#emc-devel | Logs for 2009-04-10

[00:15:49] <cradek> whee
[00:15:53] <CIA-2> EMC: 03cradek 07TRUNK * 10emc2/src/emc/task/emccanon.cc: SPLINE and NURBS motion, thanks to Manfredi Leto (Xemet), EBo, and others.
[00:15:53] <CIA-2> EMC: 03cradek 07TRUNK * 10emc2/src/emc/sai/saicanon.cc: SPLINE and NURBS motion, thanks to Manfredi Leto (Xemet), EBo, and others.
[00:15:54] <CIA-2> EMC: 03cradek 07TRUNK * 10emc2/src/emc/nml_intf/canon.hh: SPLINE and NURBS motion, thanks to Manfredi Leto (Xemet), EBo, and others.
[00:15:55] <CIA-2> EMC: 03cradek 07TRUNK * 10emc2/src/emc/rs274ngc/ (9 files): SPLINE and NURBS motion, thanks to Manfredi Leto (Xemet), EBo, and others.
[00:15:58] <CIA-2> EMC: 03cradek 07TRUNK * 10emc2/nc_files/butterfly.ngc: SPLINE and NURBS motion, thanks to Manfredi Leto (Xemet), EBo, and others.
[01:37:15] <CIA-2> EMC: 03cradek 07TRUNK * 10emc2/src/emc/usr_intf/stepconf/stepconf.py: image-to-gcode should be available by default; it's useful.
[01:41:14] <CIA-2> EMC: 03cradek 07v2_3_branch * 10emc2/src/emc/usr_intf/stepconf/stepconf.py: image-to-gcode should be available by default; it's useful.
[03:42:13] <jepler> cradek: cool
[06:11:53] <CIA-2> EMC: 03cmorley 07TRUNK * 10emc2/src/emc/usr_intf/pncconf/ (pncconf.py pncconf.glade):
[06:11:53] <CIA-2> EMC: fix stepper combobox display after pinchange. fix display of input signalnames
[06:11:53] <CIA-2> EMC: because of combobox having less names then all all the signal names (meant the
[06:11:53] <CIA-2> EMC: index between combobox and hal_input_signal_names didn't line up anymore. change
[06:11:54] <CIA-2> EMC: names of the variables that hold signalnames. Add parport signalnames to the
[06:11:56] <CIA-2> EMC: readme. add relevant updates from stepconf
[13:08:52] <SWPadnos> no
[13:08:55] <skunkworks_> darn
[13:08:57] <SWPadnos> it's from a shell login
[13:09:20] <skunkworks_> THanks SWPadnos
[13:09:26] <SWPadnos> no, thank you :)
[13:09:44] <SWPadnos> at leat it only missed my comments about the grub menu :)
[13:09:48] <SWPadnos> (plus a couple of commits)
[14:02:41] <Pilotltd> swp - the spindle lowpass filter you posted does slow the accel/decel, but I'm still getting the overshoot on slowing :(
[14:03:11] <SWPadnos> what kind of drive do you have?
[14:04:01] <Pilotltd> its a brusless three phase motor on a chinese VFD
[14:04:23] <SWPadnos> do you have a braking resistor?
[14:04:39] <Pilotltd> no
[14:04:45] <SWPadnos> that might help
[14:04:58] <SWPadnos> there's not much EMC can do if the drive can't actually slow the spindle down
[14:05:21] <SWPadnos> (and has to wait for it to coast down to the new speed)
[14:06:03] <Pilotltd> Not much I can do other than replace the VFD/motor combination I think
[14:06:13] <SWPadnos> or add a braking resistor ;)
[14:06:25] <SWPadnos> though id does depend on the drive also
[14:06:27] <SWPadnos> it
[14:08:51] <skunkworks_> there are no settings within the vfd?
[14:09:21] <Pilotltd> To be honest, it's a poor design, and undocumented. I have a flux vector VFD and decent 3 phase motor here, might just trash it and use mine, rather than the junk supplied
[14:09:52] <Pilotltd> The only setting pot is max speed
[14:15:02] <Pilotltd> cu later - off trying threading see how it copes with that
[14:15:25] <SWPadnos> see you
[14:15:38] <SWPadnos> at least while it's cutting it should slow down well :)
[14:15:47] <Pilotltd> <G>
[14:31:22] <cradek> I agree - bet a resistor would help. go pull the heater element out of your oven and try it...
