#emc | Logs for 2005-01-31

[00:00:06] <asdfqwega> and I'm trying to compile emc from cvs
[00:00:06] <anonimasu> nice
[00:00:08] <robin_z> yeah, I saw those ..
[00:00:22] <anonimasu> I wish I saw thoose before grabbing tcl off the debian archive..
[00:00:31] <asdfqwega> where do I get the -dev versions of what he made?
[00:00:35] <robin_z> why does paul distribute tcl/tk/tclx ? surely they arein debian?
[00:00:39] <anonimasu> it came with xlib and stuff..
[00:00:42] <robin_z> asdfqwega: not sure you can
[00:00:51] <anonimasu> robin_z: isnt it to circumvent some of the deps..
[00:01:00] <robin_z> not sure
[00:01:04] <anonimasu> robin_z: the standard debs installed a heap of stuff..
[00:01:10] <asdfqwega> robin_z: paul patches them to be single-thread
[00:01:20] <robin_z> oh,
[00:01:25] <robin_z> ok, is that good?
[00:01:52] <asdfqwega> I should think so...tkemc won't work properly with multi-thread
[00:01:56] <robin_z> wheres his repository again?
[00:02:19] <asdfqwega> homepage.ntlworld.com/bdi-emc/debian
[00:02:20] <anonimasu> hm isnt the guy off emc2 tkemc?
[00:02:24] <anonimasu> gui..
[00:03:01] <asdfqwega> Well, until I get the latest emc .deb off of him, I'm stuck trying to compile
[00:03:43] <robin_z> hmm .. he doesnt seem to have the source debs on there
[00:03:50] <anonimasu> asdfqwega: are you compiling emc1 or emc2
[00:03:51] <anonimasu> ?
[00:05:38] <asdfqwega> 2.6 kernel keyboard bollux !@#$%#$...
[00:05:39] <asdfqwega> emc1
[00:07:19] <asdfqwega> Paul said he'd post me a copy of BDI 4.12...but I have no idea of when it would get here, or even if he has my address
[00:08:39] <anonimasu> ah ok
[00:08:50] <asdfqwega> It's nice of him to do so, but I was rather hoping for a shiny new emc-0.0.1-14-i386.deb I could just drop in - and not have to do a re-install
[00:09:38] <robin_z> yeah, .debs are the way to go
[00:10:00] <robin_z> we could have stable, testign and unstable trees
[00:10:12] <robin_z> unstable being cvs head
[00:10:31] <robin_z> testing being the release candidate
[00:11:31] <asdfqwega> A stable, testing and unstable release? Brilliant!
[00:12:11] <asdfqwega> (If you haven't seen some Guiness commercials in the USA, you won't get it)
[00:12:24] <robin_z> I dont have TV
[00:13:05] <robin_z> it agaisnt our religious beliefs
[00:13:11] <asdfqwega> Something along the lines of Python-esque animation, with inventors in white lab coats
[00:13:42] <anonimasu> robin_z: are you serious?
[00:13:47] <robin_z> for the same reason, we dont use motorised transport either
[00:13:47] <anonimasu> robin_z: I like that :)
[00:13:54] <asdfqwega> "Look at my latest invention! I've invented a way to carry six beers in one hand!"
[00:14:11] <asdfqwega> "Six beers in one hand? Brilliant! Let's drink them!"
[00:14:13] <anonimasu> I hate tv's..
[00:14:24] <anonimasu> propaganda box..
[00:14:42] <asdfqwega> I hate tv, but I love commercials...they're an artform :)
[00:14:47] <robin_z> we also reject the use of metal cutlery.
[00:14:56] <robin_z> wood is the only true cutlery.
[00:15:12] <robin_z> * robin_z wonders how far he can go with this wind up
[00:15:31] <robin_z> the no tv bit was true, the rest is bollocks :)
[00:15:42] <asdfqwega> I eschew the use of horses, myself...coconuts are good enough
[00:15:55] <robin_z> well ...
[00:16:05] <robin_z> you cant make decent glue out of cocnuts!
[00:16:56] <asdfqwega> Sure you can...but you need to add a lot of horse to the recipe
[00:17:01] <robin_z> :)
[00:17:21] <anonimasu> :D
[00:17:21] <anonimasu> * anonimasu yawns
[00:17:21] <anonimasu> night everyone
[00:17:26] <robin_z> cya
[00:18:16] <asdfqwega> * asdfqwega considers doing a --nodeps
[00:19:39] <asdfqwega> I'll surely burn in debian purgatory...but what the heck
[00:22:43] <asdfqwega> hm, it's just the tclx8.4-dev that has a problem
[00:41:13] <asdfqwega> Maaaaybe Paul had some -dev stuff in the Morphix repository...
[04:17:44] <A-L-P-H-A> heh. Day1 Design. Day2 bore out a single hole, measure everything. Day3 make a tool to hold the giant tap and tap the part. Day4. Mill out the part by hand (horribly done), and disassemble and reassemble mill. Mill's measurable backlash = 0.0005" [on that axis] I'm happy now.
