Back
[00:11:21] <skunkworks> logger_dev: bookmark
[00:11:21] <skunkworks> Just this once .. here's the log:
http://www.linuxcnc.org/irc/irc.freenode.net:6667/emcdevel/2007-12-11.txt
[02:50:02] <cradek> jepler: I do still have those eagle files
[03:40:55] <jepler> cradek: good news
[03:41:49] <cradek> wonder where jmk is...
[03:43:50] <jmkasunich> who, me?
[03:44:08] <cradek> yeah, you
[03:44:18] <cradek> http://timeguy.com/cradek-files/emc/PICT0081.JPG
[03:45:05] <jmkasunich> you been holding out on us
[03:45:10] <jmkasunich> made that back in july
[03:45:27] <cradek> no, I'm too dumb to operate the camera
[03:45:39] <jmkasunich> wow, you converted a lot of aluminum into chips
[03:46:01] <cradek> yes
[03:46:19] <cradek> several dollars' worth
[03:46:53] <cradek> I probably could have roughed the major area out with the saw, but milling it probably didn't take any longer
[03:47:39] <jmkasunich> but you would have had a lump of al left over
[03:47:40] <cradek> haha on the shelf on the very left of the picture you can see one of my souveniers
[03:48:26] <jmkasunich> ?
[03:48:36] <jmkasunich> I see a ring clamp, and some stuff I don;t recognize
[03:48:44] <jmkasunich> I think I see pc board cutting tape
[03:48:48] <cradek> the aluminum block with the bolt in it
[03:49:14] <jmkasunich> what is that?
[03:49:21] <cradek> one of the first rigid taps
[03:49:26] <jmkasunich> oh
[03:49:59] <jmkasunich> nice power supply there
[03:50:06] <jmkasunich> did you have that at the workshop?
[03:50:28] <cradek> yes that has been max's for quite a while now
[03:50:35] <cradek> I had a switcher but it died
[03:50:47] <cradek> the switcher was originally in the ups box which was nice
[03:51:24] <cradek> now that box is half empty, which sucks - it would be nice if it was smaller
[03:53:04] <cradek> ha, it's 25 degrees and raining
[03:53:43] <jmkasunich> gonna have icy trees tomorrow?
[03:54:19] <jmkasunich> we had that yesterday:
http://jmkasunich.com/pics/icy-branches-1737.jpg
[03:55:52] <cradek> I read recently that it was 10 years ago we had our big ice storm
[03:56:01] <cradek> that doesn't mean anything to you, I guess, but it was a big event here
[03:56:44] <cradek> it sounded like constant gunshots but they were trees breaking down
[03:56:50] <jmkasunich> nasty
[03:57:30] <cradek> in some places there was no electricity for weeks, pretty much the whole city's wiring was ruined
[03:58:03] <cradek> we took the cats and stayed with a friend who had heat...
[03:58:26] <cradek> (seeing your picture reminded me of this)
[03:59:00] <jmkasunich> when I took that it was still raining, and I was wondering how bad it would get
[03:59:06] <jmkasunich> but the rain stopped not long after dark
[03:59:12] <cradek> yeah if it goes all night it can add up.
[03:59:41] <jmkasunich> the trees were still coated this morning, but by noon it was pretty much gone - it got up to 35 or so
[04:00:26] <cradek> now they say ice accumulation 3/4 inch, snow accumulation 4 inches
[04:00:31] <cradek> this will be fun!
[04:00:35] <jmkasunich> not
[04:00:50] <cradek> well I'm usually smart enough to stay home
[04:03:06] <jmkasunich> how thick is the plate going from the B axis table to the head?
[04:03:09] <jmkasunich> seems kinda thin
[04:03:37] <cradek> .375
[04:04:04] <jmkasunich> did you mill a raised round boss on it to match the table, or am I seeing things?
[04:04:13] <cradek> it doesn't seem wobbly but I could always make a thicker one
[04:04:29] <cradek> yes you are seeing it right
[04:04:40] <cradek> it has to be cut back a tiny bit to clear the motor and motor mount on the left
[04:04:54] <jmkasunich> ah
[04:05:02] <jmkasunich> I didn't notice that motor
[04:05:44] <jmkasunich> that part is steel, right?
