#emc-devel | Logs for 2006-05-12

[00:00:18] <alex_joni> argh
[00:30:59] <alex_joni> damn..did I really forget how long a kernel compile was?
[00:32:20] <SWPadnos> ~15 minutes, right?
[00:32:36] <alex_joni> it's been 2 hours.. something is wrong..
[00:32:47] <alex_joni> usually it's under 30 minutes
[00:33:00] <alex_joni> but not using debuild :D
[00:35:14] <alex_joni> yay.. I start to see LD's
[00:37:55] <alex_joni> jepler: hello
[00:41:47] <alex_joni> jepler: I can say now I am a LOT smarter about udebs & co ;)
[00:42:58] <jepler> alex_joni: yay. does that mean it's working yet?
[00:43:14] <alex_joni> want me to share what I learned?
[00:43:24] <alex_joni> it's still compiling (for the last 2-3 hours)
[00:43:29] <jepler> oh
[00:43:33] <alex_joni> and probably I won't get it right the first time :)
[00:43:38] <jepler> no, one never does
[00:43:49] <alex_joni> but it seems after reading & hacking & whatever.. it's pretty easy
[00:44:02] <alex_joni> I just need to redo the kernel unfortunately :(
[00:44:07] <alex_joni> maybe cradek will help there..
[00:44:18] <alex_joni> ok .. here's the magic:
[00:44:26] <alex_joni> apt-get source linux-source-2.6.12
[00:44:36] <alex_joni> hack the thing (patch & whatever)
[00:44:39] <alex_joni> debuild
[00:44:50] <alex_joni> </end of magic>
[00:45:55] <alex_joni> the main thing to watch for is to use 'apt-get source' not 'apt-get install'
[00:46:15] <jepler> you had to get the source for linux-source? that barely makes sense
[00:46:20] <jepler> * jepler shakes his head
[00:46:26] <alex_joni> lol, yeah .. I missed it quite a few times
[00:46:33] <alex_joni> and it was right in front of me :D
[00:46:43] <alex_joni> it seems the source for linux-source contains debian/
[00:46:52] <alex_joni> and all the necessary scripts for udeb & co
[00:47:07] <alex_joni> along with scripts for building linux-source
[00:47:10] <jepler> after that can you figure out making the ubuntu rtai and emc2 packages build the kernel modules with module-assistant?
[00:47:22] <alex_joni> I have no clue yet..
[00:47:38] <jmkasunich> jepler: ?
[00:47:39] <alex_joni> I tried to outsmart it by moving the debian/ folder to chris's source
[00:47:54] <alex_joni> and then run debuild.. but that failed :/
[00:48:13] <jmkasunich> you mean instead of having the emc2 build system build the modules?
[00:48:14] <alex_joni> so now I'm building the kernel off of the vanilla ubuntu source-source :D
[00:48:39] <alex_joni> jmkasunich: no, instead of building against the source, you can build against headers
[00:48:55] <jmkasunich> I thought we already did that
[00:49:08] <alex_joni> right, and there's a step further .. which paul suggested
[00:49:16] <jmkasunich> didn't realize I had a whole source tree here
[00:49:41] <alex_joni> to use module-assistant to compile modules which aren't linked to a specific version of kernel
[00:49:50] <alex_joni> or something like that.. never really understood it
[00:50:12] <jmkasunich> * jmkasunich doesn't want to understand it
[00:50:29] <jmkasunich> I'm perfectly happy if I can build modules that work on the box where I compiled them
[00:50:31] <alex_joni> I think this is compiling over and over again ..
[00:50:42] <jepler> jmkasunich: if you look in the debian/ directory, the kernel version number is hardcoded.
[00:50:42] <alex_joni> for different scenarios :((
[00:51:03] <jepler> jmkasunich: module-assistant is some way to make it easy to build a different "emc2 kernel modules" package for whatever kernel
[00:51:24] <alex_joni> jepler: btw, I talked to Colin Watson today in #debian-boot.. he was the one to set me into the right direction
[00:51:26] <jepler> it makes it possible to build one for ubuntu 5.10, one for ubuntu 6 when it comes out, and even one for bdi4 if we decided we wanted to
[00:51:29] <SWPadnos> how many kernels are on the CD? (SMP / UP, preempt/no preempt ...)
