#emc | Logs for 2005-07-11

[09:40:15] <alex_joni> logger_aj, bookmark
[09:40:15] <alex_joni> See http://solaris.cs.utt.ro/irc/irc.freenode.net:6667/emc/2005-07-11#T09-40-15
[09:40:30] <fenn> morning
[09:41:04] <fenn> hey are you controlling your parallel cable robot with emc?
[09:41:23] <alex_joni> not parallel
[09:41:27] <alex_joni> but yes (emc2)
[09:41:37] <fenn> whaddya mean not parallel?
[09:42:23] <fenn> the one with three motors in a triangle, mig tips as guides
[09:43:40] <fenn> looks parallel to me
[09:44:45] <alex_joni> parallel?
[09:44:49] <alex_joni> how so?
[09:45:51] <fenn> as in parallel kinematics
[09:45:57] <fenn> the three wires move in parallel
[09:46:10] <fenn> compare to a robot arm, which has actuators arranged in serial
[09:46:28] <alex_joni> I see.. but I have a different notion for parallel ;)
[09:46:42] <fenn> i dont mean parallel like two parallel lines
[09:46:52] <alex_joni> right
[09:47:00] <fenn> i'm not making this up as i go :)
[09:47:19] <fenn> anyway, which motion module did you use for kinematics?
[09:48:11] <fenn> minitetra.o?
[09:48:41] <A-L-P-H-A> morning folks.
[09:49:12] <alex_joni> I made mine
[09:49:15] <fenn> i dont even see anything related to parallel kinematics in the emc2 src tree
[09:49:19] <alex_joni> it's a tripodkin
[09:49:26] <alex_joni> it's not in cvs
[09:49:29] <alex_joni> yet
[09:49:30] <fenn> okay
[09:50:04] <fenn> wb alpha
[09:50:12] <alex_joni> * alex_joni goes to grab breakfast
[09:50:39] <A-L-P-H-A> hmm... breakfast.
[09:50:41] <A-L-P-H-A> I just had a salad.
[09:50:50] <A-L-P-H-A> should I made some pig and chickens?
[09:50:51] <A-L-P-H-A> make
[09:51:20] <alex_joni> pig & chickens?
[09:51:41] <fenn> potatoes, cocoa powder, concentrated saturated fat.
[09:51:45] <fenn> eat!
[09:51:52] <alex_joni> fenn: btw, there's a genhexkin for emc1
[09:52:03] <alex_joni> I could have used that.. but a new one was cleaner
[09:52:11] <A-L-P-H-A> alex_joni, bacon and eggs.
[09:52:34] <alex_joni> A-L-P-H-A: sounds like a plan
[09:53:24] <fenn> looking at genhexkins now..
[09:54:16] <alex_joni> alex_joni is now known as alex_joni_eating
[10:01:51] <fenn> cool genhexkins.c is exactly what i wanted
[10:03:51] <fenn> damn math people.. why can't they use english?
[10:04:08] <fenn> they always use some obscure greek letter that you can't look up to figure out what it means
[10:06:00] <fenn> what is a backwards six? is it a lowercase delta? as in derivative?
[10:11:50] <fenn> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacobian_matrix
[10:15:12] <fenn> nevermind... it's just a stupid way of writing a lowercase delta
[10:21:01] <alex_joni_eating> alex_joni_eating is now known as alex_joni
[10:26:12] <alex_joni> fenn: what do you want to do?
[10:26:56] <A-L-P-H-A> argh
[10:26:59] <A-L-P-H-A> I'm gringing.
[10:27:03] <A-L-P-H-A> calculas again.
[10:27:09] <A-L-P-H-A> <-- B.sc math
[10:27:13] <A-L-P-H-A> :/
[10:27:14] <A-L-P-H-A> run away!
[10:30:18] <alex_joni> lol
[10:37:17] <alex_joni> * alex_joni goes outside
[10:37:18] <alex_joni> bye guys
[10:47:54] <fenn> meh
[10:48:08] <fenn> math isnt so hard, it's just conveyed badly
[10:48:21] <fenn> i.e. taught badly, explained badly, demonstrated badly
[10:49:08] <fenn> they give you these complicated glyphs and expect you to draw pictures in your head, but then they never show you examples of what the pictures you shuold be drawing in your head look like!
