#emc | Logs for 2005-03-07

[19:25:45] <robin_z> ive not had over 100bhp on the road, always seems quite sufficient
[19:25:48] <alex_joni> robin_z: how's stuff lately?
[19:26:11] <robin_z> mmm, depressing
[19:26:17] <alex_joni> why's that?
[19:26:46] <robin_z> not making money right now
[19:27:01] <alex_joni> that's not good :(
[19:27:04] <robin_z> quite :)
[19:27:11] <alex_joni> kinda tough over here too
[19:27:36] <robin_z> well yeah
[19:27:50] <robin_z> I'll have a final bash at a small 4x4 plasma table
[19:28:00] <robin_z> if that doesnt sell, well bollocks to it :)
[19:28:07] <Jymmm> lol "Lower Anchors and Tethers for Children"
[19:29:30] <robin_z> Im supposed to be seeing Les Newell of sheetcam fame next week
[19:29:36] <robin_z> that should be fun
[19:29:58] <anonimasu> bbiab..
[19:34:12] <robin_z> Les is the guy who built a CNC plasma for 30 quid or something
[19:35:05] <Jymmm> is a trunk that can hold three sets of golf clubs 'big' ?
[19:35:34] <robin_z> soounds big. too big to lift anyway
[19:35:53] <paul_c> is that "trunk" as in car, or tree ?
[19:36:05] <Jymmm> paul_c: "Truck"
[19:36:11] <Jymmm> Truck Trunk
[19:36:13] <robin_z> oh, I was thinking "big box like a hard suitcase"
[19:36:28] <Jymmm> the new Honda Trucks have a trunk in them
[19:36:58] <paul_c> next question.... What is a golf club ?
[19:37:08] <paul_c> a kinda party ?
[19:37:15] <alex_joni> the bag you get your golf clubs into
[19:37:30] <robin_z> paul_c: its a building with a bar and some stuffed shirts.
[19:37:43] <Jymmm> paul_c: shaft with offset bracket designed to impact spherical projectile
[19:37:58] <paul_c> marbles ?
[19:38:05] <Jymmm> paul_c BINGO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11
[19:38:09] <alex_joni> high speed marbles
[19:38:14] <A-L-P-H-A> what is grade-25? that must be bad.
[19:38:28] <alex_joni> but they tried to make those round...
[19:38:39] <alex_joni> didn't really succeed... so they abandoned the ideea
[19:39:32] <robin_z> I'm still trying to figure out why honda make trucks
[19:40:16] <Jymmm> I wish Honda made trucks years ago
[19:40:20] <A-L-P-H-A> mitshibishi foso aren't too bad... they work well. OR atleast they seem to.
[19:40:22] <paul_c> robin_z: All the rage over there is overgrown pickups
[19:40:31] <robin_z> I thought they concentrated on consumer stuff, rather than industrial stuff
[19:40:39] <robin_z> ahh, that sort fo truck
[19:41:13] <paul_c> up market transit+tipper bed
[19:41:14] <robin_z> sort of like a big car, but with a boot that lets the rain in?
[19:41:22] <Jymmm> paul_c 1/s ton or better on average
[19:41:24] <paul_c> you get the idea.
[19:41:29] <robin_z> * robin_z nods
[19:41:30] <Jymmm> 1/2
[19:42:04] <robin_z> paul_c: just wait till the petrol prices even out, then see what happens :)
[19:42:26] <Jymmm> a pickup has ALWAYS served me well.
[19:42:27] <paul_c> Oh they squeel enough with it over $2/gal
[19:42:33] <robin_z> heh
[19:42:43] <Jymmm> It's already $2.15 USD
[19:42:48] <Jymmm> has been for years
[19:42:53] <robin_z> not even got going yet
[19:42:54] <Jymmm> gallon
[19:43:10] <paul_c> US gal = 3.9l
[19:43:24] <robin_z> you know its pretty much a global market and it will all even out in the end dont you?
[19:43:45] <paul_c> Oh yes - It will get to $5/gal before too long.
[19:43:52] <Jymmm> The Bay Area is far different fromt eh rest of the US.
[19:44:14] <robin_z> Jymmm: but it will even out ... thats global economics
[19:44:23] <robin_z> wanna guess what it is in the eu?
[19:44:51] <Jymmm> nah, you guess have public transportation system, we have corrupt politions
[19:44:52] <paul_c> * paul_c => food
[19:45:02] <Jymmm> s/guess/guys/
[19:45:07] <robin_z> do we?
[19:45:31] <alex_joni> paul_c << food
[19:45:33] <Jymmm> Oh gawd yes, compared to here in the US?
[19:45:33] <robin_z> * robin_z doesnt think so
[19:45:42] <robin_z> we do? oh. OK.
[19:45:57] <Jymmm> Ours looks like something they just tossed together.
[19:46:06] <robin_z> whatever .. its close to $10/gallon here
[19:46:21] <robin_z> thats a imperial gallon
[19:46:27] <Jymmm> I understand.
[19:46:51] <Jymmm> We love our vehicles here
[19:47:08] <alex_joni> it's about 4$/gallon here (US gallon)
[19:48:57] <A-L-P-H-A> WTF? 3/8 x 7/8 x 3/8 (ID, OD, H) bearings, rated 20,000RPM+. Metal Shielded (NSK $9.00, EBC $1.17). Rubber Shielded (NSK $9.81, EBC $1.21). Why is there such a HUGE difference?
[19:50:11] <alex_joni> alpha: how do you mean that?
[19:56:55] <A-L-P-H-A> well. the NSK is over 29K+ rpm. these EBC are good for 29Krpm. Rated.
[19:56:59] <A-L-P-H-A> strange.
[19:58:56] <A-L-P-H-A> well. the EBC are made from China.
[19:59:04] <A-L-P-H-A> worse comes to worse... I waste $10 bucks.
[19:59:54] <A-L-P-H-A> hmm... these may not even be Chinese. But Russian.
[19:59:58] <A-L-P-H-A> http://www.ebcorp.ru/eproducts/tool/index.html
[20:02:22] <Jymmm> I dont get it... "oil impregnated bronze bushing"
[20:03:37] <A-L-P-H-A> makes they slide.