[00:51:34] <jmkasunich> I must admit I've never looked in the debian directory
[00:51:58] <SWPadnos> (ie, when you use a liveCD, and/or do an install, how many pre-built images are there)
[00:52:00] <alex_joni> oh, btw.. did you guys see that emc2 is available on bdi4.40 ?
[00:52:13] <jmkasunich> probably a busted version...
[00:52:47] <alex_joni> http://bdi4emc.ourproject.org/debian/pool/extras/e/emc2/
[00:52:49] <SWPadnos> interesting - 4.46 is out now
[00:52:56] <jepler> at one point paul made a deb of HEAD on some random day, warned everyone that it was for the wrong kernel and would conflict with his emc deb, and said not to install it
[00:53:26] <jmkasunich> lets not speak of him
[00:53:56] <jmkasunich> is emc2/debian/control the file you're talking about, with the hard coded kernel version?
[00:54:07] <jepler> jmkasunich: yes, I think so
[00:54:37] <jmkasunich> so why not have control.in, and let configure do a few well placed `uname -r` ?
[00:54:44] <jepler> because that's not the debian way
[00:54:55] <jepler> not that I understand the debian way, mind you
[00:55:09] <alex_joni> jepler: we should make a udeb instead of deb
[00:55:09] <jmkasunich> pthbbbt to the debian way
[00:55:16] <alex_joni> that would scrap all the debian way
[00:55:18] <alex_joni> :))
[00:55:31] <alex_joni> udeb=deb which is not conform to the debian way
[00:58:41] <alex_joni> SWPadnos: you were right.. I just built 386, 686, 686-smp, k7, k7-smp, and source
[00:59:03] <jmkasunich> :-/
[00:59:21] <SWPadnos> cool. that probably means it's closer to working
[00:59:39] <SWPadnos> I wonder if it would work on a 64-bit SMP machine ;)
[01:00:37] <alex_joni> it's still compiling.. so by morning I probably have ARM & other oddities too
[01:00:45] <SWPadnos> heh
[01:00:50] <jmkasunich> linux for PIC
[01:00:53] <jmkasunich> Z80 too
[01:00:54] <SWPadnos> hmmm - you may be right
[01:00:59] <SWPadnos> nope -AVR only, AFAIK
[01:00:59] <alex_joni> aaarghh.. PIC
[01:01:24] <alex_joni> I'll stop using linux the day they port it to PIC
[01:01:26] <alex_joni> :/
[01:01:34] <alex_joni> or to ir2111 :D
[01:01:42] <SWPadnos> don't worry - nobody has bothered to port gcc yet ;)
[01:01:48] <fenn> * fenn mumbles something about eCos
[01:01:49] <SWPadnos> 6502, baby!!
[01:01:55] <SWPadnos> or possibly 6809
[01:02:05] <alex_joni> I'm ok with that :D
[01:02:10] <alex_joni> anything but pic :P
[01:02:33] <SWPadnos> heh
[01:02:36] <SWPadnos> I agre
[01:02:38] <SWPadnos> e
[01:02:52] <SWPadnos> any processor that doesn't understand its own carry bit is too brain-dead for me
[01:03:32] <alex_joni> this was too much fun for one evening..
[01:03:43] <SWPadnos> heh
[01:03:57] <alex_joni> guess I liked it so much, I'll do it again :D
[01:04:03] <SWPadnos> let me know when the Alpha compile is finished, and MIPS ;)
[01:04:12] <SWPadnos> maybe I can try it on my Indigo2
[01:08:43] <alex_joni> ayeee... found debian/configs/archmap
[01:08:54] <alex_joni> less archmap | wc -l
[01:08:55] <alex_joni> 45
[01:11:04] <jepler> time for bed
[01:11:09] <jepler> maybe by this time saturday morning...
[01:11:25] <alex_joni> this is starting to get weirder and weirder
[01:11:44] <alex_joni> - Coordinate with mjg59 and jbailey for new ACPI patches to attach
[01:11:44] <alex_joni> DSDT to initramfs/initrd.
[01:11:44] <alex_joni> - Fix all the bugs SLACKER!
[01:11:46] <alex_joni> - Adam: remeber NOT to upload while you are menstruating!
[01:11:51] <alex_joni> ????
[01:12:01] <alex_joni> that's from the TODO
[01:14:11] <jepler> * jepler rolls his eyes
[01:14:54] <alex_joni> wonder how Eve looks like..