[14:56:13] <SWPadnos> or hook up a light socket, that way it's easy to change "elements" :)
[14:56:33] <SWPadnos> though for 220V an oven element is better
[15:28:29] <skunkworks_> doesn't everyone have big power resistors in their parts bin?
[15:31:00] <alex_joni> big is relative :)
[15:31:09] <alex_joni> I have some 0.01 ohm @ 20W ones :)
[15:37:35] <skunkworks_> Don't know the size - but we have ones that are about 1 ft long coiled and the coils are made up of .25X.0625 metal.
[16:20:46] <cradek> the problem with masking step pulses for gantry homing is the missing accel/decel periods. you'd have to go very slow.
[16:21:21] <SWPadnos> yes, the initial search phase would have to be slow
[16:21:42] <SWPadnos> or you also gate it with home_state (if that's a pin)
[16:21:45] <cradek> I guess you could do the fast search - pull off - slow search
[16:21:56] <cradek> yeah, only adjust the offset during the slow search part
[16:21:57] <SWPadnos> yep, but only if you know which is which
[16:21:59] <SWPadnos> right
[16:22:11] <cradek> yes home state is a pin for this (and other) reasons
[16:22:21] <SWPadnos> I drew out the logic Len Shelton suggested in Eagle - man, what a PITA that was
[16:22:48] <SWPadnos> I didn't want to fire up Altium because it's big, but it would have saved me some time if I had
[16:25:50] <SWPadnos> hmmm. I thought jepler had added an "all" function to comps
[16:26:02] <cradek> he took it back out
[16:26:04] <SWPadnos> so you don't need to addf and2.0 / and2.1 / and2.2 ,,,
[16:26:06] <SWPadnos> oh, bummer
[16:26:18] <cradek> if you have all those ands, there's probably only one right order for them to run
[16:26:32] <cradek> anyway, that was the reasoning, iirc.
[16:26:35] <SWPadnos> I guess it was a back-door to bugs, since you could have multiple executions of the same function on the same data
[16:26:46] <SWPadnos> interrupting each other
[16:27:08] <SWPadnos> heh, there should be comp.0-n, and comp.the_rest :)
[16:27:08] <cradek> well when there's a chain of logic, you need to run it in order, or it can delay several periods
[16:27:12] <SWPadnos> sure
[16:29:50] <Master15> hello... I have a question about the Driver Type (basic machine information). Where can I find this values? Sorry for my bad english, i am from germany. Today we have get our cnc-step machine and I had test it with WIN PCNC. I have found the EMC2 Software and want test ist too. But now I have problems with this dialog.
[16:30:13] <SWPadnos> you need to get that information from the manufacturer of the drive
[16:30:16] <cradek> it is stepper motors?
[16:30:34] <SWPadnos> or some other support forum where people might know the numbers
[16:32:14] <Master15> Its the machine High-Z S-1000/T: http://www.cnc-step.com/html/high-z_t__die_cnc_frasmaschine.html
[16:32:53] <Pilotltd> hi guys, even with the crap chinese VFD/motor combination, I just cut a perfect test thread. Even leaned on the chuck and slowed it 200 rpm and pitch was still spot on - good work, I'm impressed :)
[16:33:40] <skunkworks_> Pilotltd: what are you using for an encoder on the spindle?
[16:33:43] <cradek> Pilotltd: what resolution is your spindle encoder?
[16:33:49] <skunkworks_> heh
[16:34:02] <SWPadnos> cool
[16:34:07] <Pilotltd> home made 90 slot
[16:34:12] <skunkworks_> nice
[16:34:23] <cradek> neat, one count per degree
[16:35:04] <cradek> now for a real good time, try rigid tapping
[16:35:09] <SWPadnos> heh
[16:35:36] <SWPadnos> making the motor not overshoot is nice, but luckily real feedback makes it less critical
[16:35:48] <alex_joni> Master15: reading the manual, I don't see any numbers
[16:35:59] <alex_joni> you'll have to ask cnc-step about specifics
[16:36:03] <Pilotltd> I'll give that a miss until I replace the VFD / motor - the overshoot on slowdown would kill it I think
[16:36:09] <alex_joni> or at least what kind of drives they use
[16:36:37] <cradek> Pilotltd: as long as it reverses somewhat smoothly it'll probably be fine
[16:37:08] <cradek> just try s500m3 / m4 / m3 / m4 and see what it looks like
[16:37:18] <skunkworks_> Pilotltd: are you counting thru the printer port?
