#emc | Logs for 2004-11-09

[00:05:52] <alex_joni> * alex_joni is leaving soon...
[00:12:09] <paul_c> * paul_c is back
[00:18:09] <alex_joni> hey paul...
[00:18:18] <alex_joni> I was just preparing to write you an e-mail...
[00:18:24] <alex_joni> but this saves my time ;)
[00:18:31] <paul_c> * paul_c can go again...
[00:18:42] <alex_joni> ok...
[00:18:47] <paul_c> ;}
[00:19:05] <alex_joni> so: in emc.ini there are some relative links (e.g. configs/emc.nml, configs/emc.var)
[00:19:20] <paul_c> an email might be better - Gives us a chance to think responses through...
[00:19:32] <alex_joni> ok... I'll mail you too...
[00:22:26] <paul_c> There isn't any paths spec'ed in the sample emc.ini
[00:22:41] <alex_joni> hmmm... are you sure?
[00:22:49] <alex_joni> I see configs/emc.nml and configs/emc.var
[00:23:22] <paul_c> PARAMETER_FILE = emc.var
[00:23:33] <alex_joni> what checkout?
[00:23:38] <alex_joni> emc1?
[00:23:47] <paul_c> The only one I see is doc/help.txt
[00:24:09] <paul_c> auto_configure_0_1
[00:24:15] <alex_joni> well... not good ;)
[00:24:20] <alex_joni> that was what I did...
[00:24:27] <alex_joni> remove configs/emc.var
[00:24:59] <alex_joni> if you look at emc2 (HEAD) or (cvs up on autoconf) you will see PARAMETER_FILE = configs/emc.var
[00:26:26] <paul_c> PARAMETER_FILE = $EMC2CONFIGDIR/emc.var
[00:26:36] <alex_joni> yup... that's what zwisk did
[00:26:47] <alex_joni> and $EMC2CONFIGDIR gets replaced by make install
[00:27:01] <paul_c> * paul_c needs to have a word with zwisk on that then....
[00:27:28] <alex_joni> my proposition:
[00:27:29] <paul_c> It will break if/when a compiled ap tries to parse it.
[00:27:39] <alex_joni> yes...
[00:27:50] <alex_joni> but before parsing there is a make install needed
[00:28:00] <paul_c> need to get away from the /bin/bash thinking.
[00:28:05] <alex_joni> that's why run-in-place is broken (you need a make test first)
[00:28:38] <alex_joni> ok.. I see it like this...
[00:28:47] <alex_joni> take from zwisk the whole dirs stuff
[00:28:56] <alex_joni> and include that to the make install I did
[00:29:05] <alex_joni> (no altering of any scripts)
[00:30:04] <alex_joni> right now (both my version and zwisks uses emc.conf for finding out what is where)
[00:30:15] <alex_joni> and emc.conf gets created by ./configure
[00:30:42] <paul_c> which only works if you use a bash script to launch everything
[00:40:19] <alex_joni> I gotta run...
[00:40:26] <alex_joni> I'll send you an e-mail.. ok?
[00:40:37] <alex_joni> and we'll take it from there
[00:42:03] <paul_c> No prob.
[00:43:56] <alex_joni> bye...
[01:44:01] <les> hello
[01:46:13] <paul_c> Hi Les
[01:47:47] <les> ha the local isp's chat room is going down since they are out of business
[01:47:52] <les> so...
[01:48:07] <les> I will host a rabun county chat room
[01:48:16] <les> heheh
[01:48:31] <les> these guys never heard of yahoo groops
[01:48:36] <paul_c> irc style or web based ?
[01:48:55] <les> either
[01:49:14] <les> irc stle might eat up some of my bandwidth
[01:49:22] <les> style
[01:49:45] <paul_c> Shouldn't do...
[01:49:46] <les> actually...it shouldn't
[01:50:14] <les> the bandwith of even a very active IRC channel is prob very low
[01:50:24] <les> I guess
[01:50:25] <paul_c> I'm currently downloading Dedian (all of it), and it isn't impacting on the irc latency
[01:51:07] <les> yes I am running a stepper moter control program right now on the same computer!
[01:51:47] <les> anyway...I will host the site and have the entire Acme Brinworks customer base
[01:52:00] <les> I won't spam 'em though
[01:52:03] <paul_c> IRC is a simple text based protocol...
[01:52:58] <les> now if it was voice chat...that would eat up major bandwidth
[01:53:04] <les> but not text
[01:53:16] <paul_c> Cooo... No there's an idea...
[01:53:22] <paul_c> voip chat room.
[01:53:23] <les> ?
[01:53:45] <les> it works really good...my kid uses it
[01:53:57] <les> what's it called....
[01:54:05] <les> forgot the name
[01:54:15] <paul_c> gotta set up voip and see how it works sometime
[01:54:36] <les> yes that would be neat
[01:56:24] <les> grrr my stepper program locks up sometimes in !%^&$ Windows
[01:56:50] <paul_c> time for linux ?