[20:03:42] <A-L-P-H-A> means
[20:04:02] <A-L-P-H-A> been chewing gym tooo long... my jaw hurts now.
[20:04:19] <Jymmm> That I get, but I don't understand how a piece of metal can be impregnanted with oil
[20:04:38] <Jymmm> is there a lil reservoir in it
[20:04:51] <Jymmm> is it like a sponge
[20:05:38] <Jymmm> does it have a dipstick to check when the oil is low?
[20:05:45] <Jymmm> Inquiring Minds want to know.
[20:06:06] <A-L-P-H-A> wikipedia?
[20:07:17] <Jymmm> * Jymmm checks
[20:07:46] <Jymmm> nada =(
[20:10:08] <cradek> Jymmm: I don't know, but it sure is impossible to get all the oil off/out (I've tried)
[20:10:31] <Jymmm> cradek: of a OIl preg bushing you mean?
[20:10:37] <cradek> yes
[20:10:50] <Jymmm> cradek: ever used any solvent?
[20:10:51] <A-L-P-H-A> it's limited to low rpm though
[20:11:05] <Jymmm> A-L-P-H-A why is that?
[20:11:13] <A-L-P-H-A> heat buildup.
[20:11:20] <A-L-P-H-A> and their design.
[20:11:20] <cradek> Jymmm: I even tried fire
[20:11:20] <alex_joni> heya cradek
[20:11:27] <cradek> alex_joni: hello
[20:11:32] <A-L-P-H-A> shit, I've been up 24hours.
[20:11:37] <A-L-P-H-A> oh no.
[20:11:44] <alex_joni> cradek: seen some more stuff on your site lately
[20:11:53] <A-L-P-H-A> what's cradek's site?
[20:11:58] <Jymmm> cradek: Good to know =)
[20:12:03] <cradek> alex_joni: yeah, I posted a few pics
[20:12:11] <Jymmm> url?
[20:12:16] <A-L-P-H-A> is it about cracks?
[20:12:17] <alex_joni> alpha: that's secret
[20:12:21] <A-L-P-H-A> the nice booty kind?
[20:12:23] <cradek> alex_joni: I haven't spent much time on the site - I do want to fully document my pcb process
[20:12:25] <alex_joni> I'd have to kill you after I tell you
[20:12:28] <cradek> http://timeguy.com
[20:12:45] <alex_joni> cradek: heard some rumors about axis ...
[20:13:05] <Jymmm> cradek: Oh that TTF thing is yours! thats kinda cool (haven't used it yet).
[20:13:08] <cradek> alex_joni: yeah, it works great for us, so now we don't care about adding stuff to it anymore
[20:13:13] <A-L-P-H-A> cradek, oh! you're the guy that made AXIS! Cool!
[20:13:23] <alex_joni> don't think there's stuff missing from it ;)
[20:13:34] <cradek> I have a fan club!?
[20:13:37] <alex_joni> if it were... would be a different story
[20:13:49] <cradek> alex_joni: oh there's some stuff missing, like editing the tool table
[20:13:50] <alex_joni> * alex_joni thinks cradek should have
[20:13:59] <cradek> alex_joni: I just don't care about it, and neither does jepler
[20:14:00] <Jymmm> cradek: No fan club, your head wouldn't fit in this channel then
[20:14:12] <alex_joni> cradek: as long as toolchanging is not very automated on emc...
[20:14:19] <A-L-P-H-A> k, I'm off for a bit. big nap.
[20:14:26] <cradek> the channel is only 80 columns wide; I don't know how wide my head is
[20:14:33] <alex_joni> alpha: don't forget jepler
[20:14:39] <alex_joni> cradek: should be more than 80
[20:14:51] <cradek> * cradek holds his head up to the monitor
[20:14:59] <alex_joni> 123456789012345678901234567890123456789012345678901234567890123456789012345678901234567890123456789012345678901234567890123456789012345678901234567890123456789012345678901234567890123456789012345678901234567890123456789012345678901234567890
[20:15:04] <alex_joni> that's 240
[20:15:04] <cradek> yeah, I guess it is
[20:15:35] <alex_joni> but then again...
[20:15:44] <alex_joni> depends how flat your head is :-)
[20:15:58] <alex_joni> to make it fit on one line ... lol
[20:16:13] <cradek> alex_joni: it's pretty big already - I have a terrible time finding motorcycle helmets
[20:16:19] <robin_z> and you probably have old-standard eyes anyway
[20:16:23] <alex_joni> hehe... right
[20:16:29] <Jymmm> alex_joni : cradek doesn't need ears, jaw, nose, etc.... we can make it fit!
[20:16:33] <alex_joni> robin_z: old-standard ?
[20:16:37] <cradek> I don't know who they make those things for
[20:16:51] <alex_joni> cradek: ladies?
[20:17:07] <robin_z> cradek: man your eyes must be shot! ... motorcycle helmets are quite big .. you should be able to find them easily ... get glasses!
[20:17:23] <alex_joni> that's the problem if you shop for pink helmets
[20:17:29] <cradek> hahaha
[20:17:31] <alex_joni> * alex_joni rofls
[20:17:33] <robin_z> alex_joni: yeah, old 4x3 format eyes. new eyes are 16x9
[20:17:39] <alex_joni> ahhh
[20:17:45] <alex_joni> * alex_joni gets the NEW eyes
[20:17:58] <robin_z> actually .. there is an even newer spec
[20:17:59] <alex_joni> four-third standard ;)
[20:18:16] <robin_z> you know 16x9 is wider than 4x3?
[20:18:35] <alex_joni> I know.. but the latest camera CCD's are 4/3
[20:18:45] <alex_joni> as a size, not format
[20:18:46] <robin_z> well, theyre doing a new version of 16x9 ... just as wide but .. taller too! ..16x12!!
[20:18:54] <alex_joni> 4/3'' I think
[20:19:02] <alex_joni> kinda like 25 mm film
[20:19:06] <robin_z> yeah
[20:19:10] <Jymmm> rob_melb: how would that work with HDTV's?