[12:17:57] <les_away> must have lost power overnight
[12:37:22] <cradek_> cradek_ is now known as cradek
[14:28:58] <anonimasu> * anonimasu yawns
[14:35:10] <anonimasu> hey alex
[14:35:39] <alex_joni> hey anon
[14:41:46] <anonimasu> what's up?
[14:42:16] <alex_joni> a LOT
[14:42:24] <alex_joni> I have just sold and delivered 2 robots
[14:42:30] <alex_joni> and I gotta install them this week
[14:42:41] <alex_joni> another customer called with some problems, etc.
[14:44:38] <anonimasu> ok
[14:44:39] <anonimasu> :/
[14:48:13] <alex_joni> well... it's actually ok ;)
[14:48:15] <alex_joni> I feel alive :P
[14:49:13] <anonimasu> hehe
[14:49:13] <anonimasu> ok
[14:49:40] <alex_joni> how bout you?
[14:49:49] <alex_joni> how's the tree planting going?
[14:55:28] <anonimasu> havent been working on that today
[14:55:37] <anonimasu> been helping out in the store
[14:55:37] <alex_joni> ;)
[14:55:37] <anonimasu> :)
[14:55:51] <alex_joni> I had a great talk to rayh yesterday
[14:56:05] <anonimasu> ok?
[14:56:08] <anonimasu> about what
[14:56:55] <alex_joni> about making a wire-suspended cutting machine
[14:57:05] <anonimasu> oh neat :)
[14:57:12] <alex_joni> yeah
[14:57:23] <anonimasu> I think the main challenge would be getting it rigid enough..
[14:59:13] <asdfqwega> * asdfqwega has a sudden image of Tarzan with a cutting spindle...
[14:59:28] <alex_joni> lol
[14:59:33] <alex_joni> it's for a plasma
[14:59:41] <alex_joni> so.. tarzan with fire ;)
[14:59:54] <anonimasu> haha
[14:59:55] <anonimasu> yeah
[15:00:01] <asdfqwega> Fire on which end, that's the question
[15:00:16] <anonimasu> haha
[15:00:30] <anonimasu> * anonimasu would love to build a robot..
[15:01:00] <anonimasu> although a very small one..
[15:02:24] <alex_joni> yay ...
[15:02:31] <alex_joni> an0n: get a cheap puma on ebay
[15:02:36] <alex_joni> or off some junkyard
[15:02:42] <alex_joni> and retrofit it with emc ;)
[15:02:48] <alex_joni> a puma560
[15:02:57] <alex_joni> DC-motors, encoders...
[15:03:04] <robin_z> plasma on wires eh?
[15:04:19] <alex_joni> yay... interested?
[15:04:26] <alex_joni> maybe a laser on wires later :D
[15:04:32] <robin_z> I can imagine the system, but I can also imagine significant problems :)
[15:04:46] <alex_joni> I know...
[15:04:52] <alex_joni> I am curious how it'll behave
[15:05:06] <robin_z> you were thinking of the full 3 axes on wires, or some sort of sled pulled about the table?
[15:05:11] <alex_joni> but it would be a cheap, big machine
[15:05:20] <anonimasu> alex_joni: I cant get one off ebay
[15:05:20] <alex_joni> full 3 axes on 6 wires/motors
[15:05:21] <anonimasu> :)
[15:05:26] <alex_joni> puma?
[15:05:32] <anonimasu> I am in sweden
[15:05:44] <anonimasu> most places dont ship to here
[15:05:50] <alex_joni> :(
[15:05:53] <robin_z> well, yes. but consider ... the BIG machines tend to cut thick plate
[15:06:04] <alex_joni> e.g. slow speed
[15:06:13] <anonimasu> building one wouldnt be that hard..
[15:06:24] <robin_z> thick plate means being precisiley vertical is important
[15:06:32] <alex_joni> angle?
[15:06:37] <robin_z> liek +- 1 degree
[15:06:45] <alex_joni> I agree...
[15:06:57] <anonimasu> yeah if you have 1deg at the base
[15:07:05] <robin_z> 1 degree of torch angle = 2 degrees of edge
[15:07:05] <alex_joni> how about one of those RC-gizmos.. to keep it vertical
[15:07:09] <alex_joni> with another local motor
[15:07:12] <anonimasu> yeah
[15:07:17] <anonimasu> it makes a big diff..
[15:07:20] <alex_joni> 2 of them
[15:07:24] <anonimasu> maybe 1deg per cm..
[15:07:28] <anonimasu> I dont know how to calc it..
[15:07:33] <anonimasu> err 1mm
[15:07:56] <alex_joni> I don't want it that big...
[15:08:02] <alex_joni> 3x6m or so
[15:08:09] <alex_joni> hey paul
[15:08:15] <robin_z> anyway, I cant quite see it being stiff enough, motion wise
[15:08:37] <alex_joni> I guess we'll see ;)
[15:08:38] <anonimasu> bbl..
[15:08:43] <robin_z> unless you can get true position feedback from the head
[15:08:47] <paul_c> Morning Alex
[15:08:50] <alex_joni> DGPS?
