#emc | Logs for 2005-07-28

[00:00:11] <Jacky^> 10 stepper motors 12 Vdc 0.8A / Phase, 20 ohm, 200 step - ( 1.8 deg/step ) = euro 35
[00:00:19] <Jacky^> good price ?
[00:08:40] <Jymmm> 20 ohms?
[00:08:48] <Jymmm> Jacky^ so no party tonight?
[00:09:05] <Jacky^> no martini.. no party :((
[00:09:11] <Jymmm> WHAT?!
[00:09:21] <Jacky^> i will wait 5 august for a party :P
[00:09:25] <Jymmm> Jacky^ well hurry up and makes some drinks!
[00:09:28] <Jacky^> hehe ..
[00:09:36] <Jymmm> why wait!
[00:09:42] <Jacky^> my girlfriend is away :\
[00:09:46] <Jacky^> not here
[00:09:48] <les> I have beer.
[00:09:53] <Jymmm> Jacky^ So?
[00:10:09] <Jymmm> Jacky^ is she the only one that can mix drinks?
[00:10:14] <les> heh
[00:10:18] <les> hi jacky
[00:10:21] <Jacky^> lol
[00:10:26] <Jacky^> not really..
[00:10:32] <Jacky^> :)
[00:11:07] <Jymmm> Jacky^: here you go.... 1 liter of rum, 12oz of soda, one straw,
[00:11:16] <Jacky^> :D
[00:11:30] <les> yum
[00:11:38] <Jacky^> I like to go on the beach in the evening..
[00:11:53] <Jacky^> to drink some tequila listening live music :P
[00:12:09] <les> I would too...but it is 800 km away
[00:12:21] <Jacky^> sometime, there is nice music
[00:12:28] <Jacky^> :)
[00:12:47] <les> I used to live on the beach.
[00:12:54] <les> We had good parties
[00:12:56] <Jymmm> Jacky^ : Cadillac Margarita http://www.drinksmixer.com/drink7393.html
[00:13:18] <Jymmm> les : is being a beach bum technically considered livign on the beach?
[00:13:33] <Jacky^> nice :)
[00:13:38] <les> I tried.
[00:13:43] <Jymmm> les =)
[00:14:00] <Jymmm> Jacky^ good stuff, only mixed drink I have anymore
[00:14:12] <Jacky^> I will try :)
[00:14:13] <Jymmm> * Jymmm loves his tequlia
[00:14:35] <les> just beer for me. I make it sometimes.
[00:15:12] <les> I like tequila but it just goes right to my little head.
[00:15:26] <Jymmm> I drink beer and tequilia (cadillac margaritas), dont need many cadillacs to have a good time, two max for me
[00:15:39] <les> yeah.
[00:15:41] <Jacky^> les: homemade beer ? :P
[00:15:51] <les> yes jacky!
[00:15:55] <Jacky^> cool
[00:16:10] <les> 20 liter batches
[00:16:18] <Jacky^> :P
[00:20:42] <Jacky^> Jymmm: http://cgi.ebay.it/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5790570941&ssPageName=MERC_VI_ReBay_Pr4_PcY_BIN
[00:20:52] <Jacky^> what you think ? nice price ?
[00:21:17] <Jacky^> i'm not sure about the 0,8 ampere ...
[00:21:31] <Jacky^> I think too few
[00:22:34] <Jymmm> Jacky^ : Honestly, I'm not the person to ask. The inductance (20 ohms) leads be to think they are from a dot-matrix printer or something.
[00:22:50] <Jacky^> mmhh.. right
[00:23:06] <Jacky^> I think it's good for small applications
[00:23:14] <Jacky^> not for cnc machine
[00:24:10] <Jymmm> I'm not sure, but sounds about right.
[00:24:27] <Jacky^> ;-)
[00:24:41] <Jymmm> more like a lil robot toy motors
[00:24:49] <Jymmm> or from a copy machine
[00:24:49] <Jacky^> yeah
[00:25:10] <Jymmm> I pulled some steppers froma copy machine and most were 20 ohms
[00:26:08] <Jacky^> they say are *new motors, I doubt..
[00:27:00] <Jacky^> anyway are inadeguate
[00:32:48] <Jacky^> too much traders on ebay now, I remember 4-5 years ago, Aucland, was very nice i got optimal transactions
[00:32:53] <Jacky^> :(
[00:57:52] <Jacky^> Gnight all
[01:07:56] <Jymmm> Bah, coals are taking long to light today
[01:14:01] <les> back for a bit
[01:14:21] <les> I use nothing but cherry wood...and you know why!
[01:15:43] <Jymmm> too band that isn't brandy infused cherry wood
[01:15:47] <Jymmm> bad
[01:16:09] <les> heh
[01:16:28] <les> wood gives a nice flavor
[01:16:34] <les> campfire like
[01:16:45] <Jymmm> Oh gawd I LOVE campfires....
[01:17:20] <Jymmm> I use a chimeny starter for the bbq, thus why it takes longer to start - but no fluid smelling food eihter
[01:17:45] <les> apple, cherry, hickory are good
[01:17:48] <les> oak is ok
[01:17:54] <les> mesquite good
[01:18:35] <les> you can let it burn to coals more or les to control how much smoke flavor
[01:18:47] <les> make jerky over wood fires too
[01:18:49] <Jymmm> mesquite gives it that earth scent - good stuff
[01:18:50] <les> in the smoker
[01:19:01] <Jymmm> earthy
[01:19:19] <Jymmm> I haven't tried smoking anything yet, would like too though
[01:19:45] <les> those cheap tall smokers a walmart are ok
[01:20:13] <les> cut brisket into stips
[01:20:29] <Jymmm> I bought a turkey fryer a few years ago, it was great! Cooks a turkey in 33 minutes, but the oil is expensive
[01:20:38] <les> soak em in adolph's , a little vinegar and spices
[01:21:01] <les> oh turkey frying yeah
[01:21:13] <Jymmm> in peanut oil
[01:21:39] <les> need to turn that oil into biodeisel for tractortoy!
[01:22:36] <Jymmm> I had fryed like 5 turkeys still had propane left and wanted to fry some more.... 5 lbs of red potatos, THE BEST DAMN FRIED POTATOS I EVER HAD! My gf even went to the store for another 5 lbs
[01:22:52] <les> sounds good
[01:23:16] <Jymmm> but, spam doesn't deep fry very well =)
[01:23:17] <les> I did not do the big garden this year...I was so busy in the spring
[01:23:39] <les> making a year's production of turkey calls in 3 months
[01:23:55] <Jymmm> plus extras I hope
[01:24:05] <les> no extras...
[01:24:08] <les> all sold
[01:24:32] <les> starting again for next year as soon as this research gig is up
[01:24:34] <Jymmm> no extra buyers this year?
[01:24:41] <les> working on it
[01:24:45] <Jymmm> ah, ok
[01:24:51] <les> I think sales will increase
[01:24:58] <les> a bunch
[01:24:59] <Jymmm> sounds like it
[01:25:51] <les> Now if the research works I will have to allot time for product design on the spray thing
[01:26:06] <Jymmm> any progress?
[01:26:21] <les> it is tough
[01:26:45] <les> they are asking for something almost impossible
[01:27:02] <les> I always get the way out weird stuff
[01:27:10] <Jymmm> whats the major issue? materials?
[01:27:28] <les> the laws of thermodynamics.
[01:27:52] <Jymmm> ah
[01:29:00] <les> last one...the throttle position sensor...is selling great
[01:29:11] <les> we have 100,000 units/year
[01:29:29] <les> for the client
[01:29:40] <Jymmm> checking bbq
[01:29:46] <les> I was just retained to do the research then design it
[02:13:04] <Jymmm> I wish I understood more or how you're approaching it - but it probably be over my head
[05:28:07] <CIA-8> 03jmelson * 10emc/src/emcmot/ppmc_dio.c:
[05:28:08] <CIA-8> add support for DIO boards with 11/20/2004 update
[05:28:08] <CIA-8> disconnect negative limit bit from 3rd axis on USC and UPC boards,
[05:28:08] <CIA-8> as this is the OK-to-come-out-of e-stop sense bit
[07:46:17] <anonimasu> hello
[08:34:01] <fenn_> wb
[08:34:05] <fenn_> fenn_ is now known as fenn
[08:34:20] <fenn> trying to get this blasted quickcam to work
[08:34:42] <anonimasu> thanks
[08:36:07] <anonimasu> nice
[08:36:22] <fenn> no.. it's not fun at all
[08:36:40] <fenn> all the drivers are like 4 years old.. i'm tracking stuff down in archive.org
[08:36:58] <fenn> then, once i get it to compile, it locks the computer solid
[08:38:03] <fenn> you have the parallel port version right?
[08:38:09] <anonimasu> no
[08:38:16] <anonimasu> usb
[08:38:16] <fenn> ah
[08:38:40] <fenn> it has a PS2 connector and a DIN-5 connector on it as well as a parallel port connector
[08:38:44] <fenn> i have no idea what those are for
[08:40:19] <anonimasu> ok
[08:40:32] <anonimasu> weird..
[08:40:40] <anonimasu> why didnt you get a usb one?