[01:17:05] <alex_joni> ok.. night all
[01:17:11] <jmkasunich> goodnight
[01:34:22] <cradek> looks like alex_joni has had some success
[01:34:38] <cradek> is he still just working on doing the live cd?
[01:34:38] <SWPadnos> hopefully, we'll know over the weekend ;)
[01:34:41] <SWPadnos> yep
[01:35:29] <cradek> maybe he'll end up doing the dapper packages, that would be nice
[01:36:16] <SWPadnos> or maybe documenting the steps he took to get the liveCD working (assuming ...)
[01:37:31] <cradek> huh, sf is announcing their cvs changes
[01:38:07] <cradek> the anon cvs delay is going from "minimum three hours" to "maximum two hours"
[01:38:15] <jmkasunich> thats nice
[01:38:23] <SWPadnos> "Announcement Announcement: we'll be implementing CVS soon!!!" ;)
[01:38:24] <jmkasunich> I like "max a few seconds" better
[01:39:08] <SWPadnos> I was thinking of adding the static IP to my dreamhost account, which would allow us to do an anonymous cvs server there
[01:39:15] <jmkasunich> where is the announcement?
[01:39:18] <SWPadnos> there's already anonymous svn available
[01:39:20] <jmkasunich> not in the status page
[01:39:26] <cradek> they've "applied their best practices" so they can "scale the project horizontally"
[01:39:34] <cradek> jmkasunich: email
[01:39:36] <jmkasunich> ohh, buzzwords
[01:39:43] <SWPadnos> I can "scale the project horizontally" with a large hammer ;)
[01:40:01] <jepler> jmkasunich: they sent a copy of this message directly to me. do you want me to forward a copy to you?
[01:40:13] <jmkasunich> I think I got one too...
[01:40:20] <jepler> Greetings,
[01:40:20] <jepler> You are receiving this mail because you are a project admin for
[01:40:20] <jepler> a SourceForge.net-hosted project. One of our primary services,
[01:40:20] <jepler> CVS, suffered a series of interrelated, critical hardware failures
[01:40:22] <jepler> BLAHBLAHBLAH
[01:40:25] <jepler> oh sorry
[01:40:27] <jepler> that last line wasn't actually in the e-mail
[01:40:46] <jmkasunich> yeah, I got it
[01:40:48] <jepler> ok
[01:43:44] <cradek> is it just me or has the #emc channel turned into something nearly unrelated to emc?
[01:43:55] <jmkasunich> it gets pretty bad at times
[01:44:23] <jmkasunich> some stuff is vaguely on-topic
[01:44:35] <jepler> well most of the serious talk seems to have moved here
[01:44:48] <jmkasunich> Jymmm's question about canvas is because he wants to make a dust cover for his CNC router, keep the dust inside
[01:45:08] <cradek> oh I wasn't picking on anyone in particular
[01:45:12] <jmkasunich> I know
[01:45:22] <jepler> maybe we should talk more there
[01:45:34] <jmkasunich> the really OT ones are the italians
[01:45:37] <cradek> that's an interesting idea
[01:46:22] <cradek> it's not just them - it seems like there are quite a few people there who don't even use emc
[01:46:48] <SWPadnos> or any CNC
[01:46:53] <SWPadnos> (like me ;) )
[01:47:03] <cradek> haha
[01:47:04] <SWPadnos> jymmm is actually using TurboCNC, I think
[01:47:35] <SWPadnos> he keeps complaining about EMC needing too much computer, or not being pure debian (or whatever) ...
[01:49:00] <cradek> hmm.
[06:14:27] <alex_joni> morning
[06:14:40] <alex_joni> damn this was a short night :(
[06:39:41] <skunkworks> I'm still up
[06:39:48] <skunkworks> suprisingly
[06:40:16] <skunkworks> how did the live cd go?
[06:40:26] <alex_joni> the kernel was still compiling when I got up ;)
[06:40:37] <alex_joni> but it's starting to make more sense now..
[06:41:04] <skunkworks> that is a plus
[06:41:29] <alex_joni> I'm still trying to build a standard kernel, to see how that works
[06:41:37] <alex_joni> after that I need to tackle a RTAI one
[06:42:08] <skunkworks> sounds like a plan
[06:42:15] <alex_joni> heh.. I am currently in /usr/src/linux-source-2.6.12-2.6.12/debian/build/linux-source-2.6.12/debian/tmp-headers/usr/src/linux-headers-2.6.12-10/
[06:42:34] <alex_joni> that surely sounds like a long path :))
[06:43:33] <skunkworks> greak to me
[06:45:45] <skunkworks> 7:45 there?