[15:08:59] <alex_joni> how's it going paul?
[15:09:30] <alex_joni> there's a new guy working on 2.6 (at least he said so...)
[15:09:30] <robin_z> I just ordered a programming cable for the Rabbit
[15:09:42] <alex_joni> I directed him to pc_2_6_test from emc2 CVS
[15:10:02] <paul_c> It won't compile
[15:10:04] <robin_z> going to dump Steve Hardys EMC interp port into it
[15:10:16] <alex_joni> he's trying to figure out a Makefile.inc (with as little changes to Makefiles as possible) to get emc2 working under 2.6
[15:10:38] <alex_joni> I asked him to send an email to the dev-list when he encounters problems
[15:10:40] <paul_c> Send him my way
[15:10:58] <alex_joni> will do...
[15:11:06] <alex_joni> maybe I'll send myself yourway too ;)
[15:11:14] <alex_joni> I plan to install a 2.6 too
[15:11:23] <paul_c> might not be able to reply to any emails till mid Feb.
[15:11:37] <alex_joni> short question about that: can I keep 2.4 and 2.6 running in parallel?
[15:11:56] <alex_joni> I remember having to change modutils when switching from 2.2 to 2.4
[15:12:13] <paul_c> Not unless we install kernel modules in a sane location
[15:12:14] <alex_joni> along with other stuff (gcc, some libs)
[15:12:32] <alex_joni> paul_c: didn't quite get that...
[15:12:33] <paul_c> GNU tool chain does not change
[15:12:47] <alex_joni> ok, that's good to know (a 3.3 would probably be ok)
[15:12:59] <paul_c> you can use the same compiler & libs for both
[15:13:02] <alex_joni> modutils?
[15:13:29] <paul_c> an upgrade to module-init-tools is needed, unless you already have it installed
[15:13:45] <alex_joni> don't think so, but I'll check
[15:13:54] <alex_joni> so you're saying a dual-boot is possible?
[15:14:06] <alex_joni> boot a 2.4 kernel or a 2.6 kernel?
[15:15:47] <alex_joni> the guy from yesterday is "SWPadnos"
[15:16:07] <alex_joni> he sent an email to the dev-list some days ago, but yesterday he was around and we talked a bit
[15:18:13] <alex_joni> robin_z: still around?
[15:18:26] <alex_joni> robin_z: seems some stuff is missing from the wiki... ;)
[15:18:48] <alex_joni> robin_z: I added a page yesterday as an intro to the wiki.. it seems to be gone now
[15:22:03] <robin_z> oh!
[15:22:14] <alex_joni> found it :)
[15:22:18] <robin_z> hah!
[15:22:19] <alex_joni> wasn't on the HomePage
[15:22:26] <alex_joni> but on EmcKnowledgeBase
[15:22:48] <robin_z> just a default page name
[15:22:57] <alex_joni> different page ;)
[15:23:01] <alex_joni> http://www.redpoint.org.uk/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?EmcKnowledgeBase
[15:23:11] <alex_joni> http://www.redpoint.org.uk/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?HomePage
[15:23:27] <alex_joni> * alex_joni leaves for a while...
[15:23:30] <alex_joni> back later
[15:47:49] <A-L-P-H-A> quiet again.
[16:09:17] <paul_c> Morning Steve.
[16:09:24] <SteveStallings> morning
[16:10:51] <SteveStallings> havin fun learning to edit WiKis
[16:16:31] <paul_c> tip: mangle any URL to the wiki page to confuse wiki-spammers
[16:17:32] <paul_c> http://www.foo.com/w1k1-warz (for example)
[16:19:05] <robin_z> * robin_z adds some more crap to the wiki
[16:19:44] <robin_z> ahh, maybe emcwiki.pl then?
[16:20:32] <paul_c> I think the scumbags grep for "wiki"
[16:20:52] <robin_z> emcinfo.pl
[16:21:50] <robin_z> ok, I'll copy the script .. leave the old one up there for a while too
[16:24:26] <alex_joni> * alex_joni is back
[16:53:52] <robin_z> I do like the wiki idea more and more
[16:59:47] <paul_c> who/where/why is this wiki ?
[17:00:13] <alex_joni> because...
[17:00:17] <alex_joni> it's there
[17:00:21] <alex_joni> to be filled
[17:00:49] <alex_joni> robin_sz set it up, as a test... if it turns out ok, it'll be moved to Steves site
[17:02:46] <paul_c> Looks like vertually all the bugs/problems have been fixed with BDI-4.12
[17:02:57] <alex_joni> wow... ;)
[17:03:08] <paul_c> Synaptic works
[17:03:08] <alex_joni> paul: how do I get it to put it on the site?
[17:03:22] <alex_joni> can you ftp it in ?
[17:03:37] <alex_joni> hi steve2 ;)
[17:03:38] <stevestallings2> dang silent disconnects
[17:03:41] <paul_c> can you email me the login/passwd ?
[17:03:51] <alex_joni> how about /msg ?
[17:04:04] <alex_joni> * alex_joni is really lazy now...