[08:40:53] <fenn> no idea
[08:41:07] <fenn> this one was $0.99
[08:41:17] <fenn> and i fancied using it with my laptop, which doesn't have a usb port
[08:41:25] <anonimasu> ah ok
[08:41:43] <fenn> and at the time it looked like it was well supported
[08:41:58] <fenn> i actually tried to find one that was supported, then decided which one to get
[08:45:44] <anonimasu> ok
[09:03:11] <anonimasu> *yawns*
[09:03:13] <A-L-P-H-A> ola people
[09:03:17] <anonimasu> morning A-L-P-H-A
[09:03:23] <A-L-P-H-A> what are you up too?
[09:03:33] <anonimasu> not much
[09:03:43] <A-L-P-H-A> how's work going? gone yet?
[09:03:45] <anonimasu> working on the UI for a product at work..
[09:03:52] <anonimasu> just got here 1� hour ago
[09:04:03] <A-L-P-H-A> how do you type 1/2?
[09:04:13] <anonimasu> shift & �
[09:04:19] <A-L-P-H-A> well. that's no good.
[09:04:24] <A-L-P-H-A> I can't type that.
[09:04:40] <anonimasu> my keyboard is slightly different :)
[09:05:03] <anonimasu> * anonimasu has a deadline by friday
[09:05:33] <anonimasu> well tomorrow..
[09:05:34] <anonimasu> :D
[09:07:00] <A-L-P-H-A> ouch
[09:07:19] <A-L-P-H-A> are you getting along there?
[09:07:23] <A-L-P-H-A> I mean with the project
[09:11:47] <A-L-P-H-A> I don't think I should have had that latte.
[09:11:55] <A-L-P-H-A> completely awake
[09:16:18] <A-L-P-H-A> 1� hey!
[09:31:50] <anonimasu> not with the entire project..
[09:31:57] <anonimasu> just with this particular part
[09:35:10] <A-L-P-H-A> 1� hey! <-- figured it out
[09:36:37] <anonimasu> nice :D
[09:36:59] <A-L-P-H-A> alt-171, and alt-172
[09:37:05] <anonimasu> but can you do it out
[09:37:05] <anonimasu> <anonimasu> nice :D
[09:37:07] <anonimasu> err
[09:37:09] <anonimasu> 3/4
[09:37:10] <anonimasu> ;)
[09:37:16] <A-L-P-H-A> yeah.
[09:37:21] <A-L-P-H-A> �+� :)
[09:37:26] <anonimasu> nice ;)
[09:43:03] <anonimasu> hm..
[09:43:14] <anonimasu> how many mm/min is 3000sfm
[09:44:42] <anonimasu> 6m/min..
[09:44:49] <anonimasu> and 14000rpm..
[09:45:03] <ValarQ> * ValarQ is afoot
[09:45:15] <anonimasu> ValarQ: car crash?
[09:45:40] <ValarQ> nah, router/firewall/server crash
[09:45:50] <anonimasu> ah
[09:46:01] <anonimasu> power outage?
[09:46:19] <ValarQ> nope, burnedout mainboard
[09:46:21] <anonimasu> we had a major power dip here yesterday..
[09:47:02] <anonimasu> :/
[09:47:14] <ValarQ> ok, not very often we got that here nowadays
[09:47:33] <anonimasu> the power struck a transformer.
[09:47:37] <anonimasu> err lightning
[09:50:19] <anonimasu> brb lunch
[10:29:20] <anonimasu> :)
[10:44:42] <Jacky^> morning
[10:56:16] <anonimasu> morning jacky
[11:01:21] <Jacky^> hi anonimasu
[12:16:26] <an0n> hm, I found why iron is hard to mill at my machine.
[12:16:39] <an0n> backslash in the Z axis..
[12:18:26] <an0n> hm, but the part is within spec anyway.
[12:18:42] <an0n> an0n is now known as anonimasu_
[12:48:09] <anonimasu> hm used machine prices are horrid
[12:58:26] <anonimasu> * anonimasu so wishes that he could import a machine from the US
[13:04:08] <cncuser> hello
[13:04:36] <anonimasu> hello cncuser
[13:04:38] <cncuser> anybody a hint where i can find gdata files for loading into emc/axis ?
[13:04:51] <cncuser> hello anonimasu
[13:05:02] <cncuser> (i am with bdi 4.20)
[13:05:31] <anonimasu> I dont have any idea sorry
[13:07:40] <cncuser> a in the ~/gdata directory :
[13:07:58] <cncuser> gcode
[13:08:13] <anonimasu> are you looking for parts?
[13:08:54] <cncuser> anonimasu: yes, to watch them in axis :)
[13:09:32] <anonimasu> ah, heh... look at www.cnczone.com
[13:10:26] <cncuser> thanks )
[13:14:24] <les> hi guys
[13:14:45] <les> check out jon's graph of the arc glitch
[13:14:57] <les> in the user and dev lists
[13:17:10] <cncuser> anonimasu: can onlky find pictures
[13:20:36] <anonimasu> les: will do
[13:20:41] <anonimasu> les: looked any more at it?
[13:23:11] <anonimasu> *grabs mail to see*
[13:24:41] <anonimasu> les: cute graph
[13:27:19] <anonimasu> now where/why does it occur..
[13:36:52] <cncuser> hmm, cant find any complex gcode :(
[13:37:33] <cncuser> seems like i have to look at some converters for dxf
[13:38:02] <cncuser> a gcode library would be nice
[13:38:50] <anonimasu> I can give you something nice to try ;)
[13:39:07] <cncuser> cool :)
[13:40:48] <anonimasu> I cant remember what program is right :/
[13:40:53] <anonimasu> but I'll give you something to look at
[13:42:37] <anonimasu> http://www.bojn.net/~an0n/wheel3.cnc
[13:43:22] <cncuser> woow, bigone :)
[13:43:37] <anonimasu> 3d ;)
[13:44:12] <cncuser> rocknroll :)
[13:45:44] <cncuser> nice, this looks good :)
[13:46:40] <ValarQ> oh, thats a heavy one :)
[13:47:29] <anonimasu> nah
[13:47:30] <anonimasu> :D
[13:47:49] <anonimasu> I forgot to post the last 3 ops ;)
[13:48:11] <anonimasu> ValarQ: dont you feel like finding the TP bug?
[13:48:17] <anonimasu> *hint* *hint*
[13:48:58] <ValarQ> heh
[13:49:30] <ValarQ> i would love to, but i have to give my cats water
[13:49:41] <anonimasu> oh, you've got plenty of time for later :)
[13:49:48] <ValarQ> and my webserver needs a bath...
[13:56:15] <anonimasu> heh
[13:57:58] <cradek> yay, now "someone" just need sto fix it
[13:58:01] <cradek> needs to
[13:58:08] <cradek> how do you get a plot like that?
[13:58:40] <cncuser> cu later :)
[13:59:03] <anonimasu> jon elson I think
[13:59:19] <anonimasu> but I dont know how you do it
[14:08:36] <cradek> obviously it's gnuplot, but I don't know how to get the logging to generate it
[14:24:50] <cradek> ok, I figured out how to plot, but I don't see this anomoly on circles
[14:25:28] <les> hi chris
[14:25:38] <cradek> hello
[14:25:48] <les> so you saw jon's plot?
[14:25:51] <cradek> yep
[14:25:58] <cradek> trying to reproduce that behavior here with sim
[14:26:00] <les> fairly dramatic huh
[14:26:02] <cradek> ... failing so far
[14:26:08] <cradek> yep, obviously wrong
[14:26:26] <cradek> his velocities top out at .0007
[14:26:31] <cradek> any idea what units those are?
[14:26:53] <anonimasu> "
[14:27:17] <les> km per hour I hope
[14:27:27] <cradek> I'll take that as a no
[14:27:28] <les> he said it was 40 ipm
[14:27:36] <les> some scaling going on
[14:27:54] <cradek> my plot says .035
[14:28:00] <cradek> but it's perfect and smooth
[14:28:08] <les> ok
[14:28:12] <cradek> but I have no idea what velocity I'm getting
[14:28:18] <les> what is your commanded speed?
[14:28:31] <cradek> f200
[14:28:39] <les> ok
[14:28:40] <cradek> I'm sure it's limited by the ini
[14:29:23] <les> I saw it on both g2-g2 circle segments and g2-g3 s curves
[14:29:30] <cradek> EMCMOT = emcsegmotsim
[14:29:32] <cradek> doh
[14:29:35] <les> but it may not universally happen
[14:29:36] <cradek> no wonder
[14:29:39] <les> who knows
[14:29:54] <les> oh segmot
[14:30:01] <cradek> starting over...
[14:30:01] <les> yeah it did not do this
[14:31:19] <cradek> yep, there it is
[14:31:20] <cradek> yay
[14:31:35] <les> should see it on joined coliner lines too
[14:31:39] <les> colinear
[14:32:32] <les> the inflection at zero crossing is weird too but pales in comparison to the joining blip
[14:33:54] <les> My guess and observation is that it gets much worse as speed increases
[14:34:09] <les> seemingly all the way to zero velocity
[14:35:09] <les> I would expect it to be a function of ini max accel as well
[14:35:13] <cradek> wow, the straight line looks terrible
[14:35:25] <cradek> x.1 x.2 x.3 x.4 ...
[14:35:31] <les> if it isn't...that would be a clue to tracking it down
[14:35:41] <les> seeing it with lines right?
[14:35:44] <cradek> yes
[14:35:49] <cradek> colinear
[14:35:58] <les> Fred and I saw that years ago
[14:36:35] <cradek> so somewhere is there a description of the algorithm this planner is *supposed* to use?
