#emc-devel | Logs for 2006-08-17

[03:59:31] <jepler> my internet access will be spotty for the next week or so. see you guys around.
[04:00:31] <jmkasunich> same here (hotel)
[04:00:40] <jmkasunich> but only for a couple days
[04:01:14] <jmkasunich> I hope yours is spotty because you are on vacation or otherwise having fun...
[04:01:36] <cradek> have a nice trip jepler
[04:03:31] <cradek> I do know he's going on a fun trip (not work)
[14:52:34] <rayh> Morning Steven.
[14:55:06] <cradek> hi guys
[14:55:43] <Lerneaen_Hydra> 'lo cradek, rayh
[14:55:50] <cradek> hi LH
[14:56:06] <cradek> how's your lathe?
[14:56:09] <rayh> Hi guys.
[14:56:43] <Lerneaen_Hydra> still haven't connected the encoder ;)
[14:57:08] <cradek> hmm!
[14:57:16] <cradek> you must not need any threads cut.
[14:57:18] <Lerneaen_Hydra> been keeping busy with a math assignment thingy, a bunch of math stuff that's good to know before starting EE
[14:57:25] <Lerneaen_Hydra> I'll need them soon though
[14:57:38] <SWPadnos> hi there
[14:59:51] <cradek> Lerneaen_Hydra: V=IR, now get to work on your encoder
[14:59:58] <Lerneaen_Hydra> HAHA
[15:00:44] <Lerneaen_Hydra> it was more like simplify ln(x^3)/ln(1/x) :/
[15:01:00] <SWPadnos> 42
[15:01:04] <Lerneaen_Hydra> etc etc
[15:01:15] <cradek> x^2
[15:01:20] <cradek> or e^x
[15:01:27] <cradek> or something like that
[15:01:32] <cradek> who cares
[15:01:59] <Lerneaen_Hydra> I've also found a really nifty little linux handheld called a GP2X
[15:02:31] <cradek> sounds nice
[15:02:48] <cradek> I've been looking for my Palm M100 which I've apparently lost well this time
[15:03:48] <Lerneaen_Hydra> not as nice
[15:04:29] <cradek> nope. but will yours run for a month on 2 AAA batteries?
[15:05:34] <cradek> oh it's actually sold as a linux machine, slick
[15:05:57] <Lerneaen_Hydra> yeah
[15:06:03] <Lerneaen_Hydra> powerfull too
[15:06:16] <Lerneaen_Hydra> nice big devel community too
[15:06:26] <Lerneaen_Hydra> they've ported qtopia to it, and it has USB hos
[15:06:51] <Lerneaen_Hydra> so kb/mouse/usb mass storage, and later on all other standard devices
[15:07:40] <cradek> Resolution: Max 1920x1024 (hardware scaling for TFT screen)
[15:07:41] <cradek> ?
[15:07:48] <cradek> what's the real screen resolution?
[15:07:51] <Lerneaen_Hydra> I'm not really sure what they mean
[15:07:52] <Lerneaen_Hydra> 320x240
[15:07:57] <Lerneaen_Hydra> it's got TV out though
[15:08:00] <cradek> Battery Life: ~2 hours
[15:08:04] <cradek> hahaha
[15:08:07] <Lerneaen_Hydra> hmm
[15:08:12] <Lerneaen_Hydra> that's not the life I'm seeing
[15:08:19] <Lerneaen_Hydra> around 6 hours light usage
[15:08:26] <Lerneaen_Hydra> 3-4 when heavier
[15:08:28] <cradek> Battery Life: ~10 hours (info given by manufacturer: 2 x 2850mAh AA battery)
[15:08:55] <cradek> hmm I don't follow this
[15:08:55] <Lerneaen_Hydra> that's probably stretching it a bit. if they run it at 100mhz maybe
[15:09:03] <Lerneaen_Hydra> the clockspeed is adjustable
[15:09:07] <cradek> ah I see
[15:09:09] <Lerneaen_Hydra> 100-266 mhz specced
[15:09:24] <Lerneaen_Hydra> s/specced/spec
[17:50:58] <alex_joni> hi guys
[17:52:13] <Lerneaen_Hydra> 'lo
[17:52:23] <alex_joni> hi LH
[17:56:41] <rayh> Hi Alex
[17:56:58] <alex_joni> oh, hi ray.. how are the lakes?