[04:06:08] <cradek> which?
[04:06:18] <jmkasunich> the B to head plate
[04:06:31] <jmkasunich> and the spacer between the plate and the head, I think
[04:06:38] <cradek> no it's all aluminum
[04:06:44] <jmkasunich> oh
[04:07:02] <jmkasunich> just shows I shouldn't try to ID metals in photos
[04:07:46] <jmkasunich> only thing left is motorising the C table?
[04:07:51] <cradek> yes
[04:07:59] <cradek> and making a driver board for it
[04:08:00] <jmkasunich> (and adding two more channels of stepper driver, or do you have that already)
[04:08:35] <jmkasunich> I think I see 4 ribbons coming out of the box
[04:08:55] <cradek> I have 4, need one more
[04:09:15] <cradek> that's what I meant by driver board
[04:11:35] <jmkasunich> well, I've wasted the whole evening
[04:12:01] <jmkasunich> somebody posted a link to that video of 100 cats, and I've been watching critter vids for a while
[04:12:15] <jmkasunich> small minds easily amused I guess
[04:12:28] <cradek> that doesn't sound like a complete waste.
[04:12:35] <jmkasunich> no, it wasn't
[04:12:51] <cradek> but you should do that at work. no need to waste the productive hours of the day.
[04:13:11] <jmkasunich> kinda veging out - I had to make a grocery run, etc, this evening, so there wasn't really enough time to get much done on the machine anyway
[04:13:26] <jmkasunich> heh - they block as many things as they can
[04:13:33] <jmkasunich> youtube is near the top of the list
[04:14:11] <cradek> yeah I bet :-)
[04:16:51] <jmkasunich> I think its time to walk the fur beast, and get some sleep
[04:16:55] <cradek> goodnight
[04:16:58] <jmkasunich> hope your weather doesn't get too bad
[04:17:03] <cradek> it will
[04:17:11] <cradek> but that's ok
[04:17:31] <jmkasunich> if its ok, then by definition, its not too bad
[04:17:37] <jmkasunich> make up your mind dammit!
[10:43:00] <fenn_> fenn_ is now known as fenn
[13:22:51] <skunkworks> logger_dev: bookmark
[13:22:51] <skunkworks> Just this once .. here's the log:
http://www.linuxcnc.org/irc/irc.freenode.net:6667/emcdevel/2007-12-11.txt
[13:22:54] <jepler> hi skunkworks
[13:23:21] <skunkworks> Good morning jepler
[13:23:32] <skunkworks> how is the snow/ice
[13:23:34] <skunkworks> ?
[13:23:49] <jepler> I haven't been outside yet to find out
[13:23:57] <jepler> but I'm using it as an excuse to take the day off
[13:24:37] <skunkworks> heh
[13:24:51] <skunkworks> it is a bit slippery here.. it is currently snowing
[13:24:54] <jepler> it looks like there's a good layer of ice on everything, and soon the snow will start falling
[13:25:14] <skunkworks> ooh - that is the worst - snow on ice
[13:26:39] <alex_joni> hi guys
[13:27:11] <jepler> hi alex_joni
[13:27:37] <CIA-42> EMC: 03tissf 07v2_2_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/ (5 files): French translation
[13:27:39] <CIA-42> EMC: 03tissf 07v2_2_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/ladder/ladder_intro_fr.lyx: French translation
[13:27:42] <tissf> hi
[13:27:58] <jepler> morning tissf
[13:28:35] <alex_joni> what's up guys?
[13:31:31] <jepler> just hiding from the weather
[13:31:41] <alex_joni> hmm.. it's pretty nice here atm
[13:31:45] <alex_joni> +9C, and sunny
[13:32:20] <jepler> apparently it's -2C here, I expected it to be more negative.
