#emc-devel | Logs for 2007-07-24

[15:47:16] <steve_stallings> steve_stallings is now known as steves_logging
[16:05:16] <jepler> what is the good reason to make the "predefined parameters" required in the var file?
[16:05:40] <jepler> it seems like making them all optional, and having the one which must be nonzero default to 1.0 would be just dandy
[16:06:54] <cradek> there's some strange behavior - I think variables are only saved if they were previously in the file when read
[16:08:04] <jepler> hm
[16:08:14] <cradek> (I'm not saying any of that is good)
[16:08:47] <cradek> but, you can (currently) make #1 or any other number nonvolatile by adding it to the file
[16:10:32] <jepler> I wonder why the "active" coordinate system is even saved, given that M2 resets it to G54
[16:11:56] <cradek> you don't need to use M2
[16:13:19] <jepler> oh -- if you use %%?
[16:14:16] <cradek> yes
[16:14:39] <cradek> that's how people can/should avoid resetting their various coordinates
[16:15:35] <jepler> maybe we should add M2.1 -- stop program but don't fuck with my offsets
[16:16:22] <cradek> M2 does a lot of things - not sure how you'd choose which ones M2.1 would do
[16:19:36] <jepler> indeed
[18:29:55] <jepler> ouch -- I edited drivers.lyx with lyx, but now (on another machine, maybe a different lyx version) building the documentation blows chunks because lyx can't parse the file
[18:31:18] <cradek> while I feel I should like a gui program that makes LaTeX more accessible, I sure hate lyx
[18:34:28] <jepler> There were errors during the LaTeX run.
[18:34:28] <jepler> 32 errors detected.
[18:34:28] <jepler> You should try to fix them.
[18:34:34] <jepler> ^^^ fuck you
[18:35:20] <cradek> haha
[18:36:06] <jepler> LyX: Paragraph ended before \@item was complete.:
[18:36:06] <jepler> I suspect you've forgotten a `}', causing me to apply this
[18:36:06] <jepler> control sequence to too much text. How can we recover?
[18:36:06] <jepler> My plan is to forget the whole thing and hope for the best.
[18:38:23] <jepler> (too bad it won't even tell me what line...)
[18:38:49] <jepler> "\@item" doesn't even seem to appear in the source file
[18:42:24] <cradek> they should spend more time making the error messages informative instead of cutesy
[18:44:32] <jepler> by removing different parts of the text and running 'make docs', I've narrowed it down to the two figures I added
[18:45:25] <jepler> hi ray
[18:46:49] <rayh> Hi Jeff
[18:52:47] <rayh> Say jepler What is the NML command for home all?
[18:53:34] <jepler> rayh: home axis number -1
[18:54:41] <rayh> Ah thanks.
[19:06:07] <jepler> aha -- if you have a Figure inside a Description layout, you get this weird cascade of errors
[19:19:05] <skunkworks> hmm - does 2 nominations equal a second? ;)
[19:31:20] <cradek> very good question
[20:34:04] <alex_joni> evening all
[20:34:33] <SWPadnos> HIYA
[20:34:35] <SWPadnos> oops
[20:34:39] <alex_joni> hey SWPadnos
[20:34:54] <alex_joni> figured out the SAT business/problems ;)
[20:35:02] <SWPadnos> cool
[20:35:20] <alex_joni> yeah, it was a buggy importer
[20:35:52] <alex_joni> there's a field in the SAT that says what the scaling is (units / mm), and the importer always assumed 1
[20:36:30] <SWPadnos> bummer
[20:36:40] <SWPadnos> at least you know that now
[20:37:28] <alex_joni> yup, the problem is the app I used to export it has an urge to scale everything by 10, and put 10 there..
[20:37:37] <alex_joni> anyways, OT
[20:37:59] <SWPadnos> like that ever mattered :)
[20:39:28] <alex_joni> so.. how's things in your corner of the globe
[20:40:30] <SWPadnos> mostly good
[20:40:39] <SWPadnos> I actually have paying work!
[20:41:14] <SWPadnos> and I get to make things that will be useful for EMC (or at least HAL) while getting paid
[20:43:59] <alex_joni> yeah? what's that?
[20:50:02] <SWPadnos> analog I/O card for the Mesa
[20:51:08] <alex_joni> analog I/O?
[20:57:24] <SWPadnos> sorry - phone
[20:57:40] <SWPadnos> yeah, A/D and D/A converters on a 50-pin ribbon connector
[20:57:53] <alex_joni> oh cool
[20:57:58] <SWPadnos> err - on a board connected via 50-pin ribbon connector :)
[20:58:00] <alex_joni> gpl design?
[20:58:04] <alex_joni> :P
[20:58:09] <SWPadnos> 16-bit resolution, probably 4 in and 4 out per baord
[20:58:18] <alex_joni> serial?
[20:58:22] <SWPadnos> I can probably release it that way, yes
[20:58:27] <SWPadnos> and the driver can be added to HAL
[20:58:30] <SWPadnos> I'm not sure yet
[20:59:11] <SWPadnos> this is for some relatively high speed signals (10 KHz per channel), and I'm not sure exactly how I'll do it yet
[20:59:21] <SWPadnos> high speed relative to EMC PID loops, that is
[20:59:45] <SWPadnos> I may also put a slew rate limiter in the FPGA, so it can do multiple updates inside a single "servo period"
[21:01:36] <SWPadnos> I'll probably need to put some work into A64 and SMP as well, though I'll likely be asking questions on those subjects :)
[21:04:55] <SWPadnos> oh, and I'll probably be able to contribute some knowledge, if not some packages, for an embedded EMC install (meant for headless or text-only operation)
[21:06:20] <alex_joni> * alex_joni is looking at another bug reported by petev
[21:06:39] <alex_joni> if one is in MDI and ESTOP RESET (so no machine on)..