[17:58:26] <rayh> Nice these days. Fishing should get better now that cooler weather is the norm.
[17:58:58] <alex_joni> we had cooler weather, just starts to get warmer
[17:59:45] <alex_joni> it was around 20-25, now it's up to 35
[18:01:22] <rayh> That's about the upper limit of nice.
[18:01:40] <alex_joni> expecting 40 these days :(
[18:02:11] <rayh> Say I've got a problem with my dapper install.
[18:02:28] <rayh> It wants to complain when I start up the rtai kernel
[18:02:37] <alex_joni> what does it say?
[18:03:11] <rayh> A normal gdm startup dies
[18:03:27] <alex_joni> special graphics card?
[18:03:28] <rayh> startx gives me the error I posted on emc a bit ago.
[18:03:36] <rayh> nvidia but using vesa
[18:03:39] <alex_joni> * alex_joni didn't look
[18:03:47] <rayh> let me find it.
[18:03:48] <alex_joni> vesa? how come?
[18:05:19] <rayh> With 5.10 it would not run with the nv driver
[18:05:26] <alex_joni> I see
[18:05:37] <rayh> This was an upgrade so it grabbed the old values.
[18:05:42] <rayh> should I try nv
[18:06:07] <alex_joni> I only see an email from JonE about spindle speed
[18:06:20] <rayh> This was on IRC a while ago.
[18:07:00] <rayh> "This program can not start until you start the dbus system"
[18:07:11] <alex_joni> * alex_joni looks up
[18:07:58] <alex_joni> durn.. I have no idea what dbus is..
[18:08:16] <rayh> me either.
[18:08:22] <cradek> I don't either
[18:08:32] <alex_joni> yet it seems to be running here
[18:08:41] <alex_joni> and x-session-manager seems to be using that
[18:08:45] <cradek> Your search - "This program can not start until you start the dbus system" - did not match any documents.
[18:08:49] <rayh> How do I see that?
[18:09:02] <alex_joni> I think it's some kind of messaging system for X
[18:09:15] <alex_joni> rayh: I did 'ps aux | grep dbus'
[18:09:20] <rayh> it says something about messagebus
[18:10:23] <rayh> perhaps I'd better step back and install from cd.
[18:10:51] <rayh> it looks like dbus is running here. got a pile of reply to your command.
[18:12:03] <cradek> seems like maybe dbus a gnome-related thing
[18:12:50] <alex_joni> rayh: I see some users reporting problems with dbus, but those went away after a hard reset (not simply Ctr-Alt-Backspace)
[18:13:01] <alex_joni> * alex_joni wouldn't quite see why..
[18:13:20] <alex_joni> rayh: does X crash completely?
[18:13:44] <rayh> no with gdm it returns to the login screen
[18:14:02] <alex_joni> tried any other login types?
[18:14:07] <rayh> with startx it complains but runs.
[18:14:15] <alex_joni> is there anything else in the syslog?
[18:14:19] <rayh> until you try to shut it down.
[18:15:53] <alex_joni> rayh: what then?
[18:18:01] <rayh> ah. gdm_auth_user_add Could not open cookie file.
[18:18:12] <alex_joni> sounds like a permission thingie
[18:18:22] <alex_joni> did you run any sudo's lately?
[18:18:59] <rayh> gdm_cleanup_children child 4220 crashed of signal 6
[18:19:10] <rayh> It does allow sudo
[18:19:18] <rayh> with startx
[18:19:25] <alex_joni> rayh: this is going to be a PITA to debug via irc
[18:19:28] <rayh> or in a terminal.
[18:19:40] <alex_joni> that might have been a wrong move 'sudo startx'
[18:19:43] <rayh> Yes it is worse since that box is not on line.
[18:20:04] <alex_joni> it might have created some files belonging to root, and now the normal user can't access them
[18:20:05] <rayh> I do have to boot with the recovery
[18:20:23] <alex_joni> rayh: anything important on that machine?