[01:57:19] <les> oh yeah....but the salesmen have W2000 on their laptops
[01:57:57] <les> But I am working on the money guys for Linux/RTAI factory automation
[01:58:07] <les> bit of a hard sell
[01:58:56] <paul_c> use language they understand - no licencing costs
[01:59:08] <les> They prob get kickbacks/perks from the closed source automation vendors
[01:59:57] <paul_c> no lock in on proprietory hardware or software
[02:00:25] <les> I think those arguments will sell to the right people
[02:00:40] <les> like the finance guys
[02:00:49] <paul_c> multiple source for low cost hardware
[02:01:20] <les> yup
[02:01:43] <paul_c> complete control over software
[02:01:56] <paul_c> and higher system security
[02:02:18] <paul_c> (no need to have web browsers on PC based controls)
[02:03:37] <les> hmmm I think I need to get you in there to make the pitch
[02:04:22] <les> Right now I am talking to engineers...
[02:04:29] <les> wrong people
[02:04:39] <les> need to go much higher up
[02:05:44] <les> I want to make a presentation when I go up there
[02:06:10] <les> I sure don't want to go but it looks like I have to
[02:06:41] <les> Need to settle on a plant visit fee schedule
[02:07:08] <les> $1000/day is typical
[02:07:26] <paul_c> as little as that ?
[02:07:28] <les> sounds like a lot but one doesn't get to keep that much
[02:07:33] <les> haw
[02:07:55] <paul_c> Is that plus expenses ?
[02:08:12] <les> usually not
[02:08:28] <les> so it kinda gets whittled away
[02:08:49] <paul_c> OK - That puts me at a disadvantage then
[02:09:03] <les> it can be negotiated
[02:09:40] <les> I used to spend RIDICULOUS amounts when traveling as an employee
[02:10:04] <paul_c> probably looking at $1200 - $1500 just to fly out from Heathrow
[02:10:13] <les> I recall a dinner bill of $600 once
[02:11:25] <les> I think travel stuff could be taken care of if they can be convinced to go with the program
[02:11:32] <les> or even before
[02:11:59] <les> Are you comfortable giving dog and pony shows to groups?
[02:12:11] <paul_c> Is there any more to the "setting up a linux based production line" than just a vauge concept ?
[02:12:34] <paul_c> * paul_c can do presentations - But NOT with powerpoint !
[02:12:34] <les> no powerpoint though....heh...I hate powerpoint
[02:13:05] <les> haha that crossed in the airwaves...we were thinking the same thing
[02:13:22] <les> pwerpoint is like watching paint dry
[02:14:08] <les> I suppose it is a vague concept
[02:14:15] <paul_c> http://www.norvig.com/Gettysburg/
[02:15:55] <les> haw that cracks me up
[02:16:17] <les> gotta save that
[02:16:30] <paul_c> You want to here the Churchill PP presentation
[02:17:03] <les> yeah
[02:17:23] <les> haw those dumb ass bar charts heheh
[02:19:07] <paul_c> http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/factual/rams/mon1545.ram
[02:21:40] <les> durn windows media player can't do .ram
[02:21:50] <les> let me try something else
[02:23:07] <les> outta luck...no joy on Quicktime
[02:25:15] <les> oh welll...hmmm having spam popups that won't close (not from your link)
[02:25:35] <les> I am gonna get off for a while to blast the spyware
[02:26:01] <les> bet that was what crashed my stepper program
[02:26:35] <les> later
[02:26:38] <paul_c> When you have a better defined "game plan" for this automation project, I can give you a hand putting a Bean Counter's report together
[02:26:51] <les> sounds good
[02:27:17] <les> back in a while
[03:33:08] <CIA-1> 03cradek * 10emc/src/emcplot3d/emcplot3d.cc: another arc fix: arcs like g0x0y0z0/g2x0y0i.5j0z1 were wrong.
[03:50:55] <paul_c> Hi daryl_v
[03:51:25] <daryl_v> Hey Paul. What's up?
[03:51:50] <paul_c> Oh.... putting together a package list for KDE
[04:43:37] <les> still there paul?
[04:44:20] <cradek> 11:43:50 < paul_c> Oh.... putting together a package list for KDE
[04:44:31] <cradek> he was here 45 mins ago
[04:45:42] <les> I wonder if you could test the B2 Blog I just set up
[04:45:55] <cradek> sure I'll have a look
[04:46:05] <les> k...
[04:46:27] <cradek> url?
[04:46:27] <les> http://lmwatts.com/v-web/b2/
[04:46:29] <cradek> aha
[04:47:50] <cradek> it looks fine from here
[04:47:56] <cradek> there's a cute bear
[04:48:03] <cradek> want me to leave a comment?
[04:48:19] <les> should be good for quickly showing pictures etc while in irc
[04:48:23] <les> yes please
[04:48:41] <les> that bear was in my back yard...