[20:19:17] <Jymmm> robin_z: how would that work with HDTV's?
[20:19:31] <robin_z> well, OLD hdtvs will have trouble
[20:19:45] <robin_z> but the new generataion have a little extra screen height
[20:19:55] <Jymmm> Oh that sucks. Most are just hitting homes now.
[20:20:20] <robin_z> do they have HDTV in the US?
[20:20:44] <Jymmm> Yes, but the HD tuner is seperate a majority of the time.
[20:20:58] <robin_z> how many lines resolution does it give?
[20:21:11] <alex_joni> 12 lines
[20:21:16] <alex_joni> 16 pixels each
[20:21:18] <alex_joni> =))
[20:21:20] <robin_z> it never got going in the UK
[20:21:31] <robin_z> 625line is all we get
[20:21:57] <robin_z> I thought the US was all still on 525line
[20:22:20] <robin_z> didnt know they had HDTV, but .. ive been out of the TV game for a few years, it moves on
[20:23:31] <Jymmm> I'm not into Home Theater anymore, just know what I see in the ads in the paper
[20:23:31] <robin_z> I remember seeing some 1400line Sony sets at the Sony facility .. but they never made it to sale.
[20:23:55] <robin_z> yeah. might still be 525line but just widescreen format
[20:24:38] <Jymmm> Sorry to seem stupid here, but what is a 'JAM NUT'? I'm not familure with that term. Is that the type with the nylon built in?
[20:28:41] <Jymmm> Ah, found it.
[20:30:42] <Jymmm> never heard of a "Nylok pellet nut" before, weird.
[20:47:38] <alex_joni> * alex_joni wonders when a PC will replace a TV
[20:47:57] <alex_joni> I'm not pleased with the state of the PC-tuners
[20:52:19] <robin_z> nylocs?
[20:52:23] <robin_z> common
[20:52:46] <robin_z> but .. use ONCE only
[20:52:48] <alex_joni> sounds like nylons :D
[20:53:33] <robin_z> http://www.bolts-nuts-washers.com/images/NYLOC_NUTS.jpg
[20:54:06] <cradek> oh
[20:54:12] <cradek> we call them "airplane nuts" around here
[20:54:35] <alex_joni> oh.. those
[20:54:54] <cradek> my spindle motor mount is made with those
[21:00:01] <robin_z> I think the airplanes cant use them
[21:00:29] <robin_z> planes use a split metal type ... ummm ...
[21:00:33] <alex_joni> robin: cheap airplanes use them to secure the landing gear
[21:00:35] <cradek> well, I don't actually know why they're called that...
[21:00:38] <alex_joni> lol
[21:00:39] <robin_z> but anyway
[21:00:46] <robin_z> yeah, probably "just a name"
[21:01:16] <robin_z> http://www.airturbinetools.com/spindle.htm
[21:07:21] <robin_z> http://www.a2a4.co.uk/acatalog/aerotight_nut_logo.gif
[21:07:32] <robin_z> thats an "aerotight" nut .. I see a lot of those on planes
[21:16:42] <anonimasu> laters everyone
[21:16:44] <anonimasu> goodnight
[21:24:58] <robin_z> * robin_z plays with some GIS software
[21:26:34] <alex_joni> * alex_joni goes to sleep
[21:26:38] <alex_joni> night ...
[21:26:45] <paul_c> * paul_c wonders how much robin_z is going to want for the 100W laser...
[21:27:00] <robin_z> it my mate Andys ...
[21:27:12] <robin_z> I'll ask.
[21:27:38] <robin_z> it was on a cardboard-box cutting machine ...
[21:27:57] <alex_joni> bye guys
[21:48:04] <gezr> howdy folks
[21:49:07] <les> hello Gezr
[21:51:04] <Jymmm> Hi Les
[21:51:17] <les> hi Jymmm
[21:51:43] <les> had to fart around most of the day with this data aq scripting language
[21:51:50] <les> really buggy program
[21:51:58] <les> worse than Labview even
[21:52:46] <gezr> yuck
[21:53:06] <gezr> man I have a delemia on my hands, my uncle has become very ill
[21:53:26] <les> yeah allsorts of things...cursor vanishes...arrays aren't initialized... etc
[21:53:28] <gezr> I dont know if I should call my cousin or not, cant really decide to do
[21:53:32] <les> sorry to hear
[21:53:43] <gezr> I dont know the etiquite in this matter
[21:54:29] <les> I have an uncle with a very bad heart
[21:54:30] <acemi> i installed emc from BDI 4.18 to my debain sarge system, but i can't start emc. when i trying to start emc, i get the following output: http://rafb.net/paste/results/0lEX1J65.html any suggestion..?
[21:54:33] <cradek> my opinion: if your uncle can answer, you should ask. If not, you should probably call whoever you think he might want to know.
[21:54:33] <les> brbphone
[21:55:05] <gezr> cradek : the uncle cant. yeah, its probably best to just call
[21:56:04] <Jymmm> gezr: Sorry I missed part of the conversation, what did you need to ask your uncle?
[21:56:28] <paul_c> acemi: Don't use su
[21:56:53] <paul_c> Install sudo and set it up so that the usr can run stuff as root
[21:57:08] <paul_c> and then launch emc as any login usr.
[21:58:11] <les> Hmm that was a call from some web business listing service business
[21:58:16] <les> from india
[21:58:30] <gezr> Jymmm : uncle is sick, wondering if I should call his son
[21:58:37] <les> guess i'll get plenty more junk mail to burn in the wood stove.
[21:58:49] <Jymmm> gezr: do you like this uncle?
[21:58:52] <les> oops haha
[21:58:57] <gezr> Jymmm : oh yeah
[21:59:58] <Jymmm> gezr: Call, definately call. you can at least find out when are his better times to speak with him; after breakfast, before dinner, etc and speak to your uncle directly. Even if it's just for a couple of minutes.
[22:00:28] <Jymmm> gezr: Wehn your sick, it's always a "good thing" to know that someone is thinking about you.
[22:01:02] <Jymmm> and took the time to go out of their way to speak directly, not by proxy if at all possible.