[10:52:17] <fenn> lazy professors, 3d graphics should be a requirement for math teachers
[10:58:54] <A-L-P-H-A> heh.
[10:59:00] <A-L-P-H-A> my calc profs were never that bad.
[11:00:22] <fenn> i've never seen a math prof give you a 3d graph when talking about a 3d function
[11:46:06] <fenn> yeesh.. the ps3 graphics unit puts out 1.8 teraflops
[11:49:57] <alex_joni> heh
[11:50:13] <A-L-P-H-A> fenn, my profs did a decent job.
[11:50:35] <alex_joni> A-L-P-H-A: calculus?
[11:50:45] <A-L-P-H-A> yup
[11:50:58] <A-L-P-H-A> well, the ones the spoke english did.
[11:50:58] <A-L-P-H-A> :)
[11:51:18] <A-L-P-H-A> though profs they hired off the western european bus, really were crap.
[11:51:27] <A-L-P-H-A> geniuses... but couldn't communicate at all.
[11:51:49] <alex_joni> lol
[11:52:03] <A-L-P-H-A> image a computer scientist, that stutters, and has a thick western european accent. Trying to teach you solid state machine logic.
[11:52:30] <fenn> makes me want to go back to college
[11:52:37] <fenn> er, wait no it doesnt
[11:53:21] <fenn> i think instead of signing up for classes, you should just sign up for "technical support"
[11:53:35] <A-L-P-H-A> <shrug>
[11:53:36] <fenn> then every time you run into a problem or get stuck, you stop by the prof's office and he helps you out
[11:53:41] <A-L-P-H-A> I'm going back to school in September.
[11:53:44] <A-L-P-H-A> Forensic accounting.
[11:53:56] <fenn> huh?
[11:54:06] <A-L-P-H-A> <-- turning into a bean counter.
[11:54:14] <fenn> detecting corrupt corporations by examining their paper trails?
[11:54:43] <A-L-P-H-A> yes
[11:54:53] <A-L-P-H-A> prevention of enron type scandals.
[11:54:56] <fenn> it's not really called forensic accounting is it?
[11:54:59] <A-L-P-H-A> and nortel.
[11:55:03] <A-L-P-H-A> it really is.
[11:55:08] <fenn> wow
[11:55:12] <fenn> you're fighting the good fight, lad
[11:55:38] <fenn> good luck getting a job :)
[11:55:50] <A-L-P-H-A> if someone actually paid attention... it wouldn't really be that hard to know enron was a scam. Like... look at sales vs revenue vs profit.
[11:55:56] <A-L-P-H-A> actually check up on those sales.
[11:56:03] <A-L-P-H-A> and look at the bank account.
[11:56:05] <A-L-P-H-A> <shrug>
[11:56:06] <A-L-P-H-A> oh well.
[11:56:15] <A-L-P-H-A> I didn't have any stocks in them. :)
[11:56:52] <fenn> hmm.. so if you find a company that's about to go bankrupt, do you say something? or wait until they go bankrupt and buy up all their stock?
[11:57:10] <A-L-P-H-A> fenn, sell short. :)
[11:57:38] <fenn> eh, i dont understand wall-street
[11:57:50] <A-L-P-H-A> that's why you're not rich. :) hehehe
[11:57:55] <A-L-P-H-A> that's why I'm not either!
[11:57:57] <fenn> maybe
[11:58:21] <A-L-P-H-A> I need to find a relay switch that's good for like 15 amps @ 120VAC.
[11:58:27] <fenn> i prefer to think it's my superior compassion and profound laziness
[11:58:57] <fenn> magnetic contactor?
[11:59:03] <fenn> to keep your router turned on?
[11:59:31] <A-L-P-H-A> ouch.
[11:59:41] <A-L-P-H-A> they're expensive.