[17:04:24] <paul_c> * paul_c being lazy
[17:04:34] <alex_joni> hmmm... seems we both are...
[17:04:38] <paul_c> That would mean having to pick up a pen & paper
[17:04:39] <alex_joni> now that's a problem ;)
[17:04:51] <alex_joni> I'd have to start the sendmail program
[17:04:53] <paul_c> /msg will be fine.
[17:05:03] <alex_joni> I'll msg to your logger
[17:05:06] <alex_joni> how about that?
[17:07:12] <stevestallings2> robin - I am ready to change the wiki link, are you here?
[17:14:18] <alex_joni> * alex_joni is gone home
[17:14:19] <alex_joni> bye
[17:21:25] <robin_z> stevestallings2: feel free to change the link whenever you like
[17:21:51] <robin_z> http://www.redpoint.org.uk/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl
[17:23:03] <robin_z> I'll delete the old .pl file tomorow sometime
[17:24:16] <stevestallings2> link has been updated, now if I can just get FrontPage to quit converting &# characters back to plain text 8-)
[18:28:38] <asdfqwega> Hahahaha...who wrote this wiki?
[18:29:07] <asdfqwega> Look out, the underpants gnomes are going to sic the copyright pixies on you
[18:31:12] <SteveStallings> robin set up the wiki, I provided links from LinuxCNC
[18:31:23] <SteveStallings> what is the risk you see from gnomes?
[18:32:44] <SteveStallings> hopefully the links are resistant to scans for "WiKi"
[18:37:47] <asdfqwega> Ah, just the section "Debian installation"
[18:38:47] <asdfqwega> Hey, paul_c...you're stateside right now, aren't you?
[18:44:56] <SteveStallings> OK, so I see WiKi content can be somewhat "free form" 8-)
[18:48:23] <asdfqwega> * asdfqwega pesters paul_c for the latest .debs
[19:12:39] <robin_z> * robin_z cuts and pastes bits of stuff from various pages into the wiki
[19:16:45] <asdfqwega> Robin with a wiki is probably like giving a monkey the keys to bannana plantation
[19:18:59] <robin_z> no no
[19:19:12] <robin_z> a monkey in a plantation would have some sense of direction and purpose
[19:20:16] <asdfqwega> aye, and a 'nanner in his mouth, too
[19:43:47] <robin_z> thats info wiki-ing for one night
[19:49:54] <paul_c> * paul_c edits wiki pages.
[19:51:42] <asdfqwega> Has anybody here ever used the Realtime Testsuite LiveCD?
[19:52:04] <paul_c> yup - On two systems
[19:53:11] <robin_z> * robin_z gets all axcited about running the NIST gcode interp on his G2002
[19:54:07] <robin_z> I wonder what Steve compiled it with ... the almost free dynamic C from rabbit, or the expensive thing
[19:56:47] <robin_z> whatever, it will be fun to play with
[19:57:47] <asdfqwega> I'm trying to understand the RT LiveCD scores...
[19:57:54] <asdfqwega> I'm almost sure that large numbers are bad :)
[20:02:14] <asdfqwega> It'd be nice if there was something (legible) that you could point to "THIS is the best hardware to use"
[20:02:55] <asdfqwega> And since I opened my mouth to suggest it, I guess I'm nominated
[20:11:54] <robin_z> asdfqwega: id say, that is almost a pointless exercise
[20:12:26] <robin_z> the average life of a motherboard in supply is, about, 6 months
[20:13:17] <robin_z> you'll never stay on top pof it
[20:13:31] <cradek> a list of common gotchas might be useful instead
[20:13:40] <cradek> laptops with APM: gotcha
[20:13:54] <cradek> no parallel port: gotcha
[20:14:03] <cradek> paul says something about some chipset or other
[20:14:12] <cradek> and onboard video ram shared with system ram?
[20:14:17] <robin_z> and, worse, when youve recommended a Tyan B45-AR345G, then people will assume that they need just that, and when they cant find it, assume nothing else will work
[20:14:48] <robin_z> yeah, but ive run emc on Intel 810 chipset systems just fine ...
[20:15:10] <robin_z> yes, with onboard video
[20:15:30] <robin_z> there are some rules I guess
[20:15:44] <robin_z> but some other things seem harder to define
[20:16:55] <robin_z> I have to say ... im impressed with Steve Hardy's GUI for the G2002
[20:17:33] <robin_z> considering hes developed on his own, in not that long, its quite good
[20:20:07] <asdfqwega> robin: got a link
[20:20:09] <asdfqwega> ?
[20:20:34] <robin_z> yeah, which version you wanna see? windows or linux?
[20:20:46] <asdfqwega> linux, of course!
[20:20:51] <robin_z> the windows one is easier to install ;)
[20:21:16] <asdfqwega> Feh, like that's going to deter me
[20:21:27] <asdfqwega> I just wanna know what this G2002 thingy is
[20:22:26] <robin_z> its a open-source hardawre based step generator
[20:22:35] <robin_z> controlled over USB
[20:22:38] <robin_z> http://finance.groups.yahoo.com/group/geckodrive/files/G2002%20Project/G2002%20Misc./
[20:23:10] <robin_z> ypou want the g2002_alpha_2.tgz
[20:23:15] <asdfqwega> I've heard something about that last year...
