <les> I'm vfr, but have had little problems flying into ifr
[22:28:10] <les> lost ground contact for a good while in a snowstorm once
[22:28:38] <icee> so an instrument rating is tempting-- not so much for regular instrument flight, because i'm not sure i will fly enough to maintain that level of proficiency.. but to be able to depart ifr and cancel
[22:28:55] <les> yeah it sure is
[22:29:01] <les> I might do that
[22:29:15] <les> that's what I use fs for
[22:30:26] <les> Well, vfr or instrument....little planes are just impractical toys really
[22:30:32] <les> but I sure do like em
[22:30:42] <icee> * icee nods.
[22:30:59] <icee> It's not all that useful for travel, etc, (though there are a few trips i've taken where it's probably worked out to be cheaper than any other alternative)
[22:31:19] <icee> and I don't really have a whole lot of desire to go faster or farther
[22:31:51] <icee> i'm content to just go on short little day trips with friends or just fly around the local area
[22:32:03] <les> On nice days I would fly business trips from chicago to indy....but only if I didn't have a particular time I had to be there
[22:33:23] <icee> there's a fun little thing you can ask bay approach for here, the 'bay tour'
[22:33:30] <les> oh and when getting back from commercial flight at chicago midway....If weather was good I would rent a 172 and instructor to fly it back and use that to go home.
[22:33:45] <les> it was about the same as cab fare
[22:33:50] <icee> it's my favorite way to transition the bravo; they take you up 101, across midfield at sfo at 1000', and then on over the golden gate bridge
[22:34:05] <les> cool
[22:34:21] <les> ohare just wouldn't let you in...period.
[22:35:10] <icee> norcal/bay approach/whatever they call themselves these days are really very nice when conditions permit them to be
[22:35:49] <icee> (there was a couple month period a year ago where they changed their name 3 times; now they're stable as 'norcal'.. i think.)
[22:35:51] <les> One good tour down in florida was a low pass over the shuttle landing strip....but it's not done anymore
[22:36:01] <les> had to call em up first
[22:36:12] <les> used to be ok
[22:36:20] <icee> terrorism concerns?
[22:36:24] <les> yeah.
[22:36:28] <icee> bleh.
[22:37:18] <les> how long have you been flying?
[22:37:49] <icee> i've been licensed for 2 years; i started flying in 2000 but circumstances didn't allow me to finish
[22:37:57] <icee> i've got 160hrs pic
[22:38:56] <les> I have 275 or so...but that is over 10 years. Have not been flyng much lately. Starting a new business sucked up the money.
[22:39:08] <les> Even more than airplanes!
[22:39:17] <icee> ;) i know how that is
[22:39:21] <icee> i had a crummy time with training, actually
[22:39:29] <icee> in 2000, business concerns tied me up and made me stop
[22:39:40] <icee> in 2001 i started up again shortly before sept 11 and everything was all messed up
[22:39:53] <icee> and then in 2002, i started up again-- right before entering talks with symc to acquire my company
[22:39:56] <icee> which didn't pan out.
[22:40:05] <icee> that is, the flying didn't pan out because of the unanticipated crap
[22:40:11] <les> right
[22:41:38] <les> I just used home equity loan money and went for it
[22:41:56] <les> but took a while still due to often poor weather
[22:42:20] <icee> every time i thought things were stable and i'd have plenty of time, something huge came up.
[22:42:28] <les> yeah
[22:42:31] <icee> Now I'm at the opposite end of the spectrum-- bored with nothing to do but hobby projects. :P
[22:43:04] <les> I kept up lessons all winter....so landed on ice and packed snow a lot
[22:43:45] <les> My business is doing well so I can afford it again...but I have a time problem
[22:44:05] <icee> les: got an url for your company?
[22:44:14] <les> yeah
[22:44:21] <les> www.lmwatts.com
[22:44:34] <les> small but doing well
[22:44:46] <icee> ah, furniture.. neat.