[14:36:43] <les> so it is not arc exclusive
[14:37:08] <les> it's a "discriminate" algo in tc
[14:37:52] <les> That is a nasty little recursive thing that is supposed to be computationally efficient I guess
[14:38:25] <les> The closed form matrix version is simpler to follow
[14:38:43] <les> I'll bring up the code
[14:39:28] <anonimasu> ok
[14:41:34] <les> the function tcruncycle() is the algo I think
[14:42:13] <cradek> yeah
[14:42:29] <cradek> I'd just like to have a nice paper that tells what it's supposed to do, like I have for segmentqueue
[14:43:00] <anonimasu> * anonimasu nods
[14:43:07] <anonimasu> would it be possible to rewrite the algorithm?
[14:43:17] <anonimasu> just that part of it..
[14:43:22] <anonimasu> with fresh math
[14:44:45] <les> Well it's damn hard to follow with so many intermediate variables all over the place
[14:44:51] <anonimasu> yeah
[14:44:59] <anonimasu> les: dont you think that it would be way easier?
[14:45:26] <anonimasu> and make it easier to debug.
[14:45:38] <les> trap blending math in a book is quite simple...just can't relate it to this jumble
[14:45:57] <anonimasu> * anonimasu nods
[14:46:01] <les> It would be easier...but where to you plug it in?
[14:46:18] <anonimasu> where the recursive function that calcualates blending is now?
[14:46:23] <les> which ends of a spaghetti strand do you hook it to? heh
[14:47:37] <les> else {
[14:47:37] <les> discr = 0.25 * tc->cycleTime * tc->cycleTime - 2.0 / tc->aMax * discr;
[14:47:37] <les> newVel = - 0.5 * tc->aMax * tc->cycleTime + tc->aMax * sqrt(discr);
[14:47:37] <les> }
[14:49:05] <anonimasu> :)
[14:49:08] <anonimasu> the first ;)
[14:49:18] <les> haha
[14:49:39] <anonimasu> * anonimasu has major trouble, I need to make dinner for my parents tonight..
[14:49:43] <les> Fred got this stuff from delta tau I think
[14:49:54] <anonimasu> I'd rather dig tp code
[14:50:05] <les> heh
[14:50:22] <les> I'd rather you made dinner for me! air ship.
[14:51:34] <les> Well Chris...you have about as good a handle on this as anyone other than perhaps Fred
[14:51:54] <les> The code is a jumble to me
[14:52:16] <anonimasu> I think re-writing the part with the blending algorithm would be easier.
[14:52:17] <les> I can dig up references to trap planning algos if you need it
[14:52:28] <anonimasu> but that's ju my point of view
[14:52:50] <les> if you can, that would be good.
[14:52:51] <anonimasu> we need a well documented algorithm..
[14:53:39] <les> My old text (Fred used the same one in school as well) has about 5 pages on trap algos.
[14:54:33] <les> the blends are quadratic in position of course
[14:54:34] <anonimasu> isnt the algorithm basically calulating the maximum velocity you can keep and stay within x
[14:55:14] <anonimasu> and if the velocity is too high adapt it until you can keep moving, within reasonable limits
[14:55:35] <les> It uses a linear ramp/cruise/linear ramp to connect segments
[14:55:51] <les> the linear vel ramp is of course constant accel
[14:56:03] <les> so a parabolic path is made
[14:56:28] <anonimasu> * anonimasu nods
[14:56:39] <les> you need three waypoints to do one blend
[14:57:34] <les> i'll get a reference and post it
[14:57:43] <anonimasu> great
[14:57:44] <cradek> thanks, that might help
[15:09:55] <Jacky^> hi
[15:10:05] <anonimasu> hello jacky
[15:10:24] <Jacky^> anyone know how to run job from an arbitrary line ?
[15:10:44] <Jacky^> my machine stopped at 50 % of a job
[15:10:51] <anonimasu> yes
[15:11:00] <anonimasu> open the file in the MDI editor
[15:11:04] <Jacky^> I resumed, but started from first gcode line again :\
[15:11:11] <anonimasu> and select set pointer at line
[15:11:15] <anonimasu> at the line
[15:11:41] <Jacky^> ah.. MDI, not auto ?
[15:12:11] <anonimasu> it's edit in the menu
[15:12:27] <anonimasu> cant remember exactly where since I dont have the mill close...
[15:13:04] <Jacky^> so, after i select the line i want to start should only push run, I suppose
[15:13:18] <Jacky^> in MDI mode
[15:13:25] <anonimasu> in auto mode..
[15:13:28] <anonimasu> but you need to open the editor :)
[15:13:39] <Jacky^> edit file, right ?
[15:14:00] <anonimasu> yeah
[15:14:02] <Jacky^> that's ok , if work
[15:14:27] <anonimasu> it does :)
[15:14:33] <Jacky^> otherwise I losted 3 hours of machining work :\
[15:14:41] <Jacky^> thanks :)
[15:14:59] <Jacky^> I'm going to try
[15:15:48] <anonimasu> * The combined velocity of this move and the next one will be
[15:15:48] <anonimasu> square root(currentVelocity^2 + nextVel^2 + 2*the dot
[15:15:48] <anonimasu> product). to prevent the combined move from exceeding vMax
[15:15:48] <anonimasu> preVMax may need adjustment. tcRunCycle will subtract preVMax
[15:15:48] <anonimasu> from vMax and clamp the velocity to this value. */
[15:16:10] <anonimasu> line 520 of tp.c
[15:16:19] <anonimasu> it should be somwhere nearby
[15:17:22] <anonimasu> cradek: I was going to ask you before
[15:17:36] <anonimasu> cradek: does all the motion get passed to the tp before or during the run?
[15:18:19] <anonimasu> it's during right?
[15:20:22] <les> I think
[15:20:42] <anonimasu> les: do you have a tp.c handy?
[15:20:51] <les> yes
[15:21:01] <anonimasu> start reading at line 564
[15:21:08] <anonimasu> if (tcIsDone(thisTc)) {
[15:21:08] <anonimasu> /* this one is done-- blend in the next one */
[15:21:08] <anonimasu> if (t <= toRemove) {
[15:21:08] <anonimasu> toRemove++;
[15:21:08] <anonimasu> }
[15:21:09] <anonimasu> continue;
[15:21:11] <anonimasu> }
[15:21:24] <les> he no line numbers in windows...but I will find it
[15:21:41] <anonimasu> at line 516.. also..
[15:21:43] <anonimasu> begin there..
[15:21:45] <anonimasu> :D
[15:22:00] <anonimasu> ctrl+g in notepad will go to a line
[15:22:20] <Jacky^> seem doesnt work :(
[15:22:50] <anonimasu> try pushing resume then
[15:23:07] <Jacky^> tried.. it run from the same point
[15:23:13] <anonimasu> broken..
[15:23:16] <anonimasu> it works in emc2 :)
[15:23:21] <Jacky^> i'm maybe missing something
[15:23:28] <Jacky^> but..
[15:23:50] <Jacky^> maybe the only way is to cut all lines non needed
[15:23:57] <Jacky^> and save a new file
[15:24:04] <Jacky^> this should work !
[15:24:08] <anonimasu> hm, that shouldnt be nescessary..
[15:24:25] <Jacky^> :\
[15:25:00] <Jacky^> i'm thinkig ro remove optical limit switch,,
[15:25:22] <Jacky^> can't work fine with sawdust around..
[15:25:27] <Jacky^> :(
[15:28:21] <anonimasu> les: around?
[15:48:40] <anonimasu> I guess not :&
[15:48:40] <anonimasu> :/
[16:24:02] <anonimasu> well, I'll be back later
[16:41:50] <anonimasu> * anonimasu yawns
[16:41:54] <anonimasu> finally home again
[16:43:23] <les> I had to be away...had a visitor
[16:43:27] <anonimasu> ah ok
[16:44:52] <les> hard to find good references on trap blending because it is largely obsolete
[16:45:09] <les> My book is good but it is 25 years old
[16:45:38] <anonimasu> ok
[16:46:00] <Jymmm> I have a few ref books that are good but out of print
[16:48:41] <Jymmm> What's happening folks
[17:20:44] <les> this:
[17:20:57] <anonimasu> playing with the friendly tp.
[17:20:59] <anonimasu> :D
[17:21:01] <anonimasu> brb dinner
[17:21:12] <les> http://jelinux.pico-systems.com/images/circleglitch.png
[17:59:00] <anonimasu> iab
[17:59:57] <Jymmm> les : Eeeewww... that don't look too pretty at all.
[18:00:13] <les> i'm back too
[18:00:25] <les> you should see it at 200 ipm!
[18:00:30] <les> that is at 40
[18:00:36] <Jymmm> no shit?
[18:00:38] <anonimasu> 200*25.4
[18:00:40] <les> yeah
[18:00:43] <anonimasu> 5m/min
[18:00:55] <les> about
[18:01:07] <anonimasu> I can run it at 2m/min without trouble..
[18:01:17] <anonimasu> if I'd like but emc bugs with that kind of period..
[18:01:23] <Jymmm> is that strictly mechanical, signal, or software?
[18:01:27] <les> I had to live with this all during thousands of turkey calls.
[18:01:27] <anonimasu> software.
[18:01:30] <anonimasu> tp..
[18:02:00] <Jymmm> wth? It looks like it was trying then gave up
[18:02:10] <anonimasu> Jymmm: calc error
[18:02:16] <les> In one case I had to put in an anti vibration move to stop a gouge this caused
[18:02:25] <Jymmm> anonimasu : FPU?