[11:59:52] <A-L-P-H-A> cheapest one is $8.35USD.
[11:59:53] <A-L-P-H-A> :/
[11:59:56] <A-L-P-H-A> on digikey.com
[12:00:13] <A-L-P-H-A> 20am ones are $35.
[12:00:15] <A-L-P-H-A> amp
[12:00:28] <fenn> that's a bit much
[12:00:38] <fenn> try ebay
[12:03:43] <A-L-P-H-A> cheapest on ebay $2.00. but it looks OLD.
[12:03:50] <A-L-P-H-A> it's got oxidation and everything
[12:04:41] <alex_joni> ever heard of bush robots?
[12:04:46] <alex_joni> http://www.frc.ri.cmu.edu/users/hpm/project.archive/robot.papers/1999/NASA.report.99/9901.NASA.AA.html
[12:05:47] <fenn> you mean the presidents?
[12:06:26] <fenn> looks like a fractal to me
[12:06:29] <alex_joni> nah ..*g*
[12:06:34] <alex_joni> smthg like that
[12:06:44] <alex_joni> but it's supposed to be articulated
[12:06:52] <alex_joni> with a LOT of joints
[12:08:06] <fenn> i wonder what is the point
[12:08:06] <A-L-P-H-A> that's a pretty fractal sculpture.
[12:08:34] <A-L-P-H-A> none... besides a 3d real life view of it.
[12:08:43] <fenn> attack of the killer broccoli
[12:08:47] <alex_joni> lol
[12:11:17] <fenn> they say it's because they are the "most dexterous robots imaginable"
[12:11:31] <fenn> even though they dont expect to be able to make anything for at least the next 50 years
[12:11:49] <alex_joni> this is nice
[12:11:50] <alex_joni> http://www.cours.polymtl.ca/roboop/
[12:11:57] <alex_joni> imagine this linked to emc
[12:12:06] <alex_joni> for backplot
[12:13:17] <fenn> nah they'd never accept it.. it's OO :P
[12:13:26] <alex_joni> heh
[12:14:18] <fenn> that would be useful to guide someone through setting up the proper kinematics
[12:14:46] <A-L-P-H-A> know what I really want... have absolutely no need... a titanium kenetic watch.
[12:15:01] <fenn> wtf is that?
[12:15:15] <fenn> gears and wheels made out of titanium?
[12:15:28] <A-L-P-H-A> a watch... that's made of titainium... that's kenetic.
[12:15:37] <A-L-P-H-A> kenetic, self winding by the motion of the wearer.
[12:15:42] <fenn> oh
[12:16:05] <alex_joni> jeez...
[12:16:09] <fenn> would you settle for a regular kenetic watch?
[12:16:12] <alex_joni> Denavit-Hertenberg parameters?
[12:16:27] <alex_joni> Inertia tensor mass
[12:16:31] <A-L-P-H-A> fenn, no... the titanium just throws it over the top coolness.
[12:16:41] <alex_joni> like really COOL
[12:16:45] <alex_joni> especially in the winter
[12:16:59] <A-L-P-H-A> I'm not leaving it outside. it'd attached to me.
[12:16:59] <fenn> denavit-hartenberg?
[12:18:23] <alex_joni> fenn: to define a new robot
[12:19:52] <fenn> sounds complicated
[12:20:29] <A-L-P-H-A> just give me nanobots that build, and self replicate.
[12:20:42] <A-L-P-H-A> I wanna make an industrial grey goo accident.
[12:21:36] <fenn> is it just a general way to specify how joints are connected?
[12:22:06] <fenn> like, these DOF's are constrained to this object, these DOF's are free
[12:23:09] <fenn> or do you have to program in more, like where the mass is distributed in each part
[12:23:25] <alex_joni> dunno :D
[12:23:33] <alex_joni> your guess is as good as mine ;)
[12:24:32] <fenn> dammit alex you're supposed to know everything!