[16:37:34] <Pilotltd> Yep through PP
[16:37:49] <Master15> I have some data, but this informations are not there. I know the informations of the pins (LTP1)... OK Email to CNC-Step
[16:37:50] <skunkworks_> very neat
[16:38:25] <Master15> How difficult is the installation on Ubuntu? I only have test it with the Live CD.
[16:39:02] <cradek> Pilotltd: I can see you are a big fan of mach3 - is it because of the thread cutting performance that you are switching, or something else?
[16:39:04] <alex_joni> Master15: if the Live CD runs, then installing should be just about the same
[16:39:46] <Master15> But I want to install ubuntu 8.10 and after that the emc2
[16:39:55] <alex_joni> Master15: that won't work
[16:40:03] <alex_joni> we only provide packages for 8.04 LTS
[16:40:10] <alex_joni> LTS is Long Term Support
[16:40:21] <Master15> ok
[16:40:55] <alex_joni> if you really want to use 8.10 (or 9.04), it will get pretty hard
[16:43:23] <Pilotltd> Cradek: thread cutting and other reliability issues
[16:43:28] <Master15> Whats the problem?
[16:45:45] <cradek> sorry, problem with what?
[16:47:02] <skunkworks_> Pilotltd: wait until you hook a mpg to it.. :)
[16:47:50] <Pilotltd> got two mpg's on modbus, that for another day, month <G>
[16:48:03] <Master15> with the installation of emc2 on ubuntu 8.1... I have a pc where ubuntu 8.1 is already installed
[16:48:03] <skunkworks_> I hear (I am not a mach person) that it feels solid - compared to mach.
[16:48:12] <cradek> just that if you want to use the release packages that our team builds, you need to use the OS we support. You are of course free to build RTAI and EMC2 on any OS you like.
[16:49:01] <cradek> compiling these is hard - installing the release binary deb packages is easy
[16:49:14] <SWPadnos> skunkworks_, that may be less true with userspace jog controls
[16:49:23] <SWPadnos> which modbus certainly would be
[16:49:27] <skunkworks_> I bet - you mean like modbus?
[16:49:32] <skunkworks_> heh
[16:49:32] <Pilotltd> skunworks_: it's very different
[16:49:36] <SWPadnos> Pilotltd, do you have specs on the MPGs?
[16:49:39] <cradek> you really want realtime jog wheels
[16:50:02] <Pilotltd> Yea - they are exactly the same as fitted to fanucs
[16:50:34] <SWPadnos> ok, is it some PLC / I/O device that has an encoder input, or is it actually a serially-connected jog wheel?
[16:50:49] <SWPadnos> (I'm not familiar with the Fanuc internals)
[16:50:57] <SWPadnos> or externals for that matter :)
[16:50:58] <Master15> compiling is cool.... I love gentoo.... but with the CNC machine I want to make no experiments... ;-) OK I install Ubuntu 8.04 with your Live CD
[16:51:19] <skunkworks_> Master15: good call :)
[16:51:54] <Pilotltd> mpg is simply a 100 count encoder with detents, it has A & B channels and connect to Mach via a modbus card
[16:52:25] <cradek> good, you can hook those A/B right to a realtime input to EMC (not modbus)
[16:52:46] <SWPadnos> ah, ok :)
[16:52:48] <cradek> you can use an hardware encoder counter, or just two random input bits hooked to the software encoder component
[16:53:01] <SWPadnos> assuming you have some spare I/Os
[16:53:20] <SWPadnos> which I'd doubt, considering that you have a Modbus I/O expander
[16:53:25] <Pilotltd> I need abother breakout board - got two parallel ports on PC, but ran out of inputs :)
[16:53:45] <cradek> you know about input mode of parallel ports right?
[16:53:54] <SWPadnos> are any of those I/Os used for things like user switches or indicators?
[16:54:43] <SWPadnos> if so, you can move the less time-critical stuff to the modbus I/O (once we get a suitable driver, which should be pretty easy with specs), and use the parport I/O for jogwheels and more RT stiff
[16:54:46] <Pilotltd> All pins in use
[16:55:56] <Master15> Some Question about the file format... My father works with Autocad. Can i use dxf or Plot Files with emc2? I have draw some logos with inkscape. Can I use it too?