[18:02:39] <anonimasu> what?
[18:02:40] <les> just the emc code.
[18:02:44] <anonimasu> floating point?
[18:02:49] <Jymmm> anonimasu yeah
[18:03:08] <anonimasu> Jymmm: it's not a calc error like that.
[18:03:13] <anonimasu> Jymmm: it's a algorithm error..
[18:03:14] <Jymmm> anonimasu k
[18:03:37] <Jymmm> Hmmmm.... seems to be isolated (mostly) to peaks and valleys
[18:03:56] <les> that is a velocity plot
[18:04:06] <les> of two connected 180 degree arcs
[18:04:23] <les> it's one axis so the motion is a sin wave
[18:04:59] <Jymmm> so instead of it just slowing down during the transition, it just keeps goin?
[18:05:05] <anonimasu> um
[18:05:08] <les> there is the nasty slowdown at the connection point, and also a perplexing inflection at zero crossing
[18:05:09] <anonimasu> it BLIP's
[18:06:02] <les> It looks like an exact stop termination condition, which fooled me until I did some tests
[18:06:31] <Jymmm> It's as if the function/subroutine didn't hand off properly
[18:06:51] <anonimasu> the tp does a miscalc during the blending..
[18:07:05] <Jymmm> anonimasu have you isolated it yet?
[18:07:08] <anonimasu> Jymmm: no
[18:07:17] <anonimasu> it's messy
[18:07:22] <Jymmm> I bet
[18:07:37] <anonimasu> have a look at tp.c
[18:07:37] <anonimasu> ;)
[18:07:40] <anonimasu> in emc2
[18:07:40] <Jymmm> nobody has run a trace program yet?
[18:07:47] <Jymmm> url?
[18:08:24] <anonimasu> sourceforge has it..
[18:08:37] <Jymmm> full url?
[18:08:45] <anonimasu> I dont have it
[18:09:05] <anonimasu> www.linuxcnc.org
[18:09:22] <anonimasu> http://www.linuxcnc.org/EMC2-description.html
[18:09:26] <anonimasu> grab it off cvs :)
[18:09:34] <anonimasu> err emc2..
[18:09:50] <Jymmm> no cvs installed, thus wanted url to web interface
[18:10:34] <Jymmm> aw hell, SF is offline
[18:10:41] <anonimasu> no
[18:10:42] <anonimasu> :)
[18:10:51] <Jymmm> Unable to connect to search server
[18:11:12] <anonimasu> wait
[18:13:39] <anonimasu> http://cvs.sourceforge.net/viewcvs.py/emc/emc2/src/emc/kinematics/tp.c?rev=1.15&view=markup
[18:13:58] <Jymmm> http://sourceforge.net/projects/g200x/
[18:14:19] <anonimasu> Jymmm: what?
[18:14:42] <anonimasu> Jymmm: have a look
[18:14:49] <Jymmm> looking now
[18:15:38] <Jymmm> This function is intended to put the motion queue in the state it would
[18:15:38] <Jymmm> be if all queued motions finished at the current position.
[18:15:41] <les> anders... I wonder about this:
[18:15:49] <les> /* clamp accel if necessary, and recalc velocity */
[18:15:49] <les> /* also give credit for previous segment's decel, in preAMax,
[18:15:49] <les> which is a negative value since it's a decel */
[18:15:49] <les> if (newAccel > 0.0) {
[18:15:49] <les> if (newAccel > tc->aMax - tc->preAMax) {
[18:15:49] <les> newAccel = tc->aMax - tc->preAMax;
[18:15:51] <les> /* if tc->preMax was calculated correctly this check is
[18:15:53] <les> redundant.
[18:15:55] <les> (Just because I'm paranoid doesn't mean they are not out to get me!) */
[18:15:57] <les> if (newAccel < 0.0) {
[18:15:59] <les> newAccel = 0.0;
[18:16:01] <les> }
[18:16:19] <les> I wonder if that whole bit should be remmed
[18:16:31] <anonimasu> the alst..
[18:16:34] <anonimasu> last if yes
[18:16:41] <anonimasu> how do you get a velocity plot?
[18:17:16] <anonimasu> les: that accel seems strange..
[18:17:25] <anonimasu> newAccel= 0.0;
[18:17:33] <les> I guess from the log file and gnuplot
[18:17:37] <les> never tried it
[18:17:40] <anonimasu> ok
[18:18:20] <Jymmm> If cond is TC_TERM_BLEND, the following move
[18:18:20] <Jymmm> is begun when the current move decelerates.
[18:18:40] <les> Well those operations are redundant then why are they there?
[18:20:08] <anonimasu> * anonimasu sighs I've lost thoose lines in my file :D
[18:20:11] <anonimasu> what line number..
[18:20:11] <anonimasu> :D
[18:21:43] <anonimasu> les: why set the velocity to 0.0 when still in a move..
[18:23:23] <les> don't know
[18:23:35] <les> I can't follow this
[18:23:51] <anonimasu> les: got any idea where in the file it is?
[18:24:02] <anonimasu> * anonimasu lost he's window
[18:24:14] <les> well need more clues....
[18:24:47] <les> in jon's case it inserted an accel where the local acccel should be zero
[18:25:07] <Jymmm> what is 'pure rotation' in this aspect? /* If either this move or the last move was a pure rotation reset the
[18:25:08] <Jymmm> velocity and acceleration and block any blending */
[18:25:40] <anonimasu> damn..
[18:25:42] <les> We think that refers to rotation axes a,b, and c
[18:25:46] <anonimasu> I cant find the lines we are talking about les
[18:26:11] <Jymmm> les I see mention of xyz in there, not abc
[18:26:22] <les> I know
[18:26:41] <les> I brought that up in an email a couple days ago
[18:26:48] <les> but consider...
[18:26:54] <Jymmm> From that plot, as it's so consistant, I don't think it's a algo issue, more of a logic one.
[18:27:08] <les> this error occurs with connected straight lines as well!
[18:27:21] <anonimasu> would a logic one be different from a algorithm error?
[18:27:35] <Jymmm> ok, are straight lines considered 'pure rotation' by chance?
[18:27:38] <anonimasu> les: we are talking the emc2 tc.c right?
[18:27:54] <anonimasu> err tp
[18:27:57] <les> yes. an algo is just a collection of logic and other operators
[18:28:42] <Jymmm> Can someone run a marker on these? if (lastTcWasPureRotation || thisTcIsPureRotation)
[18:29:36] <les> doz box and I don't know much about G++ compiler and utilities anyway
[18:29:54] <Jymmm> me neither, not on nix anyway
[18:30:39] <Jymmm> running thru the source w/o knowing having a clue under what conditions are when it occures is a needle/haystack thing.
[18:30:55] <les> Wanting to call Fred soon
[18:30:57] <anonimasu> les: can you check where it is..
[18:31:06] <anonimasu> I've gotten totally lost cant find that comment either
[18:31:13] <Jymmm> anonimasu which?
[18:31:19] <les> What we need is plots like Jons at several different speeds
[18:31:28] <les> and with straight lines
[18:31:35] <anonimasu> (Just because I'm paranoid doesn't mean they are not out to get me!) */
[18:31:44] <les> yeah heh
[18:31:57] <anonimasu> where the hell did it go
[18:32:10] <anonimasu> emc2/src/emc/motion/tp.c
[18:32:42] <les> I am out to get Fred...get him on the phone!
[18:33:42] <anonimasu> :D
[18:34:03] <les> I have the tarball on the box here so I can use winzip to look at source
[18:34:17] <anonimasu> * anonimasu wonder where it went
[18:34:33] <les> But first we really do need more plots
[18:34:45] <anonimasu> I cant find the code we were talking about
[18:35:07] <les> heh I have it up in notepad
[18:35:42] <anonimasu> can you send me the file?
[18:35:44] <anonimasu> just the tp.c?
[18:35:48] <anonimasu> * anonimasu lost he's version
[18:36:00] <les> hang on
[18:36:00] <anonimasu> ah..
[18:36:03] <anonimasu> tc.c that is
[18:36:08] <Jymmm> http://cvs.sourceforge.net/viewcvs.py/emc/emc2/src/emc/kinematics/tc.c?rev=1.13&view=markup
[18:36:14] <anonimasu> bleh.
[18:36:17] <anonimasu> wrong file ;)
[18:36:49] <anonimasu> * anonimasu just recomplied
[18:37:17] <Jymmm> /* we're decelerating, but blending next move is not being
[18:37:17] <Jymmm> done yet, so don't flag a decel. This will prevent
[18:37:17] <Jymmm> premature blending */
[18:37:37] <anonimasu> Jymmm: this is realtime stuff debugging it is hard :)
[18:38:09] <Jymmm> anonimasu so what, just need a trace on it.
[18:38:21] <anonimasu> Jymmm: what are you tracing for?
[18:38:41] <anonimasu> Jymmm: and the amount of data is horrid also..
[18:38:44] <Jymmm> to see where in the code the problem occures
[18:38:53] <Jymmm> at least narrow it down
[18:39:12] <Jymmm> right now it's like being in the koby desert w/o a map
[18:39:54] <anonimasu_> going to try it with that line turned off..