[22:02:28] <Jymmm> MY Aunt whoch I haven't spoken with in years was so heartfelt when I called and spoke to her for a couple minutes. She directly said that she thanked me for calling and said she really appreciated it.
[22:04:08] <acemi> paul_c: i get the same result: http://rafb.net/paste/results/MDNqDM78.html
[22:04:50] <paul_c> acemi: Run dmesg and paste the o/p
[22:05:29] <gezr> Jymmm : yeah, i called em. :)
[22:06:13] <Jymmm> gezr: Cool Beans. Did you get to talk to him?
[22:06:50] <acemi> paul_c: http://rafb.net/paste/results/lY938a58.html
[22:07:12] <gezr> Jymmm : the uncle is incapaciated, I called to speak to his son, I didnt get ahold of him but his wife, I dont speak to them much,
[22:07:54] <Jymmm> gezr: thats cool
[22:09:41] <robin_z> hmmm ... line 34 has a nasty feeling to it.
[22:10:31] <Jymmm> gezr: Screw etiquite, I see things like this... If hearing from someone would make me feel good, I'll return the favor in kind. Just keep it simple.
[22:11:28] <Jymmm> Cards and flowers are "nice", but sure doesn't show the effort that one really cares imo.
[22:11:56] <robin_z> and they can't spell "shareable"
[22:12:15] <gezr> Jymmm : these folks tend to operate as vultures out of goodness, its really strange
[22:12:34] <Jymmm> I felt weird calling my aunt after all those years, but she answered the phone with "open arms".
[22:12:49] <Jymmm> gezr: vultures out of goodnes?
[22:12:50] <gezr> Jymmm : yeah, maybe the guy will call me later on when he gets off work
[22:12:55] <gezr> Jymmm : its strange
[22:12:56] <robin_z> I find its always best to have some "balance" in these things ...
[22:13:07] <Jymmm> gezr: vultures out of goodnes? I dont understand (sorry)
[22:13:24] <acemi> i can use livecd without problem
[22:13:31] <robin_z> so yeah sure, call them and chat .. but balance it up by mailing them a roadkill later in the week
[22:13:42] <robin_z> * robin_z is weird
[22:13:57] <gezr> Jymmm : they did a lot of really strange things when my mother got sick, this uncle who is sick now, was the cool one, I dont talk to the family much at all because of things in the past, so hearing from me may or may not be a good thing
[22:13:59] <les> noo o...
[22:14:11] <robin_z> les: nooo?
[22:14:22] <les> weird?
[22:14:27] <robin_z> dang, is that bad form?
[22:14:30] <les> Hey I was thinking
[22:14:47] <les> I ought to rep your plasma machines in the colonies
[22:15:09] <robin_z> heh, like I'd be able to get PL insurance for there
[22:15:18] <les> oh..yeah
[22:15:19] <gezr> Jymmm : I love them all to death, but im the outcast.
[22:15:52] <Jymmm> gezr: Eh, all families are fuber
[22:15:56] <Jymmm> fubar
[22:16:04] <les> I second that
[22:16:23] <robin_z> les: the ONLY thing my insurers want to know is "will you sell any to the USA" ... the basic concept was it might be close to impossible to get insurance without LOTS of testing
[22:17:00] <les> arrgh silly regs....makes it damn near impossible to make a buck
[22:17:07] <robin_z> its not the regs
[22:17:15] <Jymmm> Sell it as an OEM component
[22:17:17] <robin_z> its the people who sue you
[22:17:21] <les> Remember I have people that want a plasma...
[22:17:26] <les> but I am booked
[22:17:33] <robin_z> when they put their hands under it and fire it up!
[22:17:45] <robin_z> oh, heh :)
[22:18:04] <robin_z> but they wanted a BIG plasma right?
[22:18:24] <les> Your design seems sound and economical
[22:18:28] <robin_z> of the two-floor-beams and a gantry to sit on variety?
[22:18:37] <les> yes one client wants a pretty big one
[22:18:48] <robin_z> * robin_z is having a bit of a sales downturn at the moment
[22:18:59] <les> so you said
[22:19:09] <robin_z> sigh.
[22:19:16] <les> I just want to keep the ball rolling
[22:19:19] <robin_z> :)
[22:19:27] <les> Have done well so far this year
[22:19:28] <robin_z> worry not, I have software to cook as well
[22:19:58] <robin_z> yeah, and you didnt *quite* go mad during turking mating season either
[22:20:11] <robin_z> it sounded close some days though :)
[22:20:33] <les> As I mentioned before if I can keep up the sales this might be the first year I do better than at the large corporation
[22:20:57] <les> Just about bouncing off the wall yes
[22:22:00] <les> hey...know anything about thermoforming?
[22:22:33] <gezr> ive watched vacume forming
[22:22:47] <les> I have decided that it is the way to get camo on the product
[22:22:56] <les> rather than ink jet etx
[22:23:00] <les> etc
[22:23:12] <les> I read up on it
[22:23:42] <les> screen print B staged uv cured camo pattern
[22:23:47] <les> thermoform
[22:23:53] <les> cut out
[22:24:01] <les> stake to moulded part
[22:24:14] <les> then full cure
[22:24:41] <les> but I don't want to displace my own accounts
[22:24:48] <les> so I ould want to do it
[22:24:54] <les> would
[22:25:23] <Jymmm> les camo on what product?
[22:25:30] <les> turkey call
[22:25:38] <robin_z> those spindles coming your way still?
[22:25:39] <robin_z> $friend went to look at some grinders a guy is using ...
[22:25:39] <robin_z> dimaond embedded wheel, about 18" dia
[22:25:41] <robin_z> to drind a thin , small part ..
[22:25:43] <robin_z> weird thing ..
[22:25:45] <robin_z> they used 11hp motors ...
[22:25:47] <les> shaped kind of like a hokey puck
[22:25:49] <robin_z> 11hp, into a part, 50x25x1mm
[22:25:53] <robin_z> that cant be right, can it? or are grinders terribly inefficient
[22:25:57] <robin_z> * robin_z has seen some vacuum thermo
[22:25:59] <robin_z> les: let me guess .. like drinks bottles?