[20:23:28] <robin_z> very very fast, very smooth
[20:23:59] <robin_z> steve has ported the emc interp to it :)
[20:27:32] <asdfqwega> Ugh...looking will have to wait until I can dig up my Yahoo! ID
[20:27:56] <robin_z> I'll stick it on my server if you wanr
[20:27:57] <robin_z> t
[20:28:25] <asdfqwega> Thanks, but no need
[20:28:46] <robin_z> ok
[20:29:13] <asdfqwega> If you want, you could always help me stare at Paul until he updates his .deb repository
[20:31:10] <robin_z> I suspect that wont be until he rurns to the UK, mid feb at earliest
[20:31:32] <asdfqwega> Yeah, I kinda figured
[20:31:55] <asdfqwega> I've just been doing way to many "install, test, break, re-install" cycles lately
[20:32:47] <asdfqwega> And I was all eager when he said he fixed the problems in the new BDI :)
[20:33:43] <cradek> so do any of the BDI-4 work?
[20:34:15] <asdfqwega> Paul said 'virtually all problems in BDI-4.12 are solved'
[20:34:54] <robin_z> I have not a whole lot if interest in the BDIs anymore
[20:34:56] <asdfqwega> I haven't tried the BDI-4 yet - don't have good broadband
[20:35:05] <robin_z> im a .debs convert :)
[20:35:20] <cradek> robin_z: I don't either, but I have no idea what to recommend to new users.
[20:35:30] <asdfqwega> I was using the .debs
[20:35:38] <robin_z> recommend they install sarge and grab the debs then ;)
[20:37:46] <asdfqwega> Well, some good came of my Frankenstein computer work...
[20:38:19] <asdfqwega> What cause my old EMC to fail - not exactly the motherboard
[20:39:17] <asdfqwega> Either use jumper switches or autodetection - and autodetection is flaky
[20:45:49] <asdfqwega> Set jumpers, works perfectly
[20:56:15] <les_away> hello all
[20:56:23] <les_away> taking a break
[20:56:45] <les_away> I NEED to hire a spray painter
[20:56:52] <les_away> this is getting old
[20:57:14] <les_away> But since I will not find one here...
[20:57:50] <les_away> I am gonna go ahead and automate painting
[20:58:10] <les_away> what are cheap PLCs going for theses days?
[20:59:05] <les_away> 2 spray heads, 2 solenoids, a motor, and some ss relays should do it
[20:59:20] <cradek> fun
[20:59:40] <les_away> yeah
[20:59:42] <cradek> going to use the new motion-coordinated IO in emc?
[21:00:11] <les_away> ought to be able to throw that together pretty fast
[21:00:30] <les_away> well pretty much out of dio with stg
[21:00:45] <les_away> anyway...heh...it's busy
[21:00:50] <cradek> so use a parallel port
[21:01:10] <les_away> I could do that
[21:01:12] <cradek> "simple matter of programming"
[21:01:15] <CIA-temp601> CIA-temp601 is now known as CIA-7
[21:01:56] <les_away> I have used pcs and parports for soft PLCs with dos and c way back
[21:02:31] <les_away> This time just grabbing a PLC will free me quicker though
[21:02:49] <les_away> I think they are not more than $200 or so
[21:02:57] <les_away> perhaps less
[21:03:05] <cradek> les_away: I made the smaller of my two pulleys successfully, but I think the big one is not within my ability...
[21:03:14] <cradek> I'll try some stuff tonight, but I might have to take you up on your offer
[21:03:18] <les_away> heck...a basic stamp would work fine
[21:03:34] <les_away> No problem...I can whip that out for you
[21:03:47] <cradek> do you have a cnc lathe too?
[21:04:13] <les_away> No, but I have a well tooled Boxford VSL 500
[21:04:33] <les_away> I'ts a nice little lathe
[21:04:42] <cradek> can I just stop by and use it?
[21:04:58] <les_away> little...hmmm weighs a couple thousand I guess
[21:05:07] <les_away> sure
[21:05:20] <les_away> But I'm not exactly down the street
[21:05:30] <cradek> yeah, too bad about that
[21:06:10] <les_away> But if you had a trip to Atlanta or Greenville or Charlotte you could
[21:06:23] <cradek> I was just being funny
[21:06:36] <les_away> heh
[21:06:45] <cradek> back soon
[21:06:53] <les_away> well lots of list members have stopped by
[21:06:56] <les_away> k
[21:21:53] <robin_z> hey les!
[21:21:58] <les_away> this will work:
[21:22:12] <les_away> http://www.tri-plc.com/t100md.htm
[21:22:17] <les_away> hey robin
[21:22:28] <les_away> I'm gonna automate painting here
[21:22:32] <les_away> goin nuts
[21:22:45] <robin_z> yeah?
[21:22:51] <robin_z> * robin_z scrolls up
[21:22:54] <robin_z> hmm
[21:23:00] <les_away> 200 bucks
[21:23:19] <robin_z> all built in a box?