[18:40:58] <les> grr extracted the files and lost em
[18:41:03] <les> hang on
[18:42:06] <anonimasu_> les: I found them again
[18:42:07] <anonimasu_> it's ok
[18:42:07] <anonimasu_> :
[18:43:11] <les> ok
[18:43:25] <les> I sent these to who knows where
[18:44:13] <anonimasu_> still does show up..
[18:44:30] <anonimasu_> I'll add some debug stuff there..
[18:46:20] <Jymmm> did you notice in that plot that the blips are identical?
[18:46:41] <Jymmm> inverse, but identical
[18:47:58] <anonimasu_> * anonimasu_ nods
[18:49:36] <cradek> guys, use sim and gdb
[18:49:44] <cradek> debugging is not hard, there's no reason to use realtime
[18:50:00] <anonimasu_> cradek: how do you set up sim?
[18:50:09] <cradek> build emc1, it's already there
[18:50:16] <anonimasu_> I am not using emc1 :)
[18:50:25] <cradek> sucks to be you then
[18:50:29] <Jymmm> lol
[18:50:38] <Jymmm> what cradek said!
[18:50:45] <Jymmm> =)
[18:50:54] <cradek> (sorry)
[18:51:40] <anonimasu_> cradek: couldnt you trap when the variable gets set to a certain negative value..
[18:52:10] <cradek> you already know which variable is wrong? share!
[18:52:37] <anonimasu_> cradek: look at velocity first..
[18:54:32] <les> we need some more data chris
[18:54:44] <les> plots at different velocities
[18:54:53] <les> plots with colinear lines
[18:56:37] <anonimasu_> cradek: could you explain how to get plots?
[18:57:23] <cradek> in tkemc it's on the menu
[18:57:41] <cradek> just a minute
[18:58:03] <anonimasu_> ah trajectory vels
[19:01:44] <cradek> settings/logging
[19:01:49] <cradek> type: axis velocity
[19:05:55] <anonimasu_> ok
[19:06:35] <anonimasu_> les how many plots do you want?
[19:07:34] <cradek> whoah
[19:07:40] <Jymmm> anonimasu do plots at differnet velocities... 10 20 40 80 160, etc
[19:07:51] <cradek> I got a peak the other way (velocity amplitude higher)
[19:08:42] <les> really
[19:09:02] <anonimasu_> i'll be trying it under power since I have the machine set up
[19:09:08] <les> I have only seen lower
[19:10:02] <cradek> http://timeguy.com/cradek/emc
[19:10:16] <les> it is likely that every single blend does this
[19:10:38] <les> which would go a long way explaining the horrible jitter
[19:11:08] <Jymmm> cradek can you change the resolution of the plot to get more detail in the blips?
[19:11:38] <cradek> I think I would have to increase my velocity, which I haven't been very successful at doing
[19:11:47] <anonimasu_> hm, I cant seem to get emc1 running..
[19:11:50] <anonimasu_> :/
[19:11:58] <anonimasu_> I've forgotten where the install is..
[19:12:13] <anonimasu_> I think I re-wired it.. when I changed to emc2
[19:12:20] <les> just that first peak is anomolously higher
[19:12:39] <les> chris, why the low velocity numbers on the plot?
[19:12:44] <Jymmm> cradek so the detail in the plots is like this http://jelinux.pico-systems.com/images/circleglitch.png
[19:13:36] <cradek> les: I don't know what the numbers mean...
[19:14:50] <les> some sort of autoscale prob
[19:15:32] <Jymmm> Oh John's plot, look at the trailing edge of the blips... CmdVel is goin crazy.
[19:16:06] <les> well it seems not symetrical
[19:16:53] <Jymmm> it's like it's playing catch up
[19:16:56] <les> nor is it centered on the vel peak like it is in chris'
[19:17:40] <Jymmm> I think Chris' plot just lacks the resolution.
[19:17:54] <les> I cannot really see the zero crossing inflection on chris graph either
[19:18:18] <anonimasu_> might be due to different accel/decels..
[19:18:24] <les> yeah
[19:18:30] <anonimasu_> I think jon plots with feedback from teh motors..
[19:18:33] <anonimasu_> the..
[19:18:48] <anonimasu_> with one of he's boards.. also :)
[19:18:58] <les> commanded position wouldn't be
[19:19:08] <Jymmm> les : I can see the zero crossing inflection on chris' on the right side of it
[19:19:20] <Jymmm> (ever so slightly)
[19:19:29] <les> a little wiggle there...but hard to tell
[19:20:05] <Jymmm> ah, chris's scale is way different then John's
[19:20:21] <Jymmm> .0008 vs .04
[19:20:58] <les> You can imagine what fun it was to make all those calls with this bit going on
[19:22:44] <cradek> les: well dig in!
[19:24:42] <Jymmm> cradek you better watch what you say, les is looking for ANY excuse to play with his new tractor!
[19:25:06] <anonimasu_> heh
[19:27:39] <les> I can make plots but a little trouble getting them to a place where others can see them
[19:27:39] <anonimasu_> I'll set up my sim.ini like my emc2 is set up so we can use my real settigns
[19:27:39] <anonimasu_> but it'll be in a hour..
[19:27:39] <anonimasu_> or so
[19:29:00] <les> if the plots at several velocities can be posted on a site Where fred can see them Then I can call and talk algos with him
[19:29:47] <les> I am thoroughly familiar with trap planning math
[19:30:12] <les> That of course does not mean I can decyper his code
[19:30:47] <les> must power down.
[19:30:52] <les> big storm
[19:31:09] <les> l. strikes within 200 mters
[19:31:19] <les> back soon
[19:31:53] <cradek> bye
[19:37:17] <Jymmm> that's gotta be rough... lighting.. unplug everything as fast as you can
[19:37:44] <Jymmm> and my comuter has a TV tuner in it too!
[19:46:54] <Jymmm> storm gone?
[19:47:08] <les> I think...checking radar.
[19:50:14] <les> ok for about 45 minutes
[19:50:20] <Jymmm> eeeesh
[19:50:44] <Jymmm> I was just saying that's gotta be rough... lighting.. unplug everything as fast as you can!
[19:50:57] <les> well the front that promises to end the heat wave is comming through
[19:51:31] <Jymmm> eh, cold beer and A/C, just save the electronics!
[19:51:38] <les> I have ups/ surge but things can still get poped
[19:51:50] <les> popped
[19:51:52] <les> heh
[19:52:12] <Jymmm> Yeah, is there actually anything to prevent it other than unplugging everything?
[19:54:00] <les> that is the best
[19:54:06] <Jymmm> KISS
[19:54:33] <Jymmm> but I've heard of frigs being blown too, when ppl are away for a few days
[19:56:03] <les> anyway was reading a bit
[19:56:31] <bpmw_> Hi guys!
[19:56:33] <les> think blip is related to a velocity or accel clamping event
[19:56:41] <les> hi bpmw
[19:57:03] <Jymmm> les : sounds like the lock I saw in the comments.
[19:57:12] <Jymmm> howdy bpmw_
[19:57:24] <bpmw_> Hows things?
[19:58:30] <les_away> still a little thunder..
[19:58:52] <Jymmm> les : To be brutally honest, unless a debugger is put on, it's just a guessing game where the problem exists. Kinda like chasing 100 chickens to find the one wiht a blue dot on it's butt!
[19:59:48] <les_away> a debugger is sometimes not so useful on algo errors
[19:59:51] <Jymmm> reproducign the problem doens't seem to be an issue, but findig WHERE it occures in the code is. And running a debugger may isolate it to one function or routine
[20:00:09] <les_away> no undoable operations are happening
[20:00:13] <bpmw_> I goota get back to work, will catch up on weekend. Bye for now!
[20:00:21] <les_away> bye
[20:00:40] <Jymmm> Maybe not, but the blips themselves are identical
[20:01:07] <Jymmm> so wherever it's occuring, it's consistant.
[20:01:11] <les_away> Now if the blip vanishes at or below some particular velocity completely...I say it's clamping related
[20:01:20] <les_away> tests will show that
[20:01:35] <anonimasu_> well, I'll soon be going inside..
[20:01:37] <Jymmm> I think they are still there, just not noticable
[20:01:39] <anonimasu_> and we can verify that it happens..
[20:01:45] <anonimasu_> plots do show what happens..
[20:02:28] <les_away> things have to change when the clamping happens
[20:03:01] <les_away> when velocity clamps the peak the average velocity has to drop
[20:03:15] <les_away> then it's triangle rather than trap
[20:03:51] <Jymmm> then why is the cmdVel so busy on the trailing edge?
[20:04:05] <Jymmm> it looks like it's playing catch up
[20:04:35] <Jymmm> the lil red specs on Jon's plot
[20:05:46] <anonimasu> back inside
[20:06:13] <lesnumber3> owwww
[20:06:18] <anonimasu> wb les
[20:06:30] <Jymmm> lighting?
[20:06:46] <lesnumber3> dsl dropping out from it yes
[20:06:54] <lesnumber3> not near
[20:07:18] <Jymmm> you have any clamps on your telco line(s)?
[20:07:27] <Jymmm> arrestors
[20:07:28] <lesnumber3> yeah
[20:07:55] <lesnumber3> and some surge devices
[20:08:19] <Jymmm> cool (like they are gonna save you from a zillion volts)
[20:08:44] <Jymmm> strike hitting a pole 5 miles away I mean
[20:08:48] <anonimasu> /home/an0n/new/emc2-dev/src/emc/kinematics/tp.c
[20:08:50] <anonimasu> whoops
[20:09:00] <anonimasu> ups does insure your stuff
[20:09:01] <anonimasu> :D
[20:09:34] <lesnumber3> my battery is almost gone though...does not stay on long
[20:09:44] <Jymmm> laptop or ups?
