#emc-devel | Logs for 2010-09-03

[02:10:44] <KimK_> cradek: With your interest in clocks, and programming, and, well, cool stuff, I wonder if you have seen this: http://gizmodo.com/5223606/jaquet-droz-time+writing-machine-elegant-in-still-life-clumsy-on-video Apparently all mechanical, very impressive!
[02:12:58] <cradek> heh, slick
[02:13:03] <KimK_> A person would probably go through a lot of Post-It notes though, showing the time to their friends.
[02:16:14] <KimK_> I hope there's a heavy spring to power the "plotter" and a light spring to power the "watch".
[02:16:22] <cradek> surely so
[02:25:11] <morficmobile> morfic: ^ later
[02:38:37] <ries_> ries_ is now known as ries
[02:51:55] <Jymmm> Jymmm is now known as Red70sShow
[02:52:05] <Red70sShow> Red70sShow is now known as Jymmm
[09:00:35] <KimK_> KimK_ is now known as KimK
[10:08:12] <morfic> wow, fabulosity (Re: Time writer)
[14:39:20] <skunkworks_> skunkworks_ is now known as skunkworks
[15:09:01] <cradek> g'morning seb
[15:09:10] <seb_kuzminsky> heyya
[15:17:27] <alex_joni> hey guys
[15:17:42] <alex_joni> hmm.. someone scared jepler away
[15:17:45] <seb_kuzminsky> hi alex
[15:18:28] <alex_joni> it's the weekend..
[15:18:34] <alex_joni> * alex_joni is running home ;)
[15:30:21] <cradek> whee 3 day weekend soon
[15:30:37] <seb_kuzminsky> are you doing anything fun?
[15:31:10] <cradek> I'm staying home and doing whatever I feel like!
[15:31:16] <cradek> you?
[15:31:18] <seb_kuzminsky> that sounds fun! :-)
[15:32:38] <seb_kuzminsky> i'm stacking a cord of firewood, hopefully finishing the kids' bunk bed, and maybe painting some new drywall in the living room, and *maybe* if there's time going on an overnight bike camping trip with kerry
[15:32:47] <seb_kuzminsky> :-)
[15:33:08] <cradek> do you guys heat with wood? I don't think I even remember a fireplace
[15:33:53] <seb_kuzminsky> we had a really cheesy open fireplace when you were here, but this summer we bought a new one that will be an effective heater
[15:33:59] <cradek> I have some programming to do, and I also might try (again) to build heekscnc
[15:34:06] <cradek> ah, neat
[15:34:26] <seb_kuzminsky> what kind of programming are you thinking about?
[15:34:51] <cradek> a little paying gig, nothing big/fun/interesting
[15:34:58] <cradek> I just have to find a block of time to do it
[15:35:07] <seb_kuzminsky> paying gigs ftw
[15:35:58] <cradek> yeah, never hurts
[15:36:07] <skunkworks> I think I have a good 1.5 days to work on the K&T. Hope to get x and z homing
[15:36:19] <seb_kuzminsky> cool :-)
[15:36:20] <cradek> skunkworks: that would be very cool
[15:37:13] <skunkworks> if the line drivers work - to an index :)
[15:38:08] <skunkworks> I need to look up your fix for the homing thump
[15:38:21] <skunkworks> when I get that far.
[15:39:23] <skunkworks> should be fun to see how z sounds. it always had a shutter to it. most likely because of the backlash in the gears (which should be fixed now)
[15:39:40] <cradek> woooOOOOOOOOOOOooo woOOOo wooo BANG! wooo.
[15:39:50] <skunkworks> heh
[15:39:51] <cradek> ^ jr homing before that change
[15:40:36] <cradek> I hope they're all as tight as X - that's sure great
[15:40:59] <skunkworks> then you had to use a crow bar to move jr back into position? ;)
[15:41:26] <cradek> nope, it still homed fine, but it was cringe-inducing
[15:41:40] <cradek> sometimes it ferrored the first time, and the second time would work
[15:42:14] <skunkworks> cradek: yes - should be neat. Z has the most geartrain. Y only has 1 right angle zero backlash gear setup.
[15:42:32] <seb_kuzminsky> i crashed my z axis the other night
[15:42:45] <cradek> ouch, did you hurt anything?