[22:26:05] <robin_z> sounds do-able
[22:26:09] <robin_z> well, lets think, thes wooden calls, they split and break over time I guess, due to moisture?
[22:26:13] <robin_z> and a plastic one would last forever right .. ?
[22:26:23] <les> yeah
[22:26:33] <Jymmm> les url ot a pic?
[22:26:35] <Jymmm> to
[22:26:44] <robin_z> heh, but a camo one would get lost REAL EASY :)
[22:26:48] <les> but I make 5.25 in 3 minutes with the wood
[22:26:51] <les> haha
[22:26:52] <les> good
[22:27:03] <joe2000chevy> does anyone know the name of the website for linier bearings?
[22:27:09] <joe2000chevy> starts with an i
[22:27:17] <robin_z> ina.de
[22:27:20] <Jymmm> les: is this a "quality" product, or more of a functional one?
[22:27:21] <les> there are many joe. What kind?
[22:27:33] <les> quality
[22:27:40] <joe2000chevy> it was like ies????
[22:27:46] <Jymmm> ips
[22:28:04] <robin_z> not http://www.ina.de?
[22:28:25] <joe2000chevy> no
[22:28:30] <robin_z> oh, ok.
[22:28:31] <joe2000chevy> i think paul told be bout it
[22:28:38] <les> I notice HIWIN is having a fire sale at the mount prospect warehouse. I will be up there soon and better stop in
[22:28:46] <robin_z> coo
[22:28:54] <robin_z> HIWIN stuff is VERY good value
[22:28:56] <joe2000chevy> awhen you look it also had yellow bearings
[22:29:04] <robin_z> real fire sale?
[22:29:17] <les> check the HIWIN USA site
[22:29:53] <les> I remember they had a rom with a couple kM of rail cutoffs sitting in bins
[22:29:59] <les> room
[22:30:30] <Jymmm> les: I don't know if this helps, but what about these heat shrink plastics that are printed, then placed on consumer products and shrunk down?
[22:30:45] <Jymmm> les like coffee creamer containers and such
[22:31:03] <robin_z> they only really work on cylinders
[22:31:03] <Jymmm> og bleach bottles
[22:31:13] <robin_z> like bottles
[22:31:19] <Jymmm> yeah
[22:31:27] <les> yes many are pad printed
[22:31:31] <Jymmm> well, I did ask for a url to a pic
[22:31:35] <robin_z> les' thing is a flat disk, with holes
[22:31:53] <les> and 7 degree tapered sides
[22:32:03] <les> perfect draft for molding
[22:32:06] <robin_z> persoanlly, id mold out of green plastic, cnc spray black camo with an air brush
[22:32:14] <Jymmm> ew
[22:32:39] <les> I thought about textures molded in that would hold paint
[22:32:47] <robin_z> you can get great plastic-sticking paints these days, etch themselves in
[22:32:48] <les> slop some on and wipe it off
[22:33:05] <Jymmm> stencil ????
[22:33:27] <Jymmm> Oh that's an idea.....
[22:33:32] <les> but screen or flexo on large thermoformed ABS sheets I think is the way to go
[22:33:54] <robin_z> can you mold the entire puck from a sheet?
[22:33:57] <les> I thought a good bit about stencils
[22:34:14] <Jymmm> les Create some muffin pan vacuum form molds and then cut out as needed for stenciling.
[22:34:21] <les> robin: it would bea strethc
[22:34:26] <les> stretch
[22:34:30] <robin_z> yeah
[22:34:40] <Jymmm> nah
[22:34:54] <les> Only thing is I am getting old on mold prices
[22:35:00] <les> single cavity
[22:35:15] <pfred1> les you're a moldy oldie?
[22:35:20] <les> perhaps two
[22:35:27] <les> haha gettin there
[22:35:31] <gezr> les expensive
[22:35:37] <robin_z> heh, you have a CNC bridgport :)
[22:35:40] <pfred1> Mo money
[22:35:45] <les> will
[22:35:49] <robin_z> 'k
[22:36:05] <robin_z> so,
[22:36:22] <Jymmm> les: what about multiple cavity molds that have cutout (like a stencil) and just toss in the calls; spray green, another mold; spray brown, etc
[22:36:25] <robin_z> what exactly was wrong with the CNC airbrush idea??
[22:36:40] <Jymmm> robin_z overspray
[22:36:42] <les> I think I can get the ink to stay put even in the extreme stretch areas where it drapes over the side
[22:36:53] <robin_z> i mean camo, its all random anyway
[22:36:59] <les> robin:
[22:37:12] <les> High up front costs...low productivity
[22:37:42] <joe2000chevy> http://www.igus.com/
[22:37:49] <joe2000chevy> thats the one
[22:37:51] <robin_z> oh ... IGUS
[22:37:57] <les> I use a lot of IGUS stuff
[22:38:02] <robin_z> plasitc bearing linear rail
[22:38:59] <robin_z> les: well, 6 airbrushes @ 30 bucks each ... fixed ... puck come in, squirt ... moves on
[22:39:46] <robin_z> justa thought, sorry. I have sprayed ink fixed in my brain now :)
[22:39:50] <les> I suspect a liscenced popular pattern like Mossy Oak might sell best
[22:40:08] <robin_z> nah
[22:40:23] <robin_z> you have totally failed to learn from the 'net
[22:40:31] <robin_z> nekkid ladies will sell best :)
[22:40:35] <les> 3 color scrren print on about one meter square ABS sheet
[22:40:37] <les> heh
[22:41:03] <Jymmm> les: you good with polymers?
[22:41:14] <robin_z> les is Mr Polymer
[22:41:39] <les> I developed some conductive screen printing inks that are used a good bit
[22:42:22] <Jymmm> les: can't you come up with some paints that will do the oil/water not mix thing and be able to create a camo paint?
[22:42:54] <les> Well the current process works like this:
[22:42:56] <Jymmm> dunk a bucket ok calls, then let dry a bit, then on to the next color, etc.