[12:25:04] <alex_joni> lol
[12:25:09] <alex_joni> I just started playing with this
[12:25:11] <alex_joni> seems nice
[12:25:22] <alex_joni> you can choose some controller, trajectory
[12:25:23] <alex_joni> etc
[12:25:51] <A-L-P-H-A> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=31387&item=5012739394&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW
[12:25:55] <A-L-P-H-A> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=31387&item=5011728663&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW
[12:27:41] <fenn> i wonder why they need a new class for stewart platforms
[12:28:00] <fenn> i thought the point was to be general purpose enough to just program in the kinematics
[12:31:57] <A-L-P-H-A> damn. I wished I had money.
[12:32:07] <A-L-P-H-A> I have a cnc mill and lathe. why can't I make millions?
[12:33:55] <fenn> wow
[12:33:57] <fenn> http://www.robotique.ireq.ca/new/en/index.html
[12:35:40] <fenn> i wonder why nobody's using this for CNC
[12:36:14] <alex_joni> it's only sim from what I see
[12:36:56] <fenn> oh the "useful for developing realtime robotics applications" made me think it was realtime
[12:37:51] <fenn> Through the use of the OSDL module, which insulates all the platform-specific code from the application, one can use a desktop workstation to develop and simulate an application and then recompile and test it on a real-time OS.
[12:38:58] <A-L-P-H-A> oh... this is a nice watch. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=10354&item=5011873530&rd=1
[12:39:11] <A-L-P-H-A> I wouldn't mind a back that's see through.
[12:41:52] <fenn> interesting.. microb supports networking
[12:42:54] <fenn> A-L-P-H-A: what happens if you're bound and gagged, and you can't move your arm to charge up your watch?
[12:44:26] <A-L-P-H-A> well... 6 months capacitor life on those things.
[12:44:39] <A-L-P-H-A> so it will last 6 months without movement.
[12:44:49] <A-L-P-H-A> before you have to wind it up again
[12:45:29] <A-L-P-H-A> anyways, I can't afford _anything_ right now.
[12:46:51] <fenn> you should make some kinetic watches on your cnc mill ;)
[12:47:26] <alex_joni> later guys
[12:47:29] <alex_joni> lunchtime
[12:47:33] <fenn> ciao
[12:48:11] <A-L-P-H-A> how come emc doesn't have a subroutine functionality?
[12:50:29] <fenn> the board decided that would be too useful
[12:52:04] <Jacky^> hi
[12:52:17] <fenn> it's because the interpreter is so damned stupid it's impossible to implement any changes to it
[12:52:29] <fenn> hi Jacky^
[12:52:54] <A-L-P-H-A> fenn, what about emc2?
[12:53:09] <fenn> emc2 uses the old interp because nobody wants to write a new one
[12:53:20] <A-L-P-H-A> :(
[12:53:28] <fenn> nobody wants to write a new one because then they'd have to deal with nml and the canonical command set
[12:53:40] <fenn> both of which are even more of a tangled hair-brained mess than the interpreter
[12:53:47] <A-L-P-H-A> the what and what?
[12:53:55] <fenn> exactly :)
[12:54:32] <fenn> read the emc-developers mailing list archives
[12:55:03] <fenn> i've been bucking for a total re-write of emc, which is what emc2 was supposed to be, but then they kinda gave up halfway through
[12:55:21] <fenn> oh well
[13:03:40] <fenn> cat jumped on the keyboard?
[13:03:41] <A-L-P-H-A> I'm subscribed... I don't read it though.
[23:21:45] <alex_joni> Jymmm: what's up?
[23:22:18] <Jymmm> alex_joni Waiting for them to call me regardign the machine. They said a lil after 1400, and it's now 1530
[23:22:33] <alex_joni> weeeell....
[23:22:35] <alex_joni> ;)
[23:22:46] <alex_joni> Jymmm: what part of US were you again?
[23:23:01] <Jymmm> California, 40 minutes south of San Francisco
[23:23:13] <alex_joni> right..
[23:23:20] <Jymmm> brb, I need a smoke.