[06:45:51] <alex_joni> 09:48
[06:46:04] <alex_joni> was up till 4:30
[06:46:33] <skunkworks> why does the time on logger_devel say 7:45?
[06:47:19] <skunkworks> 6:45 I mean
[06:47:26] <alex_joni> GMT
[06:47:52] <skunkworks> ah - I just figured it was the time where you where. stupid stupid stupid
[06:48:10] <alex_joni> no-one else is here ;)
[06:48:59] <alex_joni> dpkg-deb: building package `linux-image-2.6.12-10-686-smp'
[06:49:04] <alex_joni> sounds like progress ;)
[06:49:32] <skunkworks> :)
[06:58:24] <skunkworks> alex_joni: have you ever been to the US?
[06:58:35] <alex_joni> not yet
[06:58:54] <alex_joni> y?
[06:59:02] <skunkworks> next years workshop?
[06:59:45] <alex_joni> hopefully
[06:59:52] <alex_joni> we shall see
[07:00:38] <skunkworks> Just wondering. How hard would it be for you to get a visa or whatever you need?
[07:01:02] <skunkworks> passport?
[07:01:05] <skunkworks> whatever
[07:01:06] <alex_joni> don't think it's very hard.. but it involves travelign to the embassy (which is in bucharest)
[07:01:16] <alex_joni> passport I have, I need a visa
[07:02:42] <alex_joni> it's usually not that hard.. but I never worried enough to get one (for the US)
[07:02:48] <skunkworks> again - wondering. My cousin has a new boyfriend she met in france. He is having a heck of a time getting what he needs to come for a visit.
[07:02:53] <alex_joni> at least now I have a reason ;)
[07:03:09] <alex_joni> skunkworks: that sounds odd
[07:03:20] <skunkworks> I thougth so too.
[07:03:28] <alex_joni> not sure about france, but german people can go visit without anything else
[07:03:39] <alex_joni> and that should be true for france too
[07:04:12] <skunkworks> odd. (just found out about it today - well yesterday now I guess)
[07:04:34] <skunkworks> twidling my thumbs while a raid rebuilds.
[07:04:49] <alex_joni> wanna build a kernel?
[07:04:49] <alex_joni> :D
[07:05:28] <skunkworks> would not know where to start. I do have ubuntu here.
[07:05:40] <alex_joni> nm ;)
[07:05:41] <skunkworks> or are you kidding? :)
[07:05:44] <alex_joni> yeah
[07:05:58] <alex_joni> probably not worth the trouble
[07:06:43] <skunkworks> we just spent the last 3 days trying to get ubuntu and mysql running.
[07:06:49] <skunkworks> not that successful yet.
[07:07:18] <alex_joni> how so?
[07:08:32] <skunkworks> sort of the blind leading the blind. had issues with right and sounds like there was a bug in mysqladmin we where fighting.
[07:08:48] <alex_joni> ouch
[07:09:02] <skunkworks> and my helper doesn't want to install apache and php to use the phpadmin
[07:09:29] <skunkworks> he is a worse case senerio guy. thinks if we have apache installed someone will hack into the system :)
[07:09:52] <alex_joni> didn't he hear about iptables?
[07:09:58] <alex_joni> or binding apache to localhost only?
[07:10:34] <skunkworks> :) he just a little goofy. hard worker though.
[07:10:56] <skunkworks> we will get there.
[07:11:10] <skunkworks> its a learning experience
[07:12:14] <skunkworks> 2:10am here
[07:12:30] <alex_joni> sure sounds like a learning experience
[07:12:40] <alex_joni> most of the good stuff I've one was after 01am ;)
[07:13:10] <skunkworks> remember - this is probably the 3rd month of running linux for me. give me some time :)
[07:13:42] <skunkworks> it is definatly a lot easier than a year or so ago.
[07:14:47] <skunkworks> (though my only experience was with the bdi(
[07:14:49] <skunkworks> )
[07:15:00] <skunkworks> maybe 2 years ago.
[07:16:32] <skunkworks> alex_joni: don't know if I have said it to you personally - but thanks for all your hard work on emc2.