[20:09:54] <lesnumber3> this year's ups battery is last years lawn tractor battery
[20:10:01] <Jymmm> lol
[20:10:15] <lesnumber3> each year
[20:11:03] <anonimasu> I'll have this setup in a bit
[20:11:32] <lesnumber3> dsl dropped out again but didn't time out irc
[20:11:56] <Jymmm> emi?
[20:12:08] <lesnumber3> I don't know
[20:12:14] <lesnumber3> it's just the weather
[20:12:35] <Jymmm> yeah
[20:15:50] <anonimasu> now
[20:15:50] <anonimasu> :)
[20:16:08] <lesnumber3> one more to go
[20:16:18] <Jymmm> lol
[20:16:40] <anonimasu> * anonimasu sighs
[20:17:20] <anonimasu> I cant simulate in nonrealtime
[20:17:24] <anonimasu> wont give me real speeds.
[20:17:35] <Jymmm> it doens't matter
[20:17:38] <anonimasu> * anonimasu hates emc1.
[20:17:47] <Jymmm> you don't need a machine connected
[20:17:58] <cradek> anonimasu: the reported/logged numbers are right
[20:18:02] <anonimasu> Jymmm: I like to be able to run mm/min
[20:18:20] <LawrenceG> gedit emc.run
[20:18:30] <Jymmm> anonimasu : It's called SIMULATE for a reason. *sigh*
[20:18:32] <LawrenceG> opps:]
[20:19:25] <anonimasu> Jymmm: *sigh* all you want
[20:21:04] <cradek> anonimasu: it's true the wall time will be wrong, but the vel/accel numbers are right
[20:21:13] <anonimasu> yeah true
[20:23:58] <anonimasu> i'll run it in "
[20:24:22] <lesnumber3> There are many types, but I think emc uses max accel for all blends
[20:24:54] <anonimasu> i'll do a full circle.. g2 x0 y0 i0 j10 f10-70
[20:25:00] <lesnumber3> velocity floats unless it is clamped
[20:25:03] <anonimasu> err 2 ones..
[20:26:13] <LawrenceG> is it possible to run emc2 in simulate easily?
[20:26:21] <lesnumber3> some trap schemes float both vel and accel to try and get a symetrical three equal part trapezoid
[20:26:34] <anonimasu> no idea it does not have the the logging componenet
[20:26:37] <anonimasu> component..
[20:26:46] <LawrenceG> tnx...
[20:26:49] <anonimasu> cradek: can you give me your logging values?
[20:26:53] <lesnumber3> Hi lawrence I don't know either
[20:27:53] <LawrenceG> I have emc1 from about 2000 (rh8.0) on the laptop.... will see if I can get that going as a comparison
[20:28:32] <lesnumber3> care to join the blipbug hunt?
[20:29:20] <LawrenceG> yep... it may relate to my recent experiences with tuning max accell/vel and axis acell and vel
[20:29:33] <lesnumber3> great
[20:30:15] <anonimasu> * anonimasu sighs
[20:30:26] <anonimasu> cradek: can you give me the settings to catch the peak's..
[20:30:46] <cradek> anonimasu: which settings do you mean?
[20:30:53] <anonimasu> cradek: size skip/all
[20:30:55] <anonimasu> for the logging
[20:31:28] <cradek> oh! I didn't change anything there
[20:31:34] <cradek> I guess I didn't even notice them
[20:32:22] <anonimasu> it shows up between the arcs..
[20:32:23] <anonimasu> clearly
[20:38:01] <LawrenceG> what are you guys using for a test gcode file?
[20:38:33] <LawrenceG> mdi?
[20:38:49] <anonimasu> g2 x0 y0 i0 j0.5 f??
[20:38:55] <anonimasu> 2 after another
[20:38:55] <LawrenceG> tnx
[20:42:33] <anonimasu> I am running one at 5
[20:42:37] <anonimasu> it blips at all velocities..
[20:42:58] <anonimasu> at slow speeds it's just unnoticeable..
[20:43:44] <Jymmm> can you change the resolution of the plot?
[20:43:48] <anonimasu> no
[20:44:00] <anonimasu> at lower speeds you get more res
[20:44:36] <Jymmm> Jon's plot was .0008 and Chris' was at .04
[20:44:44] <anonimasu> depends on what speed you run
[20:44:51] <anonimasu> the lower speed plots are more high res
[20:45:01] <anonimasu> I have 10-60ipm plots now
[20:45:01] <Jymmm> oh it's automatic =(
[20:45:25] <Jymmm> anonimasu whats the scale on the left side of the plot?
[20:45:58] <Jymmm> (top left corner)
[20:46:19] <anonimasu> 0.2
[20:46:36] <anonimasu> and 1.5 on the fastest
[20:46:49] <anonimasu> it dosent really matter though..
[20:46:54] <anonimasu> you should have a look..
[20:47:11] <lesnumber3> so describe how the blip changes with spped
[20:47:17] <lesnumber3> or post...
[20:47:22] <anonimasu> they dont..
[20:47:38] <anonimasu> wait.
[20:48:22] <anonimasu> www.bojn.net/~an0n/plots.zip
[20:48:25] <anonimasu> enjoy :)
[20:48:29] <lesnumber3> ty
[20:48:39] <anonimasu> lesnumber3: the blips always happens..
[20:48:46] <anonimasu> speed dosent matter..
[20:49:31] <anonimasu> I might have saved over 30ipm with 20ipm..
[20:49:33] <anonimasu> damn
[20:49:40] <anonimasu> but it does show on all different ones..
[20:53:25] <anonimasu> lesnumber3: had a look yet?
[20:55:29] <lesnumber3> looking closely
[20:57:26] <lesnumber3> so there is no distinct threshhold
[20:57:39] <anonimasu> always there..
[20:57:49] <lesnumber3> which suggests to me it is not a clamping realted thing
[20:57:58] <lesnumber3> related
[20:58:00] <anonimasu> * anonimasu nods
[20:58:06] <anonimasu> it's as there's a miscalc during blending
[20:58:14] <lesnumber3> tour accel must be set high
[20:58:19] <lesnumber3> your
[20:58:27] <anonimasu> just the stock sim.ini accel
[20:59:13] <lesnumber3> drop that number down a bunch and think the blip v will open up?
[20:59:28] <anonimasu> want me to try it?
[20:59:32] <lesnumber3> please
[21:00:07] <lesnumber3> if it does, we know the bad calc is using MAX_ACCEL
[21:00:30] <anonimasu> dropping it to 10
[21:00:37] <lesnumber3> from?
[21:00:41] <anonimasu> 20
[21:00:43] <lesnumber3> ok
[21:00:48] <anonimasu> and default to 10
[21:01:01] <lesnumber3> ok
[21:01:12] <anonimasu> I only have to change the traj MAX_ACCEL
[21:01:15] <anonimasu> first
[21:01:17] <anonimasu> er
[21:01:36] <anonimasu> that should stop overide the separate axis:es
[21:01:39] <anonimasu> right?
[21:01:41] <lesnumber3> right I forgot...I don't use per axis
[21:02:14] <lesnumber3> I think...change em all to be sure
[21:02:55] <anonimasu> ye�p
[21:03:04] <anonimasu> what speeds do you want plots of?
[21:03:19] <anonimasu> 10ipm seems nice
[21:03:27] <lesnumber3> perhaps just one of the slower ones...more resolution
[21:03:50] <lesnumber3> ok 10
[21:04:53] <anonimasu> makes no diff.
[21:05:19] <lesnumber3> hmm
[21:05:38] <lesnumber3> hope it was enough to catch the next pair of points
[21:05:44] <anonimasu> no
[21:06:03] <anonimasu> there are no next pair of points
[21:06:53] <lesnumber3> if the v were less than twice as wide it wouldn't catch them
[21:06:59] <lesnumber3> right?
[21:07:43] <anonimasu> www.bojn.net/~an0n/10ipmlvel..jpg
[21:07:46] <anonimasu> made a typo ;)
[21:07:48] <anonimasu> but there it is
[21:08:42] <anonimasu> I lowered the feed override and got more res
[21:08:45] <anonimasu> but there are no more points
[21:09:13] <lesnumber3> link is dead...
[21:09:46] <anonimasu> wait a bit
[21:09:51] <anonimasu> www.bojn.net/~an0n/2.7ipm.jpg
[21:10:05] <anonimasu> www.bojn.net/~an0n/2.7ipm.JPG
[21:10:08] <anonimasu> www.bojn.net/~an0n/10ipmlvel..JPG
[21:10:09] <anonimasu> ;)
[21:10:22] <anonimasu> look at the 2.7ipm
[21:10:27] <anonimasu> I forced it down with feed override
[21:10:43] <lesnumber3> dead link still
[21:11:21] <anonimasu> http://www.bojn.net/~an0n/10ipmlvel.jpg
[21:11:36] <anonimasu> http://www.bojn.net/~an0n/2.7ipm.jpg
[21:11:38] <anonimasu> they should work :)
[21:11:42] <anonimasu> I renamed them
[21:12:08] <lesnumber3> got it
[21:12:30] <anonimasu> interesting right?
[21:12:42] <anonimasu> I think the blending algorithm is fscked.