[21:23:25] <les_away> saw some other PLCs for under a hundred
[21:23:39] <robin_z> is price *that* important?
[21:23:47] <les_away> 189...not in a box I think
[21:24:05] <robin_z> I would put getting it going TODAY as being a big plus if it really needs doing
[21:24:25] <les_away> No...I just want to end my spray painting carreer NOW
[21:24:29] <les_away> haha
[21:25:02] <les_away> Gosh this thing is a pretty good stepper conteoller
[21:25:09] <les_away> 10 amps 24v
[21:25:17] <robin_z> low voltas
[21:25:25] <les_away> even reads encoders
[21:25:31] <robin_z> neat
[21:25:46] <robin_z> had the Baldpr guy in today
[21:25:47] <les_away> I just need to operate solenoids for a couple spray heads
[21:25:50] <robin_z> baldor
[21:26:07] <les_away> buying servos?
[21:26:11] <robin_z> yeah
[21:26:16] <robin_z> well, yeah and no
[21:26:25] <robin_z> this is Baldor ...
[21:26:40] <robin_z> I phone them and the rep is on site within 2 hours
[21:26:52] <robin_z> talks about the machine, gets some specs ..
[21:27:05] <robin_z> quotes some guide prices ...
[21:27:09] <les_away> Baldor less expensive than SEM?
[21:27:56] <robin_z> says "let us know when you are ready, we'll ship it up to you. when its mounted, call us and we'll send an engineer to help tune it. try it for a few eeks, if its no good, send it back. no cash down"
[21:28:26] <les_away> must be including amp
[21:28:38] <robin_z> yeah and controller and front end software
[21:28:42] <les_away> brushless?
[21:28:45] <robin_z> yep
[21:28:55] <les_away> ok
[21:29:27] <les_away> you have been using steppers right?
[21:29:42] <robin_z> steppers were a bit of a disaster, under Mach2 anyway
[21:29:56] <les_away> well yeah
[21:29:56] <robin_z> so I used those Burny things on a couple ..
[21:30:02] <robin_z> but the price is scary
[21:30:19] <les_away> I stopped using them in tools a LONG time ago
[21:30:22] <robin_z> this is better servos (brushless v brush DC)
[21:30:34] <robin_z> for half the cash
[21:30:42] <les_away> brushless is good
[21:30:51] <robin_z> and a far mor capable controller
[21:31:08] <les_away> pidff?
[21:31:33] <robin_z> pid yes, ff, not sure
[21:31:48] <robin_z> that NextMove ESB thing ..
[21:32:05] <robin_z> 8 servo channels, shed loads of IO, analogue IO etc
[21:32:22] <les_away> should be enough
[21:32:40] <robin_z> you looked at the spec a while ago
[21:32:58] <les_away> I am suprised at how much those cheap PLCs can do
[21:33:04] <robin_z> yep ...
[21:33:09] <les_away> and they are a web server
[21:33:12] <les_away> ha
[21:33:19] <robin_z> isnt everything these days?
[21:33:24] <les_away> I guess
[21:33:28] <robin_z> its usually almost embedded by default
[21:33:50] <robin_z> ordered a prgramming lead for the G2002 embedded micro
[21:34:08] <robin_z> steve hardy has got his emc interp port to it working
[21:34:30] <les_away> neat
[21:34:41] <robin_z> im sort of thinking servos and a proper baldro controller for the big machiens
[21:34:58] <robin_z> steppers and a G2002 for the small (4x4) stuff
[21:35:00] <les_away> the interpreter is by far the best part of emc
[21:35:18] <robin_z> yep
[21:35:24] <robin_z> needs subroutines though
[21:35:39] <les_away> yes tell me about it
[21:35:57] <les_away> had to do that array in a test editor pasting stuff
[21:36:04] <robin_z> hey ...
[21:36:06] <les_away> text editor
[21:36:11] <robin_z> you know geneva right?
[21:36:29] <les_away> Been there a couple times
[21:36:29] <robin_z> http://www.skyandsummit.com/Glacegeneve/
[21:36:43] <robin_z> similar waether to your I bleieve :)
[21:37:24] <les_away> nice
[21:37:44] <les_away> No it was Zurich not Geneva
[21:37:57] <les_away> It was for all that powder coat stuff
[21:37:57] <robin_z> well, switzerland anyway :)
[21:38:02] <robin_z> right
[21:38:20] <robin_z> well, if you ccant sort out your paint application, no one can :)
[21:38:29] <robin_z> hows the sander? bored yet?
[21:38:36] <les_away> heh yeah
[21:38:59] <les_away> I let him walk home and take a nap at lunch
[21:39:03] <les_away> really
[21:39:08] <les_away> he is 75
[21:39:12] <robin_z> ahh
[21:39:28] <les_away> He is doing ok
[21:39:29] <robin_z> watch that RSI
[21:39:35] <les_away> I am going nuts
[21:39:47] <les_away> can't do repetitive tasks
[21:39:57] <les_away> RSI?