[22:43:03] <Jymmm> s/ok/of/
[22:43:17] <les> A litho'd sheet is placed in water
[22:43:41] <les> the ink image comes loose from the substrate and floats to the top
[22:43:53] <Jymmm> like decals?
[22:43:54] <les> objects are below the surface
[22:44:12] <les> they are raise out
[22:44:16] <les> raised
[22:44:37] <les> and the floating image conforms and sticks to them
[22:44:43] <les> very expensive
[22:45:01] <robin_z> works well for top end car "wood" trim
[22:45:04] <les> but that is what is being done on hunting gear for camo
[22:45:11] <Jymmm> les what if you just "blot" it on the surface?
[22:45:19] <Jymmm> les much like a stamppad
[22:45:32] <robin_z> hmm .. that might work ..
[22:45:38] <robin_z> what about the sides?
[22:45:45] <Jymmm> rotate it
[22:45:51] <robin_z> swivel!
[22:45:53] <Jymmm> think glazed donut
[22:46:03] <les> I have thought about workers with flexo (stamppad) pads of several colors
[22:46:06] <Jymmm> with sprinkles =)
[22:46:19] <les> just semirandomly putting them on
[22:46:45] <robin_z> hey, my wife tells me what my middle kid did at bedtime ...
[22:46:53] <les> using an Analox texture on the pads
[22:46:55] <robin_z> youngest pee'd in the loo
[22:47:02] <les> kinda like a knurl
[22:47:07] <les> holds ink
[22:47:10] <robin_z> middle one dipped his toothbrush in and brushed his teeth!
[22:47:17] <Jymmm> lol
[22:47:18] <les> eww
[22:47:28] <robin_z> he'll not live till 3yrs old I tell you
[22:48:12] <les> My boy stuck a couple butter knives in the electrical outlet to get the power out
[22:48:17] <les> when he was 3
[22:48:17] <gezr> if you get him wearing one of them government approved helmets a sure bet on 4 could be given
[22:48:48] <robin_z> les: for small runs, that printing, cutting, forming .. well, it sounds like a complex process to get right for small runs.
[22:48:52] <les> Wife insisted on those plastic covers for outlets
[22:48:58] <robin_z> heh,
[22:49:06] <les> makes em want o mess with them more.
[22:49:10] <robin_z> quite
[22:49:30] <robin_z> nothing like a few amps at 240v to bring the point home
[22:49:31] <gezr> my folks took me to chruch to fear the lord, left me alone with metal things to fear electricity
[22:49:32] <les> Robin: we are not talking so small here
[22:49:45] <robin_z> 30K?
[22:50:09] <les> not sure...will have some meeting s to find out
[22:50:18] <robin_z> well, thats small
[22:50:30] <robin_z> rmember I said I was involved making lamp dimmers?
[22:50:31] <les> I just know you can buy turkey hunting magazines in the stores
[22:50:49] <les> robin: me too a long time ago
[22:50:53] <robin_z> we do 25k to 45k a month .. every month ..
[22:51:11] <les> cool
[22:51:11] <gezr> oh yeah, when I was like 10yo, I remember using a transformer I ripped out of something I had, to use it to weld pennys together
[22:51:29] <les> I designed the GE slimline dimmer
[22:51:35] <les> low end
[22:51:41] <les> single time constant
[22:52:09] <les> hmmm weld pennies together
[22:52:22] <les> I just put em on the train track.
[22:52:54] <gezr> i used to also use a transformer as a cap, i would enduce a current into the windings, and then discharge them onto a friend
[22:53:13] <gezr> simple 9v and a small transformer was a lot of fun
[22:53:29] <les> Robin: A quadrac, a choke, a capacitor, and a couple resistors and a pot printed right on the PCB
[22:53:38] <pfred1> gezr we used to call those shockers
[22:53:45] <robin_z> les: anyway, my point was, 30K is small in production run terms ..
[22:53:48] <gezr> pfred1 : yep :)
[22:53:59] <robin_z> les: yeah, printed pot is neat
[22:53:59] <Jymmm> * Jymmm is having a hard time finding 12' drill rod 'in stock' on the shelves locally.
[22:54:00] <les> 30k...i'll take it
[22:54:09] <pfred1> gezr and it's a good thing we didn't know about relaxation oscillators and MOSFETs!
[22:54:17] <gezr> pfred1 : hahaha
[22:54:19] <les> heh
[22:54:22] <gezr> Jymmm : o1 or a1
[22:54:30] <Jymmm> w1
[22:54:33] <gezr> or that too
[22:54:45] <Jymmm> gezr D) Any of the above
[22:54:47] <les> Just order it from MSC...less trouble
[22:54:55] <pfred1> damn there's no html special tag for an ohm sign
[22:55:06] <Jymmm> ohm? just a sec...
[22:55:22] <les> upper case greek omega?
[22:55:26] <les> bet there is
[22:55:27] <Jymmm> 2126
[22:55:35] <Jymmm> &#2126;
[22:55:58] <Jymmm> inverted ohm &#2127;
[22:56:29] <Jymmm> if those dont work, try &#8486;
[22:57:46] <Jymmm> 2126 is hex, 8486 is decimal equiv.
[22:59:13] <pfred1> Jymmm &#8486; works thanks :)
[22:59:22] <robin_z> and if that fails, there always unicode :)
[22:59:45] <Jymmm> robin_z: That IS unicode =)
[23:00:23] <gezr> I need an iris less then 3 microns away from my event horizon
[23:00:27] <pfred1> * pfred1 is making a webpage about his screwy microwave transformer he's trying to rewind
[23:00:41] <Jymmm> All Unicode is hex (I didn't know that), so to use in html directly, convert unicode to decimal and bang!
[23:00:44] <gezr> pfred1 : read how one guy used 9 of them to make a welder :)
[23:01:00] <pfred1> gezr yeah i have I'm glad I have some welders
[23:01:17] <gezr> pfred1 : I just want a nice tig
[23:01:25] <pfred1> gezr but i need about 24V ar about 6 amps
[23:01:27] <Jymmm> pfred1: Just be sure to include the declaration in hte html
[23:01:27] <les> me too
[23:01:33] <pfred1> gezr I got a Miller EconoTIG
[23:01:51] <pfred1> $1400 worth of "econo"
[23:01:55] <les> good
[23:02:21] <pfred1> yeah it's pretty cool still if i had to pick one or the other I'd go with a MIG
[23:02:26] <gezr> I looked under my neighbors truck the other day as he was moving out to check out the work some muffler shop did, It was really nice, they left a lot of unmelted hot glue wire to show how efficient they were at performing the task they had
[23:02:58] <pfred1> MIG way handier for glueing together exhausts
[23:03:25] <les> I worked most on MIG with miller.