[23:23:32] <alex_joni> say when back
[23:23:37] <Jymmm> k
[23:30:12] <Jymmm> back
[23:30:27] <alex_joni> quick smoke
[23:30:36] <Jymmm> stressing
[23:30:45] <alex_joni> heh
[23:30:56] <alex_joni> do you have any experience with cowboy hats?
[23:31:13] <Jymmm> such as?
[23:31:27] <Jymmm> I know the fancy ones are Stetsons
[23:31:32] <anonimasu> heh
[23:31:40] <alex_joni> I'm looking for one for my gf
[23:31:45] <alex_joni> she needs one :)
[23:31:56] <Jymmm> for dress or work?
[23:32:05] <alex_joni> dunno *g*
[23:32:09] <alex_joni> dress
[23:32:10] <alex_joni> ;)
[23:32:38] <Jymmm> http://www.hatcountry.com/
[23:32:54] <Jymmm> Ladies hats --> http://www.hatcountry.com/catalog/default.php/cPath/22
[23:33:12] <alex_joni> yeah.. googled it myself too
[23:33:14] <alex_joni> seems nice
[23:33:20] <Jymmm> Bridal Cowgirl hats --> http://www.hatcountry.com/catalog/default.php/cPath/22_86?osCsid=be72524006a55c13a4d1ff4fd4617196
[23:33:59] <alex_joni> don't wanna go there ;)
[23:34:03] <Jymmm> rotf
[23:34:03] <alex_joni> soft felt looks nice
[23:34:33] <alex_joni> http://www.hatcountry.com/catalog/product_info.php/cPath/22_67/products_id/131
[23:34:36] <Jymmm> you said she NEEDS one, why?
[23:34:54] <alex_joni> dunno.. gf are that way sometimes ;)
[23:34:58] <alex_joni> she needs to have one
[23:35:05] <alex_joni> to be more precise
[23:35:20] <Jymmm> oh, she "HAS TO HAVE ONE", not that she actually needs one.
[23:35:57] <alex_joni> well... those are the same
[23:36:01] <alex_joni> actually ;)
[23:36:05] <Jymmm> nah
[23:36:11] <alex_joni> nah?
[23:36:42] <Jymmm> it's like " I HAVE TO HAVE A STEAK FOR DINNER" not that I NEED my medication.
[23:36:59] <alex_joni> I know the difference
[23:37:05] <alex_joni> but for girls it gets blury
[23:37:18] <alex_joni> the limit between NEED and HAVE TO HAVE
[23:37:43] <Jymmm> not really... they NEED mydol, the HAVE TO HAVE fashionable colthing.
[23:38:20] <alex_joni> lol
[23:38:28] <alex_joni> the NEED mydol?
[23:38:37] <alex_joni> what kind of example is that? :)
[23:38:59] <Jymmm> sexest of course.
[23:39:30] <alex_joni> u sure?
[23:39:33] <alex_joni> rotf
[23:40:17] <anonimasu> :D
[23:40:21] <Jymmm> Hey, some have PMS *****REALLY**** bad... I'll go to the store at 3am if I had to.
[23:40:39] <alex_joni> heh
[23:40:52] <alex_joni> for mydol?
[23:40:52] <anonimasu> Jymmm: caffeine addict?
[23:41:22] <Jymmm> mydol is for cramps
[23:42:01] <alex_joni> u should know
[23:42:13] <Jymmm> http://www.drugs.com/PDR/Maximum_Strength_Midol_PMS_Caplets_and_Gelcaps.html
[23:43:05] <anonimasu> heh
[23:53:41] <A-L-P-H-A> Jymmm, any luck with the k2 people?
[23:54:00] <Jymmm> A-L-P-H-A were suppose to call me at 1400, it's now 1600
[23:54:15] <A-L-P-H-A> Jymmm. well... did you call them?
[23:54:18] <A-L-P-H-A> CALL them.
[23:54:27] <A-L-P-H-A> hound. bitch. or file a credit card chargeback. :)
[23:54:29] <Jymmm> A-L-P-H-A They are open till 1900
[23:54:55] <A-L-P-H-A> I like this watch. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=10354&item=5012018021&rd=1