[07:32:15] <alex_joni> heh.. thanks
[07:38:15] <skunkworks> I have apache server running. cool
[07:39:02] <alex_joni> nice ;)
[07:40:01] <skunkworks> Thought I would give it a shot installing mysql by my self :)
[07:41:05] <alex_joni> apt-get install mysql
[07:41:10] <alex_joni> apt-get install apache
[07:41:16] <alex_joni> apt-get install phpmyadmin
[07:41:17] <alex_joni> ;)
[07:56:06] <skunkworks> it can;t get the phpmyadmin
[07:56:15] <skunkworks> for some reason
[07:57:17] <alex_joni> apt-cache search phpmyadmin
[07:57:37] <alex_joni> maybe you need to enable universe & multiverse
[07:58:01] <skunkworks> I thought I did enable it. I will double check
[07:59:24] <alex_joni> sudo apt-get install phpmyadmin
[08:00:12] <skunkworks> the unuverse was not enabled - giving that a try
[08:00:31] <alex_joni> does it show in apt-cache seach phpmyadmin ?
[08:00:33] <skunkworks> that worked
[08:00:37] <alex_joni> coo
[08:00:50] <skunkworks> the apt-cache didn't do anything
[08:01:01] <skunkworks> unless I didn't do it right :)
[08:01:50] <alex_joni> apt-cache search 'name'
[08:02:07] <alex_joni> that's for searching for packages you don't know the exact name of
[14:01:30] <rayh> At Cardinal now.
[14:01:48] <rayh> Got a question for developers that are going to be here.
[14:03:40] <cradek> hi ray
[14:22:56] <rayh> Off reading about the sourceforge snafu.
[14:23:08] <SWPadnos> which one?
[14:25:53] <rayh> What a mess that is.
[14:26:17] <rayh> And it doesn't look like the cvs solutions is a real good one.
[14:30:06] <cradek> I bet after a while they get it working well - it says they plan on getting rid of the anon delay
[14:31:20] <cradek> maybe someday we can even move our stuff back
[14:31:35] <cradek> but I'm glad we aren't relying on them during this painful period
[14:34:28] <rayh> I don't like the idea even of being one of 10 servers.
[14:35:02] <rayh> The service now is great.
[14:35:38] <cradek> I appreciate that compliment
[14:36:38] <rayh> I appreciate the work you guys did to get this going.
[14:36:56] <rayh> We'd have been way up shit creek if we'd waited for sf.
[14:37:29] <cradek> we would sure be uneasy heading into fest with such a big unknown
[14:38:00] <rayh> Yep. and dead on the release.
[14:54:27] <rayh> For the developer activities here, do we need an area separate from the machine and integration areas?
[14:58:40] <SWPadnos> I think that would be good
[14:59:25] <SWPadnos> a separate (relatively quiet) room where we can have discussions about architecture and that kind of thing.
[15:02:37] <rayh> Okay. Would we want our pc's set up there as well. Kinda like we did at NIST?
[15:03:01] <cradek> I agree it would be nice to have a quiet-ish place to set up
[15:03:03] <rayh> Or will most developers also have machines they run with the same box.
[15:03:29] <SWPadnos> pc's as well
[15:05:01] <cradek> I don't know about anyone else, but I'll have a laptop that I can either connect to my machines or not
[15:05:39] <cradek> I don't know if I'll bring the big machine I usually use to run the mill or not
[15:05:50] <rayh> Okay.
[15:06:11] <cradek> I'll help carry if people want to move machines. no big deal.
[15:06:27] <rayh> In the machine area, I've got room for a line of tables about 30 feet long.
[15:06:43] <rayh> I figured benchtop activities there.
[15:07:08] <rayh> The Mazak, diacro, and japax are nearby
[15:07:26] <cradek> I will have two tabletop machines, so I'd like a good 6' of table
[15:07:27] <rayh> as is the bridgeport that JonE wants to convert
[15:08:06] <rayh> Okay. I'll reserve one table 6' to 8' for your stuff.
[15:08:21] <rayh> Aram is bringing motors and a servo setup.
[15:08:22] <cradek> thanks
[15:08:43] <rayh> I've got three sherlines and the 2 hp motor setup.
[15:09:03] <rayh> and several pc's for folk to experiment with emc2 and hal.
[15:09:11] <cradek> oh and jepler will need another 6' for his etch-a-sketch
[15:09:18] <rayh> so that ought to fill up most of these tables.
[15:09:23] <rayh> Okay.