[15:42:51] <seb_kuzminsky> retracted at full speed into the positive (up) hard stop
[15:43:03] <seb_kuzminsky> it seems fine
[15:43:04] <cradek> didn't stop in time when it hit the switch?
[15:43:09] <seb_kuzminsky> right
[15:43:21] <cradek> huh
[15:43:28] <seb_kuzminsky> i was messing with my new control panel, testing the continuous jog setup
[15:43:29] <cradek> those are hardwired as estop, right?
[15:43:39] <seb_kuzminsky> yes the machine e-stopped
[15:43:58] <cradek> that machine disconnects the servos and shorts them out on estop - I'm surprised it didn't stop in time
[15:43:59] <seb_kuzminsky> i had restarted emc2 and forgotten to home the machine before testing the jogging... :-(
[15:44:15] <cradek> heh I bet everyone has done that
[15:44:49] <cradek> it's tempting to severly limit jog speed when the machine is not yet homed - I bet that would save a lot of mistakes
[15:45:05] <seb_kuzminsky> the axis was jammed pretty good against the stop, i couldnt budge it by jogging it off (instant ferror) or by tugging on the servo belt by hand
[15:45:37] <cradek> dang
[15:45:47] <seb_kuzminsky> i ended up taking the belt off and whacking on the timing pulley of the axis
[15:46:08] <seb_kuzminsky> i used a block of aluminum and a regular steel hammer
[15:46:22] <cradek> does it hit something flat, or do the balls run out of track?
[15:46:26] <seb_kuzminsky> it took a couple good whacks to get it free
[15:46:58] <seb_kuzminsky> i think it hits something flat
[15:47:13] <seb_kuzminsky> the axis moved fine under servo power once i freed it
[15:47:25] <cradek> good - at least the pressure is on all the balls then
[15:47:53] <seb_kuzminsky> i should pop the cover off the z axis and look for loose balls maybe...
[15:47:56] <cradek> wonder if you could move the switch down any
[15:48:03] <seb_kuzminsky> i like the idea of limiting jog speed when unhomed
[15:48:25] <cradek> I've made the same mistake, but jr must have more overtravel
[15:48:41] <cradek> I did it going up on Z also
[15:48:53] <seb_kuzminsky> the limit switch is moved pretty far down already, the plunger has moved a bit once the home switch trips
[15:49:00] <seb_kuzminsky> i'll see if i can make it any tighter
[15:49:15] <seb_kuzminsky> +Z seems like a popular jog to do quickly
[15:49:20] <cradek> yep
[15:51:22] <cradek> the boss8 would only let you do a very very slow creep before it was homed
[15:51:49] <seb_kuzminsky> "annoy the user until he makes the machine safe to operate" sounds like a good thing
[15:52:04] <cradek> people sure whine whenever we make that kind of change though
[15:52:24] <cradek> I still haven't heard the end of requiring homing before mdi or running a program
[15:52:37] <seb_kuzminsky> heh
[15:52:44] <seb_kuzminsky> if there was an UNHOMED_JOG_SPEED parameter they could set it however they want
[15:52:51] <cradek> not everyone has big/fast/dangerous machines
[15:53:10] <cradek> I crashed jr for the first time the other day! it was pretty spectacular.
[15:53:26] <seb_kuzminsky> was that the jog +z thing you mentioned?
[15:53:32] <SWPadnos> WOOOOOOO BANG!!! ooo
[15:53:42] <cradek> nope, that wasn't a crash, it just hit the limit and stopped
[15:53:50] <SWPadnos> ah
[15:53:58] <seb_kuzminsky> did it crack your cement floor this time? ;-)
[15:53:58] <SWPadnos> that's not spectacular
[15:54:13] <cradek> recently I did a g83 in mdi with Z=0 set about four inches below where it should have been
[15:54:22] <seb_kuzminsky> ouch
[15:54:29] <cradek> so it rapided downward into the work
[15:54:33] <seb_kuzminsky> what size drill bit?
[15:55:00] <cradek> it drilled for a little bit, I'm sure, and then the drill bit disappeared, then the drill chuck jaws drilled for a little bit (quarter turn), then it ferrored
[15:55:09] <seb_kuzminsky> ow
[15:55:10] <cradek> I think it was #7
[15:55:32] <cradek> except for destroying the work and the drill, everything was fine
[15:55:45] <seb_kuzminsky> yay, just the right parts failed!