[21:40:05] <robin_z> repetetive strain injury
[21:40:11] <les_away> oh
[21:40:30] <les_away> yeah
[21:40:41] <les_away> brb
[21:41:52] <les_away> lunch has defrosted...back in a while
[21:51:36] <CIA-temp319> CIA-temp319 is now known as CIA-7
[21:53:52] <les_away> I think I will get that plc...I like that it can be programmed in basic
[21:54:03] <les_away> not a great ladder logic fan
[21:54:20] <gezr> whats an alternative to it?
[21:54:37] <les_away> basic or c
[21:54:47] <gezr> na, to a plc
[21:55:21] <les_away> I just decided to automate the spray painting
[21:55:52] <gezr> thats cool, but what about plc, is there an alternatitive to it?
[21:56:26] <les_away> I could use a pc, a basic stamp, or a host of other things
[21:56:32] <gezr> how many parts will you be able to auto magically paint?
[21:56:35] <gezr> at a time
[21:56:44] <les_away> But the trick is to get it done fast
[21:57:00] <les_away> Just one at a time...the parts rotate
[21:57:08] <les_away> cycle time is 3 seconds
[21:57:14] <gezr> oh sweet
[21:57:27] <gezr> completely even coat Im guessing as well
[21:57:42] <les_away> plus placing/removing the part
[21:57:56] <les_away> well you saw the picture...pretty even coat
[21:58:06] <gezr> I bet I missed that
[21:58:13] <gezr> I just got home a bit ago
[21:58:14] <les_away> i'll get it
[21:58:51] <CIA-temp634> CIA-temp634 is now known as CIA-7
[21:58:53] <robin_z> hey, you know my BIG laser ...
[21:59:03] <robin_z> needs some exotic RF connectors ...
[21:59:11] <robin_z> I found some on Ebay .. :)
[21:59:18] <robin_z> �5 each
[21:59:46] <les_away> hmm
[22:00:00] <les_away> here is the link I had before gezr
[22:00:01] <CIA-temp194> CIA-temp194 is now known as CIA-7
[22:00:06] <les_away> http://www.dynamiccalls.com/Catalog.htm
[22:00:20] <les_away> look at "crystal over slate"
[22:00:49] <les_away> you know that plc has encoder reading and PID
[22:00:54] <les_away> pretty fast too
[22:02:53] <les_away> les_away is now known as les
[22:03:36] <les> gotta find some solenoids here
[22:03:45] <gezr> looks sweet les :)
[22:03:55] <les> thanks
[22:04:01] <les> made with emc
[22:04:04] <robin_z> its a flange )
[22:04:06] <robin_z> :))
[22:04:13] <les> it's a frisbee
[22:04:54] <les> I need two spray heads...one for the top and one for the side
[22:05:22] <les> unless I could get a gun to do a figure 8 spray pattern
[22:05:46] <robin_z> get the angle jsut right, split nozzle maybe ...
[22:06:00] <gezr> if you have a programable method, you can mount the sprayhead on an arc, rotate the part front/back, then park at the side facing the gun, then arc the gun around the part, repeate right?
[22:06:18] <les> well I have seen clogged nozzles do a figure 8
[22:06:27] <robin_z> 2 guns might be cheaper and more reliable I guess
[22:06:36] <les> gezr: yes I could do that easily
[22:06:53] <les> But I have LOTS of spray guns
[22:06:53] <robin_z> * robin_z adds another two weeks to the project
[22:07:24] <les> ( my old company invented paint spraying)
[22:07:25] <gezr> im really tired today for some reason
[22:07:37] <les> me too
[22:07:42] <robin_z> get some nice pre-made linear actuators
[22:07:51] <les> painting 800 of those things
[22:07:54] <robin_z> those linear rail and belt things
[22:08:02] <robin_z> painted 800 today?
[22:08:04] <les> oh and 36 degreesf in the booth
[22:08:12] <les> 800 coats
[22:08:15] <robin_z> is that hot?
[22:08:23] <les> 2x400
[22:08:33] <les> ha
[22:08:39] <robin_z> how long did that take?
[22:09:09] <les> hmm 4 hrs or something like that
[22:09:20] <robin_z> not bad
[22:09:29] <les> I was also working on robotics stuff
[22:09:47] <gezr> * gezr see les having a clap on/clap off automated turkey call making setup in a year
[22:09:56] <les> haha
[22:10:01] <robin_z> that reminds me, must size some servos
[22:10:35] <les> Oh I am sizing servos for that foam cushion manufacturer still
[22:10:41] <les> or already did
[22:10:43] <robin_z> that countersunk hole, its a pne operation job, special cutter?
[22:10:54] <robin_z> one
[22:10:58] <les> 90 degree v
[22:11:07] <robin_z> and a drill first?
[22:11:11] <les> right
[22:11:17] <les> could combine
[22:11:21] <robin_z> yep
[22:11:38] <gezr> les : ever consider using a dual Z axis on that thing of yours?
[22:11:46] <les> but It make about 1 a second already
[22:11:49] <robin_z> save you a tool change and many many plunge operations
[22:11:56] <les> Gezr: yes
[22:11:58] <gezr> one of them procuner heads with 6 drills in it and just one plunge?