[21:12:51] <anonimasu> entirely positively fscked.
[21:13:00] <lesnumber3> well....it says it is a wild number...not related to programmed accel
[21:14:13] <anonimasu> does the blending work at all?
[21:14:22] <anonimasu> I think not..
[21:14:28] <anonimasu> it's just not noticeable at lower speeds
[21:14:47] <lesnumber3> so it appears worse at higher speeds...hmmm....simply because all the numbers get bigger?
[21:15:00] <anonimasu> yeah
[21:15:06] <lesnumber3> I do suspect this happens withall blends
[21:15:08] <anonimasu> I have a wild idea.
[21:15:12] <lesnumber3> ?
[21:15:18] <anonimasu> how about clamping MAX_VELOCITY_CHANGE
[21:15:21] <anonimasu> between two segments..
[21:16:23] <anonimasu> lets see where do I add it..
[21:16:52] <lesnumber3> I have seen then on x any y simultaneously with 45 arcs Lawrence
[21:17:15] <anonimasu> lesnumber3: I am making full circles..
[21:17:26] <LawrenceG> ok... I havent figured out how to get all axis logging... my plots only log the selected axis
[21:17:32] <anonimasu> LawrenceG: default ;)
[21:17:44] <lesnumber3> ah ok thats why no blip on top part
[21:18:16] <Jymmm> ok, how do you enable SIM mode?
[21:18:24] <anonimasu> ./sim.run
[21:18:33] <anonimasu> tc->currentPos = newPos;
[21:18:33] <anonimasu> tc->currentVel = newVel;
[21:18:33] <anonimasu> tc->currentAccel = newAccel;
[21:18:35] <anonimasu> after thoose lines
[21:18:55] <anonimasu> if ( tc->currentPos = newPos;
[21:18:55] <anonimasu> tc->currentVel = newVel;
[21:18:55] <anonimasu> tc->currentAccel = newAccel;
[21:18:56] <anonimasu> err
[21:19:32] <anonimasu> *thinks hard*
[21:21:36] <lesnumber3> I have to bring the code back up....didn't after shuting down
[21:21:40] <anonimasu> ah
[21:21:44] <anonimasu> do it please and have a look
[21:21:56] <lesnumber3> k for what it's worth!
[21:22:04] <lesnumber3> tp or tc?
[21:22:09] <anonimasu> tc
[21:22:11] <lesnumber3> k
[21:23:19] <anonimasu> I am making now
[21:23:26] <anonimasu> I prevented it from changing velocities..
[21:23:30] <anonimasu> in the first place..
[21:23:39] <Jymmm> I dont have sim.run =(
[21:23:48] <anonimasu> emc1?
[21:23:54] <Jymmm> bdi 420
[21:24:01] <lesnumber3> line no on tc (i'll try alt g)
[21:24:05] <lesnumber3> ?
[21:24:08] <anonimasu> wait a sec..
[21:24:13] <anonimasu> going to start a compile
[21:24:21] <lesnumber3> k
[21:25:29] <lesnumber3> whoops
[21:25:49] <JymmmEMC> ?
[21:26:21] <lesnumber3> I think the only solution of no velocity change allowed is....
[21:26:26] <lesnumber3> no motion!
[21:26:28] <lesnumber3> haha
[21:26:46] <JymmmEMC> What's wrong with that? =)
[21:26:50] <lesnumber3> heh
[21:26:51] <anonimasu> making now..
[21:27:13] <lesnumber3> place bets now on lock up or not
[21:28:11] <anonimasu> if ( newVel > (tc->currentVel+MAX_VELOCITY_CHANGE) || newVel < (tc->currentVel-MAX_VELOCITY_CHANGE ) {
[21:28:15] <JymmmEMC> Lock up tigher than OJ in a White Bronco!
[21:28:39] <anonimasu> ;)
[21:28:48] <JymmmEMC> well shit, no sim.run for soem reason
[21:29:25] <anonimasu> grab a emc off cvs
[21:30:18] <JymmmEMC> can cvs version be a seperate install?
[21:30:34] <anonimasu> yes
[21:31:04] <lesnumber3> I have four installs on the cnc box
[21:31:07] <JymmmEMC> just tell me how
[21:31:52] <anonimasu> compiles.
[21:31:56] <anonimasu> compiled..
[21:32:06] <anonimasu> now lets see hell break loose ;)
[21:32:12] <lesnumber3> haha
[21:32:27] <anonimasu> if you clamp the change you can probably solve it..
[21:32:40] <anonimasu> hack hack.
[21:32:55] <anonimasu> or well get away with the blip..
[21:33:00] <lesnumber3> will be a corner rounder?
[21:33:15] <anonimasu> hm no..
[21:34:11] <lesnumber3> big hero to fix this...I think it has always been there
[21:34:33] <lesnumber3> plagueing people and slipping steps for thousands!
[21:34:39] <lesnumber3> heh
[21:34:59] <anonimasu> in axis_velocity you can see it clearly
[21:35:16] <lesnumber3> but it was good for my sander...more pay
[21:35:44] <lesnumber3> running yet?
[21:36:07] <anonimasu> yeah..
[21:36:21] <lesnumber3> and (holding breath)
[21:36:32] <anonimasu> making again
[21:36:39] <anonimasu> going to check the plot and see if the change were at the right place
[21:36:55] <lesnumber3> ok
[21:37:00] <lesnumber3> brb
[21:37:00] <anonimasu> actually
[21:37:04] <lesnumber3> yes?
[21:37:04] <anonimasu> it's the wrong plots we have
[21:37:14] <anonimasu> it's the trajectory velocity plots I made..
[21:37:24] <lesnumber3> you need axis velocity
[21:37:27] <anonimasu> if you make axis velocity plot you get commanded versus actual..
[21:37:36] <anonimasu> but you see the same there..
[21:37:38] <lesnumber3> yeah
[21:37:38] <anonimasu> but with more res
[21:37:42] <anonimasu> it's a smooth ^
[21:37:44] <lesnumber3> hey brb
[21:37:49] <anonimasu> ok
[21:38:01] <JymmmEMC> lesnumber3: go check radar
[21:39:39] <JymmmEMC> ok, wheres the plotting located at?
[21:39:59] <JymmmEMC> I'm using TkEMC if that makes a diff
[21:40:38] <anonimasu> logging
[21:41:13] <anonimasu> somwhere
[21:41:30] <JymmmEMC> heh
[21:42:21] <Jymmm> g2 x0 y0 i0 j0.5 f
[21:42:36] <anonimasu> f10
[21:42:50] <JymmmEMC> k
[21:43:54] <JymmmEMC> bah can't get into MDI mode
[21:44:49] <anonimasu> I compiled the wrong thing ;)
[21:44:53] <anonimasu> realtime/nonrealtime
[21:45:15] <JymmmEMC> I hate when that happens!
[21:52:42] <anonimasu> *yawn*
[21:53:24] <JymmmEMC> bah, now I can't get logging to start
[21:53:36] <anonimasu> why not?
[21:54:17] <JymmmEMC> no clue. I click START it does nada
[21:54:39] <LawrenceG> interesting... at 100% feedrate glitch is to a higher -ve.... at 120% feedrate it is towards a more positive velocity (same part of curve... one outside, one inside)
[21:55:32] <robin_sz> meep?
[21:55:37] <anonimasu> frrzp
[21:56:48] <anonimasu> we are toying with the tp
[21:58:30] <anonimasu> I am trying to break it
[21:58:31] <JymmmEMC> not us
[21:58:46] <anonimasu> :(
[21:58:47] <JymmmEMC> "we would never do such a thing" =)
[21:59:56] <JymmmEMC> do you have to START logging before entering MDI?
[22:00:01] <anonimasu> I dont know
[22:00:01] <anonimasu> no
[22:00:07] <anonimasu> before you do the move
[22:00:20] <JymmmEMC> thats what I thought.
[22:01:21] <anonimasu> fsck. emcsegmotsim..
[22:01:22] <anonimasu> yeah
[22:01:33] <anonimasu> * anonimasu is kind of pissed.
[22:03:36] <Jymmm> only sorta kinda?
[22:03:43] <anonimasu> not really
[22:03:45] <anonimasu> I am furioud
[22:03:46] <anonimasu> s
[22:05:40] <anonimasu> ah finally
[22:05:42] <anonimasu> I broke it ;)
[22:09:53] <lesnumber3> a bit confused
[22:10:11] <lesnumber3> Lawrence affected it with feedrate anders did not
[22:10:22] <anonimasu> les: my sim was running segmentqueue.
[22:10:27] <anonimasu> lesnumber3: bah..
[22:10:28] <lesnumber3> oh
[22:10:30] <anonimasu> <- feels stupid.
[22:10:35] <anonimasu> crap.
[22:10:37] <lesnumber3> I had to run out and get dinner
[22:10:40] <anonimasu> nice
[22:10:45] <anonimasu> I am fiddling with it a bit now though
[22:10:55] <lesnumber3> now I have to eat it!
[22:12:30] <robin_sz> I see there was lots of activity on the gecko list today ..
[22:12:41] <robin_sz> Mr Shaver made a guest appearance
[22:12:49] <lesnumber3> you know, I never found a good web tutorial on trap planning
[22:12:58] <lesnumber3> I could make one...
[22:13:05] <robin_sz> I can help there
[22:13:12] <robin_sz> heres some tips
[22:13:12] <lesnumber3> what did matt have to say?