[15:09:25] <cradek> yep sounds like
[15:09:51] <cradek> kidding, of course, but he is going to bring it to show off the simplest emc2 servo setup ever
[15:10:15] <rayh> Good. We need all levels of integration.
[15:20:38] <SWPadnos> I'll be bringing several computers. one or two can be atatched to machines if we want
[15:21:10] <SWPadnos> one of them is an embedded touchscreen PC, which works nicely with the USC
[15:21:34] <SWPadnos> another is a full tower (also has a touchscreen LCD), which I can put the m5i20 into.
[15:22:09] <SWPadnos> consider also what kinds of test equipment may be wanted for both development purposes and retrofits
[15:27:48] <alex_joni> hi guys
[15:28:05] <alex_joni> SWPadnos: figured out the long build eventually.. was building only for i386
[15:28:40] <alex_joni> but all flavours of it (i386, i686, i686-smp, k7, k7-smp)
[15:35:44] <SWPadnos> did it finish?
[15:38:11] <alex_joni> eventually.. but now I'm smarter and do only i386
[15:39:06] <SWPadnos> I wonder if the other kernels / modules would work...
[15:39:36] <alex_joni> they all would work, but only on d-i
[15:41:11] <SWPadnos> d-i?
[15:42:55] <alex_joni> debian-installer
[15:43:02] <alex_joni> the installer on ubuntu :)
[15:47:12] <SWPadnos> ah
[15:48:23] <SWPadnos> I guess I'm not sure what you mean. of course the liveCD boot will only be i386, but wouldn't d-i select the "best" kernel for an install?
[15:48:41] <SWPadnos> ie, k8-smp for a dual opteron, for instance :)
[15:49:12] <alex_joni> probably
[15:49:26] <alex_joni> but we don't have rtai kernels for those.. so I don't care about those
[15:50:08] <SWPadnos> the RTAI patches should work for SMP, and AMD64 support is in there (in beta form)
[15:50:23] <alex_joni> you have different ADEOS patches for each kernel arch
[15:51:37] <SWPadnos> hmmm. I wonder if the various intel-like patches can be applied to the same kernel
[15:51:56] <SWPadnos> ie, if the common code is the same, but the various arch subdirs each get their own changes
[15:56:54] <alex_joni> you can always diff them..
[15:57:07] <alex_joni> but I didn't see any non-i386 patches for 2.6.12 for example
[15:57:21] <alex_joni> oops.. looking in the wrong arch/ dir ;)
[15:57:21] <SWPadnos> hmmm. ok
[15:57:27] <SWPadnos> well duh ;)
[15:57:29] <alex_joni> duh
[15:59:54] <alex_joni> cradek: care for a tripod ?
[16:00:00] <alex_joni> I could ship it.. :D
[16:06:27] <cradek> the kind that works with your new kinematics, or the kind you sit a camera on?
[16:08:03] <alex_joni> the one that works with the kinematics ;)
[16:08:18] <alex_joni> although you probably can build a nicer one ..
[16:08:24] <cradek> cool, I thought you told me you took it apart already
[16:08:33] <alex_joni> it's got motors & cables
[16:08:40] <alex_joni> only drives are missing
[16:10:13] <cradek> I wish you could be there to show it at fest
[16:10:23] <alex_joni> next year ;)
[16:18:53] <SWPadnos> how about a camera tripod that walks ;)
[16:18:59] <SWPadnos> (maybe two)
[16:20:31] <alex_joni> would be fun to watch :P
[16:20:54] <alex_joni> I'll programm it to walk around cradek and take pictures all day long
[16:21:09] <SWPadnos> heh
[16:24:00] <rayh> HI alex
[16:24:21] <alex_joni> hi ray.. was wondering.. did you try cycle-start on halui the other day?
[16:24:43] <rayh> I didn't. Was packing to leave.
[16:25:02] <rayh> I plan an upgrade of the mazak here to ubuntu and then try it on that.
[16:25:12] <alex_joni> ok, coo
[16:25:29] <rayh> That has the push button in place.
[16:25:56] <rayh> I've got to make certain that the cvs configs are current first.
[16:26:24] <SWPadnos> tar and scp are your friends
[16:26:34] <SWPadnos> (or cvs, if you like ;) )
[16:27:00] <rayh> Yep.
[16:27:09] <cradek> I'm anxious to see rigid tapping on that machine
[16:27:17] <rayh> I'll get that processor on line here in a bit.