[21:06:54] <alex_joni> (this only works on tkemc, AXIS doesn't let you MDI when not switched on..)
[21:07:05] <alex_joni> commands like M3 M8 etc work
[21:07:16] <alex_joni> wonder if that's a feature..
[21:07:26] <SWPadnos> hmmm
[21:07:38] <SWPadnos> what are M3 and M8? (spindle forward and ???)
[21:08:05] <alex_joni> flood on
[21:08:32] <SWPadnos> ah
[21:08:34] <alex_joni> doesn't spindle on seem strange when machine is switched off?
[21:08:45] <SWPadnos> mostly, yes
[21:09:24] <alex_joni> you can do it even when ESTOP
[21:09:27] <alex_joni> eeek
[21:09:56] <SWPadnos> spindle off and flood/mist off I can imagine, I wonder if it's some symmetry thing
[21:10:23] <alex_joni> change to MDI, hit ESTOP .. spindle goes off
[21:10:33] <alex_joni> type M3, spindle works again
[21:11:10] <SWPadnos> that would make sense, if you could also command motion in that state
[21:11:11] <SWPadnos> but since you can't ...
[21:11:30] <alex_joni> command motion while estopped???
[21:12:25] <alex_joni> I'm not sure of the advantages of MDI while not in MACHINE_ON
[21:12:46] <SWPadnos> right - it would make sense to be able to turn on the spindle if you could also command motion, but since you can't command motion in estop, the spindle makes no sense
[21:35:29] <alex_joni> so.. anyone else thinks MDI while not switched on makes not a lot of sense
[21:35:28] <alex_joni> ?
[21:35:49] <SWPadnos> I don't think MDI as a whole should be disabled
[21:36:18] <SWPadnos> for example, turning coolant off or doing other M codes may be valid
[21:36:24] <SWPadnos> (especially custom M codes)
[21:36:26] <alex_joni> why?
[21:36:46] <alex_joni> for me anything but machine on is an error state
[21:36:52] <SWPadnos> err - I'm not sure exactly why :)
[21:37:02] <SWPadnos> that should be left to the integrator I think
[21:37:05] <alex_joni> (AXIS does this right btw.. won't allow you to MDI while not switched on)
[21:37:32] <SWPadnos> well, here's the logic:
[21:37:47] <alex_joni> * alex_joni is all eyes
[21:38:08] <SWPadnos> I have a weird machine, and the predefined machine on->stopped transition does some stuff I've set up in ladder
[21:38:36] <SWPadnos> but there are things I don't want to explicitly start/stop at that transition, depending on what's being done at the time
[21:38:56] <SWPadnos> so I leave some things alone, and the operator can MDI those as needed
[21:39:04] <SWPadnos> (that's all the logic)
[21:39:10] <alex_joni> why would he switch to stopped ?
[21:39:13] <SWPadnos> I have no specific example of such a situation though
[21:40:24] <SWPadnos> the counterargument: if MDI only allows you to command things that can't be done in estop reset, then there's no point in allowing MDI in estop reset :)
[21:40:24] <alex_joni> like I said.. switching to anything except machine on is an error state
[21:41:05] <alex_joni> SWPadnos: right.. no point in having MDI for anything else but MACHINE_ON
[21:41:33] <SWPadnos> err - I may not have understood the situation we're discussing
[21:42:35] <alex_joni> right now you can only use MDI in machine on (with AXIS)
[21:42:49] <alex_joni> if you're running tkemc, you can send MDI commands in all states
[21:42:56] <alex_joni> even ESTOP and ESTOP RESET
[21:43:01] <alex_joni> but motion is not accepted
[21:43:23] <SWPadnos> what commands are accepted when the machine is in the ESTOP RESET state?
[21:43:41] <alex_joni> I have no idea..
[21:43:45] <alex_joni> :P
[21:43:43] <SWPadnos> if there are actions that are acceptable in ESTOP RESET state, then MDI should be allowed in that state
[21:43:58] <alex_joni> basicly it accepts a TASK_PLAN_EXECUTE command
[21:44:00] <SWPadnos> if there are none, then disabling MDI in non "machine on" state is fine
[21:44:04] <alex_joni> there are a few
[21:44:09] <alex_joni> like M-codes
[21:44:18] <alex_joni> S and F work too
[21:44:42] <alex_joni> but I can't find a reason for any of these to work in non "machine on"
[21:45:25] <SWPadnos> M codes, tool prep, etc.
[21:45:37] <SWPadnos> you may not need machine on to e.g. load a tool carousel
[21:45:52] <SWPadnos> but you may need to issue tool prep commands to do that
[21:46:22] <alex_joni> imo it would be a misconfigured machine if things start moving while not switched on
[21:46:44] <SWPadnos> the carousel moving isn't the same as the "machine" moving
[21:46:56] <alex_joni> doesn't matter.. I have my hands in there
[21:47:35] <SWPadnos> also, you still want to be able to turn things off - I'm not sure that everything is turned off at machine off (like coolant)
[21:48:39] <alex_joni> it is.. I just checked ;)
[21:48:48] <SWPadnos> heh
[21:48:49] <alex_joni> same for spindle
[21:49:14] <SWPadnos> ok. if it's defined that everything is turned off at machine off->estop reset transition, then MDI may be unnecessary