[04:49:10] <cradek> heh cool
[04:49:28] <les> I have 3 SQL databases with my webhosting account
[04:49:51] <les> so I did a blog, a realtime chat, and a community BB
[04:50:35] <cradek> for the comments, I think the date and time should be more clear: have the month spelled out so it's unambiguous, and a timezone on the time
[04:50:47] <les> I will have to lose one if I put on an online shopping cart
[04:51:03] <cradek> that's the only complaint I can come up with :-)
[04:51:18] <les> Yeah I have to work on the appearance...but must read the B2 docs
[04:51:33] <les> just set it up 15 min ago
[04:51:41] <cradek> yeah, it's plain, but there's nothing wrong with plain
[04:52:07] <cradek> (I am using Mozilla 1.7)
[04:52:36] <les> the B2 is on the webhost server so I will have to see how much I can change it
[04:53:46] <les> same with the php chat and bb
[04:53:58] <cradek> it's no big deal, but having the date written DD.MM.YY and the timezone in the US is an odd combination
[04:54:14] <les> they also have x7 chat...not familiar with it
[04:54:28] <cradek> me neither
[04:54:41] <cradek> all web based chats are a terrible idea
[04:54:51] <les> I think I can easily fix the date formats etc from the control panel
[04:55:04] <cradek> irc is for chatting, usenet is for threaded messages, anything else is an abomination
[04:55:30] <les> yeah....It may eat up too much of my bandwidth
[04:55:43] <cradek> irc uses very little bandwidth
[04:56:23] <les> but I did the bb to replace the local isp one here...they are closing down
[04:56:41] <les> I was asked if I would host one
[04:57:07] <les> could do yahoo groups but to much work filtering spam
[04:57:13] <les> too
[04:57:13] <cradek> yeah
[04:57:25] <cradek> people seem to like webbbses instead of usenet
[04:57:39] <cradek> One company I know uses a local news server instead of a webbbs
[04:57:47] <cradek> they don't distribute or receive any messages
[04:58:30] <cradek> people can use their web browser's news interface as news://the.site/ if they must use a web browser
[04:58:37] <cradek> it seems to work well
[04:58:59] <les> well this isp was charging unsuspecting locals $100/mo to "administer" commercial websites
[04:59:27] <cradek> ugh
[04:59:53] <cradek> they better do a lot for that price (reliable backups for instance)
[05:00:03] <les> so I am signing up people to $7/month ipowerweb and showing them how to use cuteftp etc so they can do their own site
[05:00:20] <les> they didn't do anything...they were just reselling
[05:01:00] <les> rather than resell I am just charging a one time setup fee
[05:01:22] <les> $1000
[05:01:45] <les> but they are happy with that compared to years @ 100/mo
[05:01:49] <cradek> everyone wants to use their frontpage publisher wizard, not ftp
[05:02:48] <les> I will just give them cuteftp...and make it look like Windows Explorer
[05:03:05] <les> they won't even know what ftp is
[05:03:21] <les> they can just drag n drop
[05:03:36] <cradek> let me know how that goes...
[05:04:00] <cradek> I know frontpage used to want server extensions so the user can push the "publish `My Website'" button
[05:04:23] <cradek> but I've been out of the webserver business for ages
[05:04:34] <les> I think it has reached the point where most non-technical folks can easily manage a web sitee
[05:04:40] <les> oops
[05:04:44] <les> site
[05:05:02] <les> I need to find a kid to do the initial pages
[05:06:39] <les> I just use word and prune out all the extensions and MS crap
[05:07:39] <les> anyway, thanks for the blog check. Out to the shop for me!
[05:07:45] <cradek> np
[23:11:34] <paul_c> Hi Alex
[23:13:44] <alex_joni> hey ray
[23:13:54] <alex_joni> paul: how are you?
[23:15:14] <paul_c> Now that I have Debian mirrored locally...
[23:15:28] <paul_c> Taken a few days to get all of it.
[23:16:00] <rayh> Hi guys
[23:17:21] <rayh> * rayh dreams of having enough connection to get it all in a few days -- years it would take here!
[23:20:20] <rayh> paul_c: Smithy is testing with the machine today. Install went well.
[23:21:20] <paul_c> Oh good.
[23:23:22] <alex_joni> nice...
[23:24:58] <rayh> paul_c: Did you come to terms with python and anaconda?
[23:26:43] <paul_c> I know what the problem with anaconda is at compile time...
[23:27:10] <paul_c> Me and python have reached an agreement
[23:27:19] <alex_joni> paul_c: got my last e-mail ?
[23:27:36] <paul_c> If it doesn't bite me, I won't delete it.
[23:28:25] <paul_c> alex_joni: Yes - Having a little think about the answer.
[23:29:22] <rayh> Didn't get anything from you, Paul.
[23:29:35] <alex_joni> paul_c: no hurry...
[23:29:51] <alex_joni> I hope I'll get online later tonight... (if not.. tomorrow morning...)
[23:29:52] <rayh> oops. Not reading right yet, more coffee.
[23:34:22] <paul_c> <Homer mode> Hmmmm... Coffee.. whahoo - Donuts </Homer mode>
[23:34:32] <alex_joni> I'm out of the office for today...
[23:34:41] <alex_joni> bye guys