[23:03:27] <gezr> pfred1 : yeah, mig is great for all sorts of things, but this looked like a 3 year old was using a crayon
[23:03:28] <Jymmm> Man MSC is expensive for > 36" They charge a $15 handling fee
[23:03:29] <pfred1> home depot has some nice lincoln MIG welders
[23:03:56] <gezr> pfred1 : for anything large I would need welded I would take it to where I work
[23:04:11] <les> I built most of my cnc with MIG
[23:04:14] <gezr> yeah dangit, I would need a mig too
[23:04:25] <les> or GMAW as it's called now
[23:04:31] <pfred1> gezr you Vee grind the joint them little 110V MIGs will do like better than 1/4 inch thick
[23:05:08] <les> yeah v grind but a little gap at the bottom
[23:05:09] <gezr> pfred1 : we use submerged arcs and spray, then standard fluxcore with gas for all the pipping
[23:05:24] <pfred1> heh i love pipe robots
[23:05:35] <gezr> his name is Jerry
[23:05:48] <pfred1> I saw some steamfitters doing a stainless steel handrail
[23:05:50] <gezr> hahaha
[23:05:54] <pfred1> man that robot could weld!
[23:06:17] <les> I did all my cnc fabrication with a small 160 amp unit
[23:06:48] <les> One good thing about little welders...
[23:06:55] <pfred1> the trick with the real elcheapo MIGs is point a fan directly into the back of them that doubles their duty cycle
[23:06:58] <les> things don't warp as much
[23:07:17] <les> yeah many are 20% dc
[23:07:29] <pfred1> yeah but if you fan it it'll keep up
[23:07:36] <les> cool
[23:07:41] <pfred1> that's what i did when I did my truck frame
[23:07:50] <pfred1> because it kept on shutting down
[23:07:54] <gezr> les : yeah a common mod is to open it up and plop a few computer type fans inside
[23:08:03] <les> I have had that problem
[23:08:16] <pfred1> bah just throw a little box fan on a milk crate
[23:08:22] <gezr> radio shack has a few 110v fans like computer fans, that have huge cfm
[23:08:41] <pfred1> you should see the fans i pulled out of the top of a PDP 11/34
[23:08:48] <les> Gee I guess I should take you guys to miller and hobart
[23:08:50] <les> haha
[23:09:01] <les> (itw owns them)
[23:09:15] <pfred1> Lincoln is the snizzle
[23:09:18] <pfred1> :)
[23:09:37] <les> I did some of the automation at the hobart fluxcore plant
[23:09:53] <cradek> pfred1: don't tell me you're parting out a good 11/34
[23:10:05] <pfred1> cradek hacked it up long ago
[23:10:08] <gezr> les : can you krochet(sp), like nitting but with a hooked needle?
[23:10:21] <les> no
[23:10:23] <cradek> pfred1: sigh
[23:10:27] <les> ex wife could
[23:10:32] <les> wives
[23:10:36] <les> both of em
[23:10:38] <gezr> * gezr owns les in the krochet department
[23:10:43] <pfred1> cradek get a simulator lots easier on the electric bill floor etc
[23:10:45] <gezr> :)
[23:10:57] <cradek> pfred1: true but it's somehow not the same.
[23:11:11] <pfred1> cradek you know how big an 11/34 is?
[23:11:18] <pfred1> half a ton?
[23:11:21] <cradek> 2-3 racks I suppose
[23:11:28] <cradek> depends on what's hooked to it
[23:12:29] <pfred1> cradek here's the bottom of it and the HDD chassis that i made into drawers
[23:12:52] <pfred1> those drawers were the hard disk drives!
[23:13:26] <pfred1> I still use a side of it as a temporary work table
[23:13:32] <pfred1> throw it over some horses
[23:14:18] <pfred1> cradek really nice drawer slides huh? full extension!
[23:22:04] <gezr> martha stewart has been looking good, sorry I couldnt go on any longer without mentining that
[23:22:33] <Jymmm> gezr: you sick sick man!
[23:23:03] <les> Wish I had bought her stock about christmas
[23:23:33] <pfred1> hopefully they'll get her on something else and throw away the key this time!
[23:23:42] <gezr> if she still had what she sold, she would be set
[23:23:44] <les> Turned a prison stay into a marketing campaign
[23:25:48] <pfred1> les yeah she turned her ex husband into a quivvering bowl of jelly too
[23:26:11] <gezr> who was that?
[23:26:17] <les> My latest young ex was martha stewart crazy
[23:26:34] <pfred1> where she got the Stewart name from
[23:26:45] <les> couple of the rooms in my house are martha stewart green.
[23:26:48] <pfred1> she took everything she could from that man
[23:27:13] <pfred1> including his manhood she's probably got his balls swinging between her legs!
[23:27:18] <les> haha
[23:27:30] <gezr> or on loan to another famous woman in the spotlight
[23:27:44] <gezr> maybe they trade them like baseball cards?
[23:27:51] <les> hillary.
[23:28:20] <les> I don't really have a problem with martha...but a big one with Hillary
[23:28:40] <les> I'm not a republican either
[23:28:51] <les> heh
[23:29:20] <les> I like that web site: stop_her _ now.com
[23:29:25] <les> or something
[23:31:13] <les> well what do I know...divorced twice
[23:31:14] <pfred1> hmm I missed a pair of leads on this thing
[23:31:15] <les> heh
[23:32:39] <gezr> les : I would say 3rd time is a charm, but a guy we had at work, had used all the marriages he could have in the state of arkansas, no common law 7 year thing here, but you can only get married 7 times here
[23:32:58] <pfred1> 7 time loser?