[22:13:28] <robin_sz> make sure your trap is well hidden and not visible from the path
[22:13:37] <robin_sz> put lots of spikes in the bottom
[22:13:39] <lesnumber3> haha
[22:13:46] <robin_sz> Matt .. oh
[22:14:08] <lesnumber3> I actually wrote a trp planner for the lm628 in dos/c a long time ago
[22:14:31] <robin_sz> he sorta seemed to be doing the "the G101 looks OK, but I dont like the license on the rabbit libraries .. and the compiler wont run under Whine"
[22:14:54] <lesnumber3> yeah well look at emc:
[22:15:10] <robin_sz> do I have to?
[22:15:13] <lesnumber3> http://jelinux.pico-systems.com/images/circleglitch.png
[22:15:24] <lesnumber3> cute huh
[22:15:39] <lesnumber3> that is the blend glitch
[22:15:39] <robin_sz> omigod!
[22:15:50] <robin_sz> 3 tenths of a thou?
[22:16:00] <anonimasu> robin_sz: it's a dead stop at high speeds
[22:16:01] <lesnumber3> I endured that through all those turkey calls
[22:16:24] <robin_sz> borked then
[22:16:31] <anonimasu> no shit!
[22:16:35] <lesnumber3> heh
[22:16:37] <anonimasu> heh
[22:16:51] <cradek> it sure works great for me, even though it's obviously totally wrong
[22:17:06] <robin_sz> well, good luck trying to dig through the fungus to fix it
[22:17:09] <lesnumber3> the path vectors are ok...just the tangiential velocity poops
[22:17:20] <cradek> I really need the original description of the algorithm
[22:17:21] <lesnumber3> makes nice burns as chip load drops
[22:17:29] <cradek> yeah, the path is correct
[22:17:48] <lesnumber3> I did a web search
[22:17:51] <lesnumber3> no good
[22:17:55] <lesnumber3> it is too old
[22:17:56] <Jymmm> * Jymmm is always happy to see robin_sz's positive outlook on things =)
[22:17:58] <cradek> the original writer obviously worked from some document, and I want whatever it was
[22:18:02] <lesnumber3> but I have my book.
[22:18:13] <lesnumber3> should scan it and post a page
[22:18:24] <robin_sz> lesnumber3: try running an "obround" pattern .. two half circles, joined by short lines ...
[22:18:27] <cradek> a different reference might help, but it'll probably be to different to help "find the simple bug"
[22:18:35] <anonimasu> yeah
[22:18:40] <lesnumber3> I will call Fred as soon as I digest all this
[22:18:42] <cradek> I'm off to go home now
[22:18:54] <lesnumber3> ok
[22:18:58] <anonimasu> les you should call him and have a talk
[22:18:58] <cradek> lesnumber3: maybe he will remember what book he used or something
[22:19:00] <lesnumber3> and I am going to eat
[22:19:13] <anonimasu> lesnumber3: tomorrow afternoon like when we started to talk about this
[22:19:19] <anonimasu> I'll provide you with more plots..
[22:19:24] <robin_sz> that error is just in the plain "go round a circle" code?
[22:19:25] <anonimasu> with the velocity of one axis.
[22:19:31] <anonimasu> robin_sz: in all blends
[22:19:33] <lesnumber3> ok
[22:19:36] <robin_sz> ick
[22:19:50] <robin_sz> so ..
[22:19:51] <lesnumber3> robin it happens on colinear straight segments too
[22:19:57] <robin_sz> lovely
[22:19:57] <anonimasu> lesnumber3: try and get a book from him so we can have a read..
[22:20:00] <lesnumber3> may happen on all blends
[22:20:15] <lesnumber3> when I complain about it stuttering...
[22:20:15] <robin_sz> * robin_sz wonders how hard it should be to belnd two collinear segmetns
[22:20:23] <anonimasu> robin_sz: very hard :D
[22:20:32] <lesnumber3> haha
[22:20:34] <lesnumber3> biab
[22:20:47] <robin_sz> so .. today I was cutting 10mm plate
[22:20:54] <robin_sz> fsck thats heavy stuff to move
[22:21:15] <anonimasu> nice
[22:21:27] <anonimasu> I've milled 5mm off my large ass iron block.
[22:21:29] <anonimasu> :D
[22:21:30] <robin_sz> not a great cut, but OK
[22:21:36] <robin_sz> heh
[22:21:40] <anonimasu> will take it to the saw tomorrow
[22:21:43] <robin_sz> dust everywhere?
[22:21:47] <anonimasu> no
[22:21:51] <anonimasu> high feed.. ;)
[22:21:53] <anonimasu> 800mm/min
[22:21:56] <anonimasu> and 3000rpm
[22:22:02] <robin_sz> right
[22:22:08] <anonimasu> it wouldnt cut nicely at lower speeds..
[22:22:11] <anonimasu> everything vibrated..
[22:22:16] <robin_sz> just ... please, clean it all up
[22:22:19] <anonimasu> heh
[22:22:21] <anonimasu> when I am done..
[22:22:27] <anonimasu> I found a speed where the mill would stop resonating
[22:22:48] <robin_sz> well, at least brush it off the guidways
[22:23:07] <robin_sz> it seems to rust and bind on overnight
[22:24:13] <Jacky^> hello
[22:26:54] <anonimasu> ok
[22:29:37] <anonimasu> I have a clue..
[22:31:22] <Jymmm> candlestick in the library?
[22:31:51] <anonimasu> I added ( ) to a calculation
[22:31:55] <anonimasu> and the ^ became a dip
[22:32:13] <anonimasu> newVel = tc->currentVel + (newAccel * tc->cycleTime);
[22:32:14] <Jymmm> OOP ?!
[22:32:19] <Jymmm> lol
[22:32:23] <anonimasu> usually newVel = tc->currentVel + newAccel * tc->cycleTime;
[22:32:40] <Jymmm> OOP == Order of precidense
[22:33:11] <Jymmm> is it consistant?
[22:33:17] <anonimasu> consistent?
[22:33:35] <Jymmm> you know what I mean!
[22:33:50] <Jymmm> is it?
[22:33:52] <anonimasu> it's the same as with the other code I tried but it falls instead..
[22:34:04] <anonimasu> I am trying to find out where it calcs the accel..
[22:34:04] <Jymmm> hmmm,
[22:42:18] <anonimasu> hm..
[22:42:35] <robin_sz> weird ...
[22:42:45] <robin_sz> the * should binf more tightly than +
[22:42:54] <robin_sz> the () shold nto affect it there
[22:43:05] <anonimasu> robin_sz: it does
[22:43:09] <robin_sz> weird
[22:43:16] <anonimasu> it causes newaccel * Tc->cycletime to be calculated before they are joined..
[22:43:39] <robin_sz> it should do that anyway
[22:43:53] <anonimasu> hm, yeah..
[22:44:01] <anonimasu> * takes precendence over +
[22:44:18] <robin_sz> normally yeah
[22:44:30] <robin_sz> ah well, good fishing :)
[22:44:33] <anonimasu> yeah
[22:44:42] <anonimasu> I'll start by removing the scaling stuff tomorrow..
[22:44:49] <robin_sz> scaling?
[22:44:52] <anonimasu> yeah
[22:44:54] <anonimasu> for feed override..
[22:44:59] <anonimasu> so I dont have to see it while looking
[22:44:59] <robin_sz> coo
[22:45:12] <anonimasu> makes it 100% easier to follow
[22:45:21] <anonimasu> and allows me to remove lots of checks
[22:45:23] <robin_sz> its icky in there isn;t it?
[22:45:26] <anonimasu> yeah
[22:45:55] <robin_sz> I'm going to go play with the G101 again :)
[22:45:59] <anonimasu> I wish we could find aexplanation about it..
[22:46:47] <anonimasu> err a desc of the algo
[22:54:17] <anonimasu> ah well
[22:54:18] <anonimasu> tomorrow.
[23:02:49] <robin_sz> so soon?
[23:03:21] <anonimasu> yeah
[23:04:19] <robin_sz> badger badger badger badger ....
[23:10:11] <anonimasu> I need to let my brain do something else
[23:10:26] <anonimasu> this stuff is like inserting glowing needles at strategic places.
[23:30:54] <lesnumber3> back but now another storm is coming
[23:33:50] <lesnumber3> oh no. I See a list message from Ken Lerman. He discovered the blip while milling threads!
[23:34:28] <lesnumber3> People all over are discovering this...but it has always been there I think. Why?
[23:36:45] <anonimasu> yeah I think so
[23:36:56] <anonimasu> because they are looking
[23:39:26] <robin_sz> mmm, les didnt have to look *that* hard to see the results
[23:39:32] <robin_sz> judder shake judder
[23:44:50] <lesnumber3> well tangiential path is correct but when it makes a big velocity drop chip load drops too and leaves a bad bump or burn
[23:45:35] <lesnumber3> I may drop out...another big storm coming
[23:46:00] <lesnumber3> This must have hail...the sat tv is out and only hail does that
[23:46:18] <lesnumber3> it is a pretty good radar!
[23:47:43] <lesnumber3> bang! strikes. I'm off again
[23:49:46] <robin_sz> mmm Sherry!
[23:56:18] <cradek> Ken's problem could be simple backlash, we don't know
[23:59:12] <anonimasu> yeah, that's a possibility
[23:59:16] <anonimasu> does it show up on the plot?