[15:56:05] <seb_kuzminsky> did you check runout on the drill chuck afterwards?
[15:56:19] <cradek> the chuck seems ok still - it doesn't turn quite as free, but it works
[15:56:33] <cradek> only by eyeball :-)
[15:56:33] <seb_kuzminsky> great :-)
[15:56:54] <cradek> straight down is probably the best kind of crash - unlikely to hurt the spindle
[15:57:04] <seb_kuzminsky> right
[15:57:53] <cradek> I've done that same thing twice (mdi a drill cycle assuming Z=0 is the workpiece when it's not) - the other time was on the lathe
[15:58:18] <cradek> it reamed a thru-hole very very fast - surprisingly the hole turned out ok
[15:58:37] <cradek> I need to be more careful in mdi.
[16:00:17] <SWPadnos> make ctrl-enter do a preview of the MDI move (if only you could see it)
[16:00:51] <cradek> yeah it would sure be neat if AXIS could show you a preview of the mdi move ... somehow
[18:18:40] <seb_kuzminsky> i'm looking at the EMC2 G Code Language document, and i'm confused
[18:18:42] <seb_kuzminsky> http://linuxcnc.org/docs/devel/html/gcode_main.html#sec:G80:-Cancel-Modal
[18:18:48] <seb_kuzminsky> what does "modal group 0" mean?
[18:19:46] <cradek> group 0 is the motion group containing approximately g0, g1, g2, g3, all the canned cycles
[18:20:04] <seb_kuzminsky> g80 is the member of that set that prohibits motion?
[18:21:48] <skunkworks> going to be wierd not having to manually program pecking cycles....
[18:21:56] <cradek> yes, it's the motion gcode that makes no motion
[18:21:56] <cradek> hm, the rs274ngc3 doc says the motion group is called group 1
[18:22:07] <skunkworks> (gwbasic sure came in handy)
[18:22:18] <tom3p> gee wiz
[18:22:25] <seb_kuzminsky> i see in axis' mdi's "Active G-Codes" display that exactly one of g0-g3, g73, g80, g83, and maybe others is shown at all times
[18:22:53] <seb_kuzminsky> Fanuc 21 puts g0-g3 in group 1 and g80-g89 in group 9
[18:23:50] <cradek> interesting
[18:24:28] <seb_kuzminsky> i dont have access to a fanuc controller, but i have a fanuc gcode program that programs "g80 z.6" and I *think* it expects g0 motion to z.6
[18:24:29] <cradek> so in fanuc maybe the sequence g2 xyij, g81 z..., g80, ij would be valid
[18:24:37] <seb_kuzminsky> right...
[18:24:47] <seb_kuzminsky> i wonder if there's a fanuc anywhere to poke at
[18:25:12] <cradek> I think the g80 would cancel the cycles and revert to the previous type of motion whether it's g0/1/2/3
[18:25:28] <cradek> I have a fanuc book, but not a control to poke
[18:25:33] <seb_kuzminsky> i think so too
[18:25:53] <cradek> in emc I think g3..., g80, ij is an error
[18:26:12] <seb_kuzminsky> i agree
[18:26:13] <cradek> (I struggle to see any use for g80)
[18:26:40] <seb_kuzminsky> bbl
[18:27:03] <cradek> I guess it can be used to cause the "intial level" to be reset in canned cycles
[19:29:42] <SWPadnos> G80?
[19:29:51] <SWPadnos> isn't that used to cancel modal motion?
[19:30:17] <SWPadnos> so you have to specify G0..G3 (or something else) before any more motion can occur
[19:50:53] <cradek> yes I think that's the idea
[19:51:00] <cradek> of course I have no idea why you'd do that
[19:54:51] <SWPadnos> to make sure that a subroutine can't result in an unexpected motion type
[19:55:33] <SWPadnos> like a peck cycle - some random axis word after that would result in another peck cycle if a G word isn't specified
[19:56:02] <tom3p> some mfctrs used G80 to end a 'list' , some canned cycles used a list. like 'begin drillahole xy xy xy xy end of list', g80 was endoflist
[20:01:46] <tom3p> g80 ended the modal canned cycle
[20:43:43] <jepler> * jepler notices there are about 60 commits since v2.4.3!
[20:43:51] <jepler> it makes me think maybe I should get another version out soon
[20:44:19] <cradek> wonder if there was anything I intended to fix...