[16:27:33] <rayh> Looking for another hub or switcher.
[16:27:48] <SWPadnos> cradek, does synchronized motion work with negative spindle speed?
[16:28:02] <cradek> SWPadnos: no, SMOP
[16:28:41] <alex_joni> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/KernelBuildpackageDetailedHowto <- jfyi
[16:28:53] <SWPadnos> heh - ok
[16:29:02] <cradek> I think I tried once to put a spindle stop/spindle start while synchronized and it all went wrong
[16:29:08] <cradek> didn't look into it any further
[16:29:17] <SWPadnos> ok.
[16:29:57] <SWPadnos> I suppose the spindle speed should be treated as a magnitude, since it's likely that the retract would be a -Z move anyway
[16:30:12] <SWPadnos> it would be bad plunge further due to double-negatives
[16:30:46] <cradek> I haven't quite wrapped my head around how a rigid tap should be represented at the canon level
[16:31:07] <cradek> probably just two feeds in opposite directions
[16:31:12] <cradek> but it could also be a new canon type
[16:56:45] <alex_joni> * alex_joni yawns at the kernel build
[17:02:05] <alex_joni> cradek: still around?
[17:08:02] <alex_joni> cradek: you know what I was wondering? why don't we just take a default ubuntu install iso, and feed emc2 into it
[17:08:10] <alex_joni> along with kernel and all
[18:44:42] <jepler> alex_joni: aside from wanting to stay out of the OS Distribution building business?
[18:44:46] <jepler> (that's my main consideration)
[18:45:01] <alex_joni> you don't really build an OS
[18:45:13] <alex_joni> mainly inject some packages using apt-get install into the image
[18:50:27] <alex_joni> jepler: basicly putting the packages you put on a second cd into the install cd
[18:50:34] <alex_joni> well, not all the packages :)
[19:08:28] <alex_joni> jepler: what was the stuff paul talked about ?
[19:16:24] <fenn> alex_joni: that sounds reasonable to me..
[19:16:47] <fenn> you have to host the whole OS though
[19:16:52] <fenn> the .iso
[19:17:36] <alex_joni> fenn: not for hosting.. but for spreading around / giving away cd's
[19:38:21] <jepler> alex_joni: you saw my blog entry? I linked to the posts that are partially quoted
[19:40:15] <alex_joni> I didn't.. let me look
[19:40:45] <jepler> oh .. if you weren't talking about that, then what did you mean?
[19:44:16] <alex_joni> module-assistent
[19:44:28] <alex_joni> I asked in #ubuntu-kernel.. they never used it
[19:47:58] <jepler> paul_c hasn't said anything I've successfully understood
[19:47:59] <jepler> Subject: Re: [Bdi4emc-help] Re: [Emc-users] New BDI-4 packages.
[19:48:03] <jepler> Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2006 12:51:04 +0100
[19:48:09] <jepler> If the rules were smart enough to interpret KSRC and KVERS (both exported when
[19:48:12] <jepler> building with m-a), editing of any file would be unnecessary. With a little
[19:48:15] <jepler> forethought and use of dh_install, there should be no need to have version
[19:48:17] <jepler> dependant paths listed.
[19:48:28] <jepler> ^^^ paul_c in the discussion that followed his announcement of his broken emc2 packages for bdi4
[19:49:05] <jepler> From: Paul <bdi-emc@ntlworld.com>
[19:49:06] <jepler> To: "Help and advice for BDI-4 users." <bdi4emc-help@lists.ourproject.org>
[19:49:06] <jepler> Subject: Re: [Bdi4emc-help] Re: Where is the source code for the versions of
[19:49:06] <jepler> emc and axis on bdi 4.30 and 4.38?
[19:49:06] <jepler> Date: Wed, 18 Jan 2006 11:24:33 +0000
[19:49:12] <jepler> dpkg-buildpackage will always fail to build the emc-1.0 package. To
[19:49:12] <jepler> successfully build the emc-1.0-xx.deb requires (amongst other things), m-a,
[19:49:12] <jepler> dh_helper, and a few extra packages from the experimental branch.
[19:49:50] <jepler> ^^^ paul_c explaining why 'dpkg-buildpackage' won't build emc-1.0 (note that nmost recently he claimed that dpkg-buildpackage does build it; whether he just changes his story every day of the week, or whether the emc package changed in the meantime, I'm not sure)
[19:50:15] <jepler> m-a, I eventually figured out, refers to module-assistant
[19:51:38] <alex_joni> I didn't know dh_helper is experimental..