[16:56:53] <Pilotltd> I reckon just as easy to stick another cheap breakout board in - can get a buffered one for about $40 US
[16:57:33] <cradek> Master15: you need to convert those things to gcode. There are lots of ideas here: http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?Cam
[16:57:40] <Pilotltd> I'm also tempted by one of the Mesa cards
[16:57:55] <cradek> yeah, they are really great.
[16:59:53] <Pilotltd> grub up here, cu later guys, thanks for your efforts
[17:02:31] <Master15> thanks for the link... I hope it will work... Today I could't start emc2 with the Live CD. The Stepconf Wizard works great, but the emc will not start... It crash with an error. I am stupid, i have not write the error on a paper.
[17:03:26] <Master15> Perhaps the error are the wrong Basic Machine Informations.....
[17:03:42] <alex_joni> Master15: try connecting to IRC from the emc2 machine
[17:03:46] <alex_joni> even if it's LiveCD
[17:04:11] <alex_joni> it's quite easy to copy/paste needed stuff then
[17:06:01] <Master15> that's a good idea, but the pc is more than 50 Meter away from my switch... But i can try it with a usb stick... But i dont know if the live cd support that...
[17:06:41] <alex_joni> wireless usb stick?
[17:07:29] <SWPadnos> it might work, but I've had bad luck with a Fritz! USB->wifi adapter
[17:07:42] <Master15> no a data stick... I don't know how you say it in english...
[17:08:11] <SWPadnos> "thumb drive", "flash drive" ...
[17:08:12] <alex_joni> Master15: ich verstehe deutsch ziemlich gut, also kannst du ruhig mal paar deutsche woerter einmixen ;)
[17:08:22] <Master15> lol
[17:08:34] <Master15> naja so lernt man ein wenig englisch...
[17:08:50] <alex_joni> most don't, so keeping it to english is best
[17:09:03] <Master15> i have found it... i mean: USB flash drive
[17:09:07] <alex_joni> otoh, most of the things we talked about are more fit in #emc, than #emc-devel
[17:09:08] <cradek> how do you say lol in german?
[17:09:19] <cradek> ^ also OT
[17:09:19] <Master15> in german it is: USB Stick
[17:11:29] <Master15> how do you say lol in german? We also use lol.... = Laughing Out Loud = Lautes Lachen
[17:12:16] <SWPadnos> it should be "USB Schtick" :)
[17:12:25] <Master15> lol
[17:13:03] <SWPadnos> bbl
[17:13:04] <cradek> I wish there was a name for these things. I've heard them called almost anything. flash - thumb - gum - usb - stick - drive [pick two]
[17:13:15] <cradek> did I miss any? (I bet so)
[17:13:34] <Master15> swpadnos scheint ja auch deutsch zu k├Ânnen... ihr wollt mich reinlegen. :-)
[17:13:34] <cradek> I blame the various marketing departments
[17:15:27] <Master15> otoh, most of the things we talked about are more fit in #emc, than #emc-devel <- Sorry... Should I post the error here or ther?
[17:17:51] <alex_joni> Master15: #emc-devel is for development related things (changes to the sourcecode, etc)
[17:50:09] <CIA-2> EMC: 03eric-johnson 07TRUNK * 10emc2/src/emc/usr_intf/ (emcsched.cc emcsched.hh schedrmt.cc): Basically working, but minimum of testing performed. More extensive testing will occur once UI has been updated to use it.
[18:16:37] <Master15> one little question... would the emc run with kubuntu 8.04 because I do not like gnome.
[18:27:37] <fenn> Master15: yes; gnome is only required for stepconf
[18:27:59] <fenn> in the future i hope this requirement will be dropped
[18:28:18] <fenn> (when gtk adds the wizard routines)
[18:29:01] <skunkworks_> http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showthread.php?p=596857#post596857
[18:29:15] <skunkworks_> Mariss is cool...
[18:29:21] <skunkworks_> :)
[18:30:08] <fenn> neat
[18:30:55] <fenn> i'd run that in a simulator before blowing up transistors with it
[18:31:00] <Master15> gnome is only required for stepconf.... This should mean, that i can not use stepconf in kde? Does it nead qt?
[18:32:03] <fenn> Master15: when you install emc it will also pull in some gnome libraries so that everything will work
[18:32:55] <Master15> I thought so.