[22:44:47] <les> mostly engineering work
[22:45:12] <les> product development
[22:45:56] <les> and some cnc production stuff
[22:46:44] <icee> nice shop :)
[22:47:16] <icee> quite the varied career, too, which is a good thing
[22:47:51] <les> thanks...yeah reinvent every few years haha
[22:48:20] <les> That helps a lot with product development
[22:48:51] <icee> i've been out of industry a couple years.. i'm trying to figure out how to get plugged back in
[22:49:27] <icee> i'm sort of doing the vc gig right now, but it makes me feel dirty
[22:49:43] <les> Well it was a little strange with me. I was in the corporate world, but wanted to start my own business.
[22:50:29] <les> My inventions did well there, so I was able to start my own business and still work for the. I try for half and half.
[22:51:35] <les> So for half the time, I am under an invention/ non disclosure/compete contract....
[22:51:45] <les> and half the time i'm not!
[22:52:06] <icee> that's a pretty nice arrangement.. it hedges out a lot of the uncertainty
[22:52:25] <les> yeah...I like it.
[22:52:46] <icee> i founded my company at 19. I had little to lose.
[22:52:54] <les> wow
[22:53:19] <icee> and then got on the crazy venture capital trajectory, became profitable, sold it to SYMC
[22:53:32] <icee> was chief architect there for all their enterprise products for a bit over a year and then split
[22:54:15] <les> well off though....
[22:54:45] <icee> I did OK from it. I miss the energy of being at a startup though, and doing hard engineering with real impact
[22:55:18] <les> I did it twice. Once starting a division at corp, and once for me.
[22:55:23] <les> both pretty hard.
[22:55:31] <icee> hey, me too ;)
[22:55:42] <les> heh
[22:55:44] <icee> at 17, i went to work in industry and went to work for exodus communications
[22:56:10] <icee> and built their computer security services business up to $15m/yr; and it was the only business at exds that was generating positive cash flows as far as i could tell
[22:56:57] <les> uh...at 17 I was sittin' behind the dumpster at high school smokin' a joint
[22:57:12] <icee> so after 2.5 years of that, and being compensated almost purely in stock from a place that was bleeding red ink.. it wasn't hard to choose to leave
[22:57:21] <les> yeah
[22:57:47] <icee> i mean, it was funny. I was the chief technologist and did the product marketing group for the only profitable group at the company, and they were paying me $30k/yr.. heh
[22:58:05] <icee> when i went to leave they countered me with $120k. it was funny.
[22:58:40] <les> Well, yeah. I was payed ok at the corp, even good bonuses.
[22:58:59] <les> But I didn't have a piece of the action.
[22:59:23] <les> That's why I did this.
[22:59:27] <icee> the upside is important, yah.
[22:59:59] <icee> and being able to prevent the organization from doing really stupid things without fighting WWIII
[23:00:07] <icee> that's even more important for me
[23:00:17] <les> If you do several things, and most of them work and make money....you want to do it for you rather than the stockholders
[23:01:36] <icee> well, it's also very frustrating to see them work and make money, but because of organizational structure, broken incentivization/wrong sales org structure, etc, not go nearly as far in the market as they should
[23:01:47] <les> yeah
[23:02:03] <les> I have an odd situation comming up though
[23:02:34] <les> my best product's base patent expires in two years.
[23:02:50] <les> The patent does not tell how to make it.
[23:03:31] <les> They know how to make it at the division that was created....and I know how to make it.
[23:03:39] <icee> it's not 'enabling'-- e.g. it doesn't allow someone reasonable skilled in the art of (mechanical design, whatever) to produce it?