[13:32:24] <tissf> only +6C here, sunny
[13:32:44] <cradek> http://lincoln.ne.gov/asp/city/pwcam.asp?ID=23
[13:33:03] <alex_joni> morning chris
[13:33:19] <cradek> http://lincoln.ne.gov/asp/city/pwcam.asp?ID=25
[13:33:20] <cradek> hi
[13:33:24] <cradek> these are funny
[13:34:21] <alex_joni> heh.. I'm also sitting in my car
[13:34:34] <alex_joni> (not driving right now ;)
[13:35:00] <alex_joni> cradek: this is great
http://lincoln.ne.gov/asp/city/pwcam.asp?ID=36
[13:35:42] <skunkworks> cradek: nice picture of your max!
[13:36:14] <cradek> thanks
[13:36:30] <jepler> cradek: once the code is done, you'll be able to make billions of dollars selling 5-axis kits for small mills..
[13:36:46] <cradek> sure I will
[13:37:03] <alex_joni> jepler: only the first half of year
[13:37:14] <alex_joni> then he'll sell 6-9 axes kits
[13:41:21] <jepler> 'Data is stored in non-volatile buffer memory (i.e. will be lost if power is interrupted)
[13:41:24] <jepler> '
[13:42:06] <alex_joni> wonder how volatile acts then :)
[13:42:07] <skunkworks> http://www.wkbt.com/global/Category.asp?c=98578
[13:42:14] <skunkworks> seems to be stopping
[13:49:39] <jepler> hm -- how do you "average" modulo values such as angles? e.g., if I have 3 samples of an angle and they are 330, 0, 15 I would want the answer 355, not 115.
[13:50:46] <jepler> I suppose that there's not a general answer -- what's the average of 0, 120, 240? or 0, 180?
[13:57:34] <fenn> sqrt(-1)
[13:58:40] <alex_joni> jepler: do you care about deviations?
[14:01:07] <fenn> jepler: you could add up the vectors and normalize
[14:05:38] <alex_joni> cradek: yuck.. seems the "queue not empty after probing" is not a sim-only thing :/
[14:19:52] <jepler> fenn: that sounds like a good idea
[14:19:53] <jepler> thanks
[14:24:02] <jepler> that doesn't quite give the answer 355 (or -5) for the dataset 330, 0, 15; but it's close: -4.868...
[14:26:36] <fenn> where does 355 come from?
[14:26:41] <jepler> * jepler ponders whether the answer for [0,120,241] (= -29.5) makes any kind of sense
[14:27:16] <jepler> ((330-360)+0+15)/3 = -5
[14:32:39] <alex_joni> jepler: do you want to restrict the answer to one quadrant?
[14:32:52] <alex_joni> you could translate all angles there..
[14:34:03] <alex_joni> bbl
[14:35:12] <CIA-42> EMC: 03tissf 07TRUNK * 10emc2/docs/src/config/ (6 files): French translation lyx conf more coherent
[14:35:12] <CIA-42> EMC: 03tissf 07TRUNK * 10emc2/docs/src/gcode/ (4 files): French translation lyx conf more coherent
[14:35:12] <CIA-42> EMC: 03tissf 07TRUNK * 10emc2/docs/src/gui/ (axis_fr.lyx image-to-gcode_fr.lyx): French translation lyx conf more coherent
[14:35:13] <CIA-42> EMC: 03tissf 07TRUNK * 10emc2/docs/src/hal/ (5 files): French translation lyx conf more coherent
[14:35:15] <CIA-42> EMC: 03tissf 07TRUNK * 10emc2/docs/src/install/ (compiling_emc2_fr.lyx installing_emc2_fr.lyx): French translation lyx conf more coherent
[14:35:18] <CIA-42> EMC: 03tissf 07TRUNK * 10emc2/docs/src/quickstart/stepper_quickstart_fr.lyx: French translation lyx conf more coherent
[14:35:21] <CIA-42> EMC: 03tissf 07TRUNK * 10emc2/docs/src/ (Master_HAL_fr.lyx Submakefile docs.xml index_fr.tmpl): French translation lyx conf more coherent
[15:10:48] <SWPadnos> jepler, for any angle other than 180 (which has indeterminate sign), you can average everything as the offset from 0
[15:10:59] <SWPadnos> so 330 = -30, 0=0, and 15=15
[15:11:09] <SWPadnos> giving -5 as the average, which is 355
[15:40:58] <fenn> so the average of 179 and 181 is 0?