[18:20:27] <rayh> It did this crap the first time after install and reboot.
[18:20:40] <rayh> I can move what I want to keep.
[18:20:50] <alex_joni> could you try a fresh install?
[18:21:04] <alex_joni> then the kernel (no other updates if possible)
[18:21:38] <alex_joni> also> maybe you can come up with a hardware list of that PC: mobo, CPU, graphics card, etc
[18:22:44] <rayh> It was running well with ubuntu 5.10
[18:23:07] <alex_joni> then it would be best to install that again :)
[18:23:18] <alex_joni> it will be still supported for a couple of years
[18:23:28] <rayh> This was to be my test box for dapper.
[18:23:37] <rayh> I guess dapper fails?
[18:23:44] <rayh> I hate the thought of that.
[18:23:56] <alex_joni> rayh: you're the first I hear about
[18:23:59] <cradek> I think don't conclude that until you try a fresh install
[18:24:14] <alex_joni> and I'd want to know what's wrong.. but it's hard to understand that from here
[18:24:36] <cradek> fwiw, I haven't tried the update, but I've installed fresh on many machines
[18:24:39] <alex_joni> rayh: did you do a fresh install or an update?
[18:24:51] <rayh> update
[18:24:55] <alex_joni> ohhhh
[18:25:01] <alex_joni> update crapped on me too..
[18:25:13] <alex_joni> that was before the RT kernel
[18:25:23] <cradek> oh really
[18:25:26] <alex_joni> but other parts were falling apart
[18:25:54] <alex_joni> cradek: I still have it on another partition, got it to usefull.. but it's not like a fresh install
[18:26:15] <alex_joni> and I'm too lazy to start comparing hundreds of packages
[18:26:38] <cradek> apt is great for updating some packages or security fixes, I'm not sure I believe in using it to upgrade a distribution
[18:26:38] <alex_joni> rayh: do a fresh install, I'm now confident it will work OK
[18:27:22] <alex_joni> the biggest problem I see in apt is dependencies
[18:27:32] <alex_joni> it's the greatest help when installing new stuff
[18:27:39] <alex_joni> but the biggest problem when removing a package
[18:27:55] <alex_joni> because tons of stuff that was pulled in as a dependency stays installed
[18:29:06] <alex_joni> it's enough to install some software which pulls some deps in, then during dist-upgrade the software gets replaced, and new deps get pulled. but maybe one of the old deps doesn't have a replacement candidate.. they will stay installed
[18:29:16] <alex_joni> leading to all kinds of possible scenarios
[18:31:00] <rayh> Okay. It does take me a couple hours to download the kernel and such.
[18:31:21] <alex_joni> get them off a cd?
[18:31:44] <alex_joni> oh.. you can save the debs if you have downloaded them once
[18:31:58] <alex_joni> you might still have them in /var/cache/apt somewhere
[18:32:24] <rayh> Yes they are there.
[18:33:11] <alex_joni> dpkg -i can install them on the new system
[18:33:22] <alex_joni> I'd install only the kernel deb that way
[18:33:27] <alex_joni> the others are not that large
[18:33:33] <alex_joni> and can be pulled from the web :)
[18:33:41] <alex_joni> maybe rtai-.. too
[18:34:04] <alex_joni> cradek: what do you think?
[18:37:06] <rayh> Okay copied /var/cache/apt and will try to install from CD.
[18:37:13] <rayh> back in a bit.
[18:37:16] <alex_joni> ok
[19:22:48] <rayh> Well the install went okay.
[19:23:05] <rayh> now to transfer the kernel
[20:39:39] <rayh> I'm back -- on the dapper box this time.
[20:57:55] <cradek> yay
[21:03:46] <rayh> I'll have to wait and see what happens when the emc install completes.
[21:04:01] <rayh> I like what I see of it so far.
[21:04:06] <rayh> Very responsive.
[21:04:24] <cradek> I also noticed gnome was a lot faster
[21:04:36] <cradek> and the install is *much* faster
[21:04:56] <cradek> like maybe a tenth the time to install on a slower machine
[21:08:09] <rayh> Right I saw that. It also starts and shuts down faster.