[18:33:38] <Master15> but why will you use gtk? The new QT Designer is a great Tool...
[18:33:49] <fenn> "because"
[18:35:11] <fenn> gtk is used because gtk was the best choice for halscope several years ago (and probably still is)
[18:35:39] <fenn> most of emc's GUI is actually tcl/tk or python/tk
[18:36:03] <fenn> personally, i find the large -dev libraries for qt to be annoying
[18:36:13] <fenn> but i've never tried to write any qt apps
[18:37:48] <fenn> also, take note that gtk is not gnome
[18:37:49] <Master15> ok... I have heard that the qt creator is great... but I had not enough time to test it... I like WPF. But it don not run under linux.
[18:43:13] <Master15> cu... and thanks for the help 8)
[18:43:21] <alex_joni> later Master15
[18:59:38] <alex_joni> whee.. this looks nice: PGMBYID %d %d %f %f %f %d %s %f %f %d
[19:00:19] <alex_joni> * alex_joni wonders why PGMBYID is better than Program_by_ID
[19:03:32] <cradek> I don't understand what he's working on - some kind of queue?
[19:03:58] <fenn__> arg
[19:13:25] <alex_joni> cradek: the ability to run multiple files for a random number of times I think
[19:13:36] <alex_joni> something like cron or something
[19:15:13] <cradek> how many fenns are there?
[19:17:52] <skunkworks_> not enough? ;)
[19:18:31] <skunkworks_> that is all I need - a cpld addiction...
[19:18:49] <alex_joni> Results 1 - 10 of about 4,240,000 for fenn.
[19:18:58] <alex_joni> sounds like more than enough to me :D
[21:14:41] <skunkworks_> jmkasunich: did you see this? http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showpost.php?p=596857&postcount=72
[21:16:17] <jmkasunich> skunkworks: yeah
[21:16:24] <jmkasunich> not sure what its all about
[21:17:31] <skunkworks_> mariss has been helping people understand cpld's.. Showing how he does it. That is the current limit/enable ligic from my amp.
[21:17:38] <skunkworks_> logic.
[21:17:58] <jmkasunich> its like 5 gates worth of logic - I can't imagene using a PLD for that'
[21:18:04] <skunkworks_> heh
[21:18:17] <skunkworks_> I don't know when I would do it - but I would like to tinker.
[21:18:45] <alex_joni> too bad there are no CPLD's out there where you can program MOSFETS inside
[21:18:45] <skunkworks_> it would allow me to add pwm+dir and such easy.
[21:18:51] <skunkworks_> heh
[21:19:52] <SWPadnos> I wonder how you kill the fish once you've freed them
[21:20:08] <SWPadnos> (by typing free the fish into the "run" prompt in Ubuntu)
[21:20:29] <alex_joni> killall fish ?
[21:20:38] <alex_joni> or killall -9 fish :D
[21:20:52] <SWPadnos> there's nothing with "fish" in the name
[21:21:07] <SWPadnos> ps ax | grep -i fish yields only grep :)
[21:21:27] <alex_joni> it seems you need to kill gnome-panel
[21:21:38] <SWPadnos> yeah, looks that way
[21:21:38] <alex_joni> the panel "should" restart
[21:21:56] <SWPadnos> I guess I'll just see if there are any updates - it is the Jaunty machine
[21:22:06] <alex_joni> * alex_joni tries that on his portable ubuntu :)
[21:22:22] <SWPadnos> incidentally, I tried a bootable USB stick with Jaunty A3 on it in a couple of netbooks
[21:22:49] <SWPadnos> the Acer worked fine, even saw the wireless network (couldn't connect, it was a private Costco network)
[21:22:54] <SWPadnos> the HP wouldn't boot
[21:24:16] <alex_joni> ROFL.. I actually get fish
[21:24:28] <alex_joni> this is mindboggling
[21:30:17] <fenn> friendly interactive shell?
[21:30:28] <fenn> it's quite obnoxious when set as your login shell and you can't change it
[22:07:31] <alex_joni> hey BigJohnT
[23:48:45] <CIA-2> EMC: 03cmorley 07TRUNK * 10emc2/src/emc/usr_intf/pncconf/ (pncconf.py pncconf.glade): Add ability to write user made signal names to HAL file. started switch to use hostmot info from ini file. Work towards adding hal signal to each servo axis