[23:33:06] <gezr> yeah I think so
[23:33:16] <pfred1> who's he think he is Liz Taylor?
[23:33:27] <les> Aw my problem is that I won't do what women say.
[23:33:35] <les> I do like em though!
[23:33:38] <gezr> no, If i wasnt married, and there were no stalking laws, there is a uber hot red head on that myth busters show
[23:33:42] <pfred1> SWMBO
[23:33:50] <pfred1> She Who Must Be Obeyed!
[23:34:05] <les> yeah I know.
[23:34:23] <pfred1> les can't handle the shackle burns from the old ball and chain?
[23:34:32] <les> actually sometimes I would...
[23:34:44] <pfred1> but the chafe would get to you eventually?
[23:34:47] <les> heh
[23:34:54] <pfred1> they never let up!
[23:35:05] <pfred1> they just keep clamping down tighter and tighter
[23:35:32] <pfred1> til you can't hop in a circle on one foot without her express say so!
[23:36:10] <les> One of my workers, 75 years old, had a girl spend the night with him that he picked up in a hillbilly bar.
[23:36:21] <les> My 98 year old grandma told me
[23:36:37] <les> she is next dorr to him and is very nosey
[23:36:53] <les> door
[23:37:05] <pfred1> OK which coil should i chop out?
[23:38:15] <pfred1> I think it's the D-E that has to go
[23:38:34] <les> well DE at 55v is good for a typical servoamp
[23:38:47] <pfred1> that's at 37V input
[23:38:49] <les> if it is a secondary
[23:38:56] <pfred1> I fed it with a step down transformer
[23:38:57] <les> oh
[23:39:13] <pfred1> I've had transformers let the smoke out on me
[23:39:28] <les> don't know...have never messed with them
[23:39:49] <les> I use the 240/120 a lot
[23:39:59] <pfred1> well A-B-C seems like the primary to me evne tho you get more voltage out of the D-E side
[23:40:12] <pfred1> the D-E winding is huge!
[23:40:20] <les> and those $100 toroids where you wind your ownsecondary
[23:40:44] <pfred1> I got a little toroid I wonder if it's powerful enough?
[23:40:45] <gezr> pfred1 : how many power levels did the mwayve have before you took out the former?
[23:41:10] <les> pfred: what do you want to do with it?
[23:41:10] <pfred1> gezr I don't know
[23:41:21] <pfred1> I want to drive my stepper drivers
[23:41:40] <gezr> pfred1 : well, you want the more heavy duty wire for your needs then
[23:41:54] <gezr> you can always rewind the primary side to get your voltage
[23:41:56] <les> what voltage and current?
[23:42:12] <pfred1> gezr well this thing I will have to rewind it with heavy wire
[23:42:23] <pfred1> les 24V 6 amps
[23:42:36] <les> oh
[23:42:48] <pfred1> I wonder if this can do it?
[23:42:48] <les> 24v dc?
[23:43:02] <pfred1> well in that range it's not that critical
[23:43:10] <pfred1> PWM drives can handle up to 46V
[23:43:39] <pfred1> but i htink it should run OK in the neighborhood of 24V it'll be higher after I rectify and filter it
[23:44:39] <les> 24v filament transformers are dirt cheap
[23:44:48] <pfred1> at 6 amps?
[23:44:53] <pfred1> like 500 VA or so?
[23:45:01] <les> will give you 24- 1.5 X 1.414
[23:45:10] <les> parallel them
[23:46:07] <les> anyway sounds like you only need 150 va or so
[23:46:13] <pfred1> yeah?
[23:46:15] <pfred1> hmmm
[23:46:39] <pfred1> yeah heck I should try a smaller transformer and if it blows up what the heck?
[23:46:58] <pfred1> each of my motors draws 2 amps
[23:47:02] <Jymmm> stinky
[23:47:17] <pfred1> nothing like blowing a cap on an induction motor I bet
[23:47:18] <les> The secondary voltages will buck a tiny bit when you parallel...but nort enough to matter really
[23:47:24] <les> not
[23:47:52] <robin_z> pfred1: remember, you use sum(motor currents) * 0.666
[23:48:10] <les> surplus center or some such outfit has plenty really cheap
[23:48:17] <pfred1> robin_z can't say as i cna recall
[23:48:28] <robin_z> so 3 motors@2A = 4A PSU rating
[23:48:36] <robin_z> well, it is.
[23:48:42] <pfred1> hmm it seems like lots of people use rewound microwave transformers
[23:48:50] <robin_z> why?
[23:48:53] <pfred1> which is why I am considering it
[23:48:57] <les> If you want to fine
[23:49:17] <pfred1> I've already had power supply problems with this whole deal
[23:49:22] <les> but 150 va is a $20 problem if you buy it surplus
[23:49:38] <les> perhaps $10
[23:49:41] <robin_z> I cant imagine why you would waste time rewinding a txfmr .. they are dirt cheap
[23:49:45] <robin_z> exactly
[23:49:55] <pfred1> OK
[23:51:06] <robin_z> some things are worth making, somethings .. its just easier to buy the right thing straight out.
[23:51:33] <les> well make it if it's fun
[23:51:40] <robin_z> well sure
[23:51:50] <les> I don't get to do as much of that lately
[23:52:00] <robin_z> but winding txfmrs and messing with all those laminations .. ick
[23:52:06] <robin_z> not my idea of fun :0
[23:52:10] <les> yup
[23:52:56] <les> The toroid kits are quick to do
[23:53:04] <les> about 1 volt per turn
[23:53:09] <les> not to bad
[23:53:15] <rayh> pfred1: You looking at 48 volts?
[23:53:21] <les> and the primary is pre wound
[23:53:33] <pfred1> rayh 48 volts for what?
[23:55:54] <robin_z> toroids are fun to do ..
[23:56:03] <robin_z> but then, i have a toriod winder :)
[23:56:45] <robin_z> and, better still, I have a bloke who will stand in front of it all day and wind toroids .. thats even better :)
[23:58:48] <les> Gezr does crochet (sp) so he would like toriods
[23:59:02] <les> toroids haha