[22:12:35] <les> I could...but I want to see how the sales go before I do stuff like that
[22:12:43] <robin_z> complex
[22:12:57] <les> Hard tooling is often faster than cnc
[22:13:02] <gezr> yep
[22:13:04] <robin_z> surely those holes must take up abut 40% of the total machining time?
[22:13:11] <les> But it's the versatility that gets the job
[22:13:34] <les> robin: no, only a tiny fraction
[22:13:38] <robin_z> 'k
[22:13:54] <robin_z> its the chopping out that takes the time, severla passes
[22:13:58] <robin_z> ??
[22:14:01] <les> The big ones are hollowing it out and cutting it out
[22:14:06] <robin_z> right
[22:14:10] <les> it's just a thin shell
[22:14:15] <robin_z> right
[22:14:29] <les> And I am severely hp limited
[22:14:36] <gezr> oh my lord, I cant think of what its called, machine, rotates the part to a station, something is done to it, then it gets rotated to another station, and now you have 2 parts going, on and on, till a complete part pops out and 8 more getting stuff done?
[22:14:39] <les> hollowing takes 45 seconds
[22:14:48] <robin_z> yeah
[22:14:56] <robin_z> like a reloading press for cartridges
[22:15:14] <robin_z> but then you have a single use machine
[22:15:22] <robin_z> speaking of which ...
[22:15:36] <gezr> anyway, im almost done with my new blast cabinet :), I need to devise a vacume method for it
[22:15:42] <robin_z> should get the STL files back from the 3d scanner tomorow :)
[22:15:59] <robin_z> (too fscking expensive!!)
[22:16:13] <robin_z> 300 GBP to scan a handgrip!!
[22:16:20] <les> yeah
[22:16:26] <robin_z> gits.
[22:16:38] <robin_z> to go on this:
[22:16:39] <les> I have paid big $ to have things scanned
[22:17:06] <robin_z> http://www.hps-tr.com/ultraStocks.htm#fr703
[22:17:18] <les> gezr: picture of your casbinet?
[22:17:18] <robin_z> that grip :)
[22:17:45] <gezr> les : www.masternode.net/gallery in the machine stuff
[22:17:49] <gezr> page 1
[22:19:16] <gezr> I like to hear some feedback on it
[22:19:33] <robin_z> I have a good deal going with that gunsmith ... I sort out automating his grip production, he gives me one of those rifles.
[22:19:40] <robin_z> :))
[22:20:39] <les> gezr: nice
[22:20:59] <les> robin: I did some grips once for a power nailer
[22:21:10] <robin_z> wooden?
[22:21:22] <les> haha 2024 AL
[22:21:27] <robin_z> ahh:)
[22:21:30] <robin_z> cast then
[22:21:51] <robin_z> high pressure die cast I presume
[22:22:19] <les> It was the prototype for the silenced explosive nailer
[22:22:27] <robin_z> right
[22:22:30] <robin_z> hilti gun
[22:22:36] <les> actually to be later done in glass filled nylon
[22:22:52] <les> hilti!!! the competition
[22:23:00] <les> Ramset/redhead
[22:23:05] <robin_z> right
[22:23:22] <les> 5 chamber silencer built in
[22:23:40] <les> went grom 160 dba to mid 80s
[22:23:43] <les> from
[22:24:05] <robin_z> nice
[22:24:30] <robin_z> easy when you know hoe
[22:24:33] <robin_z> how
[22:24:34] <les> It basically makes no sound of it's own
[22:24:51] <robin_z> right, jut the nail hitting wood
[22:24:59] <les> Well I modelled it in spice
[22:25:04] <robin_z> :)
[22:25:20] <les> But made the whole thing in 2024 and 4140
[22:25:27] <robin_z> like a well silenced .22LR
[22:25:39] <les> 'cause I didn't really calculate the stresses
[22:25:43] <robin_z> you hear the click of the pin hitting the cartridge ...
[22:25:55] <les> and didn't want to blow my hand off
[22:26:09] <robin_z> and the SMACK of the lead hitting the target
[22:26:18] <les> you usually need a muzzle brake to silence .22lr
[22:26:25] <les> (supersonic)
[22:26:26] <robin_z> yeah,
[22:26:31] <robin_z> no
[22:26:35] <robin_z> some is
[22:26:39] <les> right
[22:26:41] <les> varies
[22:26:42] <robin_z> the quite stuff is sub
[22:27:30] <les> Hey I must go out to the shop a bit
[22:27:39] <les> the day s not quite done
[22:27:57] <robin_z> k
[22:27:58] <robin_z> l8r
[22:28:03] <les> have to paint 4 robotic tester enclosures
[22:28:18] <robin_z> powder!
[22:28:25] <les> ha l8r
[22:28:32] <les> powder would be good
[23:23:01] <gezr> back, spent another 30 bucks at home depot
[23:23:40] <gezr> got me a ruber pipe thing, to use as the vacume release vent so I dont colapse the box, new feeder line and air line, and thing I can connect the vacume line to