[15:41:40] <SWPadnos> of course :)
[15:42:03] <SWPadnos> since this method can't reasonably decide which is really 0 - 0/360 or 180/-180
[16:19:45] <skunkworks> cradek: how much 'umph' is needed computer wise to do the 5 axis kins?
[16:20:04] <skunkworks> will the computer your using now work?
[16:20:11] <skunkworks> for your max
[16:20:29] <SWPadnos> I imagine it isn't too compute-intensive, relative to a more or less modern CPU
[16:20:36] <SWPadnos> unless you want 10 KHz servo rates
[16:21:20] <skunkworks> heh - I thought the hexapod guys where having issues with speed.. or is the hexapod kins a magnatude more complicated?
[16:22:08] <SWPadnos> they were using an iterative method for inverse kins, I think
[16:22:31] <SWPadnos> and I believe that wwhen they took the debug code out of the algorithm, it ended up being fast enough
[16:22:41] <skunkworks> ah - ol
[16:22:43] <skunkworks> ok
[16:22:48] <SWPadnos> they were doing something like 100,000 iterations per cycle
[16:23:13] <SWPadnos> I don't think there's any special kins for a 5-axis machine anyway - it's tool offsetting that's a bear
[16:23:29] <SWPadnos> (I should look over all those commits from when I was traveling though, I may be surprised ;) )
[16:29:08] <jepler> I think chris's insight is that by making a "W" axis that always points in the direction of the tool, and making the offset along W instead of Z, it magically becomes simpler.
[16:30:01] <skunkworks> that actually makes sense to me :)
[16:40:13] <Guest793> Guest793 is now known as skunkworks_
[16:54:15] <cradek> even aside from that, yes there are special kins. when you move a rotary to change the tool vector, you want the tooltip to stay at the specified XYZ on the workpiece
[17:04:23] <skunkworks_> it is going to be cool to see a real machine moving in 5 axis
[17:39:27] <alex_joni> skunkworks_: only the first couple of times :)
[17:39:34] <alex_joni> after a while it gets boring
[17:41:08] <skunkworks_> heh :)
[17:41:57] <cradek> after that the problem will be how to make interesting gcode for it
[17:44:12] <cradek> alex_joni: probing in mdi works for me. do you see the problem there?
[17:46:14] <alex_joni> not here.. (but I am not home atm)
[19:10:02] <alex_joni> good night all
[19:10:48] <SWPadnos> but - it's only like 10:00 there
[19:10:51] <SWPadnos> :)
[19:11:03] <alex_joni> it's 9pm actually
[19:11:09] <alex_joni> but I'm tired as hell
[19:11:11] <SWPadnos> oh. even stranger
[19:11:15] <SWPadnos> well, good night then
[19:11:16] <alex_joni> indeed
[21:32:08] <tissf> good night all
[22:20:38] <CIA-42> EMC: 03jepler 07TRUNK * 10emc2/docs/src/common/emc2_introduction.lyx: remove mention of yemc, emcpanel which no longer exist
[22:20:55] <CIA-42> EMC: 03jepler 07v2_2_branch * 10emc2/docs/src/common/emc2_introduction.lyx: remove mention of yemc, emcpanel which no longer exist
[23:13:36] <skunkworks> logger_dev: bppl,arl
[23:13:36] <skunkworks> I'm logging. I don't understand 'bppl,arl', skunkworks. Try /msg logger_dev help
[23:13:41] <skunkworks> heh
[23:13:46] <skunkworks> logger_dev: bookmark
[23:13:46] <skunkworks> Just this once .. here's the log:
http://www.linuxcnc.org/irc/irc.freenode.net:6667/emcdevel/2007-12-11.txt