[19:51:59] <alex_joni> but if apt-get build-dep doesn't get it then the deb is borked imo
[19:55:13] <cradek> * cradek sticks his fingers in his ears
[19:55:50] <alex_joni> bet you didn't read the blog
[19:56:42] <cradek> I scanned it
[19:56:49] <jepler> there are a lot words there
[19:56:58] <jepler> I probably should have tried writing fewer
[19:57:00] <alex_joni> jepler: his ocr is fast
[19:57:21] <cradek> paul's packages can't be rebuilt by a user, so he's in violation of the gpl, this is not new news
[19:57:31] <cradek> paul hates jepler, this is not new news
[19:57:52] <cradek> who cares what his issue of the week is? not me.
[19:58:46] <cradek> if he thinks he's doing us a personal favor putting the software we've worked hard on, and released for free, on his CD, that's bizarre but not my problem.
[20:00:44] <alex_joni> jepler: if you care: http://pastebin.com/713846
[20:00:55] <jepler> how can I know if I care without clicking?
[20:01:41] <alex_joni> it's about the livecd kernel
[20:01:51] <alex_joni> build instructions
[20:02:31] <jepler> I'm interested in seeing it work
[20:02:38] <cradek> I am too
[20:02:45] <jepler> I'm happy to leave the "blood, sweat, and tears" to somebody else
[20:02:51] <cradek> I am too
[20:03:12] <rayh> that was an interesting musical group.
[20:03:18] <jepler> rayh: yeah, them too
[20:03:58] <alex_joni> jepler: I'm way past beyond that
[20:05:03] <alex_joni> did you manage with your cd?
[20:05:49] <jepler> I never went back to it after verifying that it would install emc2 and axis, and rebuild them both into debs
[20:06:01] <jepler> so the repository signature issue has to be solved, and some docs need to be written.
[20:07:48] <SWPadnos> can you remove the need for a signature for the debs on the CD?
[20:07:54] <SWPadnos> or do all debs need to be signed?
[20:08:13] <cradek> I think you sign the repository (cd), not the debs themselves
[20:08:21] <SWPadnos> ah. ok
[20:08:33] <SWPadnos> can you remove the need for a repository to be signed? ;)
[20:08:42] <cradek> but I don't see how we can get a key into apt in time.
[20:08:58] <cradek> the user can just say "yeah whatever" at the prompt
[20:09:07] <jepler> http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=31671
[20:09:46] <cradek> haha
[20:09:54] <jepler> cradek: to do that the instructions would have to involve running a shell script, I think
[20:10:14] <cradek> yeah I guess so, maybe that's not hard
[20:10:20] <cradek> depends what happens when you insert the cd
[20:11:06] <jepler> there doesn't seem to be an autorun script (for various sensible reasons IMO)
[20:11:17] <jepler> and you can't double-click either because it's mounted "noexec"
[20:12:57] <alex_joni> jepler: http://www.wlug.org.nz/UbuntuRemastering
[20:14:20] <alex_joni> can anyone see a package called debian-install in ubuntu somewhere?
[20:14:40] <alex_joni> err.. debian-installer
[20:15:45] <alex_joni> nm, found it
[22:22:18] <rayh> * rayh needs to make speaks with jmkasunich as soon as he gets on line.
[22:22:38] <alex_joni> huh.. sounds scary
[22:25:38] <rayh> Hi alex. Just a few questions about handouts for the fest class and how we ought to layout the room for the developers.
[22:26:26] <alex_joni> ah.. cool
[23:19:10] <rayh> How much of halui is in v2 release?
[23:20:10] <alex_joni> not much..
[23:20:44] <alex_joni> I mean.. most of halui iirc, but it's not in the runscript
[23:20:51] <SWPadnos> I think we may want to keep a short list of things to put into a fairly quick 2.0.1 release
[23:21:03] <SWPadnos> that list will likely be fleshed out at fest
[23:21:07] <rayh> Okay. Think I can get away with compiling a rip on one machine and transfering it to another.
[23:24:38] <alex_joni> heh.. burning my first cd in ubuntu :)
[23:24:43] <alex_joni> this is really a treat
[23:24:58] <rayh> Fantastic.
[23:25:23] <alex_joni> I thought I had to use cdrecord & co, but instead right click on the iso, burn to CD .. done