[23:03:47] <les> no
[23:03:54] <icee> you don't want to say that
[23:04:00] <icee> if a patent isn't enabling it's not enforcable
[23:04:28] <les> my attorneys at corp woked miracles I guess
[23:04:47] <icee> oh, you can get any patent granted
[23:04:47] <les> we have one two infrigement suits
[23:04:53] <les> won
[23:05:58] <les> The infringers got about halfway there technically
[23:06:09] <icee> well, it all depends-- like you can patent a method to do X, and have the patent be an enabling description on how to do X, when a useful patent requires X,Y, and Z
[23:06:17] <les> heh
[23:06:35] <icee> but you, as inventor, definitely don't want to be saying 'the patent doesn't tell you how to do X'
[23:07:02] <les> haha
[23:07:06] <les> not too worried
[23:07:15] <les> it's the process
[23:07:21] <les> that is the tough part
[23:07:47] <icee> my patents have finally started to issue
[23:07:51] <icee> the backlog at the USPTO is crazy
[23:07:56] <les> yes it is
[23:08:18] <les> over a year on my last
[23:08:24] <les> filed another last week
[23:08:41] <icee> over a year? mine were filed in 1999, and have just issued in the past few months
[23:08:54] <les> wow
[23:09:19] <zwelch> * zwelch bets the target area of the patent affects its turnaround time
[23:09:34] <les> sounds like it
[23:09:49] <icee> http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO2&Sect2=HITOFF&p=1&u=/netahtml/search-bool.html&r=2&f=G&l=50&co1=AND&d=ptxt&s1='lyle,+michael'&OS=%22lyle,+michael%22&RS=%22lyle,+michael%22 there's one
[23:09:56] <les> looking
[23:10:51] <les> is that yours?
[23:10:55] <icee> yah
[23:11:20] <icee> it's extraordinarily valuable, too, as since DNSSEC and sender-id and all kinds of protocols have started to use similar techniques
[23:11:28] <icee> it's unlikely symantec will enforce it though
[23:11:50] <les> reading...
[23:12:17] <zwelch> icee: i tried to find the answer to this in scrollback, but i couldn't: what attracted you here/to EMC? :)
[23:12:56] <icee> zwelch: I'm building some stepper pwm controller boards and i'm going to automate my little mill
[23:13:30] <icee> i figured it was worthwhile to lurk here and hear what people are complaining about
[23:13:31] <icee> ;)
[23:14:46] <zwelch> just hobby interest then?
[23:14:56] <icee> yah, pretty much.
[23:15:03] <les> read some but don't understand much! My stuff usually involves transducers. Last one filed is an encoder
[23:15:33] <icee> les: I don't understand much, either. part of what the patent attorneys do is turn my enabling disclosure into code that only lawyers can read :P
[23:15:50] <les> oops time before last
[23:16:04] <les> latest I can't talk about for a while....
[23:16:05] <les> haha
[23:16:19] <les> yeah I can't read that crap on my patents
[23:18:15] <anna_emc> hello
[23:18:46] <Jacky^> hello anna_emc
[23:20:05] <zwelch> * zwelch wonders how to introduce icee to the idea of investing some VC in/around EMC ;)
[23:21:52] <icee> zw: hey, i'm willing to look at and pass on business plans
[23:22:22] <icee> zw: I'm not sure what offhand would have the immediate applicability and market sizing to justify an investment, though
[23:23:24] <icee> if you can't have a large exit in 3-5 years, venture capital isn't interested
[23:23:47] <icee> even if the growth rates/generated cash flows are good and the risk is low
[23:24:18] <zwelch> right, i am familiar with VC expectations (i.e. i grok what "large exit" means)
[23:25:02] <zwelch> icee: mind if i privmsg you? :)
[23:25:08] <icee> not at all.
[23:43:28] <les> icee...gotta go...good talking to you
[23:43:54] <icee> les: the same goes to you. take care.
[23:44:10] <zwelch> * zwelch waves to les too
[23:44:21] <les> les is now known as les_away
[23:44:33] <les_away> hi zwelch...later!
[23:54:49] <anna_emc> night all